# Need Help With Lionel HO Slot Car Track



## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

...specifically the Mystery Track Selector track piece that splits two lanes into six lanes and then back again with the second selector piece. I have these set up right now but the cars really have a hard time making it through without coming off the track,even at slow speeds. This is especially bad at the return piece. Just wondering if there is any trick to making this piece perform better. Thanks.


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## Rich Dumas (Sep 3, 2008)

This thing?










I have never tried to negotiate one of these, looks like small tires would bounce across the slots and a guide pin could get caught. What sort of cars are you running?


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## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

Yes...that is the one. I am running pretty much standard T-Jets so far. I am going to experiment with some different guide pins,magnet cars,etc...I have just set this up and so far it's a PITA. Thanks for your reply.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

I'm sure it's not without a few drawbacks ...

...but the carnage factor is right up there!


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## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

I am not opposed to some occasional "CAR"nage, that's for sure. I also have 2 railroad crossings in the layout to inspire just such moments. It just seems that this piece almost has to work better than it presently is. This being Lionel track,I am wondering if Lionel cars have shorter or wider guide pins? I wonder if the problem may be pin length...or size...in some way. Opinions? Thanks.


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## slotking (May 27, 2008)

I would use a car with no top gear plate to roll through the track to verify the problem areas.

is it the rails in general?
the slots?
are the shoes getting caught in the rail cross overs
are some of the rails pushing into the slot?
Are the lane changing dohickies causing the issue?

will a slim nail file help smooth out some issues?
will tapering the top edges of some rails help the transition? 

just some thoughts


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## Dslot (Sep 2, 2007)

TUFFONE, 

Modelmotorist.com has these two pictures in their Chassis - Lionel section, among others. From the drawing, the pin looks pretty much like a regular round Aurora style pin.
-- D


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## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

Thanks for that info and pictures. I am about ready to throw in the towel on this one. I have tried different types of guide pins and lengths. Different cars, magnet cars,whatever I have. Some were better than others but the overall performance of this track piece is just too random to use everyday. It's too bad as you can really put together an interesting layout with these.


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## Dslot (Sep 2, 2007)

TUFFONE said:


> ... This being Lionel track,I am wondering if Lionel cars have shorter or wider guide pins? I wonder if the problem may be pin length...or size...in some way. Opinions? Thanks.


Wooo. Such luck.
I was able to locate *both* my one complete Lionel chassis _*and*_ my digital caliper.

The Lionel guide pin appears to be the original. It is 
.195" long, 
.051" front to back at the base, tapering to
.038" front-to-back and 
.034" side-to-side at the tip.
(probably started off round and became oval from slot wear), 
.10" (approx) projection into the slot
which I measured by holding plastic stock of various thicknesses 
across the tires, until I found one even with the tip of the pin. 
The tires measure .413" dia., but are hard, probably worn and shrunken slightly, so the pin might have projected even less into the slot when they were new. 

For comparison I measured an open-rivet original T-jet with very little wear.
The pin is
.189" long,
.046" dia. at the tip, 
.111" projection into the slot. 
but the tires have been replaced. They are .393" dia. so the pin might not have projected quite as far with fresh, original tires.

I don't know if that's useful, but you asked, I was curious, and there it is. The Lionel pin is thinner, and projects appr. .011" less into the slot, assuming all my examples are representative.

Cheers,
-- D


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## Dslot (Sep 2, 2007)

-- deleted --


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## Dslot (Sep 2, 2007)

TUFFONE said:


> Thanks for that info and pictures. I am about ready to throw in the towel on this one. I have tried different types of guide pins and lengths. Different cars, magnet cars,whatever I have. Some were better than others but the overall performance of this track piece is just too random to use everyday.


This is something of a desperate suggestion, but old-time model railroaders used to build their own turnouts (track switches) and one way they checked them was to cut a test car base of clear plexiglas and fasten the trucks (swiveling wheel frames) to it in the right locations. Then they would slowly push or pull the car through the switchwork. By observing through the clear floor, they could see exactly where a wheel-flange began to ride up over the rail or pick the switchpoint or whatever.

You might be able to modify a junk chassis by sawing out the plastic floor between the two rails that hold the front axle. Replace it with clear sheet, and drill a hole for a wire guide pin, making sure it projects the same distance into the slot as a stock guide pin. Put on your Magni-focusers, and push the test car through the trackwork, watching for where the pin strikes an obstruction, goes into the wrong slot, etc.

A fair amount of work with no guarantee of usefulness, but I thought I'd suggest it, just in case you were up for it.



> It's too bad as you can really put together an interesting layout with these.


What is the thing for, and how is it supposed to be used? Can you manually set movable points to guide a car on a chosen path, or was the car supposed to randomly find a path? Or did the car pin change the setting so the next car would take a different route? I assume it was to split routes for a multi-path highway display setup at slow speeds, not a raceway. But still, what the heck? :freak: 

-- D


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

there is a built in split on Gilbert's 0-Gauge James Bond 007 set.
the tiny lever that selects the direction of the car changes to the other choice upon one car passing through it.
the design only changes the route for a brief distance and the cars always remain in their respective lanes.
based on that design, which has fewer possibilities, each car would take the second choice of lanes the next time around.
in the Gilbert's track one could manually (no switch) adjust either or both lanes for the first pass and allow the continued alternating lane selection while making laps.
I suppose each could be manipulated manually during a lap to continue on the same path as previous.
this is all circumstantial to either of the cars ever making a complete lap on the 6 piece landscaped track.
it was (is) problematic for many reasons and the original Gilbert's inline type chassis ran so poorly that Gillbert's bought a quantity of Aurora 0-Gauge chassis to include in sets.

but, I digress. that is the only experience I have with that type of lane selecting device.
I too am curious to learn how to make it work to it's designed potential.
the previous suggestions all sound good.

I am curious as to the rail connections across the lane changes.
the Gilbert's has them wired (soldered to the rails) under the track.

based on the pics of the lionel, I would think momentary shorting of rails could still take place.

perspiring minds want to know


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## Rich Dumas (Sep 3, 2008)

If your cars always deslot when they try to negotiate the section it hardly matters if you don't know how it was supposed to work. A friend of mine had a combined Atlas slot track and HO RR layout with one grade crossing. Getting through the crossing was a crapshoot with the cars coming out of the slot at random times. He did tinker with the crossing and made it better, but he never entirely eliminated the problem. Even with plain old Tomy track T-Jets can have a problem because the slots get a little wider at the ends of each section. That makes little pockets at the joints that can catch a guide pin.


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## Rich Dumas (Sep 3, 2008)

If your cars always deslot when they try to negotiate the section it hardly matters if you don't know how it was supposed to work. A friend of mine had a combined Atlas slot track and HO RR layout with one grade crossing. Getting through the crossing was a crapshoot with the cars coming out of the slot at random times. He did tinker with the crossing and made it better, but he never entirely eliminated the problem. Even with plain old Tomy track T-Jets can have a problem because the slots get a little wider at the ends of each section. That makes little pockets at the joints that can catch a guide pin.
Can modern high downforce cars get through this section? How about Magnatraction or X-Traction cars?


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## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

The cars don't deslot every time...but they do so often enough that I can't live with it. I am going to take them out and revise my layout, probably later today. T-jets with a traction magnet worked better than just a standard T-jet chassis. As far as guide pins go, I tried a few different types and lengths. The best one was a T-jet guide where the pin has been designed as more of a small blade...think AFX blade side of the reversible pin but smaller. The selector track seems to be much more reliable on the section going in than on the section coming out. The out side on this layout is the one with the guardrails. I will set these aside for now. I will later work on them on the desktop to see if a minor modification might solve the problem. I would still like to use them in the future. Here are a couple pictures of the layout that I have been working on. The Aurora railroad crossings work perfectly on both the slot and train sides. Thanks again.


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

TUFFONE, curious, .... does the exit section have the same little "toggle" lane selectors as the entrance section?

if so, removing them might be a solution


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## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

The exit section does not have the cams installed. I believe that this is the way it was intended to operate. I tried it both ways,with and without. If the cam was turned the right way,the exit seemed to be a bit smoother. If the cam was turned the other direction on re-entry, it was like running into a wall...Spectacular failure! Busted a few guide pins testing this theory. There is no external wiring under the track, by the way. All the contacts are made with hard rail on the top. I would love to get a hold of an instruction sheet for these to see what the factory recommended set up is. These selector tracks were sold as an add on accessory (pair),or as part of the Sears Matterhorn Raceway. The Matterhorn is what I have but there was no instruction sheet in the set.


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

interesting.
all in all, it might have never worked satisfactorally outside the factory lab.
I would think that a slide guide would be best.
maybe not even worth more effort trying to get it to work.
neat concept, but apparently not practical


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## TUFFONE (Dec 21, 2004)

I am kind of thinking the same...that it might have never worked very well. It is a lot of twisting and turning in just one length of track. If it was longer,with a more gradual turn at each of the track intersections, I think this would work well. I will try again at a later date though after some desktop intervention.


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