# Decal Paper Question 29,084



## pshoe64 (Jun 10, 2008)

Okay, I'm still struggling with decal creation. I have about 300 complete decal sets of various historical race cars created with Photoshop and Illustrator, scaled to specific existing bodies. I've never been completely happy with the Testor's decal paper. The substrate seem thick and the the white always shows at the edges. The thickness becomes really apparent under macro photography.
I can't afford silk screening and I've been investigating the Pro-FX dry transfer system which has issues with HO scale and application challenges due to size, body contours etc. (works great with 1/32!). So with all that being said, I would like to find a waterside, inkjet medium that is thinner and harder to detect at the edges like traditional decals. I've been reading about several brands and the Papilio brand keeps showing up under other hobby applications. They have 8.5" x 11" in clear and white. Anyone here ever use this brand? How does the appearance and application compare to the Testor's?

Any feedback appreciated,
Thanks,
Paul


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## slotcarman12078 (Oct 3, 2008)

I've used the Papilo brand paper with minimal issues. The white paper showing the edges are the nature of the beast though. You can preform the Hilltop trick in which you make a separate decal of just the border of each decal on clear paper, scaled slightly bigger and overlay that over the white paper decal. Option two is to color or paint the edges of the decal after you cut it out. Just be cautious of what you use to color the edge, and you'll have to trim the decal really close to get away with that. In some cases, I have gone as far as printing the car color on the decal, and then painting up to and over the edge to hide the white. I did that with Oxx:



Not going to get away with that with car numbers and such. 

There's one other brand of paper I haven't tried that might help. I'm not sure if it can be sealed after changing it from white to clear though... 18.99 for 5 sheets...

http://www.modeltrainsoftware.com/decalpaper.html

Scroll down and watch all 4 videos!! The last 2 are quite interesting. Sadly, my sound is no longer working on my 'puter so I don't know the dialog.


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## pshoe64 (Jun 10, 2008)

The body color in the background has been how I've gotten around the white/light numbers and sponsors on dark colors. I used to work in the printing business and learned how to color match ink and paint pretty well. I like the Jeep. Nice work! Here's the best I've managed with the Testor's. I guess I'm always looking to improve my results. Most of which I can credit the help and techniques learned here on HT. I'll check out the the other sources on the decal paper too. Thanks for the link.

-Paul


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## pshoe64 (Jun 10, 2008)

First off, thanks to everyone that sent me info or let me know what they have tried. That narrowed the field a bit. I found a supplier in Texas that sends sample sheets of different brands. I also found sample sheets for others they didn't carry. So I ordered Papilio and Bel Inc decal paper in clear and white base. I'm printing from an Epson Stylus 9400 Color Printer/Fax. Following the directions for printer settings, I ran a sheet using the white base from each brand. Both printed well, no smearing or pooling of ink. However, the Bel paper looked sharper. The Papilio looked okay, but side by side the Bell looked more in focus. Both were printed using the same printer, driver and program.

So now for the big test, applying them to the car! Both worked fine there as well. The Bel decal substrate was thinner and applied to contours better. Both stuck well and with a little vinegar, both snuggled down into crevices and held form.

Below are the Bel decals applied to a Tyco Grand Prix. I only have the nose done, but I'm happy with the results so far. I'll use the Papilio for larger scales or flatter surfaces. 

-Paul


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## Ralphthe3rd (Feb 24, 2011)

Looks Very Nice Paul :thumbsup: Thanks for sharing your findings with us


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## SCJ (Jul 15, 1999)

Paul-

I have been using Bell ( http://www.beldecal.com/ ) for years now (both clear and white) and find them to be accurate amd fast w/ shipping but wish they would take a little better care of the shipping envelope used.

I however do NOT print my own....I design/obtain/copy my artwork onto an SD card, and then take this to kinko's and use their color laser copy machine. It lays another .5 mil or so of thickness down and I think a more consistant color and of course I can reproduce/create vintage items! :thumbsup:


-------------------------
www.SlotCarJohnnies.com


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## Jisp (Oct 19, 2008)

Thanks for the update Paul and I'm pleased you seem to have found a product you are happy with. Given that the 9400 printer is an ink jet I assume you clear coated the decals before using. What do you clear coat them with?

Also, regarding substrate thickness, did you find the white Bel substrate less opaque than a thicker alternative like Testor's? The Tyco is looking great and the white looks quite white to me.

Thanks for any additional info.

Cheers,
Michael. :thumbsup:


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## pshoe64 (Jun 10, 2008)

The white has remained opaque. No bleed on the orange body color. I used the recommended clear coat from Bel, Krylon Crystal Clear Gloss. Walmart, $3.49 a can. I used three coats in thin applications. I let it dry over night between coats. So far I haven't seen any white edges, but that may be due to the orange background. I'm working up a Dodge Midnight Express Truck, so that should show the edges, if any, a bit better. I'll keep updating as I go.

-Paul


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## Jisp (Oct 19, 2008)

Good info Paul, thank you. I had a problem in the past with ink bleeding into a white area while I was actually applying the decals. If I recall correctly I only used two very thin coats to seal the decals because I needed to get them to conform to some difficult curves. I went thin to try and keep the decal as flexible as possible. Manipulating the decals must have worn the very thin acrylic coating enough to cause the bleed....

Now you have me thinking with your mention of vinegar. I've seen it mentioned in the past as an alternative to some commercial softening/setting products. I tried one of the commercial products once and it destroyed my DIY decal so have not used it again. Did you apply the vinegar to the painted surface before placing the decal, or over the top of the decal once it was in place? I know it's hard to quantify but how much vinegar - a complete bath or quite dry?

On the off chance that you have not heard of this tip for white edges. If they are overly visible, try very dry brushing the body paint with an extremely fine tip brush along the white edge. It's got me out of trouble a few times. Looking forward to seeing more of your work.

Thanks mate,
Michael. :thumbsup:


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## pshoe64 (Jun 10, 2008)

I use white vinegar, diluted 3 parts vinegar to 2 parts water. I brush the solution on the target area before sliding the decal in place. After the deacl "softens" and conforms to the area, I will use a soft paint brush to position and smooth out any wrinkles or air pockets. I'll dip the brush in the solution and work across the decal, working it into the position or snuggling down into door jambs and the like. I blot it dry with a lint free, clean cloth. Once all decals are in place, I brush on the Future for clear coat and protection.

If I'm applying decals to clear bodies (Lexan etc) on the inside of the body, I will use an acrylic flat clear to coat the decal and around the edges to seal it to the body and prevent the paint from seeping under the decal. I've used thinned white glue to the same effect. Just make sure your sealant is flexible so the decals don't pop off the body in the event of a wall-shot (which is guaranteed with me driving!).

-Paul


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## Jisp (Oct 19, 2008)

Thanks Paul.


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## pshoe64 (Jun 10, 2008)

*Update 5-26-13*

Still not finished with the #20, but I have the decals placed and the black painted on the roof and rear spoiler. Next up, Future and windows. I missed the orange by a shade or two. I'm working with a new printer so my color sync was set for the old printer. That's what I get for getting excited and in a hurry.
I'm happy with the decal paper from Bel. Good stuff and no white edges (so far). The side decals from the front fender-back are 1 piece and conformed well with a little vinegar mix. Here's how it looks before clear-coat. After seeing the "white-out" on the roof flaps in the macro shot, I went back with more vinegar and they snuggled back down. Need to watch thet before I take the pictures. Hard to sneak stuff by that macro lens.

-Paul


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

good job Paul


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