# Gtb Or Lrp?



## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

I would like to hear from racers of both the GTB and the LRP competition.

I heard that the LRP comp. has been burning up. But, it's lighter than the GTB.

Let me know what you think.


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## Bob Wright (Sep 25, 2001)

OvalTrucker said:


> I would like to hear from racers of both the GTB and the LRP competition.
> 
> I heard that the LRP comp. has been burning up. But, it's lighter than the GTB.
> 
> Let me know what you think.


For oval racing just remove the cap and the heat sink on the GTB and it is about the same weight as the LRP.


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## RPM (Dec 20, 2004)

Bob Wright said:


> For oval racing just remove the cap and the heat sink on the GTB and it is about the same weight as the LRP.


That's OK if your running the 4300 Brushless motor and NOT the 4.5 or 5.5. :thumbsup:


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## Bob Wright (Sep 25, 2001)

RPM said:


> That's OK if your running the 4300 Brushless motor and NOT the 4.5 or 5.5. :thumbsup:


I guess I should have qualified my answer. I believe if you are running any of the Velociti motors the heat sink may be necessary. I've run the 4.5 motor with no problems without the cap though.


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## Z-Main Loser (Nov 17, 2004)

Bob, are you removing the fan or the whole heat sink?


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## Bob Wright (Sep 25, 2001)

Z-Main Loser said:


> Bob, are you removing the fan or the whole heat sink?


I took off the whole heatsink and covered the fets up with some .020 lexan.


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## peelu (Jun 18, 2006)

I would stay away from the lrp brushless for now, I have heard nothing good about them from my local hobby store. The owner has used them and has sold them with not much more than a few runs before the unit is unusable. I myself have had a novak 5800 system and had a mosfet burn out unexpectedly. Mind you Novak has amazing customer service and will look after you if you do have problems. I am not sure How Lrp is, but I assume they are pretty good. I am however having really good luck with my Mamba max setup now that I have gotten my reciever bugs worked out of it.


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

Thanks for the feedback guys.
I would like to hear from the 4 guys that voted for the LRP COMP. Have you had the problems that peelu mentioned?

I have pulled the trigger on the LRP.... I now own one. Maybe I'll be a guinea pig, maybe not.


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## muddd (Sep 7, 2005)

the guy at LRP is not helpful i can vouch for that, called me ignorant, didnt like that at all, guys got a attitude,,,,,,just my 2 cents, sorry i should say the guy at associated!  

Charlie flanagan


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## SDL98 (Jan 8, 2005)

I run both the spere comp and the GTB and I have never had any problems with either one running a 4300 oval car. I thought I had a problem with the sphere last week while practicing it was shutting down but relized I had gone way past the 5 minute mark and batt voltage was really low. It wasn't like the batts just going dead it would just all of a sudden lock the rear wheels. But it worked fine in a 5 minute race


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## KenBajdek (Oct 7, 2001)

I would definitely recommend GTB because Novak customer service is second to nobody. Novak took the risk and spent the money to develop the sensor based brushless systems and has continually improved power and performance. Novak had some issues 4 years ago with the first few systems and they handled them quickly and took care of us REALLY WELL!!! After the bugs were worked out things have been great. LRP on the other hand doesn't have customer service. If you want excuses or an attitude than LRP is the place to go.


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## rickk5 (Jan 20, 2003)

Wow, Ive Been Running Lrp's Since The Mid 90's And Have Never Had Any Problems With Their Service???


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## ohiorcracer (Jan 27, 2002)

A buddy of mine just bought a lrp and ran it for a few laps and it shuts off and he is out of the lipo mode. He called LRP and they wouldnt even pay for him to ship it back and they have aknowledgment of whats gone on but they dont really even want to take the blame for it. I was gonna buy one but I am really looking at the GTB myself now.


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## racer97 (Apr 5, 2006)

Go with gtb. I got a lrp i sent it for repair now i just hope brushless is still around when they return it to me.lrp lasted less than a minute. for $224.00


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## jbrow1 (Aug 18, 2005)

After reading all the stuff I have about the lrp, I am very happy I went with the gtb. I'm very happy with it anyways as it's ran flawless all summer, but I still wondered if I'd have liked the lrp better.


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## jenzorace (Dec 23, 2005)

Ive ran a gtb all summer in my latemodel with the 5.5 and the 4.5. never a problem. The 4.5 is tooooo fast... Ive gotta have a 3.5 SICK FAST.


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## LARCGuy (Apr 18, 2004)

I bought the Comp/Sphere 4 Star combo and it has performed flawlessly all summer. I even ran it on a Velodrome in July when the air temp was 118 and the track temp was 156 and it never thermaled.


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## ROBO (Apr 13, 2005)

Hello
Ran my Sphere Comp. all night on Friday (5 runs) in 4 cell stock. Sat. first battery ran for 20 laps with my new 13.5 motor - temp 90 degrees. Geared up alittle ran 10 more laps motor power failed took car to my pits and smoke started rolling out of the speed control. Speed control still works with brushed motors. Also, motor feels like it has a bad bearing now. I'm not taking it apart its going back as is. 300.00 before first BRL race exciting----Smoke from speedo and bad motor............................................. .................................................. .................................................. .......................................PRICELESS!

I guess I need a spare $300.00 system at ready five. Roar stock motor I can get for $25.00. Sportsman 13.5 stock (same speed as a 27 turn) $77.00. The next person who says brushless is way cheaper and easier please read this post. Hope you guys have better luck.

Scott


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## yokman (Sep 19, 2004)

bumer.ran my original sphere last night agian without a single problem.probly put about 15 packs through it.i keep seing people have problems with the sphere comp but when they get it programed right....then the problems go away.we had 14 cars running 4300's last night and only 2 of them had problems.reset the speed control and no more problems.have fun with that stock racing as your comp is dying around here.


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## NitroStar (Dec 30, 2004)

I have 2 GTB 6.5 systems and 1 Original Sphere/3 Star system. The 3 Star slung a rotor and the Sphere's setup buttons quit working correctly after dust gets inside the ESC. I have had zero problems with my GTB systems. I also have a SS 5800 system that has had no problems. Associated's (LRP) tech support is cocky and blames everything on you. Never will give them the chance to blame anything on me again. I run the mess out of my 6.5's, wearing out batteries left and right :thumbsup: .


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

I ran my Sphere Comp yesterday with no trouble whatsoever. But, I am still waiting for what seems to be the inevitable. At which point I'm going GTB. The only GTB I've seen burn up was with a 4.5 geared to the moon. I run 4300 and 13.5. In my opinion there is no reason for an LRP ESC to burn up with such small motors. Above all, customer service in playing a big part for me to. I have not had to deal with Novak or Associated/LRP yet. 
It has been said that if you get more than a few runs on either system, you should have a good one.
I'm still crossing my fingers after several runs on my LRP.


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## Vanwall (Feb 22, 2004)

I ran a GTB off road last winter and all summer dirt oval.

No problems other than than the whimpy cooling fan which I replaced.

BTW I bought another GTB this fall and it came with the same whimpy cooling fan. I called Novak and they are shipping a replacement (black more rugged) fan (no charge).


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## Tim Reed (Nov 30, 2004)

Hey Scott, are you still running your Sphere? I recently got one from Greg D. and I was wondering if I should run it in my 13.5 or switch back to my GTB. I have been running the Sphere for about 2 weeks pretty heavily before Istumbled across this thread. Now I am pretty hesitant about putting it down on the track.


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

Hi Tim,
Yeah, I have been running my Sphere Comp since the first race at Bay City in September. I have not had any trouble with mine. My only back up is a SS controller. If you have been running it for any lengthy period of time I would not be too worried about it. At least you have a GTB to fall back on.


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## Tim Reed (Nov 30, 2004)

Thanks Scott... I feel better now... Haha. Coming to Bay City this weekend?? If not... Probably see you in MP next week.... LRP in car ready to break in that nice new carpet some more.


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

Not sure if I'll be at BC Saturday or not. Carolyn (wife) and I are planning on going to TC to celebrate our wedding anniversary. But, the weather may screw that up.


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## badmojo13 (Sep 27, 2002)

I say go with choice c the mamba max


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## hopper (Oct 12, 2006)

I have a novak 4300 system and an LRP sphere with a 0ne star. I am on my third novak! (Thank goodness they are still replacing them!) The only problem with the LRP is that it is INSANELY fast. I ran it in a breakout class a few weeks ago. I was geared the pinion 5 teeth less than the novak in the same vehicle. I had the throttle at 60 percent. I was running the high line on the track and still broke out 12 times in one race!


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

The Reedy One Star motor is an 8.5 turn, equivalent to the Novak 5800. If you're running that motor with the LRP, it's no wonder it's faster.


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## hopper (Oct 12, 2006)

I have had to return three bad novaks so far. Apparently they got a load of bad mosfets. I have had NO problems with the LRP. I am aware of the differences in the motors. Speed is just a bonus to go along with the dependability!


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## bobbymbx5 (Mar 16, 2005)

i got an lrp sphere brushless + brushed esc with a 3 star motor, run it one time, the next run it reset it sleff and it would not go in to the set up mode or the programming mode. i send it back to lrp and got it back in a week and half. after got it back have been runin it and not had any more trouble. BUT! i put it in my xxx4 and with in 3 or 4 laps it just locks up the brakes and quits like its thermaling the steering servo stell works, but its not hot cant even tell its been runin  i can put it back in my bk2 with the same batt. and it runs forever batt after batt?? can any one tell whats goin on?


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## RPM (Dec 20, 2004)

bobbymbx5 said:


> i got an lrp sphere brushless + brushed esc with a 3 star motor, run it one time, the next run it reset it sleff and it would not go in to the set up mode or the programming mode. i send it back to lrp and got it back in a week and half. after got it back have been runin it and not had any more trouble. BUT! i put it in my xxx4 and with in 3 or 4 laps it just locks up the brakes and quits like its thermaling the steering servo stell works, but its not hot cant even tell its been runin  i can put it back in my bk2 with the same batt. and it runs forever batt after batt?? can any one tell whats goin on?


Yes, you did buy a Novak! Made in the USA !! LOL


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## Miller Time (Sep 24, 2006)

I run my LRP Comp. in a Losi JRXS on a tight road course with a 90 ft back straight and a 4300 motor. The thing is awesome. No need for a fan, program freindly,lighter smaller footprint too i think. The only problem I've heard of is possibly with the Auto detect brush/brushless mode, I just set mine to full time brushless and don't worry about it. I have talked to a few oval racers running auto detect w/o any meltdowns.


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## Porksalot4L (Nov 4, 2002)

without me reading thorugh this thread did anyoen decide what is better for me to run? the lrp or the novak? 4 cell oval?


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## brian0525 (Jan 17, 2005)

gtb all the way


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## JDW (Oct 29, 2006)

Still running my LRP Sphere on my 4300 car and bought another one to take the place of my GTB on my 13.5 car.

Jake :thumbsup:


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## smokefan (Mar 22, 2004)

Gtb !!!!!


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## ohiorcracer (Jan 27, 2002)

GTB is awesome and customer service is awesome 2nd to none.


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## dangerousdave (Oct 26, 2004)

i was told by a guy that sells them he would pay $100.00 more for the LRP, well that was last year now he has the GTB in his cars and so do I. I had 2 LRP's and both have gone south, down for the count, POS. I am now using the GTB in both cars of mine and had no problems.

Dave D


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## Joey 3 (Apr 14, 2004)

Novak GTB


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## 17nut (Oct 1, 2006)

i run a sphere neo 1 3 star in my tc4 only had trouble once went into the mode selection then went back into setup never any promblems since BLUE IS BETTER!!!!!!
LRP


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

My LRP COMP finally burnt up a week ago.
I've replaced it with a GTB.
When/If I get my LRP back, it'll be a backup ESC at best. Probably just end up collecting dust though really.


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## Buff (Dec 9, 2002)

The new 2007 Edition of the LRP Sphere Competition is now out and has a lot better hardware and software which i believe cures any of those problems.....

I just can't wait till Tekin comes out with their new stuff, which should be to us team drivers within a couple weeks, and I'll post pics and how it performs. Tekin will also be making brushless motors called "Redline" brushless motors. 

I believe Tekin will be the ones sitting back watching all the "others" keep failing or over-heating....The new Tekins' won't need fans or external capacitors or anything. Just plug in and run.


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

Will the Tekin's run the Sensored line of motors that Novak produces? Novak's Brushless stuff has a very strong following here in the Midwest. Especially the motors. NOBODY runs any of the Reedy brushless motors in serious racing.
I think Tekin will have an uphill battle to win over the advances Novak has made in just a couple years.

Competition is good though, I hope they can bring something worthy to the fight!


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## NovakTwo (Feb 8, 2006)

OvalTrucker said:


> Will the Tekin's run the Sensorless line of motors that Novak produces? Novak's Brushless stuff has a very strong following here in the Midwest. Especially the motors. NOBODY runs any of the Reedy brushless motors in serious racing.
> I think Tekin will have an uphill battle to win over the advances Novak has made in just a couple years.
> 
> Competition is good though, I hope they can bring something worthy to the fight!


Novak's motors are all sensored. They are designed and manufactured (hand wound) in Irvine, CA. After-market replacement parts are also available--rotors, bearings, back end bells.

You can use sensorless controllers with sensored motors. However, if you are racing, you lose the low-speed driveability of the sensored circuitry and may have some degree of cogging.


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## NovakTwo (Feb 8, 2006)

Buff said:


> I believe Tekin will be the ones sitting back watching all the "others" keep failing or over-heating....The new Tekins' won't need fans or external capacitors or anything. Just plug in and run.


Ty at Teamtekin said:

"As for external caps, the R1 and R1Pro need them and the FX will need one for lower turn mod motors. Both R1 and FX will have them, but they aren't too big."

"By the way, the R1 weighs 2.0oz with wires. the R1-Pro weighs 2.3oz with the same wires. The GTB with the same wires weighs 2.5oz"

"The solder posts act as very efficient heatsinks by them selves. Since they are directly soldered to the copper board, they draw heat directly off of it. A small fan cooling the solder posts is even more efficient."

http://www.rctech.net/forum/showthread.php?t=133415&page=5&pp=40

The Novak GTB (with attached heat sink) weighs 1.36oz (38.5g) without wires. Ty will weigh the R1 Pro to get the unwired weight.


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## OvalTrucker (Dec 14, 2003)

NovakTwo said:


> Novak's motors are all sensored. They are designed and manufactured (hand wound) in Irvine, CA. After-market replacement parts are also available--rotors, bearings, back end bells.
> 
> You can use sensorless controllers with sensored motors. However, if you are racing, you lose the low-speed driveability of the sensored circuitry and may have some degree of cogging.


Oops. My mistake. I meant to say "will the Tekin BL ESC's run Novak's *sensored *motors".

At any rate, my main point was that the Novak motors have a strong foothold on the BL market as far as racing goes. I would like to see the Tekin ESC's be competitive though. But the cogging issue could be problematic since we are used to the smooth way the Novak's operate. The sintered rotor produces a little more cogging than the normal rotors even with the Novak ESC's. With a normal black or gray rotor you can coast a long time after you let off of the throttle.


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## rcdemon1 (Jun 2, 2003)

*Lrp*

I Run A Lrp 8070 The 07 Model And 4300 In 2 Cars And Have No Problems.just My 2 Cents


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## kgbracing (Feb 18, 2002)

Lets not forget that the sphere can be mounted conventionally because its smaller. You shouldnt have to stand it up to get it to fit.....I even have mine mounted on a KSG 6 cell tray which has a very small speedo tab.

My Sphere Comp (06 not 07) has been flawless (knock on wood) running both 4cell 4300 and lipo / 17.5


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## Craps (Mar 22, 2005)

*Novak + 8000 mah li-po + 2wd 1/10th scale stadium truck + 20 minute main = Domination*










*Novak! Either get one or get beat by one!*


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## Craps (Mar 22, 2005)

*Let me add all Novak GTBs are now coming with an optional li-po voltage cut off that can be turned on to cut off at 6.25 volts and all Velociti series motors are coming with sintered rotors and finned endbells from the factory!

Good luck all!!!

Novak Rocks!*


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## kgbracing (Feb 18, 2002)

Craps said:


> Let me add all Novak GTBs are now coming with an optional li-po voltage cut off that can be turned on to cut off at 6.25 volts and all Velociti series motors are coming with sintered rotors and finned endbells from the factory!
> 
> Good luck all!!!
> 
> Novak Rocks!


Erm, LRP has had lipo cut since last year. How many times are they going to update the GTB? first it was 4 cell, then spread spectrum, now lipo cut 
Why wont novak add a plug for the sensor wire on the motors...like every other company???



On a less political note, heres an update from the race at RC Mania (Phoenix) this past weekend (1/10th oval):

Joe Meyers had his SPhere Comp (2006) get to where it would shut off randomly. Ran it fine, then it just shuts off on the straight (no steering), wait a bit and it comes on. rinse and repeat. This was 4cell 10.5

Kevin Osmon had his brand new GTB (ran it like 3-4 times in practice the previous day) go up in massive smoke, like none other. Took his car to the line, turned it on, set it down, few seconds....SMOKE!! This was 3200 carbon (lipo) with 10.5

1 loss for both camps


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## brian0525 (Jan 17, 2005)

they can send them in for repair and we can see who gets there speedo back first! lmao


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## NovakTwo (Feb 8, 2006)

brian0525 said:


> they can send them in for repair and we can see who gets there speedo back first! lmao


We're here waitin'.........


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## gezer2u (Sep 25, 2001)

I think his point was that both have their problems. Novak has done a good job with getting brushless out, but has kinda lagged in the important options compared to other brushless companies. The one constant is there great customer service. But of course their service should be great, they are based in the US. I'm not wanting to start a 'Mine bigger then yours" fight, but would rather discuss the good points and the bad.


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## Buff (Dec 9, 2002)

But then again, you don't want a system that has to keep the customer service busy in the first place.....isnt that the point? If a specific company has learned to keep their service dept. so busy that they've gotten good at what they do?? I would rather them get it right first and NOT EVER have to DEAL WITH a customer service.

There will be a day when Tekin will take care of this I believe which is why they're taking longer to get their systems out....to be sure that when they're out, they STAY OUT and don't come back! Tekin doesn't want to keep customer service busy.


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## Craps (Mar 22, 2005)

The only problem with the new to be announced Tekin system will be the same as with the Mamba, Mtroniks, Schulze and pretty much any sensorless brushless system can not match the smoother throttle feel of a sensored system. Once I converted to the Novak GTB sensored system, I don't plan on ever racing again with a sensorless system again.

Sensorless is great for bashing around, but if you are going to race a hard to hook up 2wd stadium truck on a very slick dirt off road track, you are going to have to use the sensored system to get the most out of the truck!

You guys that are hooking up the PC to the ESC and programing it to do everything a high end radio can do with throttle curves, braking and drag brake that all can be adjusted from up on the driver's stand with the radio. Been there done that with the Schulze U-Force 75 ESC.


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## NovakTwo (Feb 8, 2006)

Aren't you, and other Tekin supporters, a bit concerned about raising customers' expectations of perfection beyond the ability of Tekin to deliver?

After all, it's easy to make promises about the quality and customer service of products (unseen by the public) that have been "Coming Soon!" for months or years.

And, it's fun to make snarky comments about Novak's customer service. But Novak has been shipping products for use in R/C cars for almost 30 years. So, well-designed and well-functioning CS and Tech Support departments are a necessity. Also, Novak continues to add CS options for their racers.

We can revisit this topic of Tekin's product and CS superiority six to nine months after they actually start shipping all these long-promised items. 

After all, if Tekin is not creating perfection, just why are they taking so long?



Buff said:


> But then again, you don't want a system that has to keep the customer service busy in the first place.....isnt that the point? If a specific company has learned to keep their service dept. so busy that they've gotten good at what they do?? I would rather them get it right first and NOT EVER have to DEAL WITH a customer service.
> 
> There will be a day when Tekin will take care of this I believe which is why they're taking longer to get their systems out....to be sure that when they're out, they STAY OUT and don't come back! Tekin doesn't want to keep customer service busy.


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## kevinm (Jan 16, 2002)

One thing that everybody needs to remember is that we racers are pushing technology to the limit. Novak rates the 6.5 turn motor at 390 watts. This is over 1/2 horsepower, and we complain that the speed control is 1.5" square and almost an inch tall (with fan). Here's a link to a fairly small industrial brushless motor controller rated at 400 watts:

http://web6.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Motion_Control/Servo_Systems/Low_Inertia_(100W_-_1KW)_Servo_Systems/400W_Servo_System_(Low_Inertia)/SVA-2040

It's 6.38"H. x 2.95"W. x 5.51"D. This is *52 times* larger by volume, and costs $479. The motor is $439.


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## swtour (Oct 8, 2001)

...Gezer,

I have to admit, so far I am happier w/ my 2 GTB's vs my LRP...BUT I've spent more time reading about the GTB and learning it's functions and I forgot my instruction sheet for the LRP at the PHOENIX race...

I have a earlier version of the LRP Comp, the instructions say it should have blue, amber and red set up L.E.D's, but apparently the early one that I have only has Amber and Red. I screwed up the set up when I programed it before I left the house..and had it in LIPO mode...so when the 4 cell pack dropped just a small amount of voltage it shut the system down... Being the GTB's don't have the lipo cutoff, and since I wasn't running LIPO I didn't event think about this speedo being in the LIPO mode.

XXKeeping fingers crossed that I'll remember this NEXT time I have an issue. (Bought another GTB this week though..so now I'll have 3 ORANGE and 1 BLUE)


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## Craps (Mar 22, 2005)

Just finished the 2nd race weekend of 20 minute mains with the New Spread Spektrum GTB with great results. It is noticably smoother using it with my Futaba 3PK w/spektrum module. The first thing I removed when I installed the GTB is the fan...I don't need it racing offroad. Just gear it right and 20 to 30 minutes of runtime is no problem.

I still don't understand the guys and the laptop PCs at the track changing the ESC when you can do 95% of everything you need on a high end radio without the PC. We use the 5.5 motor that is really too much motor for slick track, so we dial out the percentage of throttle or even better change the throttle curve to where it is like a stock 13.5 motor in the corners and still have the full power of the 5.5 at the top of the curve to make those big quad jumps when needed. Drag brake in and out is simple with the throttle trim advanced to take it out or put more in by more negative trim on the brake side.


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## badassrevo (May 8, 2006)

Novak's customer support is number 1. We are running 10 min mains in the electric off road classes right now as soon as we can get a few more guys into the lipo scene we will push for the same track as the nitro guys. I have 3 GTB's only one has lipo cutoff.


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## local nc driver (Mar 12, 2007)

notice to all racers using spectrum...you need to add a capacitor to your reciever! solder a battery plug for the reciever and plug it into the place on the reciever for a battery so that it holds a small amount of current when you have exhausted the power output after about 30 to 45 seconds of runtime from the start of your race.I am waiting to hear back from spectrum as to what size capacitor is needed and will post it on here.


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## NovakTwo (Feb 8, 2006)

local nc driver said:


> notice to all racers using spectrum...you need to add a capacitor to your reciever! solder a battery plug for the reciever and plug it into the place on the reciever for a battery so that it holds a small amount of current when you have exhausted the power output after about 30 to 45 seconds of runtime from the start of your race.I am waiting to hear back from spectrum as to what size capacitor is needed and will post it on here.


This is what you need:

Novak Electronics Glitch Buster Capacitor


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## Ralf (Oct 19, 2001)

The new Sport Series of motor/esc NOVAK has coming out, does the esc have a LIPO cut off? Thanks Ralf


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## NovakTwo (Feb 8, 2006)

Yes, the XBR has the lipo cut-off circuitry.

Novak's Extreme Sport Motor Systems



Ralf said:


> The new Sport Series of motor/esc NOVAK has coming out, does the esc have a LIPO cut off? Thanks Ralf


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## Ginsu (Dec 1, 2004)

*GTB 4 cell*

We did a review of the new GTB 4 cell Spread Spectrum Optimized. So you don't have to watch I can sum up the review. We liked it! If you want to watch you can at www.rctvlive.com For oval use the weight savings is huge. It features lower brake and drive values and lower drag brake values....a very good unit. Enjoy.


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## Ralf (Oct 19, 2001)

Probably can't afford to upgrade for a while, just bought new within the last few months, BUT doesn't the (P#5470) Novak Smart Stop 2Cell LiPo cut off module added to my GTB do the same thing? Thanks Ralf


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