# Is The Polar Lights Era Over????



## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

WHAT IS TO BECOME OF US???
all those great reissues! all those great blasts from the pasts!
man, why cant it just keep going?

WHY????

is the lights in Polar Lights " out "????


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## Rattrap (Feb 23, 1999)

"...not really dead, so long as we remember."
-Dr. Leonard H. McCoy


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## cinc2020 (May 10, 2004)

*Yup*

Yup. It's all over. Pack your bags. Get your affairs in order. Polar Lights is lights out. Over and out. Finished. Through. Finito.

But, maybe not. Maybe this is the result of what the intelligence community calls RUMINT. 

It amazes me how some get so excited about a few bits of plastic that rumors fly and feelings get trounced. 

I, for one, want to get my hands on a 350 Refit, but if I can't I'll move on...


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## Geoff Boaz (Jan 1, 1970)

One aspect of the Polar Lights demise is that we may see the older AURORA kits regain some of their lost value. For those of us (like myself) who collect unbuilt kits this would be nice.

My unbuilt boxed AURORA Lost In Space chariot kit needs to be worshiped and appreciated again. 

Still, I would also have liked to have had more years of Polar Lights repop models being released.


Geoff


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

thats one reason i like the PL models........because the originals are so *&^*#&)# expensive!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## origAurora buyer (Jan 12, 1999)

First there was the Kingdom of PL...and that was followed by the PLBB for all PL's subjects to gather to discuss the monsters that run loose in the country side. The subjects were ruled by Da Queen, Lisa, and her henchman Dave the Horrable. Sometimes we would gather just to watch a witch burning or throw tomatos at a Bellringer or two. Dave used to run around the crowds scaring the un-ruley with his fearce growl and crazy glue.

Then one day Da Queen was banished form the Kingdom of PL. The subjects were angered and many left the Kingdom. The Kingdom didn't know what to do so the remaining subjects started to push each other around and made wish lists. Skunks were allowed into the kingdom and sometimes it just smelled like a swamp in the streets. 

After a few years King Tom decided to sell the Kingdom. The subjects didn't know what to do...nor did they know what was going on. Months passed and then one day the Canadians came down to allow the subjects to basically continue to stand around to burn witches and stuff. 

Then, shortly after the Canadians vanished...and subjects were left standing....once again in the PLBB! Dave the Horrable returned and found the trap door switch...and as soon as he was about to pull it...

Da Queen returned!

Many of the old subjects returned and things started to be like the old days...but..

the subjects and Da Queen have no castle that flys the PL flag. It's no longer the Kingdom of PL. What are they going to talk about when there's no more kits from the Kingdom of PL? 

"What the heck is goin' on!?!" shouts the subjects. "We've run out of witches to burn!" they cry. The echos can be heard through out the country side....and the monsters are listening.

OAB


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## Scott Hasty (Jul 10, 2003)

When did the Aurora era finally end? Well, frankly, I don't think it did. There are still kits on the shelves, re-poped from various manufacturers. The auction sites have endless originals and re-pops of Aurora kits. Okay, maybe most are not currently being produced, but a GREAT deal of them are available from various sources.

PL will live long, regardless of who owns the molds or who decides what mold to inject plastic into.

I was very young in Aurora's hey-day. My fondest memories are of the square-box kits, so I missed out on the really good stuff. BUT, I am VERY thankful to Tom, Dave and Lisa for giving us a piece of our [my] childhood back!

Scottie


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## Otto69 (Jan 2, 2004)

*I'm with Scott.*

Perhaps 'an' era has ended. But 'the' era has not, not as long as the kits are still available and the molds still live. I mean, look at Glencoe, now reproducing, among other things, the old Strombecker-Disney space kits, *from the original molds*.

So as Toshiro Mifune said in one of those samurai movies, "Brace up!"


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

I'll tell you something.....If you search through the bay of e for Polar Lights kits that are no longer produced, then you may find their kits are starting to appreciate in value. Some kits that appear to have appreciated in value already are the C57-D, Jupiter II, and of course the Go Cart. The four original Toys 'R' Us monsters from 1999 and the Monsters Frightening 4-pack have all gone up in price considerably. The Polar Lights era is just beginning.......Someday there may be a story about a freak accident involving the Queen of Styrene being chased by a forklift and damaging many of the original PL molds---including the Yama's Hawg.


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## origAurora buyer (Jan 12, 1999)

That's...

The Queen of Styrene being chased by a forklift driven by the Creature from the Black Lagoon through the warehouse!

Don't leave out the important details, mister.

OAB


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

Shouldn't that be "a forklift ALLEGEDLY driven by the Creature from the Black Lagoon"?

I don't think he was ever convicted.


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## DinoMike (Jan 1, 1970)

I'd have to say Yes, it is indeed over, UNLESS...


... the people in charge at RC2 change their way of thinking.

Let's take the reissue of the existing-mold Star Wars Millenium Falcon kit as an example:

Do I like the ship? Oh yeah.

Will I buy the reissue? No way. I already have several in my stash that I got for under $5 each at a clearance store. I'm sure the same goes for a lot of other kit hounds out there.

Now, let's say RC2 had someone make an accurate master and cut a new mold. 

Would I buy a new-tool, more accurate Falcon? Yep. More than one, in fact.
Would I be willing to pay a little more for it, to offset the new-tooling cost? Sure. (Probably not more than $10 - $20 for a similar-sized kit to the first release.)

Would the kit sell to the general population that they're targeting these reissues for? Probably as much as the reissues would... plus they'd get us "hoarders" as well. With VERY rare exception, the only people who are gonna be buying these kits are people much like those of us on the BB.

RC2 got some decent molds when they purchased AMT/Ertl. Sadly, most of the sci-fi stuff doesn't fall into that category. I gave up on classic Enterprises years ago... I had built that AMT thing so many times over the years that I got sick of messing with everything that needed to be done to it.

I bought 2 PL TOS Enterprises. The refit is on my list too, right at the top! Quality. It's not a dirty word. Granted, it would cost more to make new tools, but I would be shocked to find that a new-tool sci-fi kit of good quality wouldn't do well enough to make a profit for RC2. In fact, a quality kit would probably sell to a lot of the people who gave up on sci-fi kits simply BECAUSE they didn't want to have to do as much work as the old AMT stuff used to require. (Not just as far as accuracy goes... you folks here know how much basic stuff like parts fit suffered on those old things.) Do things "on the cheap", and your sales numbers drop as word gets around. Do things right, and the word of mouth will work FOR you. 

The refit looks great in the prototype & test shot pics. If the actual kit looks (& builds) to a comparable level, I predict that RC2 will like what they see in regards to the sales figures. I hope then they interpret the data to mean not so much that "Trek kits sell" or "large-scale sci-fi kits sell" or even "refit Enterprise kits sell well", but that even in a "niche" market like sci-fi we appreciate good kit engineering & attention to detail, just as much as the military/NASCAR/whatever modelers do.

(Sorry... that rant's been building, had to let it out.):dude:


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## Mitchellmania (Feb 14, 2002)

Polar Lights and this BB will always live as long as we build and post these 
great models and stop whinning!!! Dave and Lisa are here still to carry the 
torch... carry on!!!


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

*The Answer is....*

Ahhh, my wonderful and dearly loved friends. You ask, "Is it over?" Your Queen has but one simple answer. No. It is far from over. It can only be over when the last PL kit, pulled from the shelf of the last stash in this galaxy has been built and to which the last word of praise has been spoken regarding said kit and when the last memory of the joy these amazingly simple things has given you and countless others has faded to nothingness. Then...and only then, will it be over.

Hugs!
Lisa


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

I would say "Yes", it is over.

I certainly could be wrong and _(as a matter of fact)_ I hope that I am.

I think that we shall never again see the *Aurora Monsters* on store shelves ever again.
I don't think that we'll see *Figure Kits* on store shelves again, at least not for a while.

I'm not trying to be negative about all of this, just sharing my feelings.

The way that I see it, we have only a few options...

*1. Build resin figures* (yeah, i know that they cost a lot)
*2. Build cars and other vehicles*.
*3. Build the boxed kits that we've collected and not yet built.*
*4. Leave the hobby and take up the violin.*


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## ChrisW (Jan 1, 1970)

TRENDON said:


> I think that we shall never again see the *Aurora Monsters* on store shelves ever again.


Gotta disagree with that one. In one form or another, the Auroa monster models have turned up time and time again over the years, from Luminators to Wally-world exclusives.
Now, will Revell/Monogram (who owns the molds) get in bed with RC2 (whom I assume holds box copyright) tucked in by Cinemodels (who owns the copyright for the Aurora logo) to produce the repops like we saw a few years ago? My magic 8 ball says "no", but I'm sure there will be reissues on the horizon... And I'd be very suprised if RC2 didn't take advantage of the molds they have now invested in.


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

Well, as I said...
I hope I'm wrong.
I'll now say, I hope that you're right.

I was just thinking along the lines that the kids of today and model building don't seem to mix but, who knows?


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## MonsterModelMan (Dec 20, 2000)

I'd say as long as RC2 is calling the shots...definately a long wait from a figures/monsters/super heroes point of view.

You would think that they would have responded to my request to them about the PL Captain America model contest...after all, it was their kit we were building and promoting. I called and left messages with their product manger, sent e-mails and the like. What do YOU think happened?

MMM


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

I guess a NEW AND DIFFERENT plastic model company needs to be started, and NEW sculptures produced of Frankensteins monster, Dracula, the mummy, Wolfman, CFTBL, the Hunchback, and a bunch of other figures, but 1/6 scale!. 

Next they should do the famous PD rockets from past decades(Gordon, Space Explorers etc) and then produce the 50's and later space ships and subs and end with scenery extras for their kits. You know, like lab gear, landing platforms. Maybe this time they could try....ACCURACY. I'd pay 50-70 bucks for an ACCURATE CFTBL, or Robby, or Seaview, AT-AT, or Ship from Space Explorers.


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## A Taylor (Jan 1, 1970)

>yawn<


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## Mitchellmania (Feb 14, 2002)

>Burp!!< :drunk:


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## beck (Oct 22, 2003)

while it's true PL as a company is gone ( absorbed , if you will ) the " spirit " of PL and Aurora live on in us modellers . 
i don't really care what kids do for hobbies these days . i build models . been doin' it since i was about 7 YO and i ain't stoppin' now .
hb


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## Steve CultTVman Iverson (Jan 1, 1970)

I think as long as RC is selling kits, Polar Lights is alive and well. It may just not be what some of you want it to be. The company has gone through a series of changes ever since it started. This is just one of them. Change is the way of business. Barbie's and Hot Wheels have changed over the years at Mattel. No one has turned out the lights. 

My advice: quit fretting. Hasn't there been enough whining on this board since the sale? 

Build some models.

Steve


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Steve CultTVman Iverson said:


> My advice: quit fretting. Hasn't there been enough whining on this board since the sale?


And more than enough people telling us to quit whining.

The PL era is over. The touchy-feeling sentiment that it "lives as long as..." is all very precious.

PL truly is RC2/AMT/ERTL. 15 years ago, the antecedents of RC2 made Trek and car kits. And more Trek and car kits is what we are getting. PL does not live on in my heart and it doesn't live on as long as people continue to build models and post photos. C'mon, we arent' six year olds. We are over 40 (most of us) and lets be honest adults.

I would truly hope for the return of a company that would fulfill the mission of Polar Lights. I also realize that hoping for somebody else to fulfill my wishes is a formula for dissappointment. I do hope and do maintain some optimism. At the same time, however, I've invested a lot of money in machine tools and scratchbuilding equipment. We may well be in for a period of "every modeler for himself" and I'm getting prepared.


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## fjimi (Sep 29, 2004)

Not over for my life. I'll build to the end and leave my stash to the kids and specifically state they are meant to be built not sold. I'll try to amass as many as possible while in this galaxy, document my builds and processes to pass along-and will urge them to do the same. Hopefully it will last generations. As many have said in other threads, PL brought me straight back to being a kid. The Wolfman build was the most fun I had in 20+ years, the box art almost made me faint. They can put that build in my "long box".

Keep the faith.


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

I HAPPEN TO LIKE WHINING!!!!!!!

it got me thru some tough times!!


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## Steve CultTVman Iverson (Jan 1, 1970)

This thread reminds me of the people that go around saying "I liked Bob Dylan before he changed."

To which I reply, "Which change?"

When he went electric?
After the motor cycle accident?
When he went country?
When he went Christian?
When started the never ending tour?
When he became a Wilbury?
When he jumped the shark?

When you talk about the end of the "Polar Lights era", what do you mean?

When they started doing more original kits?
when they started doing cars?
when Lisa left?
when Jerry went on vacation?
when they started making Star Trek kits?
when they said they ran out of Aurora subjects worth doing?
when they sold to Racing Champs?

I think everyone here has a different take on what the "Polar Lights era" was, if there ever was one. 

It's like.... "Who's your favorite Doctor Who?" or "Who is the best James Bond?" Chances are, the answer to the question is directly tied to what you first encountered be it William Hartnel or Tom Baker as Doctor Who or Sean Connery or Roger Moore for Bond.

For many people, the "Polar Lights era" started with the reissue of the Bride of Frankenstein and is all about monsters. For others it is when they release the Jupiter 2 and is tied to Lost in Space or other Sci-fi. For still others, it was when they started their own line of original kits like the Three Stooges and Big Godzilla. Yet another group thinks of Polar Lights as being great Star Trek models. 

If you have a narrow definition of what constitutes Polar Lights, then you can easily say its over. You could say it died a long time ago. For some others here, you could say its just starting and they are eagar and hopeful to see what's next. 

Hell, even Aurora changed! When did the "Aurora era" end? It ultimately ended when Nabisco liquidated them. So far, that hasn't happend to Polar Lights.

It's not over til its over. 
Steve


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## Roy Kirchoff (Jan 1, 1970)

Y3a said:


> I guess a NEW AND DIFFERENT plastic model company needs to be started, and NEW sculptures produced of Frankensteins monster, Dracula, the mummy, Wolfman, CFTBL, the Hunchback, and a bunch of other figures, but 1/6 scale.


"LAPCO!!!"

RK


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## Matthew Green (Nov 12, 2000)

Yeah, Lapco promised to come out with Jekell's Jalopy; another Monster rod but it only got to production designs and it failed...


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Well, if we get good stuff in the future in a box with a Polar Lights sticker on it, that will be great. I had always wanted to see kits like a Proteus and Planet of the Apes Icarus from Polar Lights. That never happened. However, I did find these ships in lovely resin kits from Wilco Models. So, while I will be disappointed if this is the end of an era ( and I hope it won't be), there are other places where I can get very nice sci fi kits at a fair price.

Huzz


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## Otto69 (Jan 2, 2004)

CultTVman makes a good point. Go check out the Aurora catalogs over the years and you'll see how the changes happened:

http://www.majormattmason.net/aurora/catalogs1.htm

Note the changes when TV shows came out..then faded.

I was briefly in the computer game biz, which is full of artists and such and has overlap with toy companies (the Producer I worked with used to work as Hasbro, etc.) When you're in the business you quickly see that items/people selected for production are tied to temporal events: TV shows, movies, etc. Times change, and kits come and go. There are down times when no new kits "come", but that shouldn't be a problem for those of us who have 80-300 kits in the closet eh?


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Steve CultTVman Iverson said:


> My advice: quit fretting. ...Build some models.


 "Quit fretting" - isn't that one of the reasons for building models, to relax?




Brent Gair said:


> PL...doesn't live on as long as people continue to build models and post photos. C'mon, we arent' six year olds. We are over 40 (most of us) and lets be honest adults.


Brent, you're entitled to your opinion, but you're wrong as far as THIS honest adult is concerned - and I hit 50 today.




Otto69 said:


> ...There are down times when no new kits "come", but that shouldn't be a problem for those of us who have 80-300 kits in the closet eh?


 There ya go! With all the concern about where our next models are going to come _from_, we've been forgetting about the models we already _have_.




Da Queen said:


> Your Queen has but one simple answer. No. It is far from over...


That should have been the last word two pages ago. Not so much because it comes from Our Queen (though that should be enough right there), but because it comes from someone who has every right to trash PL. If Lisa can still sing the company's praises, why not the rest of us, who have only benefitted from its existence?

And the future need not be all gloom and doom. Suppose it turns out that RC2 wants to produce die-cast products and absolutely *nothing *else. What's to stop them from selling the PL part of Playing Mantis and the Aurora molds from Revellogram to someone who *wants* to produce model kits? The motivation to sell would seem to be there, because RC2 apparently isn't isn't interested in producing figure kits.

LAPCO fizzled out, but I have heard from one of its founders that many of the molds from those Aurora projects that never made it to the stores are still in existence. There'd be a treasure trove of new kits for a neo-Aurora outfit to produce. Perhaps such a company might even see fit to repop (giggling like a school girl) Big Frankie, Dr. Jekyll as Mr. Hyde, and the Monster Scenes!

I know that this all sounds like pie in the sky, but Tom Lowe proved that the revival of a classic line of models isn't impossible. On the other hand, the plastic model industry has been down before, but it hasn't been out yet. I spent many long years mourning the demise of Aurora. Since then there have been enormous changes in the industry and the hobby. It's going to take a lot more than RC2's wheeling and dealing to get me started weeping again.


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## Seaview (Feb 18, 2004)

Happy birthday, Mark; half way to a hundred!
Anyway, let's just build what we have, keep one of each mint-in-box until doomsday/reissuing in 2012, appreciate what we already have, and look to other companies for good kits in the future.
This hobby IS a "work in progress", and never really ends. Keep yer chins up!


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## origAurora buyer (Jan 12, 1999)

Matthew Green said:


> Yeah, Lapco promised to come out with Jekell's Jalopy; another Monster rod but it only got to production designs and it failed...


*Just for the record*...Jekell's Jalopy didn't fail. It was designed independently from LAPCO and suggested to LAPCO as a new kit design. It was not commissioned by LAPCO...nor was it requested from LAPCO.

During the time of consideration, by the people of LAPCO, it was printed/published somewhere as an up coming kit from LAPCO _without _knowledge _or_ permission from its designer... (me). No deal or money was ever passed to the independent designer....as the company died shortly after.

I believe that LAPCO was nothing more than a hoax all along. I don't believe that there was anything other than talk, smoke and mirrors.

*Bottom line*:I still, and always did, own the rights to Jekyll's Jalopy. 

It is _not_ dead...it has not failed...it's just waiting to be produced.

OAB


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

BOB DYLAN CHANGED WHEN HE WENT ELECTRIC!!
and then again when he sold out for a commercial!

all i wanna know is, if the reissue craze of Aurora models is over??


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

john guard said:


> ...all i wanna know is, if the reissue craze of Aurora models is over??


To quote John Adams (in the musical _1776_): *NEVAH!!!!*


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## Ignatz (Jun 20, 2000)

Is the Polar Lights Era "Over"? I'm not sure I even know what that means! The company is gone. Assets absorbed. Redundent personelle has been shed. What was once a company is now merely a brand name under RC2 ownership. So in that sense it's really over. Utterly. From a hobbyist's point of view, it's only as "over" as the Aurora era. It's changed, obviously. I just ducked into the local Big Lots and they had a couple of boxes of Godzillas (repop) for $4 each. Conversely, it's getting a bit rarer to simply go to a retailer and picking up a PL repop, and I guess I will miss the anticipation of going to the store under the pretense of scoping out the "next new kit". There'll be no more scuttle to read on this board andr others about what is in store for us in next year's line-up. That was a big part of the fun. Given enough time, we'll be refering to our "vintage" PL kits along with those nice Aurora finds. Last I looked, there were over 43 thousand entries in the hobby model category on Ebay. The PL era maybe over, but it's far from dead!


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## capt Locknar (Dec 29, 2002)

Personally I think its over regardless of what the Old PL employees are saying. They are saying that probably to at least keep the faith. After Researching RC2 for the past couple months, they could really care less about their plastic model divisions or their so called customer service. Their customer service is totally and completely crap. I have never seen a company before that prohibits its retailers so much. The requirements they have are a joke. You can't carry their product (as a new retailer) unless you have been in business for at least 4 years. Oh come on now, how are any new business supposed to get merchandise if they Refuse to sell to them. Kind of makes no sense at all. RC2 is killing their plastic divisions slowly, mainly because in my opinion, the only people building plastic models anymore is us crusty old scrooges lol. The kids sure don't want to do it anymore, Playstation and Nintendo are much more fun. Yes in my opinion PL is gone and gone for good.


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## Rattrap (Feb 23, 1999)

Right now, my local Wal-Mart has five Polar Lights kits in stock: The Dodge Coronet, the Ecto-1, the Back to the Future Time Machine, The Enterprise (no bloody A, B, C, or D) and the Klingon Battle Cruiser.


That's the most Polar Lights kits our Wally World has ever stocked at one time. Pretty good for a "dead" company.


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

In the words of the late, great Roy Orbison: 

_It's Over,_ _It's Over,_ _It's Over, ....... *It's Overrrrrrrrrr!*_



No matter how many threads we post saying the same thing, it's done with. 

And it was wonderful.


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## Dave Metzner (Jan 1, 1970)

Never mind, Brain fade!


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Rattrap said:


> That's the most Polar Lights kits our Wally World has ever stocked at one time. Pretty good for a "dead" company.


Which makes my point...

You just listed three CARS and two TREK kits.

In other words, we are looking at a variation of the old AMT product line.

Remember the Polar Lights kits we bought: The Bride of Frankenstein, Jupiter Two, Lost in Space Robot, The Phantom of the Opera, Michael Meyers, The Wolfman, The Forgotten Prisoner, Seaview, Spindrift, LIS Cyclops, Godzilla, Robby the Robot, The Guillotine, Sleepy Hollow, The Mummy, King Kong...

How many of those did you see on the shelves at Walmart?


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## scifiguy (Oct 19, 1999)

Zorro said:


> In the words of the late, great Roy Orbison:
> 
> _It's Over,_ _It's Over,_ _It's Over, ....... *It's Overrrrrrrrrr!*_
> 
> ...


 I hate RC2 with a passion, they KILL EVERYTHING they get their dirty hands on!!!!


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

refresh my memory, why did PL sell out to RC???


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## Otto69 (Jan 2, 2004)

Um, for money?


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

thats a lousy reason!!
what about loyalty to us modelers??
THATS WHATS WRONG ABOUT THIS COUNTRY! WE FOUGHT THE "SCALE MODEL WARS" SO WE COULD BE FREE FROM CORPORATE TYRANNY!!

WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## MangoMan (Jul 29, 1999)

john guard said:


> thats a lousy reason!!
> what about loyalty to us modelers??
> THATS WHATS WRONG ABOUT THIS COUNTRY! WE FOUGHT THE "SCALE MODEL WARS" SO WE COULD BE FREE FROM CORPORATE TYRANNY!!
> 
> WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Here's a little cheese for your whine


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

Guys, don't worry about a thing.

I have decided that I'm going to win the *Powerball Lottery* and once I do, I'm going to start my own modeling company that produces figure kits.

I'll call it "*Some-Mora Aurora*."

Stay tuned, I let you all know as soon as I win.


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

HA!! i love that name!! brilliant!!

YOU MAY LAUGH AND MOCK ME BUT.....
whining pays! how do you think i got my mom to not toss me out of the house after i turned 18!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

john guard said:


> refresh my memory, why did PL sell out to RC???


 Every man has his price. And apparently Tom Lowe's is very near 24 million dollars.

Mine would be too.


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## beck (Oct 22, 2003)

Trendon , as long as ya put out the Dutch Boy and the Nieuport Bi-plane we'll all be happy .
hb


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

beck said:


> Trendon , as long as ya put out the Dutch Boy and the Nieuport Bi-plane we'll all be happy .
> hb


I figured that I'd start a new line called *"The Hee Haw Scenes."*
Four figures that include Buck Owens, Roy Clark, Grandpa Jones and Junior Samples.
along with a few Hee Haw Dioramas.

The kids will get a kick out of these kits, fer sure.
Here is *Roy Clark!*








Not a very good photo but here's a buildup of the *Buck Owens* figure.


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

was'nt Jr. Samples a porn star?


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

john guard said:


> was'nt Jr. Samples a porn star?


*Gee, I would hope not.*


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

yeeech!! i must be thinking of someone else!


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## Ziz (Feb 22, 1999)

john guard said:


> thats a lousy reason!!
> what about loyalty to us modelers??
> THATS WHATS WRONG ABOUT THIS COUNTRY! WE FOUGHT THE "SCALE MODEL WARS" SO WE COULD BE FREE FROM CORPORATE TYRANNY!!
> 
> WAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





MangoMan said:


> Here's a little cheese for your whine


john guard's post is what's called _sarcasm_...as in, exaggeration in order to prove a point.

A lot of people don't like it because they have to stop and *think* to understand it, and *thinking* apparently isn't very popular or fashionable these days.


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## ChrisDoll (Sep 2, 1999)

Ziz said:


> john guard's post is what's called _sarcasm_...as in, exaggeration in order to prove a point.
> 
> A lot of people don't like it because they have to stop and *think* to understand it, and *thinking* apparently isn't very popular or fashionable these days.


Like you've never taken my sarcasm the wrong way. . .sheesh!


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

In the words of the late, great Roy Orbison:

_A candy-colored clown they call the sandman
Tiptoes to my room every night
Just to sprinkle star dust and to whisper
"Go to sleep, everything is all right"_

_I close my eyes then I drift away
Into the magic night, I softly say
A silent prayer like dreamers do
Then I fall asleep to dream my dreams of you_

_In dreams I walk with you
In dreams I talk to you
In dreams you're mine all the time
We're together in dreams, in dreams

But just before the dawn
I awake and find you gone
I can't help it, I can't help it if I cry
I remember that you said goodbye

Too bad it only seems
It only happens in my dreams
Only in dreams
In beautiful dreams.
_


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## Otto69 (Jan 2, 2004)

I think you'd have a different take on that song if you saw Dean Stockwell sing it in _Blue_Velvet_ .


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

Otto69 said:


> I think you'd have a different take on that song if you saw Dean Stockwell sing it in _Blue_Velvet_ .


You mean Ben? He's suave.


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

:tongue: 

Okay, you guys want to sing, huh?

*Where oh where are Polar Lights?*
*Why did they leave me here all alone?*
*I searched the world over for some-mora Aurora.*
*Sold to another and PFFTHHP! they was gone.*


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

... just call BR-549.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Hot dang, I used ta love that show.


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## beck (Oct 22, 2003)

naw , Jr wasn't the porn star . Lulu ( that's right , the ,uh let's be PC here ,FAT chick ) used to be a stripper . oh man ,now i gotta work all weekend to get that image outta my head .
hb


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Hey, Trendon...since you're thinking of starting a model company, I've got two words for ya....

BIG FRANKIE!
BIG FRANKIE!
BIG FRANKIE!

Phew. Thanks. You have no idea how long I've been wanting to do that to someone!!!

Smirk.

Hugs!
Lisa


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## sbaxter (Jan 8, 2002)

Around this board lately, I think the more appropriate tune would be:


Buck Owens and Roooooooy Clark said:
 

> Gloom, despair and agony on me!
> Deep dark depression!
> Excessive misery!
> If it weren't for repops I'd have no kits at all!
> Gloom, despair and agony on me!


Qapla'

SSB


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

sbaxter said:


> Around this board lately, I think the more appropriate tune would be:
> 
> Originally Posted by *Buck Owens and Roooooooy Clark*
> _Gloom, despair and agony on me!_
> ...


:thumbsup:


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

Da Queen said:


> Hey, Trendon...since you're thinking of starting a model company, I've got two words for ya....
> 
> BIG FRANKIE!
> BIG FRANKIE!
> ...


Not a bad idea.
I'll see what I can do.


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## kangg7 (Jun 21, 2000)

:devil: I'm thinkin' a bunch of kits of the hee haw honies would be awesome.

Qapla'

DAve


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## TRENDON (May 24, 2000)

kangg7 said:


> :devil: I'm thinkin' a bunch of kits of the hee haw honies would be awesome.
> 
> Qapla'
> 
> DAve


 
Why didn't I think of that?


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

Big Phrankie!!! Big Phrankie!!! Big Phrankie!!!


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

so we wont be having an services to mourn the loss of Polar Lights??

i for one am deeply saddened at this it's passing!
i say we observe a moment of silence to REMEMBER THE WAY IT WAS!!
oh "PL" it used to like me calling 'em that......

I DOST REMEMBER THY GLORY
THINE ART THE MOST COURAGEOUS OF MODELS LINES!
YEA, TO ARISE IN THE GUISE OF FALLEN AURORA OF PAST
IS MOST GLORIOUS. WE HOLD OUR BRUSHES TO THEE, THY FALLEN FRIEND!
THOUEST SHALL GO TO THE LIGHT NOW, GO AND MODEL FOR ETERNITY
IN THE NETHERWORLD OF SCALE MODELS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## pagni (Mar 20, 1999)

phrankenstign said:


> Big Phrankie!!! Big Phrankie!!! Big Phrankie!!!


 Big Junior Samples!!! Big Junior Samples!!! Big Junior Samples !!!
oh...wait......he's already big......


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## MangoMan (Jul 29, 1999)

Ziz said:


> john guard's post is what's called _sarcasm_...as in, exaggeration in order to prove a point.
> 
> A lot of people don't like it because they have to stop and *think* to understand it, and *thinking* apparently isn't very popular or fashionable these days.


Gee, thanks for the English lesson. But since sarcasm is a cutting, often ironic remark intended to wound, maybe someone else should do a little more thinking?  

(See, _that_ was sarcasm)

I'd agree with you, except for the fact that every post this 14 yr old has ever made has been a whine or a "gloom and doom" of some sort. It's turned the dead horse into a grease spot on the road. You'd think if there was more to it than adolescent whining, he'd have made an actual point by now.


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## AFILMDUDE (Nov 27, 2000)

I lie awake many a night wondering if we had posted just one more:

BIG FRANKIE!
BIG FRANKIE!
BIG FRANKIE!

if that _ONE EXTRA POST_ would have got Mr. Lowe into thinking: "Ya know, maybe I should repop the big guy after all." 

It'll haunt me the the rest of my days...


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## Otto69 (Jan 2, 2004)

*I must be the only guy in the world...*

Who could care less about Big Frankie and would never, ever, buy one.


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

Otto69 said:


> Who could care less about Big Frankie ....


In the words of the late, great Frank Sinatra*:

_You've gotta accent-tcu-ate the positive, _
_eli-my-nate the negative,_
_Latch on to the affirmative, _
_don't mess with Mister In-between._
_You gotta spread joy up to the maximum, _
_bring gloom down to the minimum._
_Have faith or pandemonium's li'ble to walk upon the scene._
_To illustrate my last remark, Jonah in the whale, Noah in the Ark,_
_What did they do just when everything looked so dark,_
_Man, they said we better_
_Accent-tchu-ate the positive, elim-my-nate the negative,_
_Latch on to the affirmative, don't mess with Mister In-between,_
_Don't mess with Mister In-between_

* Johnny Mercer, actually.


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## BatToys (Feb 4, 2002)

AFILMDUDE said:


> I lie awake many a night wondering if we had posted just one more:
> 
> BIG FRANKIE!
> BIG FRANKIE!
> ...


It was really close. I tell you when I interviewed Tom, he looked sad he could not reissue Big Frankie after Dave told him it would not sell enough to justify costs. Dave was just doing his job. I really think Tom would have reissued Big Frankie even if he lost money because he is a fan. 

The ironic thing is even if they did reissue Big Frankie, Tom would not have lost money because the RC2 sale would have made up for it.


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

Boy, that _is_ ironic!  Hey BatToys, could you post that interview here for all to see? I mean, it was a _published_ interview wasn't it? Or was it some _other_ kind of interview?


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Actually, yes. Tom was soooooo close to cutting the big boy loose, but Dave wasn't the one (the first one, yes) who gave the final thumbs down and said it wouldn't sell. It was the other Tom in the company...the hired gun that was brought in to head up marketing. Big Frankie was a seemingly constant discussion around the place and Dave was in on much of it, but the conversation I had with Tom...in which I honestly thought he was going to tell me to go ahead and let the BB know he was going to do it....came at the time Dave was gone and Jerry was there. Tom Lowe himself told me he had looked at every conceiveable angle to get that kit made to make a profit, but Other Tom said no. Tom L and I had numerous conversations about Big Frankie because he always wanted to know what the boards were saying...and I told him. Tom L was indeed bummed out about not being able to do it. He thought it would have been one of the more fun kits to put out. Was he "BS'ing me? I don't think so. He loved bringing out the kits for y'all. He really did. He always got a huge grin on his face when he would hear how pleased you were with the latest offering. For a long time, PL was his baby and he kept it on life support for a long time. And to think I used to sweat bullets thinking he'd close the PL side down and exile me to the JL BB. Boy! Was I worrying about the wrong thing or what?! Tom really loved the kits, but he was and is a business man. The selling of PM wasn't personal, it was business. 

Hugs!
Lisa


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

Thanks for the "straight dope", Lisa.


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## Cro-Magnon Man (Jun 11, 2001)

Lisa ought to write a book, "Polar Lights, My Part in a Dream", or "Confessions of a Polar Lights Employee", or something along those lines. I'd buy it.


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

I'd heard one or two unflattering things about the other Tom, and could never say anything because I wasn't "inside" to know anything and it was confidential. Wasn't he one of the bottom-liners who wasn't fond of the PL side of PM anyway, and also wanted to dump the BB?


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Affirmative. But then, that's what he was hired to do....only...I think Tom didn't see what the future outcome of bringing that particular person on board would be. Tom trusted people to do their job for him. There was a handful of truely loyal people working for him...people who I refer to as "the kitchen table gang." Those are the folks that started it all from Day 1 back in little 'ol Cassopolis, MI and a few who came after. Then there were those who saw an easy "mark" because Tom L had a whimsical and a compassionate side to him. The other Tom didn't...at least at the office he didn't. IMHO (an probably an ignorant one at that some would say)it was a fated pairing of business minds.

At the final Warehouse sale, I decided (with Cult cheering me on) to damn the legal threats and to step foot on the PM property once again. When I saw Tom, I decided I had to say something about how much hurt I've been carrying around because of the way everything was handled. To make a long story short...we had a wonderful talk. He apologized. I accepted. We hugged and a load was lifted. I have always liked and admired Tom Lowe and I always will. 

Hugs!
Lisa


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## ChrisW (Jan 1, 1970)

Thanks for sharing these stories Lisa.


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## fjimi (Sep 29, 2004)

Ditto Chris. Thanks for sharing. 

We know those who loved the company and those that never undestoood-those who spoke from the wallet versus those that spoke from the heart.


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## BatToys (Feb 4, 2002)

Zorro said:


> Boy, that _is_ ironic!  Hey BatToys, could you post that interview here for all to see? I mean, it was a _published_ interview wasn't it? Or was it some _other_ kind of interview?


It was published online in Raving Toy Maniac. You can find it in their archives but I'll include it below as a _favor_ to you.
It was also posted on the board with pictures of the Batman PL display. I got the impression Tom liked it when I met him a year later for a second interview.
Lisa?, I wonder what he thought of the second one where I wrote "
 It’s a sunny day in Gotham. Meanwhile millionaire playboy Tom Lowe and his youthful ward Dave Metzner are taking a leisurely stroll down the aisle of the Chicago hobby expo. But wait! What’s this? Mild mannered reporter BatToys is taking pictures of the Polar Lights booth. And so they, as they have done many times before, turn into CEO and Brand Manager eager to tell me all about their upcoming model kit plans."

The first article:

The Polar Lights booth at the 2002 Chicago Hobby Expo displayed all the current and prototype model kits. Here is a review with photographs.


It was cool to see the Aurora Batcycle. The photos are a test shot. It will be the same Aurora scale with rubber tires. The Batgyro prototype was displayed along with an updated diecast Batboat.



I talked with the man himself Tom Lowe and Polar Lights Brand Manager Dave Metzner.

Tom began the company and Aurora, Captain Action, and 60’s toys are something he wanted to bring back. Because he’s a fan like us and is passionate about it is the reason Playing Mantis is a successful fan favorite. 



Dave’s answers to my questions: Aurora Batboat will be remade a larger 1/24 scale. Batcycle will likely have a white plastic “chase” version aimed at collectors who like to keep items Mint in Box. 



No Barris Batmobile-rights too complicated. No to Aurora Superman and Batman reissues with engraved emblems because Revell has the rights to those plus the Revell ones sold poorly and are still too recent. No Dr. Jekyll but I forgot to mention that the new Sean Connery movie “The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen” will feature Dr. Jekyll as a Hulk type superhero, so maybe a movie behind it helps. 



There will be a Johnny Lightning 1/64 60’s Batmobile slot car! Star Trek figures if the Enterprise kits sell very well. Maybe a 32 inch TOS Enterprise if the other smaller Enterprises show a demand. Chris White painted the neat NX-01 box cover. Tom added that the Aurora Wonder Woman would be reissued in about a year.



And don’t even ask them about Gigantic Frankenstein. Polar Lights will never make that kit according to Dave. They would like to but it’s way way too expensive and not enough buyers. Even at 40.00 they would lose money. Tom and Dave are nice guys who listen to their customers but I get the distinct impression they would be happy if they never again heard “What about Gigantic Frankenstein?”



Dave is looking to borrow a first issue Hulk box and also a complete with box Aurora Batboat that he is willing to pay market price. I mentioned to Tom I liked the idea of the Penguin and other reissues being remade larger scale as it makes them more impressive and he said that was Dave’s idea. Good work Dave!



Having collected Captain Action and Aurora kits, I told Tom it was great to see them again. His Captain Action line was a one-time event. Their rights to DC are limited to model kits. I suggested new poses that are sculpted more photorealistic and he replied they would consider that suggestion for the far future. I wish I hadn’t forgotten to ask about the Banana Splits Buggy, if they would make the Batmobile parody “The Deathmobile” from Animal House, and if Superboy will have the engraved “S.”



The metal 1950’s Batmobile is very cool with the Bat face painted black flat as a nice contrast to the gloss. At another booth I saw a spiffy oak wood display for 1/25 model cars like the Batmobiles at:www.golftreasuresinc.com 



Tom and Dave were very busy talking to all the domestic and international buyers so I thank them for their time in answering all my fanboy questions. All their new kits show Polar Lights to be a visionary company.



BatToys


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

Thanks.


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## Roy Kirchoff (Jan 1, 1970)

Hey Lisa, I'm really glad that you two could clear the air. Thanks for sharing some of the inside stuff. It's always fun to hear the back story!

Thanks BatToys for posting the interview, WW was that close...........

RK


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Mentioning Big Frankie got to be about as bad as mentioning the dreaded G word. But, if Tom could have, he would have. 

I'm sorry I can't comment on your article, BatToys. I never discussed it with my collegues at PM. And, I'm thinking it may have been written in the time frame from when I left, Jerry went on vacation and Dave returned. It's a nice piece...I'm sure Dave was lovin' the "youthful ward" reference. 

Moi!

(that's for you Mikey!)


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## Mike Warshaw (Feb 23, 1999)

I feel warm all over.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Mike Warshaw said:


> I feel warm all over.


 That happens a lot in middle age.


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## BatToys (Feb 4, 2002)

Lisa,
It's a moot point but would it have made a difference *if* at that time, Tom knew RC2 would buy PL and so would have made Big Frankie as there would be no risk?

Also in honor of Lisa, I think the 1/350's refit nickname should be "Da Queen." 
Maybe the decals can have "USS Da Queen" too.


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Bat, I "left" PM before the RC2 issue got really hot. I'm told by a reliable source that conversation was starting to be "in play" about that time, but I cannot speculate on what Tom would or would not have done. I do know that he, or maybe it was the rich kid in him, really would have liked to do it. He did indeed explore all options, which included getting one off eBay (guyz...remember when someone from here spotted that sale??) to do mold research and that it had progressed to the point where I really thought he was calling me into his office to tell me we were going to do it...but...alas...the big boy was not to return.

Moi!


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Anything for you, Mikey Babe...anything.

Moi!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Da Queen said:


> ...but...alas...the big boy was not to return. Moi!


The fact that you and Tom were able to reconcile makes for as happy an ending to the Polar Lights story as I could wish for, O Queen. And I still say that what Tom Lowe did for us Aurora fans, another will do someday!


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

Mark McGovern said:


> The fact that you and Tom were able to reconcile makes for as happy an ending to the Polar Lights story as I could wish for, O Queen.


Well said.


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## Da Queen (Mar 11, 2005)

Thanks, Guys. It did do my heart great good.

Hugs!
Lisa


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

Over on the Eastern Bay, it appears the Monsters Frightening 4-Pack just sold for $202.50 + $7.00 for S/H. It originally sold for $39.99 at Toys 'R' Us.

I wonder what the retail price for a Big Phrankie would have been......and what it would go for now if PL _had_ produced it.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Wow!

I just picked up three Polar Lights Godzillas (the repop of the old Aurora kit) at a local discount chain for $4 Canadian each. At that price I'd have bought more but that's all they had!
Huzz


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

Is the Polar Lights Era Over????

It looks like it's living on, and on, and on........


So Polar Lights wasn't able to get Big Phrankie to the market....
......but it looks like that dream stayed alive....

Now.........maybe the odd rods line may be completed.......Jeckyll's Jalopy, Bride's Buggy, Creature's Crate, Witch's Brewster, Prisoner's Pram, Phantom's Bantam, Hunchback's Hot Rod, Ghost's Booo-ick, Nosferatu's Vanpyre, Hyde's Boilermaker, Robby's Run-A-Bout, etc....


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## mrmurph (Nov 21, 2007)

PL did a great job reinvigorating our hobby, and I'll always be grateful to them for re-popping obscure kits from my childhood. LOG Snake, anyone? You have to hand it to the folks at PL for taking a chance on loopy kits with limited appeal.

I think modelers have a lot to look forward to in 2008. The Ghost, possibly The Fly, Conan, The Invisible Man, Big Frankie on the horizon.... and on and on. As the sun sets on PL, it rises on M & M. "And the torch is passed to a new generation". 

As for Junior Samples... when my sister was expecting, she showed up at my house wearing a pair of coveralls. I told her (jokingly) that she looked like the aforemention Mr. Samples, and she didn't speak to me again for a loooooong time. Some people have no sense of humor. :-D


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Appropriate that someone named phranquenstign would revive a thread that's been dead for three years!!


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

John P said:


> Appropriate that someone named phranquenstign would revive a thread that's been dead for three years!!


There are two reasons for this:

1) I didn't want this thread to get purged.

2) It delved into reasons why PL was unable to produce Big Phrankie.



btw There is no "qu" in phrankenstign!


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Yes, indeed.

Moebius and Monarch are the phoenix that has risen from the ashes of Polar Lights.

The new kit announcements just keep getting better and better. Can't wait to see what's coming next!


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Lets not forget what Tom Lowe might have going on too!

*VIVA la plastique model kits!*  

I found an 'older' article with quotes from Chris White and Tom Lowe...it gives a very interesting inside look from Tom's perspective 'then', what Frank and Scott are up againts now and this very KILLER photo!

http://www.mania.com/28733.html


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

That article gave a very interesting perspective on the hobby. Thanks for posting the link, fluke - it goes to show that you're not just another mutated face. :freak: 

Mark McG.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Try telling my parole officer that  .....to him I'm just one more freak....but my mommy thinks I'm swell!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

An extreme example of the power of a mother's love!

Mark McGee, no test tubes...whoda thunk it?


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## Mitchellmania (Feb 14, 2002)

I think the new kits coming out from Mobius and Monarch has brought me back here, so you can turn the lights back on!


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## Prince of Styrene II (Feb 28, 2000)

phrankenstign said:


> Shouldn't that be "a forklift ALLEGEDLY driven by the Creature from the Black Lagoon"? I don't think he was ever convicted.


Well, judging by this recently recovered survelience photo, I think the Creech is as good as locked up!
http://www.tylisaari.com/polar/CreechKit1.jpg


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

You mean Polar Light is dead! :freak: Someone should lift my rock up, once in awhile, and give me some news. I thought moving out of the cave, would be better for me.  .......


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

Hey Lloyd....


I guess it's time to lift your rock to tell you *Polar Lights* has come BACK!!!

Evidently rumors of its death had been _*exagerated!!!*_


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## xsavoie (Jun 29, 1999)

Polar Lights just like the Undead always manages to rise again from the grave.:thumbsup:


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## xsavoie (Jun 29, 1999)

Just because Polar Lights is not reissuing the Polar Lights kits or issuing other Aurora kits doesn't mean that they are dead.I think Polat Lights is responsible for influencing RC to re release it's MPC kits,etc.It's just that the Polar Lights logo is no longer visible on the boxes.Seems to me that it's just a change of tactics.A metamorphosis,so to speak.


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## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

xsavoie said:


> *Just because Polar Lights is not reissuing the Polar Lights kits or issuing other Aurora kits doesn't mean that they are dead*.I think Polat Lights is responsible for influencing RC to re release it's MPC kits,etc.It's just that the Polar Lights logo is no longer visible on the boxes.Seems to me that it's just a change of tactics.A metamorphosis,so to speak.


 
They _*ARE*_ re-issuing *Aurora* kits:


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## mrmurph (Nov 21, 2007)

With all the great kits coming out, modeling has become really fun again!


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## Mitchellmania (Feb 14, 2002)

I wish they Polar Lights would have their own board again!


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

As long as there is some one some where who has the resources to put out old kits and is willing to do so then the name brand model companies like Polar Lights, AMt MPC etc, etc are NOT dead.


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## Jimmy B (Apr 19, 2000)

xsavoie said:


> Polar Lights just like the Undead always manages to rise again from the grave.:thumbsup:


Speaking of the Undead, Barabus this month and the DS Werewolf next is the last I heard


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

And I thought THIS thread was dead, like Polar Lights, the dead will arise.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

It's not really dead. Not as long as we remember it.


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## tr7nut (Apr 18, 1999)

*Bright side!!*

Hey guys! We witnessed an entire product life cycle! For those of us in I.T. that's something we can put on our resume!  Not only did we witness and even participate in a product's complete life cycle, we witnessed IT'S RE-BIRTH!! YAHOOO!!! 
Cliff


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## xsavoie (Jun 29, 1999)

Someone just have to make aftermarket heads for the Dark shadows kits.The heads are the weak part of the kit.


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