# Avoiding "turds" on eBay?



## twolff (May 11, 2007)

I've managed to aquire a number of real "turds" off eBay recently. Mostly from somewhat non-descriptive listings with pictures poor enough to hide obvious defects. I've taken to asking sellers:

"Is there anything on the body of the car scratched, chipped, cracked, broken, bent, discolored, painted, worn, loose, or missing?" Guess what, most of them don't answer.

I've also learned that the text "I don't know anything about these" really means "This car is a broken hunk of crap with few, if any, useable parts."

What methods do you use to ensure that your eBay slot car purchases are ones you are happy with?


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## dlw (Aug 17, 1999)

Those words also mean:

"I'm selling these for a friend who told me what to wite down about it", and:

"I'm looking to see if anyone will pay an outrageous price for this"


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## SplitPoster (May 16, 2006)

You know, my experience with sellers who don't usually handle slot cars in similar situations has generally been pretty good. That is, if they truly don't handle slot cars (as evidenced by other items and seller feedback) and they attempt to describe to the best of their ability. Positives are if they offer to email additional pictures and, as you said, reply to email. This is why if I'm looking for something specific I try to search rather than bargain hunt "ending soonest" and not have enough time for a reply. My few negative experiences have been with people who obviously do know something and use vague or generic descriptions " we are selling some of our nicest t-jets with few if any flaws....." That sort of specific, accurate listing title with vague description is a red flag. 

Do you think the new rating system will help?


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

I depend on the rating system... what gets me ticked is this: Items listed as MINT, and then when you look at the pics, it's missing pieces or is obviously damaged ... then it doesn't matter what the seller's rating is, I won't bid

I tend to use the same sellers again and again...until they cross me, then they lose my buisness forever, unless they try to make things up to me. For the most part, I haven;t had too much trouble on the "bay' . I've been ripped off a few times, and there are items I bid on that I was disappointed with, perhaps I didn't look at the pic close enough... or iwhat happens to me alot is this.... I don't read the shipping charges and then I get hosed. Now, That's one of the first things I look for is the shipping charges. Too high, no bids form me. 

When I sell things, I encourage people to ask any and all questions. One man's trash is another man's treasure and I wouldn't want people to be disappointed... but on the other hand, as a bidder... if I see info that's not complete, I say it's up to you to ask the questions you need to make sure you bidding on an item you want.


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## martybauer31 (Jan 27, 2004)

The worst one I believe is when someone says it's "minty". I still collect hot wheels from time to time and this one is abused over there. 

"This car is minty except for a scratch on the window and some small nicks on the corners and the tampos are rubbed off on one side."

YAAAAARRRRGHHHHH!!!! EVERY CAR out there is minty with that description.

If the picture doesn't describe it well enough, ask for more pics and a better description. If they don't reply, let some other guy buy your troubles for you.


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## roadrner (Jul 21, 1999)

Yeah, I love all those disclaimers or descriptions. Regardless, it still boils down to "Caveat Emptore". Not everyone has your ethics or moral interpitude when it comes to dealing in ventures like this. 

Some sellers out there are just ___________________. :freak:


 rr


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*That's Fertilizer!*

Ahhhhh! Steaming piles on the bay! Smells like another custom to me. :tongue: 

Crappy pics, and flowery descriptions make me scroll right on buy. A good pic is worth a thousand words.

"Minty" is an adjective best used in a toothpaste commercial and when used in slots provokes an immediate scroll-on on my part.

I've lost the collector bug and just look for suitable victims to Model Murder. I now happily collect just turds and forage for replacement parts/spares. 

Y'all know the drill-

1 Check and read sellers feedback.
2 Check their other items to see what they're about.
3 Check shipping/handling charges...twice!
4 Communicate any questions or concerns in detal so you have it in writing. 
5 Protect yourself at all times and come out fightin'...LOL
6 If ya get toasted; remember to share on board so we can collectively gut and fry them in the HT vigilante justice system. I always love a good hangin'!  

Conversly though always share your sweet deals as well :thumbsup: 

All kiddin' aside most of my dealings have been good, cuz I use the checklist and heed all warnings.


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## tjd241 (Jan 25, 2004)

*I gotta admit...*

I have never bought anything on the bay. Nothing, zip, nada. Have I missed some great deals?... Undoubtedly scores of times, but all the negatives I've seen over the years has me too leary. Call me a scaredy-cat, but I'm on too limited of a budget and I lost the collector bug pretty much too. Just not my cup I guess. Shows, trades with friends, that's been my market. If you are so inclined to buy off the bay, then you should follow your wallet and not your heart. Buyer beware because whenever money is involved some people seem to get selectively honest. nd


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## twolff (May 11, 2007)

eBay is a strange place sometimes, that's for sure. Thanks for the tips. Some of which I've learned in a (thankfully, only slightly) costly manner. Anyone that can't provide decent pictures and confirm that the car isn't tore up is off the list.


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## ParkRNDL (Mar 20, 2002)

Bill Hall said:


> I've lost the collector bug and just look for suitable victims to Model Murder. I now happily collect just turds and forage for replacement parts/spares.


ditto. I mean, I certainly won't pass on an uncut Mach 1, but I'm usually pretty happy to score a beater hacked Camaro to play with. Funfunfunfun...

--rick


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## SplitPoster (May 16, 2006)

tjd241 said:


> I have never bought anything on the bay. Nothing, zip, nada. nd


ND, If I had a slot car show to go to I might feel the same way you do. If it weren't for the bay, I wouldn't have acquired over 90% of the neat old stuff I have. I don't buy MIB or minty, I buy "handled or played with", love to buy old lots when I have $ to play with., I'll have to say I have been pleasantly suprised with more than I expected more often than disappointed. That said, if I bid on a fuzzy picture I bid appropriately, and expect to get a chassis with some sort of cruddy body on it, not a diamond in the rough. Got a real nice straight Aurora 904 with box and label that way for 9.99 once, but if it was a solid rivit chassis with a cut body and a cracked box it would have been ok. Bought a set once from some estate sale ladies, and asked them to please pack carefully when I sent my payment - box looked like a refrigerator being delivered LOL, and I got a truly excellent vibe galaxie in the mix. Sent them a thank you note.

I never, ever buy "new" (slot cars anyway) at all on the bay- if I want new I buy from the source or a dealer. Not comfortable with resellers trying to turn a buck, or somebody putting a "pre-run" or substituted car back in the box. 

I have a number of sellers I'm happy with and trust. There are also some guys who I have bid against in the past, guys who have bought a load of stuff, putting up their rejects, parts donors, and semi-slag that I won't even look at.


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

I have also collected most of my cars on ebay as well. There would be no other way from me to collect them otherwise. I've done over 1300 transactions and have only been flatly ripped off once or twice. I have overpaid for some of my collection, but when you want something and it's right there for the taking, and you can afford it.. why not grab it while you can? There are cars I let slip through my fingers that I still haven't seen reappear yet, years later. 

I have also scored some great deals too. The more I learned about collecting, the better deals I was able to spot. It's not rocket science, ya know? My best deal ever?
A MIB, never opened, never touched, Riggen Can Am ... for 10 bucks. I could easily snag ten times that if I wanted to sell it. 

What I do now is this... I put a lot "dream" price bids on a lot of different cars. Sometimes I hit, more often I don't ... but when I do hit, it's a great deal and I have no ebyer's remorse... a feeling I became all too familiar with. It's easier to walk out of a hobby shop than being caught in a bidding frenzy on ebay. A mental condition that clouds your better judgment and often impacts your bottom line... VERY negatively. 

Too bad it took me 2 yrs of collecting before I fell upon my anti frenzy strategy. 
I figure, I over paid for a third of my collection and got good deals on another third.

I guess that makes me even.


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## gear buster (Dec 1, 2005)

*How to avoid turds..*

When surfin the bay for the special piece of art here is 3 rules of thumb.. :thumbsup: 

#1.. Do not surf in the bay without your popper scooper and doggy bag.
'
#2.. Always watch where you are stepping through your search. Sometimes can be messy.  

#3.. When all else fails carry a roll of charmin :wave: 

I have run into the turds. Seems like I find them all. From slots to auto parts. Same old discription and Same when you email them for ???

Item is mint or near as possible.. (Pic of good side) don't tell you other side is toast. Bill said it all and down to earth. Picture says a thousand words


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## tjd241 (Jan 25, 2004)

*I see your point about no shows...*

I'm lucky to be within striking distance to the Beers shows. I do like to hold them before buying though. I'm a worrier... what can I say?  ... that's what we Nuthers do ! nd


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## micyou03 (Apr 8, 2003)

Another thing to keep in mind as far as I'm concerned is that for every negative a seller has he should probably have three more. There are many buyers who don't leave negatives.


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## Dragula (Jun 27, 2003)

Recently the chassis under the cars I have won off ebay werent worth the powder to blow them to hell.The quality of car and chassis I send out is nearly flawless,guess im one of the minority.
Chris


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## A/FX Nut (May 28, 2004)

I've had all good luck on ebay so far. But I don't buy the high dollar stuff either. 

I check the feedback, and shipping cost. Anything shipping and handling over $6.00 and I don't bid.

I laugh at so many auctions where the item is listed as mint, and is pictured out of the package. IF THE ITEM HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM THE PACKAGE IT IS NOT MINT. That's the way I see it. 

No picture gets no bid. Use to see alot of no picture auctions, now they are very rare.

If any questions, I'll ask. The item pictured is what you should get if your the high bidder. But to be sure, you should ask that question. The recently closed thread is a classic example. BOTH BUYER AND SELLER WERE AT FAULT!

Ebay is a good place but buyer beware. Those guys and gals who can't get to the shows it can be good. I find the prices at the shows to be lower than on ebay. Randy.


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## Pomfish (Oct 25, 2003)

A/FX Nut said:


> I
> I laugh at so many auctions where the item is listed as mint, and is pictured out of the package. IF THE ITEM HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM THE PACKAGE IT IS NOT MINT. That's the way I see it.
> 
> I find the prices at the shows to be lower than on ebay. Randy.


Repeat after me, "Nothing is Mint"

Just because it is the package does not mean it is mint.
One time I sold a Fairly rare Tyco Indy car and sent the customer one still sealed in the package, it was a set only car which came sealed in a plastic bag.

Customer got the car fine and then never gave feedback, so after like a month I gave positive feedback.

Not more than 5 hours later I get an email saying the car has a blemish on the side of of that looks to have been touched up. Now he is implying that negative feedback will be left if I do not correct this.

So, I sent him one from my own collection as I had no more of these to send, and low and behold, when it was returned it was unopened and did have a factory touch up on the side.

Bottom line, if you look hard enough, any and all slot cars have some error whether on the car itself or on the package.
I will never use the word Mint in any of my auctions.
I will say new/unused or still sealed, but never mint.

But that is just me. 
Thanks,
Keith


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## A/FX Nut (May 28, 2004)

Pomfish said:


> Repeat after me, "Nothing is Mint"
> 
> Just because it is the package does not mean it is mint.
> One time I sold a Fairly rare Tyco Indy car and sent the customer one still sealed in the package, it was a set only car which came sealed in a plastic bag.
> ...


I see you're point Keith. A few months ago I purchased an Auto World car and it has a bump in the paint it shouldn't have. But I've kept and run it anyway. 

There's a grading system I like that goes from C-10 down to C-1. I had a copy of it somewhere but I can't find it. 

C-10 being sealed or unopened package.
C-9 opened but not used.
C-8 minor play wear.

Can't remember the rest. Trouble with it is getting people to agree on the condition of a car and where it may fall in the grading scale. Randy.


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## micyou03 (Apr 8, 2003)

Good clear pictures from many angles is the best description. That's what I do and I usually get more for the same stuff others are selling than they do.

I do also use words in conjunction with the pictures. It only costs $1.25 to show up to six supersized pictures and a gallery picture. Why do so many sellers scimp on the pictures?

I usually assume its because they don't want me to see what the car really looks like.


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## hellonwheels8 (Feb 4, 2007)

twolff said:


> I've managed to aquire a number of real "turds" off eBay recently. Mostly from somewhat non-descriptive listings with pictures poor enough to hide obvious defects. I've taken to asking sellers:
> 
> "Is there anything on the body of the car scratched, chipped, cracked, broken, bent, discolored, painted, worn, loose, or missing?" Guess what, most of them don't answer.
> 
> ...



Ask questions. If they don't answer then don't buy. Remember, you can arbitrate through Paypal if you get something that is not as stated. This includes questions you ask. eBay buyer protection has a $25 deductible so you are going to lose $25 if the seller is a bum. Paypal protection is a little better but if the seller doesn't have the funds in their account when you file then you lose anyway. They lose their Paypal Account but you don't get any money back.

Of course, you can always buy mass quantities of junk lots and keep the good stuff and sell off the rest back on eBay. :tongue:


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## slotrod (May 21, 2007)

I think you are right about how people will list items. When I list items I have the car in front of me and list all or any defects so the buyer knows what he is getting. Along with that a clear picture or pictures. If I have a car that is good for parts then I will put it in a lot with cars in the same condition. Then list them as good source for parts. I feel that being up front with them they then know what they are getting and will come back to buy again. I encourage them to email any questions. I feel that listing all defects is always the best policy. I always add scratches chips cuts bent post etc. I rate cars 10 if in sealed package. Not out of packed but just in a collection etc.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

I like the the No BS outline format where the common problem areas are listed. IE: Posts, A pillars, glass, chrome, finish/wear, and distinguishing scars or tatoos. I also like to see pics from front, rear, sides, top and bottom angles.

Ya all have seen them a million times. They show me that the seller knows what I want to see.


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## sethndaddy (Dec 4, 2004)

If I have a somewhat turdish car, I'll always point out the problem and show an extra picture of it.
I had one problem that I had to go to paypal about, and my money was returned to me relatively fast too.
I have bought and sold for years, I would say 97% of the sellers/buyers are no problems. Its the 3% that keep making the rest look bad.

Like HELLON said, ask questions, if they don't respond, don't bid. That is the best rule of thumb to follow.


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## bobhch (Apr 22, 2007)

*I want to buy from you guys...wish everyone was honest*

I use a host to post my pictures on my Auctions. $4.00 a month is all it cost me. Used to use free pic posting sights but, as soon as I would start getting comfortable with the set up for linking pics they would shut down...Why give all that money to E-PAY? Will take the free picture they give me. lol

My point is that I can put as many pics up on an Auction as I want to. Just put up an Auction with about 24 pics a couple of weeks ago. Oooooh and did you know you can link pictures to your me page? http://members.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewUserPage&userid=bobhch. 

Honesty is the best policy! If you ever bid on bobhch Auctions you are beeing told completly about the item (good and bad) with pics of any flaws in close up and not blurry...blurry pics just make me "CLICK" the back arrow FAST!

Bob


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## micyou03 (Apr 8, 2003)

Nice pics!!!


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## Crimnick (May 28, 2006)

I ve allways done allright on the bay....it was here that I found my first stinker of a pay for something and get nothing deal...oh boy...


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## bumpercar88 (Feb 6, 2005)

Crimnick,
I hear ya No3forever burnt both of us!


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## JordanZ870 (Nov 25, 2004)

That makes 3 of us, eh.

I have done business and trades a couple of times with him in the past and it was good.
I can't see why he would screw me now. I wonder if something happened to his computer or whatever. He lives in Canada....I think.


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## LeeRoy98 (Jul 8, 2005)

micyou03 said:


> Why do so many sellers scimp on the pictures?
> 
> I usually assume its because they don't want me to see what the car really looks like.


I usually list my items with only the one picture. I don't plan on making a living from ebay profits so the extra cost can mean the difference between a break even and a loss. But anyone requesting additional pictures and willing to give me an e-mail address can get a lot of extra pictures.

Ebay and PayPal fees can sneak up on you and make you not realize your real costs of selling.

Gary
AKA LeeRoy98
www.marioncountyraceway.com


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## bobhch (Apr 22, 2007)

*spend to make...Money good. No money bad.*



LeeRoy98 said:


> I usually list my items with only the one picture. I don't plan on making a living from ebay profits so the extra cost can mean the difference between a break even and a loss. But anyone requesting additional pictures and willing to give me an e-mail address can get a lot of extra pictures.
> 
> Ebay and PayPal fees can sneak up on you and make you not realize your real costs of selling.
> 
> ...


Gary,

Read my post above and you can see that I disagree with you totaly on the need for more than one picture. Not trying to start a fight....Ding, ding Nooooooooooo

Just saying if you got something good to sell and it has potential to sell for a bunch of money. More pictures are needed to make the buyers feel like they are seeing what they are bidding that wad of money on. Like this Cop car that I sold for $94.00 today....didn't think that it would go for that much at all....just call me Lucky! Yeah baby!! http://www.image4u.org/bobhch/as16.jpg

Now if you are just selling AW bodies then 1 picture is enough. lol

Hey everyone has there opinion on things but, the old expresion: You gotta spend some money to make some still works today. Yeah I hate to give E-Pay all my Doooogh. That is why I use a picture host for just $4.00 a month. Way cheaper than the bays "give me, give me" attitued (Why couldn't I own E-Pay????)  Whaaaaaaaaaah  Ooooooh Dang it anyways.

Bob...zilla


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## Ligier Runner (Nov 29, 2004)

A/FX Nut said:


> I check the feedback, and shipping cost. Anything shipping and handling over $6.00 and I don't bid.


I agree about the shipping costs. Had my eye on a car that I would really like to have but just could not bring myself to pay $10.63 shipping for one little car that weighs next to nothing and doesn't take much to pack up.


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## slotrod (May 21, 2007)

Hey Bob
Why did the cop car sell so high. Are they limited or something. Reason I ask is I have a brand new one that has never been used. Still sittin' on the shelf.


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## SplitPoster (May 16, 2006)

Have to agree that with many single items 2 pictures is plenty! Can't get that mirror-in-the-back thing to work sufficiently well LOL. 

Shipping can be a limiting factor - I figure it into the total cost I am going to pay, and don't trust a seller with exhorbitant shipping costs so much. I bid on a NOS Aurora chassis - shipping was $6 !!!!!! So, I maxed at $2.50.


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## Ligier Runner (Nov 29, 2004)

SplitPoster said:


> Shipping can be a limiting factor - I figure it into the total cost I am going to pay


Agreed again as I do the same thing. I am expecting three cars from Bud's HO (through the bay) and spent $7 shipping for all three which I thought was very reasonable. With shipping, it came out to $19 per car for three new super G's. With the price of gas, I couldn't beat that driving somewhere to get them.


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## bobhch (Apr 22, 2007)

*lucky I guess...didn't have a clue this would jump up...*



slotrod said:


> Hey Bob
> Why did the cop car sell so high. Are they limited or something. Reason I ask is I have a brand new one that has never been used. Still sittin' on the shelf.


I don't know why this thing went for so much. Lots of bids...lots (over 20).

Probably because Carrera doesn't make it anymore?? For eveyone else that doesn't know this is a 1/32 Carrera slot car that came out about 3 or 4 years ago.

I had a blue Super Bird in the same nice condition and it only sold for $17.00 Beats the heck out of me why it went for so much. May have just been in the right place at the right time also. 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...MESO:IT&viewitem=&item=220127151101&rd=1&rd=1

Bob...zilla


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## hellonwheels8 (Feb 4, 2007)

I try to keep my shipping down also. I give customers a choice of 3.00 first class or priority 5.00 both those prices are with confirmation. 
What gets me is when you pay 5.00 get 1st class and no confirmation. 
GO FIGGER!!!


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## *MAYHEM* (May 4, 2007)

Ok, this is what annoys me most on e-bay:

One blurry photo of an entire tabletop upon which is something that might be a slot car but you really can't tell and this sort of description:

"You are bidding on one rare minty slot car. 

This item is from a smoke free house.

Good luck and look for my other cars and trucks that I am unpacking and listing!

Paypal is preferred and it will get your item shipped out the quickest. Other forms of payment (US Money Orders and Bank Teller/Certified Checks) will delay your shipment until funds have cleared my account as well as the Federal Reserve Bank. I have access to all fraud departments (I work in the industry)! Avoiding fraud makes selling & buying pleasant for everyone!!!

Please email me with questions.  

*SORRY, NO RETURNS.*

I prefer payment through PAYPAL, - ABSOLUTELY NO Personal Checks or FOREIGN items!

Insurance is optional on US shipping and REQUIRED on International items. All Items sent delivery confirmation.

All items sold as is with no warranty or refunds and are described accurately, so please ask questions before you bid. SORRY, NO RETURNS. The winning bidder must pay for the item within 5 days to avoid negative feedback.  

I have been building/collecting for over 30 years, so needless to say I have some unusual and hard to find items! I have many unbuilt kits, most of which are still in the plastic! I will be listing most of my personal collection (I have to keep a few), so check back frequently for new items. I will also be listing some built models and many lose parts including bodies, instruction sheets, decal sets, etc. I also have a few slot cars that I will be listing.

I will combine shipping if you buy multiple items, please contact me before making your payment.

Email me with questions and I will do my best to get back to you within 24 hours, so please do not wait until the last day.

Should you experience any trouble with your order, email me immediately. I will do my very best to make your eBay bidding experience positive.


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## micyou03 (Apr 8, 2003)

I am very annoyed with sellers listing brand names that are not associated with what they are selling (keyword spamming), to the point I will not even look at the auctions. I don't even care what i miss out on. I just can't stand this practice. It really puts a damper on searching.

I think I'll start reporting the auctions.


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