# This weeks carnage



## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Here's some final pics of the Crushstang. Top coat was cooked from an old blue tuff ones controller. This one gave me fits. Adhesion was poor and resulted in a rescuff and shoot. Lot's of detail I worked hard to preserve went ba-bye. I've never had an adhesion problem prior so I'm gonna assume that there's something up with that particular plastic. I was crushed...LOL. Sits on a standard t-jet chassis with a hop up pinion. Gears are lapped and she runs out smooth and sweet.

Ed's speedline Willy's got a final wet sand in 1200. Ordinarily I like to go 1500 but the speed line is a different plastic. Quite a bit softer than regular t-jet plastic and the 1500 wasnt cutting it. Pic reflects two or three passes with AFX black. It was cooked from a coupla Shadows courtesy of Bobzilla. The busted A pillars came out decent. I'll poke some silver accents back on it in a few days. Didnt have a glass for it in my menagerie, so Ed's gonna have to scrounge one up. I was thinking the purple glass from a tuff ones edition would be kinda cool. Final pics in a few days... we're still a bit sticky.


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## christos_s (Jan 16, 2008)

They look very nice, congrats Bill.

Uh-hm what do you mean "top coat form a controller"??


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## JordanZ870 (Nov 25, 2004)

christos_s said:


> They look very nice, congrats Bill.
> 
> Uh-hm what do you mean "top coat form a controller"??


oh! let me, let me! (give ya a bit of a break, Bill. You have had to field this often enough. LOL):wave:

Christos, the blue Mustang was actually molded in white and stepped on...HARD!. After the repairs were made to the body,The blue TOP COAT was applied. Bill melted blue plastic from an old blue slot car controller and sprayed it on with his airbrush! . There are numerous threads here abouts that discuss "Billrene" (Bill+ styrene) or GOOP (as Bill calls it).

The stuff is easy to make and requires patience to work with, but the results can surely be stunning! (see Crushstang pics)

Hope this helps!


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Old plastic for new*

It goes like this Christos. I began restoring t-jets a few years back. Picked up Mike Vitales (MEV originals) book on restoration. There in are the instructions for basic repairs to styrene bodies. During the first year I worked on mastering Mikes process. It's not something you just pick up and do, there's a huge learning curve, and it requires lot's of practice and patience.

After I "fingered" the process out and was comfortable with it, I found the process somwhat lacking. You see the bulk of my "car-reer" was spent in automotive restoration and customizing. I'm what they call a shop lizard. 

'Lil cars or big cars they all share some commonalities, so during the second year I worked towards incorporating 1:1 production autobody technology into the Vitale technique.

In a nutshell the plastic is melted, actually chemically cooked. The first hurdle was creating quantity. The original process use's a scrath and puddle technique that produces a meager yeild that at best is cumbersome to work with. I wanted to be able to open a jug and go to work with enough material to avoid the constant "hunt a peck" interuption of scraping up little gooey wads of liquified plastic. 

I finally developed a brushable form of liquid plastic in mass quantities. So in effect I could then repair huge areas with ease. Later on I learned to adjust the plastic ratio to produce glazes and washes that one uses in the later stages of body work where you want more flow and less build of solids.

Color matching was always a problem as not every batch from the factory was created equally. There are a myriad of subtle shade variations. This presents a huge problem...it looks bad!

The final solution came when I figured out how to shoot it through an airbrush. It allowed the blending of repaired panel areas, complete oversprays, and even complete color changes. This made precise color matching a non-factor. This is not to say that one cant produce acceptable finishes with out the airbrush. I still use the old school wet sand, cut and rub aka "color sanding" all the time. This produces a finish undiscernable from the factory. That said, my airbrush finishes have a depth and luster that look great. Future and clearcoats actually dulls them down. Purely happenstance, thats just the way they come off the gun, a side effect I can live with.

So that's how it goes. I make new cars from old ones. Very little goes to waste here. Vitales book is worth it you're interested. It covers most contingencies and has valuble intel.

All the guys have seen these but they are a good reflection of the process.
The blue bug was shattered. I reassembled it on a dare. The plastic has been revitalized and is no longer brittle. Dont even remember what the blue repair plastic was cooked from. she's still sitting unfinished. Threw some mods at it for fun. 

The yellow high boy is a mutation of Aurora Hot Rod coupe and an Indy racer. Again I've long forgotton what the top coat was cooked from but it is AFX bright yellow. Last time I checked it was still sittling in the exhaust shop.

The Willys pick up is made from bits of half a dozen cars. A recent build that has yet to be sprayed. 

Sectioning is covered in the book, IMHO it's probably the most enjoyable part of cookin' plastic. You can make darn near anything!


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

LMAO Joe!

Thanx for thinking of me. 

I rekon it's a little like a television sit com...occasionly I have to repeat an episode for folks who just tuned in. Re-runs of Goop.

At some point I'll have to dig into the archives and compile some sort of coherant pictoral document... for $29.95 LOL!

Unfortunately all the ancient pics are long since dumped so any archiveal spelunking will only result in dry reading and may also cause confusion in that the process has morphed considerably over time. Enter at yer own risk!


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## win43 (Aug 28, 2006)

Great work again Bill. :thumbsup::thumbsup: I'm gonna have to send you some more stuff to fix


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

Bill Hall said:


> Here's some final pics of the Crushstang. Top coat was cooked from an old blue tuff ones controller. This one gave me fits. Adhesion was poor and resulted in a rescuff and shoot. Lot's of detail I worked hard to preserve went ba-bye. I've never had an adhesion problem prior so I'm gonna assume that there's something up with that particular plastic. I was crushed...LOL. Sits on a standard t-jet chassis with a hop up pinion. Gears are lapped and she runs out smooth and sweet.
> 
> Ed's speedline Willy's got a final wet sand in 1200. Ordinarily I like to go 1500 but the speed line is a different plastic. Quite a bit softer than regular t-jet plastic and the 1500 wasnt cutting it. Pic reflects two or three passes with AFX black. It was cooked from a coupla Shadows courtesy of Bobzilla. The busted A pillars came out decent. I'll poke some silver accents back on it in a few days. Didnt have a glass for it in my menagerie, so Ed's gonna have to scrounge one up. I was thinking the purple glass from a tuff ones edition would be kinda cool. Final pics in a few days... we're still a bit sticky.


I like the way the coat of plastic smoothed out the lines on the stang, it gave it a custom look! Your Willy's looks like one I am working on, spliced in some new styrene for the wheel well cut outs in back then shot with Krylon. I don't have spray plastic technology! They look great Bill....


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## bobhch (Apr 22, 2007)

*Love to see this kinda stuff Bill....thank you!*

Blue Mustang........Ooooh Yeah & the Black Willys......Yeah Baby!

Love them.....love them....love them!!!! :woohoo:

Bob..."nice work bill"...zilla


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Thanks guys! 

It's still tons of fun to bring little cars back from deaths door. Ed's Willy's provided a great oppurtunity to experiment with black plastic. I've got four black XKEs with pillar and post damage. Being able top coat in black puts my mind at ease and I can see all four coming back to the land of the living.

Next up is the final wet sanding on VJ's "O guage bummer". Got some final spit and polish on Jerry's turquoise Toronado yet to do but it's real close. His olive Toronado has the busted A-pillars roughed out and the first two skims on the chainsawed rear wells. The rear post is 'sploded and awaiting a transplant. Strangely they both had about the same damage. The Toronado is similar to the Mako, very robust down low and rather wimpy above the cowl line.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

So here's a few shots of Win's olive Toronado after the pass side has been re-spliced and the driver side was grafted. Typically the pass side splice has bowed back out slightly. I'll re-activate the pillar and shove it back after the next skim has cured. The driver side graft was actually a flat chunk. After it was bonded and had a little time to set up a second application was applied and allowed to set for a few minutes. At the right moment a 000 brush is used to pull a snotty strand of plastic up the pillar to begin the seam detail. Once it was slobbererd into position it was gently brushed down with testors to smooth it into the pillar. This trick saves time after profiling when I begin to chase the seams. A rudimentary line will be present and much easier to follow than freehanding the cuts.

Just had to mount Ed's Willy's up and check the well clearance one more time. Some times in spraying a top coat the solvents will cause the plastic body to wander a bit and potentially bind the tire (s). Especially cars with tight well clearances. Such was not the case today and Ed's Willy's will be going home soon.:thumbsup:

Also pic'ed is one of the occassional nightmare cars that come my way. The rare drab olive Charger. "She's KFC extra crispy" on the Model Murdering brittleness scale. The A pillars were broken and warbled which is no big deal, however the glass is hammered down with a giant glue wad the size of a dime. I'm trapped! Ordinarily I'd remove the glass and spray some testors on the inside to revitalize the brittle plastic body. Makes fixing the pillars a lot easier too when you can work the backside! Cant dremel the out the "original" glass. Cant pry it out cuz the glass is three times thicker than the roof...it'll tear the roof right out. This ones gonna take quite a while to tip toe around and straighten cuz I'm hogtied. I'm on very thin ice here given the value of the body.:freak:


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## roadrner (Jul 21, 1999)

Can't get over the repair job on that Tornado. One would never know just by the pic. Great job(s) Bill! :thumbsup::thumbsup: Dave


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## Hilltop Raceway (Feb 12, 2006)

Bill, Were you the one who repaired all of the Dukes of Hazzard cars from the TV show??? They had a new Charger after every jump, usually the fenders were bent, window posts bent, etc. It had to be you!!! I'm truley amaaaaaaazzzzzed!!! Thanks for pics and the techniques. I think I'll just send my cars to you... RM


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

roadrner said:


> Can't get over the repair job on that Tornado. One would never know just by the pic. Great job(s) Bill! :thumbsup::thumbsup: Dave


Dave: Sometimes I even fool myself. Now that the color match thing is under control I'm working towards fooling Bob Beers! 3 years ago if ya'd a told me I'd be doing microscopic body work on t-jets...I'da laughed you out of town!
So far the Toronado A pillar is about the most difficult thing I've encountered with the extra wrap around double seam detail.

Randy: Yer just about on the money with the Dukes thing. Instead of fenders and hoods it's hopping from pillars to posts. I actually look forward to ragged wheel wells and exploded cars to take some of the monotony out!


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## JordanZ870 (Nov 25, 2004)

Bill Hall said:


> SNIP:
> Instead of fenders and hoods it's hopping from pillars to posts. I actually look forward to ragged wheel wells and exploded cars to take some of the monotony out!


Well, why didn't ya say so! I have a piece or two that my poor skills and poorer confidence would make a mess of. You could do them if ya like? LOL I am still cutting my teeth on hotrods!:thumbsup:


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## gear buster (Dec 1, 2005)

*Gives GOOP a new meaning.*

Bill,

I love to see the GOOP cars. They are so smoOOOooth and cool how you spray the plastic.:thumbsup:
Looks like the Stang has a little chop going there.:woohoo:
Lets see..... You can Chop them apart , Reassemble even with a chop , and spray the filler which in turn becomes the color , and presto..
What more can you ask for.. 
You give a whole new meaning to hand full of GOOP..
Great work there Bill.. Keep'um comin...:thumbsup:


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## T-Jet Racer (Nov 16, 2006)

Hey Bill, grind the glass out and get another one. I think that would be better than a ripped roof... jmo...


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Do no harm vs wingin' it*



T-Jet Racer said:


> Hey Bill, grind the glass out and get another one. I think that would be better than a ripped roof... jmo...


T-jet: No can do!

a. not my car, Id have already murderfied it if it was mine. (Really I'm just pee whining cuz it's a bastage) 

b. original drab olive charger, ya know how those mopar freaks can 
be...snicker 

c. it can be done without glass removal :thumbsup:

d. applying a dremel to an extremly brittle car (plastic expolsives) with already thin proportions is bad juju and inviting the devil to dinner. :freak:

e. I've blown up enough brittle cars to know one when I see one.:drunk:

f. "Danger, Will Robinson!"

Gear Buster: Tinted mud! Yessiree Your observations are spot on. The liquid plastic has one other great advantage. Unless it's a color change (usually a tale of woe); if ya happen to cut through when blocking it's no great shakes. Also no need for primer. The filler is the same color and approximate density as the parent material, so ghost lines and edge lift along your feathering are a non issue. Mud is paint and paint is mud.

Joe: Just jump in the pool. Whatever yer workin on is already broken...duh? No reason ya cant just fix yer mistakes like I do. I still fubar on a daily basis with gusto! If I make too many fubars, I cut them up and hide them in the next jar of goop when nobody is lookin'. Keeps my bench clean and the inventory fresh! :woohoo:


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## JordanZ870 (Nov 25, 2004)

Bill Hall said:


> Snip:
> 
> Joe: Just jump in the pool. Whatever yer workin on is already broken...duh? No reason ya cant just fix yer mistakes like I do. I still fubar on a daily basis with gusto! If I make too many fubars, I cut them up and hide them in the next jar of goop when nobody is lookin'. Keeps my bench clean and the inventory fresh! :woohoo:


HAHAHAHAHAHAH! Good point, Bill! You got it!:thumbsup:


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## BKracer (Sep 25, 2005)

insane and beeyootifull finish!!!thats some space age stuff!!when did you martians arrive on this rock!!???


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## sethndaddy (Dec 4, 2004)

WEEEEEEEEEEEE..............theres been so many posts lately I have'nt read up on all of them till now......and I see my little Black Willys sitting there all pretty and ready......I have to dig out some glass..........
speaking of.......can glass be tinted with the "clear" paints?


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

BK: The martians landed on my paint bench about a year and half ago.

Ed: The minor brush touches are done. It'll be lost in the mail soon. I made an exception to my "No clear over sprayed styrene rule" and sealed it down with some tight, shiny clear. Should be very durable in the event that Sethy wants to take it for a spin. 

Tinting windows is something that I havent dabbled in although I've pondered it occasionally. Joez uses felt pens, I think. On my list of to do's is to check out those translucent paints in a "Farts and Crap" store like Micheals. The kind the kiddies use for painting glassware. Pretty sure it's some kind of acrylic. I was just gonna give it a whirl on an old junk glass and see what happens.


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## gear buster (Dec 1, 2005)

*glass tinting*

Bill , Ed,

Ever try Ritz Fabric dye... 
Mix it in luke warm water..(The powder type) 
The liquid type just pour in a container and warm a little.
Place the clear or white plastic parts in and let soak for an hour or so.
Depends on the darkness you want. 
Dye will adhire to the plastic like staining wood and won't come off.
Instant tinted winders. I do it for model cars I need tinted. Took a little practice to get it just right but the effects are great.:thumbsup:
I think you will like the way it works. Gets darker as it dries. Need more put it back in and go as warm as the plastic will handle. Works better


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*D'Oh!!!!*

Thanx for joggin' my head Steve. I now remember that you had posted this trick some time in the wayback...but I'm old and as Coach will remind ya's....I'm old and I've have slept since then :freak: 

Greatly appreciated Gear Buster! :thumbsup:

You tuned in Ed?


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## SplitPoster (May 16, 2006)

No Ritz dye around here, but, hmmmm, wonder if there is some clear junk glass around here to dip with the Easter eggs? LOL Lots of pastel colors..... but I'm guessing it wouldn't work nearabout as well. Fabric dye, Nice tip, wonder how it would tint bodies? Dip Front end of car, pull out gradually to shade? Just got me to thinking... that's dangerous. 

Bill, what's this about the martini's landing on your workbench?


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## neophytte (Sep 14, 2006)

sethndaddy said:


> speaking of.......can glass be tinted with the "clear" paints?


I believe it can, or use some Future with food colouring to tint. Please note I haven't tried this, please have a look at:

http://www.swannysmodels.com/TheCompleteFuture.html

Cheers

Richard


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*"No Hurry!"*

Hahahahaha , probably the worst thing ya can say to me...Jerry!

Started on Win's olive Toronado a ways back and sorta poked at some of the initial repairs.

Fixed weird pinhole in the roof and roughed the A pillars around with a graft er two...then set it aside to dry. Picked it up again this week and began by fixing the 'sploded rear screw post. It was terminal and required a transplant. Also spent a little time in the rear wells to add some material.

Cut the first pass on the A pillars back and rekimmed them. After a coupla days the seam detail was scribed in and the pillars were sanded and skimmed again. Also blended the roof repair in and sanded it down in preperation for final polish. The rear wells were re-radiused with the trusty sanding pencil and the outer fender flares were contoured into the quarters.

Currently in 1200 which means we're pretty close to final polishing, save for some picking and digging at a few of the minor details.


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Can you hear me now? Probably not!*

Cuz I cooked yer phone into goop. Tossed this one in for fun. 

Sometimes ya gotta break a few eggs. This drab olive charger had been pushing my buttons for a while. Coundnt push the vent posts back straight using my usual softening technique. The roof had the usual tell tale "creak" indicative of a break it but I just couldnt find it. Hidden behind the glass on the inside...duh...but kinda odd... given that pillar/roof joint usually cracks out along the leading edge.

Finally got mad enough and gave it a good yank...of course this seperated the roof from the pass A pillar that was hanging by a thread. Repair goop was provided by Ma Bell and is a dead on match.

All things being equal I guess I got a lucky "break". I didnt break the driver side pillar and the vent posts popped up straight given that they were loaded with solvent. Down side is now I gotta re-paint the roof!:freak:


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## Dragula (Jun 27, 2003)

Cool Bill! NOW GET MY 55 DONE!!!! lol!
DRAGjet


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Kid gloves*

Roger Wilco Drag! Yer fiddy fie is in the batters box. Ya know I never rush the first cut! PLAN carefully...cut once! She's a rare duck.

Errr woops ..."Oh dude sorry 'bout those cherry header pipes that're right in my way....well not any more!" We can goober them back on so they look kinda crooked...er.... stock! :thumbsup:

Awwww "kerschlip"! Oh man sorry I harpooned yer mint blue tinted glass so bad that the good Lord mimself couldnt polish it out!

Now where's that darn dremel? I got a new carbide "destructo" burr I wanna try out!


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## Dragula (Jun 27, 2003)

Bill "he said he was in there combing his hair!!!How was I to know what he was doing!!!""
DRAGjet


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*The Shadow knows*

Ok Drag here's the skinny. These are fairly routine once you get past the hard part, which is getting the old mounts pared away cleanly. Working space for whittling is really cramped with a bunch of flimsy things in jeopardy like headers and traction bars. A clean joint is a strong joint.

By da numbers...

1. What was left of mounts bottom hook was carefully blunted off with the electric knife. Then the remnants were cleaned flush with a straight gouge and tourniquet at the ready...LOL.

2. Replacement mounts were pilfered from a shadow and trimmed to fit using on of my cherry 55's as a guide. In general the Shadow has robust mounts when compared to the 55's and has a considerable amount of material to work with laterally because it's a fairly wide body. Only the bottom half of the mount was replaced. This allowed me to keep the top of the factory mount in tact to use as a registration point, thus ensuring the chassis will fit exactly as it did before.

3. Both the mounts and body are pre-wet with solvent and carefully slid/gooshed into place and checked for square.

Walked away for a bit...:thumbsup:

4. Came back and refloated the bonds with some more solvent to fill any misses or dry spots and fabbed up some side gussets. Chris requested reinforcement and given the spliced mount it was mandatory for a drag car that will receive frequent body removal for service. The multiple grafts and mounts were nailed down with a 50/50 mix of black AFX goop and solvent.

5. Snapped a chassis in this morning to check fit...snug as a bug!

She's gonna have to sit a few days for good cure. The rear mounts have just a slight bit of flash hanging below the rocker (just visible from the outside). Gotta wait 'til things harden up to trim the final half MM away with a quick slice.

All good Chris!


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## Dragula (Jun 27, 2003)

Tommy want wingys!!lol!
DRAGjet


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Up sell*



Dragula said:


> Tommy want wingys!!lol!
> DRAGjet


Sure thing Drag. Customer is ALWAYS right! I'll upholster it Mardi Gras style and grease to please. Would you like dem wings traditionally mounted... OR can I interest you in the Star Warts X-Wing fighter package with scoop mounted laser cannon for a few dollars more?


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