# Lighted 1/2500 Enterprise B



## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Hey everyone. I'm still wrapping up my Enterprise A build, but I'm not done setting up my workshop after moving so progress is slow right now. I'm starting this thread early because I'd like some input on some detail aspects of the Excelsior Refit... 

Let me first say I'm not necessarily going for screen accurate, case in point, I'm using the Federation Models decals which are blue instead of turquoise purely because I think the blue looks better. 

The first item I'd like to get some input on is lighting with the nacelles. I know screen accurate is pretty much just the little bands across the front of the nacelles. Does anybody know why the blue area on top was never lit? It seems like these are screaming to be lit, especially when you look at the lighting of the A, C, D, & E's nacelles. Was this a budget thing? In your opinions do you feel like it would overly ruin the look of the ship if I lit these? 

The second item I'd like to discuss is major sections like the officer's lounge and the arboretum. If you've been following my Enterprise A build, you've seen that I built those sections in. I'd like to continue that level of detail with the Enterprise B but it's very hard to find where they would seem at home. The schematic below has the arboretum in the bottom portion of the secondary hull, though it also labels the impulse engines as hangers. If I was to follow this, would the arboretum stretch across the whole deck like the Constitution's or would it be more central with an aft facing window? 
 

Thank you in advance for your input and thoughts!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Well, I've started on her. 

First off just wanted to share these beautiful reference pics I found... 
 
 

Here's the starting point for the build. 
 

To light the deflector dish, I mounted an SMD LED directly to the back. I'll light block everything but the dish on the other side. 
 

Last for the evening the initial hole drilling for the FO.


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

Deep Space Nine had the engine side bands and top glowing blue. They used Lightsheet in the AMT/ERTL model to get the effect. But when the showed the USS Lakota, there was no side/top lighting (battle scene with the Defiant). One could argue that all of the shots of the Lakota/Enterprise-B were not shown at warp, though the DS9 Excelsior class ships had the glow even at impulse. In Generations, they did re-use a shot of the Excelsior (ST6) flashing past at warp with the blue streak behind, though the 8 foot model had no such lighting. Voyager had a smaller Excelsior model made which did have the warp engines lit. 

So it's up to you, really. The re-use of the warp flyby of Excelsior (aka Enterprise B) could be a justification if the trailing streak is any guide.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

charonjr said:


> Deep Space Nine had the engine side bands and top glowing blue. They used Lightsheet in the AMT/ERTL model to get the effect. But when the showed the USS Lakota, there was no side/top lighting (battle scene with the Defiant). One could argue that all of the shots of the Lakota/Enterprise-B were not shown at warp, though the DS9 Excelsior class ships had the glow even at impulse. In Generations, they did re-use a shot of the Excelsior (ST6) flashing past at warp with the blue streak behind, though the 8 foot model had no such lighting. Voyager had a smaller Excelsior model made which did have the warp engines lit.
> 
> So it's up to you, really. The re-use of the warp flyby of Excelsior (aka Enterprise B) could be a justification if the trailing streak is any guide.


I decided to not go the route of fully lighted nacelles, despite the fact that I personally prefer that look. 

I'm planning on having this build fully animated so the space that I would have used for the built out interior like I did on the refit and extra lighting is pretty much getting eaten up by the extra wiring and fiber optic I'm running to accommodate this. 

The only major deviation from screen accurate is I'm pretty set on going the blue decal route vs the turquoise. It really just comes down to the fact that my favorite color is blue and the Excelsior class is one of my favorite class of starships so I want to do it the way I see it in my mind.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Yep. This design grew on me. Just like the original Excelsior. Now I like it a lot.


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## barrydancer (Aug 28, 2009)

I love this ship, too. I built the 1:1000 before starting my Refit, and really came to appreciate it. Never was a fan of the plain Excelsior.

Here's a great compilation of pictures of the studio model at auction for reference.
http://www.mutara.net/Christies/Lakota.html

I think that schematic you posted is as much fanon as canon. I don't believe there are any aft facing windows on the filming model where it says the arboretum is. Here's the Enterprise B MSD as shown in Generations.

http://static4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110412094943/memoryalpha/en/images/8/8c/Excelsior_class_refit_MSD.jpg


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## MLCrisis32 (Oct 11, 2011)

The B is growing on me, I just always loved the Sulu version more. However I do like the extra impulse engines it gives it a more hefty, semi truck power feel if that makes sense.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

barrydancer said:


> I love this ship, too. I built the 1:1000 before starting my Refit, and really came to appreciate it. Never was a fan of the plain Excelsior.
> 
> Here's a great compilation of pictures of the studio model at auction for reference.
> http://www.mutara.net/Christies/Lakota.html
> ...


I've already saved most of those pictures for reference haha. Every time I build a ship I build a folder that I fill with as many reference shots as I can find. These starships are a far cry from the cars I'm used to detailing! 

As for those plans they definitely aren't canon. My plan was to place the arboretum and the lounge side by side facing aft above the probe bay in the secondary hull. The decals have 2 rectangles that I was basically going to use as window frames. The problem though is I've come to find that I'm going to be very limited by space inside so I'm scratching detailed interiors on this one. Instead it will have an animated start-up sequence as well as different strobe lights throughout. 

Here you can see the secondary hull has all the window, torpedo, and strobe spots cut out. 
 

The bottom of the primary hull has all the windows/sensors, and strobes drilled out. 
 

And this is how I will be separating the strobe lights and weapons from the rest of the ship lights. 
 

The appropriate number of FO for the lights will be held together and isolated by a small piece of aluminum tubing. I will then glue the LED at the base of that so that it only provides the blinking light to the fibers that I want to blink. I will then paint the fibers when I do the light blocking so that any possible light solution from the primary lights won't impact the blinking affect on the finished product.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

An animated startup sequence in a model this size? OK. I'm calling the boys in the white coats for you now. You have gone off the deep end for sure.


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## MLCrisis32 (Oct 11, 2011)

Trekkriffic said:


> An animated startup sequence in a model this size? OK. I'm calling the boys in the white coats for you now. You have gone off the deep end for sure.


This build seems to be the definitive example of 'madness' but I'm eagerly awaiting the results


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Trekkriffic said:


> An animated startup sequence in a model this size? OK. I'm calling the boys in the white coats for you now. You have gone off the deep end for sure.





MLCrisis32 said:


> This build seems to be the definitive example of 'madness' but I'm eagerly awaiting the results


We'll see how it turns out. I was going to try this with manual switches for each one, but I made friends with an electrical engineer at work a few months back. He heard of my plan and had to step in. He's setting me up with an Arduino board and is going to walk through the programming. I can take credit for the wiring and kit construction, but the animation, if it works, will all be credit to him! 

I appreciate both of your interest in the build!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Looking at the shots of the Enterprise B from Generations, it seems to not have very much in the way of windows/lights. When actually go through and look at window placement throughout the ship and start drilling the holes, this thing has a lot. The saucer is a perfect example of this. It no longer has the relatively flat top that the Constitution had, but unlike the Galaxy that is sloped and contains window, it doesn't have anything in the way of windows in the sloped region of the saucer. This and the dim lights on the filming model leave the saucer to seem kind of barren. After mapping out everything and drilling the holes I appreciate a lot more how many lights there are. 

So, without further ado, here's this weekends update. 

I used tape to roughly map out the areas where windows needed to go. 


I would then use a sharp exacto to start a hole where I needed to drill. The hole allows the micro drill bit to bite into the plastic exactly where I want it to, not slipping around as you try to start a new hole. 
 

Then, masked off the top to paint for light blocking. 
 

Black for blocking. 
 

And white for reflection/distribution.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

I used the dremel to carve out some nice deep channels along either side of the top piece as well as hollowed out the shuttle bay area more as there will be an LED for the windows as well as another LED for a strobe. The channel is important less for the wires (the magnet wire is so thin that it doesn't really need it's own space) and more for light transmission as there are windows the whole length of the primary. 
 

This view shows just how thin the plastic is after the grinder as you can see some of the dark table through what's left. 
 

I had some photo etched grill material left over from model cars and planned on using this to add some texture inside of the probe bay.


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## ProfKSergeev (Aug 29, 2003)

Don't ever stop, harristotle; this is incredible.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

ProfKSergeev said:


> Don't ever stop, harristotle; this is incredible.


Thank you! 

Usually try and get an update in over the weekend, so sorry for the delay! This is the inside of the nacelle structure. I did the normal light blocking, but the reason I'm doing it separate from the rest of the upper secondary hull piece is there is I'm placing a strobe light in there. After light blocking I'll mount the strobe and fiber optics than light block again over top of that to help make sure the light is isolated. 
 
 
 

The next part is the upper part of the primary hull. With light blocking done I added all the fiber and used realistic water to glue it all in place. I ran it extra long in the middle to help ensure max lighting with two LEDs. Also, I used bare metal foil to add extra light blocking to the impulse engines just to help isolate them further. 
 

This last picture shows some of the strobe lights. I used aluminum tube to contain all the fibers for the lighting affects then I glued that to the top of an SMD LED. After that I can paint it all and the only place the light should show is the tips of the cut fibers. 
 

Thanks for looking!


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## sarah_bear_1701 (Mar 11, 2014)

That's a tiny scale for installing lighting! Cool!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

These nacelles are a pain to light! In order to get rid of the seem and help reduce the likelihood of hot spots for the bussard collectors I cut the front of the nacelle off with a jewelers saw. 
 

You can also see where I drilled out the fin on the nacelle for the strobe light. I glued the end caps together then cut out the section that will be lit. 
 

I placed tape around the outside of it, then filled it in slowly with Realistic Water. After that I drilled the holes for the lights on the front of the nacelle and glued the fibers in place there.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Strobes in the fins??? I think Andy and Barney got it right about you...


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

After some traveling with my wife we're finally home and I can get back into more of a set schedule with this thing. 

This picture shows the pre-staging for some of the lights and FO before light blocking. For things like the deflector, strobes, and weapons I wanted to get those installed before light blocking. My plan is that this will help isolate these lights from the rest of the ship so that there is no light pollution affecting the visual affects like strobes. 
 

This picture is prior to light blocking for most of the remaining parts. 
 

I used liquid mask so that I can remove the light blocking in the areas for the sensors. 
 

The black paint for light blocking. 
 

And the white paint for reflection. 


Thanks for looking!


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Excellent work! Liquid mask was a great idea to allow light to shine thru from the sensor lights. Your own mini Raytheon effect!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

After I pulled the liquid mask off the inside of the lower saucer half, I had to go back with black then white paint to refine the area around the sensor lights. 


Lighting test. 
 

I've got most of the FO knocked out that will be inside the probe bay. It had to be glued so that it laid as flat as I could get it against the hull in order to still have the bay.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

I had made a little grate to go inside the shuttle bay to add some realism. After the FO were place though, the grate didn't fit inside and with the FO painted white it helped to add some texture to the inside. That being said, here's beginning to assemble the secondary hull. 

 


Gluing the strobes and rear torpedoes in place.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

*OMG... You are insane!!!*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RijB8wnJCN0


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Trekkriffic said:


> *OMG... You are insane!!!*
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RijB8wnJCN0


Nice lol when it comes to this, I'll take that as a compliment.


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## Prince of Styrene II (Feb 28, 2000)

barrydancer said:


> Here's a great compilation of pictures of the studio model at auction for reference.
> http://www.mutara.net/Christies/Lakota.html


Anyone know how I can get ahold of, I guess Jim & Mary Ann, who posted the pictures from the auction on that site? There's no "contact us" button. The pics they have of the Defiant & the E-C were not taken by Jerry Silber, as stated. All but one pic of each of the ships are my pics, taken at Mohegan Sun casino when the tour was going on before the auction. That's my daughter peeking out below the Defiant's nose & my arm in the Trek T-shirt touching the E-C. Just thinking it'd be nice to be credited for my pics.
http://www.mutara.net/Christies/JerrysPics.html


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Before light blocking the top of the secondary hull I had to get the nacelle's wired and attached as there would be a strobe that needed to be light blocked into the secondary hull. I didn't bother with light blocking the nacelle's as most of the light would be directed forward. 

This process was ridiculously challenging and time consuming as I had to weave a strand of FO all through the nacelle as well as balance the wires for the LED's while gluing it together and to the pylons. 
 

After quite some time I was finally successful, but the end result isn't what I had hoped, though I kind of expected that. The end flashers will be dim because of how many sharp bends I have the FO undergoing.


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## jgoldsack (Apr 26, 2004)

I have found that if you want to get bends in the FO, warm them up a bit. While I have not been able to get true 90 degree angles, I can get pretty sharp ones if I either warm it up in warm water, or if it is a thicker strand, a hair dryer on low, or even a flame at distance can give a decent bend.

I like using the warm water because I can bend it easier, since I can use another item (like a metal strip) to bend the FO at the proper angle.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

jgoldsack said:


> I have found that if you want to get bends in the FO, warm them up a bit. While I have not been able to get true 90 degree angles, I can get pretty sharp ones if I either warm it up in warm water, or if it is a thicker strand, a hair dryer on low, or even a flame at distance can give a decent bend.
> 
> I like using the warm water because I can bend it easier, since I can use another item (like a metal strip) to bend the FO at the proper angle.


That's really good to know, I'll tuck that away in my tool box. Thank you!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Bottom of the primary hull has been attached and you can see where I'm running the FO for the strobes inside the saucer. 
 

Here's all the components as final assembly gets ever closer...


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Hurry up! I can hardly wait!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

You can see in this picture I hand painted the lights and FO with a reflecting layer of white before the spray painted layers. 
 

Black light blocking coat. 
 

White reflecting coat. 
 

Also, attached the bussards back to the front of the nacelles... 
 

... and got them puttied.


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## chood73 (May 5, 2014)

Awesome!!!


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## barrydancer (Aug 28, 2009)

Looking good. What kind of putty are you using? I'm looking to switch to something other than Bondo spot putty before working on the Refit saucer.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

barrydancer said:


> Looking good. What kind of putty are you using? I'm looking to switch to something other than Bondo spot putty before working on the Refit saucer.


Thank you! 

It's this stuff, http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/171314595561?lpid=82 

I was using some random putty not designed for body work, but as I've progressed I knew I needed to switch to something better. My first build using it was the Refit Enterprise and I was really impressed with the stuff. It's fairly easy to work with and after it sets is sand-able, though it's best to sand it before it completely hardens because it gets rock hard.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

This update will be mostly pictures. This is the process of attaching the nacelle's and secondary hull top to the bottom of the secondary hull. Everything had to be held just right by my helping hands as I found the right connections and soldered everything together. VERY tedious process...


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

All those little wires. Your eyes will be permanently crossed when this is done!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Trekkriffic said:


> All those little wires. Your eyes will be permanently crossed when this is done!


Probably true lol I'm 25, but I started wearing magnifiers when I do this stuff to help save my eyes. 

This is the first test light after assembly, just the forward lights in the secondary hull. They look dramatically bright in the picture, but in person they aren't as overwhelming. 
 

Got a mess of wires and FO in the primary hull to contend with even though the secondary hull is getting sealed. At least all the major soldering inside the ship is done. 
 

Just an underside shot while sealing her.


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## barrydancer (Aug 28, 2009)

harristotle said:


> Thank you!
> 
> It's this stuff, http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/171314595561?lpid=82
> 
> I was using some random putty not designed for body work, but as I've progressed I knew I needed to switch to something better. My first build using it was the Refit Enterprise and I was really impressed with the stuff. It's fairly easy to work with and after it sets is sand-able, though it's best to sand it before it completely hardens because it gets rock hard.


Thanks. I'll take a look at that. I was leaning towards Squadron white. Any experience with it?


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

barrydancer said:


> Thanks. I'll take a look at that. I was leaning towards Squadron white. Any experience with it?


Not to stray too far OT but I thought I'd jump in here...

I haven't used the Squadron white. I've heard it's better than their green putty. 
I prefer Tamiya Basic Type polyester putty for sink hole and seam filling. It stinks though and you need lacquer thinner or a solvent, like acetone, to clean it off your tools.
Perfect Plastic Putty is another filler putty made in the UK that I use. It's water based for easy cleanup and doesn't shrink. Sands easily too.
I've used AVES for years. Heard about it on Starship Modeler. Hard to beat when you need a strong joint. 
It's great stuff, doesn't shrink, gives you 30-40 minutes of work time, and you can smooth it with alcohol or water. 
They also make a solvent for that purpose but alcohol works just as well. 
You can get it so smooth that very little sanding is required, at least for seam filling.
The only thing better I've found is Tamiya 2-part epoxy putty which comes in 2 sticks; it's hard to find these days so I use it only rarely when I need something stickier than AVES.

If all of this is old news to everyone please forgive the intrusion as we return to our regularly scheduled topic.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Don't worry about getting OT, it's a place to hang out! :wave:


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

This post will have quite a few pictures... 

Glued and clamped the saucer together. 
 

First sealed light test. 
 

Finally an assembled, albeit rough starship! 
 
 
 
 

And... more lights!


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## barrydancer (Aug 28, 2009)

Trekkriffic said:


> Not to stray too far OT but I thought I'd jump in here...
> 
> I haven't used the Squadron white. I've heard it's better than their green putty.
> I prefer Tamiya Basic Type polyester putty for sink hole and seam filling. It stinks though and you need lacquer thinner or a solvent, like acetone, to clean it off your tools.
> ...


Thanks for the info. I'll give this stuff a try. Been using Bondo spot putty, but it's a dark orange and takes WAY too many coats of white to cover it up. For the saucer on the Refit, I'd rather go with something white.


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## barrydancer (Aug 28, 2009)

harristotle said:


> This post will have quite a few pictures...
> 
> Glued and clamped the saucer together.
> 
> ...


Shiny!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

For the Enterprise A base I had used a piece of wood with channels cut out for the switches and wires. This base needed a little more engineering to accommodate the arduino so I went with reinforced styrene. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

The next base I make will likely be a wood reinforced frame with a styrene shell. I'm not overly pleased with this one, but it serves it's purpose.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Catastrophe has struck! Once she was attached to her base, I was dying to see the thing lit up, so I hooked her up to a power source and started holding wires in place to see it lit. Then, I heard this funny "pop" sound. OMG, you've got to be kidding me! Design note: my last 2 Enterprise builds had resistors in-line with their LED series. The way my friend designed the board for this build incorporated the resistors into the board. Stupid, idiot me forgets that there aren't any resistors to protect my beloved, and sealed inside the ship, LED's. I fried 1 set of flashers and the primary hull lights. Seriously, almost cried haha! Months of work and it goes up in smoke (or so I can imagine inside... Scotty, give me a damage report!) in a matter of a second. 

Despite this setback, my friend insisted on us getting the board hooked up so that we could at least test that it was working properly as he had designed the board from scratch and we would figure out a way to approach the toasted lights. Normally I would use just resistors, but he did some trickery with transistors, voltage regulators and resistors. 
 
 
 

After we got everything hooked up, here's the first test of the lighting sequence. Keep in mind, I know the timing and the order are off, but you get the idea. 





Stay tuned next week for how I solved this nightmare!


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## chood73 (May 5, 2014)

Love the circuit. That is awesome! I thought my regular old flashers were cool.
I will be subscribing to this for sure. GREAT WORK!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Taking her apart was not an option. I use too many different kinds of glues and the plastic is SO thin in some places, it would have torn the ship apart worse than the Nexus :lol: so I had to devise an external solution. The wires I use are so thin that hiding them on the outside of the hull was a very real possibility. 
 

I drilled 2 holes in the bottom of the primary hull for new LED's, tucked them down inside, then glued them in with Realistic Water. This is where photographing every step came in handy as I was able to identify where things were inside so I didn't damage anything when I drilled into the hull. 
 
 


After that was all dry, I sealed the holes with Aves putty. 

I was never happy with the light distribution in the secondary hull so I used this opportunity to add another LED to the secondary hull as well.I chose this spot because I knew any surface imperfections would be hidden under the decal here.


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## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

I'm glad to see you didn't let that misfortunant accident stop you. Creative solution!


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Nice lighting sequence in the vid. Too bad about your blown saucer LEDs. Hopefully your fix works!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

So finally a few glamour shots with all the working lights. You can see the areas that still need attention with light blocking. 
 
 
 

I've started to add liquid mask to the deflector, engines, and bussards. 
 
 

As well as fine tuning the seams with putty and sanding sticks. 
 

I'll try and get a new video up in the next day or two. Take care!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Here's the latest video


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## Prince of Styrene II (Feb 28, 2000)

Very nice!!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Finally I can start on painting! Trekriffic suggested this stuff to me and it's awesome. It's called Dupli-Color High-Build Filler Primer. 

First coat of primer
 
 
 
 

And with the lights on you can see there's still some light leaks. Another coat of primer after sanding and the black light blocking layer on top of that should be enough.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

After sanding/filling and a second coat of primer the light leaks were cut WAY down and the surface is looking even better. 
 
 
 
 

Next step will be black for the last bit of light blocking, then the white base coat.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

The final light blocking layer with black before the white base coat and pearl is applied.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Finally time for the white! I did 3 light coats of white.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

The FO has been cut... 
 

 
 

Without the lights on. 
 
 
 
 

The next step will be the pearl coat and detail painting before clear and decals.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Wowsa! Nice to see this coming to fruition!


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Thanks for the compliments everyone! 

Pearl has been applied. These pics don't pick it up super well, but you can kinda see it.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Small update today, the bussards have been painted blue.


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Well life has be CRAZY busy the last couple months! As we head into the holiday season it looks like things might slow down enough for me to start building models. I just turned in my final project for my MBA a couple nights ago, so that's a huge weight off my back. Anyways, enough of that, update time! 

The impulse engines received their red paint. Additionally, I painted the neck black. I know it was technically a gray color and the black was caused by the shadows, but to me it always looks more black so that's what I went with. I'm using the blue decal set, so I've already departed from a canon look. 
 
 
 
 
 


Thanks for looking!


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Grrrrrrrreat! If I didn't know better I'd think this was studio scale !


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## harristotle (Aug 7, 2008)

Trekkriffic said:


> Grrrrrrrreat! If I didn't know better I'd think this was studio scale !


Thanks Trekkriffic! 

Here's a LONG overdue update! 

Decal work in progress... 
 
 

And lights!


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## Prince of Styrene II (Feb 28, 2000)

Looking good!! I like how the decals have snuggled down, especially the grey squares along the bridge.


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