# More time charging, less time racing?



## Outlaw 44 (May 27, 2003)

With the battery packs giving more and more run time, inevitably packs take more and more time to reach their peak voltage during charging. As if the 3800mah cells didn't give us enough run time, now we're pushing towards 4200mah, and then what?

I have no problem with a cell that gives me a steadier output on the track from start to finish, but I'm starting to wonder how my charger will keep up with the night's racing schedule. With the 4200's it will surely take at least 50 minutes charge time. Time between qualifying rounds will just have to be longer, or the racer won't have a choice but to have 2 chargers on deck if he or she doesn't want to charge at 8 or 9 amps to cut charge time!

The RC companies are going to work to find an economical solution to this. It's already starting to be a concern, now just imagine just 2 or 3 years down the road ( I can hear the Nitro guys chuckling in the background).

Unless we do away with three 4 minute qualifiers and go with two 8 minute qualifiers instead, then go to a 10 minute main. We can already do this in 4 cell stock with the 3800 mah packs! If someone is fast enough, he could have time to overcome a mishap that costs him a lap during a race. We would inevitably see more lead changes in one race! Concentration and a consistent setup would become an even bigger factor in the race's outcome.

What do you all think about this?


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## tommckay (Sep 26, 2001)

That would be great if you can get the majority to change their mindset about 3 qualifiers and a main. That's the biggest drawback to increasing time to 6, 7, or 8 minutes is a days race time, 15-20 heats at 5 minutes is already a FULL race day. You have to get tha racers to agree 2 longer qualifiers are enough.


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## patcollins (Sep 29, 2001)

If you dont discharge your batts all the way you still only use an x amount of millamps in the race. 

I find that with my 3300's I am only using 1500 mAh of the charge cause I use them twice in a race day.


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## Manning (Mar 2, 2004)

If you want to save some time charging, charge on the way to the track. I use a couple of Electrifly Peak 400 chargers. Only 2.5 amps, but if you have to drive more than an hour to get to the track, the batteries will be charged by the time you get there. Best part is that the chargers are only $30 each. These chargers work just fine with GP3300's, GP3700's and IB3800's. And 18T batteries, and transmitter packs, and......

I also do not discharge the batteries except at the end of the day. The batteries only take about 20 minutes to repeak (at 5-6 amps) if used for one 4 or 5 minute race. Discharging between heats is just wasting energy, and wearing out the batteries at the same time.


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## LittleR/CGuy (Apr 8, 2006)

you've got a point outlaw44. it sucks charging for 50, 45, and even 30 minutes! i think someone should find out if its better to use less mah batteries since it takes less time to charge. if someone tries that, let me know.


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

Tried that 15 years ago with 1200mAh cells  At an 8 amp charge rate it would take about 15 minutes to charge. Of course you could only run 4 minutes before the battery was dead.

You don't get somethin' for nothin'! It's all relative, if you want more run time it will take you longer to charge.


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## Manning (Mar 2, 2004)

If you are just bashing, get some Sanyo 1900 packs and charge at 7 amps. Less than 20 minutes and they are ready. I abused some at 8 amps when they were new. No problems. They get pretty warm at 8 amps now that they are 3 years old........

If you are racing, then to be competitive, you're pretty much stuck with the latest 3800+ batteries and nearly hour charge times.......  

Kids now days and their need for instant gratification......sheesh... :freak:


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## RPM (Dec 20, 2004)

Todays batteries.....3800,4200, etc..

This is where the future of batteries and motors is moving towards Lipos
and brushless systems.

No more matching batteries. 
Less cells lighter weight, longer run times..

WAAAAY faster motors then brushed motors!
Why are people trying to hold on to the PAST?? :freak: 

Forgot to mention that Lipo and brushless systems are out there TODAY!


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## hock (Dec 31, 1998)

I get the feeling that all the new technology is making racing boring. 

NO motor work.
NO Battery work.
Car comes RTR

Might as well by a Radio Shack car


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## CDW35 (Jan 17, 2006)

I havent been into rc racing for a to long of time, but I enjoy trying to build a fast motor, trying to find batteries and the challange of putting a car together and getting it to go fast, I agree with what hock says if we all go to brushless, lipos and RTR there would be no time into anything and what would be the fun in that!!!
Just a thought,


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## d4man (May 3, 2005)

To charge my batteries on the way to the track (promatch IB3800's), I bought one of these from Radio Shack. My LRP Pulsar 2 plugs right into it. I dont have a problem charging 2 batteries (for me and a friend) as long as you keep the car moving along the highway. Sometimes, I run into a problem when you're sitting in traffic.


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## Manning (Mar 2, 2004)

d4man said:


> To charge my batteries on the way to the track (promatch IB3800's), I bought one of these from Radio Shack. My LRP Pulsar 2 plugs right into it. I dont have a problem charging 2 batteries (for me and a friend) as long as you keep the car moving along the highway. Sometimes, I run into a problem when you're sitting in traffic.



Exactly what I did.......I did put some spade terminals on it for additional spots for alligator clips.


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## CDW35 (Jan 17, 2006)

d4man said:


> To charge my batteries on the way to the track (promatch IB3800's), I bought one of these from Radio Shack. My LRP Pulsar 2 plugs right into it. I dont have a problem charging 2 batteries (for me and a friend) as long as you keep the car moving along the highway. Sometimes, I run into a problem when you're sitting in traffic.


I mite have to check into getting one of them, Thanks d4man


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## Outlaw 44 (May 27, 2003)

I charge my 1st practice pack on the way to the track as well. If I didn't do that I would never get ahead on my charging schedule.


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## rctazmanmc (Oct 8, 2001)

One thing that can help is to get more people racing at your track so you have more time to charge and do whatever.

I am running 2 classes and it is almost mandatory to have 2 chargers to keep up. I also start with a fresh trayed battery when I charge so I know what you are talking about when it comes to the time it takes to charge. Pre-charging my packs gives them crappy output. I even charge my practice packs that way - 2 for each vehicle so I am charging a crap load each time I race.

I am reluctant on lipo and brushless for the fact stated above by someone - I get enjoyment tweaking a motor, adjusting springs/brushes and getting the most out of my batteries. Your are more involved with the vehicle and get more appreciation out of making good on something you changed.

If we all go to lipo and brushless then it boils down to the driver that makes the difference - since I see little other than changing gearing and maybe program profile for any changes on the car compared to brushed. Granted I am not the greatest driver but the batteries, motors and equipment helps me stay competitive since I have good stuff.

Just something to chew on. I think the industry will be going that way but it will take a good amount of time to get everyone on board.

see ya,

mike


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## hock (Dec 31, 1998)

hock said:


> I get the feeling that all the new technology is making racing boring.
> 
> NO motor work.
> NO Battery work.
> ...


IT'S WORTH REPEATING
WHAT WILL RACERS DO WHEN THERE NOTHING LEFT TO BLAME BUT THE DRIVER? THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO ARE THE SAME IS 2ND PLACE TO LAST PLACE. BECAUSE THE WINNER STANDS ALONE :thumbsup:


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## FishRC (Sep 28, 2001)

Boring????? No way!

This year I'm runing 3800's with brushless systems in my 4WD and Truck. I'm able to run more pratice, work a lot on the setup, and pratice! I'm not there back cutting a com, new brushes, springs, motor spray, ....... etc. draining my racing funds. Is it all cheeper, some, but I'm burning up more tires because I'm on track more!

I know for some the tinkering in the pits is there true fun and the on track is more validation on there work. But for me, I'd rather be on track.


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## hock (Dec 31, 1998)

so what do you do the other 6 days of the week


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## rctazmanmc (Oct 8, 2001)

FishRC said:


> Boring????? No way!
> 
> This year I'm runing 3800's with brushless systems in my 4WD and Truck. I'm able to run more pratice, work a lot on the setup, and pratice! I'm not there back cutting a com, new brushes, springs, motor spray, ....... etc. draining my racing funds. Is it all cheeper, some, but I'm burning up more tires because I'm on track more!
> 
> I know for some the tinkering in the pits is there true fun and the on track is more validation on there work. But for me, I'd rather be on track.


It will have to grow on people for them to accept it. Yeah there are a few at our track running brushless but until everyone else jumps on board they are the lone ones like a few of us trying to run 4wd mod.

Not sure on cheaper though - I know I have less into my motors and speedo than the guys with brushless - also a few of them fried their stuff already which leads me to the technology does not have its bugs worked out yet - that is apparent.

The future will tell what will happen with our sport. I see it slowly becoming mainstream now - just a matter of time for us to let go of the brushes and go brushless.........

mike


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## Mames (Feb 25, 2002)

this seems pretty interseting, as i was thinking about this during this past race day..

i run 2 classes, well my kids run in 2 classes. i am trying to race gas. but back to the subject. i have 9 battery packs that i use. one charger 1st gen. pulsar pro. chrge everything the night before at 5 amps, for practice. get to the trackk and watch the kids go thru the batterys like water, usally less than an hour..start charging first pack when they are good and cooled, but by no means the 3/4 hours cool down thats recommended.. usally 45 minutes. the first qualifier usally is the hardest to get ready for i usaaly just pull on of and stick it in the truck as my son walks up the stand. on average we have a hour between rounds and i charge at 5.5v to 6 v depending on the battery pack. by the mains every pack is usally cherged.. now the reason i was thinking about this was i had thought about running a 3rd electic but i would def. need another charger to do that.. no i am not fully discharging my batterys as mike, usally do that during the week. my kids only run in novice, so i do not do much motor work either, but tyring to run 2 electic classes and 1 nitro i do not have much time fot that as it is. then past 2 races i have opted not to run my class so i could get a ahndle on the kids racing before i go full bore with my 1/8 buggy...time is not on my side with this and iwas thinking of picking up ano0ther electic to run...flippen crazy...
i have 4 motors 2 are used in pratice and first 2 qaul. and the next 2 the better motors are used in the last qual. and main. cut the coms every other race weekend..

well i figured i would share my side of this to show it sould be done....

matt


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## swtour (Oct 8, 2001)

...here's a proposed race format change....that would take a LOT of patience, but would be so much fun if we could get on the same page with it.

NO MORE TIMED EVENTS

Race like the BIG BOYS for a set # of laps.

Run SHORT (2 - 4 lap) qualifying (Similar to FULL SCALE racing)

Use the qualifying to set your HEAT Position...

Run a SINGLE 15 - 20 lap Heat Race to set the mains. (Heat ONE sets the INSIDE LANE, Heat TWO sets the OUTSIDE Lanes.

Run 20 car mains (EVEN ON THE SHORTEST of TRACKS)...er um, you'd have to SLOW down then~ (To those who want to know how you do that...)

Run LONG mains with LAPS (100 lappers for example)

Do a pill drop (Pull a number from a hat) for an inverted start (ie: None, 2 cars, 4 cars, 6 cars, 8 cars), that way you never KNOW who will be up front...

Bump Ups from LOWER mains the rear 2 - 4 cars...so if you DO have a bad heat race...you can still RACE your way into the "SHOW"

PENALIZE the GUYS who DRIVE through everyone crashing them...and PREACH Patience, Patience...Patience~


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## Eppler (Aug 5, 2007)

Go to gas it empties you refill Receiver battery last half a day.


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

You are replying to a thread that is 1.5 years old.


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## RC 18 MT (Aug 4, 2007)

heres a solution get a mini those batts last like 2 hours running time on those and it take about 8 hours unles u use a quick charger.


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## swtour (Oct 8, 2001)

LOL @ This thread !

LESS TIME CHARGING MORE TIME RACING

1/10th Scale Oval - 17.5 B/L Motor w/ 3200 Peak/Orion LIPO

Charge 15 minutes run 
Charge 15 minutes run
Charge 15 minutes run
Charge 15 minutes run


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## CDW35 (Jan 17, 2006)

swtour said:


> LOL @ This thread !
> 
> LESS TIME CHARGING MORE TIME RACING
> 
> ...


LOL AWESOME


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## IndyRC_Racer (Oct 11, 2004)

What is the dump characterics of a LIPO battery. I saw some people racing this past weekend at the Indy Velo and it looked like when the voltage dropped the car immediately lost power unless they were thermo-ing the motor/speed control.


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## swtour (Oct 8, 2001)

Indy,

From what I heard from INDY was guys were Thermalling their MOTORS.

You do NOT want to dump a LIPO pack - I believe about 6 volts is the MIN. voltage from the 3200 type (A lipo cutoff speed control will cause it to SHUT DOWN when it hits that spot...similar to a THERMAL) This protects you from Ruining your battery.

I had my LRP B/L speed control set in LIPO Cutoff mode when I got it..and was trying to use in w/ 4 cell. Everytime I'd pull the trigger hard - the car would SHUT DOWN - I got the ESC used and had NO clue how to get it out of LIPO mode...drove me crazy for 2 races..including the one I went to in PHOENIX in April (Long way to travel to NOT be able to make the car run) 

Since then - I LOVE IT. My 3 GTB's don't have the LIPO cutoffs and I'll buy one of the INLINE units to use them in the lipo cars until such a time as when I upgrade to the NEWER GTB's. (I'm running the ORIGINAL GTB's in 3 cars...and LOVE them too)


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## DARKSIDE DAVE (Aug 16, 2007)

i like hock's suggestion we should all buy radio shack cars. i got dibs on the 1/18 scale blue and yellow rally car. i'll see you guys at the shack later this afternoon. and if you beat me there you beter not buy my car i already called dibs


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