# OT: portable generators



## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

Hey guys... I recently bought a portable generator to have as a backup power supply to my house for when the Next Sandy hits. 

After talking to my electrician and having a new panel installed, I settled on a Rigid 8000. I'm breaking the engine in and I wanted to ask if anyone knows how long I should run it before giving it it's first oil change? I've read that after 8 hrs the oil should be changed to flush any metal particles from manufacturing. 

Does that sound right? I don't know a lot about engines but I figure that it can't hurt, right... So, why not? 

Thanks men,
Jim


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

I own and have owned several generators.. the engine is like the ones in lawn mowers and riding lawn tractors...

Yes after the first 5 to 10 hours.. but I would do it at 5... and change it every time it starts looking dark. regardless of time.
and start it every 3 months and do not let the gas in it get older than 6 months old.

I currently own a Generac GP7000. and it has an oil filter as well.
I have been using generators since 1985.


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## [email protected] (Jan 31, 2010)

Oil changes as stated above. 

Todays gas does not store well due to the ethanol. It breaks down fairly quick and can wreak havoc on small engines. If you can get no ethanol premium I would advise doing that. I also would put some kind of gas shut off between the tank and carb. I run my generator close the valve and let it burn the gas out of the carb. I have yet to have an issue in any of my small engines since running the carbs dry.


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## Bubba 123 (Sep 10, 2010)

[email protected] said:


> Oil changes as stated above.
> 
> Todays gas does not store well due to the ethanol. It breaks down fairly quick and can wreak havoc on small engines. If you can get no ethanol premium I would advise doing that. I also would put some kind of gas shut off between the tank and carb. I run my generator close the valve and let it burn the gas out of the carb. I have yet to have an issue in any of my small engines since running the carbs dry.


i totally agree....
also, u can disconnect the fuel line after the shut off valve. 2 drain/flush 
the fuel tank of old or contaminated fuel :thumbsup:

make sure it has a fuel filter (after the valve, so u can shut off fuel from draining all over..)

an oil filter w/ be nice, if it has 1 also...

Bubba 123 :wave:


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

I use/install Sta-Bil to the gas .. always.
yes I drain the fuel every 6 months.. put it into wife's car.
has control valve to drain.. easy.
extra fuel filter is a PLUS.. 

planning is good. you got the generator for emergences .. so planning and preparation is key.
you want/need it to work every time its needed.
every time I do the test runs. I also use my power saw to load the generator. just for a minute.. you have (2) 110 volt gen/sets so test run both sides.


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## Jisp (Oct 19, 2008)

Interesting timing on the subject and the reference to the motors being like those of mowers and the break down of fuel over time.

It's Winter here in Australia which means I only need mow our grass about every 4 weeks. All of my gear is in good condition and when I did it about 4 weeks ago I found the mower and line trimmer hard to start. They eventually ran but both usually start first pull of the cord regardless of the season. A mental note of it was made.

Last weekend I went to mow the grass and could not start the mower. Checked a few things and could find nothing wrong. Wondered if the line trimmer would start - nope, refused to run. Grabbed the blower/vac.... same thing.

Figured it had to be the fuel which was probably about 3 months old in the cans. Grabbed some fresh fuel, drained all three tanks and flushed the lines. Bingo, all three items working again.

What interests me is the fact that I have never had this problem before. I wondered if the colder weather was causing condensation within the fuel cans but it's never happened before in Winter. Maybe I just had a "bad" batch of fuel.... or perhaps the fuel supplier has changed and the fuel broke down.

I'm quietly hoping it was just a bad batch of fuel because I don't consider 3 months to be old and want to be able to store it for that long.

VJ, I guess my message is that fuel quality is a priority for reliable operation and regular oil changes should prolong the life of your new gear and keep it running "tight". I'd change the oil after no more than 8 hours. I try to change the oil in my mower about every six months regardless of colour and hours.

Hats off to you for being pro-active.

Cheers,
Michael. :thumbsup:


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

yes the newer type of Gas (fuel) is of poorer quality than years past.
over here we have summer gas and winter gas. summer gas does not store as well as winter gas.. (its not really called summer/winter) but you get what I am saying.

I always use a FUEL Storage additive.. LIKE STA-BIL. but I still replace it every 6 months.

I need the generator when needed.. for Freezer, sump pump (keep basement from flooding) and the biggest part... my wife has health problems and her machine must be available 24/7... it also has battery power.. but only about 2 hours.


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

Thanks guys... Good advice!


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## slotking (May 27, 2008)

never ran into an issue with mine, ran it for years with only the normal oil changes.

but if it made in china, then maybe change it


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## Jisp (Oct 19, 2008)

Chuck, yep, I understand what you mean. I wonder if the real issue is actually water (via condensation?) entering the fuel. A quick search of Sta-Bil tells me that among other things, it essentially removes water from stored fuel. I've no idea how this works but in Aus I have heard/read many times that a little methylated spirits (denatured alcohol) also removes water from fuel. Perhaps it's the key ingredient with Sta-Bil.

VJ..... for the record I'm not suggesting to go tipping denatured alcohol into your fuel. Merely a discussion point.

Cheers,
Michael.


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## Ralphthe3rd (Feb 24, 2011)

Jisp said:


> Chuck, yep, I understand what you mean. I wonder if the real issue is actually water (via condensation?) entering the fuel. A quick search of Sta-Bil tells me that among other things, it essentially removes water from stored fuel. I've no idea how this works but in Aus I have heard/read many times that a little methylated spirits (denatured alcohol) also removes water from fuel. Perhaps it's the key ingredient with Sta-Bil.
> 
> VJ..... for the record I'm not suggesting to go tipping denatured alcohol into your fuel. Merely a discussion point.
> 
> ...


 Micheal, ALL our Motor Vehicle Gasoline, now has ethanol in it, upto 10%...and our Feds are considering moving the limit upto 15% ! Back in the day, we used products such as Dri-Gas to clear H20 from our fuel, and that product was mainly alcohol, but today, with the high ethanol content, our fuels absorb and burn the water off all the time, hence no need for such aftermarket products.
Funny thing that one of our HT'ers mentions using non ethanol Premium, as I'd like to know who sells that besides Race Fuel suppliers. And for the record, Ethanol and/or Methanol increases Octane, and it's my belief that Premium (91+ octane) Fuel actually contains MORE Ethanol in it that Regular 87 octane does


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

I guess the term is "HOT" todays gas does NOT stay as HOT as years ago..
like paint . some paints were considered "HOT" and must NOT be used on any plastic stuff..

but yes today's High TEST, will not last as long as regular...
there are places that sell 100 percent gas. at 91 octane. but there is only 1 with in 100 miles of me. and its 40 cents per gallon higher than 10% ethanol high test

and it is well known that 10% ethanol will give you 15% LESS gas mileage.


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

slotking said:


> never ran into an issue with mine, ran it for years with only the normal oil changes.
> 
> but if it made in china, then maybe change it


in the USA . gas is junk in 1 year... you are so lucky...

and Generac , upper range portable generators are 100% United States made.. engine and gen-set (engines with oil filters), and they say to replace gas every 6 months.


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

I looked into a Generac... The batch they made last year were very poorly rated. 
From what I read, most of the parts are made in China.
I went with the Rigid, after a fairly exhaustive research, and found it has a very high rating both among professionals and consumers. I'm able to run must if my house on it.
Not looking to live like a king during an outage, just need the basics, and my man cave .. Lol. 

My unit can handle ethanol as long as is E10.
Just changed the oil, it was pretty black for an engine that was only run about 8 hrs.
Started right up. Getting ready to add Sta-bil and store it until I run it again in the fall.
Thanks again for all the input, you guy rock!


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

the best of luck...videojimmy..

my Generac is 3 years old.. and is great.. but yes there rating has gone down. 
I had a coleman 2200 for 18 years... ran every time.. just needed more .. most of my house will run on 7000 watts.


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## Bubba 123 (Sep 10, 2010)

chuck_thehammer said:


> I guess the term is "HOT" todays gas does NOT stay as HOT as years ago..
> like paint . some paints were considered "HOT" and must NOT be used on any plastic stuff..
> 
> but yes today's High TEST, will not last as long as regular...
> ...


gas/fuels are rated in "Octane"...
and ever since unleaded was RE-introduced in the mid-1970's....
it's nose-dived....
octane booster OR airport/plane gas is MIN. 100% octane (last I knew..)
if not, "THAT" explains 4 a lot of WHY the private I.C.E. planes have engine troubles 

Bubba 123 (Father was a private Pilot & brother still is..) :wave:


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## slotking (May 27, 2008)

lets not forget the killer ethanol!

posted on my BB that my wife's truck is now getting a 100+ extra miles per tank after went from ethanol to no ethanol gas


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

"Initial break in" is pretty simple.

Unless otherwise specified, I always figure about 20 minutes, unloaded, at a skoshe above idle; approx 1500-2000 rpm depending on the motor. Then dump it while it's still hot and viscous. Thats kinda your normal camshaft/actuator break in. Rings take a bit longer, but all your commercially available one or two lunger "put puts" are governed anyway.

After that I just follow the manufacturers recommendations.

As for the fuel thing thats pretty simple too. Octane costs money. Period. Like Jeepman, I run my small engine carb bowls dry if I can. I also minimize the amount of canned gas I store during the off months. I never mix more than a gallon of two stroke mix at anytime. 

Rotten gas smells like moth balls. The more it smells like gramma's house the worse it is. If ya manage to get something running on stale fuel you'll barf the neighborhood out. :tongue:


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## slotking (May 27, 2008)

stable has worked pretty well for me over the years


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## Jisp (Oct 19, 2008)

Excellent information guys, thank you. VJ, I hope you never actually need the gen but again, good on ya for doing your homework now.

Cheers,
Michael.


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## NTxSlotCars (May 27, 2008)

I've used this for years...


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## [email protected] (Jan 31, 2010)

Ralphthe3rd said:


> Micheal, ALL our Motor Vehicle Gasoline, now has ethanol in it, upto 10%...and our Feds are considering moving the limit upto 15% ! Back in the day, we used products such as Dri-Gas to clear H20 from our fuel, and that product was mainly alcohol, but today, with the high ethanol content, our fuels absorb and burn the water off all the time, hence no need for such aftermarket products.
> Funny thing that one of our HT'ers mentions using non ethanol Premium, as I'd like to know who sells that besides Race Fuel suppliers. And for the record, Ethanol and/or Methanol increases Octane, and it's my belief that Premium (91+ octane) Fuel actually contains MORE Ethanol in it that Regular 87 octane does


Ralph where I live in the far northwoods of WI there are tons of ATV, snowmobiles, and boats. No ethanol premium is readily available here at about 60% of the gas stations. I use it in my Jeep as it can sit for 4-5 weeks without being driven. You do pay $.40 more a gallon on average but I swear by it and the Jeep even gets 21mpg on it compared to 18.5mpg on the regular.

I even did a test this past year to prove a point to myself. I had two one gallon cans. I filled one with no ethanol premium and one with regular. I let them sit in my garage for 6 months. January till June. I ran them in my riding mower. The regular had turned and barely ran in my riding mower. The no ethanol premium had ran like the day I pumped it. My 4 cycle riding mower is very picky about the gas it uses as it will sputter and backfire with poor gas. 

Keep in mind most of the pumps with a single hose and multiple grades of fuels, that there is still some fuel from the last customer still in the hose and filters. So if you only buy one gallon of premium be sure to pump at least two into your car first to flush it out. As I could not figure out why my new Husqvarna 346XP had rotting fuel lines only after one season. The loggers here recommended I pump premium gallons two into the car first then fill my chainsaw can.


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## IndyRC_Racer (Oct 11, 2004)

There is a forum here on Hobbytalk dedicated to small engine repair (http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/forumdisplay.php?f=107).

Lots of specific threads on different types of engine (lawnmowers, weed eaters, chainsaws, 2-cycle, 4-cycle, etc)


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## Ralphthe3rd (Feb 24, 2011)

Yeah, believe me, I know all too well how much mpg's we lost when switching to Ethanol Blended gas. BTW, I made an assumption before, as my State of Pennsylvania made it a LAW about 3 years ago, that All Gasoline sold in my State had to substitute Ethanol, for some other toxic additive that used to be in our gas here. And I assumed this was a nationwide switch- so My Bad. 



[email protected] said:


> Ralph where I live in the far northwoods of WI there are tons of ATV, snowmobiles, and boats. No ethanol premium is readily available here at about 60% of the gas stations. I use it in my Jeep as it can sit for 4-5 weeks without being driven. You do pay $.40 more a gallon on average but I swear by it and the Jeep even gets 21mpg on it compared to 18.5mpg on the regular.
> 
> I even did a test this past year to prove a point to myself. I had two one gallon cans. I filled one with no ethanol premium and one with regular. I let them sit in my garage for 6 months. January till June. I ran them in my riding mower. The regular had turned and barely ran in my riding mower. The no ethanol premium had ran like the day I pumped it. My 4 cycle riding mower is very picky about the gas it uses as it will sputter and backfire with poor gas.
> 
> Keep in mind most of the pumps with a single hose and multiple grades of fuels, that there is still some fuel from the last customer still in the hose and filters. So if you only buy one gallon of premium be sure to pump at least two into your car first to flush it out. As I could not figure out why my new Husqvarna 346XP had rotting fuel lines only after one season. The loggers here recommended I pump premium gallons two into the car first then fill my chainsaw can.


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## SplitPoster (May 16, 2006)

Have used Stabil for a long time and it has worked for me - we are in a very, very humid climate. I probably go a tad high on concentration. I also use a little bit of high quality 2 stroke oil even for my 4 stroke mower and edger gas- was told it would preserve the gas too, helps cylinder lube at start up (splash oil lubrication in small engines). Old 2 stroke mix smokes but always seems to burn OK in my trimmer and saw. 

There are years when we have had 3 or more storm threats. I have a small portable generator, dual purpose, run it dry after every use and test. It is stored in garage obviously, oil gets changed at least once a year regardless. I use the same quality oil used in my car. Thanks for reminding me, I need to check the hoses, bowl seal and primer to see if they are dried out! The stuff breaks down over time. My only suggestion is to use high quality automotive gas hoses, gaskets, sealers, not the cheap, unrated yard and garden stuff that may be crap, is definitely overpriced in the blister pack at the big box, and will deteriorate faster. 

I use non-ethanol gas in my 27 y/o BMW, exclusively if it's going to sit between drives. Around here 100% gas prices vary a lot, but the two closest stations both have it. if I can go by a Pure station there are multiple grades and it isn't that much more than regular.


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

Pure gas stations. I did not know there were any of them around..

my first part time job after school was at a Pure gas station... 

I have not seen one in more than 30 years. here in Ohio.


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## swamibob (Jan 20, 2009)

SplitPoster:

PURE Gas Station? Haven't see those for a long, long time. What's their current logo look like? Maybe a picture? 

Tom


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## eastside johnny (May 13, 2008)

chuck_thehammer said:


> Pure gas stations. I did not know there were any of them around..
> 
> my first part time job after school was at a Pure gas station...
> 
> I have not seen one in more than 30 years. here in Ohio.


There is one here in Lorain Ohio........don't know if there is any connection to the Pure from the past. Maybe just using the name.....seems to look like one of those cheap gas places that might be selling dated fuel but can't say for sure. Have not seen any others so it was interesting to read here that this one is not the only one around.


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## chuck_thehammer (Oct 24, 2007)

eastside johnny said:


> There is one here in Lorain Ohio........don't know if there is any connection to the Pure from the past. Maybe just using the name.....seems to look like one of those cheap gas places that might be selling dated fuel but can't say for sure. Have not seen any others so it was interesting to read here that this one is not the only one around.


 
If you can... can you provide an address... I would like to ride by and check it out... I live on the far east side of Cleveland... a nice afternoon ride.


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