# JLTO rear axles



## Rickc (Jul 9, 2002)

I just read a thread on JLTO performance, and wanted to make an observation. On my JL's I have found the biggest issue for me to correct on most cars is that the rear axle is sloppy. I had a few old Aurora axles which are grooved differently. Once the axle was replaced, the car ran much more quietly. I unfortunately only had a limited supply of old axles, and am a tightwad and don't feel like buying a new batch. Does this tend to agree with y'all who run these a lot more than me?
Rick


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

I agree. The JL rear axles leave a lot to be desired. The material seems a bit soft and the splining is too deep and makes wheel removal and replacement harder than it should be. I've been searching for an inexpensive substitute.


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## dlw (Aug 17, 1999)

*Tuff Ones Axles*

If you have one near you, see if a hobby shop carries American Line parts. TO axles are usually under $1 a piece. Here's a couple online shops to try:

Jag Hobbies
Bud's HO Cars

If you can't find any, try using an Afx axle. They're very close, if not the same piece.


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## roadrner (Jul 21, 1999)

dlw said:


> Jag Hobbies
> Bud's HO Cars
> 
> If you can't find any, try using an Afx axle. They're very close, if not the same piece.



Have purchased from both, can't go wrong with either one! :thumbsup: rr


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Those are both excellent dealers that I've bought plenty of nice stuff from. I was thinking along the lines of buyer some bulk tube stock and making my own axles, mostly for the adventure.


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

AfxToo said:


> I was thinking along the lines of buyer some bulk tube stock and making my own axles, mostly for the adventure.


I'm always up for adventure too.Do you know offhand what diameter stock one would need to try this????

Mike


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

The Aurora and Tomy cars use a 0.0625" (1/16) rear axle and the rest the brands usually use a 0.059" rear axle. I know you can buy stock solid and hollow core tubing in those sizes in a number of different materials including aluminum and titanium. Of course an exotic material would end up costing much more than a stock replacement axle. But the cool factor would be much higher.


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## Guest (Nov 15, 2004)

Try a super II axle or find a better chassis. Production cars are sold as toys, it is up to us to weed out the good from the bad and make them go fast. 
I'ts the nature of the beast :devil: 
Hi performance is found at www.stores.ebay.com/daveshoraceway


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

You can also use drill blanks

Roger Corrie


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

I picked up some different sized brass tubing and rod the other night after work to tinker with the JL axles a bit.
What seems to be the problem in the cars I have taken apart is not the axles themselves,but the holes in the chassis that they go through.Very inconsistent at best.

I found that out after making a brass axle out of a piece of the proper diameter tubing,and then rod.All I ended up with was a sloppy homemade brass axles.

Next up,I took a piece of tubing I bought that has the same ID as the axle.I Dremeled off two small pieces,reamed out the axle holes with a small needle file until the press fit in.

Actually,on the first try,the axle fit into the brass bushings TOO well.So I put in a little rubbing compound,spun the axle in the bushigs for a bit,cleaned off the compound and then oiled it up.Problem solved,no more sloppy axles.

Mike


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Mike(^RacerX^) said:


> I picked up some different sized brass tubing and rod the other night after work to tinker with the JL axles a bit.
> What seems to be the problem in the cars I have taken apart is not the axles themselves,but the holes in the chassis that they go through.Very inconsistent at best.
> 
> I found that out after making a brass axle out of a piece of the proper diameter tubing,and then rod.All I ended up with was a sloppy homemade brass axles.
> ...


Excellent idea Mike......I had the same thoughts......I bought some really tiny rivets a while back to try and use for this very purpose


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## mking (Apr 25, 2000)

*drill blanks*

Roger, where do you buy drill blanks?


Thanks
Mike


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

That's a tried and true technique for making axle bushings from brass or bronze. 

I'll be interested to hear what Roger says about a source for drill blanks. I found this site: http://www.drillblank.com/catalog/ that sells them. The sizes that would be relevent to HO would be size 53 for your 0.059 axles (Tyco rear) and size 52 for 0.063 axles (Aurora rear). They're not cheap, but if you want a hardened steel axle they do work well.


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

But if the hole in the chassis is still out of wack,how would drill blanks help????
Or would it just be easier to use drill blanks and just go up a size,rather then make bushings????I bet a combination of the bushings and the blanks would be the ultimate setup.

I've been running the car this afternoon that I did the bushings on,and the more I run it,the better it gets.BIG difference I tell ya.I was getting pretty annoyed with the JL's to be honest with you,but there is now hope.

Mike


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Mike(^RacerX^) said:


> But if the hole in the chassis is still out of wack,how would drill blanks help????
> Or would it just be easier to use drill blanks and just go up a size,rather then make bushings????I bet a combination of the bushings and the blanks would be the ultimate setup.
> 
> I've been running the car this afternoon that I did the bushings on,and the more I run it,the better it gets.BIG difference I tell ya.I was getting pretty annoyed with the JL's to be honest with you,but there is now hope.
> ...


Mike, I'd say the bushings alone would be the answer......drill blanks would only really be needed if you had a badly warped axle....


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

No, drill blanks won't help you cure the sloppy axle hole problems. They're just another option for fancy custom axles. Nothing special there. Bushings on the other hand should give you a big improvement. That's probably why they are banned in most forms of organized racing. Better still is ball bearings...


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

AfxToo said:


> Bushings on the other hand should give you a big improvement. That's probably why they are banned in most forms of organized racing.



In all honesty, bushings may be banned from most racing classes for now....but as more and more get into the hobby and JLTO's gain even more popularity with folks and the axle slop problem is discovered with these then I'd expect to see bushings legal for use in an exclusive JLTO class. I've already been hearing that alot of people are looking at specific JLTO classes........so it's possible. :thumbsup: 

I played around with a JLTO chassis today.....I did install the homae bushings in my chassis with ease..... and I also dyed the chassis for the heck of it. The JL chassis accpets the dye rather well....I dyed mine purple.  

I'm basically going to build this chassis as an all out JLTO runner. I've dyed the chassis,installed the rear axle bushings,installed Wizzard dual flange rears with silicones, and installed a brass JW's independant front end kit. Next I plan on working with gear mesh and making sure all of the electrical rivets are nice and tight. So far so good.......


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

Tex....

I did basically the same thing as you did this evening.Except I made a front axle and bushings out of brass tubing and glued the stock tires to the rims.I ran it for awhile with rubbing compound in the gears,and it quieted it down and stopped the chatter almost completely.I also ground away quite a bit of the gear plate as well.I suppose it will help to keep it somewhat cooler.

The only problem I still have with it is over zealous pickup shoe springs.I squahed them as much as I could,which did help a bit.

Runs a heck of a lot quieter and better then it did for sure.It's not deslotting every few feet around the track like it was before.And, I learned quite a bit in the process.Fun stuff.

Mike


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## 22tall (Jul 28, 2002)

Mike, Springs were a problem with the round 1 cars. Try cutting a round off each spring and test. Repeat if necessary.

The sloppy axle hole showed up with round 5 (?) cars. Hope it is fixed for the bow tie cars.


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Being banned from a racing class usually means the modification gives a perfomance boost that would give you an "unfair advantage." In other words, it really works! This sort of unbridled and enthuisiastic quest for performance used to be the fuel for exciting race car building and driving. If you can find a group to race with that encourages this sort of innovation and craftsmanship you're going to have a blast. Well done.


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

AfxToo said:


> Being banned from a racing class usually means the modification gives a perfomance boost that would give you an "unfair advantage." In other words, it really works! This sort of unbridled and enthuisiastic quest for performance used to be the fuel for exciting race car building and driving. If you can find a group to race with that encourages this sort of innovation and craftsmanship you're going to have a blast. Well done.


Nah, I haven't found a local group.....in fact there is no local HO group. The closest HO racing group is 3 1/2 hours away  Captain Fred and myself are trying to start our own local racing group....in fact we're recruiting guys right now....I'm beating the bushes with sending out emails and talking with people I know. If we do start our own local league then these chassis bushings will be addressed....and our class for these would be open to the addition of the bushings....especially since Mike and I have so many JLTOs . Mike, I'll have to show you how I did these bushings, it's a breeze man....so have no fear :jest: 

I just mentioned a JLTO exclusive racing class because I have read posts on other sites where guys were discussing the JLTO....and the need for a specific class for the chassis. So I figure, when guys start focusing on tweaking these JLTO's for racing they will find the need (not want) for the rear axle bushings...........and if it truly is a need or requirement to make these cars run...then I could see it being made so. That's my opinion anyways :thumbsup: 

On the chassis I worked on I find that not only was there axle slop....but the holes were even drilled out of line.....pretty roughly too. I was successful in realigning the axle holes.......and I'm confident it will run fine. The "bushings" I made were nothing more than some micro sized rivets that I bought at a slot shop.........they had a decent length about them.....so I was able to drill and glue these in place (tight fit,almost pressed in) and neatly trim the excess off......and the axle fits nicely...almost a bit too snug. I plan on running the chassis a bit first to debur the rivets somewhat......then everything should seat nicely.....and I'll be in buisiness.


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## boss9 (Apr 19, 2002)

AfxToo said:


> This sort of unbridled and enthuisiastic quest for performance used to be the fuel for exciting race car building and driving.


Just like Nascar used to be


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

boss9 said:


> Just like Nascar used to be



AND NHRA.........I remember that story you sent me Phil about those racers that were basically black balled and thier engines mysteriously outlawed from racing.......so much for the spirit of competition.


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

TX Street Racer,
Unless its a modified class, axel and armature bushing are illegal everywhere. What a lot of folks do to tighten up the rear end when you have a lot of slop is go to a larger axel.

Roger Corrie
Virginia Becah, VA


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

vaBcHRog said:


> TX Street Racer,
> Unless its a modified class, axel and armature bushing are illegal everywhere. What a lot of folks do to tighten up the rear end when you have a lot of slop is go to a larger axel.
> 
> Roger Corrie
> Virginia Becah, VA


Roger, I understand what you're saying....but we're talking about JLTO's......which aren't really allowed to run in most classes,correct? What I'm saying is that I think as more people start building JLTO's and find the inherrant problems that most will be forced to remove that axle slop........and I think running these kind of bushings (really nothing more than slightly larger I.D. tubing) would become acceptable. After all, if this is a common problem then why not? 

I already know that running bushings in a standard Aurora Tjet isn't legal unless it's a modified class.....but these are a totally different beast compared to the Aurora chassiss


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## micyou03 (Apr 8, 2003)

Where I sometimes race they only race JLTOs and Aurora Tuffones. No mods allowed. If you want to run an Aurora T-jet you can, but you wouldn't have a chance. Actually the Aurora Tuffones don't come close either.


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

> What a lot of folks do to tighten up the rear end when you have a lot of slop is go to a larger axel


Another thing they do is loosen up their wallets and buy a bunch of chassis and pick the best one of the bunch.


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

AfxToo said:


> Another thing they do is loosen up their wallets and buy a bunch of chassis and pick the best one of the bunch.



Are you referring to JLTO's or Aurora chassis?? If we're talking Auroras then yes, there's no reason to have axle slop other than someone is running a worn out chassis.......but I'm talking about running JLTO's exclusively....not Auroras


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

Same difference,

Not all JL chassis are sloppy Series 1, 2 and 3 were fairly tight series 4 was loose not sure about the bnext series as I have some but never raced these

Roger Corrie


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## Rickc (Jul 9, 2002)

I am just musing here, but what if one carved out a bit of the plastic around the hole, and built it back up with epoxy, then drilled that out. Mix blacking in the epoxy, and nobody need ever know. Drill press needed for this one I suspect.
Rick


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Here are some interesting examples of what happens when race car designers are allowed to play around with new ideas:

http://users.pandora.be/aerogi/Racing/Weird/Weird.htm


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

Interesting site.I actually remember some of those as I used to follow racing with my dad when I was a kid.
I was always fascinated by the six wheel Elf Tyrell.Definetly one I am going to add to my slot garage when I get a chance.

Mike


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

It would be interesting to try to do a 6-wheel slot car with 4 rear drive wheels.


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

I dion't know what advantages or disadvantages it would have,but I agree,it would be interesting.Matter of fact,it's on my "things to try list".

Something else I want to try,and I know it's been done with the bigger scales,and probably HO as well,is a direct drive car.
I have an idea in my head that I would more or less have to build from scratch using a G Plus armature with the shaft as the axle.

Many other easier things to do first tho.  

Mike


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Mike(^RacerX^) said:


> Something else I want to try,and I know it's been done with the bigger scales,and probably HO as well,is a direct drive car.
> I have an idea in my head that I would more or less have to build from scratch using a G Plus armature with the shaft as the axle.


Mike there indeed has been a couple of direct drive HO slot cars built before.....I believe one was called "The Rattler" :thumbsup:


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## mking (Apr 25, 2000)

*rattler link*

here is a link to the rattlers. nice cars, i have 2. they dont see much track time, but sure are purdy . 

http://members.rogers.com/horacepro/rattler.html


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## Mike(^RacerX^) (Mar 15, 2003)

mking said:


> here is a link to the rattlers. nice cars, i have 2. they dont see much track time, but sure are purdy .



Wow.Neat looking car.I really like the MK 4.

How does it run???? I imagine it would be pretty fast???

Mike


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