# Update from Round 2 - October 7, 2011



## GSaum (May 26, 2005)

I received an email today from Round 2. They have confirmed that the 1/350 TOS E will contain interior parts for the shuttlebay AND the main bridge. Also, it will include space inside the engineering hull for a battery pack (to power the lighting kit) and they are trying to design the deflector as an on/off switch. The update also discusses in detail the decision making process to include the grid lines.

I must say I'm most impressed with the amount of detail and care that is being used to craft this model. I think this will likely be one of the greatest, if not the greatest, sci-fi models ever produced, and the more I read, the more I'm excited to have at least one in my possession.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

GSaum said:


> ...Also, it will include space inside the engineering hull for a battery pack (to power the lighting kit) and they are trying to design the deflector as an on/off switch...


Funny, but this is similar to how AMT did it on the original 18" kit. Surprised they didn't use the base for this, since this means the deflector dish housing would have to be removable leaving a seam that most modelers wouldn't want.


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## jaws62666 (Mar 25, 2009)

GSaum said:


> I received an email today from Round 2. They have confirmed that the 1/350 TOS E will contain interior parts for the shuttlebay AND the main bridge. Also, it will include space inside the engineering hull for a battery pack (to power the lighting kit) and they are trying to design the deflector as an on/off switch. The update also discusses in detail the decision making process to include the grid lines.
> 
> I must say I'm most impressed with the amount of detail and care that is being used to craft this model. I think this will likely be one of the greatest, if not the greatest, sci-fi models ever produced, and the more I read, the more I'm excited to have at least one in my possession.


I saw the update as well. All I can say is it will be worth every penny and the somewhat long wait for this baby.


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## kdaracal (Jan 24, 2009)

Awesome news! Might be the first one I do, again, since childhood!


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

I hope even those against them can recognize the amount of thought that R2 put into the grid line issues. Wow, having their engineer chime in on it was really helpful. And if they can get down to the target depth of 1mm, then they should be subtle enough for most people and that much easier to fill for those who don't want them at all. The inclusion of the bridge is a boon, whether or not you make it visible is up to you. The shuttle bay render looks darn fine too, hopefully they throw in some figures/clear parts for the observation area, but a little fiddling with photoshop can accomplish that in 2d, so not a huge deal.

Whatever else, this is clearly a labor of love, not just a product. It's aimed right at us (well, Star Trek Fans and modelers so as not to take anything for granted) and if done well will make my MR ship largely obsolete.

Now if I just had more skill 

Tib


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## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

I loved the note to make the bridge dome THIN so you will be able to see the bridge with less distortion. And the comments to change things around a bit to make puttying seams easier, not to mention the comments about the sub-assemblies. They really are looking out for the modelers' best interests, it seems. I am very excited. This is going to be something special, no doubt! :thumbsup:


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## jgoldsack (Apr 26, 2004)

And there was a large section dedicated to the grid lines. A very good detailing of the process involved in deciding why to add the lines, and the potential problems of NOT adding lines.


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## Atemylunch (Jan 16, 2006)

The funny thing is the grid lines are wrong. They do not touch the bridge. 

The gridlines are going to be .008"x.008" or .008"x.004". in the machining world that's what we call tolerance(or how much error we can have in part dimensions, really the numbers can vary. But these numbers are very common). 
But with all of the justification, the lines will be wiped out with a paint job. Making then useless as a guide for decals.

Much less what is going to happen to the lines on the molds over the production run. 

In my opinion things look a bit overdone.


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## KUROK (Feb 2, 2004)

Tiberious said:


> . It's aimed right at us (well, Star Trek Fans and modelers so as not to take anything for granted) and if done well will make my MR ship largely obsolete.
> 
> Now if I just had more skill
> 
> Tib



There are already shops out there now doing hi-end build ups of the refit kit. No doubt same thing will happen with this kit....


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## drmcoy (Nov 18, 2004)

no complaints here -- looks like, overall, it's going to be AMAZING.

i was on the fence about this one as i already own the MR and have also built the classic AMT, a few 1/1000 PLs and converted the cutaway.

but after reading what is going into this, i'm afraid i will have to muster the strength and stamina to build this baby one more time...and put some extra effort into my build to do this model proud.

and yes, i will likely buy the lighting kit -- how could you not?

t


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

^ It's a big reason why I haven't gotten around to building my 1/350 Refit.

Well, that, and not having any room to even store a three-foot long model, never mind display it...


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

I hear ya Captain. I have some room atop my TV cabinet in one corner and my curio cabinet against the opposite wall but my cat loves to jump up there too. It wouldn't be long before he'd have it teetering over the edge. And nothing survives reentry from those heights.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

They'll be making it so the bridge can be positioned front-facing or at 36°, modeler's choice. Very cool.

Also nice to see Gary Kerr agreed with my suggestion to make the nacelle grills separate pieces. I don't know if they'll be clear or not, for those who may want to break with tradition and light them, but if not it'll be damn easy for the aftermarket guys this way. Not only that, but the whole nacelle trench will be a separate insert, no doubt to facilitate the pilot/production differences without needing a whole new nacelle half.


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

If you want to light the nacelles, I'm pretty sure the PE* that will come with the special edition kit will include the grillwork so you don't even really need a clear insert.

* I don't have any inside information on this. It just makes sense that that would be PE.


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

Once or twice, just to see the reaction of folks, I'd tape the pieces together to show them just how friggin' big the thing is.

On the other hand, I might be able to get some much needed repair work done on my poor bedraggled NX-01. I'm not sure which'll be the bigger challenge, making sure the lights still work, reopening the saucer to redo some things, or trying to get those damn PL decals to work.


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

The NX-01 engines have kept me befuddled all these years: anyone know how to go about properly aligning them? The 1/350 kit doesn't have them aligned correctly, instead they have a built in "droop"!


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## WarpCore Breach (Apr 27, 2005)

It was suggested back in the day of the NX kit that the best way to fix that rearward engine droop was to shim up the rear of the engines until they are sitting level. No real info was provided on how much shim you needed, though; I'm guessing it will be a Mk. I eyeball and personal interpretation of how much you need to shim.


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## robcomet (May 25, 2004)

I'm currently feeling slightly annoyed that because I live on the wrong side of the Atlantic, I don't get to read these updates. I've been a fan of Polar Lights kits for years and have spent a minor fortune on their products. I had planned on buying at least 3 of these and getting them shipped over but (and I know this sounds childish) I'm beginning to think that I'd rather save my money. Surely they can do something for their international fans?


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

robcomet said:


> i'm currently feeling slightly annoyed that because i live on the wrong side of the atlantic, i don't get to read these updates. I've been a fan of polar lights kits for years and have spent a minor fortune on their products. I had planned on buying at least 3 of these and getting them shipped over but (and i know this sounds childish) i'm beginning to think that i'd rather save my money. Surely they can do something for their international fans?


Marketing !


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## Landru (May 25, 2009)

robcomet said:


> I'm currently feeling slightly annoyed that because I live on the wrong side of the Atlantic, I don't get to read these updates. I've been a fan of Polar Lights kits for years and have spent a minor fortune on their products. I had planned on buying at least 3 of these and getting them shipped over but (and I know this sounds childish) I'm beginning to think that I'd rather save my money. Surely they can do something for their international fans?


Seconded!


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## BolianAdmiral (Feb 24, 2009)

If 1mm is their target depth for the gridlines, then that's too deep. Sorry, but it is. In any case, now that I know it'll have the lines, I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.


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## fire91bird (Feb 3, 2008)

BolianAdmiral said:


> If 1mm is their target depth for the gridlines, then that's too deep. Sorry, but it is. In any case, now that I know it'll have the lines, I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.


You overlooked the decimal point. Their target is .1 mm.


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

BolianAdmiral said:


> ...I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.


The only other TOS Enterprise kit on the horizon is the Revell one - and if you think these, quite minute, grid lines are are bad then you're going to hate those.

Polar Lights and Revell are the only model kit manufacturers with licenses for Trek so there won't be an eventual smoothie.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

BolianAdmiral said:


> If 1mm is their target depth for the gridlines, then that's too deep. Sorry, but it is. In any case, now that I know it'll have the lines, I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.


I hope you know a good cryonics lab.


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## robiwon (Oct 20, 2006)

I think BolianAdmiral meant an _aftermarket_ smoothie saucer. I could see some resin company make one of those. But man, that's going to be one heavy piece of resin!


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## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

BolianAdmiral said:


> If 1mm is their target depth for the gridlines, then that's too deep. Sorry, but it is. In any case, now that I know it'll have the lines, I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.


Since the saucer is going to be 15"-16" in diameter, I don't think anyone will be producing a smoothie replacement part. It is simply too large. Is there any precedent for someone making something like that for a kit this size...? 

(Can you imagine how heavy a resin saucer that size would be...?)


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

BolianAdmiral said:


> If 1mm is their target depth for the gridlines, then that's too deep. Sorry, but it is. In any case, now that I know it'll have the lines, I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.


Target is *.1* and not 1. There's a decimal point there. *.1mm* is awfully small. In full scale that would be only *35mm*. or a shade more than *1.3in*.


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Plus, the secondary hull and nacelles have engraved lines as well, so just replacing the primary hull wouldn't do much good.


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

fire91bird said:


> You overlooked the decimal point. Their target is .1 mm.


Forgot to say "ditto". 

They're looking at 0.2mm wide by 0.1mm deep. For the metric impaired, that's 0.008" x 0.004". A little too much paint and they'll disappear.


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

It seems our misguided friend is of the mindset that this one tiny detail is destined to ruin the greatest Star Trek model in history. If he has decided to rob himself of the satisfaction of building this iconic vessel who are we to stop him? Fanboys....what can you say?


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## jheilman (Aug 30, 2001)

I have to chime in and say I can't see why any aftermarket group would take the time, effort and money to remake a saucer (or really most of the ship as was noted above) minus grid lines for the very small percentage of folks who refuse to fill and sand them smooth. It's not that we don't understand your opinion that they should not exist, but I simply cannot fathom a fan of this ship depriving themselves of what is looking like the very best representation of it we may ever see for such an easily removed feature.

It's like someone is preparing your very favorite meal. Using all the best ingredients and doing it right. Then when it's served, you notice that they didn't give you a napkin. And instead of getting your own napkin, you declare the meal inedible and toss it in the trash.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

I think *BA* is just apprehensive that things might not work out as well as PL plans. I can understand his concerns because I, too, have experienced similar concerns. But now seeing hard evidence and exact dimensions I'm feeling a lot more assured that PL is approaching this in a well thought out manner.


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## fire91bird (Feb 3, 2008)

Ductapeforever said:


> It seems our misguided friend is of the mindset that this one tiny detail is destined to ruin the greatest Star Trek model in history. If he has decided to rob himself of the satisfaction of building this iconic vessel who are we to stop him? Fanboys....what can you say?


You'd think it would be the basic shapes that would be of more interest - things that really are hard to modify. Not sure why this one detail has earned such attention.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

^^ Well, it's been long contested and some ideas are hard to let go. I say this having held on to the notion of a smoothie for a very long time.


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## rowdylex (Jan 19, 2010)

Got the update and I must say the effort going into this model is astounding. 
I am not one to argue over grid lines or anything like that, since I think extra bit of detail is always welcome to bring the model to life in a more realistic way. 
As long as the model is a fun and rewarding build, I am happy for what Round 2 are doing.



robcomet said:


> Surely they can do something for their international fans?


Now being an international customer myself, I still haven't got any information on how or if we are getting the goods here to us in Oz. 
I still haven't received a shirt, and have left a message about this on the Round 2 forum, but as of yet, still no reply. 
So some feedback/info about this would be appreciated from Round 2 for all its international customers. :wave:


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

rowdylex said:


> ...Now being an international customer myself, I still haven't got any information on how or if we are getting the goods here to us in Oz.
> I still haven't received a shirt, and have left a message about this on the Round 2 forum, but as of yet, still no reply.
> So some feedback/info about this would be appreciated from Round 2 for all its international customers. :wave:


From the Round 2 page to sign up for preorder: "We regret that due to terms of our licensing agreement, we can only accept orders from the US & Canada." This has also been echoed dozens of times in this and other threads. 

If you want the kit, you're going to have to order it from a US store - though since the initial run is only going directly to individuals, not stores, you won't have that option.


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## jheilman (Aug 30, 2001)

And don't blame R2. I'm sure they'd love to sell globally. But the license they have is restrictive.


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## rowdylex (Jan 19, 2010)

Thanks for the replies. :thumbsup:
No, unfortunately I didn't see the license agreement or the other replies to other threads. I signed up for this as soon as the pre-order page went live and at the time I don't remember seeing anything about overseas buyers. So when I started receiving the email updates - I thought I was on the list. 
I never got an email back saying that due to the fact I am an overseas buyer, I would not be eligible for the special edition.

Oh well, just have to wait for the regular one.


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## Helldogg (Aug 21, 2003)

I am one of the "few" that thinks grid lines SUCK! But I am far more concerned that the decals will suck like all round2 decals do.

I will buy one, spend many hours filling in grid lines and trying to sand it which unfortunately is my least favorite job in modeling. 

But I will go insane if the decals are the same crumbly, brittle garbage that they come with now.

I do look forward to this one, but I have had too many round 2 kits with crap decals and I don't want to spend even more money buying decals.


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## Kit (Jul 9, 2009)

For anyone that really hates the gridlines, Mr. Surfacer will be your friend. Get the 500 grit and spray it on -- don't dilute too much, just enough to get smooth flow through the airbrush. Hell, you might even be able to brush it on -- it levels really well. 

I bet it will wipe out those gridlines, and the beauty is, it won't wipe out any other detail because on the suirface of the saucer, there really isn't any other detail.


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## Hunch (Apr 6, 2003)

Paulbo said:


> Plus, the secondary hull and nacelles have engraved lines as well, so just replacing the primary hull wouldn't do much good.


Uh-oh. I'd better break out my magnifiyng glass and read that second update a bit more thoroughly. Thought only the saucer was going to be engraved. I'd better start stocking up on bondo!:thumbsup:


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## KUROK (Feb 2, 2004)

Too many guys have missed the point.
Round 2 has said the grid lines are planned to be very tiny, like a Tamiya airplane kit.
In this case, they'd be easy to get rid of, if you wish, with something like Mr. Surfacer. They will be very useful for lining up decals.

I do have a concern about their mold maker because they haven't done petite panel lines before that I have seen.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

I don't some will be ever comfortable with this issue. For some those subtle engraved lines will always be like crevasses.


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

I would think aftermarket decals for the kit will be a no-brainer for anyone unhappy with R2's decals.


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## CLBrown (Sep 8, 2010)

Yeah, they will, no question... 

As most of you know, I'm an "anti-engraved line" guy myself, and if they put in "TMP-kit-like" lines, I'd probably never even accept the kit at all.

Meanwhile, there are folks who really want this kit to have full-depth, full-width lines like seen on the TMP kit. And they'll be unhappy if they have to try to create those from scratch and might not even buy the kit.

But I think that the idea of the 0.1 mm (ideal) etched lines they're shooting for is about as close to an ideal compromise on this issue as you'll get. (0.2 mm isn't as good, but it's still practical to fill, it'll just require a bit more effort.) Such small lines are relatively painless to fill in (and while I've never used, or even heard, of "Mr. Surfacer," before this topic came up, I've already decided to give it a much closer look) AND is sufficient to serve as a guide for etching for those who want the "canyon-like" gridlines they expect, and will not look bad for people who just want to build the kit "out of box" without modification of any kind whatsoever.

This remains the only area of the kit that bothers me... but it doesn't bother me so much that it will "ruin" the kit for me. (Big, "Revell-kit" like lines, those would be unforgiveable, though.)


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

I'm with Helldogg on the decals, I've had some absolutely horrible R2 decals and some that aren't.....but mostly the former. For this premium kit, I expect premium decals. I'm not keen on spending another $30+ for aftermarket decals...not for normal kits, not for this showpiece. They seems to be very attentive to quality here, so here's hoping they don't drop the ball on this pretty visible detail.

Tib


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## Kit (Jul 9, 2009)

Mr. Surfacer is a great aid when used judiciously. I find it best on large, simple surfaces, like car bodies or starship saucers, where it lies down flat and smooth. However, it will wipe out fine lines and obscure greeblie-like details.

It's good for reworking light textures into smooth surfaces, or if worked a bit as it dries, smooth surfaces into light textures. It sands beautifully and takes paint like a dream. It'll even help wipe out flaws on an old kit's paint job. I used it on an ancient Jo-Han police sedan that had everything from orange peel to hairs stuck in the paint job. Sanded, laid down Mr. Surfacer, sanded again, painted, nice and smooth.

It comes in different grits, too.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

People keep dividing the camps in two, those who want gridlines and those who don't. I hate to break it to you, but there is a third, and largest, camp that just does not care one way or another. We are just looking forward to building a new model of a great subject! I just hope Round 2 knows this silent majority is out here.....if they still read these boards!


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## CLBrown (Sep 8, 2010)

Ok, so it looks like, in order to get the "smooth-as-if-it-was-molded-that-way" finish I'm looking for, we'll be looking at (a) painting on 500-grit "Mr. Surfacer" with a detail brush, and fine-sanding (wet), then airbrushing the 1500-grit "Mr. Surfacer" (with extra laquer thinner, about 30%?) as a primer, and doing an ultra-fine sanding on top of that, to totally eradicate the lines.

What I'm unclear about is that, since this is essentially a lacquer-based paint, with a fine-ground mineral-fill in suspension, does this mean that I'm restricted to using lacquers on the rest of the kit? I mean, like most of us, I've had bad experiences with using enamels alongside lacquers.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

I read once that Mr. Surfacer was brush-on sandable primer. At any rate, I think the stuff is great, and would do a fine job on any gridlines. 
I use it to sharpen rounded edges that should have been sharp: brush it on the edge, then sand both faces.


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## Gregatron (Mar 29, 2008)

I'm wondering if there will optional parts for the *pilot* bridges, as well. At the very least, the first pilot bridge had longer railings, and lacked the extra steps to the lower level.


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

Right. And they MUST include those gooseneck TV screens like the one on Pike's chair. This is a DEAL BREAKER for me. If those aren't available as optional parts I am not buying the kit. You hear that, Round 2? Do NOT mess with me.


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## Kit (Jul 9, 2009)

CLBrown said:


> What I'm unclear about is that, since this is essentially a lacquer-based paint, with a fine-ground mineral-fill in suspension, does this mean that I'm restricted to using lacquers on the rest of the kit? I mean, like most of us, I've had bad experiences with using enamels alongside lacquers.


I tend to use acrylics, but I've had good luck with enamels over lacquers. It's lacquers over enamels that will kill your paint job in a flash, unless you like a crackle finish. 

I just airbrush several light coats of enamel over the lacquer -- very light, so as not to soak the underlying paint. After a few light coats, let them cure well, then go nuts with as much more enamel as you like. The first few coats will provide a barrier to prevent a bad chemical reaction between the two different carriers.

I think of it as rock-paper-scissors, with lacquer eating enamel eating water-or Windex-based acrylic. If you're not confident about the process, there are barrier products that you can use as intermediate layers. Your results may vary.


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## dreadnaught726 (Feb 5, 2011)

Unless you are using lacquers specifically made for plastics such as Testors or Tamiya, always use a suitable primer or barrier. This was especially true of Floquil paint since it crazed the plastic if applied directly. They used to sell a barrier coating for this but I found that Dullcoat worked fine.


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

"Oh wait,I cant build this model!It has a hole it!"


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## Hunch (Apr 6, 2003)

I'm certainly VERY pleased with what they are doing with the kit, hence the thumbs up at the end of my post. This will certainly be the release of the decade and the route they are taking should please the majority of the modelers so no complaints here. I'm sure if there were no grid lines I'd still find plenty of things to bondo on the kit. 
Just very happy they are doing it at all.


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

BolianAdmiral said:


> If 1mm is their target depth for the gridlines, then that's too deep. Sorry, but it is. In any case, now that I know it'll have the lines, I'll just save my money and buy the eventual smoothie that will come from another kit producer.




:freak:



:beatdeadhorse:


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

Schmoothie!, Smoothie ! There is no way on Gods green Earth that 'ANY' aftermarket company is going to make a 15 inch saucer from RESIN. Or go to the expense of produceing 'another' 1/350 scale kit with a smooth saucer. What about the panel lines on the rest of the kit? I'd think very hard about using any more of those magic mushrooms ! If I laugh any harder I'll soil myself ! LOL .


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

It sounds as if they're doing very fine engraved lines.....and I'm all for it.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I haven't seen anybody say they want deeper and wider lines like the refit.


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

BolianAdmiral, they're aiming for 0.1mm, one tenth of what you stated. That's very thin and very shallow. Even if they can't do that, 0.2mm should still be thin and shallow to fill easily, if you wish.

CLBrown, I once used enamel over lacquer and got great results. The key seemed to be either letting the lacquer dry completely or (I think I got this from a Testors painting guide) waiting certain amount of time for a gassing window to appear, which you could then spray a layer on which was sooner than 24-48 hours. I'd have to go find that book. Some the details I recall were also on the Testors plastic foldable work surface that came with either paint sets, or was it sanding papers? My memory fails me. Daisy, Daisy....


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## GSaum (May 26, 2005)

If it's your choice to wait until some other company releases a "smoothie", then great...there's more for the rest of us!


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

So if I am getting this correct. The "grid lines" are going to be so fine that a coat of primer may very well cover them up. Worse case scenario, partially cover them up. So while some will be trying to cover those grid lines (for good) others are going to be re-scribing them. :freak:


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Yes, the gridlines should be easily filled with a nice coat of sandable primer.

So far as I've read, no one is planning on rescribing the grid lines. I have no idea why that idea suddenly popped up several posts ago.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

RSN said:


> People keep dividing the camps in two, those who want gridlines and those who don't. I hate to break it to you, but there is a third, and largest, camp that just does not care one way or another. We are just looking forward to building a new model of a great subject! I just hope Round 2 knows this silent majority is out here.....if they still read these boards!


I could have been happy with a smoothie and seeing the direction they're aiming for with the .1mm gridlines I'm equally content. Suffice to say that a simple layer of paint will make those lines even fainter. I'm not at all displeased at how this is progressing.

Regarding anyone who could want to make the.1mm lines _deeper,_ I don't get that at all.


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## CLBrown (Sep 8, 2010)

John P said:


> I haven't seen anybody say they want deeper and wider lines like the refit.


Yeah, but it's likely that someone will do this at some point... this is along the same lines as someone wanting the internal panels on the warp nacelles to be lit, or wanting to put in glass microscope slide material for windows with little set-pieces behind them, or wanting to rig up a model to look like the filming miniature (exposed wiring and all) or so forth.

The point I was trying to make is that with 0.1mm wide by 0.1mm deep lines (in english units, that's 0.004" x 0.004", which is well within the optimal range for moldmaking tolerances), it becomes easy for anyone to have any version that they like... making it a "smoothie" becomes much easier, but doing the opposite is easy too, as is any intermediate state which any builder may wish to implement.

SO, no matter how much anyone may want... "canyon" grooves or "no grooves at all," I think that 0.1 mm is the best possible compromise. That's all.


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

An effects miniature version would be fun as part of a bluescreen stage diarama, with a little Botany Bay next to it and a figure with a clapboard.

What scale will this sucker be in relation to the eleven footer?


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## swhite228 (Dec 31, 2003)

4.125 : 1 +/- if I used the scale calculator correct and rounding the model size to 32".


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## CLBrown (Sep 8, 2010)

swhite228 said:


> 4.125 : 1 +/- if I used the scale calculator correct and rounding the model size to 32".


That's pretty much right, yep.

Meaning that a "typical 6' tall figure" would be just under 18 inches tall.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

CLBrown said:


> SO, no matter how much anyone may want... "canyon" grooves or "no grooves at all," I think that 0.1 mm is the best possible compromise.


Very sensible. 

I'm considering filling them in with something black and thick enough (Mr. Surfacer mixed with black?) to get a pre-shading effect on a smooth surface, which could then be toned down with subsequent applications of the normal hull gray. Smooth, _with_ grid lines!

(but somebody's probably thought of that already ...)


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

SteveR said:


> Smooth, _with_ grid lines!


You wouldn't happen to have a pic. on that application would you???
-Jim


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

SteveR said:


> Very sensible.
> 
> I'm considering filling them in with something black and thick enough (Mr. Surfacer mixed with black?) to get a pre-shading effect on a smooth surface, which could then be toned down with subsequent applications of the normal hull gray. Smooth, _with_ grid lines!
> 
> (but somebody's probably thought of that already ...)


Or you could take very thin styrene strips, carefully cement them in all the grooves, prime, paint, sand, paint, and there ya go...

Wait, that way lies madness...


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

I hope the gridlines aren't so fine that they disappear under a coat of paint.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

JGG1701 said:


> You wouldn't happen to have a pic. on that application would you???


Sorry -- not yet.


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## CLBrown (Sep 8, 2010)

SUNGOD said:


> I hope the gridlines aren't so fine that they disappear under a coat of paint.


Well, that's why having such fine lines is ideal...

If you want more evident lines, 0.1mm x 0.1mm etched lines are easy to trace with your average "sharpened dental pick" (aka "etching tool"... I have several of these in my toolkit, personally) but also easy enough to fill in.

If you want very evident lines, you can easily, and with no fuss, enlarge the lines slightly. And if you don't want ANY lines, you can fill them in easily, with not much fuss. And if you don't care either way, you don't have to do anything... you'll likely get something very, very subtle, but still detectable.

I still plan to totally fill mine in, and then use a mechanical drafting "lead holder" with 9H lead (VERY hard), sharpened to a needle point, to trace just the very slightest lines on the topside of my saucer, for my "replication of the ship as seen on-screen" version. And for my "the idealized Enterprise as it exists in my mind's eye" version, there will be no gridlines at all. Because there were no gridlines visible in NTSC video, ever. You can see them... BARELY... when you take the original film and transfer it to BD, but even then, it's "just barely." These were NEVER visible on a 1960's or 1970s era color TV, so as far as I'm concerned, they weren't intended to be seen.

But that's what I intend to do, and anyone else can do anything else they like... up to and including "canyon trenches" on the surface of the model. And 0.1mm x 0.1mm etched lines is the best compromise to let us all do what we want, I think.


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