# G3 Lite - what is going on?



## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

The internet abounds with references to the BSRT GJet and G3Lite, some going 
back 2 years, yet nowhere can I buy one or find out what they cost.

What gives? 


dw


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

These have been mostly isolated to HOPAC. The GJet sounds mildly interesting but I can't figure out why they couldn't figure a way to implement a G3 without traction magnets without having to come up with an entirely new 9 ohm armature. It's still a $40+ ride to start with. The G3 Lite never caught on from what I can see. It's banned in HOPRA and UFHORA at least at the present time. 

I'd like to see the JL/AW XT catch on as a national level racing class. Parts are readily available and they can certainly be tuned as well as any legacy magnatraction. You don't have to put a fancy new arm and set your track power to 12V have fun with sliders. You can build up an XT for less than the entry level cost of a GJet.


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

> I'd like to see the JL/AW XT catch on as a national level racing class.


Amen to that. Only it ain't gonna happen within any of the "national" groups out there now...


But it will happen.


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## dlw (Aug 17, 1999)

Here, here............I'd love to see that.


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## smokinHOs (May 30, 2006)

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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

I'm for anything that doesn't involve me having to go out and buy a bunch of new stuff. Trouble is, the people selling the parts don't agree with my philosophy.


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

My question is how does the G Jet compare to a AFX G + or Super Magnatraction. I would like to see how they compare set up to the same height off the rails.

Just curious

Roger Corrie


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## Slott V (Feb 3, 2005)

The GJet is much faster than an AFX or Magna. It runs like a lightweight SG+, nimble, quick and you can get them sideways and still pull out of it with practice. We were running full throttle sensitivity and no or low brakes with 12v power at the Outhouse Invitational race last weekend. Also, not one shoe was lost, not one wheel out of alignment and the bodies took a beating as well. There were quite a few wall shots through the IROC race we ran and the cars looked as good as new at the end. Can't wait to get my hands on some in September. I predict this class will really take off! :thumbsup:


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Smart.
I have an OT question though why do you race on a track like that when you could have something like at www.eahorc.com (column 3).
Not a hostile question, I an genuinely interested in an answer. I'm also concerned on tracks like ours, that the GJet would smash itself to pieces...



Slott V said:


> The GJet is much faster than an AFX or Magna.


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## Slott V (Feb 3, 2005)

I'm not sure I know what you mean by "track like that"? That's a Bucktrack in the picture. It's an awsome track. Albeit a bit older technology but it is still a fantastic track. Have you raced on routed tracks before?

If I had a chance to race on something so large as the one you are talking about I'd sure take the chance! But I don't know why you think you'd smash these cars to pieces. Do you already destroy SG+ or G3 cars on it? There's no difference in the quality.

-Scott


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Having raced on the largest routed track in the world I know how wonderful they can be, makes going back to sectional track seem like really slumming it!

But I do love the eahorc large tracks, something about running on room filling tracks is really fulfilling. I guess I'm just worried a G-Jet, without magnets to retard it, will reach some very high speeds entering corners on such tracks.


dw


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## Slott V (Feb 3, 2005)

Well they're not like just pulling traction magnets out of a G3 and nothing else. They really are a different car altogether. With the 9 ohm arms and 12 volts you aren't going supersonic. They have weight to them yes but they are very smooth and a ton of fun to drive. Unlike any magnet car I've raced before. I felt privileged to be able to race them before their release. I wanted to take one home! :tongue: 

For organized events a 16 foot Bucktrack is ideal and is also easy for most drivers to set up for as their layouts are a well established common track design. And also easy to marshall. Set up time between heats was tight at 90 seconds. Action was fast paced and it was still a very long day. We raced 4 events back-to-back on Saturday and the day went 11 hours long with a 2 hour morning practice. No lunch but snacks everywhere and stocked coolers. The BBQ dinner and fireworks afterwards was spectacular. :thumbsup:

Pictures of the 2006 Outhouse Invitational here:
http://www.planetofspeed.net/PhotoPost/showgallery.php?si=&perpage=12&sort=7&cat=3025


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## smokinHOs (May 30, 2006)

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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

I have no doubt the GJets are fun to drive. They use a time tested formula that the G-Plus/SMT refined decades ago, before dedicated traction magnets emerged. In my opinion, the G-Plus/SMT is simply the best overall driving combination of any chassis in the Aurora based lineage. Magnatractions/XTs are next in line followed by the real AFX. I love magnet cars too, but they are a whole different experience best played out on a big fast track with racers who appreciate the whole experience. 

I understand the gushing that comes with being one of the "chosen few" to sample a new car, but unless the GJets sell for less than $20 with a body they are simply not addressing the needs of the vast majority of clubs looking for affordable and competitive racing that's going to provide the following:

1) A low cost platform to pull in new racers.
2) A way to hang on to current racers who are sick and tired of Magnet Car Politics and Fray Elitism.
3) A platform that lets basement racers acquire the skills and setup experience that will take them to Nats level competition if that's where they want to go. 

Pound for pound the best thing happening right now in HO slot cars is the X-Traction. If someone would step up to the plate with a G-Plus or SMT clone and have the cojones to not put "thunder" or "jet" in the product name then I'd be interested in that one too. We don't need another niche platform that assumes we're all willing to spend $35-$45 per unit and be required to have variable power supplies. Instead of imposing requirements that keep people out of the hobby manufacturers must be looking for ways to draw people into the hobby. The barriers to entry have to be very low: inexpensive cars that work well on plastic track using low cost power supplies and controllers.

The technical merits of the GJet don't mean a thing to me unless it's a low cost, inclusive system that provides a migration path to convert current SG+ and G3 cars to traction magnet free operation. Plus, any form of national level racing needs to have multiple vendor representation.

The bottom line however is that as slot car consumers we'll soon have another choice and a (somewhat) new product to buy. This one happens to come with some strings attached, but so do some of the others. But the vast majority of my slot car dollars will still be going to the wildly affordable AutoWorld XTs and the still very healthy classes of magnet car racing that provide all of the vendors an opportunity to compete on the same track at the same time. The GJet will be another niche product and no doubt I'll buy a few to play in that small niche part of the hobby. I like choices and I wish BSRT the best with their new product.


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## Manning (Mar 2, 2004)

Any guesses as to the MSRP of the GJet?

I'm guessing $60 minimum. The regular G3 rollers are $40ish, and these have a body, silicone sponge tires, and special armatures, and chassis weights that would increase the cost.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Manning said:


> Any guesses as to the MSRP of the GJet?
> 
> I'm guessing $60 minimum. The regular G3 rollers are $40ish, and these have a body, silicone sponge tires, and special armatures, and chassis weights that would increase the cost.


I'm getting mine without bodies and body posts so I can add a second F1 class at my club. Should keep the cost the right side of $50 (I hope)


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Back to the G3 Lite. I think the "lite" name is history and the lightened G3 is just going to be the newest revision of the standard G3 chassis. I tried one of these very recently. Instead of the odd holes drilled through the rear of the chassis the G3 logo is now molded as an opening in the rear of the chassis to achieve the same effect of removing material. There are two new holes molded into the front of the chassis under the shoes, the guide pin now has two settings, the endbell sits a little further forward, and the traction magnets sit slightly differently in their holders to give a little more effective width. Some additional material has been removed around the traction magnet sockets. Overall these subtle little tweaks all add up to a noticeably lighter and snappier feeling chassis that will remind you somewhat of a well setup T1. The G3 has been struggling to hold its own against the other two chassis that were released in response to the G3's success. These tweaks should give it back some of the dominance it enjoyed early on. Well, at least until the other brands react.


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## smokinHOs (May 30, 2006)

(removed)


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## smokinHOs (May 30, 2006)

(removed)


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## noddaz (Aug 6, 1999)

*yes!!!*



smokinHOs said:


> Or we can just race and have fun... and who cares who finishes first.


i AGREE!!!


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

I have nothing against IROC, but it totally removes the building, testing, and tuning aspects of racing. That's giving up too much fun for many of us. Does this mean that IROC is bad? No way! It's just another variation on the many themes of racing. If you race with anyone else you should mix things up and try different things every now and then, including IROC style.

Truth be told, most racing takes place at the club level using informal and flexible rules that everyone involved agrees to. If rules get in your way at this level then you're racing with the wrong people. The rules that the greatest number of people argue about are the rules that affect the fewest number of people. Go to any once a year national level race and you're unlikely to find more than 100 people. That's a tiny fraction of the number of people who race on a weekly or monthly basis. 

Everything else in racing is all about your personal attitude. Only you can decide if you want to let yourself get sucked up into the politics or the whining or the brand wars. If you really think that a fellow racer is going to buy up hundreds of XTs to find the one freak combination of parts that's going to ruin your chances of winning then should re-think your own motivations for being involved in racing in the first place. If you put your best efforts into building, testing, tuning, and practicing your driving and marshalling skills then you need to find your own rewards in what you are able to accomplish, whether or not you win the race. If you let someone else's behavior ruin your enjoyment of racing then you'll always be at the mercy of others and be powerless to do anything about it.


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## smokinHOs (May 30, 2006)

(removed)


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## coach61 (Sep 6, 2004)

Last club I drove with I had to supply and setup almost 80% of the field...You know how frustrating it is to get beat by one of your own cars!!! My Brother took the 1983 Southern Ontario Champ with a Tyco Pro Chappy mounted on a Gplus that "I" built him blew my friggin doors off.. lol...But it was still alot of fun....


Dave


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## oldraceral (Dec 1, 2005)

coach61 said:


> You know how frustrating it is to get beat by one of your own cars!!!


And then while you're being lapped for the third time by YOUR car, some wiseacre marshall will say "Gee, Al, that car isn't that fast when you drive it."


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## Manning (Mar 2, 2004)

Some news.......Finally!!!

http://www.scaleauto.com/latenews/index.htm

Can't wait for the bodied cars! Sweet!!!


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## T-jetjim (Sep 12, 2005)

Scott V- Can you post pics of the Gjet chassis? I have no idea what this all about. Is it close to a Tjet or is it a mag car sans magnets?

Jim


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## martybauer31 (Jan 27, 2004)

There are pics on some of the other forums, I know I have seen them out there. It is essentially a G3 mag car, with brass weights replacing the traction magnets in the rear, and a weight in the front of the chassis at the nose.

They are a blast to drive, are all fast out of the box, but then do have the ability to be tweaked more and get more speed by changing springs, rear wheel heights, heavy or light weights in the front and back depending on the track and how you drive, etc...


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## noddaz (Aug 6, 1999)

*G Jet*



T-jetjim said:


> Scott V- Can you post pics of the Gjet chassis? I have no idea what this all about. Is it close to a Tjet or is it a mag car sans magnets?
> 
> Jim


It is a G3 with brass weights replacing the traction magnets and
it also has an additional brass weight at the guide pin.
The chassis uses a special 9 ohm arm.
Tires are .350 front and .450 rear (I believe...)
And the cars are run at 12 volts....
And that is pretty much it...


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

The manufacturer suggests that you run the GJet at 12 volts because that's the driving experience that they are trying to promote. It will of course run at whatever track voltage you currently have and still be fully controllable. 

There's nothing special about the arm other than it having a 9 ohm wind. This is a different winding than the Tomy SG+ and G3 with their 6 ohm winding, but various arm windings have been used for decades. No big deal. I only point this out because it may be misinterpreted that the arm is somehow limited to being run at 12 volts and can't be used at the higher voltages that have been used by HO since its inception. Not true. Anyone who currently has a variable voltage power supply already knows that any HO slot car can be run at lower voltages. I do it all the time when youngsters are using my track.


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## Slott V (Feb 3, 2005)

Here you go:


















Here is a picture of the amazing hand painted bodies these IROC cars had that will be offered soon:










I raced 4 of them at the Outhouse Invitational the first week of August and it was a lot of fun. I'm a magnet car guy but raced TJets in 3 other races in that event. This car is nothing like TJets. Maybe close to a well built AFX/Magnatraction but way faster and smoother. They stuck to the track pretty well, but you _could_ get sideways in corners but control it and keep racing. We raced on a Banzai Bucktrak running on 12v battery power. Running on 18v would be a challenge as the armature will be a bit overpowered. Scale Auto/BSRT is offering a 12v power pack for $25 for racers looking to stay at 12v on a budget. I think the car has a great future and started a buzz around trhe internet for sure. I have 2 on order right now.

Don't believe the negative comments another manufacturer is writing on his business BBS regarding this new car. He's looking for allies again in his usual "us vs. them" same ol same ol campaign agenda. It's like a horrible rerun of 3's Company. Flick past it and you'll be fine. :tongue:


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

Looks cool, I'd like to buy two, just to have


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## Nightshade (Jan 15, 2006)

Do the windshield wipers move? :tongue: 

Those really do look nice.

Reading your threads above sure makes me wish there was a club around here for me to learn how to tune. I'm one of those who has to be there and see it to understand it better (hands on). Maybe I'll have to plan a business trip around a show or something.

Mike/Nightshade


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## T-jetjim (Sep 12, 2005)

Scott- Thanks for the post with pics. The bodies are awesome too.
Jim


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## AfxToo (Aug 29, 2003)

Those bodies do look awesome for lexan. I wonder who did them? It also looks like the chassis is the old style G3 and not the new G3-R. That would be most welcome news for hobby shop owners who always get left holding the bag (of obsolete parts) whenever a new version of a product arrives. 

My only potential beef with these cars is the price. If this car is targeting the performance gap between $15.00 magnatractions (XT) and $25.00 box stock magnet cars then why is the projected price around $40.00? I hope I'm way off on the price estimate. 

The 12 volt thing is not a big deal either way from a technical standpoint. We've always had the option of running our slot car tracks at 12 volts and some people already do. However it does represent a failure by the manufacturer to produce a product that meets the performance requirements when run at the *de facto standard* track voltage. What they were able to build was a car that's a little skittish at the standard track voltage. Rather than change their product, say with a 15 ohm arm, they instead recommend that we change our standard track voltage. This would be no different than me producing an electrical product targeted for the North American market and requiring it to be powered by a 50 Hz AC source to meet the product requirements. Even if I gave away 50 Hz power sources or converters or provided all kinds of compelling reasons why 50 Hz is superior to 60 Hz - the bottom line would still be that I missed the mark and produced a compromise product. Spin it however you want or try to make lemonade out of it - but I'm still asking my customers to change their system to accommodate my inability to conform to a standard, even if only a de facto standard. This is not a negative assessment of any manufacturer, it's simply an honest assessment from the *consumer's* side of the equation. After all, we are the only ones that matter. 

Finally, there's no reason to get personally involved in the brand battles with these products. I don't see it as being any different than Coke vs. Pepsi or Bud vs. Miller except none of the slot car manufacturers are nearly as sophisticated or deep pocketed as the cola and beer barons. But they're not dumb either. Just look at all the free publicity that gets generated for products that have yet to be released when they are shown off to a receptive audience. And also look at the very high prices that these manufacturers are able to charge for their products. Don't get all twisted up in esoteric arguments about the merits or failings of the products and overlook the bottom line. All of these products are expensive and they continue to get more expensive all the time.


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## Craig Jorgensen (Nov 21, 2004)

I think I read some where that the reason that they went with a 12 volt standard is that you can buy a decent cheap 12v power supply at many places (including radio shack), that will provide more that enough amperage to run these cars, without spending $350 dollars on a power supply. It's not really a problem for someone who already invested big money in a varible supply (like me!), I'll just turn the voltage down. But let's face it, you really can't run high draw magnet cars on a little "wall-wart" power supply, everything just gets too hot. I think these cars are going to be great for someone just getting started. Sure, 40 or 50 bucks is a lot for one car, but if it holds up, and preforms well, so what? Who here hasn't dumped $$$$$ into this hobby anyway? That's where the JL cars missed the mark, they were cheap for beginners, but were poorly assembled and half the time they wouldn't even run right out of the box. Out of the 40 or so JL's that I have, I have about 2 that run good. So dad buys this JL stuff to have some fun with the kids, and they can't even make a lap, and the stuff goes in the closet. If the g-jet cars are more expensive, but a decent power supply is cheaper, it works out about the same, and the stuff will actually work! I've been away from racing for the summer, but I'm looking forward to checking out these new cars, along with the new Auto World stuff, which are supposed to be improved versions of the JLs.

Have fun!!!!


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## Manning (Mar 2, 2004)

Scale Auto site says G-Jet rolling chassis is officially available to the general public.... :thumbsup: 

I'm anxiously awaiting the super cool painted lexan bodied cars to become available....


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## Craig Jorgensen (Nov 21, 2004)

*Awesome!!*

I recently picked up both a G-jet and a Storm Thunder, and I have to say, this "new" style of car is a blast to drive!
Both are very smooth, and handle very well. They have a real sense of weight to them when you throw them into the curves, and are quite fast. Both cars are very well made, and are very durable. They are also ready to run right out of the package, they don't need anything,not even tires. I didn't even have to tweak the pickups. When you look at the quality of these cars, they are actually quite a bargian. Think about it; if you go to build a fray syle t-jet, it will cost you at least as much. Plus you have to sort parts, be a master mechanic, and have a bunch of tools. And guess what, it still won't be as fast or handle as well as these new cars. Plus they're made in...hold it...the good old USA!!!


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

Craig Jorgensen said:


> if you go to build a fray syle t-jet, it will cost you at least as much. Plus you have to sort parts, be a master mechanic, and have a bunch of tools. And guess what, it still won't be as fast or handle as well as these new cars. Plus they're made in...hold it...the good old USA!!!


 
You are comparing apples to oranges. Of course a TJET will never handle as good. I have never seen a TJET or MT/XT that you can put on a 9 inch straight piece of track and hang upside down and the chassis would stick to the track but these do. These are magnet cars plain and simple equal to a early 90's Super Stock car which back then was a TYCO 440X2.

Now if you look at todays Super Stock HO Slot Cars they are faster and handle better than the Modified in back ion the 90's. So Gary just brought these cars back to whats was normal speed and handling wise back then but with no work required on our part to get them dialed in.

That said they are a great car for those that like to race vintage Super Stock HO slotcars. They are the equal to the best X2 Super Stock I remember from that time. And are very very well made and worth the money.

Roger Corrie


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## Craig Jorgensen (Nov 21, 2004)

The G-jet and Thunder are not magnet cars. They have brass weights replacing the traction magnets. The only magnets are the motor magnets. 
It's kind of a whole new thing, similar to the old brass pan chassis that we used to build in the`70's, but with an inline motor. I compared them to a Fray-style T-jet because up till now, they were really the only high performance non-magnet cars that were out there. But even the best built T-jet wouldn't be able to run with these cars. I'm looking forward to adding this class to our Monday night racing.


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## Montoya1 (May 14, 2004)

Craig Jorgensen said:


> And no, they won't stick to a piece of track turned upside down :thumbsup:


Somebody who had a TS said it did. Then I guess a GJ 'owner' countered that their car did too and now we have a couple of urban legends.


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## Craig Jorgensen (Nov 21, 2004)

Bloody Hell!! I just tried it, and they do stick!! I never even thought of trying it! Not as good as a full blown magnet car, but no urban legend here! Oh well, it's not the first time I've been wrong, just ask my wife :hat:


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## coach61 (Sep 6, 2004)

Craig Jorgensen said:


> Bloody Hell!! I just tried it, and they do stick!! I never even thought of trying it! Not as good as a full blown magnet car, but no urban legend here! Oh well, it's not the first time I've been wrong, just ask my wife :hat:



I asked my wife and she that is ture.. We are both have been wrong on several occasions.,



Dave


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