# novak or lrp BL?



## gtimax (Sep 1, 2005)

GTB or Sphere better? 
is BL system esc getting old(less punch)easliy? (cause by hot working temp.)


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

The GTB has significantly better specs then the Sphere... One could assume from that tha the GTB is better... But then the Sphere is or has been actualy sold to the public, after a very long wait, the Novak has yet to show up at retailers... There is an old saying that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush... A Sphere in your car, is better then a GTB on a web page...


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## walterhenderson (May 8, 2002)

The specs are rated different. I ran my Reedy/Lrp system again this past weekend and is as fast or faster than a 9 turn. I also ran it on carpet, it was only a tenth of a 7 turn.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

The Sphere is offically rated at 0.035V/phase @ 20A (200A/phase max), which calculates out to 0.00175 ohms/phase. Compare this to the old Novak Super Sport at 0.0019 (160A max.) and the new GTB at 0.0004 ohms/phase.

I'm not sure if the LRP specs are a bit conservative or not, but the numbers say it's only slightly better than the original Novak SS. In actual practice, it took quite a bit of throttle hammering to get the Sphere to do a thermal shutdown (it happened to both Walt and me), while it was fairly easy to shut down the Novak SS with a hotter-than-the-5800 motor. When we checked Walt's ESC, it was above 240°, so maybe LRP just set their temp limit higher. Mine hasn't shut down since I put the fan on it.

To further complicate matters, Novak's website now says they're shipping the GTB. Just in time for the indoor season when HARDLY ANYBODY RUNS MOD!   
Oh well, maybe the prospect of zero motor maintenance will change that...


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## onefastdude (Nov 6, 2002)

Walt, which system are you running and what wind brush motor is it comparable to? I assume that you are running it in sedan and not oval.


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## walterhenderson (May 8, 2002)

I ran the Reedy Neo One motor with the LRP Sphere in my tc-4 on a large outdoor track the most. I would comare the bottom end to @ a 9 turn, but the straitaway pull was more like a 7 or 8 turn.


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## onefastdude (Nov 6, 2002)

Thanks


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## rickk5 (Jan 20, 2003)

i was wondering can you run a novak 4300 motor with the sphere controller are the compatible????


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

The Sphere should run any Novak motor.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

*Dyno test data*

Here's the brushless dyno data you've all been waiting for (and possibly fearing). Attached is a Word document with my dyno testing of the LRP and Novak brushless ESCs and motors. What it shows is basically what the spec sheets predict, i.e. the Novak SS is the worst (relatively speaking), the GTB is the best, and the Sphere is somewhere in between. The difference between the Novak Velociti 5.5 and the Reedy Neo One motors appears to be insignificant, though the Reedy motor might be a bit better at lower amp rates (the Novak 5.5 couldn't get down to 20 amps). The other obvious conclusion I can reach from this is: *My dyno slave motor DEFINITELY needs a rebuild now!*


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## pmsimkins (Nov 4, 2004)

Great data. Thanks.

I race 4 cell 4300 oval. What the data says to me is the difference between the GTB and LRP is negligible for my purposes. Definately a good thing since I bought the LRP. It also seems to back up my impression that there is not a huge difference between either and the SS for 4 cell 4300.

I raced the LRP last weekend for the first time and I'd say there was little difference between it and the SS.


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## Roadsplat (Oct 28, 2002)

Thanks for the info Kevin. Not really much difference between them. Damn...now I can't use that for an excuse.

RC


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

The numbers are interesting Kevin... Clearly the biggest differances are at 4 cell voltages... ( as could be expected )... That's all I want to talk about for now... 

Can you explain the following.... The Novak GTB is clearly more powerfull all across the AMP range when compared to the Sphere with the 4300, 5800, and even with the NeoOne motor... However when you get to the Novak 5.5 motor, your numbers actualy show the Sphere having better numbers with that motor then the GTB shows with taht same motor. What's up with that?


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

DynoMoHum said:


> The numbers are interesting Kevin... Clearly the biggest differances are at 4 cell voltages...


Not really. The biggest differences actually show up at higher Amp draw (up to 12 watts).



DynoMoHum said:


> Can you explain the following.... The Novak GTB is clearly more powerfull all across the AMP range when compared to the Sphere with the 4300, 5800, and even with the NeoOne motor... However when you get to the Novak 5.5 motor, your numbers actualy show the Sphere having better numbers with that motor then the GTB shows with taht same motor. What's up with that?


I never promised to _explain_ the results. :jest: Actually, a difference of only 1-2 watts could just be normal variation of the dyno.

I also just noticed that I "fat-fingered" the numbers for the LRP/Neo One at 6.9 volts. (Actually, Mark C. noticed it at the track saturday.) Made the Reedy motor look way better when used with the Sphere. I'll fix that shortly.


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## Katana Man (Aug 23, 2005)

One other point to consider concerning the GTB vs. Sphere. It seems much easier and cleaner to use the Sphere with a brushed motor. 
I made a customized 3 pin Deans connector to allow me to easily switch between brushless and brushed while still maintaining the ability to use my other equipment and my friends equipment:

Here is my Sphere with a brushless setup.









Here is my Sphere with a brushed setup.









Here is the brushed connector I made. Notice blue and yellow leads are shorted. 









The above is pretty simple. Now look at the GTB with a brushed setup . The GTB takes more wires to work with brushed.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Now if we could convince Deans to make a 3-pin connector....


I also just noticed that the Reedy Neo One motor consistantly has more torque and less RPMs than the Novak 5.5, which makes me think the Reedy is really a 6.5 turn, not a 5.5 as reported in at least one magazine. (I've never seen Reedy make a statement anywhere about the number of turns.)


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

I guess I didn't look at the 6.9volt numbers that closely.... There is a bigger differance then I first thought there was... 

My original comments were based largely on the differance between the SS and the GTB ... With the 5800 motor, there is a 10% gain between the SS and the GTB at 4.6 volts - 40 amps. If I'm not mistaken, that's a bigger percentage gain then you see at 6.9 volts between these two controlers with that motor. (I see a maximum differance at 6.9 volts of about 7%).

Ah, but you'll never see much differance on the track... or so I'm told.


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## AJS (Mar 21, 2002)

Very interesting information KevinM, thanks, now the question is what the average amp draw be for 4300 4-cell on Oval, because it appear that the higher the amp draw the bigger the difference. 

I know that there is a formula, but I don't have it.

Thanks.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

Last year in 4 cell carpet oval on a flat snowbirds size track, we averaged at least 30 amps, maybe a little higher. Very simmilar to what we were averaging with brushed 19 turn motors.


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## rcavenger (Aug 28, 2002)

AJS....(runtime of given pack at 'X' amp rate - Runtime left in given pack at 'X' amp rate)/number of seconds in race. Take that ratio, and multiply it times the 'X' amp rate used on the pack...I.E. (400 second pack @ 30 amps - 50 seconds left after race @ 30 amps)/ 300 seconds (5 min race) = 1.167 ratio. Then take that ratio times 30 amps = 35 amps average draw...scary stuff at times


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

I think a better way to estimate real-world amps would be to calculate your average motor RPMs (based on track length, rollout, and lap times), then find where this falls in the the dyno data curves. I don't think battery capacity is reliable enough use. I just tried testing a couple stock motors on the dyno, and it couldn't make them draw 35 amps at 4.6 volts.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

I think the reason you can't draw more then 35 amps at 4.6 volts on your dyno, is a limitation of your dyno and/or slave motor... not the test motor.


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

I just checked back on my old logger data from 12th scale stock and it shows that our motors regularly draw 50 amps coming off the corners (as high as 60). On the track these spikes Jump up and taper off over about a half second or so. Kinda looks like a saw tooth.

BTW: the average current measured during the run in 12th is within 2 amps or so of the calculation using capacity. This assumes that you dump the pack immediately after the run so that the pack is still hot.

The current average that we were running in 12th was 25 to 28 amps with good 3300's

Only an acceleration (flywheel) dyno can measure these spikes reasonably.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Wow! 50 amps with a stock motor. I'm afraid to ask what a mod motor really draws, but I'll do it anyway. Do any testing with mods?


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## RC300 (Apr 3, 2002)

Always wondered about actual amp draw at various points during a race. If after a race I guesstimate an average of 30 amp draw by seeing how much battery I have left, does the motor say pull 50 amps off the corner and drop to say 10 amps down the straights or does the motor pull 35 amps off the corner and drop to 25 in the straights. Track length doesn't seem to matter, the average amp draw is still 30 amps.Gearing up is the only thing that changes ave. draw, but just curious about the actual amp draw. Didn't Victor make something that would record this stuff and let you graph it or something?


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## t4racer (Oct 18, 2005)

The reedy neo one is a 7.5 not a 5.5 so it will have lower rpm (less top speed) but more grunt torque and trust me the neo one has plenty of grunt torque. You can pack on gear all day just watch the temps. im running 18/87 or 19/87 and after an 8 minute run it comes off with the motor at 170 but what I really worry about is the batteries are at 190. I know that is a little hot but what do batteries usually thermal at.


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

Basically, in 4 cell mod 12th you're not going to spike the motor up much above 60-70 amps without dumping. Even with the new cells.

Oval is a completely different animal, You can dump in 4 minutes with 3300's easily (mod). Figure 420 seconds at 30 amps for the pack and you can do the math for average draw in 4 cell oval.

From a dead stop (race start) you can see a spike up to 120 amps pretty easily depending on the motor and gearing.


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

RC300 said:


> Always wondered about actual amp draw at various points during a race. If after a race I guesstimate an average of 30 amp draw by seeing how much battery I have left, does the motor say pull 50 amps off the corner and drop to say 10 amps down the straights or does the motor pull 35 amps off the corner and drop to 25 in the straights. Track length doesn't seem to matter, the average amp draw is still 30 amps.Gearing up is the only thing that changes ave. draw, but just curious about the actual amp draw. Didn't Victor make something that would record this stuff and let you graph it or something?


Hank sells the Eagletree system on the Hobby Shopper site. They even have a GPS option now.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

t4racer said:


> The reedy neo one is a 7.5 not a 5.5 so it will have lower rpm (less top speed) but more grunt torque and trust me the neo one has plenty of grunt torque. ...


Where'd you hear that the Reedy is a 7.5 turn? I don't find anything on their website or in their ads that state it.

Here's what I've measured with my "winding resistance tester" (in milliohms):

Novak 4300 (10.5 turn) = 16.8
Novak 5800 (8.5 turn) = 11.2
Reedy Neo One (?? turn) = 7.0
Novak Velociti 5.5 = 4.8

The Reedy is closer to the Novak 5.5 than the 8.5, which is why I'm guessing it's a 6.5 turn. Anybody with Reedy connections out there that can find out for sure?


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

You might want to look at the LRP 'inernational' forum... I'm not sure if they ever dicussed the details of that motor or not...

What I find somewhat interesting... At one point, I read somewhere that the Sphere had a brushless motor limit of 6.5 turns... but then I looked at towerhobbies site the other day and they list 5.5 turns as the brushless motor limit... and well clearly Kevin has used the Sphere and a 5.5 turn motor.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

In 4 cell oval racing... I bet the amp draw of stock ranges from about 34 amps in the corner and 26 amps at the end of the straight... at least for the really fast guys. They sure don't slow down very much in the corners, and you can barely see them accelerate at all commming out of the corners. It's probably a optical illusion, but it looks as if the fastest guys actualy pickup speed going into the corners. 

Most likely the only time they hit 50 amps is at the start, after, or during a crash.

Pretty much the same for 19 turn 4 cell carpet oval... although they do seem to accelerate a bit off the corners, and they average very close to 35 amps.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Actually, the instruction sheet for the Sphere states the brushless motor limit as "> 5.5 turns". I've never actually raced it with the Novak 5.5, just with the Reedy motor (whatever IT is).


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

Kevin, have you got any good brushed motor dyno data at those same voltages and/or amp loads? Perticularly for somehting like a 19 turn, and maybe a good 10 turn, etc... It'd be interesting to have some comparison between the brushless and the brushed...


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## MKingsley (Jul 14, 2004)

Reedy throws more motors at us. I see they have a 11 turn & 13 turn brushless motors coming out. I don't remember what the novak 4300 & 5800 are turn wise but I bet they are not the same.....Seems like Reedy is very late in the game or they just have fun listening to everybody complain LOL. I'm sure these motors will start some interesting posts.....


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Mike - The Novak 5800 is a 8.5 turn and the 4300 is a 10.5 turn. Brushless motors are usually a "something and a half" turn because all the windings are connected together at the shaft end, so the new Reedys should be that way too. Maybe they just mean they run like an 11 or 13? Where'd you hear about them?


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## MKingsley (Jul 14, 2004)

Kevin - Tower Hobbies has them on their new products listing. There is no information other than the name.


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

I see nothing to complain about. With brushed motors you have winds from 6 turn to 27 turn each with either single, double, triple, quad or quint winds. There are far more choices in brushed motors then there is with BL.


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

It's all fun and games until Novak comes out with a 5.5 double...

If Reedy wants to put out 4300 and 5800 style motors, they need to make them have the same performance if they expect people to accept them. The fact that all the motors are reasonably the same is what makes brushless perfect for oval racing.


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## Ginsu (Dec 1, 2004)

*Thoughts*

I have been reading your posts with great enthusiasm. Some of you appear to be very knowledgeable. In Florida we are setting rules for the 06 oval season and want to run a brushless class. My question is this. Would it be fair to run a Novak 5800 motor against the first Sphere motor? Will running the GTB speed control w/ a 5800 motor produce any advantages of running it with the SS speedo? I am drafting the rules and want to make it as fair as possible. ANY input would be appreciated. :thumbsup:


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## mbeach2k (Sep 14, 2004)

the best advise i can give you is set the rules for a good all around motor, the 4300
and then you won't have to worry about speed controls and other rules for brushless.
by far hear in michigan brushless has taken over in vertually every class in the past year, but the most popular class has been 4300, its faster than stock, easier on the batteries and lower tire wear than the 5800.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Fred B said:


> It's all fun and games until Novak comes out with a 5.5 double...


Actually, it's already a triple. (I think. It's hard to see how many wires are in there.)


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Ginsu said:


> ... My question is this. Would it be fair to run a Novak 5800 motor against the first Sphere motor? Will running the GTB speed control w/ a 5800 motor produce any advantages of running it with the SS speedo? I am drafting the rules and want to make it as fair as possible. ANY input would be appreciated. :thumbsup:


The Reedy Neo One is MUCH more powerful than the 5800. I agree with mbeach, choose one motor for a class. Or choose a number of turns, so if Reedy builds clones of the Novak 4300 or 5800 motors you can run them, too. Assuming that someday Reedy actually TELLS US how many turns their motors are! :jest:


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## Ginsu (Dec 1, 2004)

mbeach2k said:


> the best advise i can give you is set the rules for a good all around motor, the 4300
> and then you won't have to worry about speed controls and other rules for brushless.
> by far hear in michigan brushless has taken over in vertually every class in the past year, but the most popular class has been 4300, its faster than stock, easier on the batteries and lower tire wear than the 5800.


Sounds like a plan! Thanks.......


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

Ginsu said:


> I have been reading your posts with great enthusiasm. Some of you appear to be very knowledgeable. In Florida we are setting rules for the 06 oval season and want to run a brushless class. My question is this. Would it be fair to run a Novak 5800 motor against the first Sphere motor? Will running the GTB speed control w/ a 5800 motor produce any advantages of running it with the SS speedo? I am drafting the rules and want to make it as fair as possible. ANY input would be appreciated. :thumbsup:


From what I hear the GTB is faster than the SS with a 5800 motorin oval. I think the GTB has a higher thermal cutoff and way better resistance. This means they can gear up without thermalling the speedo.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

Hmm... there are a half dozen or so guys over on the oval thread that insist that there is no differance in speed between the SS and the GTB (or the Sphere)

Then there are at least a couple that claim otherwise... 

I have no track experiance with these matters, but based on Kevin's dyno data, my own knowlege of electronics and RC... I can't understand how it could be that there would be no differance... There is clearly a differance in power between the SS and the GTB, it must show up on the track.


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

I figured that some might be interested in the spreadsheet that I made last year to compare motors with different RPM bands. The spreadsheet allows you to change gear ratio's to match up the powerband of two motors for comparison.

The first two sheets are the raw data and the third is a comparison of power vs. car speed. M1 is the Novak 5.5 with the ratio that I used when I ran it. M2 is the Reedy motor (with GTB). 

The data shows that the two motors are totally different. The Reedy either has a higher wind or totally different timing. With enough gear, you can make the Reedy look a lot better but you would have to see how it looked on the track. It may or may not be able to pull more gear.

All the data is from Kevin's dyno runs posted earlier.


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## rickk5 (Jan 20, 2003)

dyno, the only thing i can tell you is that this past weekend at fastlane raceway in kansas city we had all three speedos in attendance the ss+, sphere and the gtb and there is no visible advantage at all. we all three ran the same lap times at one point or another, qualified within a couple thousands of each other the top 4 qualifiers as follows tq-lrp 2nd-gtb 3rd-lrp 4th-ss+

i understand that dyno data tells you one thing,but from what we can tell it is all about chassis set up and gearing(rollout) we were all suprised at the results!!!!

so in conclusion no matter which speedo you choose you will be fine,just worry about setup and gearing!!!!!:thumbsup: 

brushless racing is awesome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! rick k.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

That may all be true Rick, however I've heard from guys in Michigan that are stating otherwise. One I belive said they were seing between .03 and .08 seconds per lap. The other I think said about 1 or 1.5 laps per 4 minute race. The one that said the later, is the father of one of the most consistant racers I know, and I belive that he would have never said such a thing if it weren't true.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

Fred - I'm fairly sure that the Reedy Neo One is a 6.5 turn, based on the dyno numbers and the winding resistance. This would also explain why it has more torque and less RPMs.

As far as whether the GTB is faster, the only way to really find out is to run a race with the SS, then swap it out with the GTB (making no other changes to the car) and run again. Actually, it should be done in a practice session with no other cars out there.

I agree with Rickk5 (about 90% anyway) in that it seems to be _mostly _about chassis setup in oval racing. (I'm assuming that's what he's talking about.) However, better equipment in the same car should go faster.

I discovered this weekend that you CAN get thermal shutdown with the GTB running the 5.5 motor _IF _the fan stops running (6-cell Touring car on carpet). One of the other drivers had several shutdowns with his Sphere until I sold him a fan. (Why didn't I wait to do that until AFTER the mains???? :jest: )

On a side note, I just looked at the Fastlane Raceway web site. Looks like a great facility. _Almost_ makes me want to move there.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

According to Tower's web site, Reedy has apparently renamed the "Neo One" motor to the "Neo One 3-Star", and has 2 new motors designated 2-Star and 1-Star, which they equate to an 11-turn and a 13-turn. Based on this _HUGE_ amount of information, I'm guessing these are 7.5 and 8.5 turn motors. The Novak 5800 is an 8.5, and it runs basically like a 13-14 turn. If true, does this mean Reedy's 4300 clone will be called the "minus one star"? :freak:


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## rickk5 (Jan 20, 2003)

dyno, i am not questioning what you are saying in fact i agree with it for the most part, what i meant was from the experience we had this past weekend,being the first time that not everyone was running just the ss+ that there was minimal difference between the three speedos; i first went out with my ss+ and ran a 79/5.01.37 then changed over to the lrp sphere with the exact same car and ran a 79/501.35 so that amount is insignificant over a five minute race and honestly the car felt no faster whatsoever, if nothing else it told me that i must have driven a better line than the time before!!! i am not trying to stir it up, just giving you my experience with the three different speedos, i think they are all good and equally matched:thumbsup: 

rick kanschat


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

I think that the difference between the SS and the GTB/Sphere with a 5800/4300 motor will be the fact that you can gear up without thermalling the speedo. The power curve with these motors is so linear that hanging more gear will make the car faster as long as the batteries and speedo can handle it.


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

Not even sure on that. Reading on the oval forum that the the different ESCs seemed to be the same speed but the only one thermalling was the GTB. We'll just have to wait a bit and let people use them for a while before we see any real trends.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

If the GTB is thermaling with 4300 or 5800 motors, Novak has either got a major problem with it's design, the motors are the problem, or the users are way overgearing. I know the SSs thermaled with both of those motors when geared realitively high, and there appeared to be some who had more of these types of problems then others did, which somewhat suggested there were a small percentage that did have some sort of real flaw... However, given the specs of the GTB, etc... there's very little reason that the controler itself should be shutting down due to heat when running these milder motors. 

[edit] addition... I guess it's also possible that some small number of GTBs have some defect, etc... [edit]

I guess only time will tell for sure, but I still maintain that the GTB should be noticeably faster (not like break the tires loose faster, but better times faster), then the SS controler was. Ther is just no way you shouldn't be able to make use of 5% or more power at 30 amps and above.


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## rickk5 (Jan 20, 2003)

Dyno, I Agree 100% With Your Analysis, But So Far We Just Havent Seen It???? We Will Keep Messing With Them Until We Do!!

Rick K.


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## Bob Wright (Sep 25, 2001)

My GTB thermaled running oval this weekend.I was running pink and purple tires when I changed to whites/grays with the same roll out I had no thermaling problem.My guess is my car was way too stuck with the pink/purples in combination with a tight condition.If i could get my car to go aroiund I would like to do a comparison between the SS and GTB.As Dyno has been saying I believe that the GTB and Sphere may be a "small" advantage over the older Novak pieces.


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## RC300 (Apr 3, 2002)

I am starting to hope there is at least a tiny advantage about every 25th lap or so just so Dyno can relax and say I told ya so. I know from years of dynoing motors there is nothing more frustrating than thinking the motor that looks killer on the dyno doesn't make you any faster on the track. Hang in there Dyno.....


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

One thing to remember about these systems, you can get thermal shutdown due to EITHER the motor temp. or the ESC. Both have temperature sensors in them. I'd guess the shutdowns with the 4300 motor are all due to motor temp (unless the ESC has a defect).


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## amainiac (Feb 16, 2003)

Would someone post the thermal temp shutdown setting. I realize we cant adjust the setting, but it would be nice to know at what point the speedo or the motor will shut down so we can monitor and see at the end of a race how close we are.


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## rcavenger (Aug 28, 2002)

the SS+ i have now thermals at about 220 deg. I was told it is supposed to thermal at about 200. My first SS thermalled at 150...not good.


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## DynoMoHum (Sep 25, 2001)

Suposedly there is a single wire that can be cliped to the motor, that will prevent motor thermal issues... (but then you might also melt some windings and go up in smoke, if the motor does get too hot). Presumably one could also put a resistor in-line with this wire, and make the controler think the motor was cooler then it actualy is... 

I never had any thermaling with my SS 4300 setup. I know a few people who did however. I'm not sure if I was not geared as high, or if my motor/controler somehow weren't as sensitive to temps, etc... 

If a person were having thermaling problems, it might be interesting to have them try someone else's motor, someone who never has such problems.

The only thermaling problems I've heard of with the GTB, have been over on the Oval section, from folks I really don't know. I belive most of them were second hand info, and/or happend to somone whot these folks were racing with, etc... 

I will say this... If the motor is causing the thermal problem, then it's very possible that you'd not get to see any advantage the controler might be giving in terms of extra power... that is if the motor is working as hard as it can with a SS, then the better effciency of the GTB is not going to help that motor stay any cooler.

Perhaps these motors need some liquid cooling, or something...


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

The standard wire pinout is called out in the ROAR rules so that will tell you what temp wire to cut (or just pull the pin out of the connector).


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## jake86 (Jan 3, 2003)

Here it is

Pin #1- Black wire-ground potential
Pin #2- Orange wire-phase C
Pin #3- White wire-phase B
Pin #4- Green wire-phase A
Pin #5- Blue wire-temp control, 10 k Thermistor referenced to ground potential
Pin #6- Red wire-+ 5.0 volts =/- 10%


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

You just need to remove the Blue wire (pin 5) and put a 10K resistor between pins 5 & 1.


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## rcavenger (Aug 28, 2002)

Hank,

So, we are looking at connecting the 10K resistor between the wire for pin #5 (blue wire) and pin #1 (black wire), and then pin #5 will no longer be in the pin casing? can you explain in a little more detail?


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

Pin #1 is ground and needs to stay connected to the harness. You would remove the #5 pin/wire and connect a 10K resistor to it. The other end of the resistor would attach to the #1 pin/wire.

This is going by what is in post #63. If it is a 10 k Thermistor this should work as the resistance of common Thermistors lowers as the temperature increases.


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## rcavenger (Aug 28, 2002)

so, that is a 10K thermistor, or is it a resistor?


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

A 10K thermistor is what is installed in the motor. You want to put in a 10K RESISTOR that will bypass the thermistor.


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## NastyButler (Dec 27, 2005)

You don't need any resistors. Just unlip the blue wire from the connector.

And the SS esc does not have a temp sensor in it. The only thermal shutdown is with the motor temp.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

NastyButler said:


> ...And the SS esc does not have a temp sensor in it. The only thermal shutdown is with the motor temp.


What do you base this statement on? Novak tells me both have limits.


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## ovalbackmarker (Mar 25, 2002)

I have been following this thread with great interest and to be honest, I am upset. Right now, running the Novak 4300 SS system, EVERYONE HAS EQUAL POWER!!! Why do oval racers always try to get that little power edge? People who have been B and C main racers are finally able to make it to the A. We run 1oo lap mains and it is not unusual to have everyone on the same lap at the end. Best racing in years. Im realize that some will complain that this is Spec racing. I call it good racing and the best thing in oval in years. Don't mess with a good thing, please.


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## hankster (Jan 1, 1998)

If we look at it, all RC racing is spec racing. Stock classes are limiited to 27 turn motors and 3800mAh cells. Mod racing is limited to 05 can motors and 3800mAh cells. Besides that there are limits on tires, bodies, type of chassis, 2/4wd, etc. Those are all "specs" aren't they?


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## ovalbackmarker (Mar 25, 2002)

You could say that all 27 turn stock motors are "spec". However, before brushless, I carried a Fantom dyno, laptop, com lathe, 10 motors, brushes, arms, springs, magnet zapper, etc. I also had to spend most of my time between rounds doing motor maintainence. The Novak 4300 system has taken this all out of the equation and given everyone equal power as it should be. Why mess with that?


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## Fred B (Sep 26, 2001)

Brushless does have less maintenance, and for now less equipment required but that doesn't mean that we should hold it back and keep it from evolving.

What if we decided that we should have kept the chassis from evolving from the early 90's till now? Let's see, the cars would be more simple with no adjustments for the battery tray, they would only have one center shock and damper discs. This early car evolved into what we have today. It's part of racing and it's not going to go away.

On the brushless front, Novak is releasing a totally redesigned motor that is lighter, has better solder tabs, better cooling, and 4.5 turns. Should be out any day now.


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