# In the Works........



## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Coming along according to Frank......1/32.


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## Xenodyssey (Aug 27, 2008)

Please have a cockpit, preferably with 3 Cylons sitting inside....


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Nice CAD. It would be nice to see the 2 lights or guns at the front (can't remember exactly what they were) done in transparent plastic too. 

And if there's any other parts that should be transparent on the Viper and Galactica so they can be lit up.


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

SUNGOD said:


> Nice CAD. It would be nice to see the 2 lights or guns at the front (can't remember exactly what they were) done in transparent plastic too.
> 
> And if there's any other parts that should be transparent on the Viper and Galactica so they can be lit up.


Like this?

http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/100_1256.JPG

Easily done with a couple of strands of Fiber optic and a single light source inside the hull.


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

This particular kit was announced months ago so you see it's old news.:wave:


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

irishtrek said:


> This particular kit was announced months ago so you see it's old news.:wave:


Yes, but the CAD image that was reposted here from the Moebius Facebook page in NEW NEWS! :thumbsup:


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

kenlee said:


> Like this?
> 
> http://photos.hobbytalk.com/data/509/100_1256.JPG
> 
> Easily done with a couple of strands of Fiber optic and a single light source inside the hull.





That's it..nice. Were they guns or lights, it's years since I've watched the show?


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

SUNGOD said:


> That's it..nice. Were they guns or lights, it's years since I've watched the show?


I always assumed them to be lights since the guns are mounted in the forward edge of the wing trenches.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

So, at 1/32 scale that would make the wingspan, what, about 19"?


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Xenodyssey said:


> Please have a cockpit, preferably with 3 Cylons sitting inside....


Frank, on the company's facebook page, posted this reply to someone asking for the same thing: 

"No cockpit, but I know there's an aftermarket company working on one soon enough. With costs getting so high on tooling, it's been hard to get some of the details like that included. Especially since there's so much in the cockpit."

Also, when asked wither the canopy would be molded in clear:

"...it will be a solid piece unless we can get the tooling slightly changed. Worst thing is with no interior the openings are almost useless. If we don't open them, I'm sure when an interior comes on the market there will be a new "windshield"."

So, if you want an interior, be prepared to spend more $$$ since it will be available as a separate kit from the aftermarket.


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## Xenodyssey (Aug 27, 2008)

Yeap, that as me on the Facebook page. 

I'll be doing my own cockpit and canopy I guess. It was good of Frank to reply so quickly, at least we know where we stand and it gives an opening to the 3rd party people if they didn't already know. Unless there are blueprints or set photos out there somewhere of the Raider's cockpit I guess I'll be doing frame grabs and make up the details as needed. 

Would like to see some 3rd party Cylon pilots at least. My sculpting skills aren't so hot.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I am hoping an aftermarket will also make the ventral exit and landing gear- you only saw a suggestion of them in one episode (where they sneak onboard a Basestar in one)...


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Xenodyssey said:


> Yeap, that as me on the Facebook page.
> 
> I'll be doing my own cockpit and canopy I guess. It was good of Frank to reply so quickly, at least we know where we stand and it gives an opening to the 3rd party people if they didn't already know. Unless there are blueprints or set photos out there somewhere of the Raider's cockpit I guess I'll be doing frame grabs and make up the details as needed.
> 
> Would like to see some 3rd party Cylon pilots at least. My sculpting skills aren't so hot.


Try to find someone with the studio scale kit from a few years back.It came with the cockpit and the three Cylons.


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## Bwain no more (May 18, 2005)

Frank (and Dave) are both kit builders themselves and I know firsthand how painful some of these decisions are for them to make. The really cool thing though is how helpful (bend over BACKWARDS in most cases) they are with the aftermarket folks, giving early access to info and test shots so the add-ons are available when the kit hits the streets. :thumbsup:
Tom


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

This ^


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

kenlee said:


> I always assumed them to be lights since the guns are mounted in the forward edge of the wing trenches.




That's what I thought. 

Whilst it would have been nice to see Moebius do 3 Cylons for the cockpit I'm more interested in seeing those 2 lights done in clear plus a plastic pilot for the Viper as the Raiders had blacked out windows anyway. 

In fact the Raider windows look more like some sort of blinds/shield than a window.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

SUNGOD said:


> That's what I thought.
> 
> Whilst it would have been nice to see Moebius do 3 Cylons for the cockpit I'm more interested in seeing those 2 lights done in clear plus a plastic pilot for the Viper as the Raiders had blacked out windows anyway.
> 
> In fact the Raider windows look more like some sort of blinds/shield than a window.


Won't be able to see too much thru the slats anyway. Besides, the cockpit's not that much to look at. Love the Lazy Boy's, if anything, the Cylons understood the value of comfortable seats for long flights!


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

Zombie_61 said:


> So, at 1/32 scale that would make the wingspan, what, about 19"?


The old Monogram kit was close to 1/32 scale and the windspan was no where near 19 inches, provided I'm remembering right.


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

irishtrek said:


> The old Monogram kit was close to 1/32 scale and the windspan was no where near 19 inches, provided I'm remembering right.


Incorrect.It is a guess at 1/64 scale.If you take a 1/32 sitting pilot from any plane model,you would see that you could not possibly get three of them in that cockpit.


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

SUNGOD said:


> In fact the Raider windows look more like some sort of blinds/shield than a window.


IIRC, I recall reading that the overlapping blinds or slats on the filming miniature were cut-down interior wall panels from the Aurora/Monogram Invaders UFO kit.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

irishtrek said:


> The old Monogram kit was close to 1/32 scale and the windspan was no where near 19 inches, provided I'm remembering right.





falcondesigns said:


> Incorrect.It is a guess at 1/64 scale.If you take a 1/32 sitting pilot from any plane model,you would see that you could not possibly get three of them in that cockpit.


I always assumed the Revellogram Cylon Raider was "box scale", but I knew it wasn't 1/32. After doing a little Google research, it appears the popular consensus is 1/60.

Getting back to the Moebius kit, if I'm right about the 19" wingspan that'll be a deal-breaker for me, because I barely have the storage/display space for the Revellogram kit, and I'm sure Moebius' Raider will be much larger at 1/32 scale.


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## Lou Dalmaso (Jul 13, 2004)

it's going to be the size of Salzo's GK it. which is to scale with the existing Viper.

those invader UFO parts are not the slats themselves, but do sit just outside on each side of the slat structure.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

spock62 said:


> Won't be able to see too much thru the slats anyway. Besides, the cockpit's not that much to look at. Love the Lazy Boy's, if anything, the Cylons understood the value of comfortable seats for long flights!




Yes they look as if they have a narrow vision through those slats. It looks like the top parts ( the slats) are solid and the Cylons see through each narrow gap.

There again it's hard to tell from all the photos, even those which are clearer than most. Maybe Moebius should just do the whole window in clear and people can mask off the slats etc?


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I think in some behind the scenes footage the slats appeared to be smoked plexiglass on the full scale set.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Lou Dalmaso said:


> it's going to be the size of Salzo's GK it. which is to scale with the existing Viper.


I suspected as much. Oh well, another great kit I'll have to pass on. Thanks!


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Richard Baker said:


> I think in some behind the scenes footage the slats appeared to be smoked plexiglass on the full scale set.




Could well be. They would have much better vision from the cockpit then. Might be an idea for Moebius to do the whole window section in smoked clear.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

SUNGOD said:


> Could well be. They would have much better vision from the cockpit then. Might be an idea for Moebius to do the whole window section in smoked clear.


Frank has said that there would be no interior and therefore NO reason on their part to make the canopy anything other than solid UNLESS they could change the tooling. Meaning if they can do it without excess cost to the kit. for me there is no need for a clear or semi-opaque window if the kit has no cockpit.


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Except that you know somebody's going to make an aftermarket cockpit, so a clear canopy would be nice, rather than it having to be an AM part as well.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

I don't care about an interior. Why should I have to pay more for a kit that will have a clear window looking in at nothing? If someone wants it clear, they can pay the extra on the after market front. I'll take it the way Moebius makes it, I won't presume to tell them what they should do! :thumbsup:


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

RSN said:


> ...Why should I have to pay more for a kit that will have a clear window looking in at nothing?...





RSN said:


> ...Meaning if they can do it without excess cost to the kit...


Did I say anything about extra cost?


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

Paulbo said:


> Did I say anything about extra cost?


You didn't, Moebius did. Changing the tooling, i.e. seperating the cockpit window from the tree mold it is on now and making it a seperate mold that could be done in clear. If this adds too much cost to the kit, which would have to be passed on to the customer, ME, then they will not do it for something that serves no purpose on a kit they designed with no interior to begin with. :thumbsup:


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

While I'm OK with the kit having no interior, I think Moebius should have considered doing this. This is a 1/32 kit, about 19" dia. In this scale, most people would assume some sort of interior is included. At the very least, the clear canopy should be in the kit as the difference between a clear canopy with solid slats and the whole canopy being solid WILL be noticeable in that scale.

As for cost, any aftermarket interior/clear canopy, will likely cost the same price or more then the cost of the raider kit. Whereas, if these items had been engineered into the kit, the kit would have been more, but surely not as much as separate aftermarket parts would add to the overall cost. For example, when Revell re-issued the Cylon Raider kit, it cost around $21. An aftermarket interior/clear canopy kit is available, for about $25, a little more then the price of the raider kit. So, if you want an interior in your Revell kit, the total cost goes from $21 to $46! Quite a jump.

While I understand that people who don't want an interior, don't want to pay for the extra parts they wouldn't use, there are other people who do want an interior and would pay for the price increase to include them. For instance, I tend to build my aircraft models in flight on a home made stand. The included landing gear parts and the detail put into them are useless to me. The kit costs more to include them, yet I don't use the parts. But, since others DO use the landing gear parts, I have no problem with this.


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Your logic escapes me......


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

falcondesigns said:


> Your logic escapes me......


Assuming you meant my comment, how so?


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Well Moebius kits aren't expensive anyway so if they do decide to go in that direction then count me in. I don't mind paying more for extra detail etc.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

It just amazes me that people can't just accept a product as announced by the manufacturer, who is in business to make a product that will make the return on the money he himself invests into the development, production and release of the kit. There will be no interior, deal with it! There may or may not be a clear/semi-opaque window, deal with it! Buy it or don't buy it based on what is in the box on the shelf. Everyone thinks they know how to run a business better than someone who is running a VERYsuccessful one right now! :thumbsup:


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

RSN said:


> I don't care about an interior. Why should I have to pay more for a kit that will have a clear window looking in at nothing? If someone wants it clear, they can pay the extra on the after market front.


No one is telling Frank HOW to run his business. Your real concern is that since YOU don't want an interior, you shouldn't have to pay extra for one if it were included in the kit. Seems to me that people that would like an interior, but know that none will be provided, are dealing with it just fine.

All I'm saying is that, while I don't care wither or not there is an interior (though I would like a clear molded canopy), I can understand those that would like it included. Would the kit cost more? Sure it would. Would the total cost be more if you had to buy an aftermarket interior kit? I almost positive it would, based on what's happened before. Would the cost of the kit, if an interior was engineered to be included in the first place, had been cheaper then buying the kit and interior separate of each other? I would think it would had been cheaper, but maybe the cost of materials/labor/etc has risen so high that the aftermarket route would cost the same. I'm not sure in this, are you?

For example, when the Viper Mk VII was released, the cockpit was lacking in detail and accuracy, and that's putting it mildly. An aftermarket photo etch kit was released which is very detailed an accurate. Price of the kit is around $30, the photo etch around $32. So, if you want your Viper kit to have a cockpit that's worth putting in it, the total cost to you doubles. Had the cockpit been done correctly to begin with (similar to what was done with their MK II kit), you would be able to save $32, unless you wanted to take the kit to the next level in detail with the photo etch.

By the way, I don't think the Cylon Raider kit will be considered inexpensive. This is a 1/32, 19"+ dia. kit, bigger then their Flying Sub kit I believe. At today's prices, it will probably cost $75+. So, if you want an interior, and that aftermarket kit is even 1/2 of the price of the Moebius kit, your looking at something like an extra $37.50 for the aftermarket kit. Not exactly cheap. These numbers are assumptions, but you get the idea.

But what really gets me is that whenever someone deviates from the "all things Moebius are perfect" mantra, there's always a minority of individuals that go into attack mode. Aren't differing opinions allowed here, as long as they are non-abrasive?


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

It does not matter to me if the Moebius Cylon Raider comes without a cockpit interior. Unless the canopy is left removable the interior will be virtually unseen, even with a molded clear canopy. To me, since you could not see an interior on the filming model the issue is irrelevant. With the Vipers you could see a representation of an interior on the filming model so on that kit I would want a cockpit included in the model kit. To me it is not a necessary element to be included in the Raider kit to get a good representation of what was seen in the show. Either way I will buy and build this model when it comes out. If the model does not come with a cockpit and I decide that I want one I am quite capable of whipping one up for myself.


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

kenlee said:


> It does not matter to me if the Moebius Cylon Raider comes without a cockpit interior. Unless the canopy is left removable the interior will be virtually unseen, even with a molded clear canopy. To me, since you could not see an interior on the filming model the issue is irrelevant. With the Vipers you could see a representation of an interior on the filming model so on that kit I would want a cockpit included in the model kit. To me it is not a necessary element to be included in the Raider kit to get a good representation of what was seen in the show. Either way I will buy and build this model when it comes out. If the model does not come with a cockpit and I decide that I want one I am quite capable of whipping one up for myself.


A true voice of reason and simply said! :thumbsup:


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

spock62 said:


> But what really gets me is that whenever someone deviates from the "all things Moebius are perfect" mantra, there's always a minority of individuals that go into attack mode. Aren't differing opinions allowed here, as long as they are non-abrasive?


Well.....aparently only if they stand for one ponit of view, it would seem. I am just expressing mine freely.....in an open forum, nothing more and nothing personal toward those who make demands. Have fun with them, but that is why Frank moved to Facebook! And yes, I am loyal to my friends, not ashamed to admit it. I am proud Frank is my friend and with the fact that he shares future project information with me! :thumbsup:


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

RSN said:


> Well.....aparently only if they stand for one ponit of view, it would seem. I am just expressing mine freely.....in an open forum, nothing more and nothing personal toward those who make demands. Have fun with them, but that is why Frank moved to Facebook! And yes, I am loyal to my friends, not ashamed to admit it. I am proud Frank is my friend and with the fact that he shares future project information with me! :thumbsup:


Your right, when it's YOUR point of view. I understand and can appreciate BOTH points of view. 

And what, exactly, has your friendship with Frank have to do with anything? No one here has said anything against the man or his company. Re-read the last sentence in my last post, it has to do with people who treat others somewhat harshly for having a differing view of Moebius products then they hold. The fact that you consider him a friend and he shares future product info, well good for you. Doesn't have anything to do with this conversation.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Have to agree with spock62 RSN. Nobody's attacking Moebius or telling them how to run their business here. Just a couple of guys saying what they'd like to see or not see that's all. What's the point in these forums otherwise?


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

SUNGOD said:


> Have to agree with spock62 RSN. Nobody's attacking Moebius or telling them how to run their business here. Just a couple of guys saying what they'd like to see or not see that's all. What's the point in these forums otherwise?


I never said anyone was "attacking" Moebius, that inference was read into my posts by spock62. My thoughts were about not understanding where people were coming from on the "Clear Window" side of the discussion. My opposite point of view to his is exactly what this forum is for and I thought we where debating our opinions.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

RSN said:


> I never said anyone was "attacking" Moebius, that inference was read into my posts by spock62. My thoughts were about not understanding where people were coming from on the "Clear Window" side of the discussion. My opposite point of view to his is exactly what this forum is for and I thought we where debating our opinions.


My comment refers to this one you made:


RSN said:


> Everyone thinks they know how to run a business better than someone who is running a VERYsuccessful one right now! :thumbsup:


Granted you didn't use the word "attacking", but it seems pretty clear you don't appreciate a less then positive point of view regarding a Moebius kit. After all, who are we, since we don't run a model kit company? The nerve! 

Again, I feel the clear window should be in the kit for (2) reasons:
a) If someone ever wants to buy the aftermarket interior or has mad scratch-building skills, then a clear window is a necessity. As has been mentioned before, it would eliminate having to buy this piece aftermarket.

b)At this scale, even this louvered window, however hard to see into, would be noticeable if it were not clear. Clear windows look like clear windows. Opaque windows that are painted look like a giant piece of painted plastic. Not a good look at all, especially in this scale.

Unfortunately, the kit is already designed for an opaque window part/s, so that's the way it's going to be. Not a deal breaker, but IMHO, a kit of this scale and detail would have been better served with the clear windows/painted louvers instead. I'm sure it will sell quite well regardless of the lack of a window/interior


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## RSN (Jul 29, 2008)

That was always my point, the kit is already parted out as a solid plastic window and Frank answered someones question on Facebook about it being clear, saying that if was possible to change the tooling without adding cost to make that a part seperate tree and clear, they would look into it. I think enough has been said about something that is, for the most part a done deal.

And by the way, I include myself in the comment that I made that you highlighted as far as me posting my views on what Moebius should or shouldn't do. I also second guess what they might be thinking and get corrected for it by Frank. No big deal when it happens, all part of having an opinion.


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## Uxi (Feb 11, 2013)

The size of the raider does remind me how much I wish Moebius could do a smaller scale. I love my jets at 1/72 and would be my preferred scale so I could fit a half dozen Mk II in different schemes...

Not gonna lie, though, I won't be able to resist at least one.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Uxi said:


> The size of the raider does remind me how much I wish Moebius could do a smaller scale...


Oh, they _could_ produce smaller kits. For the time being, I think they're producing larger kits to make it easier for those modelers who want to install lighting and/or other electronic elements in their build-ups. I'd much prefer smaller kits as well (regardless of scale), but it is what it is. I'm happy for the modelers who appear to have unlimited display space, but I'm not one of 'em.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Hang 'em high!


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

spock62 said:


> Assuming you meant my comment, how so?


Please read your own post,then try to figure it out.

Companies don't make models for a specific sections of fans,or modelers,they make them because their is a demand and a profit to be made.If you don't have the space,buy the smaller Revell/Monogram raider,But don't blame the company if they don't produce exactly what you want.Don't like what they offer,fine don't buy it.Want an interior,fine learn the skills to make it your self.An opinion does not give you a vested interest in the company.it's not your money that is taking the risk,it's Moebius.And don't think you can armchair business decisions from your home,you don't know the business,Moebius does......


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I think an aftermarket cockpit would look better personally- clear casting would have some distortion, photoetch slats with an acetate sheet behind them would give you a great view in from the front.
It is going to be a big kit, with lots of room for enhancments- I am looking forward to seeing what people come up with on their builds...


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

falcondesigns said:


> Please read your own post,then try to figure it out.
> 
> Companies don't make models for a specific sections of fans,or modelers,they make them because their is a demand and a profit to be made.If you don't have the space,buy the smaller Revell/Monogram raider,But don't blame the company if they don't produce exactly what you want.Don't like what they offer,fine don't buy it.Want an interior,fine learn the skills to make it your self.An opinion does not give you a vested interest in the company.it's not your money that is taking the risk,it's Moebius.And don't think you can armchair business decisions from your home,you don't know the business,Moebius does......


First, I never said anything about the size of the kit. 

Second, I'm not "blaming" Moebius for not producing the kit in a manner I'd like, I just have an opinion, nothing more, nothing less. 

As for your usual speech about "armchair business decisions" and "you don't know business", tell it to someone who cares. Just because someone is not in the "business", doesn't mean they can not have a worthwhile opinion. If that were the case, most of the posters here shouldn't post.

This forum is, in part, is for people to post their opinions, positive or negative regarding the hobby we care about. I'm not expecting everyone to agree with me, nor should they expect me to agree with them. It's a discussion and as long as it's a civil one, no one should have problems with it. But, apparently, you do, since you seem to feel that anyone who dares to disagree with a decision made by Moebius is someone that must be lectured to.

While I disagree with RSN's opinion regarding the interior/canopy, I do respect his opinion. Your comments, on the other hand, are just an excuse to put a person down, and that deserves no respect.

Next time, try not to make assumptions about people and talk down to them. If you don't know what I mean, then take your own advice: PLEASE READ YOUR OWN POST, THEN TRY TO FIGURE IT OUT!


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

The size issue was directed at another post.I thought I was very civil in responding to you.If I were going to "put someone down" I would not have wasted my time posting.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Richard Baker said:


> ...photoetch slats with an acetate sheet behind them would give you a great view in from the front...


Would you even need the acetate sheet? Did the original filming models have anything other than the slats?


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I was figuring on the ship as in use as opposed to the filming sets/miniature. It held air since humans could travel in them also, so having some sort of transparent sheet behind them would seem logical to my eye when I build it.
From what I have seen in the DVD extras the actual full scale cockpit filming set had smoked plex slats if you wanted to follow things that closely.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Richard Baker said:


> I was figuring on the ship as in use as opposed to the filming sets/miniature. It held air since humans could travel in them also, so having some sort of transparent sheet behind them would seem logical to my eye when I build it.
> From what I have seen in the DVD extras the actual full scale cockpit filming set had smoked plex slats if you wanted to follow things that closely.


That makes sense. I had forgotten about that last episode in which Apollo and Starbuck flew the captured Raider into the Basestar; the cockpit would _have_ to be enclosed. Thanks!


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Posted today on their Facebook page.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Oh my! I might _have_ to find room for _that_ one!


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## SJF (Dec 3, 1999)

Very nice! Looking forward to getting this one. 

Sean


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## RMC (Aug 11, 2004)

*bsg raider*

wow,...that looks really cool !


falcondesigns said:


> Posted today on their Facebook page.


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## actias (May 19, 2003)

Beautiful. Any mention of a potential release window?:thumbsup:


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