# Super III?



## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

So whats the deal, winner or looser?
So far I am on the fence, it seems to have potential but needs hop up parts support in my opinion.
There seems to be very little talk about it lately...


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

There are other threads already.

The spares situation sucks. Totally avoidable really.


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

people are applauding the effort, but not the product.

The way I see it... any car you spend 25 bucks on, and then have to invest time and/or money to get it to run right... simply isn't worth it.


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

I have to say after getting rid of the s3 body the car is pretty good. I mounted it to an AW camaro it handles a lot better almost never deslots at high speed in the corners. I think it would be better if I did not have wall worts and stock controlds


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## jeremy1082 (Apr 27, 2004)

I just picked up a Super III Mustang, $15.99 at Niagara Hobbies. Nice effort but not impressed with the product. It ran for about 5 minutes then died. The motor brushes suck. I replaced them with a set from a tyco and tightened the adjustment screw that came loose and it runs fine, just not the fastest thing on the track or the smoothest. I replaced the crown gear with one from a G-Plus to make it run smoother.
These chassis are not inter-changable with other AFX bodies (same wheelbase but the mount is in a different location).
It's nice that you can adjust the traction magnets and that you can remove the brush barrels without taking apart the motor.
The fastest ones I have are old Super magnatraction cars that used to be "speed shifters" or "Blazing brakes" but with a regular crown gear set-up. They always out run a super G Plus. Must have just been a good arm/magnet/pick-up shoe combo.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Still no spares for these?

If true then that is utterly unforgivable.


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

That is a true statement, as with any "new" entry into the slot world parts are usually a little scarce at first but there seems to be no support from Autoworld at all for these. I guess they were hoping that they would get aftermarket parts support but when the manufacturer doesn't seem to care it's hard to " get behind" a product and invest money. I would assume it is not cheap to manufacture the parts with the costs to tool up so it's Autoworlds ball, I hope they finally pick it up and run with it!


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## A/FX Nut (May 28, 2004)

I purchased one over 2 weeks ago. I tinkered with it a little. I noticed the hubs are a little off center. The back of the crown gear rubs the chassis. The Dodge Stock car body is great looking. It handles good but I'm having trouble getting speed out of it in Stock trim.

Over all, I really like the car. It's got alot of potential. I haven't had much time to work with it lately. I'm looking forward to spending some more test and tune time with it. 

I think it's a good new chassis that AutoWorld hasn't copied here. I ask this question here. When is the last time we've had a new chassis hit the market at a decent price? 

I'm grateful we have new cars coming. Randy.


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## blubyu (May 4, 2008)

Picked one up at the Indiana slot show. Took it apart and reamed the bushings,cleaned the com,tossed the brushes in the garbage. Replaced with new wizzard copper and spaced the motor and glued the pinion on. Then for tires and gears wizzard LLTG .478 rears with slottech 24 tooth crown with the back cut for clearance all riding on a .059 Tyco axle, wizzard FR31 independent front w/.376 rubber. Runs good but could be better. Already drilled out front nubs for pickup shoes as one broke off. Shoes are now Tyco as one AW broke from to much tweaking.........That seemed to help the car through my new 18" radius turns, as the old shoes would hesitate no matter how I was tweaking them or what tension I had on the pickup springs. Still need to fine tune the springs and shoes, Will see how it goes this weekend against the Kids P2E, P3E's?


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

Super III review on slot car illustrated, pretty much what we all said plus they give it a Thumbs up. Check it out here http://www.slotcarillustrated.com/Reviews/Cars/HO/the-auto-world-super-iii-a295.html


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

T-Jet Racer said:


> Super III review on slot car illustrated, pretty much what we all said plus they give it a Thumbs up. Check it out here http://www.slotcarillustrated.com/Reviews/Cars/HO/the-auto-world-super-iii-a295.html


I saw that too and applaud Paul's attempt :thumbsup:

But on a technical level, there's alot of mistakes, especially concerning magnets. (Both motor mag north poles face top of car?)


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Interesting review. Nice to see some decent pics of the bodies.

....but if that front rim pictured is true and concentric, as the reviewer stated, I'll eat Joez hat!


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

and the fact the gears meshed nicely suggests he had a SG+ in his hands by mistake


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## tjettim (Nov 29, 2005)

If AW makes some neat looking F1 bodies I might try some,but who
wants to carry around a 6.2 gram body? The older Lifelike MonteCarlo
wieghed 4 grams.The Datsun,slightly under 3.And those rear tires,if
to scale,they must be for a top fuel dragster.


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## win43 (Aug 28, 2006)

:wave:This is one of my favorite topics.:wave: I know that ALL slots needs a little tweaking but, originally $25 for a car that runs for a few minutes and dies, needs hours of tweaking, or many $$$ in after market parts to make it run is just not worth it.  A few good hits with a hammer and you have the same thing you started with... A PILE OF JUNK!!! Is quality control a taboo concept or just a lost art?? :freak: I understand in business it's all about the "bottom line". But: junk product = losing customers = no "bottom line"

I was glad when the old Johnny Lightning slot car line was continued by AW. I was happy to have new bodies and even some new chassis but with each new release I start to care less and less. 



Maybe it's just me but I do expect a new car to work out of the box.

Now it's time to stop beating this poor dead horse.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Oh Jerry! Nuthin wrong with a little taste of Equine Patte'. Did you suddenly go vegetarian on us? Or did PETA convince ya that Alpo with gravy was bad juju?

I finger it this way. The more super lll's people buy the less money they have to spend on the cars YOU want.


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

tjettim said:


> If AW makes some neat looking F1 bodies I might try some,but who
> wants to carry around a 6.2 gram body? The older Lifelike MonteCarlo
> wieghed 4 grams.The Datsun,slightly under 3.And those rear tires,if
> to scale,they must be for a top fuel dragster.


Like I said pretty much what we all said here, 
pick up= adjust, brushes= tighten, gears= lap in and adjust,
bodies 30 % heavier than the competition ( althought they say the same? ), 
axels and wheels= not true (they forgot their glasses), 
chassis sits high etc. 
body clip= unique ti super 3 body,
no parts avail for repair
silicone tires would help
good first effort with new chassis, work out the bugs next release, hopfully.
I think that sums it up. can i get paid now 
lol


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## tjettim (Nov 29, 2005)

Since their current customer base seems to be more collector
oriented,they need to make some limited runs of custom colored 
chassis.Then hopefully profits will allow a Super 4 or something.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

They need to get a proper racing mentality for this supposed comp chassis to be any good. All the tweaks we read about should have been done by AW already and the bodies should have been pared to 4g maximum.

The spares situation is a total joke too.


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

I still get past spending 25 bucks per car for chassis that runs like crap, unless your'e a tweak miester. Super 4.... keep it. If I want a top end chassis, I'll buy a Wizard for 30 bucks that screams out of the box, rather than a dog for 25. 

That being said... the "study" is an impressive break down.


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

To be quite blunt, I think Tom simply had more faith in the abilities of the AW customer base.

Without adding anything, these cars are just as much bang for the buck -and then some- as a $30 Storm roller...which can be whooped by an SRT too, by the way. Not a knock on the Storm, just the facts of different technologies. Put another $30 or so into the Storm then maybe you got something.

I doubt myself and others (who aren't members of the Love To Hate AW Club) got the only good cars out there. The difference is, before I would rant on any car, I'm gonna check my own abilities first. If I see someone else making 'em scream, I'm gonna learn why I can't. If I don't want to learn, I'm not gonna go spouting off crap about the car cuz it's my choice not to educate myself.

The real bottom line with the Super III is, if you can't make it fly with 10 minutes of your time and a good pair of slip-ons, it ain't the car. That's a fact.


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## lenny (Feb 29, 2000)

SwamperGene said:


> To be quite blunt, I think Tom simply had more faith in the abilities of the AW customer base.


That statement is so pathetic, it's beyond belief... Introduce a POS that is poorly thought out and even more poorly executed, and leave it up to your ' customer base' to figure out how to make it function? C'mon Gene. You've got to be joking... 



SwamperGene said:


> To be quite blunt, I think Tom simply had more faith in the abilities of the AW customer base.
> Without adding anything, these cars are just as much bang for the buck -and then some- as a $30 Storm roller...which can be whooped by an SRT too, by the way. Not a knock on the Storm, just the facts of different technologies. Put another $30 or so into the Storm then maybe you got something.


Not any Storm roller I've bought. They scream right out of the box. Same for the Life Like TOMY and Mattel cars I buy. There are some that might need MINOR tweaking, but none of them need wholesale replacement of parts OUT OF THE BOX to get them to respectability... The cars are a joke. 



SwamperGene said:


> The real bottom line with the Super III is, if you can't make it fly with 10 minutes of your time and a good pair of slip-ons, it ain't the car. That's a fact.


The FACT is the car has too many areas where there is friction that need to be worked out. 

The fact is that the shoes require a masterful and careful bending to get them correct. Don't mess with them too much because they'll break and there AREN'T ANY FREAKIN REPLACEMENT PARTS!!!!! 

The fact is that the brushes have little actual brush material to them. These are the most minimalist brushes I have ever seen.

The fact is the arm isn't spaced properly and could (and does) interfere with the chassis. 

The fact is that the gears DO NOT mesh properly and both the pinion and crown need to be replaced.

The fact is the bodies are overweight and sit too high. 

The fact is the bodies are proprietary, which is inexcusable. You can't take this body and use it even on an AW X-Trac.

The fact is the market has spoken and is shunning this first release. Giving TL the benefit of the doubt (heavy on the doubt), MAYBE subsequent releases will have these problem areas fixed.

Gene, maybe you just have more patience and time on your hands to get these to work like an out of the box Tomy Turbo. 

The fact is that 'it's the car'. It's advertised, positioned and priced as a 'competition racing car'. It should perform it's BASIC function OUT OF THE BOX! It fails to do so. If it were advertised as a 'potential competition chassis that needs the shoes to be bent, chassis material removed, arm spaced, brushes locked into place and gears replaced' in order to get it to run, then it would live up to it's billing admirably.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Gene,

Normally I agree with you, but I think for a change you are off base here.

The performance of the S3 out of the packet can only not be described as terrible because then that would leave no word to describe the QC. The lack of spares I can't even think of a word that describes how bad that is.

AW have messed up big time.



SwamperGene said:


> To be quite blunt, I think Tom simply had more faith in the abilities of the AW customer base.
> 
> Without adding anything, these cars are just as much bang for the buck -and then some- as a $30 Storm roller...which can be whooped by an SRT too, by the way. Not a knock on the Storm, just the facts of different technologies. Put another $30 or so into the Storm then maybe you got something.
> 
> ...


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

they are not bad when you nail them for 15 bucks. I dont agree that the gears need to be replaced, it seems some had the pinion guide or stop or whatever you call it was put on backwards and yes they would cause the gears to grind and lock up after turning it around I had a good mesh, then a quick debur with the demel and I was quite happy. there are clearance issues, some need a spacer other need to be relieved with the dremel esp at the crown gear where it rubs the chassis. I like the adjustable traction magnets, i just wish they had a set screw to lock them in. Should I have to do all of this, absolulty not but quality control is not a new issue at autoworld. Yes they have their probelms esp. the brushes are meatless and they loosen, bodies dont fit other aw cars. but if you go the route of a storm you are going lexan so in my opinion the body is realy a moot point, as a matter of fact they should come only with a lexan since it is a "competition " car or so they would like to believe


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Well this evening is getting more surreal by the minute cos I agree with everything DC says. (actually that is very tongue in cheek Dan so don't take offence).

I'm not a TL hater and to dismiss anyone who does not gush about the S3 as one is unworthy of Gene.

I remember with the Marchon MR1, I made some really good cars in ten minutes by part swapping. But all the parts were Marchon and that is a very important distinction.

In this instance we cannot yet (ever?) swap in spares because there aren't any. I can't recall such a silly thing happening with any other current chassis.



lenny said:


> That statement is so pathetic, it's beyond belief... Introduce a POS that is poorly thought out and even more poorly executed, and leave it up to your ' customer base' to figure out how to make it function? C'mon Gene. You've got to be joking...
> 
> 
> Not any Storm roller I've bought. They scream right out of the box. Same for the Life Like TOMY and Mattel cars I buy. There are some that might need MINOR tweaking, but none of them need wholesale replacement of parts OUT OF THE BOX to get them to respectability... The cars are a joke


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

T-Jet Racer said:


> , i just wish they had a set screw to lock them in.


I did suggest this to TL, as I think most people accept, before the chassis was designed. You can even see the holes for the screws (I think somebody called them cooling holes!!)

Maybe if enough people asked for this and some other changes to the S3 we would get them.


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

Man, it's getting HOT in here! LOL!


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

Montoya1 said:


> I did suggest this to TL, as I think most people accept, before the chassis was designed. You can even see the holes for the screws (I think somebody called them cooling holes!!)
> 
> Maybe if enough people asked for this and some other changes to the S3 we would get them.


I have had no trouble yet with the magnets moving around, but they will eventually. I guess I have to drill and screw them or ca glue dot or something.
Hopefully some of this gets back to AW and they work on the issues, it would only improve their product and at a very minimal cost, especially the replacement parts they have them allready just bag them up!


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

Dan I'm not gonna get in a big huffin' argument over your opinion of an AW product, it'd be never ending and we both know it. I'm happy that both of you bring product to this market. If you're ever on the East Coast though, be sure to let me know and we'll settle these issues on the track. :thumbsup:

Truth of the matter is I don't care if they've got wooden axles, they can run within a second and some tenths of pro-built RTR SS lexan cars _with the body on_ _and_ _with all their stock parts_ and only the same setup "tweaks" you would apply to _any car out of the box_. In fact the hard heavy body is the only thing holding them back by that second and some. Not bad at all for a $25 car.

I've never said the cars were perfect, they aren't but they are another fun toy for us to race, and aside from the fact that TL might not be listening at all, he surely ain't gonna respond to a bunch of whining by people who do two laps with the car and toss the car into the scrapheap saying "see...those guys were right".

Believe me, if the cars tanked I'd be the first to bring up why...whether it was me or the car. But after literally thousands of laps they actually are getting better. Immediate issues that AW needs to deal with are the rear width and replacement parts, and it would be great if somebody made a good slipon sized for this car.


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## lenny (Feb 29, 2000)

SwamperGene said:


> D...they can run within a second and some tenths of pro-built RTR SS lexan cars _with the body on_ _and_ _with all their stock parts_ and only the same setup "tweaks" you would apply to _any car out of the box_. In fact the hard heavy body is the only thing holding them back by that second and some.


This, I SERIOUSLY doubt.... Most, if not all the reviews I've read here and other boards, plus my own experience and that of other area racers suggests that these cars have their hands full with something as basic as an open frame motor SRT, or even Turbo.


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

Montoya1 said:


> I'm not a TL hater and to dismiss anyone who does not gush about the S3 as one is unworthy of Gene.


I never did Deane. But lets get realistic. SG+ rear tires suck. they have for many many years and they haven't changed them. Everybody says SRT crowns are junk, throw it away and put a SG+ setup in. Years later, they still come that way. You can come up with longtime known issues for pretty much any mass produced chassis on the market. Yet since the minute Drag and Tom posted their first run heat issue, likely due to loose brushes as can happen in any adjustable-barrel car, AW has been crucified most particularly on this board for bringing this_ monstrosity_ to market, _sometimes by people who don't own or who've never even run the darn things_. If that ain't an example of a hate club, I don't know what is.


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

lenny said:


> This, I SERIOUSLY doubt.... Most, if not all the reviews I've read here and other boards, plus my own experience and that of other area racers suggests that these cars have their hands full with something as basic as an open frame motor SRT, or even Turbo.


Dan, I take any testing and reporting I do very seriously as the web can be a powerful medium and I'd never want to spread false or misleading information regarding other people's products. I keep all race reports as they provide tons of valuable insight into various cars. The gauge I'm using is hot laps and average set last year on my track by a guy named Rich Scmidt...I don't think anyone here could argue that he is not right now one of the best, if not the best, SS racers in the country. His hot lap was 4.2, in the same lane I've hit 5.4 with a SIII Taurus and can cruise at 5.9 when warmed up (similar spread with the SS average times). I have no need or desire to lie about it, why on earth do you even think I would?


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## lenny (Feb 29, 2000)

SwamperGene said:


> If that ain't an example of a hate club, I don't know what is.


There is also an exact opposite 'AW Love Club', that gives TL a free pass on EVERYTHING he brings out, no matter how lame it is. Like the S3...


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## neorules (Oct 20, 2006)

"The gauge I'm using is hot laps and average set last year on my track by a guy named Rich Scmidt...I don't think anyone here could argue that he is not right now one of the best, if not the best, SS racers in the country. "

There is one way to find out!! Come to the HOPRA Nats June 12th through the 15th at Lucky Bobs. If Rich really is that good, he should be able to prove it against the best of the best. One word of caution-- Many have tried, few have succeeded. Swamper-- I know you have good perspective on things from your posts, Rich must be good, but to claim he is the "best" He'll need to run aganst the best. Hope to see you guys in Milwaukee.


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Not really fair to put Rich on the spot. There are at least a dozen racers at that level who could take the top position is SS at any given race, but none of them would personally claim to be the top dog in that class. They are all contenders and that's why the races are run. Some of these top guys will be in Milwaukee and some will not. 

Numbers, especially "hot lap" ones, are often deceiving. The racers who win on a consistent basis are a fractional percentage better than the competition on a consistent basis. What look like very small differences in lap times can equate to a total blowout during a 4 or 5 minute race. 

The Super III is what it is. Between this board and the SCI board reviews we've more than adequately shared our opinions about the product with its maker, who is obviously reading what we say. We've done our part as informed and knowledgeable customers who want nothing more than for the car to be successful because it's in our best interests for it to be so. What happens next is up to AutoWorld.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

AfxToo said:


> The Super III is what it is. Between this board and the SCI board reviews we've more than adequately shared our opinions about the product with its maker, who is obviously reading what we say.


Really? What do you base that on?


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

There is a reference to the SCI review on the AutoWorld web site. There are a number of AW dealers/distributors who post on this site, and I have no doubt that AW staffers read this board on a regular basis. There is more than ample evidence that AW has responded to our collective requests over the years, and done so in a very positive manner. Either they are listening and trying to make us happy or we are just incredibly lucky and are getting what we've been asking for without asking for it directly. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they do respond to fair and reasonable criticism with the same degree of attention that they respond to positive feedback and future product requests. 

At the end of the day, AutoWorld is a company run by a strong individualist who has a vision for where he'd like to see his company go and how he intends to take it there. I believe that some of the creativity that has come out of JL/AW as a consequence of its leader's vision and experience in the collectibles market has translated very nicely to the slot car hobby. The inventory of new offerings since the inception of the JL/AW slot car lines is staggering compared to the current competition. That's where the diecast model has paid off in spades for us. On the other hand, some things have not translated so well. Slot cars require a lot of care and feeding on an ongoing basis to deliver lasting value for hobbyists who do more than just put them on display. That's an area where AW has to learn and we can try to help them by pointing out areas that need more attention, like spare parts and parts interchangeability. If the Super III were able to accept more parts (and bodies) from other vendors and product lines it would relieve a great deal of the pressure from consumers right now. That is a lesson to be learned right now and we'll find out if they take it to heart. The same level of scrutiny must be applied to any vendor releasing a new product. If the upcoming RaceMasters Mega G does not release with a readily available supply of service parts it will be lambasted as well. We already know the first version of the Mega G will not accept bodies from any other AFX line. The fact that new and unique bodies are stunning will alleviate some of the concern, but if I can't get shoes and brushes I'll be hesitant to run them just like I rarely run my Super IIIs.


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## 1976Cordoba (Sep 20, 2000)

I agree with AFXToo on this -- AW has put out a ton of product in the last few years. The chassis have left a lot to be desired at times, but there seems to be a progression of improvements that would indicate that they are hearing the feedback and responding to it.

We'll see if the not-so-SuperIII gets a similar make-over to address the multiple issues it has. First and foremost would be to get the brush problems sorted, followed by the gear mesh and finally the assinine decision to not make the bodies interchangeable with the rest of the AW XTrac-style cars.


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## Pete McKay (Dec 20, 2006)

I guess it's a good thing I completely read through this string before I started ordering S3's. I have been looking for a car to replace the Lifelikes series cars with that I gave away, and to base a new series on. While the LifeLikes are a great car that is cheap, it sounds like the Super III is a not realy either. I noticed BRS has the NASCAR bodied versions for $18, I'm not in a hurry now since I can still get Lifelikes for $14-18. I'll wait for Walthers to release the CoT's I guess.


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## tjettim (Nov 29, 2005)

I think a S4 is completly feasable.With a one piece low chassis,with
thin neo motor mags and long, narrow, low profile neo traction magnets,
an affordable racer could be developed.It would follow the evolutionary
lines of modern ho technology.The S3 could bridge the gap between the
magnatraction era and an all new design.


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## 22tall (Jul 28, 2002)

Even if AW offered parts who in their right mind would buy them? They would be the same bad quality.

To me the JL/AW legacy will always be a good body on an armpit of a chassis. I think people are finally getting tired of the bad quality. Please someone, name the parts that have not had problems at one time or another on any of the chassis lines. Bent axles, bad rims and tires have always been around. They copied fairly bullet proof tjets and Xts and totally screwed them up.

The SIII just shows business as usual. The average tjet runner is ill equiped to deal with the new chassis. Some sort of instruction sheet could have helped with something like understanding the concept of brush barrels. If the quality of the parts was better maybe people wouldn't be scrambling to find replacement parts. There is no excuse for a new car needing parts out of the box.

I would like AW more if they just sold bodies.

On the plus side it is good to know all those Yugo engineers still have jobs.


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

22tall said:


> If the quality of the parts was better maybe people wouldn't be scrambling to find replacement parts. There is no excuse for a new car needing parts out of the box.


This is the kind of statement I'm refering to. C_an you qualify that???_ We just set up two more of them yesterday. Again, two more fun, fast cars. I think we put 5 minutes into one car and a little more into the other that the owner had admittedly messed the shoes up. Ran tons of laps next to an SRT GT40 which had nothing on the big Nascar SIII, in fact any cornering gains by the SRT were lost to the SIII in every straight. Box stock w/slip-ons...._no parts needed_. _Why state that they need parts out of the box when they don't?_


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## blubyu (May 4, 2008)

SIII vs SRT? Mine is also a bit faster down the straights (16'), but your talking Poly vs Ceramic motor mags. As far as the lap times the SRT has the edge now. (both cars have silicone sponge & ind. fronts. all WO/body) But the kid's P2E's are much faster, under the track S/S record!


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

blubyu said:


> SIII vs SRT? Mine is also a bit faster down the straights (16'), but your talking Poly vs Ceramic motor mags. As far as the lap times the SRT has the edge now. (both cars have silicone sponge & ind. fronts. all WO/body) But the kid's P2E's are much faster, under the track S/S record!


I'm quite aware of the mag difference which is why I've said since it's release that the SIII is in a class by itself (as is pretty much any chassis these days).


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## 22tall (Jul 28, 2002)

C_an you qualify that???_ 

There have been multiple posts mentioning bent axles, out of round wheels and tires and gear problems. I am not saying that all of them are bad. I am saying they are a crapshoot. AW cannot be counted on to turn out a consistant product.


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

*Spent an afternoon at the track with a Super III... Montoya are you listening?*

Okay, I finally had an off day and decided to setup a Super III to see what it would do on a big track where I typically run stock-ish SG+, SRT, LL, and Tycos. Tuned in the brushes using the voltmeter/ammeter setup I use for P3s and Storms, stabilized the brush screws with a toothpick tip sized drop of VibraTite, glued in the guide pin, adjusted the shoes to lay flat, and because I needed to fit through a tech block and didn't want to cut any axles I mounted a stock LL rear end on the car with AJs silicone slip-ons. The overall rear wheel+tire height came out to 0.463. After a few laps I found the front tires wanted to come of the rims so I glued them on. 

The first thing I noticed was the downforce was too high with the LL setup. But then I recalled the "adjustable traction magnets" errr,,, feature of the SIII so I pushed theme further up in the chassis until I felt the downforce was just about right.

At this point I realized, "Montoya (Deane) is really on to something with his adjustable traction magnet idea!" If I had finely adjustable traction magnets I have no doubt that I could have really dialed this car in to work optimally with the rear end setup that I was using. In fact, being able to adjust the traction magnets would have allowed me to run even lower in the rear, lowering the center of mass of this top heavy car even more. When I first heard of Montoya's idea I realized the benefit of being able to tune in the car for a given rear end setup. But in fact it would also give you more tuning parameters on the overall ride height, more than what you can achieve with tire height alone. I see the light.

Back on the track I kept flogging the Super III to get it to the point where I felt it was broken in. The more I drove it the smoother it got and the better my lap times got. It is a top heavy car (even with the Mustang body) and it does exhibit the "Neo Wall Slap" behavior that all neo car exhibit. With a wide ceramic magnet setup you can stray off line a bit and still recover. With neos, when you get off the prime spot on the rail, thwack! A top heavy car accentuates the effect. I periodically put out an GT40 SRT and SG+ Indy and Tyco Indy cars just to keep my impressions calibrated between the different types of cars. I ran the Super III for probably 2 hours total, watching the heat and oil, neither of which was an issue.

Overall, I was very impressed with the Super III. It ran smooth and quiet and with the right amount of traction magnet for the track dialed in, drove quite well. I could definitely tell that the stock solid axle front end setup with its soft front tires was holding the car back. No doubt it would turn much better with an independent front end and/or harder front tires. This Super III would more than hold its own with the other brands of hardbody stock cars that we race on the same track. The one thing that impressed me was how I could drive the car for extended periods and the speed never dropped off and it constantly ran cool. The track has a ton of downforce and you can hear the growl of the cars with heavy magnets, like Life-Likes. The highest temperature that I ever measured on the arm after extended runs was 106 F. That's very cool and a testament to the benefits of strong motor magnets.

So yes, I think it is worth getting the spare parts channel up and running for the Super III (I heard that Super III Pit Kits are coming soon). The car responded to the same tweaks that work for similar designs. Being able to push the traction magnets up into the chassis to allow you to run the chassis lower is an unintended but beneficial consequence of the current design. Without a true adjustable traction magnet capability I will have to pick a position that allows me to tune around tire height because the magnets are obviously not secured well enough to withstand the stress of racing and will have to be glued in. 

What it comes down to is the Super III is just another option for people who want to try new new things on the slot car front. If there's something you don't like about it, no big deal, buy one of the many other similar toys out there also competing for your hobby dollars. After all, these are just toys and buying them is purely discretionary. There's no reason to feel personally offended or launch into a disparaging tirade against AutoWorld if you don't like something about this car. Slot cars are like candy bars, find the ones that you like and enjoy them. Don't waste your time or energy on the ones you don't like. Now that I've really tasted the Super III I have to say that I generally like it. It's not my favorite candy bar but I'll keep it in my box and give it a whirl every now and then, just like I do with the multiple other brands in my "fun runner" box.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

As usual a quality post. I do think that it is worth getting upset at the problems with the S3 though, on the basis that AW might improve things for the future if they know people are unhappy now. I would love to get my Super III running better, but the lack of a home track prevents that. Back when the MR1 got turned here from a dog to a race (and championship) winner I was at the cutting edge of that and it felt good, even though there was political fallout that rumbles on here to this day.

It is a pity that TL did not go for my fully adjustable idea, but it is pretty amazing I got a shot and my chassis made it as far as China. My own take is that AW struggle to stay on top of the Asia ops, they are certainly not alone in that, and my idea got lost in translation. It is clear from the timetable that the S3 had a long (maybe painful and expensive?) gestation period and that meant the time to sort out the adjustable magnets got squeezed. This is partly guesswork, but the comments from AW I received through the process seem to bear it out.

Meanwhile I have no idea why some people out there have trouble believing I was involved with the S3. Tom Lowe is easy to reach by anyone, was open to the idea and complimentary of it, but it did not come to pass because of the costs and the 'China Syndrome'. Why anyone would prefer to believe otherwise is beyond me, as is any idea of what I would gain by lying. As somebody said to me last month, looked at with an open mind, what happened with me and TL could have a long term benifit. If I can get into a dialogue with AW then anyone with a good idea can do so, and maybe the should.

In a similar vein Steve Russell and John Cukras at AFX are open to ideas, and it is cool to know I have affected the MG17 design in a tiny way, just as Sped has and, in a bigger way, Gary Fast. There must be loads of good ideas out there so rather than waste energy doubting if I got the chance to sell mine, racers should be honing and submitting theirs. At the moment I am trying to get changes made to the Micro Scalextric chassis, this has come about because I am lucky enough to be in their home country and I have worked damned hard to get on their radar. I doubt anything will come of it but I will keep trying.

I don't believe that my magnet idea would work in the 'high-end' magnet arena, which is fine by me. Those guys seem to like having loads of axles and would worry to much about being on the right compound or having poor COG. But for a club/home racer in certain enviroments I am convined it would find favour. I just need to win the Lotto I guess!!!


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## tjettim (Nov 29, 2005)

I think I know what you mean.A magnet directly under the rear
axle could work. A magnet would have to be removable for quick
axle changes or the axle assembly would have to be torn down
to replace like in a Tjet etc.The whole Hornbey chassis is large
and heavy and the braid setup is easily disturbed in a crash.
The F1 cars look way too tall,maybe after seeing a Mega G they
could be convinced a high performance F1 car is sellable. With
Nascar's car of tomorrow, my interest in HO Nascar has dropped
immensly.My open wheel HO interest has went up 100% though.
I hope I am not alone and the HO industry does well with them.
I also hope AW does well,competition is good for us.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

I started a dialogue with Scalex well before the Mega-G specs came out about a chassis using a small can motor to make a much lower and narrower chassis, and a wheelbase of 1.9''. Of course we realised eventually that such a long wheelbase would give all sorts of problems even though the cars would look sublime.

The chassis would also have the adjustable magnets and some other ideas that I think would be a good step. The problem with Scalex is convincing them that a new chassis is worth doing, as the range sells above their expectations anyway. If they did start from scratch there is a good chance some new thinking could be incorporated, but at the moment the chassis they have sells well despite it's faults (which they know about) and the fact some of their sets are rinky-dinky.


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## medic57 (Mar 3, 2008)

Most sets are rinky dinky, the Tomy International being the exception to the rule. Most slotters buy sets just to get the cars in them and then resell the track on ePAY efectively getting the cars for free. I welcome the Indy/F1 syle of cars to racing. I have been trying for 5 years to get some of our local guys to have a class using these bodies, but, no luck. Although we did just have a G-Jet race yesterday with Indy Hard Bodies. It was a blast. Nothing like watching the greatest of all races while racing slot cars.


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Very interesting! I've seen as many cases where nice sets like the Super International, 4 Way Split, and Long Beach sets, all of which are outstanding in my opinion, are bought primarily for the track and the cars sloughed off as E-Bay fodder. Once I settled on a track design I used set purchases as much as possible to build up track inventory because it's the least expensive way to acquire new track. I think most folks recognize that race sets are a starting point in the hobby and while they are usually short on the amount of track in the box they do give you all of the necessary components to get a course up and running, even if it's a tiny one. The Aurora and Tyco sets in the 60s and 70s were no different. I guess it's up to you to decide what constitutes a "starter set" versus a "rinky dinky set." From what I've seen the track layout pictures that are shown on the outside of the box usually give you a very good idea of what is really inside the box, even when the artwork and name embellishes the drama way beyond the reality. Heck, any set that says "Daytona" on the box and doesn't include four 48" radius high banked curves inside the box is going to be a disappointment if you buy the set based on the name.


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## tjettim (Nov 29, 2005)

I used to buy the 4 lane sets for the cars and sell the rest cheap.
Indy hard body racing is a long time favorite of mine.Both the 500
and the 600 were great races Sunday,but only the 500 had cool 
looking cars.


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## A/FX Nut (May 28, 2004)

22tall said:


> I would like AW more if they just sold bodies.


Where would you get chassis from then? Original T-Jets are going for $10 to $13 and original Tuff-Ones (If you can find them) are going for $25 or more. 

I wouldn't mind seeing AW bodies on pullback chassis in addition to the AW slot cars. Randy.


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

A/FX Nut said:


> Where would you get chassis from then? Original T-Jets are going for $10 to $13 and original Tuff-Ones (If you can find them) are going for $25 or more.
> 
> I wouldn't mind seeing AW bodies on pullback chassis in addition to the AW slot cars. Randy.


Right now you get the best of both, dealers are routinely breaking up cars and selling in pieces. Bud's H.O. does it all the time


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## 22tall (Jul 28, 2002)

A/FX Nut said:


> Where would you get chassis from then?


Easy enough question. If I wanted a chassis that doesn't fit the body I would go into my guest room and find the case of NOS Aurora tjet chassis I got a few years ago. If I want a chassis that fits the bod I go to the runners drawer where I would find a couple hundred JL/AW chassis. I buy too much stuff.

If AW sells bodies they can keep the pull back chassis. Tossed a couple hundred of those.


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## jeremy1082 (Apr 27, 2004)

Bud's H.O. has a nice selection....and he ships to Canada! Bud did not pay me to say that so this is not a commercial. (Did I say that right, Bud?).


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## jeremy1082 (Apr 27, 2004)

Also check out Gene's HO Slot Car Junkyard....nice deals & great selection.
I really should consider a career in this (if I could only find matching white belt and shoes).


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## A/FX Nut (May 28, 2004)

I'm familiar with Bud's HO Cars. He's great to do business with. I wore one of his T-shirts at Michigan International Speedway in 2006 hoping to run into a fellow slot car fan and strike up a conversation. No luck.

But I don't have the deep pockets that everyone else seems to have. If AW just made bodies, then I wouldn't have bought too many of them. I wait for the shows and go then. I have to get the most for my dollar. I was dissappointed when Bud quit going to the Midwest show. He's one of my favorite vendors.

I think it's great that AW is making new and copying old chassis' at a good price. They could make them out of Nylatron, but we would be paying more for them. Randy.


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## TJETDRAGRACER (Jan 25, 2008)

*Super III Price went down fast*

When they came out they where $25. to $30. I seen them for $15.50 on 
ebay today May 31, 08 What a drop. in price in 3 week's.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Are there still no S3 spares on sale?


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## A/FX Nut (May 28, 2004)

Montoya1 said:


> Are there still no S3 spares on sale?




I know it's over a month away, but I'll bring this up at the AutoFest. But by the time the AutoFest gets here we should know something before then. Randy.


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

The lack of product support is unacceptable. I like the super III, at times it seemed I was the only one who did. At this point they can shove them. I wont buy anymore till there is a full line of aftermarket parts for them. I hope they keep dropping in price too, just goes to show you that no mattter how good a product is ( after adjustment  ) people wont be bothered if there is no support.


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

> people wont be bothered if there is no support


I totally agree. The diecast/collectible model doesn't work well for selling slot cars that are meant to be heavily used. It's great to have the insane variety of bodies that JL/AutoWorld has given us but for the most part the focus has been on satisfying the needs of collectors. The Super III should be, according to its billing, a racer and race cars need spare parts. There's nothing sexy about pickups, brushes, springs, arms, bushings, etc., but having them is a vital piece to the equation and a showstopper if overlooked. Pit Kits are a compromise solution because they typically contain a bunch of stuff you don't need or want, but lacking anything better they can suffice. Ideally, a car becomes so popular that you have third party aftermarket parts availability.

At the very least, spare pickup shoes, brushes, brush springs, and brush set screws are an absolute necessity. Until these parts are available the Super III stays in the garage.


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## TK Solver (Mar 18, 2004)

If the SIII bodies/chassis were more interchangeable with other bodies/chassis, then would more vendors be parting out the cars? I was curious to see if an industrious entrepreneur would buy up a bunch of the SIII stock cars, custom paint the bodies to match actual NASCAR paint schemes and part out the chassis. If the bodies fit nicely on other chassis, this could work. Either way, I'm sure not skillful enough to tackle it.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Support?*



AfxToo said:


> ........ There's nothing sexy about pickups, brushes, springs, arms, bushings, etc., but having them is a vital piece to the equation and a showstopper if overlooked......


Has there ever been any real commitment to spare parts/support on AW's part for earlier releases?...I mean other than the hapless pitkits. So how could/would one expect AW to veer radically off course for the Super lll ? 

Thankfully the barf colored, and weirdo cars were created so that spare chassis could be dismembered for consumables. Want support? AW sez kill an another car.


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## win43 (Aug 28, 2006)

Here we go again....:freak:. At $25 ...no $20....wait.....$15.....still falling .....$10 a car ...it's like the Energizer Bunny.....keeps going and going (down).......there just might be a supply of stock parts available. But after all is said and done.....you have bought 2 less than Super IIIs to try to keep one running. :drunk: It's good to see that some of the faithful have started to see the light. AND now for something completely different......

:wave: THE 4 GEAR..... :woohoo: :jest: :woohoo:


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

LOL the pit kit idea fell through the floor once AW decided to let distributors provide market killing discounts to the public. Hard to justify the price of a kit when for a couple bucks more you could get a whole car.

The other problem is that since JL R1, I'd bet AW has lost (a lot) better than half of it's support from real hobby shops...the kind of places that could really support the product after the sale. How many AW "vendors" are providing tips on this board? 












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