# Seaview window woes



## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

Hi guys, 
I've been out of the modelling loop since last summer, hence the slow progress on this baby. Just got back into the swing of things recently. 
It's coming along nicely now, I hope to get finished soon. See pics below. 

Anyway, the one thing STILL holding me back (and the reason I took a break from it) are those darn windows. As you probably know the kit parts are a bit distorted (fisheye effect) so I want to replace them. I've tried using different thicknesses of clear plastic sheet, but everything I found was either too thick (won't bend easily, too rigid) or too thin (like paper). 
I also can't seem to get the plastic heated properly to try bending it. When I heat it it distorts and shrivels a bit. As it curves in both directions it's awkward to get it into shape. 

I tried just gluing it in and letting the glue hold the shape but the only glue I found was strong enough was superglue, but it fogs the plastic. 

I was wondering if anyone has made thin vacformed replacements or anything like that? Like I say I've been out of the loop for ages, (I only recently found out about the big flying sub kit, believe it or not!!  )

I'm at the end of my tether with this problem, I can't seem to make any headway with the limited resources I have 
Please help!!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

If you dunk the clear parts in Future Floor Polish, superglue won't fog them.


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## Antimatter (Feb 16, 2008)

http://www.testors.com/product/136635/3515C/_/Clear_Parts_Cement___1_Oz.


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

John P said:


> If you dunk the clear parts in Future Floor Polish, superglue won't fog them.


Whoa! Didn't know that! I think Future is known by another brand name over here, I'll see if I can find out what it is! 

Thanks John!


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

Antimatter said:


> http://www.testors.com/product/136635/3515C/_/Clear_Parts_Cement___1_Oz.


Hmm, I haven't seen that particular one before. Would it have the same hold as superglue? 
I was trying Humbrol Clearfix but it wasn't all that great, it just didn't have the necessary strength. 

I really need to get a bit of a bend into the plastic, so it doesn't stress the glued joint as much. I wonder if hot water will soften it enough. 
I think it's a sheet of PETG if that's any help!


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## backof (Mar 10, 2007)

Have you tried using a blow dryer? Find something with roughly the same contour you need, bend the plastic over it and heat it up with the blow dryer. It should put enough curve into the sheet to give you a better fit. Be careful not to heat it up too much though or it will distort the plastic.


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Some comments...

the model sub had FLAT windows. Part of the problem in the Moebius kit is they made the windows curved. 

The curved windows have a compound curve that is harder to work into flat plastic sheet, in that it bends in multiple directions. Vacuforming would be the best, or just make a squash mold copy.

They do make fog resistant CA glues.

Dipping parts in Pledge with Future Shine (it is not called just "Future") will prevent fogging. If parts are fogged, brushing on some Pledge/Future will remove the fog.

In some places outside the USA Pledge/Futrure is/was sold as Johnson's Kleer or something like that. Although I understand it may be discontinued now.

Check here for more info http://www.swannysmodels.com/TheCompleteFuture.html

I think (oddly) Great Models sells small quantities of rebottled Pledge/Future for people who can't find it locally.


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

djnick66 said:


> Some comments...
> 
> the model sub had FLAT windows. Part of the problem in the Moebius kit is they made the windows curved.


Seriously?!! I never knew that. It might be easier to put flat ones in the kit, I'll take a look when I get home!



djnick66 said:


> The curved windows have a compound curve that is harder to work into flat plastic sheet, in that it bends in multiple directions. Vacuforming would be the best, or just make a squash mold copy.
> 
> They do make fog resistant CA glues.
> 
> ...


I always read about people swearing by Future, it's said by some to be the best thing since sliced bread! :lol: I need to get myself some of it, I reckon! I'll have a look in the supermarket on the way home. Johnson's Kleer does ring a bell. 

Someone told me acetone might remove the fogging - unfortunately it just ended up damaging the test piece


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

I think it is called Johnson's Kleer now.
You could try using the packaging that covers toys and such, (heavy flexible clear plastic) it's easy to cut and bend.
I didn't worry too much about the windows' distortion:








Steve


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## BlackbirdCD (Oct 31, 2003)

Go with the Future suggestions - if you're still unhappy with the thickness you can try polishing them down. I've not looked at the parts in question, but you can sand, smooth, and polish windows like this. I've gone so far as to get the Novus polishing agents to do the trick. Definitely try it out on scrap plastic (if you can find the same type) to see how it goes. With persistence you should be able to get a crystal clear surface - then dip it in Future


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Steve, are those the kit windows you have in there & did you future them or install them as is from the kit ?
Bert


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Here is an earlier thread on this topic.
http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showthread.php?t=230913


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

Bert ,those are the kit windows I coated them in future and bam.

Steve


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

Result! The local supermarket had it! 



It's called Johnson's Klear. Going to give it a shot now!


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Hey cool, that was easy!


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

bert model maker said:


> Here is an earlier thread on this topic.
> http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showthread.php?t=230913



Yep - that was me, almost a year ago exactly, before I threw in the towel and put the sub to one side. Must be the most long drawn-out build ever! :lol:

Had hoped someone had produced nice thin crystal-clear drop-in vacformed replacements since then, but... oh well! 

Feeling more confident on making the sheet replacements now anyway! :thumbsup:


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

The kleer will even help hide some of the damage the acetone did.
You will need to polish the damaged parts first. If you can't find plastic polish, you can try using toothpaste...

Steve


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

steve123 said:


> Bert ,those are the kit windows I coated them in future and bam.
> 
> Steve


Well they look great steve ! Your entire seaview build is an inspiration. I did the same with my Pl Jupiter 2 window and it looks a little distorted however, the future dip removed all of the fine scratches & swirls that the kit window had. I saw my first seaview displayed at a hobbyshop and seeing one built really hits home how big it is. The guy who built it did not fill in the seam around the nose window and it didn't look bad at all. I am thinking of leaving my seam when i get around to building mine, & make the nose removable to get a much better view of the interior, plus, i can display it with different noses.
Bert


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

Thanks Bert! But I'd really think hard about not filling the seam, She looks great with it filled.
















Steve


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Your right, it does look a lot cleaner, now that i see a close up of yours. Are those the kit supplied belly lights or aftermarket ? did you make your own lighting ?
Bert


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

MML is gonna kill me for highjacking his thread, but the lenses are from the kit.
The lights are a strand of Christmas tree lights I installed in the sub.

Steve


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Thanks, thats what i plan on doing. which lights did you get, the 10 light string ? then back on topic.


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

It's a 3 AA cel strand, I can't remember how long..the bulbs I didn't use I wrapped in black tape. the ones I needed to light the sail and fins, I mated to fiber optic strands..

Steve


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## teslabe (Oct 20, 2007)

MML said:


> Yep - that was me, almost a year ago exactly, before I threw in the towel and put the sub to one side. Must be the most long drawn-out build ever! :lol.


You're in good company, I finished about 90% of mine and then the other kits showed up and they called to me in the night, like the "Twilight Zone" episode with the slot machine, so I had to do what it told me......

P.S. Steve your build looks great.....:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

steve123 said:


> MML is gonna kill me for highjacking his thread, but the lenses are from the kit.
> The lights are a strand of Christmas tree lights I installed in the sub.
> 
> Steve


Not at all Steve! 
Yours does look awesome. I can't believe those are the kit windows, they look great! Your cabin light is fantastic, nice and bright to see all the detail.

About the Klear. I fell asleep after I posted last, (looong day at work) but I did get a chance to try a few parts. And OMG what an effect it has! They're as clear as crystal! It did an amazing job on the pieces the acetone screwed up, the scratches are almost totally gone. Why oh why did I not get this miracle liquid long ago?

I'll try the windows proper tomorrow maybe. 
One thing though, what's the best way to proceed? Cut windows to size, dip in Klear, allow to dry and superglue in? Or does the Klear interfere with the bonding process? How long does the Klear take to fully dry? 

And as for masking - I gather humbrol masking fluid reacts badly with Klear, so that's out, but will tape peel it off? 

I found a slightly better thickness of plastic too, hopefully that'll help.


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

teslabe said:


> You're in good company, I finished about 90% of mine and then the other kits showed up and they called to me in the night, like the "Twilight Zone" episode with the slot machine, so I had to do what it told me......
> 
> P.S. Steve your build looks great.....:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


Kent! How are you! 
How did the stainless steel stand work out? I can't remember if you posted pics. I still need to get mine assembled! Looking for a nice bit of timber to embed it in!


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Steve, how many sets did you use & how did you do the navigation lights in the sail ? where exactly did you place all of your lights in the main interior ?


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## teslabe (Oct 20, 2007)

MML said:


> Kent! How are you!
> How did the stainless steel stand work out? I can't remember if you posted pics. I still need to get mine assembled! Looking for a nice bit of timber to embed it in!


Hi Martin, it's great to hear from you, you kind of fell off the radar..... I hope you're doing well....:wave: Not much work on the Seaview, I have so much going on with too many other builds, I'm so bad..... One thing I have been looking into is a way to get ride of all the FO for the Computer wall.
This is a 128x64dot OLED (Organic LED) display and it fit the space and would look much better then anything I could do with the FO, wish me luck...:wave:


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## MML (Apr 20, 2008)

teslabe said:


> Hi Martin, it's great to hear from you, you kind of fell off the radar..... I hope you're doing well....:wave: Not much work on the Seaview, I have so much going on with too many other builds, I'm so bad..... One thing I have been looking into is a way to get ride of all the FO for the Computer wall.
> This is a 128x64dot OLED (Organic LED) display and it fit the space and would look much better then anything I could do with the FO, wish me luck...:wave:


Looking good so far! The OLED is a great idea, certainly a lot easier to fit! 
I know what you mean about doing other things... I just started cutting parts off the sprues for 3x Fine Molds TIE fighters... must... resist... temptation!  One thing at a time! 
I have indeed been away for a bit... a particularly cold winter kept me out of the garage! But it's good to get back in the saddle finally. Need to get through my model stash!


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## teslabe (Oct 20, 2007)

MML said:


> Looking good so far! The OLED is a great idea, certainly a lot easier to fit!
> I know what you mean about doing other things... I just started cutting parts off the sprues for 3x Fine Molds TIE fighters... must... resist... temptation!  One thing at a time!
> I have indeed been away for a bit... a particularly cold winter kept me out of the garage! But it's good to get back in the saddle finally. Need to get through my model stash!


I have a Fine Molds Millennium Falcon and with about 900 parts it is still
in the box, there is just something about a Moebius kit that clouds my mind..... Just wait til the J-2, it will be all over for me.....


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## steve123 (Feb 9, 2009)

Ok, lets do this, Martin; The kleer wil work best on clean plastic. Pour the kleer into a bowl that will allow you to imerse the window..pull out the part, let it drip, you can wick away some of the excess with a cotton swab or a tissue. set the piece on a plate or something, and have a bowl or large container to place over the part to keep dust off while the kleer is drying. If you don't like the results, kleer can be removed right after applying by rinsing in hot water and soap, after drying, you will need to use an ammonia based window cleaner to remove it.
Martin, the kleer will prevent fogging. I'd try a thick super glue. heck, if the windows fit pretty well, white glue would work!

Bert; send me a PM and I'll answer your questions, or route you to the threads where my Seaview is. I finally found the post:
http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showthread.php?t=249582
Steve


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## GForceSS (Feb 2, 2009)

The super glue you need for non fogging clear parts is called Super Gold and I have used it many times with great sucess.
http://www.bsi-inc.com/Pages/hobby/oca.html


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