# Prices...seriously?



## Toecutter (Sep 3, 2006)

I went into my local HobbyTown yesterday and found all the new kits...then my jaw dropped when I saw the prices.
Romulan BoP--$23. Yes!! A good price I thought, cheaper than online.
Klingon BoP repop --$35. Umm, say what?
And the big shocker...
Enterprise D- $54. Probably for all the clear and Aztec decals.
They had also gone up on previously-released Trek kits.
I had looked forward to buying the last 2, but the sticker shock threw me. Has anyone found them cheaper online w/shipping?


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/WTI0095P?FVSEARCH=<B>star</B>+<B>trek</B>+models
-Jim:thumbsup:


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Toecutter said:


> I went into my local HobbyTown yesterday and found all the new kits...then my jaw dropped when I saw the prices.
> Romulan BoP--$23. Yes!! A good price I thought, cheaper than online.
> Klingon BoP repop --$35. Umm, say what?
> And the big shocker...
> ...


That is why I have stayed away from re-pops. I built them once, don't care if it was 40 years ago. If I am going to spend money, I want something new. $50.00 for a poorly detailed, 20+ year old kit is a bit much, clear plastic or not. The additions to the RBoP are still inaccurate and even at $23.00, it is not worth it to me! Bring on the new stuff!!!!


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

I found the E-B online for $28, but was $34 with shipping. My local shop has yet to receive any of the new kits.


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

Well guys you can thank the President for high kit prices. The drilling moratorium in the Gulf, being shut out of Anwar in Alaska and rising prices of oil in the middle east is bringing us uncomfortably high kit prices and will continue to rise in the future. Get used to it. Gone are the days of reasonable Hobby Prices !


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Ductapeforever said:


> Well guys you can thank the President for high kit prices. The drilling moratorium in the Gulf, being shut out of Anwar in Alaska and rising prices of oil in the middle east is bringing us uncomfortably high kit prices and will continue to rise in the future. Get used to it. Gone are the days of reasonable Hobby Prices !


Drill baby....DRILL!!!!!!! : )


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## holt32 (Nov 5, 2009)

I got my enterprise-B for 22.95 at my not so local hobby shop about 40 minutes away but still cheaper then online.


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## James Tiberius (Oct 23, 2007)

Uggh, I'm sure its completely The President's fault right? Not foreign oil? Or a company or a business that raises prices to make a profit? None, really?

Yeah, the prices are why I haven't bought a few of them.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Let's not forget the USS Reliant, $30-$42 depending were you find it. Plus, the Aztec decal set R2 sells to finish the kit is $27-$30, and it just happens to be the only way of getting the side windows that go on the saucer/hull. The decals in the kit don't include the windows!


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

Ductapeforever said:


> Well guys you can thank the President for high kit prices.


I thought that a discussion of politics was forbidden here. if this forum begins to degenerate into a political bashing site, then I'm out of here. I come here as an escape from reality not to see endless and pointless political discussion, there are plenty of other places for that.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

I got the Romulan Bird of Prey reissue for $15.99, and the Klingon Bird of Prey reissue for $25.89, both from the same seller on evilBay. Shipping was $8.90, but that was still cheaper than it would have been for me to use the gasoline to drive 25 miles to my not-so-local hobby shop (50 miles round trip) and pay the additional 9.75% sales tax.

To tell the truth, there is _one_ hobby shop within 10 miles of my house, but they're not particularly well stocked except for car and military kits, and their markup would have increased the cost of each kit by at least 50%. And the brick-and-mortar shops wonder why they're losing sales to online shops?


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

Kenlee, 
No politics involved or bashing intended. Just facts based on the current economy. Perhaps I should rephrase the point I was trying to make , model kit prices are affected by the high cost of oil, in addition to tooling costs based on anticipated units sold and pre-ordered by distributors. Manufacturers don't have a care in the world if a kid in Styrene Falls, Anywhere USA can afford their kits or not, their target demographic is much older, with a decent job and plenty of disposable income. I was merely suggesting that the days of our childhood and under $5.00 model car kits are gone forever. This is an expensive Hobby as most Hobbies are. Tried R/C lately?


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## razorwyre1 (Jan 28, 2004)

Ductapeforever said:


> Kenlee,
> No politics involved or bashing intended. Just facts based on the current economy. Perhaps I should rephrase the point I was trying to make , model kit prices are affected by the high cost of oil, in addition to tooling costs based on anticipated units sold and pre-ordered by distributors. Manufacturers don't have a care in the world if a kid in Styrene Falls, Anywhere USA can afford their kits or not, their target demographic is much older, with a decent job and plenty of disposable income. I was merely suggesting that the days of our childhood and under $5.00 model car kits are gone forever. This is an expensive Hobby as most Hobbies are. Tried R/C lately?


agreed. and remember guys, this is a "niche market". the less units sold = higher costs per unit. 
besides compared to resin, or even some vinyl, theyre a bargain.


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## bigdaddydaveh (Jul 20, 2007)

I live right here in South Bend, IN and no one stocks the Round 2 kits. I drive past the Round 2 offices twice a day (four times when I go out for lunch) and I have to buy everything on line. Round 2 does not have retail sales at their office. A buddy stopped in and asked once and it's only online. Our local Hobby Lobby is the only retailer and they only stock the 1/1000 NX and TOS Enterprise kits. I have yet to see any of the other Trek kits.


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

Ductapeforever said:


> Kenlee,
> No politics involved or bashing intended. Just facts based on the current economy. Perhaps I should rephrase the point I was trying to make , model kit prices are affected by the high cost of oil, in addition to tooling costs based on anticipated units sold and pre-ordered by distributors. Manufacturers don't have a care in the world if a kid in Styrene Falls, Anywhere USA can afford their kits or not, their target demographic is much older, with a decent job and plenty of disposable income. I was merely suggesting that the days of our childhood and under $5.00 model car kits are gone forever. This is an expensive Hobby as most Hobbies are. Tried R/C lately?


My apologies, another forum that I used to enjoy going to and having lively discussions has been recently ruined by spammers who post mindless political propaganda and the way your original thread was phrased struck a nerve. 

You are right, the days of inexpensive model kits are long gone, but I have no problem spending $25.00 to $35.00 to get a re-issue of a kit that I enjoyed building long ago and would like to build again, beats the inflated prices that a vintage kit can bring on some auction sites. Companies like Moebius, Atlantis, Monarch and Phoenix are just the icing on the cake, giving us reasonably affordable kits of subjects I never thought would see the light of day, especially in today's economy


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## phicks (Nov 5, 2002)

Most of the cost of kits goes into designing and tooling them. Usually, the box costs more than the plastic that goes into a model kit. So please don't blame the President. He has enough on his plate already.

With the KBOP, the Reliant, and the Enterprise-B, R2 made significant changes to the dies, so we get hit at the cash register. Would you have preferred they just repopped the Reliant with the weird grooves in the sides of the primary hull?


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I hate paying $35 for a kit I have originally bought for $2.50 in the Sixties. Everything has increased in cost- mainstream WW2 Tank kits are pretty expensive too. Price of oil to create the plastic is one reason, the cost of production has forced a lot overseas, then you add shipping, licensing fees, it all raises the price of a simple kit.
I do enjoy having repops though. A lot of these kits I had when young and I did not build them at my current skill level- having a second chance to do them right is wonderful.
Garage kits are also expensive now- I do have a problem paying $85 for something that I can hold in the palm of my hand. With some subjects it is the only way to get a kit, and I know how they are produced and why they cost what they do, but still I find it hard to budget for something like that no matter how I want one.


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## Guy Schlicter (May 3, 2004)

phicks said:


> Most of the cost of kits goes into designing and tooling them. Usually, the box costs more than the plastic that goes into a model kit. So please don't blame the President. He has enough on his plate already.
> 
> With the KBOP, the Reliant, and the Enterprise-B, R2 made significant changes to the dies, so we get hit at the cash register. Would you have preferred they just repopped the Reliant with the weird grooves in the sides of the primary hull?


and the reissues just plain are better. Round 2 could have just reissued them with no changes at all. Bottom line is for a few extra dollars you get a better model. I am enjoying Round 2s reissues more than the Original Ertl releases of these kits. They are the same models but after Round 2s improvements they are just plain better and more enjoyable to build.


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## starseeker (Feb 1, 2006)

You also have to recognize that at this stage they're looking at selling far, far fewer that the first time around, so they're going to have to charge more to make it worth while. I've got three 90s Klingon BOPs and two '70s Romulan BOPs and have no intention of getting any of the re-releases. And I'm sure many Trek modellers are like me: old and sated. So there is less of a market this (last?) time around.
Also that D kit is way too expensive. It's $45 here locally.


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## BronzeGiant (Jun 8, 2007)

I have a outrageously priced model kit story.

When I was a kid, 52 now, at the Indianapolis Children's Museum, in the gift shop, they sold the Pyro Dinosaur series of kits. They were molded in this swirly gray-purple plastic, there were about 6 in the series, each one had about 6-8 parts and sold for $.29 each; I can't tell you how many I bought and built.

Now, Lindberg is selling the SAME kit, from the SAME molds, with the SAME 6-8 parts for......$13.95. Just...WOW!

Steve


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## uscav_scout (Feb 14, 2007)

I just picked up the Enterprise B re-pop for the local hobby store. about $30 bucks.

the only place that I have seen cheaper (even with shipping) is Mr. Iverson at Culttvman.

guess he'll be getting all my cash for now on.


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## DL Matthys (May 8, 2004)

Hobbies vs economics?
hummm

The point about* hobbies* is that money is no object.
Otherwise one should snivel elsewhere...
Use a mirror first.

DLMatthys
ipms 32708


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

For what ever the reasons, kit prices are getting a bit high. $15 dollars for a 5 inch styrene model kit? I have to pause on something like that. If it was half the price I wouldn't think twice about picking it up. 

Ive found I just need to wait for those "scratch and dent" or "clearance" prices as of late and not pick everything up right away. 

But, you know what? Food is way up and in smaller packages, Stores that used to sell things for "less" are selling things for "more". Retail prices in general are way up. 

I guess its a catch 22 for the model kit producers. They need to cover costs and make a profit. That means higher prices with this world economy. But probably fewer sales.


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## spindrift (Apr 16, 2005)

Hope they sell a case of the E D clear at $50+ price. That is a new level of greed IMO. This is a REPOP. New decals do not justify that kind of price- NEW tool,, yes of course. Repop.


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

That point was well made, the point of a hobby is, it is an indulgence. If we are serious about the hobby, we will buy what we will at any price. Unfortunately, it also makes the hobby unatainable at some point for those of lesser means. Forceing some to find a new hobby...stamp collecting anyone?


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

Ductapeforever said:


> Well guys you can thank the President for high kit prices.


I won't apologize Ductapeforever. You mention the President directly in your statement. That IS politicizing the topic regardless of what you think.


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## GSaum (May 26, 2005)

The President's fault? Really? Riiiiiight... I'm sure the fact that the rise of video games coincided with the decline of models (plastic kits, rockets, railroading) has noting to do with why they are so expensive today.


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

Everything is going up.
Except for our paychecks!
Nuff said*.*
-Jim


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

As I have tried to point out, ad nauseum, a large part of the price of these kits is putting them on a BIIIIIIG boat and shipping them across the Pacific Ocean, and then there are custom fees, import taxes, port costs, and shipping fees to get them across the country. That ain't cheep!


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

spindrift said:


> Hope they sell a case of the E D clear at $50+ price. That is a new level of greed IMO. This is a REPOP. New decals do not justify that kind of price- NEW tool,, yes of course. Repop.


From my understanding, the decals are a huge part of cost. I'd guess that's the reason the Reliant has the azteking decals separate.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

They should just put the file up online, those who shell out for a re-pop can just download and print their own, for a lot less. Those who want to buy them can pay the premium!


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

I have apologised for my gaff so Stop being immature. My statement was NOT meant to be Political. I digress again, not his fault personally, but the decision of the administration, there...hows that? SATISFIED?
NOW ...let it Go!

If that's not GOOD ENOUGH FOR YOU, argue amongst yourselves, but I'm out of it...for pete's sake!


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Probably the two thing most affecting the price of kits are labor and shipping. Labor costs in China have been steadily rising. This increase sends up the costs of items produced there and sold here. Shipping cost have risen dramatically as well. Just look how much it costs to ship something across the country as opposed to say five years ago. Now, imagine how shipping costs from China to the U.S. must have risen. 

These are two items that the model companies in this country have no control over and must pass those increases on to the customer if they hope to make a profit. When you add this to the already mentioned niche market where you sell fewer units and it's easy to see why prices are rising.

Those kits you bought for $2.00 in the 60's have gone up in the 21st century. Don't forget, in the 60's a gallon of gas cost fifty cents now it's over $3.00. The model companies aren't greedy or trying to gouge their customers, they're just trying to stay in business. Let's face it, if the people that ran these companies were greedy they could've gotten into another business that would be more profitable than model kits.


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

Ductapeforever said:


> I have apologised for my gaff so Stop being immature. My statement was NOT meant to be Political. I digress again, not his fault personally, but the decision of the administration, there...hows that? SATISFIED?
> NOW ...let it Go!
> 
> If that's not GOOD ENOUGH FOR YOU, argue amongst yourselves, but I'm out of it...for pete's sake!


I read back through the thread: No you never apologized. You did redirect, but your intent was clear enough. Usually first statements are, before they're re-thought through and edited for content. So, I'll go ahead and pretend your statement and this one wasn't meant to be political and pretend that I heard an apology. 

As for my being immature: I've already taken responsibility for my statements and not demanded that anybody be satisfied with the sarcasm you've shown to me here. As to what's good enough for me or anyone else: blame can be placed anywhere to anyone at anytime, which is why no politics are to be mentioned here. It stirs up heated feelings in a time when things aren't going too well for many people.

I'm just thankful, that the others reading this forum were sensible enough not to participate in this little free for all. A participation that I, while perhaps not sensible, had to follow through with to counter your assertion.


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

I don't know how much clearer I can make this so i will SPELL it....I A P O L O G I S E !

The only way this can become political is if YOU continue to make it political. What...do you want to do ,stone me to death next?


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

moderator, please put a stop to this unnecessary bickering.


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## Toecutter (Sep 3, 2006)

Wow...just...wow.
When I started this thread it was simply about my amazement on the high prices of the new re-popped kits, not fishing for political turmoil. 
A few months ago the 1/350 1701-A was around $60 online, and now the re-popped 1701-D clear w/Aztecs is $54. A smaller kit with fewer pieces costs almost as much as a much larger one.
I know hobbies are expensive. I used to collect Star Wars since I was a kid. Now the figures are around $9, and Hasbro releases about 80 per year, in addition to vehicles. Many of those figures are repacks that are slightly different than last year's version.
Several years ago I picked up some BoPs at a Kay-Bee clearance outlet for $1.98 each, I think. Now, the same kit but with metal landing gear is $34.
The new prices got me thinking about what Hasbro does to its customers. 
When Episode 3 came out, I bought the Republic Gunship toy for $20 at Wal-mart. Now, Hasbro sells it as an exclusive every few years thru retailers like TRU, Target, etc., for around $60. It's the exact same toy, just with a different paint scheme and a pretty box.
I'm not saying R2 should make their kits dirt cheap, but they could give customers a choice. Maybe have 2 versions of the 1701-D: clear w/Aztecs, $54, or standard, $25. And allow the option to buy just the Aztecs online. They already went thru all the trouble to offer us metal tin box variants with box art prints of re-popped kits, so this would be a fair option to ask for.


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

I apologize to everyone for dragging out that bit of unpleasantness. Subject dropped.


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## starseeker (Feb 1, 2006)

Back to prices. Visiting my LHS again this noon and the Klingon BOP is $31 and the Reliant is $37 here, in Canada's most northern major city. If you're paying more than this in the US where transportation costs should be way less, plus no duty/customs/and all the other associated cross-border extortions, then you're just getting non-partisanly gouged.


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## robcomet (May 25, 2004)

You think you've got it bad. Over here in the UK, they've just released the E-B kit at £37.99 - that's $60.79 to you good people! The Romulan BoP in the Collectors Tin is slated at £71.99 - $115.19! At least when the Revell Trek kits come out, they shouldn't cost me that much.

Rob


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## Zathros (Dec 21, 2000)

*I look at it this way:

Since I was and am a hard core "aurora " guy, as well as the other companies of thier day back in the 60's and 70's..when I returned to the hobby to purchase the kits I wanted from back then ..the "collector" prices were outrageously high..

Aurora LIS robot : 350.00
Cyclops & chariot 500.00
Spindrift :250.00
Voyager: 300.00
Moonbus: 400.00

Those are just a few examples..so when a Kit is re released...I have NO issues whatsoever in paying 25.00 or even 35.00 for a Romulan BOP..before it was re-issued ( without the improvements) it was at least $45.00 to 50.00 ..so I feel I am ahead of the game in any case..

However, I will draw the line in certain situations where I believe something is too expensive ..Like the Moebius Jupiter 2..Great Kit, great detail..but no offense to anyone..

I wont touch it with a 10 foot pole for 2 reasons..

1. Far too big for my taste..I use my dining room table for eating.
2. I wont pay $100.00 for any kit, no matter how great it is..especially
in these economic times.
Again, thats not to take away anything from the kit..its that at 51 years old..I have my priorities..but again..In order for Frank to have put the kit out, and at the size he did..it had to 
have that price point to make it profitable..and I do believe Frank said somehere in this forum, If he knew now what he did then, he would not have produced the kit..

In addition...as has been mentioned before, this is a "niche market"..I remember one particular " company exec " in this re-issue field..that said many times when asked for a particular kit to be re-issued " this kit has no mass appeal"..whenever he'd say that, I often wondered if he was in the wrong business, as he couldnt have any rudimentary idea of this hobby field or how it actually worked....as the majority of these kits will NEVER have any "mass appeal"..thats not what makes the sales of them..they are targerted to adults...NOT mass appeal kids..or anyone else in the "mass market " for that matter.

That said...the reason some of these kits are what some of you may call "High" is that they are produced in lesser amounts , as was not previously been able to do before..Infinitely lesser amounts..so it comes down to a choice : pay a bit more and get the kit produced and in the collectors/ builders hands..or dont have the kit at all, and in the case of re-issues...Pay the much higher collector price for an original issue kit...

I personally dont mind paying more..as its never more than Id have to pay some rare kit dealer or fight in an auction to outbeat everyone else to get a kit..

What I WONT pay in any way...is the "aftermarket enhancements" kits that to me, are outrageously overpriced...if a kit sells for say..$40.00 ...I wont pay $45.00 or 50.00 or even 85.00 which is so much more than the original kit...just to make it look "perfect"..
I understand that time and effort goes into thier "kits"..but in my 
equation...It cant be double, or triple the cost of the kit...my issue..
my choice..

so it boils down to what one rationalizes with thier wallet...and how badly they want to see the kit produced again...but again..the prices are not that outrageous..for this niche market...even new releases are not that bad..since we are lucky enough to have the factories accomidate small run numbers...that they did not do before..

Z
*


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I blame Sarah Palin.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

John P said:


> I blame Sarah Palin.


No, it was The Spanish Inquisition.........No one expects The Spanish Inquisition!!!!!


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Zathros said:


> *...I remember one particular " company exec " in this re-issue field..that said many times when asked for a particular kit to be re-issued " this kit has no mass appeal"..whenever he'd say that, I often wondered if he was in the wrong business, as he couldnt have any rudimentary idea of this hobby field or how it actually worked...*


Oh, he knew _exactly_ how it worked. "This kit has no mass appeal" is business-speak for "We're confident we won't sell enough units to recoup our investment." 



Zathros said:


> *So it boils down to what one rationalizes with thier wallet...*


And that's it in a nutshell. Moebius, Monarch, Atlantis, Revell, Round 2, et al, know what dollar amount they have to sell each kit for in order to turn a profit. It's up to each modeler to determine for themselves whether or not the kit is worth the asking price to them.



RSN said:


> No, it was The Spanish Inquisition.........No one expects The Spanish Inquisition!!!!!


That was _Michael_ Palin...no relation.


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## deadmanincfan (Mar 11, 2008)

Wow, I guess I'm the lucky one here...my LHS, from what I can tell, is charging SRP on their kits...and if it's a bit more than that, well, as a regular there I get a little price break...doesn't hurt, right?


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

You're lucky just to _have_ a local hobby shop, regardless of what they're charging you.


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## deadmanincfan (Mar 11, 2008)

Zombie_61 said:


> You're lucky just to _have_ a local hobby shop, regardless of what they're charging you.


You got THAT right, Zombie ol' buddy!


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

And to be fair there have been some re-releases and new kits at very affordable prices. 

Moebius's Wonder Women and Superboy, Atlantis's Bison and Black Bear, Pegasus's new Sci Fi kits in general are very affordable, and Monarch's kits are "priced to sell" even as brand new tooling.


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## Zathros (Dec 21, 2000)

Zombie_61 said:


> Oh, he knew _exactly_ how it worked. "This kit has no mass appeal" is business-speak for "We're confident we won't sell enough units to recoup our investment."
> 
> And that's it in a nutshell. Moebius, Monarch, Atlantis, Revell, Round 2, et al, know what dollar amount they have to sell each kit for in order to turn a profit. It's up to each modeler to determine for themselves whether or not the kit is worth the asking price to them.
> 
> That was _Michael_ Palin...no relation.


* Again, the kits wont sell to the mass appeal market...so dont bother to try, was my point...the demographic for these kits are probably 35-50 year olds...and NO kit company is going to sell 10,000 pieces of say..a Spindrift... to that demographic...so they need to get a grip..and accept that they are only going to sell small runs of any nostalgic line from any 60's or 70's TV show...*


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

True, but recouping their investment on a smaller run means increasing the shelf price per kit accordingly. With the economy the way it is currently, I can understand why companies would decide not to take the risk.


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## Seaview (Feb 18, 2004)

If I want a kit, I buy it. If I don't want a kit, I don't buy it. And I accept the price for what I want and pay it.
I will also pay more for Tamiya rattle cans than Testor's rattle cans, because I want better quality for my money. "Cheap can be expensive" is a motto I've long learned the true meaning of.


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## razorwyre1 (Jan 28, 2004)

spindrift said:


> Hope they sell a case of the E D clear at $50+ price. That is a new level of greed IMO. This is a REPOP. New decals do not justify that kind of price- NEW tool,, yes of course. Repop.


its also a "special edition", in other words, a low number run. as has been said, low numbers = higher costs, even with the old molds.


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## Daikaiju1 (Apr 26, 2005)

Don't know if anyone has chimed in re prices here in Australia, but the Moebius Iron Man, Invisible Man are $80 to $90. Space Pod, Chariot and Spock about he same. MoM Creature from the Black Lagoon $35

Big Seaview well over $200 and J2 just under $200. Kits are very expensive here, not sure if it is additional shipping cost, duty or whatever. Exchange rate is no longer an excuse as our dollar is = or ^ than US $ depending on the day.
Tha Bandai 1/500 Yamato is $116 in Hobbyco this week, I paid about $68 + shipping at HLJ before Christmas.
The reissue Angel Interceptor from Airfix is slated at 6 pounds-ish, will probably be around $30 here...

You guys can get the Worlds Collide Ark for $20, the Moonbus for under $40, Romulan BoP for under $20, so please don't complain. 

PS I am not picking on Moebius, I think they do a great job! Just using some examples that we all will understand.

Oh yeah, some others: The Revell Germany AT-AT is $80 to $120 depending on the store and the Clone Wars Gunship is $75 ($25.95 in SSM store) So there!


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## btbrush (Sep 20, 2010)

Just a few other thoughts, or half thoughts. 
1. Take into consideration how many hours of enjoyment you'll get from the build. Multiply that by what your job pays you by the hour.
2. It usually takes a model company about a year to produce a kit, from conception to the shelf. Unless you have a crystal ball, you are taking a be chance on what is still going to be popular a year down the road. Like the Lost in Space movie. Movie was OK, but the models are still cool.
3. It costs alot of money to produce a kit and most model companies count on having a 10-year payback. Some of Revell's aircraft are still going strong after 40 years. But them doing a 1/72 Gato sub (52" long) was really risky. A 500 ton (clamping preassure) mold cost $200,000 10 years ago when I was designing.
4. Nothing is going down in price. And plastic kits are petroleum based.
But it really does boil down to what you're willing to pay. I've grown alot more selective over the years. Use to buy every resin figure out there. Now I look for something with a big "wow" factor, or what it might be after I'm done with it. Resins are usually over $100, but you're also paying for the superb talents of a sculptor and it takes about 20-30 hours to paint. Like, I'm saving up for a 32" Nautilus that retails for $400. Just a few more paint jobs and I should be good to go. 
Model on, dudes and dudesses.
Bruce


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Insightful,Bruce......thanks.


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## Zathros (Dec 21, 2000)

btbrush said:


> Just
> A 500 ton (clamping preassure) mold cost $200,000 10 years ago when I was designing.
> 4. Nothing is going down in price. And plastic kits are petroleum based.
> But it really does boil down to what you're willing to pay. I've grown alot more selective over the years. Use to buy every resin figure out there. Now I look for something with a big "wow" factor, or what it might be after I'm done with it. Resins are usually over $100, but you're also paying for the superb talents of a sculptor and it takes about 20-30 hours to paint. Like, I'm saving up for a 32" Nautilus that retails for $400. Just a few more paint jobs and I should be good to go.
> ...


*that price your'e quoting is probably not the overseas cost...and to my knowledge, not too many Model kit molds weigh that much*.*.one figure mold I consulted on last year cost 9,000.00..I'm not a resin guy myself, but I can see your point on hours of enjoyment recouping the cost of the kit..not to belabor this to death, but again I myself, dont see the cost of these reissues being all that high..

Z
*


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## btbrush (Sep 20, 2010)

Hiya Zathros,
500 tons is the clamping pressure of the mold bases in the press. The steel itself only weighed a few hundreds pounds. And yes that was the price of a 5t mold out of Korea 10 years ago. A smaller mold for, let's say, an airplane is maybe $100,000-$160,000 and that's just for one mold. We saved alot of money by leasing the molds and just buying bagged shots shipped and packaged here in the US.
AND NEWS FLASH: just after saying prices don't go down, gas prices here just went down. Only 4 cents, but when was the last time you saw gas prices go down?


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

A couple things no one understands either are:

1) in a slow economy, manufacturers will raise prices. This is done because a certain number of people will still buy the item. For example, back in years past, maybe Revell made a run of 20,000 of a certain kit and it sold for $5. Nowdays, runs are shorter based on the number of actual quick easy sales, and the price is higher. They can make 5000 kits and sell them at $20 and make the same profit with less expense and overhead.

2) And the obvious... its 2011 not 1967. Everything costs more, but people do have more money. The proportion to the dollar is about the same. Even compared to the 80s its similar. In the mid 80s when I started working, minimum wage was $3.35 an hour and a model car was $10. So basically three hours work equalled a model car. Today min wage is around $7-8 and a model car is $22. So three hours work equals a model car. Its not like you are earning $3.35 today and the kit went up in price.

EVERYTHING today costs more. I use shoe boxes for storage and noticed a 1980s Nike box was marked $19 with a JC Penny sticker. When could you get Nikes for $19???? A cheap pair of Nikes today is about $60 and their better lines are in the $100 range or more. But models are what people comment about as if they were still stuck in 1967


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

djnick66 said:


> but people do have more money


I agree with everything you said except for one comment. PPL have been making less and less for 30 straight years compared to the value of the dollar and inflation.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

djnick66 said:


> A couple things no one understands either are:
> 
> 1) in a slow economy, manufacturers will raise prices. This is done because a certain number of people will still buy the item. For example, back in years past, maybe Revell made a run of 20,000 of a certain kit and it sold for $5. Nowdays, runs are shorter based on the number of actual quick easy sales, and the price is higher. They can make 5000 kits and sell them at $20 and make the same profit with less expense and overhead.
> 
> ...


A poor analogy. Gasoline, the very thing that comes from the same oil that plastic comes from, was only .50 cents when some kits were .99 cents. Gas is now around $3.00 a gallon or about 6 times what is was in the late '60's. That would mean a re-pop should only be $6.00 to give a company the same profit. Right now re-pops are about 25 times the cost from 45 years ago. Hmmmmmm, what is different now, as opposed to then?!!


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## Lee Staton (May 13, 2000)

What's different? Besides inflation, which affects EVERYTHING, the market for models is a fraction of what it was in the days of 98 cent kits! And do remember that model paints were 15 cents a bottle back then, and they're like $3.60 a bottle now.

Plastic modeling used to be THE hobby for young boys. Now the market has dwindled to a small group of older buyers. What Moebius sells of a successful subject in its entire run probably represents what the companies in the 1960's did in one week! Yes, it has shrunk that much.

So...the astronomical cost of molds is divided among 2,500 kits, and not 80,000 kits. Then there is the very real plastic cost issue, which used to be nominal. Printing costs have skyrocketed. And the elephant in the corner here is licensing. In the 1960's, the lawyers hadn't quite figured out how to make scads of money from doing nothing, i.e. letting another company take the risk on a product so they could pocket millions for just giving permission. The big conglomerates that own the movie studios know this all too well. Models cost more because of it.

I'm not sure what the whole point of railing against kit costs is. The kit market is so small today I'm glad ANYONE is producing in it...and it is a very risky, marginal business. Kits cost what they cost, and if we can't afford them, then we just don't buy them.

In the 1970's I drove an awesome Mustang that cost me $1,800. Gee, I wish Ford would sell me a new one for that now!

Lee


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## donaldmackenzie (Feb 6, 2007)

Try living in the UK where we are paying more in pounds £ than you are in dollars $, Im trying to get my kid involved in building models which he is loving but its so very expensive with kits, tool and paints !!!


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## Lee Staton (May 13, 2000)

That's the tragic part. No matter the causes, modeling is too expensive at the entry level. I probably had 5 to 10 copies of each Aurora kit, since they were usually 98 cents to $1.49. Mowing lawns and getting an allowance, I could learn modeling by trial and error. That 98 cents kit is now $25.00, which certainly puts pressure on a beginner not to screw up. Back in the day, they were disposable.

Lee


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## Dave P (Jan 5, 2005)

OK, now I'm starting to get worried. Too many logical, practical, level-headed and real world responses. Something in the water? :tongue:


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## clactonite (Dec 16, 2006)

I have to agree with rob comet and donaldmackenzie. Here in England the prices of kits are simply ridiculous. They are more in pounds than they are in dollars and are now beyond what I feel is reasonable. £64 for the Ent D (that's $103) or, should you choose one of the "specialist" sci-fi model outlets, £71.95.
Don't know who is setting the pricing here but they are going to kill the hobby through greed, a damned shame

Clactonite


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

Even with the higher prices those of us who are styrene junkies will continue to buy. Display models are very reasonable in comparison to the R/C side of the hobby. R/C'rs in my city are buying cars, boats, tanks, and planes as quick as the local Hobbytown can stock them. Price seems to not be an issue.


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