# Why Model building isn't what it used to be



## Guy Schlicter (May 3, 2004)

Hi,You know I'm sure many of you noticed modeling building has dropped off considerbly amoung the public and it's ashame.I have noticed Toys R Us eliminating model kit aisles.I think one of the problems is that people don't have the patience and want instant results.Model building requires time.Also even though many newer models are truly great detail wise,they require alot of work.Many of the hobby stores I frequented have folded.Ertl had a bad philosphy,you do all the work.They molded there kits to look bland unpainted,forcing you to paint them.I'm sure some of you know the Ertl 22 inch long Movie Enterprise was made originally by Lesney/AMT and I built a few.They looked better than the later version with Ertls added detail by far.I also built them in less time with more satisfaction.Another sign that model building isn't the same.Revell and Monogram,two fine model companies merged,probably to stay afloat.Will plastic modeling end or do people think it will remain alive on a much smaller scale.Amongst the diehard builders,Guy Schlicter.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

Mostly it is because of video games, I think. Times are a changing, alot faster than we like. One day only cars, will be made, and GKs will be all we SciFi modeler will have. 

I noticed the same for electronics. Radio Shack told me, they carry less than they used to have, because interest is dying for the hobby. Not here!


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## KUROK (Feb 2, 2004)

The average age of model builders in the US is ever increasing it appears. However I think model building is still big in Europe, particularly Eastern Europe, and other places ...like Asia. However, as more PC users emerge there it might decline.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

On Saturday I drove to my local hobby shop, The Hobby Place on Pico in West L.A., to pick up a few supplies. 

Shuttered.

Once upon a time Los Angeles County was home to several dozen hobby shops. By my reckoning there are now three (at least there were the last time I checked). 

Fortunately, thanks in large part to the inspiration and information gleaned from these boards, I'm getting closer and closer to building my own models from scratch. In the meantime guys like Randy Cooper, Captain Cardboard and REL keep my X-acto-wielding hands busy.

Times change, but I'll be building models until I drop.


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## cozmo (Nov 29, 2004)

Ya' know what, model building isn't what it used to be...but then, nothing else is either.

Okay, plastic kits aren't being made by as many manufacturers as before, but the variety has increased. Somebody like Captain Cardboard can produce an injection molded kit. Computers, the very thing that put a lot of prototype builders (model builders) out of business is now helping to bring them back. Heck, before the computer, I had to make decals using masks and an airbrush, and the results were only so-so. Now I can make beautiful decals with a fraction of the effort. The price of computer mills and routers are coming down as well. I can't wait to get a 5-axis computer controlled router of my very own.

And oh man, the availability of stuff. Okay, the local hobbyshops are going the way of the brachiosaurus. I'm sorry to see that happening. I used to have two very good ones real close. I could see their time was short when places like Squadron started making it. Your average hobbyshop just cannot stock the variety of kits out there today, and this was almost 20 years ago. But, not even the biggest hobbyshop can match eBay. Remember the times some of us older guys would score something really good at a garage sale? Few and far between. Nowdays that garage sale is worldwide...okay, with just as many buyers too. It cannot all be upside.

Heck, this is the second golden age of model building. Instead of a few club members meeting ocassionally to discuss who is doing what, we are meeting every day from every part of the world sharing ideas and parts like has never been available before.

Model building is one of the worlds oldest artforms. I don't see it dying out any time soon.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

cozmo said:


> I don't see it dying out any time soon.


I do.

When I did my mermaid figure (posted on the Modeling forum), I had to use a couple of old bottles of model paint plus some Chevrolet Engine Orange spray paint to make a skin tone. That's because there are no hobbyshops within any reasonable distance of me. The local Argus Hobbyshop, which closed last year, carried full lines of multiple paint brands. I'm proud of my ingenuity in the use of car and hardware store paint but I'm not going to tolerate it any longer than I have to. I've completely stopped building model airplanes because I can't get paint.

Fewer kits are being made. Fewer places are selling them. Those kits that are being made are very expensive. The ability to use technology to make things, "with a fraction of the effort" certainly doesn't help...philisophically, its the problem. If you want minimum effort, you can buy and action figure or diecast. And many people do just that.

We've had this discussion for years and there are always the optimists who tell us not to worry. But things are bad...very bad for kit building.

Having said all of that, I don't really lose any sleep over the issue because I'm afraid this is just the natural evolution of man's hobbies. Things gain popularity and then fall out of favour or are supplanted by new things. It happens. It's a reality that needs to be recognized. I'm not going to put on rose colored glasses and proclaim that everything will be fine with the hobby. It won't be. Kit building is dying. It's time has come and gone. I appreciate the work of the guys mentioned in this thread but the hobby won't survive on pricey, specialized kits.

I, too, will ALWAYS be modeler. I began making the transition to scratchbuilding a few years ago. It wasn't part of a grand startegy to ween myself off of kits. I started scratchbuilding because I wanted models that weren't being commercially produced...mostly classic 50's and 60's stuff. Now, other modellers are starting to find themselves in the same boat. You can no longer count on, or even reasonably hope for, kits to be produced based on popular sci-fi. It going to be "back to future" where modeler builders are going to have to start using some old time ingenuity because the big model commpanies and the little hobbyshops won't be feeding our addictions.


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## ilbasso (Jun 7, 2006)

My 23-year-old daughter was somewhat puzzled by my taking up the hobby this year, spending so much time and resources on "little men" in my Enterprise. She told me that she saw a film clip about middle aged men tying flies for fly-fishing last week, in which they said that the intricate work tying the flies was so absorbing that they didn't even care if they went fishing afterward. Seeing that, she said she was enlightened about my hobby.


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## cobywan (Oct 27, 2001)

There are far more model makers than you know about out there. The thing is they model on thier computers and have thier own forums. You need to check this place out;

http://www.scifi-meshes.com/forums/

Modeling CG can be harder than carving by hand. I know because I do both. The nature of the hobby has chaged to the point that you might not recognize that you're looking at it.


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## neosporing (Feb 12, 2005)

i read somewhere (on this board?) One significant reason for the decline is that many model companies can't afford to license the models anymore from (military). Aircraft companies tripled the fee to make scale models of their aircraft effectivly killing the hobby? Someone set me straight.


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## ilbasso (Jun 7, 2006)

I'm sure the licensing fees for Star Wars kits must be astronomical.

Kids have increasing short attention spans, and the "instant gratification" aspect of our consumer culture has a big factor in this. Why would a 10 year old kid spend days or weeks building a model airplane or spaceship when they can buy an already built and painted (and far more durable) toy for the same price or less?

From a return on investment standpoint, I imagine that it's tremendously expensive to set up the manufacturing molds for models. And with shrinking demand, it's harder for them to recoup their costs. If you were a stockholder and interested solely in return on your investment, would you invest in one of these companies, or one that had a higher return? It's a self-perpetuating spiral. Lower demand => higher cost => less models made => lower demand etc.

I think that one of the best things we can do to perpetuate the hobby is to share it with our kids!!!


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## Nova Designs (Oct 10, 2000)

For me it has all been about time and expense. As I get older I have more and more demands on my time. Work asks me to do lots of overtime, I stay late frequently. Sometimes as much as 80-90 hours a week. When I am off, I have a wife, a motorcycle (that I both work on and do trackdays with) I do targetshooting and reloading, I am a long-time musician, I do home improvements. 

Lots and lots of expensive hobbies competeing for the precious few hours a week I can spare for them.

Add to that the costs involved. $35 for a kit that in the 80s cost $7. $3 for a 3oz bottle of paint that I would need 12 of to paint something like the refit. $9 for a bottle of Tenax, $7 for a tiny bottle of Zap A Gap... It gets expensive really quickly. Plus, since most supplies are no longer locally available we have to order them from the internet. In a lot of cases that means time spent waiting instead of modeling. There goes that free weekend I had, oh well maybe I can get back to this in a few months.

The pace of life, the stress of life has increased tremendously in the last 10-20 years. The way I see it, if someone only has a few hours a weekend to devote to hobby activities, modeling is not very likely to win unless that is the ONLY hobby that person has.


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## terryr (Feb 11, 2001)

When i was a kid, fly tying was for old guys. I wasn't an old guy, and didn't want to do it.
Now that 'old guys' are modelling, young people shun it. The same with comics. They used to be for kids, now it's adults who buy them, and make movies about them.

And finally, video games have a larger profit potential. Burn a disc for a few cents and sell it for fifty bucks.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Nova Designs said:


> Plus, since most supplies are no longer locally available we have to order them from the internet.


I think that factor is MUCH more significant than most people realize.

As we know, the "future of modeling" is a discussion that's been around for a few years. When it started to heat up a while back, the common line was, "Don't worry, you can get everything you need from the internet. The selection is better and the prices are usually cheaper. Sorry about the local shops but that's the market and things change..."

The problem with that theory is that modeling tends not to be something that we plan and schedule weeks in advance. It's something that we do when we have time. It's something that I might do if I have a couple of spare hours on a Sunday. If I have to mailorder for everything...and hope it's in stock...I may not be in a modeling mood when it arrives a week later.

I can't tell you how many times I've been in the middle of a project and suddenly discovered, "Damn, I'm out of flat clear coat" ...so I'd run down to the hobby shop and pick some up (I once ran out of clear coat WHILE I WAS AIRBRUSHING but managed to buy some in about half an hour). Or you get a kit layed out in front of you and you discover that your bottle of liquid cement has evaporated. Or you open up your last can of PRU Blue and discover that it's as hard as a brick.

Internet buying has turned out to be NOT a convenience but a chore. It can require that we make meticulous advance plans for required supplies. So you sit down with that new Spitfire model...you've order paint, decals, glue...realize you forget to get British Interior Green and the project comes to halt while you wait a week for another delivery. Of course, the shipping on one can of British Interior Green costs more than the paint so now you have to spend money to pad your order.

It's just too much trouble.

I've got enough stress trying to plan everything else in my life. I don't need to be stressing out about kits supplies.

If I don't have local support, I just can't be bothered.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Well Brent, you'll have to move to my town! Hot chicks, cold beer, great fish and chips (just ask Griff) plus several shops where you can buy model stuff. Here's one:

http://www.signalhobbies.com/

and if you click on teh deck cam at this link before 5:15 pm eastern time today, you can see the place live in real time! I'm the funny looking guy with the hat waving from dockside!

http://www.princess.com/ships/tp/

Huzz :dude: :wave:


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## kylwell (Mar 13, 2004)

ilbasso said:


> I'm sure the licensing fees for Star Wars kits must be astronomical.


Were, but they dropped them after the Ep1 fiasco.

The internet, computers, and mail order have changed the way we all model. Kits are now licensed for a specific country but we still get them (Fine Molds & Revell Germany). Kids play on the 'puter instead of outside. Heck when I got my first machine capable of 3D modeling I stopped building physical models for close to 3 years. Parents, good parents, are introducing thier kids to building and they either have the patients for it or they don't. Heck, my wife started building models last year. Freaked me out. Now she's got her own tools and her own stack of kits. 

Has it changed, yes, it's always been changing. I remember when the first recessed panel line kits came out. I can still remember the first anime kits I saw (and bought as soon as I had the cash, Dorvacks). Or my first, horrible, attempts to use liquid glue. 

Feel like an old modeling fart now. (grandpa voice) Back in my day we had to build models that were carved outta butter with stumps of wood (/grandpa voice).

Some hobby stores have closed. We had one here shut down simply because the guys running it wanted to retire. Sold off the entire store for cheap, to thank thier customers. Had another one close becasue they refused to keep up with the times (nothing but models, mostly R/M cars and military, very little Japanese kits). We've got another that I'm just waiting for it to shut down. Largely doll crap, hobby is shoved in the back, no checks and they frown on credit cards and thier service is kinda sucky. Hobby stores an close for a variety of reasons but largely is just bad business that will do them in. Failure to change with the times, failure to fully understand thier market, failure to support thier market. I've got a hobby store 2mi away that carries Gundams, largely becasue there's a largish asian community nearby. They also host games 2 nights a week becasue there's a buncha Warhammer nuts nearby. Caboose Hobbies is a train store, but more than that. They've got the most complete selection of Grant, Pastruct, Evergreen and other dio & stratchbuiling supplies. Trains are big here in CO. They've been concetraighting their scratchbuilding supplies because folk are stratchnig trains as much anymore, carrying more oob stuff.

And I've lost my train of thought.

damn.

er, in conclusion....support your local hobby store....er....KISS RULES!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I can pinpoint the exact moment I knew the hobby was doomed. A new "Star Wars" movie had just come out, and I discovered much to my dismay that there were no plans to produce a model kit of the spaceship featured most prominently in the film (i.e. the Royal Naboo Starship).

It doesn't take a genius to figure out why the hobby has declined in popularity. 

When most of us were growing up we had access to three TV channels (if we were lucky) and the occasional Saturday afternoon matinee. For music there was the radio and a collection of scratchy 45's.

No videos or DVD's. No computer games. No LightWave. No iPod. No Internet. 

Once upon a time (back in the twentieth century) gluing together bits of plastic seemed like a swell way for an eleven year-old boy to spend an afternoon. These days the options are not so limited.

Model making will always be around as a niche hobby, but it will never again enjoy the wide-scale appeal it once did -- any more than collecting stamps, reading comic books, or playing with dolls will.


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## Zathros (Dec 21, 2000)

there have been Many reasons as to why the hobby is shrinking that were posted here, so I will add my 2 cents without repeating what everyone else already said (which was true anyway)..Aside from the enjoyment of making something yourself that comes with kit building, another reason we all did it ( well myself anyway) was to have a nice or pretty accurate rendition of a figure or vehicle or whatever it was you built..Nowadays, most any vehicle or action figure, plane, tank, Car , etc..is available already built, painted and in far nicer shape than any kid could hope to make without spending countless hours trying to accomplish..quick gratification is the order of todays youth, so that to me, is another reason as to why the hobby is fading..Of course for myself, I got about 150 kits , so I dont see myself stopping anytime soon..a 40 year habit is a bit tough to break..


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

And despite all this - the decline of the hobby - at least some people who don't build can appreciate a well-built kit. At least there's that. Of course, I'm so tired right now, I'm not even sure what my point is... Maybe you guys can make sense of it.


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## Nosirrag (Apr 26, 2005)

It does, at times, seem that the attention span of the average person has become attenuated over the last 20 years or so. For this I blame Elmo and the public school system. Kids get the idea early on that life occurs in 2 to 3 minute segments -- an idea reinforced by fast paced kid's shows and 20 minute "learning modules" in school. It is assumed that children's attention span does not exceed these limits, and so all the structured learning environments kids find themselves in are set up to "accomidate the child's natural learning rhythms." No thought to the notion of teaching the child to have a longer attention span -- that is simply too much work and not a good investment. This attitude -- that anything that is hard work is not a good investment -- is transmitted to the child. If it's hard, don't do it.

But there is hope. Some old farts like me are teaching their children that hard work is not a bad thing. My son, who is 5, loves to build those Snap-tite and Easy-kits that you see in the hobby store. He recently built that little NX-01 model by Polar Lights. I helped, naturally, but I think he and I spent about 2 hours on that thing. He is persistant to the point of obession. After it was built he suggested we should do another with LED lights in it. (This is the boy who, at age three, cut a square plastic tube diagnally, about an inch long, and said; "look Papa, it's a shuttlecraft.")

Now he wants to get an HO train set and help me build a track with hills and trees and houses. He says: "Papa, I'm 5 now, and I'm ready for an electric train."

So, even though he does enjoy video games, I think there is hope the boy will be a builder throughout his life. He has watched me do it and he has always enjoyed sitting in my model room while I work, scotch taping Evergreen plastic tubes and rods together. It's a good start.


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## star-art (Jul 5, 2000)

This is a really interesting discussion!  I am wondering if there are any objective (rather than subjective) indicators of a decline? For example, is IPMS membership up, down, or flat compared to past years? How is the circulation of a magazine like FSM doing these days? Just wondering if the "data" supports our conclusions. I totally agree it seems to be on the decline, just wondering how much and if it can be measured in some way.

I have a now-22-year-old cousin (who, due to the age difference, is more like a nephew) who saw the work I was doing and got interested in making models. We went to the hobby shop and picked out a FineMolds snap kit of an X-Wing, his favorite subject. We decided he should build it as a glue kit to get oriented to how it all works. I showed him the basics and he started building.

His reaction was surprising. He thought building the model was much harder than he expected. All the little things you need to do (glue, cutting/trimming parts, sanding, fixing seams, etc.) were a lot more effort than he apparently bargained for. And he didn't even paint the thing!

Overall, he thought it was going to be a lot of fun. But, in the end, he decided it was just too much trouble to be worth it. So, back to the video games! Online gaming was and continues to be his primary hobby. . .


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

We still have each other...


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## Chuck_P.R. (Jun 8, 2003)

I think the major problem is companies pander to a non-existant audience.

We constantly got the message from PL that they had to make tons of juvenile-marketed snap car kits and the like that always ended up getting clearanced at Walmart in their $1 aisle sooner or later.

We have to make the kits that "sell" before we can make the kits people are telling us they "want," was the credo.

When I was growing up, there were virtually zero snap model kits, balsa kits still existed though waning, and virtually all the kits, even the few snap kits, expected kids to increase their skills and become better in order to be able to build the really cool kits that adults and kids alike most wanted.

Now everything is skewed towards a kid market that in my opinion is a non-existant ghost market.

Little to no thought is given to challenging kids to aquire more skills. Instead they are just pandered to, while the adults modelers who are the real purchasers are being all but ignored.

When I was growing up, modeling was considered to be a hobby that demanded skill, when children were addressed they were encouraged by inserts to join "master model builders" clubs in order to increase their skills and tackle trully challenging subjects that adult modelers tackled, like battleships, etc.

There were more kids interested when they were taken for granted, condescended to and challenged then there are now that most of the hobby panders to them and dummies down their selections.

Meanwhile the adults who make up almost all of the hobby are largely ignored.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

You are so right,Chuck. If the companies made for us, then sales would be their. But if you are a full time car modeler, you will see more models.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Nova Designs said:


> For me it has all been about time and expense. As I get older I have more and more demands on my time. Work asks me to do lots of overtime, I stay late frequently. Sometimes as much as *80-90 hours a week*


HOLY COW!!! I sure hope that its worth it!? are your a EMT, Fire fighter or a police officer, doctor....maybe millitary? Thats insane! Some countries think we are crazy for working hours like that and I have to agree with them. My job is interfering with my HOBBIES!!!

*Not enough demand its pure and simple.....us old farts is what kept Polar Lights alive ....well at least 80% of sales....I'm willing to bet on that.*


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Oh yeah.....one last thing 

All sing along with me:

*Internet killed the model guy star! ...internet killed the model guy star.....*

I find myself spending more time on line viewing, posting and doing research for model building than actually BUILDING the dang things! 

Come on....I'm not the only one.....there there.....its time for an old farts group hug....Things change...like it or not.....for worse or for better....change is constant.....I'm just thankful for the good times....all those great kits, tv shows and films and all my cyber pals here to lean on, share with and yadda yadda.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

Yea, time to change, my adult diaper!


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## Z28Barry (May 4, 2005)

fluke said:


> I find myself spending more time on line viewing, posting and doing research for model building than actually BUILDING the dang things!


So true, so true.
I have so many models and a dedicated hobby room that is well equipped, but I find myself reading forums or searching the Internet when I should be building. :freak:


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## Flux Chiller (May 2, 2005)

Carson Dyle said:


> I can pinpoint the exact moment I knew the hobby was doomed. A new "Star Wars" movie had just come out, and I discovered much to my dismay that there were no plans to produce a model kit of the spaceship featured most prominently in the film .


Good point, but then again there wasn't _one_ memorable killer design in the new series to match the proper films. No Millenium Falcon, no X Wing, and so on.
I cannot even remember a ship I would remotely want to make. Royal Naboo Starship? Was that the circular one?


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## jgoldsack (Apr 26, 2004)

I think the general desire to model by the younger generation is down (thanks to internet, video games, computrers, etc) but I think that those of us who have small kids, who get excited to help us build our models (my daughter is always helping me build mine, and want to build her own all the time) is what may be needed to get the hobby back into the "main stream" again.

I am fortunate that there are a few hobby shops within 30 minutes of me, but I only know of a few.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Flux Chiller said:


> Royal Naboo Starship? Was that the circular one?


No, the Royal Starship was the sleek, chrome-plated, SR71-looking, Buck Rogers-esque speedster, and from an aesthetic standpoint it kicks _Millennium Falcon's_ ass.


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Dude! That is so... undude... of you to say! _Nothing_ kicks the _Falcon's _backside! 

_Nothing_!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Don't get me wrong, Jeff. I love the _Falcon_ -- in spite of her looks.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

^^ Now you did it! You won't be on his Christmas list this year.


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## flyingfrets (Oct 19, 2001)

star-art said:


> This is a really interesting discussion!  I am wondering if there are any objective (rather than subjective) indicators of a decline? For example, is IPMS membership up, down, or flat compared to past years? How is the circulation of a magazine like FSM doing these days? Just wondering if the "data" supports our conclusions. I totally agree it seems to be on the decline, just wondering how much and if it can be measured in some way.


Depending on how long you've frequented these 'boards, the indicators you're looking for are self evident. 

I drop by periodically to see how the guys who've been here since the begining (like Fluke and Brent) are doing and what they're modeling nowadays (always impressive), but I don't recognize 90% of the posters here anymore, and there are far fewer that there were in the "glory" days 5 or 6 years ago.

I think it's also interesting to note that there was a decline in modeling between roughly 1975 and the late 90's when Polar Lights came on the scene. Sur, there were those of us doing the GK thing, but Polar made the hobby crackle with excitement again for the first time in a LONG time. 

It's been said that "What goes around, Comes Around," yet I can't help but wonder if another resurgence in the hobby will be possible. The folks that made Polar profitable were us aging "Baby Boomers" who grew up on the hobby and were maybe looking to recapture a little piece of our lost youth. 

In 25 years, the folks looking the rekindle some of the fun of THEIR youth will likely be looking for old Nintendo and Playstation consoles and games. 

The hobby may not be quite dead yet, but I think it's on life support...


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

flyingfrets said:


> I think it's also interesting to note that there was a decline in modeling between roughly 1975 and the late 90's when Polar Lights came on the scene.(


Maybe so, but_ someone_ was building all those "Star Wars" and "Star Trek" kits...


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## flyingfrets (Oct 19, 2001)

Very true Carson, but we were all kinda whistling in the dark. There were few, if any modeling magazines (BTW: our local Borders no longer carries AFM, MR or even FSM...which they did up till November of last year), not much in the way of peer support and generally we did our thing, but we were definitely the minority.


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## Chuck_P.R. (Jun 8, 2003)

Katrina did in the last hobby shop in New Orleans, that had been open for 55 years.

I remember the first time my dad took me there when I was seven years old.

Here's their story:

http://www.hubhobbyshop.com/flood.htm

Here's a look of twelve years of Corps of Engineers work to give them a combination of the largest, most powerful pumps in existance in the country, not a dozen feet away from their front curb. All for naught once the defectively built levees broke. 

http://www.hubhobbyshop.com/12years.htm

100 days after Katrina:

http://www.hubhobbyshop.com/100.htm

overview:

http://www.hubhobbyshop.com/kat1.htm


And their new home in the suburbs that may or may not make it...

www.hubhobbyshop.com

I haven't gotten a chance to get there lately with all the hours I've had to work. I plan on still buying from the guys, but the new location shop just wont be the same.

Another childhood memory bites the dust.

Damn I'm startin' to feel old for 41!

Better then the alternative I guess.


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## BigH827 (Mar 17, 2007)

Ok no one has had any thing to say here for a year, and I was looking at treads and saw this one so here goes. The hobby shop I was going to closed down four years ago a little over a year after the male owner died  from problems after a heart transplant, so CJ's Hobbys of Tyler Texas was gone. Now some of you say the shops are to far away  , I went to this shop at least once a month for almost seven years,  for two of those years I went there afther leaveing class at UTT. Now from were I live it was fifthy miles one way, but it could be the fact that this is Texas and things are not far away untill they get to be seventy miles or further away so I went.  This year I found a shop in Irving but it hits the sevent mile trip almost, but I will be back. Tyler has a Hobby Town USA that is ok  and I go there every few months, unless its a two hour drive drive go, as for Ebay to often mad men run the bidding up to trhe point were you are paying three times what it should cost. :freak: And for the number of model companys look at Hobby Link Japan, or the listings at Squadron there are hundreds of model companys, and Hawk started back up this year, :thumbsup: and Warhammer 40k has brought thousands in the fold things are looking up. :woohoo:


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## CaptFrank (Jan 29, 2005)

The "Competition Hobbies" store near Costco has not closed,
as previously thought by me.

They are growing. Their shelves used to be four feet tall 
so one could view the whole store at a glance.

Now, the shelves are eight feet high and loaded with kits!
They even have a section devoted to "STAR TREK" and "STAR WARS"!

I think the owner must believe he can make more money with kits, too,
and not just radio controlled cars.


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## srspicer (Oct 14, 2007)

This is sounding similar to the other thread is was involved with, where someone was asking for a build up for $500.00 It got everyone ( especially me ) talking. 

Most of the subject here has been covered, and good thought and statements have been made. It does seem to be the way of things, PC gaming and interests are taking over. I also agree that parenting has to be involved to guide a child's free time, by suggesting a model or building a model together. It is how all tradition is kept alive. 

The best way to counter the fading of models as a hobby is to keep it up on our own! I see loads of excelent kits, and planty of talent. Just keep going, guys and gals! It's all cyclical, there will eventually be a back lash against being indoors, constantly in front of a computor. It is hard on the eyes, 'you never see the sun', and enough computor identity theft and computor crashes will cause some to try anything, even a tactile hobby such as the ones mentioned above.
 

Scott


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## Xenon (Nov 2, 2007)

srspicer said:


> I also agree that parenting has to be involved to guide a child's free time, by suggesting a model or building a model together. It is how all tradition is kept alive.


What did it for me was two things (and by the way, at 34, I count myself in the computer generation, having been interested in them since the beginning): My dad was an HO model railroader. While I was never interested in model railroading itself, I really loved it when he was putting his dioramas together. On the other side, my mum gave both me and my sister _tonnes_ of Lego kits when we were kids. I think the combination of the two made the natural progression for me to be interested in scale modelling as a kid; which also extended itself into diorama-building and miniature painting for Warhammer, but that's a slightly different thing.

In any case, the influence of parents will have a huge inspiration and effect on the hobby, and I think that the benefit to children to getting into it (as well as other hollistic interests and hobbies, such as reading, or taking up a musical instrument, or whatever sparks their imaginations in a constructive way) are far greater than what kids count as being 'hobbies' today.

I'm not too worried for the hobby, I think that as long as there are those of us who want to spur interest in kids, it will go on and be healthy. 

Cheers,
X.


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## Stimpson J. Cat (Nov 11, 2003)

Carson Dyle said:


> I can pinpoint the exact moment I knew the hobby was doomed. A new "Star Wars" movie had just come out, and I discovered much to my dismay that there were no plans to produce a model kit of the spaceship featured most prominently in the film (i.e. the Royal Naboo Starship).
> 
> It doesn't take a genius to figure out why the hobby has declined in popularity.
> 
> ...


Well said! I've heard other thoughts on the idea of our shrinking hobby but this is the only one that holds water with me. What I wouldn't give for the days when stores like K-mart had a whole isle for models and supplies. I've bought my 9 year old kits but he just can't get into building. This year for his birthday he wanted DVDs and several PS2 video games. 
Here is another thought, once we built because it was a fun pastime we enjoyed, now as older people we build for the same reason but the subject we choose to build is as important to enjoying this hobby. In other words, if I wasn't such a nut for Star Trek and experimental A/C, I wouldn't be a modeler.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet (I may have simply missed it) is the "collectibles" industry. I think most people are content to spend their money on something they can simply pull out of a box and put on their shelf with no real work involved. Even this, it seems, is too much work for some people--I was on a site not long ago where people were complaining about having to apply stickers _themselves_ to the collectible they'd recently purchased. And on another site dedicated to creating replica props (not the RPF), people were complaining about how long it takes _paint to dry_. :freak:

I don't think there's any right or wrong answer to why this hobby seems to be in decline. Certainly, various indicators may seem to point to one thing or another as the culprit. But between entertainment media (television, DVDs, CDs, Ipods, video games, sports, the Internet, etc.) and personal obligations (work, family, etc.) I think people simply have too many other diversions and can't be "bothered" with the time and effort it takes to create something themselves.

Also, I find the vast majority of people these days simply have no interest in art, which is exactly what I consider this hobby to be--using mixed media to create something that is artistically and aesthetically pleasing.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

Also, as someone else pointed out a while ago, some of us got into modelling because it was the only way to get a copy of our favourite subjects, such as the _Enterprise_, _Spindrift_, _Orion_, _Apollo_, and so on. If they were available as nifty collectibles, we might have never gotten into modelling.


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## Nova Designs (Oct 10, 2000)

Well, for me the hobby will never be dead. I currently own enough model kits to last me several lifetimes of non-stop building.

All I need is the free time to work on them.


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## sbaxter (Jan 8, 2002)

Nova Designs said:


> All I need is the free time to work on them.


Oh, well -- free time _is_ dead. Like the Wicked Witch of the East.

Qapla'

SSB


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## Seaview (Feb 18, 2004)

I think that "Free time" went the way of peachie folders (you remember, those manilia ones with all the sports figures drawn on 'em).


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Seaview said:


> I think that "Free time" went the way of peachie folders (you remember, those manilia ones with all the sports figures drawn on 'em).


Yeah, sports figures that received some "artistic alteration" as soon as class got boring.


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## aridas sofia (Feb 3, 2004)

Nova Designs said:


> Well, for me the hobby will never be dead. I currently own enough model kits to last me several lifetimes of non-stop building.
> 
> All I need is the free time to work on them.


Me too. I just got my old compressor, air brushes, vacuformer, and dozens of kits, out of storage. I've been straightening my workroom, since my son is old enough to show him the ropes of more serious modeling. Last year we did a build up of an AMT/ERTL Edsel Pacer, and I got the bug again. But it is saddening that my old haunt (the Wheaton Squadron Shop) is closed. Only two of the eight shops I used to frequent are left, and the club I was a member of has long since folded. 

But hey -- maybe when we have cheap, easy home prototyping and intuitive 3D programs, this hobby will be reborn. 

One can dream.


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## Mr. Wabac (Nov 9, 2002)

I don't think that the hobby is dead, but that it definitely is changing. It is disturbing that young people are not as interested, which could kill the hobby longterm. In the "days of yore" there was a major distinction between toys and model kits. If you wanted an accurate replica of a plane, ship, spacecraft, the only way to go was a model kit. Nowadays, there are many high quality replicas available that would shame the average modelmaker. If I was a kid today I would probably be buying the replica and not the model kit. The problem is that replicas are the "flavour of the minute" and the most popular. Trying to get something from the past or is obscure is near to impossible, unless you turn to modelling in one of it's many forms.

Things today are definitely different, there are changes, but not necessarily signs of the end. First, many Hobby stores are closing. In many cases, they are people who started in the business in it's infancy and now want to retire. Cheaper supplies via the internet has hastened their demise, in part because they have never chased after their customer; their customer was always there. 

It is also the case, thanks to the internet, that the local shops now have to compete with their customers. I can't believe the number of times I have heard at Model Shows over the past few years "I have too many kits, I'm getting older, I'll never have time to build them, so I'm selling some of them off."

As for the internet itself, I think it has breathed new life and opportunity for the hobby. I got back into modelling because of the internet. There were reference photos of subjects I had always wanted to build, but figured I would never be able to. There was the opportunity to connect with others with the same obsession, to work on the project together. I have been able to develop new skills, such as resin casting and computer drawing to produce laser cut parts I know I would likely never be able to produce on my own. Building Studio Scale has also meant obtaining kits that were almost impossible to find 10-15 years ago.

Will we see the day when there are no hobby stores in large cities; not likely. Will we see an explosion of new stores opening; nope. The hobby is in major transition, no doubt, but it ain't dead yet !

PS: When the 3D modellers get tired of looking at their screens they will want a physical copy of what they render. Real modelling will be required. With advances in technology, this could mean another renaissance.


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## PixelMagic (Aug 25, 2004)

Mr. Wabac said:


> PS: When the 3D modellers get tired of looking at their screens they will want a physical copy of what they render. Real modelling will be required. With advances in technology, this could mean another renaissance.


That's very true. I built models as a teenager, but I stopped doing it because I got into 3D graphics. I built and rendered many starships with 3D graphics. Now that I've been getting back into building real models again after playing with 3D for about 6 years.

They are both fun in their own way, but having a physical model is so much more rewarding.


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

PixelMagic... I'm the same story! I got into 3D animation in '88 and have worked in that field ever since... then, about 10 years ago... I started collecting interesting kits... and now I'm creating an original kit! I still love 3D... but it's become a bit work-like... and the physical models are my "play".


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## Nova Designs (Oct 10, 2000)

Well, that's certainly true. There's nothing like having the physical object right there in front of you.

But there are other levels to 3D that the majority of modelers never explore... like animation.


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## PixelMagic (Aug 25, 2004)

Nova Designs said:


> But there are other levels to 3D that the majority of modelers never explore... like animation.



I'm actually working on a warp-jump animation right now, of the U.S.S Bonadventure.


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