# 1:350 Refit Enterprise



## user1127 (Jun 11, 2002)

Does anyone know if this PL model will be available in February or March?

Thanks.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Aaaargh!!!


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

There is a 1/350 refit model coming out. When did this happen. LOL


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## Dave Metzner (Jan 1, 1970)

I'd say late February arrival in country and probably mid March for kits to be available at your local friendly retailer.
We are still finishing up the instruction sheet and awaiting revised decal sheet proofs.
This work should be completed in the next few days.
The plastic parts are all ready for production and the Box is done as well.
As has been the case in the past, development of this big and complicated kit has run well past our original release date.

Sorry that it has taken so long. But I'm pretty sure it will have been worth the wait.

Dave


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

What ?! Huh ? Hmmmmmmmmmmm.


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## petseal (Apr 23, 2002)

Thanks Dave for the update! 
If the pictures you posted on your site, and elsewhere, are any indication then it will most definitely be worth the wait.
Later, Petseal :wave:


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## redlawyers (Jan 6, 2005)

Yeah, late Feb. I can't wait! I bugged Doll-Hobby and they said to wait until Feb at the earliest. I have faith that this kit will reign supreme over the others. This is the BIG one that a lot of folks have been waiting for.


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## Scott Hasty (Jul 10, 2003)

Dave,

I cannot wait for this kit. Make it right the first time! I don't care how long it takes (March, April, May, whenever), take your time and get it right! Don't listen to the impatient ones!

Scottie


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## ArthurPendragon (Jan 4, 2004)

We waited 26 years for a ACCURATE model of the enterprise refit...

We can wait a little more...


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## BATBOB (Jul 14, 2003)

It also gives me time to save a little more for the kits as I've just blown $3500 on my car in the last 2 month. A necessary evil to keep a 10 year old car running.

Thanks Dave for the UPDATE.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

If March is when it hits the Hobby Shops, then it will be just perfect for me. It is my next trip to Birmingham, and that is where the shops are. Just in case I can find one, I should have the money by then. I hope my truck is big enough!LOL


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## Sword of Whedon (Jul 5, 2004)

Dave, any way we can get a PDF of the instructions when they're ready? Just so we can drool and plan and imagine?


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## Mike Warshaw (Feb 23, 1999)

It strikes me that it would be nice for a few of the guys who accused Steve Iverson of trying to spread a malicious rumor on this last go round could at least admit it looks like he was just reporting the facts when he said the refit was delayed until the spring. Agree or disagree with the way he or Tom Sasser have carried on their feud, Dave's announcement to us and RC2's announcement on the retailer's site confirms Steve's Retro Rockets bulletin. He wasn't starting some false rumor as some of the posters on these boards accused him of doing. How about owning up to that and maybe taking back just a few harsh words?

While we're at it, it seems obvious that if they're still working on the instructions, then the kit isn't finished and the idea that the boat was ready to leave on December 29th was in error. 

It's nice to see that a lot of the guys here who were so furiously impatient have suddenly decided it's okay and they can wait a few more months now that we've gotten the word from an official source like Dave Metzner. It sure seems liken the kit'll be beautiful and worth the wait. What'll be great is once it's out, these boards will really hum with all of the builds and hints and sharing of tips and aftermarket parts.


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## redlawyers (Jan 6, 2005)

I can understand everyone's enthusiasm! This is the Constitution class refit; Enterprise class. Perhaps statistically the most celebrated and loved ship by fans all around. I am counting the days, but good things come to those who wait.


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

^ Speak for yourself, Sparky. Nothing can replace the original.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

You got that right, pal.


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## Four Mad Men (Jan 26, 2004)

Amen.


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## BatToys (Feb 4, 2002)

I don't mind waiting longer for them to make sure everything is perfect.


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## Edge (Sep 5, 2003)

Just wondering,

Since you have extra time available, are they fixing the rim pieces for
the saucer, so the sensor lines don't cut through the windows?

http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showpost.php?p=943646&postcount=10

Thanks,

Edge


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

I think this answers the question, "What part of the refit model would Jesus criticize?"...


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## Edge (Sep 5, 2003)

jbond said:


> I think this answers the question, "What part of the refit model would Jesus criticize?"...


It was just a question and I'm not perfect, never claimed to be. I
don't expect a model to be perfect either, but hey they've go the
extra time, why not? Wait I'll answer my own question, because
it is a real project, in a real world, with a real budget, and they
had to call it 'done' at some point.

BTW I find it refreshing that Christians are the only group that
people are comfortable bashing in public.

Edge


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

I'm also perfectly happy to bash the French.


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

...and don't worry--people are perfectly happy to bash those awful, awful liberals who are ruining our country in public too...


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

Let's bash some models together!


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## Rogue1 (Jan 3, 2000)

:roll: I sure hope I see alot of FINISHED refits popping up a couple weeks after they ship. I would hate to think all this sobbing and finger pointing is just for fun. 

It's pretty funny when you think that probably 80% of these will be sitting on shelves in basements long after the tears have dried. :tongue:


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## Mike Warshaw (Feb 23, 1999)

Edge is my hero today, because he went over to Tom Sasser's Science Fiction and Star Trek Modeling board yesterday to get a few things straight about the release of the PL 1/350 Refit kit, which is more than I'll do since Tom and I had an offline falling out. 

Tom censored Edge's posts and his own responses, so let me tell you what I saw before they were deleted. Edge pointed out that for weeks, Tom led the board members to believe the kit was complete and was shipping on Dec. 29 and until yesterday, he did not acknowledge that it had not shipped on that date, even while posters were questioning whether the boat had left, whether the tsunami had held it up, etc; he even left some unlikely posts about RC2 producing short runs of the kit -- who knows. 

Thankfully, Dave Metzner let us know the instructions weren't even done, so obviously, the kit had not been ready to ship at all. Either Tom was out of the loop, which wasn't the impression he wanted us to have, or he was deliberately misleading the members of this board, which doesn't seem like his kind of thing. My guess is he's a lot further away from the decision-making than he'd have us think and just didn't know.

Anyway, that's when I posted my feelings that Cult was owed something from those who accused him of spreading malicious rumors when he said the kit was delayed, since Dave's post confirmed his announcement. 

Edge went on Tom's board and pretty much laid it out, telling Tom to his face how he had passively allowed board members to be misled about the ship date and let Steve be unfairly trashed repeatedly while seeming to take a high road. Tom has always said he's not the type to erase posts and for a while, he didn't. But now, he has renamed the thread from "Refit delayed?" to "Refit Q & A" and has deleted all of the posts he doesn't like -- even those explaining the shipping confusion -- but has left the posts that trash Steve. 

Here are some quotes. First, this from Tom, on Jan. 5, when we still thought the boat left on Dec. 29, and in response to Cult's announcement that RC2 announced the kit had been delayed:

"It is proceeding on schedule. You guys are panicing over a rumor [Cult's announcement of the delay, later confirmed by Dave M.] started with only one purpose; to generate chatter as the sender of those retro-news announcements (aka come and buy stuff from me! advertisments) watches the chatter about his 'news' on this and other boards."


Now for the posts censored by Tom sasser. This is from Tom himself, after Edge called him out on his board yesterday: 


"As posted above, It is proceeding on schedule. Granted, that schedule changes almost on a daily basis. It changes every time something new comes in, or something requires adjustment. Dave reported that the kit plastics have been run. Due to a delay in the instruction design, they did not ship on the 29th of December...I reported what I was told in December as a ship date of December 29. We're a week past that and it didn't happen. Oh no!! The last time I checked, I was passing along information as it was supplied to me from the product manager, and manufacturer. I hate to say it now, but there is a lot more going on with the design and developement of this kit than you will ever know. I am not, nor was I ever obligated to inform the board of any and all information that I have been a participant in or that was passed along to me. ALL things considered, what exactly would you have me apologize for?"

Edge responded:

"You don't owe anyone an apology for the model shipping later than

the 29th. However, you led us to believe (in the post of yours I quoted above),

that everything was going on schedule. The schedule you told us was

shipping on December 29th and you inferred that Steve was just trying

to create trouble and increase traffic for his board. Now, of course, you

aren't obligated to pass on information, but when you withhold information

and disparage others who give out factual information, that's just plain dirty.

You led us to believe that Steve was full of sh*t, and caused a bunch

of people to put up nasty posts, echoing those sentiments (you might

say: 'how did I cause those posts?' look at your quote above, and realize

we trust you, and you said it was on schedule and the schedule you told

us was Dec 29th)...By withholding the change in schedule, you created the impression that the kit had shipped on the 29th. I'm sorry you two have issues, but dragging us in the fight through misrepresentation, is a very unworthy thing for you to do. Respectfully,

Edge"






I wish Steve and Tom weren't fighting, but when you see that those posts were deleted, you can see it's wrong to think Tom isn't above some censorship of his own. My belief is that Steve runs a great business and a terrific site; that Tom engineered two great kits not by hand-sculpting, but in computer files; and not completely alone, but with reference help from a number of other people, including Gary Kerr; that without Dave Metzner, they would never have seen the light of day; that Tom is just an outside contractor but Dave is an employee; that Tom needs to stop working on the Exeter and get a k'Tinga done before RC2 kills the line for good; that Dave Merriman puts us all to shame; that I miss Yama and Markenstein and that we need Lisa Greco here more than ever.


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Mike Warshaw said:


> *>SNIP<*
> Tom censored Edge's posts and his own responses, so let me tell you what I saw before they were deleted. Edge pointed out that for weeks, Tom led the board members to believe the kit was complete and was shipping on Dec. 29 and until yesterday, he did not acknowledge that it had not shipped on that date, even while posters were questioning whether the boat had left, whether the tsunami had held it up, etc; he even left some nonsense posts about RC2 producing short runs of the kit -- who knows.
> *>SNIPPERS<*


Thomas never said the kit was complete in that it was shipping in sealed boxes so that all that had to be done was for them to be shipped straight to the distributors that I can ever recall, Mike. All he said was that the production run was complete and the kits were expected to ship on 29 December. I might could be wrong, but I don't recall ever seeing a statement that led me to believe the stuff shipping from China was a 100% and had all the pieces (kit, instructions and decals) sealed in a box kit. In fact, I'm pretty certain there are pointers to the decals not having been fully decided on prior to 29 December. Kinda puts damper on the "kit was complete" point your making... 

Why don't you let the grudge go, Mike? It shows in every aspect of your posts whenever the subject of Thomas Sasser comes up. If you're so concerned w/this crusade of yours to smear Sasser's name "for the good of the hobby" and point out all of his "evil faults", why don't *you* take the high road and just let it go...?  It's one thing to make sure that the truth is put out there for folks to read, it's another to put the slant on it that you've been doing the last couple of months - "for the good of the hobby".  

- - - - - - 

Jeffrey Griffin
Griffworks Shipyards
 
* * * * * *

Star Trek Scale Modeling WebRing


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## Mike Warshaw (Feb 23, 1999)

Jeff, you and I have had our problems. This isn't about that. I think Steve has been trashed unfairly. I think the board members were led to believe the kit was shipping when it wasn't ready.


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## tripdeer (Mar 7, 2004)

Guys... this can't end well. I suggest everyone just peace out and go build a model. The refit WILL ship, and I don't think it honestly makes a difference in your life if you get it tomorrow, next month, or this summer.

As for the arguing, let's just all turn the other cheek, shall we? Peace everyone, and let's just TRY to enjoy our hobby!

Dan

Oh, and PS, this is not a criticism of anyone in particular, as it happens all the time, but keep in mind that you're is you are. Your is your.


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Mike Warshaw said:


> Jeff, you and I have had our problems. This isn't about that. I think Steve has been trashed unfairly.


Well, one might say it was Karma, Mike. Iverson has been FAR from a saint in all that, as well. Neither of them are innocent of a lot of stuff, but you're apparently turning a blind eye to the big picture. 


> I think the board members were led to believe the kit was shipping when it wasn't ready.


You're wrong about folks being lead to believe the kit was shipping when it wasn't ready", Mike. I seem to recall that both Thomas *and* Dave Metzner mentioned that a shipping day from China was 29 December. I think that Thomas first wrote about it and Mr. Metzner confirmed it all back in early December, maybe late November. No one was "lead on". Shipping dates change due to a many things. You're taking what was said and blowing it all out of proportion, twisting it to suit your needs, giving you a target for your axe grinding, it appears. 

Anyhow, that's my last word on it all, Mike. The facts of the shipping debacle speak for themselves - Thomas didn't mislead anyone from all I've read. It was simply a matter of poor plant control and bad timing on a number of things. Perhaps PL/RC2 shouldn't have set a date at all. I know after all the whining and "end of the world" posts I've seen that I wouldn't blame them if they never announced another kit in development 'til they had the stock in the warehouse. 

*shrug* Life is too short and I've got models too many to build to get hateful. Why don't you go build a model and release your anger, Mike...? 


- - - - - - 

Jeffrey Griffin
Griffworks Shipyards

* * * * * *

Star Trek Scale Modeling WebRing


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## Mike Warshaw (Feb 23, 1999)

Right back atcha.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Ya know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna build a Polar Lights TOS Enterprise, designed by Thomas Sasser (all by himself), fit it with the new CultTVMan spinning LEDs, and finish it with JTGraphics decals purchased from Federation Models, and maybe some PNT Decals purchased from Tom Sasser.

I'll post pictures on everybody's bboards, listing all the above credits.

I will have availed myself of the talents of many people who contribute to my hobby.

We'll see who edits what.



btw, I imagine Tom is spending exactly as much time on the K'Tinga as RC2 told him to.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

I just gotta say that I am so glad that Thomas and Dave care enough about putting out the best product possible that they are willing to delay the release in order to make certain that everything is as good as it can possibly be. Checking, double checking, triple checking...every step of the way - leaving little or nothing to chance.

Be GLAD this is happening! It is a GOOD thing! It is a _RARE_ thing in today's climate.

In the end _you'll_ be so glad it was delayed, too!


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## grantf (Feb 2, 2004)

John P said:


> Ya know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna build a Polar Lights TOS Enterprise, designed by Thomas Sasser (all by himself), fit it with the new CultTVMan spinning LEDs, and finish it with JTGraphics decals purchased from Federation Models, and maybe some PNT Decals purchased from Tom Sasser.
> 
> I'll post pictures on everybody's bboards, listing all the above credits.
> 
> ...


I dare you!


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## grantf (Feb 2, 2004)

Edge said:


> It was just a question and I'm not perfect, never claimed to be. I
> don't expect a model to be perfect either, but hey they've go the
> extra time, why not? Wait I'll answer my own question, because
> it is a real project, in a real world, with a real budget, and they
> ...


On second thought no comment


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## CaptSpry (May 11, 2001)

you know, some of you guys can make this hobby so un-fun and just petty....THEY ARE MODELS HAVE FUN.....GEEZ :freak: 

James

http://hometown.aol.com/captspry/myhomepage/index.html


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

How about the refit decals that were posted! Take the Spacedock decals and use the on a spacedock model.


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## Otto69 (Jan 2, 2004)

*I'm amazed.*

Baffled even. That someone would think they're opinion as to why a model didn't ship on a certain schedule, a model/product they have NOTHING to do with producing, would matter to anyone else. Let alone that they could justify flaming, pissing, and moaning about it to such extremes as I've seen here. Maybe, MAYBE, if they were the head of Polar Lights, or the boss of Dave M, or something like that, I could understand that they might think their overbearing opinion was worth sharing. Not that it would be, but I could at least hazard a guess as to why they might think so.

Sheesh.


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## Edge (Sep 5, 2003)

Mike, 

I am the reason the thread was edited. I became too heavy handed in trying
to explain (what I thought was obvious), to Mr. Sasser. It did *seem* that
the readers were being led down a certain path, to trashing CultTVMan.

BTW You don't know how silly typing that pseudonyms makes me feel, but I don't know
Steve (met him once at Wonderfest), and I don't want anyone to mistake me for a
partisan in his and Thomas' dispute).

At this point, I'm willing to chalk it up, to Mr. Sasser passing along the info
he had at the time, and being unaware that the date had slipped.

FWIW Griff, Dave Metzner never put a shipping date down. Given the
fact that RC2 is a publicly traded company, I wouldn't expect him to
do so in the future.

Edge


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Get a life.


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## redlawyers (Jan 6, 2005)

Captain April said:


> ^ Speak for yourself, Sparky. Nothing can replace the original.


Easy there people. No need for flames. Just making a general statement. Don't need controversy over TOS and the Constitution refit. Other 1701 forums on the net have their opinions too...


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Edge said:


> FWIW Griff, Dave Metzner never put a shipping date down. Given the
> fact that RC2 is a publicly traded company, I wouldn't expect him to
> do so in the future.


You're right, of course. I did a search thru the forums in the wee hours of the morning after you posted the above and couldn't find it. I'd have sworn that I recall reading Mr. Metzner either agreeing w/the 29 December date the kits were scheduled to depart China specifically or of giving a "nod" to it in a posting some one made. If he did, I can't find it, tho will admit I didn't go thru every single post, just those that dealt with the Refit. 

My apologies.  It wasn't my intent to "lead anyone on." I stand by my thinking that there was no malicious intent in the giving of the 29 December date, however, as that's just ridiculous thinking. It would serve as little purpose as these pointless vendetta that so many folks seem to rejoice in spewing forth.....  

- - - - - - 

Jeffrey Griffin
Griffworks Shipyards
 
* * * * * *

Star Trek Scale Modeling WebRing


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

The way I see it when talk moves to threats, insults and the like, the best way to respond is to ignore the posts. If no one responds, then it will go away. In life if you notice that when ever news crews are around, violents and destruction increases. If no cameras are around, it will die out. 

This thread should be about 1/350 refit model. If you do not want to talk about it, shut up.


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## Prince of Styrene II (Feb 28, 2000)

Lloyd Collins said:


> This thread should be about 1/350 refit model.


And so it shall be!



Edge said:


> http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showpost.php?p=943646&postcount=10


What I find to be a truly amazing feature in this kit is in the detail that, I admit, I would have never even thought of to do once it's in my grubby little hands! And it's already *molded in!!* Take for example the pic of the gardens. Check out the water- it's got _ripples!!_ Waves *built in!!* _How cool is that?!?!_ Go'wan, just try to make a 1/350 wave! I triple-dog dare ya'!!



Mike Warshaw said:


> I miss Yama and Markenstein and that we need Lisa Greco here more than ever.


A-men! I'm just happy I got to meet Yama back at my first WF in 2000. Got my autographed Yama's Hawg (& the origonal artwork by Yama) happily displayed in my model room.
By the by, I saw Mum over the holiday & she's doing fine, as is PoS v1.0. "Little Anth" is now 18 & has his own car. Mum just found a new good job after some hassles with her previous one. Things are good in Styrene Manor.


EDIT: I just realized that this is post 1,350. Coincidence? _I think not!!_


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

Have you got you 1/350 crew ready? Since I bought 125 brass-etched, I have plenty to work with. I am going to have some sitting in the gardens, and in the lounge. If I can I will have a crew in the hanger deck. The cargo deck is nice to have, but it will be hard to see the crew down there. Of course, I need to see the model to make further plans with the crew.


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## Heavens Eagle (Jun 30, 2003)

Hmmm Gives new meaning to the phrase "Slow boat from China".


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## tardis1916 (Mar 24, 2004)

*We need a faster boat!*

Sorry to bring up the boat thing again


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

I think I will find a way to get the boat to dock in Mobile Bay. Then the refit models will be MINE, MINE I TELL YOU, MINE, HA! HA!HA!


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## Spellbinder99 (May 19, 2000)

I could give a crap.

I have four on order from Doll and Hobby. When they TURN UP on my doorstep here where I work in the Middle East, then I will be happy.

Untill then, so what about delays?

Honestly, the sense of entitlement in this hobby sometimes defies belief. They will be here, when they are here.

Cheers all.

Tony


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