# J2 working landing gear not possible?



## JohnGuard (Jan 13, 2008)

there is no way to make a working set of landing gear for the new J2?

come on!! 
all that talent out there??
one of you guys is gonna do it!

whats the problem?


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## m jamieson (Dec 18, 2008)

The working gear isn't the real problem...it's fitting them into the space and have a complete upper deck too. I'm sure Y3a is hard at work on the problem but it's only been out a little over a week so I'm sure it will be awhile before we see that modification. I had to laugh when I was looking over the parts of my J2 and I came to the landing gear airlock doors. It was like a dog-door for the Jupiter 2..excuse me "Bloop Door" They would have had to crawl in on their hands and knees! lol Don't get me wrong ..they are beautiful and a great addition from Gary, but it's another example of the compromises of trying to turn a single story craft into a two story one at the last minute in 1965.


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## kimba32003 (Dec 17, 2008)

JohnGuard said:


> there is no way to make a working set of landing gear for the new J2?
> 
> come on!!
> all that talent out there??
> ...


Hi John
I'm with you on this idea, I believe there IS a way to make retractable legs a reality. I've still got a 16 inch Jupiter 2 I'm working on and I've pondered for months with different ideas and crazy notions on how to make an integrated system that can retract ALL 3 legs in unison..... still playing / toying with an idea of dual spring loaded pulley system that connects at a central point. The string would be connected by a single "Tab" for "pulling" and with exact measuring, it would be "notched" in the exact lengths required to the open and closed positions. 

The string would connect to the top of each strut / leg and run through some guiding mechanism / slot / hole. The pod bay doors could be cut out and hinged for access to the "Tab" and with some concealed interior fitting the would be some guide for the string to be pulled through, thus retracting all 3 legs together for flight mode. The string's "notch"could then be hooked or tethered by some style of cog or tooth design to hold in place. To deploy the legs, the tab and string is merely released from it's teher and the spring loading will draw the struts down into landing positioned, but regulated completely by how fast you guide /release the tab back into the main hull.

The excess string / tab could neatly be concealed within the pod bay doors, out of sight, once closed again for in flight mode. The string would need to be pliable but strong, that's why I've opted for piano wire, it's incredibly strong and can be supple enough to bend from each leg to the unifying junction and connected to each of the other leg's strings.

I hope I've described that well enough ??????
I will be getting around to putting this design to the test in the next month or so on my 16 incher, I'll be sure to post any and all progressive pics if it's a successful design ?

regards
Wayne


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## JohnGuard (Jan 13, 2008)

i knew one of you guys would step up and give it a go!!
Wayne! my man! 
the fate of the free world could "hinged" on your landing gear!!
dont fail us!!!!!!!!!!!!!

i'm not very smart but i'm going to give it a try. i mean if you go thru all the work to light it up, paint it, modify all the little details, there has to be a way to may workable gear!!!!!!!


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## terryr (Feb 11, 2001)

I think for a repeatable effect, it would have to be gears somehow linked to each leg and a motor. Even the large model LIS used had a false interior to fit all the parts in. Looks cool though.

Maybe three motors would work if they moved at the same rate. Car electric windows are motors geared to a lever arm which is attached to the window. A 2 way switch moves it up and down by switching polarities on the motor from positive/negative to negative/positive. 
In newer cars a cable is used that has teeth to be grabbed by the motor.
If that idea could be miniaturized with tiny motors and plastic gearing it wouldn't take up much room.


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

So what would one "do" with the working landing gear after all that work and expense? Just curious.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Not sure why anyone would go to that much trouble when the filming miniature did not have "working" landing gear. It was essentially a marrionette with the weight of the model supported by overhead wires. I built retractable gear on my 24" Lunar Models kit, would not want to go through that again. I want to enjoy model building, not re-engineering a kit that was designed for a different type of assembly. It can be done with the interior that was in the 4 footer, but not a full interior. My struts are not flexible and retract through the top of the gear well. This gives more strength to hold the weight and a partial interior reduces the overall weight. Just my observations.


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## m jamieson (Dec 18, 2008)

terryr said:


> I think for a repeatable effect, it would have to be gears somehow linked to each leg and a motor. Even the large model LIS used had a false interior to fit all the parts in. Looks cool though.
> 
> Maybe three motors would work if they moved at the same rate. Car electric windows are motors geared to a lever arm which is attached to the window. A 2 way switch moves it up and down by switching polarities on the motor from positive/negative to negative/positive.
> In newer cars a cable is used that has teeth to be grabbed by the motor.
> If that idea could be miniaturized with tiny motors and plastic gearing it wouldn't take up much room.


A linear actuator is what would work well ..they can be very small, they move at the rates you would need, and they have good torque...but they are expensive. You could tie all three gear together with thin wire and pulleys..but you still need a system to move the gear pad doors and also lock the gear in place so it wouldn't collapse. There are several other threads with a lot more gear ideas discussed, most notably by Y3a who has already motorized the gear on a lunar models J2. His was built with the "hero model scrim" that eliminates the "space" problem when building with a complete interior.


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## m jamieson (Dec 18, 2008)

RSN said:


> Not sure why anyone would go to that much trouble when the filming miniature did not have "working" landing gear. It was essentially a marrionette with the weight of the model supported by overhead wires. I built retractable gear on my 24" Lunar Models kit, would not want to go through that again. I want to enjoy model building, not re-engineering a kit that was designed for a different type of assembly. It can be done with the interior that was in the 4 footer, but not a full interior. My struts are not flexible and retract through the top of the gear well. This gives more strength to hold the weight and a partial interior reduces the overall weight. Just my observations.


Very true..the J2 would have to be hanging from wires in the first place if one didn't want it to drop on it's belly. So the only reasons I can think of to do it would be 1) if you were planning on filming your own new episodes (sounds fun!) 2) to win a modeling contest with the "WOW" factor. or 3) cause it's just kinda a cool idea to see if it can be done. Or a combination of all the above!


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## Captain Han Solo (Apr 5, 2002)

The Simple Answer..*YES.*

I have done it on all My J-2 models to date(Three 16.5 Lunars, a 2' Lunar, a 2' Sci-Fi Metropolis, and a Polar Lights). 

WITH the full interior.

In fact the great Jim Key also did a Prorotype 18" Build up for the long dead Icons J-2.

It can be done.

However, on the Moebius kit some Major surgery will need to be done...But it is made *SO WELL, I* AM THINKING Been there Done that....You can see my J-2'S in my Photo Album here.

Some people tend to over think things here..Everything is possible with this kit!!!I have several templates to make operating Landing Gear..But again, I love this kit as is..something I never thought I would say about any kit.

Need to think this out!!!


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

Jeez, I've already done every plausible idea for the working gear. The best method for power, ability to work several things at once and size is a jackshaft system which moves the pad doors first, then drops the main gear and stops where it should. When retracting, the gear goes up first and then the doors slide back shut a reverse of how the gear lowering sequence is. Trying to kludge the various Jupiter 2's into one item won't work and for all the effort, would be inaccurate. I actually plan to try another method on the Moebius Jupiter 2 for gear operation. if it doesn't work, not to worry, I already bought the stuff to make the Jackshaft and stops and reversing electrical harness n such. Making WORKING GEAR pretty much suggests the model gets hung on wires or a fusion core rest. Why not power your model from thin steel wire used to support your model? A boom to support the model can be made from a few layers of plywood glued together. If your smart enough to engineer your own working gear You are cleaver enough to design your own mount on top of your boom. It should pivot and revolve so the model can lift up, retract gear, rotate around and leave the Derelict!


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## JohnGuard (Jan 13, 2008)

am i reading right....some of you guys are saying.......

"why bother?"
"i cant do it so how can you?"
" i've done it but you cant"


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## Captain Han Solo (Apr 5, 2002)

JohnGuard said:


> am i reading right....some of you guys are saying.......
> 
> "why bother?"
> "i cant do it so how can you?"
> " i've done it but you cant"


Hopefully you didn't read any of that in my reply:freak:LOL!!!

I say if you want to do it then *DO IT BABY!!!,*However I can't make up my mind to do it on my Model


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## Dave Metzner (Jan 1, 1970)

The Question is NOT wheter or not operating lannding gear is possible rather the question should be if it is PRACTICAL...
There are several issues that are intertwined. The mechanics of retracing gear - the space for the gear when retracted, sliding landing gear doors and I've probably forgotten one or two!
Do you just want retracting gear never mind having an interior - that' can be done in a relatively straightforward manner - They did it with one of the four foot filming miniatures - That miniature had no interior (none of the miniatures had an interior).

If you want to have gear that retracts AND a full interior that makes it a whole lot more difficult....

Now if you want landing gear with an interior that operates AND has the capacity to support the model when extended you have a REAL CHALLENGE before you!!! (forget using many plastic parts for this one)

I'm sure that there is somebody out there with the machining equipment and knowledge to solve the problems I'm also sure that the results if offered as a kit will make $71.00 aftermarket add on landing gear sets look like chump change..

Now since this horse has been beaten to death already at least once before in the last few months I'm going to slap the closed sign on this thread! If you are fascinated with retracting landing gear go back a couple months in the archives, I'm sure you'll find that thread (Also closed)

Dave


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