# Regarding Monarch's Ghost model...



## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

So what do you think?
Is the Ghost figure indoors or outdoors? It's very ambiguous. Is he inside, walking up an indoor stairwell? Or is he outside, climbing a stairway wrapped around a turret?
Enquiring minds want to know!!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Bobby,

Really, I think you could interpret it either way. The owl only makes the scene more ambiguous. The model base itself covers so little ground it's hard to determine whether the Ghost is indeed inside or out.

I have the resin set that connects the Ghost with the Forgotten Prisoner model and plan to treat it as an indoor scene, with the backs of the model made to look like the outside of Castel-Mare.


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

The owl could have flown in through the window, LOL.


The only reason I posed the question is because I am working on the base, and I went out to Google Images and keyed in "castle steps", and was noticing that on outside steps there's alot of moss growing on the vertical part of the step, dampness staining on the connecting wall area, and lots of dirt accumulating against the step…maybe even some small vegetation growing along the cracks as well.

So I guess I have to decide which way I am going with this…still undecided. But I like the idea of embellishing the kit with some vegetation in the cracks. Hmmmm...


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## Rob P. (Jan 26, 2004)

Well, it could be outside of the castle proper, but inside a giant cavern that the lower regions of the castle are connected to. With a stagnant pool of crocodiles below him and out of our sight in the art work. The owl got trapped inside or maybe just lives in there having gained entrance through a crack or tunnel. Maybe.

Rob


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

Rob, I think we need to hire you to work on the first draft for the movie script…"The Ghost of Castel Mare". You've got some good ideas there. We just need a plot now.


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## TomHering (Jul 24, 2011)

The only part of a castle with a curved wall like that is a tower. If the stairs were inside the tower, both the wall and the stairs would curve the other way - the whole scene would be concave instead of convex. So the stairs are wrapping around the outer surface of a tower wall. The only question is whether this outer surface is exposed to the outdoors, or inside an attached structure (like the castle keep). I'd say the outer surface and stairs are exposed to the outdoors, as I can't imagine building cells with barred windows that give prisoners a view of an attached interior.


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## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

Well the Ghost is Baron Sorgi (Forgotten Prisoner) in 1970, issue 34 of Creepy Magazine... http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/FRANKENSTIEN53/FRANKENSTIEN53061/689149_zpshomxkrue.jpg[/IMG][/URL] features a comic story of the Prisoner and tells of a Baron Sorgi and his archrival, Lord Basti, who were vying to tax the same small populace. One gets the other drunk, chains him to the wall of a hidden wine cellar, and then is killed himself as he tries to leave the room. Both men are forgotten, and never seen again. It was written by Robert Rosen, and illustrated by Tony Williamsune.... So he is actually in a wine cellar deep within the castles dungeon....

Denis


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## TomHering (Jul 24, 2011)

mcdougall said:


> So he is actually in a wine cellar deep within the castles dungeon....
> Denis


The man's skeleton would have to be where the man died, chained in the wine cellar, but his ghost could wander anywhere around the castle.


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## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

TomHering said:


> The man's skeleton would have to be where the man died, chained in the wine cellar, but his ghost could wander anywhere around the castle.


This conversion kit ties him in pretty close to his death scene....

But as he is a Ghost.....You could put him on a Roller Coaster if you wanted
Denis


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

I want to use those stone steps with the Aurora Phantom of the Opera


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## BrianM (Dec 3, 1998)

... wait, I thought the Ghost was same person chained to the wall. The clothes look similar. I assume it's inside... down in a dungeon area. Why do ghosts need shoes?... How do you pronounce Castel Mare?.... my head hurts!


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## nautilusnut (Jul 9, 2008)

> This conversion kit ties him in pretty close to his death scene....


This resin "bridge" between the two kits is brilliant. I never cared alot for the kits separately, but when they are together, the story is obvious and I really like it. As for the Ghost having shoes- seems an oversight to me, needs bony feet! (another aftermarket part)


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

nautilusnut said:


> As for the Ghost having shoes- seems an oversight to me, needs bony feet! (another aftermarket part)


And if you really want to get realistic, you could have this kit displayed with just the base, with no figure at all. When someone asks, "Where's the figure?" Just tell them, "It's a Ghost. Trust me, he's right there on the base. Can't you see him? He's there in spirit."
:tongue:


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

mcdougall said:


> You could put him on a Roller Coaster if you wanted.


Denis, methinks you've been watching too many Scooby-Doo reruns.
:hat:


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

BobbysMonsterModels said:


> And if you really want to get realistic, you could have this kit displayed with just the base, with no figure at all. When someone asks, "Where's the figure?" Just tell them, "It's a Ghost. Trust me, he's right there on the base. Can't you see him? He's there in spirit."
> :tongue:


And you can brag about how realistic the paintjob you did on him turned out too!


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Castel Mare had an accent (not sure how to actually type that). It would be pronounced Mar A


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## Spockr (Sep 14, 2009)

To add further complicate matters I broke out the Nosferatu one night and decided that the Castel needed a couple of extra flights of stairs... :tongue:


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

scooke123 said:


> And you can brag about how realistic the paintjob you did on him turned out too!


Yeah, and when people ask how difficult it was, you can just say, "It was NOTHING!"


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## Rob P. (Jan 26, 2004)

Spockr said:


> To add further complicate matters I broke out the Nosferatu one night and decided that the Castel needed a couple of extra flights of stairs... :tongue:


Matt, that project has been on your back burner longer then my Mummy kit bash. And I am about to wrap up my Mummy....................

Would love to see your project completed!

Rob


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## Rob P. (Jan 26, 2004)

BobbysMonsterModels said:


> Rob, I think we need to hire you to work on the first draft for the movie script…"The Ghost of Castel Mare". You've got some good ideas there. We just need a plot now.


I can not take full credit Bobby. I was influenced at an early age................



Rob


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

Cool. I never saw that movie. Just ordered it on Netflix.


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## Rob P. (Jan 26, 2004)

BobbysMonsterModels said:


> Cool. I never saw that movie. Just ordered it on Netflix.


It's great, You may also want to see The Strange Door.

As for story ideas, I addressed that with my Hunchback build giving the "prisoner" an origin story..........Back in April of 2014.............


Everybody knows Victor Hugos story of the Hunchback of Notre Dame, or at least every monster model builder should. And the problem I have with it, is that the Hunchback in Hugos story and the Hollywood movies show him as a tragic hero. Not really a monster, at least in my opinion. Having made that statement, lets go back 40 years, to when I first received an Aurora Glow in the Dark Hunchback of Notre Dame model. Looking at that cool box art, and not really being familiar with the Hugo story, I knew that this must be some hideous, vile monster. In the same vein as Fritz, Karl, and Daniel from the various Frankenstein movies. The purple and green colors screamed "Ghoul" "Grave robber" and possibly, dare I say? "Cannibal!" And for a few years that is really all I thought of him as. Then the real story crept in. 

Well, I am not going to let the story ruin a great memory! This is the Hunchback of Notre Dame model, BUT it is my Hunchback and my version. In this story, Quasimodo is the ghoulish, grave robbing and I do say cannibal of my childhood! Having been caught by a torch wielding, pitchfork carrying angry mob, the ghoul has been tossed into the catacomb like torture dungeons beneath Paris. Where by chance he has run into a Prisoner (before he is Forgotten!), the unfortunate soul accused of Piracy, and having been convicted, and left to go MAD in the catacombs. Later on, after having lost all of his mind, Paris Authorities will transfer him to the Asylum of Criminally Insane at Castle Mare. A few years later, he will be completely forgotten. And as for the Hunchback's fate? Some say he is still in those catacombs beneath Paris. Rumors abound that he was a henchman of some Phantom. What we only know for sure, is that NO ONE knows for certain the Hunchbacks true fate!

Don't believe me? Well here is the only known photos of the Hunchback and the Prisoner together!







More to come!

Rob


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

djnick66 said:


> Castel Mare had an accent (not sure how to actually type that). It would be pronounced Mar A


Yep. Aurora's original box art shows the kit is called "The Forgotten Prisoner of Castel-Maré"; hyphenated and having an accent mark over the final "e". But we 'Muricans love to change things we can't pronounce, so...


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

Yeah - I've pronounced it without an accent since the 60's original release. Can't change now!!!!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Getting back to the "indoor/outdoors" question, it's entirely possible that the Ghost scene represents an enclosed staircase_ within the castle_. The window is an architectural oddment, but no two castles are exactly alike. So it could be an enclosed staircase with the inside wall bordering a curved courtyard. That's my take, anyway.

Matt, your project looks spooktacular! I may not agree with all your decisions, but I like the way you drink... :drunk:


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## Frankie Boy (Feb 28, 2002)

Mark McGovern said:


> ... it's entirely possible that the Ghost scene represents an enclosed staircase_ within the castle_.


That's how I see it.


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

In hindsight, I'd love to see someone create an alternative head for the Ghost…something a little scarier, as I feel the one that comes with the kit looks like an groaning old man, and not necessarily a creepy-looking ghost.


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## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

Hmmmmmm Jeff Yagher Sculpted this kit..... I kinda thought it was already pretty scary looking . 
Mcdee


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

Make no mistake, I think he did a great job sculpting the thing. I just would've liked to have seen a scarier visage…the head on the model now looks very tame. But I guess he was going for the "classic" horror look and not anything too intense…or modern. But it still would be cool to see someone come up with a new head…something different…an alternative.

I would imagine it was kinda hard to design this model. Afterall, what does a ghost look like? If you make it too creepy, people will think it's a zombie/walking dead thing. If it's too evil looking, people would think it was a demonic thing. I guess they handled it well, but he looks a bit like an old emaciated hillbilly in some respect.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

It should also be noted that the sculpt had to be adapted to the injection-molding process. There have to be compromises that aren't necessary for resin models that are cast in flexible molds. On the other hand, there's nothing to prevent a modeler from adding - or subtracting - gruesome detail.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

BobbysMonsterModels said:


> ...I would imagine it was kinda hard to design this model. Afterall, what does a ghost look like? If you make it too creepy, people will think it's a zombie/walking dead thing. If it's too evil looking, people would think it was a demonic thing. I guess they handled it well, but he looks a bit like an old emaciated hillbilly in some respect.


My first thoughts upon seeing the sculpt for the first time were that it did indeed look like a walking corpse more than a ghost. And that's pretty much still my opinion. But that raises the question: How _do_ you sculpt a ghost? I have no idea. So my conclusion is that it's up to the modeler to make it look less corporeal and more ghostly by the way they/we paint it. I'm not quite sure how to do that, but I'm hoping I'll figure it out one of these days.


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## BobbysMonsterModels (Mar 8, 2014)

Yep, walking corpse it is. Honestly, when I think of a "ghost" I think of this…which might have made an interesting model, LOL…maybe:










So many people paint this thing with the clothing painted in typical colors, but when you think about it, if it's a ghost it would be phantom-like and see-through…so it would look almost holographic I would think, which is why I'm going with a more monochrome look when I paint mine. This is the direction I'm going:










I'm still working on the base now. I always paint my bases first, and do the figure last. I'm still debating whether to paint the torch illumination onto the wall or just paint a straight up stone wall. I've never been one to like kits painted with lighting effects, and not sure I could pull it off well.


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

It would have been cool to have the whole figure in clear or glow plastic when the Glow issue was released. Still like the glow packaging though.


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## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

I always liked this Ghost


and this one...


and my latest one...
Jacob Marley


I would have loved the Monarch Ghost to have been cast in Pure Glow plastic :thumbsup:
Denis


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

BobbysMonsterModels said:


> ...So many people paint this thing with the clothing painted in typical colors, but when you think about it, if it's a ghost it would be phantom-like and see-through…so it would look almost holographic I would think, which is why I'm going with a more monochrome look when I paint mine...


Well, that depends on what each modeler thinks a ghost would look like. I've read "ghost sightings" in which the person (or people) reported seeing what they initially thought was another person because the figure they saw _wasn't_ transparent.

That being said, with this kit I partially agree with your thoughts that the figure should look monochromatic with shading and highlights. On the other hand, I'd kinda' like it to bear at least a slight resemblance to my Forgotten Prisoner build-up, so mine might have just a _little_ color added to it when I finally get around to building it. But that's the fun thing about a kit like this--there's really no right or wrong way to paint it.


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## Bubba 123 (Sep 10, 2010)

Spockr said:


> To add further complicate matters I broke out the Nosferatu one night and decided that the Castel needed a couple of extra flights of stairs... :tongue:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## ChrisW (Jan 1, 1970)

scooke123 said:


> It would have been cool to have the whole figure in clear or glow plastic when the Glow issue was released. Still like the glow packaging though.


I never got the kit in glow, but assumed that the whole figure would have been cast that way based on the color breakdown of the non-glow kit. So what parts are glow?


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## Rob P. (Jan 26, 2004)

mcdougall said:


> I always liked this Ghost


This is the best sheet ghost model I have ever encountered! Awesome build Denis!

Rob


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## Owen E Oulton (Jan 6, 2012)

TomHering said:


> The only part of a castle with a curved wall like that is a tower. If the stairs were inside the tower, both the wall and the stairs would curve the other way - the whole scene would be concave instead of convex. So the stairs are wrapping around the outer surface of a tower wall. The only question is whether this outer surface is exposed to the outdoors, or inside an attached structure (like the castle keep). I'd say the outer surface and stairs are exposed to the outdoors, as I can't imagine building cells with barred windows that give prisoners a view of an attached interior.


Actually the radius of the curve makes it look more to me like a thick column in the centre of the spiral stair. As this would be a load-bearing column, it would be quite thick. For an example, watch any old Errol Flynn movie with a sword-fight on a spiral stair.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Owen E Oulton said:


> Actually the radius of the curve makes it look more to me like a thick column in the centre of the spiral stair. As this would be a load-bearing column, it would be quite thick. For an example, watch any old Errol Flynn movie with a sword-fight on a spiral stair.


Good point, but would such a thick, load-bearing column have a window in it?


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