# The Amazing Disappearing Enterprise!



## derric1968 (Jun 13, 2003)

So, you guys remember Jaime's recent blog entry about the nuEnterprise? And you remember how it quietly disappeared a few days after posting? Well, there's a new blog entry today. It's a kind of year-end wrap-up plus a look ahead at 2011. There are updates on all the late Trek kits. But you know what's missing? An update on the release of the nuEnterprise. I thought that was curious, so I went to Round 2's website, and guess what? POOF! All mentions of this kit have been removed!

Now, if this kit has been straight up cancelled, I'll be one disappointed model builder. I suppose it's possible that it's been delayed again, maybe until late in the year. It's also possible that because of the delays, they'd rather just put the kit on the back burner until the nuTrek sequel is released. That would actually make a lot of sense at this point. Who knows? I guess we're stuck waiting until somebody says something official.

However, if you read the new blog entry, you'll see that there is a small shimmer of hope for Round 2. It seems they've hired some help and restructured a bit. Hopefully, this will help them get back on track with release schedules. In the mean time, though, I'm feeling a bit bummed. 

P.S. - Now, before you guys that hate the new movie and new Enterprise start popping corks and celebrating, please, please, please keep in mind that some of us here are actually fans. Imagine how you'll feel if Round 2 officially cancels all plans to produce the 1/350 E. We're all brothers in plastic here.


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## LGFugate (Sep 11, 2000)

Derric,

As one formally designated a "hater", I was hoping the new kit would come out so that the folks here could correct it and post photos! That abomination they call "Enterprise" is the only thing I truly hate about that movie.

Larry


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

I am so over Round 2.


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## James Tiberius (Oct 23, 2007)

yeah me too, I have plenty of things to keep me busy. 

I have a brand new cutaway enterprise with DLM resin parts and lighting boards. ANd a whole lot of other kits.

Moebius will be getting the majority of my money.

Oh well.


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

Well, I'm not a big fan of the ship, but if/when it comes out, I might buy one for kitbashing purposes...


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

James Tiberius said:


> yeah me too, I have plenty of things to keep me busy.
> 
> I have a brand new cutaway enterprise with DLM resin parts and lighting boards. ANd a whole lot of other kits.
> 
> ...


Glad I am not the only one!!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I hate the ship, but I want them to keep producing models.


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## USS Atlantis (Feb 23, 2008)

Maybe we'll get lucky and they've canceled 'The Abomination' to put the capital towards the 350-TOS-E 

Just hoping


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## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

I loved the ship and the movie. Can't wait for the kit.


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## derric1968 (Jun 13, 2003)

USS Atlantis said:


> Maybe we'll get lucky and they've canceled 'The Abomination' to put the capital towards the 350-TOS-E


Perhaps what you should have said was "Maybe *I'LL* get lucky and they've canceled..." No need to be so presumptive or so plural. What would be lucky for you would be most *UN*lucky for me. Can a brother not get ANY sympathy around here?


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## sunburn800 (Nov 24, 2006)

Well Playmates killed their line of NU Star Trek line of toys that could well be because they didn't sell. Looks like Round two is not so sure about how well the enterprise would sell also.Kind ironic that a starship made to look like a kids toy failed badly at that job. this is only MPO of course.


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## derric1968 (Jun 13, 2003)

John P said:


> I hate the ship, but I want them to keep producing models.


I just want them to keep producing *NEW* models! The upgraded re-pops are fine, but man cannot live on re-pops alone!


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

"Farewell and adieu to you, fair Spanish Ladies, Farewell and adieu to you, ladies of Spain......."


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## Wolvster (Mar 14, 2006)

I just watched Master and Commander last night..


_NOW_ that song is stuck in my head.. THANKS...


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## CutlassFE3 (Oct 15, 2002)

Blah blah, nuEnterprise, blah abomination, blah blah 1/350 TOS, blah REAL Enterprise ad nauseum plus tax and shipping.

Wash, rinse, repeat. 

Hopefully Round 2 will make haste with the 1/350 Enterprise so all the clamoring for a 1/144 scale Enterprise can begin. Then, a 1/72 Enterprise. Round 2 sucks if they don't do those. Our shelves should be filled with the same model, but in 7 different scales! 15 people online demand it!


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

It is my guess because of the overwhelming dislike for the design and the poor sales of other NuTrek licensed products released by other companys ,Round 2 probably quietly cancelled the poor thing. Also likely due to the economy they are less likely to take a chance on it. I won't miss it!


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Wolvster said:


> I just watched Master and Commander last night..
> 
> 
> _NOW_ that song is stuck in my head.. THANKS...


I was thinking "Jaws"!


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## iriseye (Sep 21, 2010)

From what I understand, the nu Enterprise makes a great pizza cutter.


[http://trekmovie.com/2010/09/21/new-uss-enterprise-pizza-slicer-available-]


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

Ive been a lurker for a long time. I really don't understand all the "hate" for Round 2. Its not like their stealing anyone's money or scamming the modeling community.

Its a shame new products have been long delayed or canceled, but they been doing great with "improved" re-pops. I for one been ecstatic with their repops as many have been OOP for a very long time. 

The 1/1000 Enterprise was well received and the new yet to be released Batmobile looks like a winner. 

Phantom does his best to keep a blog going and from time to time answers questions even when the crowd has been extremely hostile. 

I've been disappointed in a few things myself. But I think Round 2 has brought more "fun" to the hobby since they have been in business. I'm at least very happy with what they have produced the last year or two.


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

I'd buy that for a dollar!


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## Seashark (Mar 28, 2006)

It's hard to say for certain exactly _what_ happened to it, pushed back, cancelled, etc. I will say however that, while I was not a fan of the movie or the ship; I sypathize with those that were wanting a model of it.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

The molds were destroyed when Godzilla, as he stepped on them in the parking lot as the truck was leaving with them on board, as he was taking a short cut by the Chinese plant on his way to a Convention.


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## mach7 (Mar 25, 2002)

Solium said:


> Ive been a lurker for a long time. I really don't understand all the "hate" for Round 2. Its not like their stealing anyone's money or scamming the modeling community.
> .


I can't speak for others, but with me it's just frustration. 

Back in 2004(?) they were ready to do the 1/350 enterprise after the success of the refit, but the company was sold so no new kit.

2007(?) the original owners bought the company back and got AMT and MPC to boot! life was good! they re-pooped the original Enterprise in the original packaging and in 2008 they said the the 1/350 Enterprise was back on for 2010. 
Then in 2009 it was announced that it was delayed, but just until early 2011 so they could do the JJprise. They said don't worry it's well along the way and was definitely coming. 
Then out of the blue at wonderfest 2010 came the annual poll/questionnaire 
ASKING if they should produce it! Then came the announcement that it's not even approved yet. Over the summer it's waiting for approval, then it's on, then it's waiting for the economy. Now retailers are listing it but Jamie says it's a mistake, a "practice memo was released by mistake. 

The repops are running about 9 months+ late, nothing new has come since the 1/1000 refit, and that has had issues with the saucer. Decals and packaging are mis-spelled. 

I want them to succeed, and like having many of the old trek kits back, but it does get frustrating. Especially when Moebius is releasing so many new/great kits.


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## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

round 2 has saved me literally hundreds of dollars on kits by releasing old kits such as the Interplanetary UFO, Enterprise-E and K7 Space Station. Without them releasing them, I could have spent well over $500.

They owe me exactly zip. If anyone owes anyone anything, it is we who are indebted to them. They could have priced any of their releases at $70+ and it would have still been more than fair.


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

No question the 350 TOS Enterprise has been a 10 year train wreck. Polar Lights now Round 2 really dropped the ball on that one. Its going to cost so much more to produce, and cost so much more to purchase. They probably wont sell half of the units they could have a few years ago if it was made today. But we don't know why it wasn't made. I certainly don't have the cash flow to produce the kit. 

But, I love the repops. Mr. Spock, Aurora Batmobile (Which I never owned) the UFO, and many, many others. Many I only owned once and lost or never owned at all. There is no guarantee other companies would have released these OOP kits if Round 2 didn't. So that's why I feel they have been a great service to the modeling community. 

As far as the misspellings. Yeah, that's frustrating for the consumer and I am sure embarrassing for the company. Things like that have a way of snowballing. But again I hold no ill will towards the company. Perhaps they simply are trying to do to much at once.


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## spindrift (Apr 16, 2005)

Let's here from Jamie about this...if it is cancelled something is SERIOUSLY wrong over at R2, this kit has been in the works for a long time and always pushed back...not enough interest from retailers or something worse???


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## robiwon (Oct 20, 2006)

For me I could care less right now if it or any other kits come out. Now, don't take that the wrong way. I have so many kits in the stash that whatever I buy now wont get built for a long time. I'm on no deadline to get a JJPrise or a 1/350 E. Yeah, I would like to have both, even though neither are my favorite Trek ship. If they get released, then they get released. If not, well then, they don't. I know there are devoted fans of both ships._ For them_, I hope R2 gets on the ball and gets both kits out.:wave:


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## flyingfrets (Oct 19, 2001)

There's always the possibility that Round 2 may just be holding off releasing the Nu'Prise until the next film hits the theaters. Ya gotta admit, they'd be likely to move more kits when the subject is tied in with something more in the public eye.


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

sunburn800 said:


> Well Playmates killed their line of NU Star Trek line of toys that could well be because they didn't sell. Looks like Round two is not so sure about how well the enterprise would sell also.Kind ironic that a starship made to look like a kids toy failed badly at that job. this is only MPO of course.


Keep in mind that they also cancelled other traditional ships when they cancelled this line. There are still Ds, Reliants and BOPs left in my TRU. Does this mean that these are unpopular too?

Although I understand other's dislike for the NuEnterprise, I am completely confused by posts that suggest that a 1/350th TOS Enterprise would sell like hotcakes and that Round 2/Polar Lights should be plowing all available capital into producing that kit. 

Hello! It's a better business decision to slighty retool a Klingon BOP and sell it at a reasonable price in stores and online than to produce an expensive kit that most can't afford, find room for or have the skills to build. To me, the TOS-E is something that can wait until Round 2 is in a secure enough business position to risk it. And it would be a huge risk for them.

So calm down, let Round 2 do what they need to be successful. Be grateful that they are still producing model kits - even the NuEnterprise that many of us are looking forward to.

Jim


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Arronax said:


> Keep in mind that they also cancelled other traditional ships when they cancelled this line. There are still Ds, Reliants and BOPs left in my TRU. Does this mean that these are unpopular too?
> 
> Although I understand other's dislike for the NuEnterprise, I am completely confused by posts that suggest that a 1/350th TOS Enterprise would sell like hotcakes and that Round 2/Polar Lights should be plowing all available capital into producing that kit.
> 
> ...


This would be a valid argument IF there were not so many other companies producing MANY newly tooled kits on subjects that are not as popular as Star Trek. Galaxy Quest, War of the Worlds, When Worlds Collide, Lost in Space, Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea, when you look at the companies that make these kits, and doing well, it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out the economy or any other excuse along those lines, is NOT the real reason! ANY TIME a company announces something, with great fanfare, then quietly backs away from the product and cancels it, does not indicate a company that knows what they are doing!


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

I'm soooooo over the guys who are sooooo over R2 and the JJ-Prise.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

ClubTepes said:


> I'm soooooo over the guys who are sooooo over R2 and the JJ-Prise.


Well, this is a discussion board, so you need a "Devil's Advocate" to keep things from getting to "Lovey Dovey"! Hey, everybody have a safe and Happy New Year!!!!


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

RSN said:


> . . . when you look at the companies that make these kits, and doing well, it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out the economy or any other excuse along those lines, is NOT the real reason!


I think "doing well" is an overstatement. Any company that makes model kits is fighting for a share of a shrinking market. The kits you mentioned come from two companies - one, Pegasus, has a lot of other lines to prop up their SF kits - the other, Moebius, is taking advantage of less expensive licenses and taking enormous risks on their releases.

A couple of things to keep in mind. The Star Trek license is one of the most expensive ones. The TOS Enterprise has been released many times in different scales and formats in the 40 odd years it's been around. Sure, it's an icon but the audience that would want the 1/350th kit is shrinking quickly.

Saying Round 2 broke it's promise to release the kit is taking it personally. You have to understand that Round 2 just doesn't see any profitability in it's release right now and they'd like to stay in business.

It wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer changed it's mind and didn't produce what they had already announced.

Jim


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Arronax said:


> I think "doing well" is an overstatement. Any company that makes model kits is fighting for a share of a shrinking market. The kits you mentioned come from two companies - one, Pegasus, has a lot of other lines to prop up their SF kits - the other, Moebius, is taking advantage of less expensive licenses and taking enormous risks on their releases.
> 
> A couple of things to keep in mind. The Star Trek license is one of the most expensive ones. The TOS Enterprise has been released many times in different scales and formats in the 40 odd years it's been around. Sure, it's an icon but the audience that would want the 1/350th kit is shrinking quickly.
> 
> ...


That is cool by me, I just wish they would say so if that is the case so we all don't overthink the wheel here. Heck, a new year starts in a few hours and there are way more important things to spend this much time on. I hope they get their duck in a row, in the meantime I hope everyone here has a Happy New Year!


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

Well, a quick check of the Round 2 site as it stands now verses before, both the page for the new movie Enterprise and the press release announcing them getting the license have been removed. My guess is that Round 2 lost the license to make this model kit.

Should this be a surprise? No.

First, Star Trek is not a single licensed property, and Round 2 had to fight to get the license for the new movie Enterprise to begin with. Second, the people controlling that license have proven to be unreliable in the past (having pulled the plug on a number of novels based on the new movie characters after they had already been written).

So I don't think this has much to do with Round 2, they are just caught in the middle of all this.



Arronax said:


> Sure, it's an icon but the audience that would want the 1/350th kit is shrinking quickly.


This is laughable.

By the same logic, the audience for the Jupiter 2 would be diminishing faster than the TOS Enterprise and the peek audience for the C-57D would have passed more than a decade ago.

But if you are right, then Round 2 is hurting all of us by sitting on the license for this kit and doing nothing when others could have done something with it before it loses it's value. Are you saying that Round 2 is that type of company?

Boy... with friends like you, Round 2 doesn't need detractors. :thumbsup:


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## derric1968 (Jun 13, 2003)

Shaw said:


> My guess is that Round 2 lost the license to make this model kit.


It's also possible that Round 2 decided to allowed the license to lapse. Licenses, especially those related to movies, are granted with expiration dates. If that date arrives and the licensee hasn't delivered their product, they either have to negotiate a renewal, or cancel their product(s).

Now, considering how much time and money they've already invested, I still say there is a good possibility that they've decided to let the license lapse, put the project on the back burner, and wait patiently for the sequel to arrive. At this point, that strategy may make more sense from a business perspective.

We may never know, as companies generally don't like to formally announce cancellations.


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

RSN is a fellow Richard Sharpe fan I'll wager, I always liked him. 
As for the JJ-prise..... I'm sorry for those who want it, but expect it to change drastically for the next movie anyhow.....and it truly is butt ugly. Put the effort into the next one which Round 2 won't get due to failure to produce in all likelihood.

Tib

p.s. Happy New Year!


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Tiberious said:


> RSN is a fellow Richard Sharpe fan I'll wager, I always liked him.
> As for the JJ-prise..... I'm sorry for those who want it, but expect it to change drastically for the next movie anyhow.....and it truly is butt ugly. Put the effort into the next one which Round 2 won't get due to failure to produce in all likelihood.
> 
> Tib
> ...


Not sure of the reference......is this a good thing or a bad thing?? Are you by chance referring to the Bernard Cornwell character? 

Ron


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Shaw said:


> *>SNIP!<*
> 
> Boy... with friends like you, Round 2 doesn't need detractors. :thumbsup:


Alright, let's not make this personal. We're all a part of the same hobby, remember? Friends and whatnot?


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## miraclefan (Apr 11, 2009)

I won't lie I'm kinda happy R2 won't be doing the Nu-Prise.
Don't get me wrong, I REALLY WANT one, but after the disappointment that was the 1/1000 Refit It was going to be hard buying any further NEW Trek molds from R2.


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

I doubt very seriously that it's a licensing issue, facts are Nu Trek merchandise was far over hyped and sales 'TANKED'. Even the Dollar Stores and Tuesday Morning stores can't give this stuff away. The present economy hasn't helped either. Round 2 has had the Trek license for time and memorium, and they have a close working relationship with Paramount Pictures. "IF" it ever does get made, Round 2 will make it.


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

CutlassFE3 said:


> Hopefully Round 2 will make haste with the 1/350 Enterprise so all the clamoring for a 1/144 scale Enterprise can begin. Then, a 1/72 Enterprise. Round 2 sucks if they don't do those. Our shelves should be filled with the same model, but in 7 different scales!


Works for me! :thumbsup:

And only .00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000015 people are against it!


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

Yes, Rsn, that song is used in one of the Tv movies based on the novels, quite well rendered, though I know the song doesn't originate from the series, I do have it from the soundtrack.....good stuff.

Tib


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

I guess many of you guys don't remember AMT/Ertl's release reputation.

When you stop and look at the big picture R2 hasn't been doing too bad in comparison.

Personally I'm pretty happy with what they are doing, and its easy to judge without knowing whats going on behind closed doors.

These guys are improving detail in kits, adding better decal sheets and offering the product in new ways (like the clear 'D') and all you guys can do is complain.

Perhaps, the JJ prise was dropped from 2011 to allow funds for other projects (like the 1/350 perhaps??) and are pushing the JJ to when the sequel is due in theaters when general interest might be higher. Personally that is what I would do.


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## KUROK (Feb 2, 2004)

^ funny yet so true...


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## GSaum (May 26, 2005)

*People need to chill*

I love PL and R2, and I'm grateful for what they have released so far. The 1/350 Refit Enterprise is easily one of the greatest scifi kits out there, and its certainly the Trek kit which has generated the most awe and respect. Yes, we've been clamoring for a 1/350 TOS Enterprise kit, but look at their predicament. When the company was repurchased by the original owners, who years before had planned the TOS 1/350, there was a shift going on in Star Trek. The new movie was on the horizon and it was generating a LOT of buzz, especially after those first few trailers came out. From a business point of view, it seemed only natural to put some money and talent into creating a model of the nuEnterprise. If the film was going to be hot, then merchandising from the film could be equally hot. If Round 2 had a hot kit to sell, they could take that profit then produce all of those kits we've been waiting for (like the 1/350 TOS Enterprise). However, two things happened: the economy tanked, and (possibly as a side-effect) the merchandising of this film proved to not be as hot as the film itself. I'm sure TPTB at Round 2 likely saw this and realized that their safest move would be to "fix" the old AMT/ERTL models, add new high quality decals (which are super cheap to make, but worth their weight in gold to modelers such as myself who crave detail), and hopefully generate enough capital so they can create new models, such as the 1/350 TOS Enterprise.

This is all speculation on my part, but it seems to make the most sense. I think PL/Round 2 is simply a victim of circumstance, and I for one am THRILLED that they are staying afloat in the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression. I want the 1/350 TOS E, but I'll be glad to hold off and purchase a few repops. I can always brush up on my modeling skills (a good idea since I haven't built a kit in over 10 years) and I'll just sit back and wait. But I'm certainly not going to blame R2 for doing what I would have done if I were in their shoes.


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

ClubTepes said:


> Perhaps, the JJ prise was dropped from 2011 to allow funds for other projects (like the 1/350 perhaps??) and are pushing the JJ to when the sequel is due in theaters when general interest might be higher. Personally that is what I would do.


Logical.:thumbsup:


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

My guess is the kit got delayed too long in production and they set it aside for the next movie licensing rather than pay to renew the current agreement. If the licensing had expired a short while into the sales of the kit it would have been a disaster.

I always root for any company selling scifi kits, but R2 continually shoots itself in the foot. It is like their production schedule is not linked to actual planning but a bunch of wishful thinking, trial balloons that pop and a desire to say impressive PR things for impact. After the Akira & TOS-E I really do not believe anything they say until; it is actually on the shelves. The repops are good to keep from going to eBay and I do admire them enhancing kits some, but IMO that company needs to take a deep breath, look around and decide what to do _then do it_. Maybe 2011 will be the year for them to get the act together...


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## Gemini1999 (Sep 25, 2008)

What's this? No JJPrise? Oh well, easy come, easy go.....

It's just a model, not the end of the world. I can see that some folks are barbecueing Round 2 over it already. They never do get a break with this bunch, do they?

Bryan


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## modelsj (May 12, 2004)

I'm glad I found the PlaymatesPrise for $7.00; I had a feeling this was going south. I'm going to attempt to accurize, drill, light and paint it up into a pretty woman as best I can. If the model does come out then I can do reliant stuff to it.


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

Gemini1999 said:


> What's this? No JJPrise? Oh well, easy come, easy go.....
> 
> It's just a model, not the end of the world. I can see that some folks are barbecueing Round 2 over it already. They never do get a break with this bunch, do they?
> 
> Bryan


Nobody comes down this hard on Moebius or Pegasus or even Revell of Germany.

While I appreciate everything that these companies are doing, Moebius has had delays, and quite frankly I look at the engineering of the Viper and wonder WTF were they thinking in the area of the engine, wing, and landing gear interaction. The Galactica has issues with the flight pod garages.

Pegasus was supposed to come out with a bunch of kits last year like the WOTW tripod, the Mercury rocket and their 2001 inspired pod.
Nobody gives them grief.

Revell of Germanys kits are really hit or miss, yet everyone is calling them the savior of the Trek line without even seeing a prototype.

What I see here are a bunch of guys who LIKE to complain without any real substantial justification for singling out one company when all have their issues.

People slam R2 for canceling the 1/1000 Akira. That was a pretty smart move actually, as I firmly believe that that subject doesn't have the demand vs. the tooling cost.


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

It wasn't too long ago that there were people here who proclaimed that they would not buy the JJprise, now there are people bemoaning the fact that the kit has disappeared from the schedule. Just goes to show that you can't please everybody.

The fact is until we hear from Round 2 that it has in fact been cancelled, everything here is just pure speculation. I for one support Round 2, they are re-issuing some kits that I don't have and always wanted but wasn't about to pay inflated collector prices, especially for a kit I wanted to build. I wish the people at Round 2 the best in the new year and I will continue to buy their product that interests me, no matter how long it takes to get it out.


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

modelsj said:


> I'm glad I found the PlaymatesPrise for $7.00; I had a feeling this was going south. I'm going to attempt to accurize, drill, light and paint it up into a pretty woman as best I can. If the model does come out then I can do reliant stuff to it.


I have the JJprise that came with the Bluray set from target, it is a well engineered and detailed display model that also serves as storage for the Bluray discs. I am perfectly happy with that until a kit comes out, if it doesn't show up until the next movie, no big deal. There are plenty of things in the works to keep me busy.


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

Has anyone who's really upset about this tried to contact R2? Sitting here griping about it won't get you your answer 

Tib


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## James Tiberius (Oct 23, 2007)

Yeah, I've emailed, but no response.

Probably some internal mis-communication about what to say.


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## derric1968 (Jun 13, 2003)

kenlee said:


> It wasn't too long ago that there were people here who proclaimed that they would not buy the JJprise, now there are people bemoaning the fact that the kit has disappeared from the schedule. Just goes to show that you can't please everybody.


To be fair, the people proclaiming that they'd never buy the kit and the people bemoaning its disappearance are two entirely different groups of people.

And yes, it's quite impossible to please everybody.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I am part of the group which would probable not buy a NuE. Aside from not really likeing the design, money is tight and there are a lot of kits I want really bad to spend buck for something I would probably kit bash.
No company is perfect, but few have such an inconsistant track record as R2. Yes, the Moebius Galactica's flight pods will not fit into the garages, neither will the CGI version it was based on without active tweaking in the animation. Some people love the parts breakdown on the Viper Mk2, others hate it. I would have loved to see the Pegasus WotW Tripods and other kits released in 2010 instead of later, but they are delayed- not just cancelled and references removed regarding their existance. That is a big differene. The upcoming TOS-E may or may not become a kit- again mixed signals. I suppose the big distinction is when other companies announce products they are well along in the production. Moebius alone has the distinction of embracing the aftermarket kit industry by providing kits ahead of the big roll out so accessory and detail sets can be ready when the new kit arrives an store shelves.
Round 2 is doing some good things- the aztec decals, BoP landing gear, clear cast kits, revised Reliant hull- all of these are well appreciated. Just having repops of kits long gone is far better than the small amount still remaining from earlier releases on eBay. 
Until Phantom Stranger (or reasonable facsimile thereof) makes an appearence or R2 updates their website with some information nobody will know WTF is going on with the product queue. My main issue is that I grow weary of this shell game of kit announcements- I would be happier if they just did not say anything at all about upcoming kits until they are in the test shot stage.


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

If we went into a tizzy everytime plans were modified, promises were broken, model kit release schedules were changed, etc., well, there'd be a lot of people in that tizzy.

That reminds me, didn't George Lucas promise us NINE Star Wars movies? I'm never going to watch a movie in THX again.

Jim


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## mach7 (Mar 25, 2002)

Tiberious said:


> Has anyone who's really upset about this tried to contact R2? Sitting here griping about it won't get you your answer
> 
> Tib


Yup, I have 3 times in the last 4 months. No response. I guess my emails got lost in the R2 inbox.


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## Moebius (Mar 15, 2007)

The breakdowns are basically done by the software to make the tooling work easiest. We could complicate it, but then the price goes up. Can't make everyone happy. Either we do something that will sell to the most amount of people we can at a a price that is within reason, or we worry about the few guys that will complain about something small like how it's engineered. Galactica has issues? What kit doesn't? 

I've pretty much stayed out of all the talk on Round 2, as the majority of it is so far off. I know they have announcements coming, why not wait to see what the official word is when they speak again? It's not an easy business to be in today, and I'm sure they read some of this and wonder why they try if so many people are unhappy with something they obviously have no control over.


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

Moebius said:


> The breakdowns are basically done by the software to make the tooling work easiest. We could complicate it, but then the price goes up. Can't make everyone happy. Either we do something that will sell to the most amount of people we can at a a price that is within reason, or we worry about the few guys that will complain about something small like how it's engineered. Galactica has issues? What kit doesn't?
> 
> I've pretty much stayed out of all the talk on Round 2, as the majority of it is so far off. I know they have announcements coming, why not wait to see what the official word is when they speak again? It's not an easy business to be in today, and I'm sure they read some of this and wonder why they try if so many people are unhappy with something they obviously have no control over.


Frank, I wouldn't really call the engineering of a kit a small issue as it directly affects ease of assembly, and thus building experience of the customer. I'm curious, are you or your people here doing the parts breakdown, or are the people in China doing it?

My complaints about the Viper breakdown are things that wouldn't have resulted in any higher parts count, and allowed the modeler to putty seams as they built. The idea of 'trapping' parts like the wings and tail makes for difficult assembly and really hard to get a nice fit around the lower engines.
Its a very strange assembly process. Other parts of the Viper are great.

One the Galactica, having a couple of pins on the bottom of the flight pod garage parts with a couple of receivers on the bottom hull section would have helped with alignment and to tighten the gaps on the flight pod garages. Again looking at the parts and the way they are shot, there seems to be no reason something like this was omitted and wouldn't have resulted in a higher parts count.

I could complain about the armor undercuts on the side of the head, but those would result in more parts. I realize that so I don't complain about it.
On the positive side of the Galactica is the use of slide molds on the nose of the head and on the flight pod arms. That stuff is pretty nice.

And as I said, I appreciate everything that everybody is doing. Yes all kits have their issues. I just don't see the point of bashing a company like R2 as some here are doing.


BTW: Sorry everyone, I know I've been commenting on everything under the sun the last couple of days. I just had knee surgery and have to keep my leg elevated. Once I figure out how to build models on my back, my postings will go back down.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Wow, Frank is putting in a good word for the competition. The true sign of a great business man who knows how to run a company and treat the customers with respect!


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## Moebius (Mar 15, 2007)

ClubTepes said:


> Frank, I wouldn't really call the engineering of a kit a small issue as it directly affects ease of assembly, and thus building experience of the customer. I'm curious, are you or your people here doing the parts breakdown, or are the people in China


China does all of that after we give them a basic breakdown. It's all done in the software though from the 3d files, not manually by human decisions. Unless you consider the programming a human decision. It's set up to make the tooling as easy and cost effective as possible.



ClubTepes said:


> And as I said, I appreciate everything that everybody is doing. Yes all kits have their issues. I just don't see the point of bashing a company like R2 as some here are doing.


I don't see the point either. At this point it's all speculation. Wait until they announce something if it's going to be bashed. Has anything been officially cancelled? Nope. I hope everyone gives them a chance to at least explain it before they get lynched. Then I guess the bones will lay where they may...

But hey, it doesn't bother me that there are issues with kits here and there. When I was able to build, it gave a challenge. Everything from Moebius that I have built so far hasn't been challenging. Now something challenging, I have this Kotobukiya EVA kit with all these springs and balls, that is supposed to be posable....


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## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

that's probably the classiest thing I've ever seen on these boards.

Well done, Frank. :thumbsup:


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

I know my thoughts on this subject are controversial and most likely not appreciated, but the truth of the matter is; I love surprises! Then again I like surprise parties.
Personnaly I wish the companies would shut up completely about announcing kits until they are ready for market. ( I know....Blasphemy!) No watch pot doesn't boil, no pacing the floors, no gnashing of teeth. Surprise me! In the mean time...I'll build what I have. Just my 2 cents worth! (Kicks soapbox into corner...)


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

Moebius said:


> The breakdowns are basically done by the software to make the tooling work easiest. We could complicate it, but then the price goes up. Can't make everyone happy. Either we do something that will sell to the most amount of people we can at a a price that is within reason, or we worry about the few guys that will complain about something small like how it's engineered. Galactica has issues? What kit doesn't?
> 
> I've pretty much stayed out of all the talk on Round 2, as the majority of it is so far off. I know they have announcements coming, why not wait to see what the official word is when they speak again? It's not an easy business to be in today, and I'm sure they read some of this and wonder why they try if so many people are unhappy with something they obviously have no control over.


I liked the good old days when you didn't know something was coming out until you saw on the shelf in the hobby shop. Knowing something is coming a year in advance kind of takes away the thrill of finding a new kit in the local hobby shop. Of course the flipside is if you know ahead of time a kit is coming and will be expensive it gives you time to "save up". 
I don't bash any company that is giving us something that we would never see otherwise, sure Round 2 has had problems but in this economy who hasn't? I don't really understand why Round 2 has been singled out when seemingly everyone has delays of one kind or another, if I were running that company, all the negative comments I see here would be enough to make me just quit. 
If the nuE is released, I will buy one, if it isn't, it is not the end of the world. There are people who want a 1:35 Spindrift, I am one of them but I understand the economics of why that is not happening right now and possibly may never happen. There are people who want a 1:350 Original Enterprise, again, I am one of them but I don't want to see the company providing it go under to get it. 
There are plenty of kits I would Like to see made but if the company, any company, that produces the kit goes under to provide what I want right now, who will be there to give us more later?


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## Shaw (Jan 9, 2005)

kenlee said:


> ...
> I don't really understand why Round 2 has been singled out when seemingly everyone has delays of one kind or another, if I were running that company, all the negative comments I see here would be enough to make me just quit.
> ...


You know, it is funny... I produced a lot of stuff (drawings and plans) for free for people, and yeah, when I got a certain negativity back from some people (usually for not producing things fast enough) I called it quits. But the important distinction there is that I was doing it _for free_.

Round 2 is a business. This is how they make money. If they are willing to stop making money (putting food on their tables and keeping roofs over their heads) because their feelings are hurt, then they shouldn't be in this business. If customers telling you what they want is a bad thing, then you must be doing something wrong with your business model.

On the flip side, I find it funny that there are people treating these companies (or even product lines) like sports teams... blindly rooting for or against them. If these businesses do well, great. If they don't, that is fine too... other companies will step in to fill the void.

Round 2 hasn't done anything _for us_. Round 2 hasn't done anything _against us_. They are a business, and they should be in this to make money. They shouldn't need _warm and fuzzy_ sentiments from us, they should sell us stuff we will buy that is good enough to make sure that we will buy more in the future if they sell something else we want.

Customers can take all this as personally as they want... they are, after all, individuals. But Round 2 is a business, and they had best stick to what is good business (and a business with _hurt feelings_ isn't a good business).

If I could make money doing drawings and plans... well, first of all, I could devote real time to the effort... but I also wouldn't really care what people said because I'd be getting paid for my work. It would be a business. I'd take cash over _warm and fuzzy_ sentiments any day of the week. :thumbsup:


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## Marco Scheloske (May 16, 2000)

Hm... I just wrote an e-mail to Round 2 via their website contact form tool, and a few minutes later I got this:

"Hi. This is the qmail-send program at round2corp.com.
I'm afraid I wasn't able to deliver your message to the following addresses.
This is a permanent error; I've given up. Sorry it didn't work out.

<[email protected]>:
216.69.186.201 failed on DATA command.
Remote host said: 550 5.7.1 SPF unauthorized mail is prohibited."

Can it be that there is more wrong with Round 2 as just the disappeared JJprise?


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## modelsj (May 12, 2004)

Basically it is none of our business how they do business. The modern age of internet has made available everyone AND their thoughts. They do not need to run anything by us or solicate our approval. Sometimes I bet they wished they stayed off the net.... ooops, back to my playmates.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

modelsj said:


> Basically it is none of our business how they do business. The modern age of internet has made available everyone AND their thoughts. They do not need to run anything by us or solicate our approval. Sometimes I bet they wished they stayed off the net.... ooops, back to my playmates.


The thing is, they CHOSE to be on the internet, no one forced them. Some people love Ford trucks, others, Dodge. Neither company pouts about the bad things that are said about them, they set out to correct them, that is how business works. It is ALL about image and how much a customer is valued, if a customer feels like they are ignored, they will take their business elsewhere. That is capitalism! If you want to keep your customers, you cater to them, you don't shut them out. You can't let your ego run your business. We don't own anyone our business/money, that has to be earned by the product!


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## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

E-mail: [email protected]
Phone: Work 574-243-3000
Fax: Fax 574-243-3003


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## Marco Scheloske (May 16, 2000)

Magesblood said:


> E-mail: [email protected]


I know.

Strangely enough I got ALSO the message meanwhile:

"> Betreff: Thank you for contacting Round 2 Models

> 
> Date: 1-4-2011 6:54am
> 
> Round 2 Models has recieved your request. If requested, we will respond to
> your e-mail as soon as possible."

:freak:

Seems to be a problem in their in-company mailing system. I wonder if anybody will read my message there?


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## drmcoy (Nov 18, 2004)

well, i was really hoping the JJ Enterprise model was being released, as I held off buying any other incarnations of it (not that there were many to choose from).

bottom line, I loved the movie, I liked the new ship design, and I wanted SOME version of it (model or toy) that was under 20-inches that I could set on the shelf in my "man cave." Despite the delays, I was willing to wait out the arrival of the Round 2 model kit, which I first saw announced at Wonderfest a year or two ago.

Looks like it might not happen, so I went ahead and purchased the special DVD release that has a little Enterprise model in it that holds the DVDs in saucer section. I know it is not 100% accurate, but it is the best I've seen that cost under $50 and will be a nice representation of the ship to set out for display...plus I get the movie in Blu-Ray format.

I would have preferred the Round 2, and if it comes out, I'll still get it, but I decided to get the DVD display model as I don't forsee anything else coming out that I can afford between now and the next movie release -- provided the next movie even uses the same design.

And yes, I have the Playmates toy, which is ok, but I have it on display at my office. The Hotwheels diecast just didn't look quite right...and they are hard to find for under $40, and I don't think they are worth $15, let alone $40.

The QmX ones look very cool, but not sure I can afford $500-plus for a model, and it may be too large for me to display.

I've rambled on enough.


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## Seashark (Mar 28, 2006)

Shaw said:


> **Snip**
> 
> Round 2 is a business. This is how they make money. If they are willing to stop making money (putting food on their tables and keeping roofs over their heads) because their feelings are hurt, then they shouldn't be in this business. If customers telling you what they want is a bad thing, then you must be doing something wrong with your business model.
> 
> ...


Well said Shaw, I agree with this completely and have been quite confounded with this behavior.


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## Tiberious (Nov 20, 2001)

You know, it is apparent that we have short memories or are simply rather ungrateful as a group (not all of us, but many...) I remember these boards (and others) during the design phase of the 1/350 TMP Enterprise. Polar Lights crew were forthcoming and welcoming of design points/suggestions and advice. The result was the most accurate, to date, kit ever produced. I don't give a tinker's damn about the JJPrise, but I haven't forgotten the devotion that PL showed this classic kit, and the LAST thing I want to see is the company shut us out of their world because of the constant negativity.
Many of you have come forward with positive remarks, I hope that Round 2 takes the positive as well as the negative and will release a statement at some point in the near future, whether or not we're owed one.

Tib


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## DL Matthys (May 8, 2004)

Bussiness huh?
Considering the US Supreme Court ruling on Citizens United.
Send them checks...Try bribery...cash whip them to do our bidding.
:thumbsup:

DLM


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## sunburn800 (Nov 24, 2006)

Just to clear a few things up. first up i don't hate the Nu Enterprise i just think it could have been done much better like the other ships from the moive.Secondly i really liked the movie i thought the characters were the best part. and last but not least i have a playmates Nu enterprise, she has some nice angles not many mind you but a few.To those waiting on the model from Round Two good luck. Now where did i put my car keys?


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## fortress (Apr 1, 2006)

They killed of the subject from where I stand, that's the only thing that
makes any sense, now they are waiting for the mob to calm down while
they wait to post a announcement. Have we not seen this pattern before,
it happened allot last year and not just with RC2. It's business folks, nothing
personal in the end.

Anyway somebody out there will do it, subject like that, it's only a matter
of time.


fortress:dude:


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## chiangkaishecky (Oct 4, 2000)

So any theories why this got disappeared?


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

fortress said:


> They killed of the subject from where I stand, that's the only thing that makes any sense, now they are waiting for the mob to calm down while
> they wait to post a announcement. Have we not seen this pattern before, it happened allot last year and not just with RC2. It's business folks, nothing personal in the end.
> 
> Anyway somebody out there will do it, subject like that, it's only a matter of time.


Mob? A few dozen Star Trek traditionalists on a bulletin board is a mob? :freak:










Jim
(mad as hell and ready to storm the R2 castle)


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## fire91bird (Feb 3, 2008)

chiangkaishecky said:


> So any theories why this got disappeared?


I think there are about four threads full of theories and speculation.  My favorite so far is the cancellations are to help fund the 1/350 TOS/E. But I imagine you're looking for something more substantial than theories in which case I suspect both the new E and the 1/350 E will all be part of the Wonderfest announcement mentioned by Round 2.


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## loneranger (Sep 5, 2002)

Could it be, perhaps, that the photo attached here is the reason why R2 might be reconsidering releasing the 09 Big E in April? I know Tobias Richter is getting pretty well known in VFX circles, and in speaking with the designer of the 09 Big E last year, it seemed as though there were disagreements about the perspectives and the shapes themselves, not to mention the conjectural size of the vessel. So *perhaps* R2 is looking at redoing the model to make the proportions more TOS-like.


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

loneranger said:


> Could it be, perhaps, that the photo attached here is the reason why R2 might be reconsidering releasing the 09 Big E in April? I know Tobias Richter is getting pretty well known in VFX circles, and in speaking with the designer of the 09 Big E last year, it seemed as though there were disagreements about the perspectives and the shapes themselves, not to mention the conjectural size of the vessel. So *perhaps* R2 is looking at redoing the model to make the proportions more TOS-like.



That would definitely be an improvement. Doesn't address all my gripes about the ship, but it's an improvement!


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## Seashark (Mar 28, 2006)

I too think that is an improvment, push the nacelles apart and I could _almost_ like it!


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

The only problem I had with the design is the shallow undercut to the secondary hull. I view it for what it was built for. Unlike the timeline of the original series, in which the Enterprise and all of Starfleet centered around exploration, in the new timeline, ships were built to defend against whatever destroyed the Kelvin. I see the beefed up shielding around the warp nacelles as extra protection for the engines, as well as all the other oversized aspect of the design. But then I always could think “outside the box”. Remember, this was a reboot by Paramount so they no longer had to deal with all fan "garbage" about the franchise. This is now their baby, Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek is over. You want that, dive into the Blu-Rays!


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

RSN said:


> Remember, this was a reboot by Paramount so they no longer had to deal with all fan "garbage" about the franchise. This is now their baby, Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek is over. You want that, dive into the Blu-Rays!


Thats how I look at it. After seeing Trek 09, I feel the story worked.
JJ Prise design aside, my only nit that holds any water is that the Kelvin should have been an original TOS design as the timeline had JUST been interrupted. So nothing should have been different at that point. After that, the divergence in the timeline is free to wander.

And I agree, TOS will always be there to go back and enjoy on DVD.

Just as I'm enjoying TOS BSG on DVD as I type this.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

ClubTepes said:


> Thats how I look at it. After seeing Trek 09, I feel the story worked.
> JJ Prise design aside, my only nit that holds any water is that the Kelvin should have been an original TOS design as the timeline had JUST been interrupted. So nothing should have been different at that point. After that, the divergence in the timeline is free to wander.
> 
> And I agree, TOS will always be there to go back and enjoy on DVD.
> ...


Agreed! Again thinking "outside the box", the Kelvin was a pre divergence design, but only pre divergence from the TOS, TNG, DS9 and Voyager timeline. The Kelvin design could have been the result of the time alterations in the "Enterprise" series timeline! This type of mess is why Paramount did the reboot!


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

Arronax said:


> Mob? A few dozen Star Trek traditionalists on a bulletin board is a mob? :freak:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Have fun storming the castle .... :lol:

Sorry ... couldn't resist!


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## Captain_April (Oct 20, 2002)

Strange that you still pre-order the kit from the StarTrek.com store? The film was great and the ship has grown on me, but I still wanted a larger kit, closer to the size of the old Ertl Refit.


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## James Tiberius (Oct 23, 2007)

this covers the majority of TOS hardcore fans:


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

"Trekkies" alone are not enough for a film to make a profit. It has to appeal to a wide audience. A perfect example, “Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home" versus "Star Trek: Nemesis"! I used to run Star Trek conventions and even I didn’t go see the last two TNG “train wrecks” , but I couldn’t wait to see the reboot and I can’t wait to see the sequel!


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

The Onion piece is the perfect take on these arguments as far as I'm concerned. When you "listen to the fans" you get a movie crammed with fanboy in-jokes that has nothing to offer a general audience--or, in the final analysis, fans.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

Love the _Onion_ piece. Sometimes we take ourselves waaay too seriously.


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## James Tiberius (Oct 23, 2007)

thought it would be appropriate, glad you guys liked it.


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