# Something new, same old theme



## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

As most of you know I use quite abit of Vitagoo in my styrene builds. T-jet Jim got me thinking about the tedious nature of wetting plastic and scraping up little wads of color matched bondo. It's repetitive and time consuming to say the least.

I've tabled my XKE project while I'm waiting for my detail its and bitties to arrive. I was just about to toss all the olive green remnants and then stopped in mid toss. I had an empty bottle of testors cement. I poured in some fresh cement, about a 1/4" inch-er-so, and funneled in the green scrap. Voila' 24 hrs later I had ready to use goo! I found that if you don't stir it up and let it settle a bit; the bottom has a sticky more solid consistency.
The upper layer is of course thinner for glazing and floating. I used the thinner upper glaze to chase a couple minor pinholes on the XKE with remarkable ease and success.

One of my current projects is a yellow HR Coupe. I quickly salvaged the parts of a yellow Camaro I intend to use. It was left over from my Woodster project. The scrap was diced and left to cook as before. 24hrs later I had made a fresh batch of nice yellow mud. The last of the pics show the results of a huge thicker skim floated/glazed with the thinner upper layer. 

It allows the use of parts that you couldn't ordinarily scrape for putty, due to their small size. The time saving factor was huge.

Pic 1: Bulk goo

Pic 2: I always develop the chassis first. Rear drop axle with narrowed slots and lowpros all round.

Pic 3: That's one of my bunk chassis with the max amount removed for forward taper at the magnet housing. It's a go-nogo jig for narrowing. The pie cuts were made to the body for the flat side vibe look.

Pic 4: The pie cuts were tacked and filled the nite before. This pic shows the camaro rear fenders spliced in. They were first tacked and then filled with a monster spread of Vitagoo I previously thought impossible. Yeah she's thick, but I'd rather block it off later than reskim if I come up low.


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## coach61 (Sep 6, 2004)

This is going to be fun to watch again! Great that you do such a detailed thread really anticipating the finished product!


Dave


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## roadrner (Jul 21, 1999)

What's taking so long, I'm ready for more pix! :devil: rr


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Update*



roadrner said:


> What's taking so long, I'm ready for more pix! :devil: rr


Just old and slow Dave! I've been pretty deep in correcting a botched 1:1 resto for friend that got hosed pretty bad. Really cuts into my modeling time. Gotta keep the lights on ya know.

Pic 1: The Camaro rear fenders have been installed and rough blocked in 320. 
A little cobbed yet, but the shape is coming around. It took 3 skims to get to this point. Probably one or two more to go. 

Pic 2: The drop axle chassis needed some serious forward pinch to fit the retro flat/vibe sides. It's the ragged edge for clearance. I guess I saw it coming, but as usual kept cuttin'. The front axle rails got wacked for body clearance as well. There was a bit of trickery on the pickup hangers and shoes to get it all packed under. The rear was tubbed at the magnet housing so the tires could be sucked in an 1/8th or so.

Pic 3: The rear apron got the ole tail light license plate delete. Looks like I don't have the transition to the rear fender quite right yet. Doh! The rear post pucker was one of the reasons the reason this bucket got wacked. I'll skim it during finishing. Gonna clean up those hangin' rear frame rails too!

The maximum will be taken out of the posts at some point. I usually sneak them down little bits at a time to avoid catastrophe. There's still way to much of the chassis skirt showing, which barfs me out. In process is a modified roof and windshield assembly that's taxing my patience a little. :freak: 

Stay tuned for more mayhem. :wave: 
BH


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## 41-willys (Jan 7, 2000)

All I can say is Wow!


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Bill, that is one awesome looking roadster! :thumbsup:


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## sethndaddy (Dec 4, 2004)

I love the size and look of the specialty rear tires.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

coach61 said:


> This is going to be fun to watch again! Great that you do such a detailed thread really anticipating the finished product!
> 
> 
> Dave


Thanks Coach! I think it's a leftover habit from Highschool Algebra- "Show All Your Work!"

41 willys: Thanks for the wow! It's the best description for how much work I bit off on this one. Doh!

Brian TX: Thanks Bud! Actually it's destined to be a coupe. I never liked the way the original roof was mounted so it got removed and changed. It's a lot easier to work on with the roof outta' the way.

Ed: Me too. Thanks! I've been on the speciallty mag kick lately. I scored a pile of them on fleabay a while back. Once I figured out how to overbore them straight and remove the flanges without killing them it's opened up some new avenues. I digem' cuz they actually look like a real wheel. LOL


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

man, that's nice. I want one!


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## JordanZ870 (Nov 25, 2004)

Bill, I have been doing my best to hold comment until this latest rod was complete, eh.
Well, I have to say that Aurora should have built it like this in the first place! What a truely beautiful rod! Please give thought to casting it, hey! Several of the guys (myself included) I am sure would LOVE to own a cast of it!Though you would no longer have the single most beautiful Aurora hotrod on the planet, you sure would make a bunch of guys extremely happy! Just a thought, mate!

Beautiful, simply beautiful! :thumbsup:


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*I'm not good, but at least I'm slow!*

Thanks VJ and can do. We can trade for some of your groovy paint work down the road. Scrounge up a tolerable shell and a carcass for donor fenders. In retrospect, a Ford J body is probably the ticket as it has a good broad, flat fender; and the inner arch is about the right height. 

I'm using the upper sections of the "J" spoiler and deck for my front windshield frame. Also a piece of a Camaro upper fender will be used to complete the forward roof edge. I had considered using the front hood apron from the Camaro as an old school visor but decided on the more rounded/blunt unvisored treatment. It will show off the full tinted glass that's on the cutting board. Sorta depends on whether you want a coupe or roadster. 

As I haven't finished the roof and WS frame yet (It may be gross!) Let's wait and see. Start scrounging now. I'm slow and the process has a lotta steps that cant be rushed IE: cure times. As usual, a bit of work then a bunch of waiting. Finger up my nose just like fourth grade. LOL :thumbsup: I would like to see one of these with a VJ's custom paint job; or you too Brian TX if your lurkin' along. 

I can build you the required drop axle chassis. Send me a chassis, or we can hack up one from my fleet of RTR's. The only requirement is a good gearplate, a square chassis and any AFX/Magna/Xtrac style picups . Nuthin' fancy. I'm runnin' low on the big rear specialty mags, but will probably re-order pretty soon. If you want hot dog parts start lookin' cuz I DHS right now for goodies. 

This ones been alot of fun. Much like the original "Pup" body, the ideas for future versions has produced an avalanche of mods and accessories to simmer. Frenched Ford J tail lights, outrigger eggcup headlights, AFX retro grill, side hood louvers from the AFX model A series, front motorcycle fenders with flush width tall boy slicks in the rear for the retro look. A rumble seat for Betty and Veronica.....I may be stuck on this body style for some time. Even though the Aurora HR versions have been done to death, I feel the need to whup the Pup and come up with something familiar yet different.

I can already see that this initial version is coming out a little too "Roid Coddington" for me, but the learning curve has been established. The end game is an HO scale facsimile of Jas' (Scratch) recent 1/32 blue coupe that will combine this project and what I learned about the tube/hairpin front ends on my Woodster project.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Not qualified!*



joez870 said:


> ........ Please give thought to casting it, hey!...... you sure would make a bunch of guys extremely happy! Just a thought, mate!


Garsh Joe, that's some high praise. I'm both flattered and humbled, but; "A man's got to know his limitations". (Dirty Harry)

What say you and I collaberate on the cast? Then whoever wants one could have one. Even if it mattered to me, and it doesnt!; I'd still have the original prototypes.

Although this ones destined for a lid, I think the first shot should be a roadster. I'm assuming it would be easier to cast than the coupe. It would also provide a wider array of options for finishing, Like rollbars, interiors, drivers and the windsheild of your choice or not.

Keep in mind that this version sits on a rear drop axle unit. Thats part of the illusion. I think it would be pretty goofus on the standard setup, but some guy's dig the highboy look too. I've never actually bottomed one out by shortening the posts, but I'm gonna find out fairly soon. Maybe a post shave will create enough of dump to reasonably replicate the original.

I feel that the group deserves all of credit as they always seem to inspire me to greater things. We could call it the "HT Hot Rod". (Hobby Talk Hot Rod) or the BJF (Bill and Joez Folly)  

Give me your thoughts Joe. It would be great fun to watch the evolution of something that fell outta' my junk pile.

I think it would be fun to do a run of completed cars: Cast by you, chassied by me, Art work by Jimmy and Brian, and allocated for Ed's Christmas "Not So Secret Santa Program" this year. I missed out last year, so I'm already one car down! Dangit. 

Certainly I would never make work or voluteer anyone for extra duty, but if we can get some of the gang on board it would be a cool group Holiday stunt. 

Please chime in guys!


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## win43 (Aug 28, 2006)

Bill,
You can put me in for a few  GREAT JOB!!!!


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Bill Hall said:


> I would like to see one of these with a VJ's custom paint job; or you too Brian TX if your lurkin' along.


Heck yeah man, I could definately have some fun painting up one of those rods :thumbsup: 

Someone please put me down for one of those resin casts if they come about one day :wave: 


I'm definately lurkin' alot lately....and working on restoring my bashed up CH VW Bug body.....this time with a shot of "house of Kolor" Limetime green pearl paint  Now it looks like a Spectraflame redline bug :thumbsup: 

I'm also working on a couple of projects for a friend of mine....they all want me to do thier custom work....lol!


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## roadrner (Jul 21, 1999)

Bill,

What can I add? The others have stated it pretty well. Wow, awesome, beautiful, and nice. All I can come up with is, Damn.  Talk about custom work. Looks especially fitting with your choice of wheels. a big two :thumbsup: :thumbsup:. Thanks, Dave


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

roadrner said:


> Bill, What can I add? The others have stated it pretty well. Wow, awesome, beautiful, and nice. All I can come up with is, Damn.  Talk about custom work. Looks especially firring with your choice of wheels. a big two :thumbsup: :thumbsup:. Thanks, Dave


Thanks for the double thumbs Dave!

Here's some progress pics-

Pic 1: The slot for the stock windshield has been filled. The interior was scribed out for painting access and access for glass placement. It will be re-installed in the end. Note the relief cut in the seat bolster for rear glass fitment. The "L" shaped pieces are Ford J rear fender tops including the rear spoiler. The roof angles in the J spoiler were flattened for a smooth transition. The little casting nodes on the inside of the roof bottom are removed. The roof can can now sit up and forward on the raised portion of the forward trunk apron right up against the rear seat bolster. What I consider to be the correct position on a pup. 

Pic 2: The J rails have been sectioned in the middle and installed. They were left long so I could fidget with them during assembly. It helped keep my fingers out of the goo. The upper hood/vent grill was filled at this time. 

Pic 3: Two skims, a little 600 later and we're getting close. Barely visible at this angle is the fresh air vent on the cowl. It was left for kicks. I don't like to kill all the details.

Pic 4: The roof was shortened north to south by about an 1/8". The rolled forward section was built from the upper front fender crown of of a Camaro. The lid is just sitting there till I fab all the windows, so for now it looks weird. The "A" pillars and windshield opening will be properly thinned once the roof is attached. At the same time the sharp forward roof edge will be rounded also.

Pic 5: A Comparo shows the new roof position. The final attachment will be seamless at the roof posts and trunk apron. After seeing this pic, I'll probably take a little more off the roof posts for more forward rake on the lid.

Thanks for lookin'


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Bill, that car is simply unreal man! I must have missed it....but is it sitting on a regular Tjet chassis? I have a couple of those bodies that are resin cast....but a regular Tjet chassis won't fit....and I don't own any slimline chassis 

You know, looking at the pics, I could easily see this body as a "highboy" style roadster.......sporting a custom "Duvall" windshield too..... :thumbsup: this body is like the legendary '32 Ford Duece coupe.....no matter how you choose to customize one, it'll turn out GREAT.


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

TX Street Racer said:


> Bill, that car is simply unreal man! I must have missed it....but is it sitting on a regular Tjet chassis? I have a couple of those bodies that are resin cast....but a regular Tjet chassis won't fit....and I don't own any slimline chassis


TX that is a Hot Rod TJET Body that he has done a great job modifying. You can buy these from Dash Motorsports. It looks so good you thought it was a slim line body. The thing I like the most is the lowered roof and how he moved it forward. Bill is a master with injected molded bodies. I tip my hat to him now what exhaust is he going to put on it 

Roger Corrie


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Hey Roger, THANKS for the info.... I'll have to get some play money soon and order a few of those chassis


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Hey Roger, Mud master is more like it! LOL. Thanks for following along and I appreciate the kind words. I'm glad you noticed the roof. The back was a can of corn, but the front near drove me nuts. Not shown yet are the relief channels for the front windshield and side glass. Look back a ways on one of the early pile-o-parts pics and you'll see the exhaust I chose. I'm not tellin yet.

Yo Brian! Ed (sethanddaddy) has NOS t-jet chassis'. Chris(dragula) hasem' too. I like to keep it in the family. That whole slimline thing doesn't grab me due to the performance limitations. I wanted to find the limit on the smooth side vibrator look body. For me Hotrods with peanut motors are philosophically wrong! LOL.

If you look back a ways in this thread you'll see the chassis development pics where it was narrowed and tubbed. Nuthin fancy, just standard butchery. I could'nt get a good shot of the pick up mods, but they're simple simon as well. I'll try and get a good shot of it, if you need it. This particular chassis has a rear drop axle as I chose the gigantor rear hides. It would have been a monster highboy had I not. Unless you dump the rear, post shaving is the option. However even the modified pickups get involved with the front fender arch pretty quick when you drop the posts. I'll shave a little off at some point, but I can already see problems with the front fender radius ahead. It's gonna be a fine line.

Brian your so right! I had some dudes restored Ardun coupe in mind when I was visualizing this bucket. I saw it in an old street rodder and it's been stuck in my head for years. Then Jas and Rick posted up some awesome coupes not to mention the general insanity in Ed's members customs thread. Every time a work on this project, more ideas pour out. If I can con Joe into casting this (he showed interest), I will build a master for him so everyone can play. It will be the roadster version with the wells filled completely to the skirt. That way the option exists for a smooth well, open wheeled highboy or cut and radius the wells for the more traditional look. I chose to execute the coupe first because there's more in store for the coupe. The roadster is just the simpler derivative. The current coupe is just a practice run to work the bugs out. The master for the highboy roadster version will be in process soon! 

Thanks for playin' along TX!

BH


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Hey Bill, I knew Chris is sitting on a mountain of Tjet chassis......I've been planning to order a bunch from him for me and my friends...whenever we actually have some play money....  

I looked back up in th post and saw the side shaved chassis........insane work man.....

Hopefully I'll get an opportunity to work on one of these bodies 


Keep up the progress


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## JordanZ870 (Nov 25, 2004)

Holy Hannah!

This ride is really moving along, eh! :thumbsup:
I am* interested in helping out with the second generation cast of this beauty, Bill.
It is the least I can do for your help on my 512m, hey, AND it means getting my hands on some of these bods! Bargain, yeah?!!

Now, if I can just figure out how to get you into chat this eve! 

Wed night slot car chat @ about 8pm (or so) central time. It is a great place to shoot the breeze and gather great ideas, eh! Come join a great bunch of guys!


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

joez870 said:


> Holy Hannah!
> 
> This ride is really moving along, eh! :thumbsup:
> I am* interested in helping out with the second generation cast of this beauty, Bill.
> ...


Joe I was hoping to have it going at the same time as your 512 so they could carpool back. Best laid plans of course. 

Arent the Dash HR bodies ABS? I wonder how they'd react to the Vitale method? ABS cement is pretty much the same schlock as Testor's liquid cement. I could crankem out quicker if the body was smooth, flat, no broken or warped areas like the new dash bods appear. Hmmmmm? Might just have to kill one and see. I think the ABS might make a sturdier more durable master, but that's just conjecture at this point.

As for Hobby Chat, what do I need or how do I get hooked up? Remember your talkin' to a computer Neanderthal here!


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Bill Hall said:


> As for Hobby Chat, what do I need or how do I get hooked up? Remember your talkin' to a computer Neanderthal here!



Bill, at the top of this Hobbytalk page is an orange colored box with different text.....click on the "chat" text....and another window will open up and ask you if you'd like to join chat.....then click YES.......


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Y'all hit the hay after chat, but it was still early in the boondocks, so I did a little more whittling.

Pic1: The windshield relief channels were thinned and squared a bit with a jeweler's file. The bolster notch for the rear glass got cleaned up as well.

Pic2: The glass was created from some of the last remnants of my Woody project. If you put your specs on and squint  , you'll just make out the vertical relief notch in the side glasses for fitment into the "A" pillars. The windshield has a reverse 45 bevel on the ends so it and the side glass can all nestle in the "A" pillar reliefs. Unfortunately the back glass will just be plastered in flat, I couldnt pull off the flushmount this time. Too thin! Chickened out!  

Pic3: I mocked up the glass with tape for a rough fit on the sides and bottoms. So far so good.

Pic4: Some Fords are held together with rubber bands. LOL. This one is no exception. The roof was cemented and after a couple hours the seams got their first skim at the "A" pillars and around the rear bolster. It was a good time to run away, so I finally went to bed!

Pic5: Today all the glass got a trial fit and a little filing here and there. It'll have to get polished before final installation. The glass had to be fit now. It will be installed after painting prior to re-installing the interior panel. 

I always liked the green tint AFX glass. It's a fairly mellow tint and has a nice luster. Plus I had a pretty good sized chunk of it to play with. Tonight I'll take a few cuts with 600 and see where I'm really at.

Thanks for lookin' - Bill


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## videojimmy (Jan 12, 2006)

sounds good, I'm in!


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## boss9 (Apr 19, 2002)

Lookin' good, Bill- 


It's coming right along...
You've got this plastic melting and forming down to a science!

I love watching you make a silk purse from a sow's ear-
This is just the injection HT needed. 
I for one look to pick your brain and try and get into doing one like you have.

We'll have to compare notes one eve'-

Thanks for the new hobby avenue, and stimulating the board! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: 


Cheers..


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Thanks for steppin' up!*



videojimmy said:


> sounds good, I'm in!


That's very cool VJ, I really wanted to make the first run of the roadster something cool for our members and/or hook it up with Ed's Christmas thing. I was even thinkin' of some kind of charity deal like Coaches nifty gig, but I don't want to steal his thunder. Ultimately I envisioned a cool ride that's been touched by many talented hands. A HT statement ride if you will. 

Brian is graciously on board as well. So you hopefully wont be too taxed. I'm still considering mangling up a couple new Dash hotrods for the master. They're not 40 yr old warbely styrene. It would be nice for Joez to start with something straight and strong. I wanna help'im anyway I can. So far no other caster has volunteered to offset some of the load, but I didn't exactly advertise either. 

Same goes for you and Brian. There's nothing more annoying than trying to paint a cobbled wad. So I'd like to have it skookum for the painters too. I really don't have any input on paint. I'm a less is more guy. Nuthin' fancy man! Just good even color, and some fat, slick clear for durability. Other then that I'll butt out. I'll leave it to your and TX's discretion and imagination. If you guys want to collaborate or maintain your autonomy; whatever, either way has it's advantages.

The more the merrier VJ. Many thanks,

Bill


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Boss, Pick Away!*



boss9 said:


> ....... I for one look to pick your brain and try and get into doing one like you have.
> 
> ..


 Should be easy Boss. Dad always said there was big a$$ hole between my ears. Bring your magnifying glass and tweezers. Just dont fall into the void. :freak: 

The styrene process is 90% fitting and 10% styrene technique. The trick is very much like welding/brazing/soldering or takin' a whiz. It's all about controlling your puddle.  Once you learn to make the stuff go where you want it, it flows out pretty nice. I use the dremel very little, just for extracting the required parts from donors and rough trimming. Seams are scribed for location with a small straightedge and or square. Then they're hand trimmed just shy of the scribe line with a #2 blade. Parts are then handfiled for precise fit and checked often. You could hold all the tools required in one hand. When I get fidgety, I just walk away.

I farted around with scrap chunks after my first disastrous GTO blob till I figured out the basics. Just like welding you need to master the butting and fillet joints, the rest falls into place easily. I learn something every time I pick up my goop. Planning ahead and being patient is the ticket. There's not much in the way of booboos that cant be fixed, especially if you over paint the whole shebang. Bare color matching without painting is another story. Hospital clean conditions are required to limit inclusions. So far I'm still touch and go with it.

Post up your Jag/vert so I can see where your at. Tell me what you want to do, and I'll try and walk you through it. I like to think about stuff for a while before I whip out the knives and glue. After you mentioned black the other nite, I started thinkin' that everyone whines about not having enough black scrap, and it hit me that I might be able to use junk track for black putty and parts! Same goes for the busted up old school wheel trollers for early shades of green,grey,and tan. I reckon it's all the same plastic. Wish I'd thought of it sooner! Doh!

Here's a pic of my first sculpted Goat. It was made from two mashed Tuff Ones bodies. The rear fenders are actually the fronts from the donor flipped around to fill the chainsawed rears. I had a good fit but hadn't quite mastered the glazing/wetting stage as evidenced by the pinholes and obvious seams. I think there's a piece of my finger (DNA) in there too! Never did get the roof straight, but it was in the dirt when I started. I keep it as is for a reminder of the beginnings.


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Bill, I'm happy to help in any way possible....... Jimmy, I'm down to bounce ideas with you man.....

Just whatever you guys want to do. I've had a couple of my friends do some customs for them lately......one being a really nice Tjet '70 Chevy Elky, which I hope to finnish this weekend......pretty much they give me an idea and I run with it......


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## boss9 (Apr 19, 2002)

Bill:

That is a kind gesture, and sounds like a fun project for the board.  



Bill Hall said:


> Should be easy Boss. Dad always said there was big a$$ hole between my ears. Bring your magnifying glass and tweezers. Just dont fall into the void. :freak:
> 
> 
> Bare color matching without painting is another story. Hospital clean conditions are required to limit inclusions. So far I'm still touch and go with it.
> ...


You are much better than you think you are!
So good in fact- that you worked the Goat enough, that it actually looks like a Firebird!   




Cheers..

Ps- I'd be up to lending a hand (literally) with the HT body anyway I can-


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

boss9 said:


> .......You are much better than you think you are!
> So good in fact- that you worked the Goat enough, that it actually looks like a Firebird!
> 
> Cheers..
> ...


Haysoos Christoos! Had my GTO project on the brain. It's in about the same condition as the old red F'bird was. :drunk: 
Doh!!! Look's like I'm the "goat" now. Good catch Boss. One handed no less!

For my defense: They might as well be the same car when viewed from my hack and chop perspective. They all look like victims to me!

I probably should have been more specific. I actually meant the old wheel controller for the goo process. You'd probably have to cut my lifeless corpse from a tree if the purists ever caught me whackin' up trailers for putty! They're kinda persnickity that way. - Fascists! 

Post the Jag when you can. I like to plan ahead and ponder my pending folly. I'm thinking I'd like to send you my copy of Vitale's book, if you dont have it. I'm definatly done with it, so it should go where it can best be used.

I'm also trying to work out a spray-able version of the "Vitagoo" that may alleviate the whole spot matching issue. I was thinking a guy could repair a panel and if the match was poor or there was some grotesque inclusion, he could just top coat the panel and run it all the way out to the seams. Heck you might be able to shoot the whole rig and only your hairdresser would know for sure. It's still in the conceptual stage, but I don't see why it wouldn't work. Did I say that? LOL. I've got a pile of scrap bods just waiting to give their lives for the greater good.

As for the roadster group project, your support means a lot. I've had a blast on this board. In a few short months I've met some interesting, talented and gracious people. Along the way I've learned many new things that I other wise wouldn't have. 

I build stuff that just sits there and gets ripped around the track once in a while. Whoopty doo! The whole Deuce coupe/roadster thing was just too cool not to be shared with people who can relate. Posting pics of another shelf queen is one thing, ooh ahh baby baby, next pic! Certainly inspiring, but actually having one to play with is where it's at. :thumbsup: 

Yeah the Deuce has been done to death and rightfully so. I was just lookin' for something out of the norm. Most of the current versions are fat on scale, too wide in the cab/cowl area so they fit the high zoop wider chassis. The other end of the scale is the anemic slim line chassis method for all show and very little go! 

We have many artisans in this group whether they'll cop to it or not. I figured why not turn some of that talent outward in a collaborative effort. Ed's Christmas exchange, and Coaches current charity effort are good examples of that which brings us all closer together in the spirit of the hobby. Hopefully this little diversion of mine will do the same.

I cant wait to see all the mods and permutations this bunch will come up with. Gentlemen, Start your dremels!  

I really couldn't imagine all the twists to come, and for me that's half the fun.

Keep your wing in the sling!

Bill


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## boss9 (Apr 19, 2002)

And I thought I was seeing things! 
GoatBird?? GT-bird-O?? :freak:

I need to back up with you a bit-
What the heck is Vitagoo? Is this some chemical swill you’ve invented or a shelf product?
I think a spray form of it would be champion in a final application.

And I’m still in the dark about the trailers and the spare plastic-
For extra plastic were you referring to the old steering wheel controllers that were gray, green and beige? 
If you are referring to the old vibe trailers- yeah, slot freaks can get a bit bent over that. Although I do have another stake trailer in not the best of shape-

On the HT car:
I will need to know what you would want me to do-
What will I need to supply-
How many will be done-
What _year_ is the finished product due-
What _generation_ will these be given too- 

I dug out my Jags’ and sadly realized- I must of rid myself of the other black one (I had 2 besides a mint one). 
So here is a pic’ of the lot-










This black one (which I would’ve liked to do) has no front window posts—(no biggie,) but most importantly, it has been cut in the rears :drunk: and ever-so slightly sanded on the fronts (the fronts are ok by me).

So whatever you deem as input, I’ll take heed with.  
Thank you for taking me under your roof with doing this stuff.

I would absolutely love to page through that book!
This would give me something to prime me for the work-

This is exceptionally generous of you!  
I’m sure I’ll find something around here as gratitude-

I can pm you w/my addy’

Thank you very much Bill, for your tips, tricks, help and input!

Cheers, Mate!


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Better living through chemistry*

Sorry Boss! Forgive me. "Vitagoo" is a "Billism" It's my monicker for Vitale's styrene/testors cement blend used for the repairs. The original process involves wetting small patches of scrap with cement and scraping/working it vigorously into a paste or mud if you will.

All well and good for a nicknack repair, but dauntingly tedious for what most of us are up against. The process is time consuming enough due to cure times to be fiddling around with itty bitty skims of repair mud. Let alone the constant cleaning a fidgeting with your knives.

After the Cowpie XKE, in which I almost lost my mind, I had a accumulated a good sized pile of scrap bitties. I was on the verge of chucking them. Then I thought why the hell not? I poured off a bottle of testors down to about a 1/4 full and funneled the clean bits in. I shook it up and walked away for 24 hrs. When I returned, viola'! Vitagoo was born. Yee-fricken-ha! More than enough ready to use putty complete with applicator brush.

Interestingly, if you don't agitate it to much the bottom layer can be scooped out and troweled directly into the wound for a good high solids fill/first skim. once I get the fill down I use the thinner top layer of the bottle to float out the repair thus chemically smoothing/sanding saving mass conventional sanding later. Keep in mind that all patches and repairs are first glued in with straight cement and allowed to thoroughly cure before you start slinging mud. If you do a booboo like lumps or wads they to can be reactivated with cement and brushed smooth if you catch them in time.

Each layer must cure! 24 to 48 hrs. If it's weird or lumpy knock it down carefully with 320 then 600. Usually 320 is not necessary unless you really lump it up. Take care not to overrun the repair with the 320 as you will have to repair any overzealous sanding scratches. (If you look back I use a lot of tape to protect the areas out side the repair, and often mummify the whole darn car to protect against scratching and the glue getting away. It can occasionally run onto the next panel if you've got it too thin. Be safe!

Repeat the process until you get the area proud. High spots are generally no big deal. Keep chasing the low spots and finish out with 600. When I've completed an area with 600, I use straight cement to seal/glaze the repair for the interim. Dunk the brush and squeeze it out against the side of the bottle then stroke it across the repair. You'll note a shine almost like clear coat. A little allegro is required here. get it on quick and don't over work it or you'll re-activate the styrene. Gently with a light touch is the ticket! It's very much a dry brush technique as they use in water color painting or faux finishes. It'll quickly scuff off with 1200 when you get to the later stages. No worries! Move on to the next repair.

By the time you get all the way around the car you may notice the inevitable shrinkage here an there on previous repairs. If necessary use the thin stuff from the bottle and float on a layer around the shrinkage with the applicator brush. Once the car seems to your liking I wet sand the whole shebang in 1200. I fill the sink with luke warm water and a few drops of dishsoap for a dispersant. Helps keep the paper clean and cutting true. I do this for all sanding stages. Again I dry brush/glaze the body. Let it cure and look very close for any previous grit/stage sanding marks that pop up they must be corrected if your gonna buff. There's more of course, but that's a nutshell view of my insanity!

I see three Jags in the pics. I'd do the red one first. It's a forgiving color and not exceptionally rare. Be a good one to cut your teeth on. Were it me, I'd swap the good fenders from the one with the missing window posts onto the car with the good posts. Window posts are not for the uninitiated. Maybe a bumper delete with a mud fill or use the top forward and rear sections to fill the bumpers by sectioning instead of filling. Fairly straight forward stuff.

I do the yellow one next. Cant really see the damage in the pics. Perhaps another bumper fill, or a convertible project. Need to see those better. Yellow is a bitch and will be a good lesson by magnifying every little mistake. Having to overpaint yellow white and tan is often the rule. Even if your scrupulously clean it may not pass muster.

The black one looks like just fender wells, unless you want to vert it. It'd be a pretty rare duck with no lid! Start scouting for some black Tuff ones Lolas or AFX model A fender modules. Any black post will do, but I prefer the older black(harder) to the newer black(softer). Unless they're grenaded through the hood or trunk, they're a can of corn to fix. I'm still thinkin' good used track for the donor black plastic. I'll try some and let you know how it works. Make a fender template when you do the red one and have the sections in your hand they will be very helpful on shaping the black ones! Trust me.

The whole thing about the old plastic controller housings refers to the difficulty in finding suitable donor material for some of the earlier shades which are subtly different. Busted "wheel controllers" are a dime a dozen. I was just ramblin on 'bout nuthin'.

The Hot rod project concerns me in that Joez will be holding the bag on all the casting, unless we can get somebody to jump in. VJ and TX will handle the painting/graphic end and I'm not as concerned. They will split the load. Maybe someone else will volunteer too.

Once I've got the chunks in hand, I wont let any grass grow under my feet! I'll knock out the master for Joez ASAP. Maybe two, just in case. I will also make the rear drop axle chassis for the first run if y'all think it's a good idea. There are some incidental AFX parts required for the dump. Namely pickups and springs, and maybe wheels. The wheels are light and cheap with a good cool factor, and of course tires. I was thinkin' that Ed has NOS chassis for sale although I haven't directly contacted him yet. 

How about a short first run of half a dozen, VJ and TX can create three schemes a piece. We'll post up the six complete versions and cast our bread upon the waters. Perhaps people will just want the shell and I've over thought the whole enchilada. 

No later than the holidays would be nice. Sooner is always better.  
Please give me your thoughts straight from the hip. E-mail is [email protected]


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## boss9 (Apr 19, 2002)

Bill:

Thank you for re-hashing the finer points and details I'd missed from your previous posts.  

I've shot off an email to you-
Thank you very much, Sir!

Cheers, my Firend!
phil


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## TX Street Racer (May 8, 2004)

Hey Bill, I'm great at painting...but I severely SUCK at graphics design.......so if you need graphics and such for the cars you might want someone else to step in with that who has experience...and a printer that's worth a damn...  

I for one can't wait to see this project completed though....it's going to be ALOT of fun......


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Poor choice of words on my part TX! I was thinking more like blends or fades, two tones, stripes. Graphics not in the literal sense, but from the painters third eye. 

My Bad. Sorry. I forgot that graphics has taken on a new definition since the computer age. Old fart, brain goes soft......zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

I would like to find out how they do the flames on the MMotoring cars. Deuce roadster+bad ass flame job= :thumbsup: 

Something to ponder along the way for the future. Crap just pops into my head and flies outta' my mouth. :tongue: BH


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## vaBcHRog (Feb 19, 2003)

Bill Hall said:


> I was on the verge of chucking them. Then I thought why the hell not? I poured off a bottle of testors down to about a 1/4 full and funneled the clean bits in. I shook it up and walked away for 24 hrs. When I returned, viola'! Vitagoo was born. Yee-fricken-ha! More than enough ready to use putty complete with applicator brush.


Bill and everyone,

You can take bills technique and use the plastic form an old 9 inch curve and BINGO instant track putty to fill cracks and use for repairing your track. Perfect match color wise too

Roger Corrie


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## gear buster (Dec 1, 2005)

*Graphics..*

Flames!!!!!! Did I hear Flames..  :roll: 
The flames on the JL cars are all Tampo I believe..
To paint flames and graphics...Free hand it..LOL :thumbsup: 
Or if you have a freind with a decal cutter , get him to cut you a low tac mask.. A freind and I experimented and found with the right cutter you can get damn small and super detailed in the flames..well it depends how wild you want to go.. :freak: If ya need more help just yell ..After I have a few more coffeeeee I might beee abblee tttooo pppaaiinttt...


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Thanks GB. When I looked at the pics of the Aurora deuce body, I noted that there was finally some room along the front hoods that has been filled. I'm thinkin' it may look kinda nekid. I'm still scheming on some old school tall vertical hood louvers on the side hoods, perhaps on a later version with the Darda grill. For now a simple flame option would be slick. Something that could never be done well on the original HR. The top hood is smooth now that the center grill has been filled. Lots more room for correct "flamage".

Again, nuthin' too crazy. If you've been following along, VJ and TX were volunteered to do the first paint run on the bods, or more if they care to.
The plan is to knock some out and see how the response is, or of people just want Joez cast shell to play with. 

As you noted, good flames should appear crisp and lineal, stretched if you will, properly spaced with good compound curves and proportional tapers/tips where they need to be. A few stop and gos really changes their character as well, instead of the continuous uninterrupted run. My observation is that often times flames appear compressed and lumpy on production slot cars. I was asking about the MM flames more from the perspective of what I don't want to see; or how they could be corrected/improved. 

GB, As I've said before, this is a volunteer project and the more talented people that touch it along the way the better. If you wanna jump in on the flame thing in some capacity, that would only improve the finished product. As far as painting goes, I'm an open the fluid needle, boost the air pressure and blow some material kinda guy. Screw the runs, I'll razor and sand them off later. LOL. Not the dude you want laying flames!

If something can be worked out on some simple flame masks they could be sent to VJ and TX. If you want to jump in with both feet and leave some of your DNA on these bodies and go over the top all the better! Y'all can compare notes and the bodies can be shipped to you from TX and VJ for anything you want to let loose on them. I reckon it's really up to the paint crew to decide; so they're apples to apples on colors, top coats, or details. I'd just be meddling and corrupting the originality of the individual processes. The master will be started tomorrow. Once the master is sent to Joez, the creativity portion is outta' my hands unless he recommends some mods. 

I really have no expectations or final vision on the end product. The mere fact that the project will travel all over the U.S. from skilled hand to skilled hand is pretty trippin' in it's own way. Sorta' the mobile version of Pimp My Ride. This deuce will be a custom by committee. It's a democracy after all.

Joez, VJ, TX, Boss; sing out, chime in! Wadda y'all think? 

Bill




Bill


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