# Aurora Phantom Poll



## wolfman66 (Feb 18, 2006)

Who would be interested in getting this Phantom?


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

This is the very first time I've seen pics of the parts Dan!! It's definitely different to the Action hobbies kit!!
It's a beaut!!:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Chris.


----------



## the Dabbler (Feb 17, 2005)

You'd think he'd learn to control that darned dog (wolf) by now instead of having him dragged around by the collar like that ??


----------



## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

....and yet another Aurora Prototype that should be ressurrected :thumbsup:
Count me in!
Denis


----------



## MonsterModelMan (Dec 20, 2000)

I am definately in!!! 

MMM


----------



## Parts Pit Mike (Jan 3, 2001)

How much and how many will be made... including "Artists Proofs?"


----------



## Ignatz (Jun 20, 2000)

I'm in. Hope it happens.


----------



## wolfman66 (Feb 18, 2006)

Dont know if AL is a member here so he shot me this email when asked him about it.Now this letter came to me early this morning and sent out to him sometime Yesterday evening

Dan

Phil does not want to do it at the moment. If he changes his mind I will jump all over it.

Later
AL



-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sun, 3 May 2009 6:00 pm
Subject: aL


Al,I was wondering if can get enough people on board can we by any chance get a copy of that Lost Aurora Phantom kit?I have 6 so far that are Highly interested.Thanks Dan


----------



## DarthForge (Feb 5, 2009)

Already have the resin kit of it so would depend on price.


----------



## wolfman66 (Feb 18, 2006)

DarthForge said:


> Already have the resin kit of it so would depend on price.


You have is the Action Hobbies version that was taken from Dave Cockrums Drawing.This one in the pics is the actual sculpt that Lemon did for Aurora.


----------



## Cappy D (Jun 19, 2004)

I would absolutely be interested.

Cappy D


----------



## Marko (Jul 11, 2002)

If it gets the green light, count me in !!


----------



## Kitzillastein58 (Jan 27, 2009)

This is awesome, count me in as well! :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Kitz' :wave:


----------



## hedorah59 (Nov 24, 2008)

I would definitely be interested in one if this project goes ahead!


----------



## frankenstyrene (Oct 5, 2006)

About what scale is it?


----------



## mrmurph (Nov 21, 2007)

Ooooooooohhhhhhh! I like it!


----------



## MJB (Aug 3, 2001)

Just a small bump. I was one of the few who were able to send in a money order a year or so ago when the chance to own a copy of the Phantom was made available. I think they were asking too high a price that everyone wasn't able to get in on it and it fell through. Maybe if that person wouldn't try to get the money he paid for the test shot back at one swoop, everyone would be happy. Just my opinion.


----------



## phrankenstign (Nov 29, 1999)

It's been awhile since I saw the movie, but I remember Chaney wearing a cape. I don't remember the tights...............nor the dog. It's a rather exciting kit though. I like it!


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

We have 8 guys who will commit at the original price if Phil changes his mind. The kit isn't cheap but please bear in mind it's a 2 figure kit (Phantom and Devil), it's got heaps of parts for a resin kit and requires complicated molds, and it'll be extremely limited! There'd probably be only 25 kits worldwide.....

Chris.:wave:


----------



## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

for 25 pieces it's not worth doing..........I sold my resin kit and I paid $65.00 for it at the last Mad Model Party.


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

falcondesigns said:


> for 25 pieces it's not worth doing..........I sold my resin kit and I paid $65.00 for it at the last Mad Model Party.


 What kit did you sell? It's never been released before.....

Chris.


----------



## Gillmen (Oct 16, 2004)

Interested, but final commitment depends on price!


----------



## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Auroranut said:


> What kit did you sell? It's never been released before.....
> 
> Chris.


The Action Hobbies resin kit is just as nice...................


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

I also have that kit but it's not the Aurora. It's based on the drawings Dave Cockrum did.
Personally, as an Aurora collector, I'd much prefer the original version. The layout's similar to the Action kit, but the details are completely different.

Chris.


----------



## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

But if your only making 25 and the price is prohibitive .............and your saying that it is expensive because it is two figures,what about Superboy with three "figures"


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

I never said it was expensive- I said it isn't cheap. I also never said the price was prohibitive. 
It's the same deal as any limited run kit. There's the time and labour involved to make molds, cast the parts, pay for the rubber and resin, boxes, even the packing peanuts! 
Basic economics comes into play too. You have to take into account how many will be produced and divide that by your costs.
There's also the exclusivity of the item. If it's rare and desirable, of course you'll pay more to have it.
As far as Superboy goes, it was originally produced for the mass market. The Phantom wouldn't be.
An original Aurora Superboy kit is listed as having a value of $180-$200 as of 2006 (source: Aurora Model Kits-Schiffer Publishing). There's probably a lot more than 25 in existence....

Chris.


----------



## Bruce Bishop (Jan 17, 1999)

I think it depends on what the point of getting copies made of this Phantom would be. Is it to provide an expensive 'investment' to an exclusive few who currently want and can afford to have a resin copy of an Aurora prototype? 

This seemed to be the partial motivation from the prior offering of this kit. The main motivation, from what I could tell from the official postings on the potential offering, was to allow the owner of the prototype to have obtained it for, in effect, zero dollars.

Many more would want to have a copy than can currently afford it, based on the prior offering. I still think that if the price was to be reduced considerably, that many more copies could be sold and many more happy Aurora baby boomers would result, and the total cash going to the owner would still meet his financial requirements.

Being the owner of the prototype, the gentleman has already 'put his own money where his mouth is', and he has every right to do what he wants to with it. He can keep it on display, locked away, build it, allow unlimited copies to be made for Aurora kids, or smash it with a hammer. It belongs to him.

If I were fortunate enough to be able to own such an Aurora item, I would personally go out of my way to have as many copies of it made as people wanted, at a price which met the cost of making the copies, not necessarily to pay for my purchase, or to make a profit.


----------



## Night-Owl (Mar 17, 2000)

Well said Bruce! :thumbsup: 
I'm interested but my final vote would depend on the price.


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

To be honest Bruce, I think most people would wholeheartedly agree with you, me included. I want this kit to build for my collection - no other reason.
It'd be fantastic if it could be released in enough quantity to allow everyone that wanted it to have it. 
I'd never heard of it being offered before and I'm still ignorant of most of the facts. I just want it for my collection. 
Maybe if there are enough guys who can commit there can be a chance of it being released in much greater numbers at a much reduced cost. I just don't know enough about the situation to comment more on it.

Chris.


----------



## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

I'm well aware of kit production costs,as I cast an produce kits.I'm a Phantom fan,so the question for me is what can I afford that will be reasonable for me.


----------



## Bruce Bishop (Jan 17, 1999)

Does anybody remember the original asking price from the prior offering? 

How about the number of firm commitments required in order to have the issue produced? 

I personally don't remember the amount, but I 'think' it was something over $200 for a very limited issue. I also think there were maybe eight or nine people who committed to the purchase, which came nowhere meeting the number specified for the issue to be made.


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

It was I believe $225. So far there's 8 guys who have committed to the kit at this price this time around. That's within 24 hours of finding out about the original offer. I believe the original number needed was 25.
Personally if I owned the prototype I'd put out as many as possible (50-100) and see how they sold. There's enough comic hero collectors, figure builders, and Aurora collectors to sell that size run (IMHO). But it's not mine so if we want it we have to accept the situation as it is and be grateful that we have a chance to own it at all...
That's just my opinion though.

Chris.


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

falcondesigns said:


> I'm well aware of kit production costs,as I cast an produce kits.I'm a Phantom fan,so the question for me is what can I afford that will be reasonable for me.


If I seem rude or confrontational, I apologise. I really don't mean to come across that way. I'm not in the garage kit business and you'd be more qualified than me to comment on that side of the hobby.
I'm just a passionate Aurora modeller who'd love nothing more than to see as many prototypes as possible put into the hands of those who want them. If it means a limited release, there's nothing anyone can do about it other than the owner of the pattern.

Chris.


----------



## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Not to worry,Chris,we're just having a spirited coversation.I would just like to see this kit done so that most of us can get it.


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

Cheers mate. I agree with you that it'd be cool if everyone who wanted one should be able to get one.

Chris.:wave:


----------



## otto (Jan 1, 1970)

I'd like to have one, but only if the price was around $100 or so. If it does get produced, I'd recomend making at least 50 kits. My 2cents..


----------



## Parts Pit Mike (Jan 3, 2001)

I agree. A lower price point is necessary in order to get this item to market.

I thought that was proven in the first attempt to sell this at $225 -- when only 8 people signed up.


----------



## Buc (Jan 20, 1999)

Wow... went through my past email's and didn't realize it was
this long ago! (Sept 2006!!) This was posted on the Aurora board
by Al:

Quote
The issue date is August 1, 2007. 
An advanced payment of $215 is required by January 2007.
Kits sold on a first come first served bases. 
40 is the cut off amount.
Unquote

Buc


----------



## Bruce Bishop (Jan 17, 1999)

Thanks Buc!

While I would love to have a copy of this actual prototype also, I do have the Action Hobbies kit produced from the drawings. This is an excellent model kit itself, and since it's based on drawings for an Aurora prototype I am very happy with it, especially at the price I paid for it.


----------



## MonsterModelMan (Dec 20, 2000)

Bruce Bishop said:


> Thanks Buc!
> 
> While I would love to have a copy of this actual prototype also, I do have the Action Hobbies kit produced from the drawings. This is an excellent model kit itself, and since it's based on drawings for an Aurora prototype I am very happy with it, especially at the price I paid for it.


That is the same boat that I sit in right now, Bruce. I also have the Action Hobbies kit so I am happy either way. If the prototype comes out, I will buy the actual prototype and sell the other or keep both as they are both GREAT pieces.

The prototype looks like the base might be slightly smaller.

MMM


----------



## wolfman66 (Feb 18, 2006)

Parts Pit Mike said:


> I agree. A lower price point is necessary in order to get this item to market.
> 
> I thought that was proven in the first attempt to sell this at $225 -- when only 8 people signed up.


Ya but Phil was only selling it on the Aurora board .Now if he had widen his avenue more when trying to sell it he would have gotten alot more than 8 to jump on it.Me personally 225.00 is not a bad price for a casting of that Phantom Prototype cause to have the molds done is not cheap and neither is the resin and what grade it is or the silcone to make the molds or what AL would charge him to cast it up.Plus Al would have to make two sets of Molds to get 40 castings if thats what Phil wanted originally and also in case the first mold for some unknown reason went bad as in ripping or ect he would have a backup mold on hand.


----------



## Bruce Bishop (Jan 17, 1999)

While I could easily be wrong about this, I'm pretty sure that the info was also posted here at HobbyTalk and some of the other model forums, although not by Al or Phil. 

If I still had my job, my savings, and no wife and kids, I probably wouldn't mind the price. It does cost money to buy supplies, and to have the work done to make castings. And Al does a great job at a reasonable price! I love the kits I have bought from him in the past.


----------



## MJB (Aug 3, 2001)

Well said Bruce. One of the biggest differences between the Action Hobby release and the original prototype is that the Diamond cup of Alexander the Great and Excalibur, Arthur's sword are in the treasure chest. Those two things have been part of the Phantom Legend stories and it was cool seeing that the original prototype had them.

Thought I was willing to pay the original high amount, I did feel that it was mostly for the owner to recoup his price fully. Hopefully the owner will realize that there are a lot of us Phantom fans out there and that if the run could be done say for 50 castings and at a more affordable price, this project happen and he could have a nice portion of his original cost returned to him.


----------



## emsinker (Jun 25, 2008)

*SOMETIMES THE OPPORTUNITY TO BUY IS THE BARGAIN!* Please count me in no matter what the price is. Ed


----------



## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

emsinker said:


> *SOMETIMES THE OPPORTUNITY TO BUY IS THE BARGAIN!* Please count me in no matter what the price is. Ed


I couldn't agree with you any more Ed...well said :thumbsup:
Mcdee


----------



## Auroranut (Jan 12, 2008)

emsinker said:


> *SOMETIMES THE OPPORTUNITY TO BUY IS THE BARGAIN!* Please count me in no matter what the price is. Ed


Well put Ed!!:thumbsup: I'll be buying one if it's released! As much as I think it'd be great if everyone got the chance to acquire one, if it's still a limited release, I'll take one at the price it's offered....

Chris.


----------



## tr7nut (Apr 18, 1999)

*How much and when?*

At the time they originally were trying to put this out I.T. was not being very good to me. Money was short, but now not too bad.  I would definately ante up for this one, even though i have the Action Hobbies piece already. :thumbsup:

Cliff


----------



## MonsterModelMan (Dec 20, 2000)

MJB said:


> Well said Bruce. One of the biggest differences between the Action Hobby release and the original prototype is that the Diamond cup of Alexander the Great and Excalibur, Arthur's sword are in the treasure chest. Those two things have been part of the Phantom Legend stories and it was cool seeing that the original prototype had them.
> 
> Thought I was willing to pay the original high amount, I did feel that it was mostly for the owner to recoup his price fully. Hopefully the owner will realize that there are a lot of us Phantom fans out there and that if the run could be done say for 50 castings and at a more affordable price, this project happen and he could have a nice portion of his original cost returned to him.


MJB,

Do you have any reference pics of what you are describing about in the prototype? Arthur's sword and the Diamond cup of Alexander the Great and Excalibur? What did the prototype look like with these items included?

Thanks,

MMM


----------



## MJB (Aug 3, 2001)

MMM At the beginning of this thread are some pictures but over at CultTVMan's site, are better ones showing the interior of the Treasure chest. Here's the link to that page: http://www.culttvman2.com/dnn/Models/ModelingAurora/LostAuroraThePhantom/tabid/371/Default.aspx

Now, the reason I know it's Alexander's cup and Excalibur is that I'm a big Phantom fan and I have a lot of his early adventures from his origin through most of the 1930's. There was a story about the Phantom's Treasure and they specifically mention those two items and when I first saw the CultTVMan's pictures, I was thrilled to see that Dave Cockrum's design had those two items.


----------



## MonsterModelMan (Dec 20, 2000)

MJB said:


> MMM At the beginning of this thread are some pictures but over at CultTVMan's site, are better ones showing the interior of the Treasure chest. Here's the link to that page: http://www.culttvman2.com/dnn/Models/ModelingAurora/LostAuroraThePhantom/tabid/371/Default.aspx
> 
> Now, the reason I know it's Alexander's cup and Excalibur is that I'm a big Phantom fan and I have a lot of his early adventures from his origin through most of the 1930's. There was a story about the Phantom's Treasure and they specifically mention those two items and when I first saw the CultTVMan's pictures, I was thrilled to see that Dave Cockrum's design had those two items.


Thanks MJB!
I guess with the Action Hobbies version...those two items could be added if someone wanted to sculpt them. They aren't very big and would be easy enough to do to make the Action Hobbies version pretty accurate.

Any takers?

MMM


----------



## MJB (Aug 3, 2001)

Hmmmmm, we have some bathroom remodeling going on so I can't get into the garage to work on kits right now. But maybe afterward, I'll see what I can find or scratch build and add them to my Action Hobbies version. Here's a couple pictures from my completed kit before I work on this.


----------

