# Economical base hull color for 1/350 TOS Enterprise



## Torgo (Apr 24, 2005)

I'm in the process of collecting paints for my 1/350 TOS Enterprise build, and I could use some advice. Gary Kerr's excellent painting guide has been out for a while now, and in it he suggests a mixture of 65% Testor's Flat Gull Gray (#1730) and 35% Testor's Japanese Army Lt Gray (#2115) for the production hull color. The problem I have is that this model is BIG, and mixing up a sufficient quantity of this paint is going to be very expensive. I used about 2.5 6oz. cans of Tamiya Fine White Primer on my 1/350 Refit, and the cost for that was something like $16.00 using Hobby Lobby coupons. In order to get enough Testor's paint in the little .5oz jars I figure I'll need to spend well over $50.00, and that's accounting for a 60/40 thinning ratio.

Have any of you found a more economical alternative that closely matches the production hull color in the paint guide? I don't care if it's a rattle can or something I need to mix and thin before spraying (I have an Iwata RG-3 mini-spray gun) so long as it's durable, reasonably accurate, and relatively inexpensive.


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## charonjr (Mar 27, 2000)

I have read here and elsewhere that concrete gray is a "good" match for the shooting model. Apparently, it has just enough shading to the green, yet neutral enough to do the job. There was also a Tamiya spray can "Tamiya America, Inc Aircraft Spray Paint AS-11 Medium Sea Gray (RAF) 100ml, TAM86511" that I bought, but haven't tried yet on the 1:1000 1701. My local model shop owner was very excited when this came in (a couple of years ago, now). He's a major Trek fan, even scratch built his own 1:350 1701 before PL introduced theirs. He swears the AS-11 is a dead on match. The cans are around $6-7 each for 100ml. This is likely a better alternative that mass mixing Testors 1/4oz bottles.

Don't be afraid to check out Ace Hardware or Walmart. They might have a decent color in a large can that is something like 10oz for $4 or 5. I know that someone here recommended Rustoleum Celery Green for the Klingon D7. Though, I think the name for Celery Green has been changed, but I am not sure. Again, years ago, and I can't find that particular color by name nowadays.

Here's its paint chip for the Tamiya AS-11, from their site.


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Here is my advice: The exact color doesn't matter. It really doesn't. And I say this as someone who agonized over getting the "right" color (to the point where I unintentionally ticked off Gary Kerr on this forum) and still ended up with a model that either looks "right" or "wrong" depending on where the model is sitting, what the light is like, whether the internal lights are on, etc. Sometimes it looks too green. Sometimes it looks too gray. Sometimes it looks too dark. Sometimes it looks too light. I move it to one location and it looks awesome, then someone turns on a lamp across the room and it suddenly looks wrong again. When you watch the original TOS footage, the ship's color changes from shot to shot. On the remastered footage, it looks CG dark grayish. In person at the Smithsonian it looks very greenish. Getting the color "right" on this model is a moving target. It's an exercise in insanity. I say this only to save you some mental anguish and maybe some money. Paint it a very light gray tinted with green. Use the kit plastic as a guide, because it's pretty close. The specifics are less important than making it slightly lighter than you think because it's easier to darken it with a dusting of a darker shade than lightening it. Get the color in the ballpark and you'll likely be just as happy with the finished results as you would be if you could get some of the actual original paint from 1965 from a time machine. It will look great. It will look like the Enterprise. I'd argue that it's more important to nail the detail colors -- the dorsal leading edge, the grays on the nacelles, etc. You could get the hull color perfectly right, but paint those areas too dark or too blue and suddenly the whole model looks wrong. The contrast between colored sections is more important. Again, paint things lighter than you think, step back, look at it under a variety of lighting, then paint areas darker if need be. It will look great.


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## JeffBond (Dec 9, 2013)

Tamiya Light Ghost Gray.


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## Torgo (Apr 24, 2005)

Thanks, guys! Hunk a Junk, your advice dovetails with the experience I had painting the Refit. Details and relative color contrast is where the real work is. At least I don't have to deal with complex aztecs & strongback on this model.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

JeffBond said:


> Tamiya Light Ghost Gray.


 This!!
I'm a big fan of "close enough" color if it looks good, and LGG in the rattle can is fine.
To whit:
Polar Lights 1/350 Enterprise (TOS Series Version)


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## Captain Robert April (Jul 5, 2016)

I'm a fan of standard gray primer and calling it a day.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

I’ve used MM Gull Grey on some of my builds and it looked great, just the right amount of olive. I’ve also used ACE Shady Cove enamel which I bought a quart of at the local hardware stove for around 10 bucks or so. It’s meant for use on farm equipment, so basically tractor paint. Very tough and durable as you could imagine. It only came in gloss so took 4 or 5 days to fully cure but it’s probably the closest I’ve seen to the original in a commercially available color.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

I'm gonna be cold and suggest something. If one is OBSESSED with getting the exact perfect match to the filming miniature's original color (aside from the fact that what is correct for the 11 foot model would not be correct for something much smaller), one should not get one's shorts in a bunch about how expensive it is to create that color.

I think there's some very good and sane thinking about color in the other comments.


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## Captain Robert April (Jul 5, 2016)

Let's take a step back for a minute.

The model was molded in the correct color, wasn't it? A clear glosscoat should take care of the surface as far as decals and looking too plasticky. Otherwise, you'd only need something to match the color of the plastic for those parts that aren't molded in the same color, like the clear fantail from the lighting kit, and for the inevtiable puttying of seams.

Take a piece of the kit into wherever you're doing your paint shopping and find something that matches.


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## Hammerstein (Apr 15, 2018)

There is no correct color for a model smaller than studio scale.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Hammerstein said:


> There is no correct color for a model smaller than studio scale.



Well, there's also the argument that it's a spaceship, and there's no air in space to cause the atmospheric color-lightening effect. Therefore matching the original color would not be incorrect.


That said, I'm of the "close enough to how it looks on screen" school.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

John P said:


> Well, there's also the argument that it's a spaceship, and there's no air in space to cause the atmospheric color-lightening effect. Therefore matching the original color would not be incorrect.
> 
> 
> That said, I'm of the "close enough to how it looks on screen" school.


Agreed on the last point. It's all about our looking at our model and feeling that it looks like what we remember.

But the scale-effect crowd have a point, but there was air in the _studio_ where the thing was shot: it was never in airless space, and there never was a 947-foot ship. All we ever saw was an 11-foot model in an earthbound studio.

So the paint-lightening effect should be in the proportion of the R2 1/350 kit to the _11-foot model_, being about 32.5"/132" = about 1/4.
So, really, _the R2 kit is a 1/4 scale kit_, and should be lightened accordingly. 

... which is not much, as it turns out. 

Extrapolating the info from this link, the amount that the original gray from the 11-footer should be lightened on the 1/4 scale R2 kit is negligible, or just under 1%.

(Edit: since the little "1/1000" kit is actually about 1/12 scale, we might want to add about 3% white to its grey, going by the link above.)

Me? I'm going to use what looks good to my eye, and something I can afford.


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## whiskeyrat (May 7, 2012)

Agreed with the agonizing over the exact color. Seems like a lot of effort and stress over something that may or may not be noticed, and even then only by extremely picky builders... also, what would they suggest you do, strip the damn thing down and re-paint it, just to make someone else happy?

A while back I saw this color suggested as a pretty close match:

https://www.behr.com/consumer/ColorDetailView/PPU12-9

Looks close enough to my old peepers...but then again, I'm not a builder who insists every model everywhere be as accurate as it can be. That's just plain ludicrous.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

You know, some times it almost feels like people are afraid some 'OFFICIAL CORRECT COLOR POLICE' is going to show up at a show, whip out a fan of Pantone color chips and shake their head and say "tsk. No, not accurate, not at all accurate. at least two shades off. YOU ARE FOREVER BANNED FROM MAKING A MODEL KIT! Take this scum away!" and the offending model is burned to ashes in front of the eyes of the sobbing builder.

It's a model. It's YOUR model. Make it how you want it to look. 

ETA: And really, my opinion, the ONLY valid reason to use the 'exact color match' to the 11 foot model is if you are replicating the 11 foot model-exactly. That means removing detail, painting over windows on the port side, removing the port 'sensor ring support thingie' and all that. Yes, exposed wires too. Scale gaffer tape. the whole deal.

I really do wish someone (with way more skill than I) have would do that. Mock up a pipe stand, build the control console, the whole 9 yards.


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## Harumph (Aug 31, 2006)

@ whiskeyrat - I see that you suggested a "house" paint. I'm just a caveman. I fell in some ice and later got thawed out by your scientists. Your paints frighten and confuse me :grin2:. I'm for sure no expert at paint types. Aren't these paints meant to be mixed with latex? Is it possible to use some other base that can be used with an airbrush, or at least a mini spray gun?

If this is the case, that would truly be economical, because you could do a lot of painting with just a quart, even on a big beastie like this.

Thanks for any info you (or anyone) provides. I think I've seen Gary Kerr with some Sherman-Williams chips too and I wondered why he would bother since I couldn't see how to use them, so at least I found a good enough place to ask a dumb question.


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## whiskeyrat (May 7, 2012)

Harumph said:


> @ whiskeyrat - I see that you suggested a "house" paint. I'm just a caveman. I fell in some ice and later got thawed out by your scientists. Your paints frighten and confuse me :grin2:. I'm for sure no expert at paint types. Aren't these paints meant to be mixed with latex? Is it possible to use some other base that can be used with an airbrush, or at least a mini spray gun?
> 
> If this is the case, that would truly be economical, because you could do a lot of painting with just a quart, even on a big beastie like this.
> 
> Thanks for any info you (or anyone) provides. I think I've seen Gary Kerr with some Sherman-Williams chips too and I wondered why he would bother since I couldn't see how to use them, so at least I found a good enough place to ask a dumb question.


Home Depot says it's "acrylic latex", which is still water cleanup, but I can only imagine that it would work just as well on a model as a wall in a house, as long as the model was properly primed. An 8 oz sample can be had for less than 5 dollars, so it would be cheap to try an experiment on some old kit parts to see how well it would work. But, super economical, if it does. The most immediate problem I can think of is how to properly dial in your airbrush to cope with the latex, or is that even necessary? One day when I'm ready to build my 1/350 1701 I might run a trial on this paint to see what happens. (I'm no paint expert either, just guessing).

https://www.homedepot.com/p/BEHR-Pr...nt-and-Primer-in-One-Sample-PP10416/300401222

If you scroll down to "Product Overview" you can read the characteristics of the paint.


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## JHauser (Jan 3, 2013)

For the OP if your still looking for ideas on paint or for those that want something lighter/different than the recommended color:

After working on mine on and off for a couple of years I’m finally getting ready to paint. I purchased the recommended paint (Tamiya JN Grey 81312 XF-12 lighten 10% with white) when I purchased the model. 

Since then, the Smithsonian released their results of the original production colors which are different than what was originally recommended. I don’t have a local Benjamin Moore paint dealer in my area (the Smithsonian offered Benjamin Moore “Heather Gray” # 2139-40 as a close match) for a paint swatch so I did some research on-line and came up with this:


https://airandspace.si.edu/stories/editorial/revealing-colors-star-trek-enterprise

Convert LAB to Hex
https://www.nixsensor.com/free-color-converter/

Hex to paint match of Smithsonian’s Production Hull Gray-Green; LAB: L 64.45 A -3.53 B 2.40
https://encycolorpedia.com/979e98

Closer match than Smithsonian’s recommendation of Benjamin Moore “Heather Gray” # 2139-40

Glidden Greycliffe / 50GY 32/046 / #979c95 Hex Color Code
https://encycolorpedia.com/979c95

After I picked up a swatch card of Glidden Greycliffe I immediately realized it was too dark for what I wanted. I wanted something closer to what I would see on film. Assuming that under the bright lights of filming, the actual color would look lighter. 

So going back to “Hex to paint match of Smithsonian’s Production Hull Gray-Green; LAB: L 64.45 A -3.53 B 2.40”
https://encycolorpedia.com/979e98 


I seen that it showed a 25% lighter tint of the original Smithsonian’s Production Hull Gray-Green; LAB: L 64.45, A -3.53, B 2.40. 

https://encycolorpedia.com/bfc3c0

Then scroll down to first similar paint.

Glidden Jade Frost / 50GY 53/033 / #bfc3bf Hex Color Code
https://encycolorpedia.com/bfc3bf

I found that I could match that color fairly well by using Tamiya JN Grey tinted with their white 50/50. To get even close I added a very small amount of red to move the green tint a little to grey. 

You can also use the JN Grey and shade it with black to get close to Glidden Greycliffe that is very close to the Smithsonian’s color


This is the look I’m after, the finished model photographed.

https://airandspace.si.edu/sites/default/files/images/image-albums/A19740668000-NASM2016-02325.jpg

The lighting conditions that my model will be in won’t be in the same bright light that I sure that photograph was taken in. Hopefully I can get that look under normal lighting using a lighter shade of the original color.

.


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## Captain Han Solo (Apr 5, 2002)

If you want it to reflect the filming model, Use Gary's paint formulas.
https://culttvman.com/main/a-modelers-guide-to-painting-the-starship-enterprise-by-gary-kerr/

I wish I had it for my own build, but I relied on my collection of reference material.To me, your milage may vary of course, A huge part of the fun is getting the subject as close to the real thing, in this case the 11' filming model, as best I can.


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## JHauser (Jan 3, 2013)

If you comment was for the OP, he also referenced Gary Kerr's excellent painting guide. It wasn’t economical for him, hence the title of his post “Economical base hull color for 1/350 TOS Enterprise”. 

By the way, you seem to have done an excellent job with out it.:thumbsup:


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## Bmunger (5 d ago)

I just purchased the 1:350 scale TOS kit. Was wondering if anyone had a recommendation for a Pantone color match. I would like to use a rattle can and if I had a Pantone color I can order it. For me it doesn’t have to be super accurate.


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## whiskeyrat (May 7, 2012)

BEHR ULTRA 8 oz. #UL220-15 Frozen Pond Matte Interior/Exterior Paint and Primer in One Sample UL20416 - The Home Depot


Before delving into a big painting project, preview the color with the BEHR ULTRA 8 oz. Sample. Formulated with both paint and primer, this sample allows you to conveniently apply paint to interior or



www.homedepot.com


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## seattleguy (Jun 9, 2008)

Oh, that Frozen Pond is a nice match. In spray can, I found this a while back. Home depot Behr Lunar Surface spray paint. BEHR PREMIUM 12 oz. #N460-3 Lunar Surface Gloss Interior/Exterior Spray Paint and Primer in One Aerosol B000344 - The Home Depot. It also comes in flat, BEHR PREMIUM 12 oz. #N460-3 Lunar Surface Flat Interior/Exterior Spray Paint and Primer in One Aerosol B002244 - The Home Depot


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## whiskeyrat (May 7, 2012)

That "Lunar Surface" is also a great match, maybe even better than the "Frozen Pond" depending on the color adjustments on your monitor or TV. I would be happy with either as my base coat.


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## NTRPRZ (Feb 23, 1999)

The Lunar Surface sample looks pretty good to me as well. When I did my original TOS Enterprise in the 1980s, I used Testor's camo gray. I think it worked well then and looking at my 40-plus-year-old starship, I think it still holds up well. Of course, the scale differences between the original and the 350 kit may make the Lunar Surface a better choice, in addition to the fact that the Testors is pretty much unavailable now (though I do have a can or two on the shelf.) Even after four decades, I think my Big E holds up pretty well. When this was completed in 1984, all I had for reference was some photos of the real thing in the Smithsonian and my Star Trek poster magazines. Although I'd used the kit decals on the nacelles and secondary hull, the name and registry number on the saucer was done with a lot of tape and careful measurements.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

It's not 100% accurate, but I love the way Tamiya rattlecan Light Ghost Gray looks:


Polar Lights 1/350 Enterprise (TOS Series Version)



I did this one with the Japanese Navy gray/green:


Polar Lights 1/350 TOS Enterprise


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