# Set Ups For The Gate / Beaver



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

*Hello, looking for some general set up information for running at The Gate and Beaver?

What is a good gearing set up to start with for a 1/10 touring car and a WGT car?

As far as rubber tires are concerned for the touring car are drivers using a traction compound of any kind?

What WGT tires are being used and is traction compound allowed? If so what is being used?

Does either track have a hobby shop and what brands of cars do they currently support?

Thank you for any information that could be passed along. It is greatly appreciated. *


----------



## Bigz84 (Sep 10, 2009)

at the gate, I run sxt, 3.5 FDR for touring 17.5


----------



## Adam B (Nov 27, 2010)

Bigz84 said:


> at the gate, I run sxt, 3.5 FDR for touring 17.5


FDR varies on your motor/rotor combo. The gate has a small hobby shop with a good supply of CRC parts, some associated, and misc other stuff. I have never been to beaver yet.


----------



## CarbonJoe (Jun 29, 2006)

T28Pilot said:


> What is a good gearing set up to start with for a 1/10 touring car and a WGT car?


For TC, around 3.8 FDR to start. For WGT, around 88 spur, 44 pinion with a tire size of around 2.10 inches diameter.



T28Pilot said:


> As far as rubber tires are concerned for the touring car are drivers using a traction compound of any kind?


Yes. Most use SXT 3.0 traction compound for both rubber TC and WGT.



T28Pilot said:


> What WGT tires are being used and is traction compound allowed? If so what is being used?


WGT Spec tires (CRC or BSR WGT spec purple, with purple stripe)



T28Pilot said:


> Does either track have a hobby shop and what brands of cars do they currently support?


Lots of CRC parts. Limited AE parts.


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

*A little confused....FDR?*

It's been about 6 - 8 years since I last raced touring cars. What are you referring to when you mention FDR?

Thank you for all the other information, I'm just looking for a consistent, reliable, and durable set up in order to get as much track time as possible, the fast lap times will come later.


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

*Touring Pinion Size??*

I guess what Im looking for is a safe place to start on the pinion for a touring car, I understand it depends on motor / battery combonation but what would be a good place to start?

Thanks again, I'm planning to purchase a car in the near future and just want to order what I need to get started. I'm also coming from quite aways from the track and it makes more sense to get things in order.


----------



## Bigz84 (Sep 10, 2009)

T28Pilot said:


> I guess what Im looking for is a safe place to start on the pinion for a touring car, I understand it depends on motor / battery combonation but what would be a good place to start?
> 
> Thanks again, I'm planning to purchase a car in the near future and just want to order what I need to get started. I'm also coming from quite aways from the track and it makes more sense to get things in order.


What kind of car do you plan on getting?

As a few of us drive Xrays, a few others drive Serpents, and maybe a few drive an Associated. FRD is Final Drive Ratio, which is spur divided by pinion times the Internal Ratio of the car you are driving, usually around 1.9 maybe 2.0... all really depends on the car.

I run 92 spur and a 50 pinion, 64 pitch, and my internal is 1.9 which equals 3.496, in a Xray. to be safe, and not to abuse your motor, running a 92/46 would be a safe bet.

some run a 96 spur too...


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

*For a touring car Im looking at the Xray T3 / T4, CRC-VBC Wildfire, Serpent S411 and the Associated TC6.1.

However, I really like the HPI TCXX but am curious as to the parts availability. I used to run an HPI years ago with great results and the TCXX looks like a great platform. The Serpent has me concerned with parts availability as well.

Im also looking at running WGT or 1/12th in conjunction with the touring car, I have not decided yet. As far as chassis in those categories Im looking at the Associated R5.1 and the CRC Gen - X 10 LE and leaning more towards the CRC however I found an online sale where they are throwing in a CRC battery pack with the R5.1. In 1/12th im looking at the Associated and CRC. 

There are quite a few choices out there and its getting harder to make a decision. It sounds like CRC and Associated have parts available at the tracks I plan to race at however I havn't heard great things about the Associated TC6.1.

Thanks for the reply! It is greatly apreciated.*


----------



## Adam B (Nov 27, 2010)

CRC pan car is very popular at the Gate, and you would get a lot of support. BigZ and I run the Xray touring cars, and so do most of the guys at there. A small group do run the serpent. I would steer clear of the VBC car, even though people do have luck with it, it may try your patience getting it set up right, and nobody at the gate runs it to help you out.


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Adam B, what are your thoughts on the Associated TC6.1? Why does that car get such poor reviews from the racers?


----------



## Lessen (Jan 13, 2009)

I would just pick up a few pinions that will give you some options between 3.50 and 4.00.

The Gate is my home track but Beaver isn't too much further for me. Since their road race schedules do not generally conflict I'm planning to make all of both club's races this winter/spring. I run the Serpent S411te.


----------



## Lessen (Jan 13, 2009)

T28Pilot said:


> Thanks Adam B, what are your thoughts on the Associated TC6.1? Why does that car get such poor reviews from the racers?


According to the couple of locals who've switched from the AE to an Xray, the xray is simply easier to drive. Folks love the fact that the box stock setup on the Xray are pretty much money. I never ran the box setup on my S411 although the Martin Crisp setup that I started with was pretty darn close to it aside from springs.


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

What are your thoughts on the Xray T3R? Apparently it just doesn't have all the orange aluminum parts and otherwise the same as a T3?

Is the CRC Wildfire seriously that hard to tune?


----------



## Adam B (Nov 27, 2010)

T28Pilot said:


> What are your thoughts on the Xray T3R? Apparently it just doesn't have all the orange aluminum parts and otherwise the same as a T3?
> 
> Is the CRC Wildfire seriously that hard to tune?


T3R is not good for racing serious. The chassis and many other things are different. I know people who have made the TC6.1 fast, but I never owned one. I can tell you this, I have only been doing touring car off and on for 3 years now, and always used Xray. In those 3 years I have never not finished a race from the car breaking, and I hit and tap a lot. Of all cars out there, associated will probably always have the best parts supply. Some of my close friends run the Serpent and do well, but it has taken them awhile to get it where it is now. Plus they just released a new kit, so it will take some time to see how that one compares. Most importantly track support from local racers is important. Nobody at the gate has the vbc car.


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

You bring up some good points AdamB, thank you!


----------



## Mackin (Sep 27, 2001)

T28Pilot said:


> Thanks Adam B, what are your thoughts on the Associated TC6.1? Why does that car get such poor reviews from the racers?


I have had Xray cars in the past and just sold a 6.1. I picked up a t3/12 to use in VTA. Much better out of the box. I was faster right off and the car was much easier to drive for me than the assoc car. 

chuck


----------



## CarbonJoe (Jun 29, 2006)

Bigz84 said:


> What kind of car do you plan on getting?
> 
> As a few of us drive Xrays, a few others drive Serpents, and maybe a few drive an Associated. FRD is Final Drive Ratio, which is spur divided by pinion times the Internal Ratio of the car you are driving, usually around 1.9 maybe 2.0... all really depends on the car.
> 
> ...


FDR = (spur/pinion) * IDR

IDR = (diff pulley/layshaft pulley)

On a XRAY T3/T4, the diff pulleys are 38 tooth, and the layshaft is 20 tooth, so the IDR = (38/20) = 1.9

Re-writing the FDR equation as FDR/IDR = spur/pinion, and using the target FDR of 3.8, gives you 3.8/1.9 = spur/pinion, or 2.0 = spur/pinion. So, regardless of tooth pitch or tooth count, you want the spur to have twice as many teeth as the pinion (or the pinion to have half as many teeth as the spur). Since most of the guys have been running a 96 tooth spur, you would need a 48 tooth pinion.

The reason TC guys use FDR is that the rubber tires are all the same diameter, and hardly change diameter as they wear. The rubber changes through heat cycles, so they'll usually lose grip before they wear out.

Foam tire guys use rollout, since as the foam tires wear you need to change your gearing to compensate. Ideally, you want the car to move the same distance per motor revolution, once you have found the sweet spot for the motor you are using.

Rollout = (pinion * tire diameter * Pi)/spur, so in my case (CRC WGT 10LE),
rollout = (44*2.10*3.1415)/88 = 3.29 inches. Depending on track layout, etc. you may need to change it from there. It should be intuitive that as your tires wear, you need to add teeth to the pinion to compensate to get the same rollout. However, this would only be 1 to 3 teeth over the life of the rear tire.

Note that since all of these calculation involve ratios, they are independent of the pitch gears you use.

That said, almost everyone runs 64 pitch gears indoors, in both WGT and TC.

You'll find in WGT, the front tires wear about 2x as fast as the rears, so you'll go through 2 sets of front tires before you'll need to replace the rear tires.


----------



## T28Pilot (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks for the breakdown carbon joe, much appreciated! I was familiar with run out but was not "in the know" regarding FDR and IDR. I have always run at a track that used foam tires, never rubber.

I've also really never dove that deep into the intracacies of racing. Looking back i've always focused more on getting track time and being consistent, setting goals to fight the urge to try and go faster by slowing down and staying off the wall.:drunk:

I have never raced with Lipos either, im sure they are quite different than the batteries of the past and levels the playing field which also helps provide some closer racing.

Thanks for all the help everyone!


----------

