# Original (1966) 18" Enterprise Model



## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

For quite some time I've been working towards creating accurate plans of all the models that represented the USS Enterprise on screen in the original series. I've made great progress towards plans of the 33 inch model (I still need to make corrections/revisions to the plans I made public back in 2007) and significant progress towards plans of the 11 foot model. The other two models, the 18 inch and 3 inch models, had been a little harder to find good reference sources for.

Last month that changed for the 18 inch model when I was able to find an original (1966) Enterprise kit. 

My progress in creating plans of this model can be found over in *aridas*' forums (here), so I won't bore anyone with those details in this thread.

The thing is, I didn't buy this model just as a reference for some plans (though that was a major factor)... I intend to build this model as close to authentic as I possibly can (using painting queues from the models built by the TOS art department).

So I was wondering if anyone would care to share their experiences of the building of this kit (actually, experiences from any of the long box versions of the model would be great).

I most likely won't start the actual building for a few weeks, and I need to have some custom decals made up in the near future as well. So right now I'm mainly in the planning stages and learning from other's experiences would be quite helpful.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Are you going to stick with the kit's stirrup and clip method for attaching the struts to the secondary hull? That's the one thing I would change as they never worked right when I built this kit when I was 10 years old. It's almost impossible to prevent the engines from sagging.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Trekkriffic said:


> Are you going to stick with the kit's stirrup and clip method for attaching the struts to the secondary hull? That's the one thing I would change as they never worked right when I built this kit when I was 10 years old. It's almost impossible to prevent the engines from sagging.


I'm planning on doing something with more re-enforcements behind it as from what I can tell, the loop end tabs of the supports represent a weak link compared to later versions of the model. I'm planning on something not unlike what you used on your 18 inch model.

But more significantly, I've found in my studies of the model's geometry that if one were to do everything right and perfect, the nacelles would still appear to sag. What I noticed is that the holes in the secondary hull for the nacelle supports were cut at a bad angle, and that a small change would be enough to make the model align nicely.








I'm hoping that by the end of my studies I'll have the exact positions mapped out to avoid misalignment while still having a nice fit (that doesn't require a lot of gap filling at that point). It is sad that such a nice kit (with tons of details that I had no idea were there) would suffer because of this one error (and make good model makers doubt themselves because of it).

The alignment of the holes on the secondary hull of the retooled kit fix this issue... even if they raised a ton of other issues at the same time (and changed the character of the model to some degree).

So I would have a better understanding of this model, I bought a Round 2 re-issue the same day that I received this model (because I hadn't seen any version of the 18 inch kit since around 1995). The comparisons between the way the secondary hulls were designed is quite striking.








And those changes make the later kits about a half an inch longer than the originals.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

I always favored the original design for the deflector assembly. As you said, many of the changes were even less accurate than the original issue. If they could only have fixed the engine mounting points, fixed the A/B deck, and maybe gotten the size of the balls on the back end of the nacelles right, I would have been happier with it. Oh well, water under the bridge!


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

As you noted, the alignment issues related to the retension holes in the secondary hull of the original kit were fixed with the reissues.
On my build, I didn't do anything other than reinforce the pylons with rectangular brass tubing sections placed parallel to each other on either side of the locator pins. These were glued with CA, epoxy putty was packed in between the tubing, then the other pylon half was glued on after having thinned the tab plastic so the brass tubing was sandwiched between what was left of the tabs. That way the brass tubing could slide all the way down into the slots in the secondary hull with the thinned tab plastic acting as a shim for a super tight fit. 
Of course, my kit was one of the short box reissues.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

I'd love to get my hands on a pre 1975 issue of this kit. I remember how I excited I was when on Christmas of 1970 under the tree I found my first kits of the _Enterprise_ and the Klingon D7. I was eleven years old and in heaven. :lol:


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

This is a really interesting project!
And hey, in the end, you'll have accurate blueprints for the Constellation!


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah, a lot of people have noted that the plans will be great for the Constellation. In fact, enough people have brought it up that I decided to expand the decal sheet to include Constellation markings...








The numbers are re-arrangements of the Enterprise numbers, and the _U.S.S. CONSTELLATION_ was hand drawn like I did with the Enterprise name (and I even used a few of the same letters) so that it would maintain the same characteristics of the rest of the decal's letters/numbers. The spacing was based on an HD screen grab of the Constellation model.

The main goal with the decals is to replicate the look and feel of the originals so the model is as authentic as possible when I finish with it.

The only corrections I made were with the alignment of the black, red and yellow screen elements, but I had a reference on the sheet to help with fixing that issue...


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## pagni (Mar 20, 1999)

Very nice!
I've had an original issue Enterprise with the full lighting kit up on ebay for a while with no takers...Must have been waiting on this thread. Would love a set of the decals : )


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

^^ You gotta watch, too. I checked out some of those kits and they look suspiciously like post 1975 issues to me. The boxes are small and in one they showed the parts in the plastic bag, but you could see that they're from a later issue with different strut assembly and balls on the end of the nacelle caps.


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## James Tiberius (Oct 23, 2007)

so how do you know if its an original issue or not? theres a hobby shop around here that has alot of older models and they might have one.


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## robtrek (Sep 26, 2007)

Warped9 said:


> I'd love to get my hands on a pre 1975 issue of this kit. I remember how I excited I was when on Christmas of 1970 under the tree I found my first kits of the _Enterprise_ and the Klingon D7. I was eleven years old and in heaven. :lol:


Apparently , we had the same experince!!! I was in heaven. I got the last versions(I guess) of the long box kits. I built them immediately(Ahh the days where I just built stuff without accuracy worry) and took them everywhere I could!!!


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

James Tiberius said:


> so how do you know if its an original issue or not? There's a hobby shop around here that has alot of older models and they might have one.


I'm not sure if there's a date on the outside of the box or not. I also remember the boxes were larger with the cover image oriented length-wise as opposed to horizontally. I also believe the older ones predate the set of decals with different starship names on them.

I know the one I had in 1970/71 had no ball and no detail on the aft nacelle end caps. The nacelle caps were a clear amber plastic. The navigational deflector housing and the deflector were more detailed and better shaped. The upper and lower sensor domes were a clear green colour. and the A/B deck structure had a better shape. The decals were better and more accurate in font, too. Finally the older ones had that stupid strut assembly *Shaw* mentions upthread. That was a bitch of a thing for an eleven year old to deal with, but today an adult could fix it with little trouble.



pagni said:


> I've had an original issue Enterprise with the full lighting kit up on ebay for a while with no takers...Must have been waiting on this thread. Would love a set of the decals : )


You still have it? Which one was it because I was somewhat suspicious of the ones I saw there.

What bugs me about R2's reissue is that while they fixed some things (no grid lines) they didn't bother fixing some other simple things.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

I can tell you guys what I was originally looking for before this morphed into a research project. I was looking for an early long box, good condition, with the original decals (even if they weren't usable as I knew I could re-create them if I had a reference). I was thinking of a price between $35-$50, but would have paid more for the second release (with the amber nacelle domes).

After it became a research project, I was willing to pay more, but it needed to be the original issue of the kit as it was used on screen in TOS. I ended up paying about $90 for mine. And as a research project, I wanted something to compare it with, so I bought a Round 2 re-issue for about $25 the same day that my 1966 kit arrived.

When I was originally looking for an early long box version, the things I looked for in photos of the parts were the secondary hull front end and the nacelle dome assembly (which are a single piece rather than two pieces in the later releases). I figured those two elements were prominent enough that I could spot them even in small photos of the parts.

If the boxes were still in their original plastic wrap, I looked mainly at the cover art...








Obviously the original art work would give me an original issue, the second issue art work guaranteed I'd get at least the original decals and most likely the amber nacelle domes, the later art work made it _iffy_ if I'd get the original decals as most of these came with the later ones with the weird type style.

But the decals were a major sticking point for me as I needed them to re-create new versions. If I can get JT Graphics to provide the re-creations to others, there isn't as much a need for people to be worrying about that aspect.

I'm also working on a set of window replacement decals based on rubbings I've taken of the surface of my model. This is an early (uncorrected) tracing of those rubbings...








And these are some shots (with some comparisons to the Round 2 versions) of the parts of my kit...Secondary Hull
Primary Hull
Nacelles​
I'll most likely go through the same process of _accurizing_ the Round 2 model as I've made a number of recommendations in the past that I'd really like to try out myself. But I think that these days the long box kits are such rare antiques that they should be treated with a lot of care and built up as authentically as possible. For a lot of us, these old kits represent our first _hands-on_ look at the ship of our dreams, so building/restoring them to their original glory seems important all these years later.

And for me, having been born in 1967, it never leaves my mind that I'm handling a model that is older than myself. 








James Tiberius said:


> so how do you know if its an original issue or not? theres a hobby shop around here that has alot of older models and they might have one.


If you come across something that you aren't quite sure about, ask them to hold it for you and PM me. We can set up a time to go look at it together to make sure what it is that they are selling before you have to put down any money on it. :thumbsup:


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## pagni (Mar 20, 1999)

Warped9 said:


> I'm not sure if there's a date on the outside of the box or not. I also remember the boxes were larger with the cover image oriented length-wise as opposed to horizontally. I also believe the older ones predate the set of decals with different starship names on them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes I still have it. The kit is authentic, it was produced towards the end of the series run as the box still says "As seen on NBC" The domes are clear amber and it has the four lights. And the stand is cast in violet/orchid plastic ! This was out there for a very short time. 
This was the first Enterprise kit I ever purchased and built, I remember buying subsequent releases and being bummed that the nacelle domes were no longer amber, and the decal sheet was no longer accurate.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Just won one of the originals, with the amber domes, on Ebay. Not sure how I will build it?


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## John F (May 31, 2001)

I just got one of those on ebay myself, mine has the clear stand, and the decal sheet is still intact. One of those aforementioned clips was missing so I jammed a piece of sprue through the end piece and it seems to be holding. The lights and wiring were still there as well and everything worked.

I built it straight from the box with nothing added.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

I was thinking of trying to tie in the tapered warp engines from the later releases and thinning out the height of the primary hull and removing the grid lines, other than that, I like the original much better.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

RSN said:


> Just won one of the originals, with the amber domes, on Ebay. Not sure how I will build it?


That is a great kit. :thumbsup:

I really love the amber nacelle domes. I'm amazed that someone doesn't offer a version for the later releases (it seems like there is only clear or red available).




RSN said:


> I was thinking of trying to tie in the tapered warp engines from the later releases and thinning out the height of the primary hull and removing the grid lines, other than that, I like the original much better.


One of the first things I did the day I got both models (the 1966 and the Round 2 re-issue) was compare the nacelle taper... they were nearly identical.








If not for differences in the thickness of the plastic, you could do a straight swap of the nacelle end pieces between the most recent release and the original.

I converted a number of measurements from the original Jefferies plans to see how closely this model followed them. I was surprised at the number of elements that lined up quite nicely (I used the primary hull diameter as a gauge for the conversion).














John F said:


> I just got one of those on ebay myself, mine has the clear stand, and the decal sheet is still intact.


I heard that they ran out of the clear stands after the original issue (or shortly into the second issue). Mine came with the clear stand as well.

Do you have images?


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Shaw said:


> That is a great kit. :thumbsup:
> 
> I really love the amber nacelle domes. I'm amazed that someone doesn't offer a version for the later releases (it seems like there is only clear or red available).
> 
> ...


Thanks for that info! I remembered the original engine not being tapered, glad I was wrong! Perhaps I can build it without the need for parts from a later release and still get the finished model I was going for!


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

This is the final decal sheet layout I sent on to JT Graphics. I think this will help capture the feel of the original decals (and help avoid issues with painting windows).


_click to enlarge_​


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## John F (May 31, 2001)

Shaw said:


> Do you have images?


 
Here it is, sitting atop my computer, but I haven't decaled it yet



















and one with the lights on










And I just received this today.










the decals are yellowed and some parts are off the sprue
but it looks complete.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

It looks like it is in great condition! And (of course) the amber nacelle domes are awesome. :thumbsup:



Unfortunately, when I went to check the bulbs in my kit, only one of the six that came with it was still functional after 45 years.








Which isn't a bad thing... I was considering replacing them with LEDs anyways.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

:thumbsup: Awesome, *Shaw*. Those pics take me way back to Christmas Eve of 1970. I loved that model. My imagination took flight the following Christmas Day when I put it together.

Did you fix the nacelle support assembly to the secondary hull?


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah, those pics by *John F* are really something.

I haven't done anything beyond some test assemblies on mine. I most likely won't get started until I'm absolutely sure I've gotten all the data from the kit that I can for my plans. Plus I need some practice before I set in on this model.

The more I look at this stuff, the more I have to wonder why Round 2 hasn't considered a lit special edition with amber nacelle domes... or at least an accessory kit with those elements. They wouldn't need to do much more than what was included in the second AMT release. It seems like a better way to entice people than their _glow-in-the-dark_ release.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Because this is something that many people are facing, I wanted to put a little more effort into the nacelle alignment issue.

As I said earlier, the angle of the openings on the secondary hull were wrong on the long box model, which in turn forced the nacelles to appear to be druping. Fixing the angle of the opening should make it easier to align the nacelle center lines with the center line of the secondary hull.

This diagram was made from a surface rubbing of the original 1966 AMT Enterprise (at the correct scale at 150 dpi), showing the original opening and a corrected one (in red).


_Click to enlarge_​
When printed out at the right scale, the diagram could be laid on the surface of the part to be used as a guide for making the correction. This should be the least intrusive way to fix long box nacelle issues.

I'm putting this up in case someone wants to give it a try... but I'm hoping to get a chance to experiment (and perfect this) before anyone else needs to use it.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

I got news from JT Graphics last week that he was going to print up and sent me the decal sheets. I haven't gotten them as yet, but I think I can assume that they will turn out quite nice.

So given that, I think it would be okay for anyone wanting a copy to order them. He said that they'd be $15.00 a sheet (plus shipping I would imagine). But I wouldn't expect really fast turnaround right now as he is working on a ton of stuff for people going to Wonderfest.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

I'm ordering some decals from Jeffrey too. He said shipping was free on decals shipped to US destinations. 
His decals totally rock!


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah, they are awesome! :thumbsup:

I got mine and they are perfect matches for the ones that I'll be replacing. I was a little worried if they would match up size wise, but they were dead on.

So all I have to do now is finish up with the plans, and then the model will be freed up for building. Between now and then I'll just need to come up with a way of doing the primary hull dome lights, but I don't think it'll be too much of an issue.


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## punkrockpub (Aug 14, 2012)

*Constellation*

Are the U.S.S. ENTERPRISE/U.S.S. CONSTELLATION decal sheets available for sale in the 1/650 scale models?


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## Gregatron (Mar 29, 2008)

punkrockpub said:


> Are the U.S.S. ENTERPRISE/U.S.S. CONSTELLATION decal sheets available for sale in the 1/650 scale models?



It would be nice for vendors to carry them!

I should point out, however, that, since Shaw has very kindly made the art available, it's not hard to print your own with decal paper, as I did.

I rescaled the art for my 1/1000 _Constellation_. The whole model looks so "right" with the AMT-style decals.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

punkrockpub said:


> Are the U.S.S. ENTERPRISE/U.S.S. CONSTELLATION decal sheets available for sale in the 1/650 scale models?


So yeah... as *Gregatron* pointed out, there is the original art work as either a JPEG (at 150 DPI) or Encapsulated Postscript (EPS). For myself, I had JT Graphics print me up a few sets, and they turned out great. If you wanted to go that route, JT Graphics might still have the file on hand or you can provide him with the EPS file (which was the same one I used).

And *Gregatron*'s model is amazing! :thumbsup: And not only because it looks like the studio model, but also because it is made from the small Enterprise kit.




So, as long as this thread was brought up... yes, this model is still towards the front of my build list. But it is also waiting for me to try out some stuff on the Phase II Enterprise before applying it here. Specifically, I found that one of the front end caps fits quite nicely while the other one doesn't. So I've decided to make a mold of the good end cap and make two identical copies of it rather than attempt to fit/modify the bad front end cap.

Given what is needed, I may start the build process while still working on the Phase II Enterprise. It all depends on how far along I get on my plans for this model (which I need to be far enough along on that I can be sure that I have all the data I need from the model). Going over everything about a month ago, I'm relatively sure I have what I need, but it is better to be safe than sorry.


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

punkrockpub said:


> Are the U.S.S. ENTERPRISE/U.S.S. CONSTELLATION decal sheets available for sale in the 1/650 scale models?


The reissues by R2 have an expanded decal sheet including name and NCC numbers.


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## Gregatron (Mar 29, 2008)

Shaw said:


> And *Gregatron*'s model is amazing! :thumbsup: And not only because it looks like the studio model, but also because it is made from the small Enterprise kit.



Thanks!

The build thread is here:

http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showthread.php?t=329619


My goal was to simulate (as closely as possible using the 1/1000 kit) the original 18-incher as seen in the episode. The only minor tweaks I made were the addition of impulse engine vents, and the use of a first-pilot style color scheme (blue neck, etc.) to break up the gray.


I used JT's replacement Bridge/B-C deck piece, and modified the sensor dish and a few other parts to make the model look closer to the 18-incher.

That, and the decals, give the impression--at first glance--that you're looking at an AMT kit, but it's in 1/1000, so it fits in nicely with the rest of my "fleet".


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## Chuck_P.R. (Jun 8, 2003)

Shaw said:


> Yeah, they are awesome! :thumbsup:
> 
> I got mine and they are perfect matches for the ones that I'll be replacing. I was a little worried if they would match up size wise, but they were dead on.
> 
> So all I have to do now is finish up with the plans, and then the model will be freed up for building. Between now and then I'll just need to come up with a way of doing the primary hull dome lights, but I don't think it'll be too much of an issue.


So the window decals match the windows perfectly too?


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Yep. To record those details for the plans, I took rubbings of all the surface details and then scanned them in. And because I knew I was awful at coloring in those windows in the past, and because many windows are right along seams (and would most likely get sanded off), I figured the best solution was to replace all the windows on the model with decals which replicate the original windows (if I could have done them perfectly).

And the amount of detail that is actually included on the model is amazing... there is actually the hangar lights and the window on the cylinder at the top of the hangar doors on the 1966 model (which is why they are part of the decals... and I did the hangar lights as either black windows or the color pattern from the studio model).

Of course all these window decals would have been easier for every one to place had I finished the plans, but I hope to get around to them soon. This is a test assembly of some of the elements I'd worked on before I got side tracked...


_Click to enlarge_​
I might put together a _quick-n-dirty_ set of drawings to illustrate where all the windows go... but then again, most of my art work falls into the _quick-n-dirty_ category. :tongue:


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## Gregatron (Mar 29, 2008)

As an aside, you'll notice that my _Constellation_'s secondary hull has no windows at the rear.

Y'see the AMT's windows are out of scale--they're way too big. 

Shrinking the decal art for the windows down to a proper 1/1000 scale look meant that the overall placement of the windows was altered, because they covered a smaller surface area.

Rather than adding extra windows to the rear half of either side of the hull, I just left it bare.


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## punkrockpub (Aug 14, 2012)

How can I get the decal sheet for the U.S.S. ENTERPRISE/CONSTELLATION? I'm in the process of building my model of the U.S.S. CONSTELLATION, and I want it as close as possible to look like the AMT model used in the episode, "The Doomsday Machine".


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Two of the original long box version decal sheets were used to create the decals for the _Constellation _so those would be the ideal decals to use--or copies thereof. 

The above image is from Cult's site in an excellent article about the differences in the various issues of the AMT 1701 model kit: http://culttvman.com/main/?p=3665

If someone has a higher quality scan of the original decal sheet (or such can be found on the internet) you could print your own with probably minimal clean up necessary.

And it looks like Shaw (You are a STOS _god_, sir!) has already taken care of the whole situation regarding decals:










Shaw's cleaned up version with window decals:


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

punkrockpub said:


> How can I get the decal sheet for the U.S.S. ENTERPRISE/CONSTELLATION? I'm in the process of building my model of the U.S.S. CONSTELLATION, and I want it as close as possible to look like the AMT model used in the episode, "The Doomsday Machine".


As I stated above in post #33 of this thread R2 has an expanded decal sheet for the AMT TOS 18 inch Enterprise model kit and it _includes_ names and NCC numbers of the different ships from TOS. And there are enough extra decals for 2 ships.


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

PerfesserCoffee said:


> Two of the original long box version decal sheets were used to create the decals for the _Constellation _so those would be the ideal decals to use--or copies thereof.
> 
> The above image is from Cult's site in an excellent article about the differences in the various issues of the AMT 1701 model kit: http://culttvman.com/main/?p=3665
> 
> ...


I'm not sure about two decal sheets being used on the filming miniature. It's certainly plausible, but to my eye, "CONSTELLATION" looks like it was lettered by hand.

I'd like to see some confirmation, or at least some really good analysis beyond how it _could_ have been done, before declaring this one as confirmed.


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Captain April said:


> I'm not sure about two decal sheets being used on the filming miniature. It's certainly plausible, but to my eye, "CONSTELLATION" looks like it was lettered by hand.
> 
> I'd like to see some confirmation, or at least some really good analysis beyond how it _could_ have been done, before declaring this one as confirmed.


I'm not, by any means, presenting myself as a self-anointed expert. I did not mean to present my post as being any sort of study that confirmed or denied anything. 

I was only thinking I'd read somewhere that they used a couple of decal sheets. I may be wrong, they might have made up the extra letters by hand. I have no idea. I get such details WRONG all the time. By all means look it up and please be sure to take absolutely everything I say in the future with a huge grain of salt.  :wave:


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Okay, I wasn't planning on discussing this at this point, but as long as we are sort of on the subject...

Where did the decal art for the AMT Enterprise come from? It is obviously all hand drawn rather than a pre-existing type face or stencil.

I believe the answer is the same place that the design of the AMT Enterprise came from... Matt Jefferies.

Once Jefferies turned over the plans for the Enterprise to Datin, all Jefferies had left were his notes. Hence, all subsequent Jefferies drawings of the Enterprise are similar to, but not the same as, the studio model. Jefferies was asked to supply AMT with plans of the Enterprise for a model kit, and Jefferies drew up new plans based on his notes and what he saw was being done as far as changes to the studio model (which is why there is a mix of series and pilot elements to the AMT kit). Along with the plans for the model, he most likely drew up the decal artwork (expecting that AMT would use it as the basis for their decals).

The AMT Enterprise model kit seems to have been a rushed project. I don't believe they did any prototyping of the model (or test assembly of the masters) because the elements don't fit together correctly (the sag in the original kit is built into it, and has nothing to do with gravity). Similarly, they seem to have taken Jefferies' decal art and used it without modification to make the decal sheet.

And why do I believe this? _Court Martial_.








Like the AMT decals, it is obviously all hand drawn rather than using a pre-existing type face or stencil... and looks to have been drawn by the same person.

In fact, with those letters and numbers (along with the ones of the decal sheet), I had considered doing more than just the Enterprise and Constellation decals... but I wanted everything on one sheet and the windows were more important to what I wanted for my model.

So my guess... the _U.S.S. CONSTELLATION_ on the model in _The Doomsday Machine_ was hand drawn by Jefferies onto a decal sheet (with all the other decals a rearrangement of the model's decals).




irishtrek said:


> As I stated above in post #33 of this thread R2 has an expanded decal sheet for the AMT TOS 18 inch Enterprise model kit and it _includes_ names and NCC numbers of the different ships from TOS. And there are enough extra decals for 2 ships.


I think that when *punkrockpub* specified that he wanted his model to be _"as close as possible to look like the AMT model used in the episode"_, that explains why the _Round 2_ decal sheet (or any other after market decal sheet for that matter) wouldn't work for what he was going for.

I mean it is the same reason why I took the time and effort to painstakingly trace the original decals from the 1966 kit (along with the rubbings of all the windows)... for this to be truly authentic, _good enough_ just wouldn't be good enough.

This isn't to say that there is anything wrong with the _Round 2_ decals... I think they are awesome. I used them on my Republic model and was quite happy with the result. But with that model, I was attempting to build something that _felt_ like the 11 foot studio model and that was what the _Round 2_ decals were intended to do.




And *punkrockpub*, let me contact JT Graphics and see if there is a way for him to offer them on his site... believe me, you aren't the first person to ask about getting these and being able to point people to some where to buy them would make it easier for everyone. :thumbsup:


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Shaw said:


> And *punkrockpub*, let me contact JT Graphics and see if there is a way for him to offer them on his site... believe me, you aren't the first person to ask about getting these and being able to point people to some where to buy them would make it easier for everyone. :thumbsup:


Shaw, that would be most excellent.

If, however, someone wants to print up their own decals from your magnificent sheet, I would recommend, after getting the proper clear decal sheet for ink-jet printers of course, using one's printer or photo-editing program to scale the decals just right for one's particular set up. There always seems to be a little discrepancy even if the scales aren't off to be begin with. 

I print up draft black and white versions on paper, varying the percentage of the scale until the lengths measure up properly to the red stripes and the letters are the same size. Once I get those measurements checked two or three times, I print up on the clear decal sheet--and then measure _that _to make sure.


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## CaptBillD (Apr 29, 2011)

It occurs to me that if the TOS Art Dept. had 2 decal sheets on hand for the AMT Constellation, why wouldn't they have numbered the hull 1707, 1711, 1717, (none ever used onscreen for any other Connie appearance, and only conjecturally 1717 for the Yorktown) or even more simply, 1710 with one sheet? A mystery we'll never solve...


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## Gregatron (Mar 29, 2008)

CaptBillD said:


> It occurs to me that if the TOS Art Dept. had 2 decal sheets on hand for the AMT Constellation, why wouldn't they have numbered the hull 1707, 1711, 1717, (none ever used onscreen for any other Connie appearance, and only conjecturally 1717 for the Yorktown) or even more simply, 1710 with one sheet? A mystery we'll never solve...


I get the impression it was done as 1017 because that number would be instantly distinguishable at first glance from the _Enterprise_'s 1701 on 1960s, low-res TV sets.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Yeah... it was the same mind set that got _Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan_ a new studio model for the Reliant even though the production had been doing everything they could to keep the movies budget as low as possible. Originally the Reliant was supposed to have been an old starship like the Enterprise (and was most likely going to be a redress of the Phase II Enterprise), but the producers were worried that people (non-Trek fans) wouldn't be able to tell the two models apart on screen. So the Reliant was made specifically to be instantly distinguishable from the Enterprise for general audiences.

One also has to remember that "1701" wasn't ingrained in the public as the Enterprise's number at this time. In the 70's there were licensed toys made with images of the Enterprise with different numbers (like the Enterprise on the back of the Mego Bridge set that displayed "NCC-177").

Plus in all of TOS only three starships got numbers associated with them (Enterprise NCC-1701, Republic NCC-1371 and Constellation NCC-1017), and the main thing they (and the numbers of Commodore Stone's office graphic) all had in common was being four digits long and starting with "1" (which is most likely why the Reliant was NCC-1864).





And since this topic has been brought forward... yes, I'll be working on this soon. When I get some silicon rubber for the Phase II Enterprise study model, I'll be casting two copies of the nacelle dome part that fits correctly and will start in on that build (which will include some lighting like the kit was originally intended to have).


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

I was reviewing my current progress on documenting the 1966 AMT model and thought you guys might like seeing where those plans currently stand…


_Click to enlarge_​
Yeah, there is a lot that needs to be done, but not so much that it would be overwhelming to finish it off. And once the plans are done, I could actually work on the model.


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## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

You do excellent work, Shaw. :thumbsup:


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## feek61 (Aug 26, 2006)

Good to see you are still working on this. Your work is always stellar!!


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Thanks guys!

Yeah, I realized that the only way to _really_ be sure that I've collected all the data I needed from the kit was to start back in on drawing the plans.

The plans will be mainly the idealized alignment, with an example of the actual alignment of the model and what changes/fixes need to be done to get the idealized version (which I believe will work for all long box versions of the kit). Both nacelle dome parts are warped (one worse than the other), but I think both are salvageable without having to resort to the method used on the model displayed on later box covers (cutting the part down).


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Another small update...


_Click to enlarge_​


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## publiusr (Jul 27, 2006)

Thank you so much for doing this.


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

You're welcome! It is fun to both document all this and share it.


A few small updates, nothing too major...


_Click to enlarge_​
I still need to get back to drawing out the intercoolers. I need front/back, top/side and 45 degrees from the top center line. I'll get around to it soon.


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## RICHjm (Jun 14, 2010)

...and the windows on each side of the B/C deck.


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## publiusr (Jul 27, 2006)

Finished now ...


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## publiusr (Jul 27, 2006)

Resources:
https://treknographics101.prophpbb.com/topic64-80.html
https://airandspace.si.edu/collection-objects/model-star-trek-starship-enterprise

You know--I was thinking about the droop:
http://www.shawcomputing.net/racerx/trek_stuff/models/AMT_1966_project/1966_test_assembly_007a.jpg

As you see here, it looks as if the machinist forgot that the secondary hull was actually a cone. The top of the nacelles are actually flush with the strongback/top of the secondary hull.

An easier fix my Dad used was simply to rotate the saucer back on the pylon so that the saucer top edge, the nacelles, and the secondary hull's topside were all flush.

This made the deflector dish look like it was slanted down--but as a scanner--it makes more sense. Shaving off the front top of the secondary hull--where it joins the deflector assembly--allows it to point more forward.

To me, the Ultimate AMT (sans after market resin bits) would be to have the secondary hull of the Round 2 Re-pop, but with the saucer of the original and the lighted nacelles of the Long Box IIRC.

As per Shaw, they not only fixed some of the droop--but moved the nacelle attachment points a little farther back on the re-pop's secondary hull--so the domes didn't crowd the saucer as per the dark silhouettes here:

http://www.shawcomputing.net/racerx..._1966_project/1966_amt_enterprise-preview.jpg

That makes the Round 2 saucer a bit longer and better looking--only the front of the B/C deck is shaved off.


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