# Dragster Tjet tuning by ht members tricks to become competitive



## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

I would like every one to ad there two cent . Would like to start with a Yellow Jacket Arm. Now what would you do. Let's say unlimited class anything goes.
Thanks SJJ


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## 15807brett (Sep 10, 2011)

Love this topic, ill listen and learn, please people put the suggestions in.


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## tjetsgrig (Nov 1, 2009)

Im not tellin' ya yet John, let's see what the other folks have to say first!

JS


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

ruh roh!


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

*142 views*

Wow thought this would be hotter then this? It's more fun to race when competion tuff.
SJJ


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

Jon, it has only been a day. relax, we'll tell you in the end. let's see what others say? huh?


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## 65 COMET (Nov 4, 2012)

Maybe I am from another planet, don't understand what you are trying to do? Do you want every one to build a car, tell how to build a car , or send parts in for a car? Please explain a little better. Thank you Mr.Confussed


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## Ralphthe3rd (Feb 24, 2011)

*be specific....*



sidejobjon said:


> I would like every one to ad there two cent . Would like to start with a Yellow Jacket Arm. Now what would you do. Let's say unlimited class anything goes.
> Thanks SJJ


SJJ, be more Specific about the arm, whats the OHM's on it ? Other parts must fit the ohm range of the arm, so without knowing, we have to stop and wait for your reply.


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

I will check the OHMS i got from Jim "YELLOW JACKET PERFORMANCE". I would like instuctions on how to build a unlimited HO Dragster.
Thanks SJJ


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## dtomol (Mar 30, 2005)

*Dragster Tjet Tuning*

I would start with a Five lam aramature blank a triple or double wind for the wire about 1 OHM. Put Brush cups or use pick up springs instead. The Strongest Naco magnets drilled & lighten gears metal rear crown gear vented chassis set up for a wet com silifoam tires vented chassis sides & lighten gear plate.


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## dtomol (Mar 30, 2005)

*Dragster Tjet Tuning*

I forgot shunt wires for the I pickup shoes & wheelie bars or traction magnets to keep the front end on the track.


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## Gerome (Sep 25, 2011)

Yep that's what I'd do. If I knew how.


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## 15807brett (Sep 10, 2011)

I hear alot about wet coms, what is it and how do you make a wet com chassis.


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/321154531870?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

Ok Al i bid on it.
Dennis got get you over to race ,your not that far? Wet Comm?
Keep it coming
SJJ


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

a wet comm is considered a brush set up that requires lubrication.
as opposed to normal brush usage where oil on the brush or commutator causes problems in the flow of electrons.

a wet comm set up uses springs, often pick up shoe springs, in place of any other material or "normal" brushes.
in addition, some builders will create a packing of select material inside the coils of the spring to assist in greater conductivity for high draw armatures.
there by a light oil or possibly commutator drops are used to lubricate the spring and commutator. in addition to providing lubrication this also disperses the incredible heat a low ohm arm will generate to some degree.
many who use wet comm set ups drill a hole in the bottom of the chassis to allow easy application of their solution to the comm prior to running the car.

all this based on the discovery when we were tad poles and lost one or more commutator brushes that pick up shoes worked and actually made the cars a good deal faster even though the commutator wore out very quickly too.

I am quite sure I have missed something regarding this issue and I welcome those who do use this technology to weigh in and complete/correct my explanation
I suspect sgrig will hold off a bit longer to see if any of the lessons he has been giving have been learned.


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## tjetsgrig (Nov 1, 2009)

Guess I coined that phrase! Been calling it a wet comm for ages, never heard anyone use that term before until I posted it! Also, been drilling the oil hole in the bottom of the chassis more than a decade ago! I dont vent my chassis with a hard build, too much flex! More later, keep it goin' fellas, some of you are spot on, some not so much!

JS


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## sjracer (May 25, 2008)

Hi John, in all my conversations with the Godfathers of Ho Drag Racing ( Jim Sgrig and Alan Galinko) the first things they'd ask me about was what are the rules and next what is my power supply because if you don't have enough power the car won't run or at least won't run properly. Now in conversations with Jim regarding the 4 gear chassis it's delicate very easy to blow the rear gear at one point in time he suggested not having an arm ohming under 3.5- 3.0 retarded not advanced and he was using an afx magnatraction rear if memory serves me correct, poly mags, braid, ( I don't believe shunts) and wet com set up and of course I'd highly suggest lapping the gears, silicone sponge rear tires. Oh and start with an Afx Magnatracion chassis no AW junk. Now this is old news and Jim is constantly doing R & D so it might be mute but it should be a good start. Remember one of the reasons outlaw tjets outrun everything pancake is that they have an all metal drive train. Now if you want an outlaw tjet dragster neo magnets ( nacho magnets) the hottest advanced arm 4 or 5 lam Jim will wind for you I believe he's done some under 1, cnc gears, brass rear, brush cups, springs, poly traction magnets unless you can find something stronger shunt wire, braids, wheelie bar, silicone sponge tires not sure what size but I'd guess around 460 and work my way up. Oh and the gear plate may need to be machined to accommodate the arm and chassis should be vented. Not sure but you may need weight in the front end since the outlaw tjets he built for me some time ago has a weighted front end and wheelie bars.


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## joegri (Feb 13, 2008)

sjj for my money it,s all about the gearplate! i solder the arm pinion and the gear cluster.what good is an arm if you cant get the power to the rear wheels. hope this points you in the right direction.by the way i believe you know what to do...yer just tryin to get us all jacked up lol! and if you build this ball of lightning i,d like to see some pics!!! we love pics. just my 2 cents.


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

Guys this is getting good this is what HT is all about. No i don`t have Drag building experiance. But if you ever make it up to Skip-Pack you would want it.
Keep it coming 

Briads-- see i was under the impression polishing my pickups stay cleaner during a run?
SJJ


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## 15807brett (Sep 10, 2011)

hearing good stuff hear for this beginner but i got a question, with poly nacho mags or neo, would a afx axle be to magnetic, whats a good axle or is the afx alright. thanks


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

an axle attracted to a motor magnet or a traction magnet is going to cause drag or friction that is unnecessary.
however, some of the top builders do still use original AFX axles instead of low carbon drill blank or stainless which both have less magnetic attraction.
I cannot argue with what works, but since you asked!


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## 15807brett (Sep 10, 2011)

thanks, i got some mm1 poly magnets don't know who made them, that WERE Laying around anybody ever use them, there are a little to long for the chassis, what the best tool to open up the chassis for the magnet slot ? i got some files but its a pain, or is there a different way, they are just a hair to big and don't want to jam them in the chassis cause they will problem make the chassis to bind.


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

Brett,
I saw on HT they sand the Magnet with a Diamond Hone.
SJJ


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## Boosted-Z71 (Nov 26, 2007)

I had no prior "drag" purpose build experience when I entered Jims build / run off on HT last year, all the ideas mentioned are what I did, venting chassis, shunts, SS axle, nacho mags, flux collectors (metal shims), advanced timing, wheelie bars, etc ...... but to me one thing stands out for building, is to reduce friction everywhere. 

Having built many fast Fray / outlaw type t-jets, to me the key between what is just an above average car and fast car is how free the entire chassis / gear plate & drive train are from friction losses. It takes some work to free up a chassis in all the spots, but well worth the benefits, it reduces heat in the arm as well. And by freeing it up I dont mean hogging out every hole, that will lead to bind, especially in a road car. 

One trick I always do once I decide on axles and tires / wheels is just free roll the car down a small ramp with the magnets in and out, you will see how much the mags pull on the steel axle and how straight & true the car rolls. 

Its also a great way to look for wheel / axle drag, & measure your success or failure in tweaks. For a drag car it has to roll straight, otherwise you get a car that will do all kinds of goofy things going down the track. 

Good luck, you have a ton of good info here, from some guys that are Really fast, maybe I got lucky on my first build, but let me tell you I listened to these guys and really thought about their advice and used it in my build. I got a rocket on the first build, it even got better after Jim tuned on it just a bit. That Buick is one of my prize cars now.

Boosted


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## joegri (Feb 13, 2008)

i spect this drag racin thing could be very addictive!cuz you know you could only make it faster.the whole tuning thing comes down to makin any t-jet run as smooth n fast as it can!and the cool thing is its all right here.


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## LDThomas (Nov 30, 1999)

It doesn't matter if the racing is road racing or drag racing, the starting point is carbide axles. The precision of the carbide, the sizes available of the carbide, and the non-magnetic attribute of the carbide make them the obvious choice. Either silicone carbide or tungsten carbide will do the job.

Happy racing!


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## dtomol (Mar 30, 2005)

When I had my old home maid Dyno I would not just look for maximum output at the dyno rollers. Tuning the car I had an ammeter in series with the input put power as I would tune the car I could see the current decrease and the output power increase by freeing the gear train or adjusting the brush tension. Tire goop if allowed helped on the drag strip. I never tried the comm. drop but I do believe that they will help as well. One of my favorite tricks was to fill the inside of the pick up shoe with solder it would keep the weight down low. I understand most clubs do not allow that but the weighted wheels look terrible. Maybe it is just me. Now on shimming the magnets I always used brass shim stock, what does everybody use? I was thing about building a flux collector to increase the magnetic field. The armature lamination could be made wider at the end near the magnets this should increase the magnetic field. DC motors has made a new comm. plate with narrower gaps this should help as well.


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

Ralphthe3rd said:


> SJJ, be more Specific about the arm, whats the OHM's on it ? Other parts must fit the ohm range of the arm, so without knowing, we have to stop and wait for your reply.


Ralph,
I got a 0.6 from Yellow Jacket. Sorry took so long to get back.
SJJ


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## Ralphthe3rd (Feb 24, 2011)

sidejobjon said:


> Ralph,
> I got a 0.6 from Yellow Jacket. Sorry took so long to get back.
> SJJ


 YIKES !...that's waaay too Hot and Arm for me, so I cannot help you out here, that's waaay outta My league !
Have fun with that build, and I hope you have a large budget, and are good with your hands....as that's a Top Fuel Dragster you're gonna build


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## tjetsgrig (Nov 1, 2009)

I posted my best numbers with a 0.3ohm 5 laminate stack, not for the faint at heart!!! Parts eating specialist is what it was!!


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

alpink said:


> http://www.ebay.com/itm/321154531870?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649


Jim,
Did you wind this 5 stack ?
SJJ


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## tjetsgrig (Nov 1, 2009)

Noooooooooo!!!!!!!


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## sidejobjon (Jun 3, 2010)

guess I should asked first,any hope here?
SJJ


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## tjetsgrig (Nov 1, 2009)

What, you want a 5 stack?? Not cheap!


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

Rich Duffler probably wound that 5 stack himself.
Quite a character that Rich.
I have gotten some masterpiece bodies from him and some interesting parts.
I recall at Tim's (Subabru Guru) place, in Paradise PA, when Rich tried out his new fangled magnetic pick up braids on that fine drag track.
the braids were kinda too long, the magnets kinda too strong and the car went sideways on the starting line causing a huge short circuit flash and fire.
after the smoke cleared, a good deal of cursing in several languages by Tim, the rail was salvageable and time trials resumed.
I don't think Rich ever appeared there after that. but I have seen him at various shows and bought stuff on eBay.
colorful guy.


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## hartracerman (Jan 9, 2005)

*Flux collector?*

What are you talking about? Description please and not back to the future.:wave:


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

don't know who or where you read flux collectors ....
but, simply put ....
it is a steel shim that is next to a magnet and directs some of the magnetism to the rails for better traction control.
it will some times wrap under the chassis to function as it was designed.
Tyco used them, Amrac used them, possibly Aurora G-Plus or one of it's derivatives.

then Traction Magnets were discovered (because serious Pro racers were using them) and incorporated into chassis.


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## cwbam (Feb 8, 2010)

*Flux Capacitor*

I thought flux capacitor was from "Fletch" the old Chevy Chase movie.


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## alpink (Aug 22, 2010)

cwbam, thank you for that pic of a flux collector that is helping develop a magnetic field that is oriented top to bottom as opposed to left to right as is more common with inline designs.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

More than one application for the concept....? 

High tech sorcery!

Giggle


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## partspig (Mar 12, 2003)

Ya want to know about "Flux Capacitors" ask Marty McFly's buddy, The Perfessor from Back To The Future!  pig


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## hartracerman (Jan 9, 2005)

*flux capacitor*

So theraretically it could help an armature stay balenced in a groove? Now I have to go back and learn how to spell agin. McFly I'm commin fer ya!:drunk:


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## slotcarman12078 (Oct 3, 2008)

Just be careful... Those flux capacitors have a way of twisting the fabric of time and space, and you could wind up finishing a race before you even started it. If you think "Groundhog Day" was bad.....  :lol:


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## tjetsgrig (Nov 1, 2009)

Gotta be 88mph, the closest I got was 80.05, so Im not warping the space time continueum.............yet!


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## slotcarman12078 (Oct 3, 2008)

If you do manage to hit the 88 mph barrier, could you get me the lottery numbers for the next 5 years or so? I'll share the winnings!


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