# Round 2 Trek 50th Anniversary Plans



## morrihl1 (Jan 19, 2008)

In the news section of his site, Culttvman posted this today:

Round 2 also has at least one other Trek project in the works. It is sure to please quite a few people. Hopefully they will be able to announce it at Wonderfest. Stay tuned.

1/350 K'tinga? 1/350 Reliant? Anyone have any more information on this?


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

morrihl1 said:


> In the news section of his site, Culttvman posted this today:
> 
> Round 2 also has at least one other Trek project in the works. It is sure to please quite a few people. Hopefully they will be able to announce it at Wonderfest. Stay tuned.
> 
> 1/350 K'tinga? 1/350 Reliant? Anyone have any more information on this?


Not to stir the fires of hate, but wouldn't it be amazing if they decided to greenlight that new tool Galileo after all?

nawwwwww, couldn't be. But who knows?


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

I noticed they changed the packaging for the "Tomorrow is Yesterday" kit (looks like the actual kits provided). The F-104 is shown without external wing mounted tanks. Probably did this since the Lindberg kit used doesn't come with the tanks.

http://culttvman.com/main/round-2-updates-april-2016/

Glad to hear that a display stand is included in the kit. A "sky" background would be nice too.

It would be a nice surprise to see the Galileo kit come out, but I doubt it based on what had been said before. So, assuming it's not that kit, we'll be getting something unexpected. Wonderfest can't come soon enough!


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

spock62 said:


> I noticed they changed the packaging for the "Tomorrow is Yesterday" kit (looks like the actual kits provided). The F-104 is shown without external wing mounted tanks. Probably did this since the Lindberg kit used doesn't come with the tanks.
> 
> http://culttvman.com/main/round-2-updates-april-2016/
> 
> ...


Unexpected is good, right? 

Well, we can brainstorm some logic. 

"It is sure to please quite a few people" says to me:

It's not yet another repackage of existing kits. Nobody would be thrilled by that. 

It *could* be a new tool kit. There's plenty of worthy candidates. 

It *could* be a refreshing of an old kit that's suffered from mistreatment, such as the AMT TMP Enterprise sans the wood grain or magically discovering a clean set of tooling for the first issue of the AMT Enterprise (either one of this would make me insanely happy and yes, it's so impossible I can't even calculate the odds  )

It *could* be a release of an old kit that hasn't been re-popped yet. DS9 Runabout hasn't been seen in a long time, right? What about the larger Defiant? 

Speculate! That's what the internet is for!


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Oh, quick aside, I am STOKED for that old school 5 Space Ship box set from Lindberg. I'm sure it's not going to be $4.95 or whatever the original was but if the price is reasonable, mine. mine. Soooo many memories of most of those kits, and I might just want to take a wack at that Flying Saucer and make it into a more 'realistic' USAF Aerodyne.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

New kit? Guaranteed it's not the Galileo. Round 2 sealed the fate on that...

My money says no new tooling. Repop of an existing model...I'd bet on that...

Doug


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

My guess is that they will chrome the 19" TOS-E Kit and provide a plaque to apply to the base.
Not a new tool but something they can point to while jumping up and down to prove their commitment to the fans...

Second guess is a repop of whatever the car was that Spock & Kirk drove in 'A Piece of the Action'


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

If it's a 1/350 K'Tinga I'll take back every nasty thing I've ever said about Round 2 and pledge loyalty for life. In blood.


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## oggy4u (Sep 27, 2007)

The 1/350 K'tinga is my grail kit . It has been for years one of the most consistently , requested Star Trek kits . I would buy 2 or 3 easily .


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I think if a 1/350 K'Tinga kit was in the works we would have been treated to glimpses of it's creation which was done with Round 2's previous two big kit releases, the 1/48 Eagle and the 1/350 TOS-E.


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## oggy4u (Sep 27, 2007)

Maybe we will get a glimpse of a K'tinga ?


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

The ventral fin on that new F-104 image is way too far forward.

The 5-spaceship set - well, I think I have all 5 individually, but what the heck, I'm in!

The Galileo - Cult says he's positive it's NOT the Galileo.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Most likely the "surprise" Trek kit will be a repop of some sort. Doesn't sound like Round 2 has the cash to do any new tool Star Trek kit this year. Unless, they had something in the works for a while, the fruit of which will be shown at Wonderfest. But, I'm not holding my breath.

The Lindberg 5 kit Spaceship set is a good choice. But, seeing that I have 3 of the 5 kits, I'll pass.

Regarding the F-104's ventral fin, to me, the new box art looks like buildups of the two kits. If that's the case, it means the Lindberg kit is wrong...which shouldn't be a surprise!


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## phicks (Nov 5, 2002)

If Cult knows what the kit is, I do not think he would say it should please a lot of people if it was just a repop, or a slight modification of an old kit, like a chrome version. 


I would love a 1/350 Ktinga too, but I think a 1/1000 version would be far more likely.


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Richard Baker said:


> I think if a 1/350 K'Tinga kit was in the works we would have been treated to glimpses of it's creation which was done with Round 2's previous two big kit releases, the 1/48 Eagle and the 1/350 TOS-E.


At this time last year we knew nothing of the Eagle kit. The first we heard of it was at Wonderfest. It's not implausible that Round 2 could announce it next month for a Christmas release -- which would more that make up for the Galileo clunksterbunk, IMHO. Unlike the Galileo, the K'Tinga has the potential for supplementary kits, like parts and photo etch to make Kronos 1, which may make it more appealing for Round 2.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Everyone is jumping on the idea of a 1/350 ST:TMP Klingon ship. OK, cool, Hunk A Junk's logic is sound and reasonable and completely in-line with my thinking on stuff like this. (sorry, dude  )

But this is Star Trek 50. Wouldn't a 1/350 Klingon Cruiser (aka D7) be more logical?


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

A D-7 would be more appropriate, but IMO the ship is too plain to look good that big. It has almost no detail on it and aside for the two tone hull has almost no markings. The ship looks god small or at a distance but close up it just does not have much to rest the eye on, unlike the TOS-e.
A D-7M K'Tinga is the big screen version of this classic design with rich detail and great lighting potential. Available kits had to simplify the detail for production, a 1/350 scale would still have to be a bit simpler but but the larger size would do this subject justice.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

I absolutely _LOVE_ the 1:350 scale! So far, I've had a pretty good look at the TOS, TMP Enterprises and the Archer Enterprise at 1:350. I am gobsmacked! I have thought about what I'd look for in 1:350...:

USS Voyager
USS Reliant
Klingon Bird Of Prey
Enterprise D (No, forget that. TOO big!)

I dunno...can't think of anything else. A D-7M K'Tinga would be EPIC!

Doug


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

The existing Klingon Bird of Prey kit is listed at 1/350, 
a garage kit of the Reliant in 1/350 scale was released recently...


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> A D-7 would be more appropriate, but IMO the ship is too plain to look good that big. It has almost no detail on it and aside for the two tone hull has almost no markings. The ship looks god small or at a distance but close up it just does not have much to rest the eye on, unlike the TOS-e.
> A D-7M K'Tinga is the big screen version of this classic design with rich detail and great lighting potential. Available kits had to simplify the detail for production, a 1/350 scale would still have to be a bit simpler but but the larger size would do this subject justice.


You're right, of course. The D-7 is a plain beast, bare and smooth. Not much to see by today's standards. In the vernacular of the effects world, it's boring, not visually interesting at all. 

Then again, the same can be said of the original Enterprise, no?  I mean, that IS the reason for the sparkly color flop aztec paint on the ST:TMP Enterprise, right? To make it visually interesting?

So, I dunno. I think the Klingon Cruiser (per AMT) aka D-7 is valid and worthy from the historical perspective. But it's probably not that. 

I mean, blue sky, I'd like to see a 1/1000 Enterprise D. That would be a 'big kit' that would make some happy, wouldn't it? 

(I don't want to think about what kind of massive engineering would have to be done to make that giant saucer stable!)


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Radiodugger said:


> I absolutely _LOVE_ the 1:350 scale! So far, I've had a pretty good look at the TOS, TMP Enterprises and the Archer Enterprise at 1:350. I am gobsmacked! I have thought about what I'd look for in 1:350...:
> 
> USS Voyager
> USS Reliant
> ...


6 feet long by 5 feet wide. Larger than my family antique dinner table. Utterly impossible for a mass-market molded styrene model kit.


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## RMC (Aug 11, 2004)

Im hoping for a 1/350 reliant.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

RMC said:


> Im hoping for a 1/350 reliant.


http://www.starshipmodeler.net/talk/viewtopic.php?t=118373


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## TIEbomber1967 (May 21, 2012)

Oh man! There are some crazy, "really gettin' yur hopes up" type guesses in this thread.
I SERIOUSLY doubt it's anything in 1:350, for all the reasons discussed ad nauseam in other threads . If I was to guess, it would be something semi-new.
"And what is semi-new?" you ask? Well... didn't Round 2 have another poll at Wonderfest last year (only for Wonderfest attendees)? And didn't that poll contain a 1:1000 Franz Joseph T.O.S. scout?

So, boys and girls, my guess is with the creation of a single new nacelle with molded-in dorsal attachment, and the inclusion of the old 1:1000 saucer, clear engine dome, and engine end cap, we MIGHT get a T.O.S. Scout ship.
Cheap and economical, and a "whole new" model for the Round 2 catalog.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

TIEbomber1967 said:


> Oh man! There are some crazy, "really gettin' yur hopes up" type guesses in this thread.
> I SERIOUSLY doubt it's anything in 1:350, for all the reasons discussed ad nauseam in other threads . If I was to guess, it would be something semi-new.
> "And what is semi-new?" you ask? Well... didn't Round 2 have another poll at Wonderfest last year (only for Wonderfest attendees)? And didn't that poll contain a 1:1000 Franz Joseph T.O.S. scout?
> 
> ...


It's all in good fun, but man, a Franz Joseph-design Scout would be 'highly desired'?! I, um...wow. Honestly, really? 

But again, your logic in the speculation is rock solid. 

Funny thing, a Scout was one of the first kit bash scratch builds I ever did back in the '70s. Got an award for it too at the local IPMS club. Then I attempted a Tug, and I got the ship finished but never managed to finish the cargo pod. 

HA! I just remembered! The white I had used, an off-white rattlecan, actually had a touch of green in it! I was painting in what may have been close to authentic colors back then! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA oh god so long ago...


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

I doubt it's the K'Tinga................but I sure as hell hope it bloody is.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> Everyone is jumping on the idea of a 1/350 ST:TMP Klingon ship. OK, cool, Hunk A Junk's logic is sound and reasonable and completely in-line with my thinking on stuff like this. (sorry, dude  )
> 
> But this is Star Trek 50. Wouldn't a 1/350 Klingon Cruiser (aka D7) be more logical?








I don't think so no because as Richard says the larger size would show just how bare the D7 is whilst a bigger kit can do the K'Tinga much more justice.

I know it has Aztec engravings but the recent Revell kit is pretty good as a sort of D7.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Scott Alexander (Captain Cardboard/Atomic City) once sent me by accident one of the studio scale replicas he had produced (a paperwork issue- I have one of his 15" Aries on order). I had a choice to return it or keep in instead of the Aries.
I decided to return it unopened simply because while the D-7 is a beautiful shape, seeing it bigger does not add that much. 

The TOS-E has a lot more visual interest- markings and colored hatches, grills and greebly, it can be enjoyed at any size or distance. I love the classic Klingon battlecruiser, but the filming model was missing some of the interesting bits that were intended but not executed. They can be seen on the early editions of the AMT kit- the grills in the inset of the leading edge of the main hull, the long vent looking things on the top on the same hull, those made it look more like a machine than a great sculpture. They were in the original plan drawings provided but just not put on the filming model. They did make the AMT kit look cool and unfortunately Round 2 stripped them off the reissued model in the name of accuracy. 

I am still afraid R2 will just chrome up the 18" kit and call it a victory.


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## scotthm (Apr 6, 2007)

Steve H said:


> But this is Star Trek 50. Wouldn't a 1/350 Klingon Cruiser (aka D7) be more logical?


More logical and much more desirable, for me. This is THE Star Trek model I'm waiting impatiently for.

---------------


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

SUNGOD said:


> I know it has Aztec engravings but the recent Revell kit is pretty good as a sort of D7.


The hull markings were added to the D-7 by Greg Jein for the 'Trials and Tribulations' DS-9 episode as a visual bridge between the TOS and the TMP editions of the Klingon craft. Revel combined every source/version of the D-7 when they mastered their 1/500 kit.


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## enterprise_fanatic (Aug 4, 2014)

The lack of detail on the D-7 would make it a cheaper model to reproduce in the 1/350 scale. Round 2 could build up it cash flow because fewer parts would needed. There would be less communication time between continents because of ill fitting parts not looking right. A quicker turn around time between stages could get the kit out faster. Also too if Round 2 "wanted" to add details to the blank canvas to give it same sense of scale that the TOS Enterprise has I'm all for that.

Of all the guesses of what Round 2 plans to release next, with concerns to Star Trek's 50th no one mentioned the possibility of a larger version of the original Romulan Bird of prey. What if the sale/release of the 1/1000 scsle was a test to see if there was a market for a 1/350 scale?


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## MGagen (Dec 18, 2001)

I'm betting on the other 50th Anniversary kit being either:

The antique car Kirk and Spock attempt to drive in "Piece of the Action"

or a replica of the flag from "Omega Glory"...


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

A 1/350 Romulan? That could be interesting. 

I'm still hung up on the 'many will be happy about this' comment. Assuming the new-tool Galileo is off the table (and maybe, just maybe we might reconsider that belief) I'm hard pressed to think of a Trek subject that's been a subject of discussion and desire. EVERYTHING is wanted by SOMEBODY and passion can make it seem that there's an outcry for that, but I can't think that R2 is that swayed by such things, otherwise the fire generated by the postponing of the new Galileo would have not only burned their ears off, it would have surely gotten a huge fast-track to production and a public statement. 

The one thing I keep coming back to is the ST:TMP Enterprise kit and that horrid 'wood grain' attempt to mold in what was paint detailing. If they found duplicate tooling for that kit (maybe from England?) that was unaltered or if they decided to create a new tool from a vintage kit, that would be big news but would that really qualify for the statement uttered? I'm not sure. 

Mind, I'm still holding out hope for an 'upgraded' release of the vintage AMT Galileo kit. A diorama base, some figures, new more accurate landing gear, maybe even some interior detail improvements, that all would be pretty nice lipstick on a pig.


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

Richard Baker said:


> The existing Klingon Bird of Prey kit is listed at 1/350,
> a garage kit of the Reliant in 1/350 scale was released recently...


That Klingon Bird of Prey kit was originally considered 1/420 scale.
That being based on the original drawings with a stated length of 360 feet.

All that being said, I like to keep all my scales together and I have my Klingon BOP next to a 1/400 Die-Cast 747 (Air Force One). 
The BOP looks WAY to big next to it. So in a rare case, I'm having no problem fudging the BOP scale to 1/350.

Ignorance it bliss....... right?


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

Don't know if any one else has thought of this but they could be working on a Franz Joseph ship from TOS Tech. Manual. Yes I know they have been available in resin, but not styrene.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Richard Baker said:


> ...Second guess is a repop of whatever the car was that Spock & Kirk drove in 'A Piece of the Action'


That was a 1931 Cadillac V-12 Model 370-A Fleetwood Roadster. As far as I know, no one has ever produced a styrene kit of that particular car; not that it would matter if they had the molds for a kit that was "close enough".


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

enterprise_fanatic said:


> The lack of detail on the D-7 would make it a cheaper model to reproduce in the 1/350 scale. Round 2 could build up it cash flow because fewer parts would needed. There would be less communication time between continents because of ill fitting parts not looking right. A quicker turn around time between stages could get the kit out faster. Also too if Round 2 "wanted" to add details to the blank canvas to give it same sense of scale that the TOS Enterprise has I'm all for that.
> 
> Of all the guesses of what Round 2 plans to release next, with concerns to Star Trek's 50th no one mentioned the possibility of a larger version of the original Romulan Bird of prey. What if the sale/release of the 1/1000 scsle was a test to see if there was a market for a 1/350 scale?





Maybe but the K'Tinga's the one that's come top of the polls 9 times out of 10 over the past few years..........along with the Eagles.


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## phicks (Nov 5, 2002)

On their most recent blog, R2 said they are repopping a model of a 65 Pontiac. I am sure that was in the background somewhere in Assignment:Earth and could be re-re-released as a Star Trek special edition.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

The Reliant in 1:350 scale, I believe is resin. And over $300! Nope. Not _even_. If Round 2 did it for around $100, I might consider it...

Doug


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

Personally I am not holding my breath on any kit that will "wow" us. The Galileo was put on hold indefinitely so I don't see any 1:350 kits coming out as a result. I am expecting more a re-issue of some older kit. Hate to sound pessimistic, but I really don't think there is going to be anything major coming out.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

I saw a D7 at the Smithsonian when they had a Star Trek studio prop showing. It had lots of small details.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I think the problem is that R2 has planned on the Galileo kit to be the great release for the 50th Anniversary. When that project was sent into limbo there was nothing else in the pipeline to replace it. It would be great if they did have another great (new) kit and are simply being silent about it, I hope that is the case. 
Unfortunately the cynical side of me expects just the same old kits with a fancy new box instead...


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## enterprise_fanatic (Aug 4, 2014)

I wouldn't mind getting the 1/350 Klingon vessel from TOS or the movies but I'd rather see the Romulan BOP in 1/350. I wonder if they are considering doing the Botiny Bay in the same 1/350 scale? (yes I like the 1/350 scale)


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> I think the problem is that R2 has planned on the Galileo kit to be the great release for the 50th Anniversary. When that project was sent into limbo there was nothing else in the pipeline to replace it. It would be great if they did have another great (new) kit and are simply being silent about it, I hope that is the case.
> Unfortunately the cynical side of me expects just the same old kits with a fancy new box instead...


I wouldn't call that cynical, I would say that's practical based on experience. Don't deride that knowledge. 

But I dunno. A reboxing or even a stunt re-pressing (clear kit, chrome kit, gold kit, new decals, whatever) just doesn't strike me as the kind of thing R2 would feel safe calling out 'what many will be excited about', ya know? That would be just lying hyperbole which, I know, I know, the whole new tool Galileo thing sour taste in the mouth bad ju-ju.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Round 2 lost a lot of credibility some years ago by announcing some kits, most note worthy the 1/1000 Akira class ship, with great fanfare at big conventions. They then quietly changed their minds and forgot all about them- a classic case of either the left/right not communicating properly or some misguided attempt to use product announcements as a marketing survey. 
Things changed and Round 2 seemed to get it's act together. A few new kits, some enhanced repops and this seemed better. They then did everything perfectly with the 1/350 TOS-E, they let people who signed into a special program see virtually everything as it was being created for that kit, we saw it evolve from CD drawings into test shots then when the final kit was released there was a standing ovation and it flew off the shelves. 
Round 2 did a repeat (without the special program) with the 1/48 Eagle. Again- standing ovations and magnificent sales.

I do not know what is going on with them, but this whole Galileo/Anniversary thing is giving me a sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach, it is like the bad old days are surging forth again. I have heard a lot of excuses as to why they make some changes, most of them are just internet opinions churning around. We are never told the whys, just the whats.
Jamie is a great person and has truly fought long and hard for the Trek lineup, but he is one voice in a quagmire of suits who make the decisions. I really really hope they do not drop the ball on this one. It is special to us fans who have watched the show from the sixties, it deserves something special to help celebrate. Reboxed stunt casting is NOT going to go over well no matter well.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> Round 2 lost a lot of credibility some years ago by announcing some kits, most note worthy the 1/1000 Akira class ship, with great fanfare at big conventions. They then quietly changed their minds and forgot all about them- a classic case of either the left/right not communicating properly or some misguided attempt to use product announcements as a marketing survey.
> Things changed and Round 2 seemed to get it's act together. A few new kits, some enhanced repops and this seemed better. They then did everything perfectly with the 1/350 TOS-E, they let people who signed into a special program see virtually everything as it was being created for that kit, we saw it evolve from CD drawings into test shots then when the final kit was released there was a standing ovation and it flew off the shelves.
> Round 2 did a repeat (without the special program) with the 1/48 Eagle. Again- standing ovations and magnificent sales.
> 
> ...


Given all this, and I take it at face value, makes me think that whatever key investor may be at the upper, hidden level of management at Round 2, might be pulling out and kicking the company to the curb. I hope not, I'll take the drubbing for saying this if I'm completely wrong, but boy it sure starts to sound like a 'money man' has said "no more, I'm done, you're on your own" to my ears.

I've seen it before, I've LIVED it before, thru the deaths of several national chains. It's always the same. Money pulls out, the company tries to act 'business as usual' for a time, then they have to make some decisions and as long as certain key people are still in place they're rational choices, but if those key people go, all bets are off and you'll see some amazingly stupid things happen before the death of the company. They will spin themselves into the GROUND with one bad decision after another. The last one will be such a boner everyone will wonder if the company is being run by a brain dead chimpanzee.

(give you one nobody knows. Major toy chain Children's Palace. They were #2 right on the heels of Toys R U. Lost their backer, shuffled around for 2 years before completely collapsing. One of their last acts? "Hey, let's sell live animals in our toy stores! It's a huge profit margin! What could possibly go wrong?" Ponder that, just take a moment and ponder that. Living animals, pets, in a toy store. It was worse than you can even imagine)

I wonder if buying back the Johnny Lightning license put more hurt on their bottom line then they expected. 

I hope, I really hope R2 hasn't fallen into this condition. I hope everything they're doing now is simply minor pauses as they take a breath, observe the market, consider options and charge forward with surprises, GOOD surprises.


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

The Sci-Fi is a very small slice of the pie and Round 2. They are releasing many car models and cars outsell sci-fi, figures, ships and aircraft. We are just a very very small segment and as a car modeler too I'm really happy with a lot of their automotive releases. Sometimes it is surprising at all that they release anything sci-fi sometimes. We should wait till Wonderfest time, see if they announce anything and go from there. All this speculating and complaining without all the facts about what they are releasing doesn't help our cause in their eyes. Problem these days with all the social media we find out about cancellations more often. years ago projects were conceived- sculpted and cancelled all the time, we just never heard about it. and all was fine as far as we were concerned. They really don't have to tell us anything in advance at all. If they announce something and then cancel it doesn't end the world for me or even bother me at all. I have plenty of other things to occupy my time. I've got more stuff than I could ever build in my lifetime anyway. Sometimes I'm relieved when a model doesn't come out because then I won't spend my money on it.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

The internet IS a consideration, no question. I recall when I worked in a hobby shop in the late '70s (and earlier, helping a fellow IPMS member open his own store, which sadly closed too soon due to cashflow problems) when the local jobber would show up with all the new catalogs. Remember that? When hobby shops had that...wow, what was it called? That rack of bound-in catalogs. Flip thru that, look for the new releases, wait for them to arrive in the store... 

Do kinda miss those days. Of course I miss all the different hobby shops too.


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

At least In St. Louis here we have at least 5 or 6 decent hobby shops still all within a half hour driving time in the area.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

I think R2 have probably learned their lesson now and won't announce anything unless it's definite (obviously like what they did with the Eagles)


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## KUROK (Feb 2, 2004)

John P said:


> The Galileo - Cult says he's positive it's NOT the Galileo.


Could it be "Columbus" then? :freak:


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## KUROK (Feb 2, 2004)

Perhaps it is a new "Exploration Set" with 1:1 scale and accurate props? That would sell really well. The information to make them accurate is out there these days.
An injection plastic kit of these would be snapped up for upgrade and they could do an optional line of metal parts. 
What do you think?


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

KUROK said:


> Perhaps it is a new "Exploration Set" with 1:1 scale and accurate props? That would sell really well. The information to make them accurate is out there these days.
> An injection plastic kit of these would be snapped up for upgrade and they could do an optional line of metal parts.
> What do you think?


I would love it. Sadly, I would also expect it to be well over $100 USD because they would look at the history of the DST/Art Aslyum toys and say "we need to be in this price range"


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## JeffBond (Dec 9, 2013)

I really think anyone interested in these props would buy the Art Asylum pieces--they are fantastic and they do just about everything the screen props were supposed to do. And they're basically made of styrene so if modelers are truly interested in customizing or modifying them, nothing's stopping them. I can't see R2 making any real money by producing something that is basically out there already and easy to obtain.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

JeffBond said:


> I really think anyone interested in these props would buy the Art Asylum pieces--they are fantastic and they do just about everything the screen props were supposed to do. And they're basically made of styrene so if modelers are truly interested in customizing or modifying them, nothing's stopping them. I can't see R2 making any real money by producing something that is basically out there already and easy to obtain.


A couple of years ago I would have argued that DST has the stupid habit of not keeping stuff in production and secondary market prices unfairly punish those who didn't know they were even available in the limited window they appeared, or in the case of the Medical Tricorder and Geo Tricorder, that they were specific store exclusives, a mass produced plastic kit of the key props (Phaser, Tricorder, Communicator) would be of benefit of all.

I still agree and stand by that statement, but now, with the 50th anny of Star Trek underway, I suspect DST is gonna get those prop toys out into the marketplace again. So, you're right. 

Be nice if they put the ST:TMP Phaser back in the marketplace as well. *grumble mumble secondary market scalpers mumble*


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## seaQuest (Jan 12, 2003)

Damn, Children's Palace. I forgot all about that chain.


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## jfleisher (Sep 5, 2002)

Children's Palace was my first "real" job during high school (~1980), assembling bikes for $2.75 an hour. I bought a 1/350 New Jersey battleship with my employee discount, I really should build that someday...


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

jfleisher said:


> Children's Palace was my first "real" job during high school (~1980), assembling bikes for $2.75 an hour. I bought a 1/350 New Jersey battleship with my employee discount, I really should build that someday...


They may have had different ways of doing that, our store, we had an outside service send a guy once a week in the warm months to assemble bikes. This would have been 1989-ish. We didn't assemble in-house.

You were one of the techs? The one in our store was a machine, cranking out bikes left and right. One of my jobs as warehouse manager was to pull the bikes to be built and hang them off the hooks in the rafters. Problems arose when the bikes were handled poorly in transit. I tried to get my people to understand you had to be CAREFUL with the boxes but nobody really tried. 

Man, I do NOT miss handling bikes.


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## mach7 (Mar 25, 2002)

KUROK said:


> Perhaps it is a new "Exploration Set" with 1:1 scale and accurate props? That would sell really well. The information to make them accurate is out there these days.
> An injection plastic kit of these would be snapped up for upgrade and they could do an optional line of metal parts.
> What do you think?


I've asked Jamie about this a few times on the blog, he always answers the same. DST has that market served very well.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

mach7 said:


> I've asked Jamie about this a few times on the blog, he always answers the same. DST has that market served very well.


It's a shame, because R2 could easily jump in and do the things DST just can't be bothered with, such as a TNG Tricorder, or a TOS medical kit set, or the whole slew of TNG Phasers from that clunky first season 'dustbuster' on. 

See, it would be a synergy thing. I guess that only works if everything is owned by the same massive corporation.


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## mach7 (Mar 25, 2002)

I agree, and the tooling should not be that bad.

I would expect the TOS Exploration set could be sold as 3 separate kits each priced between $30-$40. And as stated a nice metal upgrade kit could be sold.

The Phaser could be sold as a black and white, a grey, and the P-1 could be sold individually.

There were 10 comms used in the show.

and at least 3 versions of the Tricorder.

There are LOTS of opportunities to sell multiple of each kit.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

mach7 said:


> I agree, and the tooling should not be that bad.
> 
> I would expect the TOS Exploration set could be sold as 3 separate kits each priced between $30-$40. And as stated a nice metal upgrade kit could be sold.
> 
> ...



Yeah, shared/reused tooling. And it goes further!

Make the scanner to go with the medical Tricorder, then put the scanner in the medical field kit. Take the Phaser 1, package it with the Communicator as a 'landing party' set. Like you said, potential for aftermarket metal replacement parts-R2 seems to be enamored of that as of late. Goofy things available only via web sales and conventions like 'Phaser spare power packs' or 'extra Tricorder memory discs' or even....*snicker* work with ThinkGeek and release a SD card reader that's shaped like a Library Computer terminal with the SD card carrier being shaped like the TOS data carts. 

Of course somebody might confuse that with a 3.5" floppy....


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I saw elsewhere that there will definitely be a reissue of the old AMT TOS Enterprise in a special 50th anniversary box.


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

John P said:


> I saw elsewhere that there will definitely be a reissue of the old AMT TOS Enterprise in a special 50th anniversary box.


It's already out.


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## pagni (Mar 20, 1999)

MGagen said:


> I'm betting on the other 50th Anniversary kit being either:
> 
> The antique car Kirk and Spock attempt to drive in "Piece of the Action"
> 
> or a replica of the flag from "Omega Glory"...


Gosh ... I hope it's the flag....


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## seaQuest (Jan 12, 2003)

Maybe they've cut a deal with Revell to run some Apollo-Saturn Vs and sell them in Assignment: Earth packaging.


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## ssgt-cheese (May 31, 2000)

What about a Tribble included in a special 50th anniversary tos E kit?


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## swhite228 (Dec 31, 2003)

There is always the never re-issued figure kits just waiting for another round on the shelves/


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

pagni said:


> Gosh ... I hope it's the flag....


Not if it has grid lines


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## eradicator178 (Sep 3, 2008)

Still it could be the Galileo. Remember they said Kong and the witch were dead, but still came through with them.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

eradicator178 said:


> Still it could be the Galileo. Remember they said Kong and the witch were dead, but still came through with them.


As much as I'd like to have the new Galileo kit, I'm hoping this isn't the case. Repeatedly announcing a kit, then announcing it's been canceled, then releasing it anyway, makes it look like they either don't know what they're doing, or like they enjoy jerking their customers around.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

eradicator178 said:


> Still it could be the Galileo. Remember they said Kong and the witch were dead, but still came through with them.





True but they ended up as resin...........not the infinitely more expensive plastic kits the Witch was going to be.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Zombie_61 said:


> As much as I'd like to have the new Galileo kit, I'm hoping this isn't the case. Repeatedly announcing a kit, then announcing it's been canceled, then releasing it anyway, makes it look like they either don't know what they're doing, or like they enjoy jerking their customers around.


The 1/350 TOS-E ran hot and cold for a long time before they went all-in


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> The 1/350 TOS-E ran hot and cold for a long time before they went all-in


Yeah, I kind of remember that. Didn't they say at one point it was impossible for them to do it (subtext, as an affordable kit) because reasons? Wasn't there some convention, Wonderfest or something, where they showcased the development work to date and that triggered the '1701 club' idea which the response to pushed it into 'acceptable risk' by the money controllers?

Or am I mis-remembering a much more convoluted development path than reality?


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

seaQuest said:


> Maybe they've cut a deal with Revell to run some Apollo-Saturn Vs and sell them in Assignment: Earth packaging.


They already have a Apollo/Saturn V kit, it's 1/200 scale.


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## fire91bird (Feb 3, 2008)

Steve H said:


> Yeah, I kind of remember that. Didn't they say at one point it was impossible for them to do it (subtext, as an affordable kit) because reasons? Wasn't there some convention, Wonderfest or something, where they showcased the development work to date and that triggered the '1701 club' idea which the response to pushed it into 'acceptable risk' by the money controllers?
> 
> Or am I mis-remembering a much more convoluted development path than reality?


They showed some CAD drawings and then some time later it showed up on a survey at Wonderfest as just being considered. The response was "We thought this was already under development". I believe the bad PR was at least partly responsible for the TOS/E getting the green light, but the 1701 club didn't show up until the next Wonderfest and it still felt like they needed more convincing. After that, I try not to expect anything until there are test shots at least and even then things could probably be canceled. In any case, the TOS/E is a great rendition (IMHO) and I hope it worked out for them.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

fire91bird said:


> They showed some CAD drawings and then some time later it showed up on a survey at Wonderfest as just being considered. The response was "We thought this was already under development". I believe the bad PR was at least partly responsible for the TOS/E getting the green light, but the 1701 club didn't show up until the next Wonderfest and it still felt like they needed more convincing. After that, I try not to expect anything until there are test shots at least and even then things could probably be canceled. In any case, the TOS/E is a great rendition (IMHO) and I hope it worked out for them.


It's a kit I'd love to take a shot at, but the price is out of my reach currently, and, honestly, I'm not sure my current skills are up to the level the kit deserves. Heck, I still haven't thrown one of the 1/1000 scale Enterprises together!

but yeah, what I recall, the 1701 club was the tipping point that finally got the 1/350 into production. Hard to believe there was any question about it but then again, they likely were going by the sales of the 1/350 Refit (which I'm guessing were decent) and the sales of the 1/350 'Enterprise' NX-01 (which I'm being really harsh and suggesting it didn't sell as well as the Refit.)

That's the problem when Money People are the controlling voice, because almost always they're COMPLETELY detached from the customer base. The likely thought that all Enterprises would sell the same and the lesser sales (assumed on my end) of the NX-01 probably scared them. That fear clearly wouldn't take into account the iconic nature of the original (and to me the one, true) Enterprise. 

Sometimes you have to drag the Money People kicking and screaming to do what needs to be done. Then they claim the success was their idea.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Richard Baker said:


> The 1/350 TOS-E ran hot and cold for a long time before they went all-in


Good example. "Hey, we're going to produce this new kit...no, wait, we're not because it would be too expensive...well, maybe, but...nope, we're not gonna' do it. Oh, wait, yes we are!" :freak:


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

If it's:
1) A Trek kit
2) Not the Galileo
3) Not a repop
4) They pulled a surprise Eagle at Wonderfest last year
Then for me there's really no downside to getting excited about a 1/350 K'Tinga. If I'm disappointed, well, it wouldn't be the first time.:hat:


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Hunk A Junk said:


> If it's:
> 1) A Trek kit
> 2) Not the Galileo
> 3) Not a repop
> ...


It's really important to keep in mind one of the significant things that worked in favor of the Eagle was the repetitive nature, the modular look of the design. I'm sure there was a HUGE savings in tooling costs due to the parts breakdown that allowed one mold to be shot several times for significant portions of the kit. I'm no expert but just simple observation tells me the 22" Eagle used at least 50% less tool steel compared to other kits. 

Mind, it may be this parts breakdown may have simplified the overall look and 'truth' compared to some of the 44" Filming Models but I've not seen much complaining about that. I think the main complaint has been about removing the mold seams from all the 'tubing' parts. 

(it seems to me, from looking at the different photos of the three 44" Eagles that there was more asymmetric layout in the greebly planted on the miniatures than seen in the new 22" kit)

Anyway, the minimal use of tool steel (and thus reduced cost) and the modular nature of the kit had to be factors in the seeming fast-track release. There are no Star Trek subjects that would have a similar path.


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Steve H said:


> Anyway, the minimal use of tool steel (and thus reduced cost) and the modular nature of the kit had to be factors in the seeming fast-track release. There are no Star Trek subjects that would have a similar path.


True, but that leads us right back to "which kit is it?" In terms of Trek subjects still out there (at least those customer surveys say we'd be anxious to buy), nothing is very modular. The K'Tinga at least offers some opportunity for supplemental add-on kits, like parts and etch to make Kronos One or a lighting kit. I suppose a 1/350 Reliant could have conversion pieces to make a Soyuz class (or whatever the different variations were called during the runs of TNG and DS9), but would those make a Reliant more desirable than a K'Tinga?

I often hear the argument, "Well, the bad guy ships don't sell as well as the good guy ships." This may be true for Trek because most of the villain ships are meh (especially in TOS). Star Wars imperial ships, however, sell very well because they're cool designs and have plenty of detail. I think the K'Tinga would fall into that category. The current K'Tinga model is pretty lacking, but a more accurate and larger kit could be a winner.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Hunk A Junk said:


> True, but that leads us right back to "which kit is it?" In terms of Trek subjects still out there (at least those customer surveys say we'd be anxious to buy), nothing is very modular. The K'Tinga at least offers some opportunity for supplemental add-on kits, like parts and etch to make Kronos One or a lighting kit. I suppose a 1/350 Reliant could have conversion pieces to make a Soyuz class (or whatever the different variations were called during the runs of TNG and DS9), but would those make a Reliant more desirable than a K'Tinga?
> 
> I often hear the argument, "Well, the bad guy ships don't sell as well as the good guy ships." This may be true for Trek because most of the villain ships are meh (especially in TOS). Star Wars imperial ships, however, sell very well because they're cool designs and have plenty of detail. I think the K'Tinga would fall into that category. The current K'Tinga model is pretty lacking, but a more accurate and larger kit could be a winner.


It's not just Star Trek. I won't write a long post on Bandai and the history of Gundam model kits (really short form- Bandai decided that as sponsor and eventual owner of the Gundam franchise, circa 1992 ALL Mobile Suits were to be called Gundam, because Gundam outsold all the other robots. This plan has never resulted in any robot model selling as many kits as the 'hero' main Gundam of each series/movie and nothing ever sells as well as that original 1979 design Gundam, except maybe the Zaku) but it's the same problem. 

No matter what, an Enterprise will outsell any other Star Trek kit. The Classic '60s Enterprise will always outsell any other Enterprise. These are the facts. 

That doesn't mean there should be nothing but TOS Enterprise models made, just that the sales expectations should be realistic.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Hunk A Junk said:


> True, but that leads us right back to "which kit is it?" In terms of Trek subjects still out there (at least those customer surveys say we'd be anxious to buy), nothing is very modular. The K'Tinga at least offers some opportunity for supplemental add-on kits, like parts and etch to make Kronos One or a lighting kit. I suppose a 1/350 Reliant could have conversion pieces to make a Soyuz class (or whatever the different variations were called during the runs of TNG and DS9), but would those make a Reliant more desirable than a K'Tinga?
> 
> I often hear the argument, "Well, the bad guy ships don't sell as well as the good guy ships." This may be true for Trek because most of the villain ships are meh (especially in TOS). Star Wars imperial ships, however, sell very well because they're cool designs and have plenty of detail. I think the K'Tinga would fall into that category. The current K'Tinga model is pretty lacking, but a more accurate and larger kit could be a winner.





I'd agree with that. No doubt the Enterprise kits are the biggest sellers with Trek but many of the other villain ships in Trek *are *meh.........except for the D7 and for me (and I suspect many others) the K'Tinga. 

And the best villain ship in Trek deserves a nice big kit.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> It's really important to keep in mind one of the significant things that worked in favor of the Eagle was the repetitive nature, the modular look of the design. I'm sure there was a HUGE savings in tooling costs due to the parts breakdown that allowed one mold to be shot several times for significant portions of the kit. I'm no expert but just simple observation tells me the 22" Eagle used at least 50% less tool steel compared to other kits.
> 
> Mind, it may be this parts breakdown may have simplified the overall look and 'truth' compared to some of the 44" Filming Models but I've not seen much complaining about that. I think the main complaint has been about removing the mold seams from all the 'tubing' parts.
> 
> ...





There's probably no doubt the modular parts worked heavily in the Eagles favour (alongside it being right at the top of many peoples wants lists......right next to the K'Tinga) but Trek having more fans than Space 1999 probably balances that out. And even though there's hardly any modular parts with the K'Tinga model companies do many kits that aren't modular so they obviously can't just rely on repeating patterns with every new kit.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

How many versions of the K'Tinga could be done anyway? There's the Motion Picture version and Kronos 1. Possibly the Phase II also.


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## oggy4u (Sep 27, 2007)

There were variations of the K'tinga's warp engines and the 
area near the impulse engines in Deep Space Nine and also Voyager .So I believe you can do more than two K'tinga's .


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

I don't think this possibility has been mentioned, but it's not implausible: Round 2 could be planning to offer a Phase II Enterprise in 1/1000. Shaw's study model and the fan series prove this is a pretty sweet design. It wouldn't be the first time Round 2 put out a "speculative" Enterprise since they released the NX-01 refit. And, hey, it fulfills their unwritten company directive to release as many version of the Enterprise as possible. If I can't get a Galileo or 1/350 K'Tinga, I'd settle for a PII.


----------



## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

Hunk A Junk said:


> I don't think this possibility has been mentioned, but it's not implausible: Round 2 could be planning to offer a Phase II Enterprise in 1/1000. Shaw's study model and the fan series prove this is a pretty sweet design. It wouldn't be the first time Round 2 put out a "speculative" Enterprise since they released the NX-01 refit. And, hey, it fulfills their unwritten company directive to release as many version of the Enterprise as possible. If I can't get a Galileo or 1/350 K'Tinga, I'd settle for a PII.


I would buy one if they did this! However, I would be surprised if they do. I know Eaglemoss is looking to release the Phase II die cast version in the near future, and a 1/1000 would be more cost effective.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

oggy4u said:


> There were variations of the K'tinga's warp engines and the
> area near the impulse engines in Deep Space Nine and also Voyager .So I believe you can do more than two K'tinga's .





I can't remember as I haven't seen them for years but wasn't the K'Tinga in the Next Generation not Voyager?


----------



## seaQuest (Jan 12, 2003)

Steve H said:


> It's not just Star Trek. I won't write a long post on Bandai and the history of Gundam model kits (really short form- Bandai decided that as sponsor and eventual owner of the Gundam franchise, circa 1992 ALL Mobile Suits were to be called Gundam, because Gundam outsold all the other robots. This plan has never resulted in any robot model selling as many kits as the 'hero' main Gundam of each series/movie and nothing ever sells as well as that original 1979 design Gundam, except maybe the Zaku) but it's the same problem.
> 
> No matter what, an Enterprise will outsell any other Star Trek kit. The Classic '60s Enterprise will always outsell any other Enterprise. These are the facts.
> 
> That doesn't mean there should be nothing but TOS Enterprise models made, just that the sales expectations should be realistic.


You mean, after all this time, Amuro's RX-78 is still THE top-selling Gundam kit? Amazing!


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

seaQuest said:


> You mean, after all this time, Amuro's RX-78 is still THE top-selling Gundam kit? Amazing!


Well, not the super cruddy old 1/100 scale kit or the slightly better 1/144 kit, I refer to whatever the most current version Bandai has released. They go back every couple of years and introduce new stuff. The last 'big one' was the 1/144 Real Grade kit, and that IS nice, exactly as promised- MG level detail and joints and all in a 1/144 scale model. 

The most recent version of the RX-78 is the new HGUC Revive (Bandai 0196716), which was inspired by the antics of the 2 Gundam Build Fighters series, the key idea being 'universal joints' so if you want to make a custom Mobile Suit you can swap arms, legs, head, torso and option parts as you wish. It can pose like crazy and has the most 'true to the anime and establishment sheets' design yet. Downside? No Core Fighter (they keep waffling at Sunrise if they like that or not, if it's really canon or not) and a couple of holes on the forearms to plug the shield and/or accessory weapons in. I'm filling those. 

Nobody will even mention numbers but when I asked "is it safe to say this kit sells ten times the units compared to the others in the line?" I was told "maybe more"

It's a nice kit, it's a nice price, you can even sometimes find it at a Barnes and Noble for under $15 USD, which I think puts it nicely in the 'impulse buy' zone. 

1/144 HGUC Revive RX-78-2 Gundam by Bandai | HobbyLink Japan

(well, heck! Amazon has it for just under $11! sweet! )

http://www.amazon.com/Bandai-Hobby-...F8&qid=1462585660&sr=8-1&keywords=hguc+revive

And now, back to Star Trek, sponsored by Bandai. We make Gundam. And some other things.


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## oggy4u (Sep 27, 2007)

"I can't remember as I haven't seen them for years but wasn't the K'Tinga in the Next Generation not Voyager? "

The K'tinga was used in the Voyager episode called "Prophecy" .


----------



## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

On the Discount Plastic Models site, I found a listing for the AMT USS Reliant - _Clear Edition_. Kit is currently out of stock. Could _this_ be the other Star Trek kit that Round 2 is coming out with? After clicking the link, go to the bottom of the page:

Hobby Surplus Sales - Traditional Hobbies at Discounts of 20-75%

Assuming this info is correct (I haven't seen this listed anywhere else) and based on the fact that it's listed as an AMT kit at a list price of $50, I would think this is the 1/537 kit that was reissued a few years back.

_If_ this is the kit, I'm sure a few people will be happy, but for those of us hoping for a new-tool kit, it's a bit of a disappointment.

Also, the windows on the sides of the ship are *not* molded on, so you'd have to use a guide to mask the windows before painting.


----------



## robn1 (Nov 17, 2012)

A Google search turned up an image of the box art with "Clear Edition" printed on it, so it's been done or is coming soon.


----------



## fire91bird (Feb 3, 2008)

robn1 said:


> A Google search turned up an image of the box art with "Clear Edition" printed on it, so it's been done or is coming soon.


That's the 2012 release.


----------



## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

fire91bird said:


> That's the 2012 release.


I'd forgotten about this release. It's shown on this website: http://ma-test.wikia.com/wiki/Aluminum_Model_Toys

So, either the Discount Plastic Model site has old info or Round2 is reissuing the 2012 version of the kit.


----------



## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

I think a clear Reliant would be considered a re-pop and I think we've been told this new kit isn't a re-pop.

That said, a clear Reliant? Yes, please. It also be nice to get another stab at a clear Ent-D and DS9 since those have vanished at MSR prices.


----------



## TomD66 (Apr 25, 2009)

On Culttvman's site it says the reissue of the clear Enterpise-D is scheduled for this fall.


----------



## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Hunk A Junk said:


> ...I think we've been told this new kit isn't a re-pop.


We have? Not according to this: Round 2 updates - April 2016 - CultTVman Fantastic Modeling

At the bottom of the post it says: "Round 2 also has at *least one other Trek project in the works*. It is sure to please quite a few people.".

Doesn't say whether or not the Trek project is new-tool or re-pop. Those of us on this forum have _speculated_ that it might be a new-tool.

Has there been any other official info regarding this impending release?


----------



## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

spock62 said:


> We have? Not according to this: Round 2 updates - April 2016 - CultTVman Fantastic Modeling
> 
> At the bottom of the post it says: "Round 2 also has at *least one other Trek project in the works*. It is sure to please quite a few people.".
> 
> ...


I guess not. But if this "sure to please quite a few people" kit ends up being just a re-pop, Cult may be defining "quite a few" as equal to "two guys who fell on their heads after sniffing too much glue." :wink2:


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Could be the same people who yawned when asked if they would like a big Galileo kit...

"sure to please quite a few people" is far too general advertisingese to go by. 
I am hoping for the best but who knows what we may get.


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

spock62 said:


> We have? Not according to this: Round 2 updates - April 2016 - CultTVman Fantastic Modeling
> 
> At the bottom of the post it says: "Round 2 also has at *least one other Trek project in the works*. It is sure to please quite a few people.".
> 
> ...


If you'll recall, I was wondering what re-pop or old kit rescue/revival might qualify as 'sure to please quite a few people' and of the subjects mentioned, I'm not seeing anything that appears to reach that bar. 

New tool, or modified tool, everything is up in the air. Myself, I keep coming back to the original AMT Galileo kit as having that potential, even with the hard feelings still present over the postponing of the all new tool kit. 

And I'm fully on board with the group that feels if R2 chuffs out a repop that the only thing that's new is some gimmick (plated, clear, two-for-one, whatever), that's gonna be some serious disappointment. A gold plated (for example) AMT Enterprise (for the 50th, see) is NOT on my list of 'sure to please' items. 

Finding some way to release (discovered vintage molds, new tooling created from vintage kit, whatever) that first run original tooling kit, with grain-of-wheat bulbs and all, that just might qualify.


----------



## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Hunk A Junk said:


> I guess not. But if this "sure to please quite a few people" kit ends up being just a re-pop, Cult may be defining "quite a few" as equal to "two guys who fell on their heads after sniffing too much glue."


:laugh:



Steve H said:


> If you'll recall, I was wondering what re-pop or old kit rescue/revival might qualify as 'sure to please quite a few people' and of the subjects mentioned, I'm not seeing anything that appears to reach that bar.
> 
> New tool, or modified tool, everything is up in the air. Myself, I keep coming back to the original AMT Galileo kit as having that potential, even with the hard feelings still present over the postponing of the all new tool kit.
> 
> ...


To me, _"sure to please quite a few people"_ would be either: a) 1/350 USS Reliant, b) 1/350 K'Tinga, c) 1/500-1/600 TOS Enterprise or d) 1/1000 Enterprise-D, all new-tool obviously. If it's a repop, then I'd agree with you regarding the original AMT Galileo, though that might P.O. a lot of folks that were waiting on the new-tool Galileo.

With the exception of the Enterprise-D I mentioned, I think only original series/original crew movie kits would sell well enough for Round 2 to consider doing a new-tool kit, unless your talking about their 1/2500 Cadet Series line.

But, based on what Jamie Hood has said on their "Collector Blog", I highly doubt we'll see a new-tool kit.

As much as I think the 18" has been reissued to death, there must be enough modelers out there for Round 2 to justify the re-re-reissues (I'm one of those modelers, as I'm working on the Glow-in-the-Dark Tholian version at the moment). So...I would probably buy another 18" kit if it came with lights (I'd prefer LEDs) and clear amber bussard domes! That issue of the 18" kit being one of the first kits my dad bought for me when I was a kid. He helped me with the wiring, I did the rest. Good memories.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Ya know, guys, from what I have observed in the last few years or so, I will be happy if they just release the little 1:350 Galileo by itself! I have learned to expect nothing. That 1:350 TOS Enterprise...my God! I would have _killed for that_ back in the day! Then TMP Refit, the Reliant and the Archer Enterprise? All in 1:350 scale!! Oops, I can't find the Reliant in 1:350, just 1:1000. Still...

Then we have the Space 1999 Eagle in 1:48 scale! 22 freakin' inches long! Believe me, I _ain't_ gonna stomp and complain, and demand _anything_ from this industry! I feel so fortunate to even be able to buy _any_ of the above! 

Growing up in the sixties, I had to scratch build most of what I wanted...NOW look what we have! I am forever thankful! :thumbsup:

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Radiodugger said:


> Ya know, guys, from what I have observed in the last few years or so, I will be happy if they just release the little 1:350 Galileo by itself! I have learned to expect nothing. That 1:350 TOS Enterprise...my God! I would have _killed for that_ back in the day! Then TMP Refit, the Reliant and the Archer Enterprise? All in 1:350 scale!! Oops, I can't find the Reliant in 1:350, just 1:1000. Still...
> 
> Then we have the Space 1999 Eagle in 1:48 scale! 22 freakin' inches long! Believe me, I _ain't_ gonna stomp and complain, and demand _anything_ from this industry! I feel so fortunate to even be able to buy _any_ of the above!
> 
> ...


But thankful doesn't have to equate unquestioning or slavish mindless praise no matter what. 

Remember, we are customers, consumers. In a market driven economy what we spend our money on should be considered and factored into the decisions that, in theory, are meant to result in profitability and continued corporate existence. 

In other words, they's gotsta do some listenin' 

Now, fantasy land, I think a 1/1000 Enterprise D could be a very exciting kit, were they to make it. I still think it would take some hard engineering work so the primary hull doesn't warp or fall off the neck. 

I wonder if that would have to be a choice imposed on the builder? You can have the saucer joined to the engineering hull or have them separate, but you can't have the saucer removable.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

oggy4u said:


> "I can't remember as I haven't seen them for years but wasn't the K'Tinga in the Next Generation not Voyager? "
> 
> The K'tinga was used in the Voyager episode called "Prophecy" .





Ahh yes forgot about that but it looks like it's appeared in just about all the series. I've found a link with the various appearances...........

Ex Astris Scientia - The Everlasting Klingon Battlecruiser


it would be interesting to find out any differences to the design from STTMP and Trek VI.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

One difference I can see from Trek VI to STTMP (apart from the command area) is there's no windows on the area behind the neck. 

One thing I love about the STTMP K'Tinga is the windows in that area so bit of a step backwards as far as I'm concerned.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Steve H said:


> Now, fantasy land, I think a 1/1000 Enterprise D could be a very exciting kit, were they to make it. I still think it would take some hard engineering work so the primary hull doesn't warp or fall off the neck.
> 
> I wonder if that would have to be a choice imposed on the builder? You can have the saucer joined to the engineering hull or have them separate, but you can't have the saucer removable.


Since 2017 marks the 30th anniversary of _TNG_, it would be nice if they were to commemorate it with a 1/1000 _-D_ kit. I imagine, though, that the re-release of the clear edition 1/400 kit with a 30th anniversary _TNG_ sticker will have to suffice, since Round 2 doesn't seem to want to do anything extraordinary to commemorate *any* _Star Trek_ anniversary.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Well I know one thing. The 50th anniversary of the original series deserves something big and there's only one thing that can be that big kit in my books (biased though I am).:smile2:


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I hope Round 2 surprises us with a all new kit of something we want for the Anniversary.

If they don't do something really special it will haunt them for a long time.


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## TIEbomber1967 (May 21, 2012)

"haunt" ?
What I strange choice of word(s). I don't think it will "haunt" them in the slightest.
They have an immense catalog of models of which Star Trek is only a small part. Doing nothing for Trek's 50th anniversary may be a missed opportunity, both in terms of sales and customer relations, but there are A LOT of other kits that make money too. Heck, for a guaranteed seller they could just make a Space 1999 Hawk in 1:48.
I'd like to see a new Trek kit for the 50th, but it's probably not going to happen, and they won't be haunted by that.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

TIEbomber1967 said:


> "haunt" ?
> What I strange choice of word(s). I don't think it will "haunt" them in the slightest.
> They have an immense catalog of models of which Star Trek is only a small part. Doing nothing for Trek's 50th anniversary may be a missed opportunity, both in terms of sales and customer relations, but there are A LOT of other kits that make money too. Heck, for a guaranteed seller they could just make a Space 1999 Hawk in 1:48.
> I'd like to see a new Trek kit for the 50th, but it's probably not going to happen, and they won't be haunted by that.





I'd like to see a Hawk too but they've got ta do something for the 50th Trek anniversary. I think it will haunt them if they don't and be a missed opportunity. I know they've got loads of Trek kits already but reissuing those existing kits won't exactly be such big news.

They need a big new tool...........and because I am THE Sungod only my wisdom counts and that I'm afraid must mean a K'Tinga.

(Well I can dream can't I?):grin2:


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## TIEbomber1967 (May 21, 2012)

Well okay...
Seeing how you're a god and all, I guess you could haunt them.


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## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> I hope Round 2 surprises us with a all new kit of something we want for the Anniversary.
> 
> If they don't do something really special it will haunt them for a long time.


Star Trek Magazine says that the new kit is a 1:1000 Akira-class USS Thundercloud.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

SUNGOD said:


> I'd like to see a Hawk too but they've *got ta do something for the 50th Trek anniversary*.


Check out my question and Jamie Hood's response on the R2 Collector Model blog back on 02/17/16 (response #26): Star Trek Models: (not a U.S.S. Excelsior, but a) Galileo Shuttle update | Collector Model

In part I wrote: _"Now that the Galileo is off the table for the time being, are there any new-tool kits planned for 2016? Being that it’s the 50th Anniversary of Star Trek, wouldn’t R2 want to take advantage of it?"

"You say that: “We still have a lot we can and want to do with the Star Trek license!” I guess the question a lot of people are asking is: “If that’s how you and R2 feel, why aren’t there more new-tool Star Trek kits?”. People are hoping for more, especially this being the 50th Anniversary year."_

Jamie's reply in part: _"Answering this one directly “If that’s how you and R2 feel, why aren’t there more new-tool Star Trek kits?” The simple answer is this is an unusually tight year for us. It is unfortunate that it also happens to also be the 50th anniversary of Star Trek. I wish the anniversary had come four years ago, then our timing would ave been perfect. I would LOVE to do more. I’d LOVE to do a 1:350 K’t’inga, a 1:1000 Enterprise D and many more. There is only so much I can do and only so much our company can do."_

Unless something changed soon after he wrote that, I wouldn't hold my breath for any new tool Trek kits this year.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Fozzie said:


> Star Trek Magazine says that the new kit is a 1:1000 Akira-class USS Thundercloud.


Is this from the current issue, #56, the one with George Takei on it? I saw this issue at the bookstore last week which has an article about Round 2's Star Trek kits. They mentioned the 1:1000 Akira that was supposed to be produced, and explained why it was cancelled. I didn't see anything that said the kit was to be produced. Or did I miss something?


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## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

spock62 said:


> Is this from the current issue, #56, the one with George Takei on it? I saw this issue at the bookstore last week which has an article about Round 2's Star Trek kits. They mentioned the 1:1000 Akira that was supposed to be produced, and explained why it was cancelled. I didn't see anything that said the kit was to be produced. Or did I miss something?


I thought they said it was scheduled for 2017, but it is possible I misread that. That would be disappointing.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

The 1/1000 scale Akira "USS Thunderchild" was the kit they announced with great fanfare and yhen quietly canceled many years ago. This was the start of the major credibility issues which linger yet today.

I would be astounded if that was the special kit being planned on, I hope it is but I was one of those eho believed them before...

BTW - Thunderchild was the name of the warship that fought the Tripod in the original 'War of the Worlds ' novel


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

spock62 said:


> Check out my question and Jamie Hood's response on the R2 Collector Model blog back on 02/17/16 (response #26): Star Trek Models: (not a U.S.S. Excelsior, but a) Galileo Shuttle update | Collector Model
> 
> In part I wrote: _"Now that the Galileo is off the table for the time being, are there any new-tool kits planned for 2016? Being that it’s the 50th Anniversary of Star Trek, wouldn’t R2 want to take advantage of it?"
> 
> ...


Like you stated something may have changed and they can make an announcement at Wonderfest later this month.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

I dunno. I get the impression that buying back Johnny Lightning was really expensive, maybe more than it was honestly worth all things considered, and that's having long term effects.

I still don't 'get' the idea that the Johnny Lightning brand is more than a cultural blip. I was THERE man, when Topper was making the things and those cars were ass. 

But I admit bias as Mattel and Hot Wheels were critical parts of my youth.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

An Akira wouldn't be appropriate for the 50th anniversary of _TOS_, anyway.


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

For me, the difficult thing in all this is seeing R2 struggle to put out maybe one new sci-fi kit a year -- maybe one spectacular kit every 5 years or so (the TOS-E and Eagle) -- while at the same time seeing Bandai not only cranking out new Star Wars kits every 2 months on average (or less), but making those kits accurate and engineered with crazy precision. Yeah, it may be an unfair apples to watermelons comparison, but Bandai is pushing the art of modelmaking (and I DO consider it an art) into the 21st century and I want to see other companies step up to the challenge. There's really no excuse for accuracy issues any more. There's really no excuse for poorly engineered kits unless a company is just conceding that it isn't worth it to them financially. And if that's the case, why bother? Relinquish the license. Otherwise, you're just holding your customers hostage. And for content holders, like CBS, they should choose vendors who are going to put out the best products. If R2 can't (or won't) do it, either they should step aside or CBS should grant the license to a company eager to step it up.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Hunk A Junk said:


> For me, the difficult thing in all this is seeing R2 struggle to put out maybe one new sci-fi kit a year -- maybe one spectacular kit every 5 years or so (the TOS-E and Eagle) -- while at the same time seeing Bandai not only cranking out new Star Wars kits every 2 months on average (or less), but making those kits accurate and engineered with crazy precision. Yeah, it may be an unfair apples to watermelons comparison, but Bandai is pushing the art of modelmaking (and I DO consider it an art) into the 21st century and I want to see other companies step up to the challenge. There's really no excuse for accuracy issues any more. There's really no excuse for poorly engineered kits unless a company is just conceding that it isn't worth it to them financially. And if that's the case, why bother? Relinquish the license. Otherwise, you're just holding your customers hostage. And for content holders, like CBS, they should choose vendors who are going to put out the best products. If R2 can't (or won't) do it, either they should step aside or CBS should grant the license to a company eager to step it up.


I'm probably going to be boring for a little bit here. 

Who should CBS grant the license to? Revell? They're really no longer a U.S. company, I get the feeling Germany is the driving force now. Moebius? They do make genre kits but they're really slowed down. That's about it, for any significant size or market share.

The problem, at the core, is simply there's no money to be made in plastic kit sales in the U.S. anymore. Between the cultural drift that doesn't encourage building ANYTHING and the decades of 'panic pageant' over sniffing 'airplane glue' and 'hobby paint leads to graffiti' and 'children can't touch a hobby knife, they might get HURT' , combined with the inflation that has killed plastic model kits as 'cheap disposable' entertainment, the decline of the nuclear family so that fathers aren't sharing hobbies with sons (and daughters) (see also the decline of model railroads and slot car racing) and the lack of well stocked and knowledgeable local hobby stores...

There's no market. There's no money. If I were to play the apologist, it's a damn miracle R2 makes ANY Star Trek kits and we should be grateful for that.

But I'm no apologist. 

Japan still has a thriving plastic kit market. It's mainly due to Bandai's near monopoly on genre subjects but other 'mainstream' kit makers (Hasegawa, Tamiya et al) throw a lot of kits out to the marketplace. Building things and having pride in the doing is still something encouraged and there's a TON of local hobby shops. 

Bandai dipped their toe in the Star Trek waters not that long ago and I'm still not sure how that came to be, but their kits, while quite sophisticated, didn't seem to catch on big with American Trek fans. It may have been the pre-colored, pre-decorated nature of the kits that made them more like the modern Revell-style 'building toy' kits you find at local hypermarkets, Toys R Us and Hobby Lobby and thus 'unworthy'. 

I don't know the better answer to all this. What we have NOW is R2, and hey, really, it COULD be worse. 

I mean, I don't see a ton of threads on building that Revell TOS Enterprise from Germany. What if THAT kit had been our big ST 50 'treat'?


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

It's Trek's _50th_ Anniversary! The economy sucks. It ain't gettin' any better, in my opinion. I will eventually acquire the 1:350 TOS and the S:1999 Eagle. I'll be damned happy with those, once paid for! LOL! 

How is that 1:350 scale _Archer_ Enterprise? I really like that. I was surprised to see that. The Xindi ships and the Romulan drone are interesting as is the Andorian's ship. No market for those, though. 

Remember, we had Voyager and Deep Space Nine as well. How big would a Deep Space Nine be in 1:350? LOL!

Doug


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## Owen E Oulton (Jan 6, 2012)

Radiodugger said:


> How big would a Deep Space Nine be in 1:350? LOL!


4.15 metres, or 13.6' across. That's a foot and a half more than twice the size of the studio model. Curiously that makes the studio model 1/793 scale, or very roughly in scale with Revell's _USS Voyager_ model.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Just a few thoughts on Round 2/Star Trek kits based on what some have written:

In a perfect world, I'd love to see Round 2 produce several new tool, accurate Trek kits each year. But, it's not a perfect world. Round 2 has other brands to consider too. Car and truck kits, diecast cars, etc. They only have so much cash to do new product or reissue older product. Their not going to do all Star Trek all the time.

Regarding the issue of accuracy, I'm not sure how that can be applied to Round 2. Even though Round 2 does enhance some of their old tools, there's only so much they can do to fix things. For instance, to fix the 18" Enterprise, you'd have to do a new-tool as just about every inch of the model needs work. With the new tool Trek kits, for the most part, Round 2 does a very good job regarding accuracy

The biggest problem kit manufacturers in the US have is a greatly diminished market here in the States. And Star Trek is a extremely small fraction of that market. And most customers are only interested in the main ships from the various series and movies, i.e. Enterprise, Reliant, Klingon Battlecruiser. Producing a kit of a ship that was seen in one episode of DS9 for about 5 seconds is risky at best, plain stupid at worst.

Like Steve H said, it could be worse, it just depends how you look at it. Every Amt Trek kit Round 2 has reissued has some sort of enhancement. Sometimes it's just better decals. Other times it's both better decals _and_ updated/accurized parts. Just about any Round 2 reissue is better than the original AMT release. And, when they do make new tool kits, they do put the effort into making them as accurate as possible.

As far as another US company doing better, which one? 

Revell? They seem to be mostly into car kits, especially old kits that can be reissued, I highly doubt they'd be interested in Star Trek. Besides, look at the mess they've made out of the Star Wars license.

Moebius? Seems like a good fit, but I'm not sure they'd want to take on the high licensing costs. Plus, they're kind of hit and miss in the accuracy department. I doubt they'd do much better than Round 2.

For now we have Round 2, and while not perfect, we're far better off than when AMT was in control.


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Simply put: I want Round 2 to do better. Bandai is showing how the technology of making a kit has improved. That level of quality and accuracy should now be the standard. If R2 can't or won't even try to do better, why should they continue to have the license? There is a new Trek show debuting in January. That means a new hero ship (likely an Enterprise) and other signature vessels. I'd rather not spend years waiting to see IF R2 will get around to making a kit and then another decade wrestling with an inaccurate kit try to make it presentable. But that's just my feelings based on history, so what do I know.


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## robn1 (Nov 17, 2012)

Round 2 seems to do just fine with quality and accuracy, on their new tools anyway (can't fault them for the repops). Where they are lacking is frequency of output.

Revell puts out a lot of SW kits but they're all crap, that one decent TIE fighter was a fluke.

Moebius has good output, but as was said the accuracy is hit and miss. And they seem to work with lower cost licenses, great for those obscure subjects but not for Trek.

I'd love to see ST and SW go to someone who gives a damn _and _can produce product, but who?


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Hunk A Junk said:


> Simply put: I want Round 2 to do better. Bandai is showing how the technology of making a kit has improved. That level of quality and accuracy should now be the standard. If R2 can't or won't even try to do better, why should they continue to have the license? There is a new Trek show debuting in January. That means a new hero ship (likely an Enterprise) and other signature vessels. I'd rather not spend years waiting to see IF R2 will get around to making a kit and then another decade wrestling with an inaccurate kit try to make it presentable. But that's just my feelings based on history, so what do I know.


But the difference HERE is, Round 2 trusts Chinese turnkey manufacturers which always seems to end up having cost overruns, whereas Bandai actually makes their own kits, does their own prototyping and tooling and has the complete infrastructure in-house. 

Yes some kits do get sent to Chinese factories owned (as much as anyone can 'own' something in Red China) by Bandai, but all the engineering and design is done in Japan. Tighter controls, greater oversight. Items that benefit from being a 'prestige' product are still actually made in Japan. 

Anything R2 could do to improve their manufacturing situation would cost money, long term investment money that would not instantly return a profit within a fiscal quarter, and THAT kind of spending is an idea akin to Holy Water on a vampire. 

Seems to be what R2 could do to improve the relationship with the Chinese factories would be a. put together an in-house engineering and development staff with tooling experience to do all the development and then be able to send just instructions to cut steel. b. have a service in China to oversee the complete job, with access to all the notes and plans and fully understanding the desired finished product so they can intercede and prevent mistakes, so corrections don't become a week of round-robin and cascading errors. 

But those ideas don't have a chance of actually happening.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

TIEbomber1967 said:


> Well okay...
> Seeing how you're a god and all, I guess you could haunt them.




You're learning.:grin2:


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

spock62 said:


> Check out my question and Jamie Hood's response on the R2 Collector Model blog back on 02/17/16 (response #26): Star Trek Models: (not a U.S.S. Excelsior, but a) Galileo Shuttle update | Collector Model
> 
> In part I wrote: _"Now that the Galileo is off the table for the time being, are there any new-tool kits planned for 2016? Being that it’s the 50th Anniversary of Star Trek, wouldn’t R2 want to take advantage of it?"
> 
> ...






I doubt we'll get any but at least Jamie said he'd love to do a 1/350 K'Tinga which gives me a tiny bit of hope we'll get one some day.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Hunk A Junk said:


> Simply put: I want Round 2 to do better. Bandai is showing how the technology of making a kit has improved. That level of quality and accuracy should now be the standard. If R2 can't or won't even try to do better, why should they continue to have the license? There is a new Trek show debuting in January. That means a new hero ship (likely an Enterprise) and other signature vessels. I'd rather not spend years waiting to see IF R2 will get around to making a kit and then another decade wrestling with an inaccurate kit try to make it presentable. But that's just my feelings based on history, so what do I know.


Hey, we're all entitled to our opinions, but I'm scratching my head on how you came to yours.

Just _how_ is Round 2's quality and accuracy, regarding new tool Star Trek subjects, inferior? Can you cite some examples of this? Their 1/1000 kits are very well done. Their 1/350 TOS Enterprise is considered the standard for that ship, right after their 1/1000 version. Moving away from Star Trek, there is the 1/48 Eagle and the 1/25 '66 Batmobile, both excellent, accurate kits. Just not seeing how you base your argument.

As for the new Trek show, time will tell if Round 2 gets the license and whether or not the show even lasts long enough for anyone to care. If Round 2 does produce kits from the show, what makes you think they'll turn out so bad that it will take them a "decade" to make the kits presentable?

Granted Bandai does a fantastic job with the Star Wars kits, but as mentioned, they have the resources to do so. Round 2 probably doesn't and can't do slide mold tools and all that. Doesn't mean they don't produce good kits.

And, finally, whether or not Round 2 should/should not have the license is not our decision. I'd rather see Round 2, Moebius or Pegasus have the Star Wars license in the US, but Revell has it so that's the end of that. Could be worse, Round 2 could have just followed what AMT did for years, just reissue the old kits year after year in new boxes with no attempts at updating them. And when they did make a new tool kit, screw it up. Instead, Round 2 is enhancing old kits and creating (admittedly at a slow pace) new tool kits that are very accurate. Doesn't sound too bad to me.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

I, like many others, was certainly upset at the apparent loss (or hopefully, just postponement) of the new _Galileo_ kit for the 50th Anniversary. But, I certainly have no desire to see Round 2 give up their _Star Trek_ license.

Here's why:

The ENTIRE catalog of the classic AMT and Polar Lights _Star Trek_ tools are the property of Round 2. Everything from the original AMT Enterprise repop on up through the latest 1/350, 1/1000 and 1/2500 Polar Lights kits (and everything in between) could no longer continue to be sold at retail once the license ended and the remaining stock disappears from the shelves. That's every _Star Trek_ kit out there minus the recent Revell Germany kits and and their repop of the Monogram _Voyager_.

No, I want Round 2 to continue with the _Star Trek_ license and hopefully find the resources to make more new kits that they know we all want.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Hunk A Junk said:


> ...There is a new Trek show debuting in January...


Yeah. On something called "CBS All Access", which requires viewers to pay to watch a handful of shows (at least initially) _with commercials that they will be unable to fast forward through_. No, thank you, I'll pass.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Zombie_61 said:


> Yeah. On something called "CBS All Access", which requires viewers to pay to watch a handful of shows (at least initially) _with commercials that they will be unable to fast forward through_. * No, thank you, I'll pass*.


Me too. I will NOT pay to watch TV. I cancelled my cable years ago. Hell, I pay for internet. I can watch most of what I want on Hulu/YouTube. I can't think of a thing I'd pay to watch. 

Doug


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

They are trying to jump start their new All Access streaming service with Star Trek, figuring fans will sign on like sheep. UPN used Voyager in a similar way, but just to draw viwers in instead of making them pay to watch anything at all.

Round 2 has done good eork eith whst they have released - repops have addional parts or at very least enhanced decala, new kits are accurate and well engineered. My biggest issue with them is that they are inconsistent - marketing and production keep getting out of synch and higher ups keep pulling the rug.


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

spock62 said:


> Hey, we're all entitled to our opinions, but I'm scratching my head on how you came to yours.
> 
> Just _how_ is Round 2's quality and accuracy, regarding new tool Star Trek subjects, inferior? Can you cite some examples of this?


I'm saying this in context of what Bandai is doing with their Star Wars line. There's no question that the level of accuracy, quality, and engineering on the Bandai products is superior to anything Round2 is doing. Every Trek kit I've ever owned, even the new TOS-E, which I love, has fit issues (the shuttle bay, the two saucer halves) or inaccuracies (the grid lines -- and, yes, I know that was a creative choice) that require grinding, surgery, and gobs of putty to fix. Have Round2's recent kits been better? Sure. The Eagle is great. Even there, however, the level of engineering hasn't quite caught up to Bandai's level.



spock62 said:


> As for the new Trek show, time will tell if Round 2 gets the license and whether or not the show even lasts long enough for anyone to care. If Round 2 does produce kits from the show, what makes you think they'll turn out so bad that it will take them a "decade" to make the kits presentable?


Nothing but history and a well documented track record. Round2's JJ-prise? Akira? Galileo? Again, I'm comparing the out of the box kits to Bandai's out of the box. There's no comparison that Bandai's kits, without modifications or after-market accessories, are far better representations of the subjects than the Round2 Trek kits. They just are.



spock62 said:


> Granted Bandai does a fantastic job with the Star Wars kits, but as mentioned, they have the resources to do so. Round 2 probably doesn't and can't do slide mold tools and all that. Doesn't mean they don't produce good kits.


But that's my point. If R2 can't do it -- and won't take steps to try to improve -- why should they continue to have the license? Other companies ARE doing a better job. Technology advances. Tools and techniques get better. I WANT Round2 to look at what Bandai is doing and say, "Holy crap! We need to step up our game!" Isn't that how progress is supposed to work? Isn't that how a consumer-driven market is supposed to work?



spock62 said:


> And, finally, whether or not Round 2 should/should not have the license is not our decision. I'd rather see Round 2, Moebius or Pegasus have the Star Wars license in the US, but Revell has it so that's the end of that.


No, it's not our decision, but it is our decision whether to buy their products and to give our opinions when they fall short. Revell may have the U.S. Star Wars license, but people are easily getting Bandai Star Wars kits on Amazon, usually for free or very cheap shipping, so that point is moot. The same could be true for possible Bandai Trek kits. Or else CBS could simply grant Bandai the U.S. license. All the kits are manufactured in China anyway regardless of where the company is headquartered.

At the end of the day, Bandai is making superior model kits. Their quality, accuracy, engineering, and even price are better than what Round2 currently offers. I would like Trek kits produced at that same level of craftsmanship. What's so wrong about that? If Round2 can do it, GREAT! They've taken steps in the right direction with their Eagle kit. Kudos to them. But if they can't, or won't, produce kits at the level of quality of their competitors, then why should they continue having such an iconic license? Yes, they own the molds of the existing kits and if they lost the license those kits would eventually go away. This was also true of the old AMT Star Wars kits now that Revell and Bandai have the license. But since Bandai, in particular, are making superior new kits to the old ones, who cares? I'll soon have a Bandai A-Wing that will no doubt be better than the old kit. I'm not shedding a tear that the old A-Wing is going away. The same could be true for Trek. Would I be willing to sacrifice never seeing the old AMT Galileo kit ever again if it meant having a new tool Bandai Galileo kit? In. A. Heartbeat.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

What Hunk is saying is truth to power. It's very sane yet passionate. Ultimately, however, it's just a statement of frustration because it cannot be a call to action. And I want to be clear, I'm THERE with him, OK?

The problem is, Round 2 just cannot be Bandai. It can't. Even if they WANTED to they can't. There are SO MANY barriers in the way, so many many 'Stops'.

There is no pressure for R2 to change, adapt, modify, improve, evolve, whatever you want to call it regardless of how you may feel about the job they do. Zero pressure from the consumer (not us, everyone else), from the retail chain, from the industry itself. 

Take a trip to Hobby Lobby, if you have one in your area. That model kit aisle, which can be seen as the 'Walmart' of the American Plastic Kit market, is solidly 70% R2 product. That's serious market domination. It really is. And that 70% is like , what, 98% 'old' product? It's like a local hobby shop circa the early '70s but with a 400% price increase.

The bothersome thing is, I rarely see that inventory move. I see the product CHANGE but I don't see gaps on the shelf from kits selling. The impression I get is the kits rotate. If it hasn't sold, it's returned and something else goes on the shelf. I acknowledge that may not be how it works, that would be a very radical way and unusual, but it's what I seem to be seeing. 

So, if that's how it's working, why in the world would R2 want to do anything to change that? It's safe, it's comfortable, it does nothing for long term growth but so what, business nowadays only considers that money that they make RIGHT NOW and right now, it's OK. 

R2 isn't really considering the international market, even in a 'gray seller'(i.e. they don't have a license for a specific region/country but they know the kits will get there, same as Bandai and the currently embargoed Star Wars kits) way. It really seems to me their thinking is more based on nostalgia for that mid-'60s to early '70s reality (many hobby shops and other retail channels, low prices making kits 'cheap disposable' entertainment, a societal culture that encourages building as a creative act and advertising. Actual honest to god advertising), all of that which is GONE, completely gone.

Can you picture R2 selling the 1/350 TOS Enterprise via a single page ad in a comic book? I can only imagine it in a ironic parody manner and it makes me sad.


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## TIEbomber1967 (May 21, 2012)

I also agree with Hunk-a-Junk, other companies could do better. BUT...
I've said this before in other threads... other companies aren't interested in Star Trek!

Bandai produced a few Trek kits, and then dropped the license. Why?
Fine Molds (F-toys) had the license, and made (only) one series of Star Trek miniature models, then dropped the license. They went on to make 11 or 12 series of Star Wars miniatures. Why not more Trek?
Revell made a few new kits, and then dropped the license. Why? Well, we know why, 'cuz they told us. The kit's didn't sell, so they won't make more.

Round2 makes money from the license BECAUSE they can re-pop all the old kits. If Moebius came along and got the license you can be guaranteed they would NOT reproduce the catalog of Trek ships that Round2 has. They would probably only do about half a dozen kits before finding out that the market is saturated with Trek models, and only hard-core, dedicated modelers are interested in yet another model of the Enterprise (whatever iteration).
It does not make me happy to say this. I wish it was different, I wish more people liked Trek and liked to build Trek models, but it's just not the case. In a way we're lucky Round2 came along, and is interested in Trek. Because it could just as easily have stayed Racing Champions, and Star Trek modeling would have taken a (distant) back seat to race car models.


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## robn1 (Nov 17, 2012)

I'm perfectly happy with R2's quality and accuracy. The TOS E and Eagle are superb as far as accuracy goes. The refit E has major problems, but that was done before R2, I'm sure they would have done it better. A few minor fit problems aren't really a problem, they're still far better than what we got from AMT or ERTL. Sure Bandai could do better, but they won't be making a 1/350 anything from Trek, 1/1000 would be about the max.

Revell's Trek kits are a unique case as they only had the license for Voyager, and there wasn't much to kit from that show beyond the Voyager and Marquis ship. They only did the Kaizon torpedo because it was _something _to do. The recent RoG kits did poorly because they were a huge step backwards in accuracy, they would have sold better otherwise. 

R2 seems to be a good fit for Trek, but geez guys get off the pot and make stuff! Bandai is also a good fit for SW, I just need an electron microscope to see the damn things. How about some bigger scales huh guys?


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Hunk A Junk said:


> At the end of the day, Bandai is making superior model kits. Their quality, accuracy, engineering, and even price are better than what Round2 currently offers. I would like Trek kits produced at that same level of craftsmanship. What's so wrong about that? If Round2 can do it, GREAT! They've taken steps in the right direction with their Eagle kit. Kudos to them. But if they can't, or won't, produce kits at the level of quality of their competitors, then why should they continue having such an iconic license? Yes, they own the molds of the existing kits and if they lost the license those kits would eventually go away. This was also true of the old AMT Star Wars kits now that Revell and Bandai have the license. But since Bandai, in particular, are making superior new kits to the old ones, who cares? I'll soon have a Bandai A-Wing that will no doubt be better than the old kit. I'm not shedding a tear that the old A-Wing is going away. The same could be true for Trek. Would I be willing to sacrifice never seeing the old AMT Galileo kit ever again if it meant having a new tool Bandai Galileo kit? In. A. Heartbeat.


I can see where your coming from after you fleshed out you opinion and do agree, in part, with what you're saying. 

Would Bandai be able to do better Trek kits then Round 2? Based on their Star War kits, of which I have several, I'd say yes. Still it seems to me Round 2 is doing better with each new release, not Bandai quality to be sure, but a lot better than what we've had before in Trek kits.

If Round 2 gave up the license (not likely), who's to say any other company would pick it up? If Bandai wanted to, they could acquire the license for the Asian market today, which means we could still get the kits for decent prices on Amazon and Ebay. But, Bandai doesn't seem to be interested. Heck, they *HAD* the Trek license, but gave it up. I wouldn't hold my breath for a Bandai or similar type of company to produce Star Trek kits. But, like you, if Bandai acquired the rights and produced new tool, accurate Trek kits that rivaled what Round 2 is doing, I know I'd be a customer!



Steve H said:


> There is no pressure for R2 to change, adapt, modify, improve, evolve, whatever you want to call it regardless of how you may feel about the job they do. Zero pressure from the consumer (not us, everyone else), from the retail chain, from the industry itself.


Couldn't agree more.



Steve H said:


> So, if that's how it's working, why in the world would R2 want to do anything to change that? It's safe, it's comfortable, it does nothing for long term growth but so what, business nowadays only considers that money that they make RIGHT NOW and right now, it's OK.
> 
> ...It really seems to me their thinking is more based on nostalgia for that mid-'60s to early '70s reality...


You can thank the owner, Tom Lowe, for that. Forgot where I read it, but a spokesperson from their company put the emphasis on reissuing those old kits from the '60's - '70's...with the occasional new tool kit when describing what Round 2 is all about. 



TIEbomber1967 said:


> Round2 makes money from the license BECAUSE they can re-pop all the old kits. If Moebius came along and got the license you can be guaranteed they would NOT reproduce the catalog of Trek ships that Round2 has. They would probably only do about half a dozen kits before finding out that the market is saturated with Trek models, and only hard-core, dedicated modelers are interested in yet another model of the Enterprise (whatever iteration).


You've hit the nail on the head, something I've mentioned before, they reissue kits because they _can_. That was the attraction to Tom Lowe in purchasing the tools from Racing Champions, his new company would instantly have one of the largest kit catalogues available. Round 2 would be able to put kits on the shelves, and start raking in the cash, in a relatively short time period. It would have been stupid of them not to reissue kits they just paid good money to acquire! I'd say 95% of their business model is to reissue old kits, the other 5% geared towards new kits...and I think I'm being generous with the 5% figure! But, like you and I mentioned, we're lucky to have Round 2, since AMT/Racing Champions didn't give a damn about Trek kits and no other company seems to either!


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

I have no problem whatsoever with nostalgia kits. I love the idea that I can find the U.N.C.L.E. Car or the Lindberg space kits or the AMT Enterprise (version 4.0?) or anything. I love the idea. I cherish the idea. 

I would be MUCH more happy if those kits were priced as vintage as well. $5-10 instead of $20 and up. 

I understand there are many reasons why they price the way they do. Not all of the reasons have to do with the price of oil or plastic or manpower prices. 

But regardless of the reasons, the fact, for me at the least, is that all these lovely old kits are priced out of my range in terms of 'momentary distraction impulse purchase', the pricepoints move these kits into 'have to serious consider' land. If I throw $20 into buying a creaky old Lindberg rocketship, is that worth pooping around with? They're terrible kits, you know. It was just the way they were. But that's part of the nostalgia. 

So, for $20 I'm not buying FUN, I'm buying work. $36.95 for the AMT Enterprise, and it's not the first issue kit where everything fit better and looked better mostly kinda? I don't need that headache. 

I just can't bring myself to 'gluebomb' a kit that costs that much anymore. 

I doubt there's any chance the economy is going to change in a way that would result in an overall lowering of prices, I see them going up and up as time goes on, which will finally kill the business. But maybe by then we'll all have 3D printers with super fine resolution and enterprising people will be selling 'plans' to amazing kits. 

Or we're living in caves barely existing as mutants roam the Earth in search of human flesh.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> I'm probably going to be boring for a little bit here.
> 
> Who should CBS grant the license to? Revell? They're really no longer a U.S. company, I get the feeling Germany is the driving force now. Moebius? They do make genre kits but they're really slowed down. That's about it, for any significant size or market share.
> 
> ...





Actually I think it's the other way round now from what I remember with Revell. The German part was bought up by the US Revell so it's really the US that runs Revell now.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

SUNGOD said:


> Actually I think it's the other way round now from what I remember with Revell. The German part was bought up by the US Revell so it's really the US that runs Revell now.


Really? I mean, it's OK, if that's true I've made a mistake, but from what I see Revell Germany seems VERY aggressive in making not only new kits but a surprisingly active old kit revival program. Didn't I see some MASSIVE mining machine that would be a joyful pile of parts for scratchbuilding and custom work, released not too long ago?

Mind, Revell USA does still do their SSP program but man I am so far out of the loop I find out about them after the kits have been snapped up by scalpers. And, as I said above, the things cost too much for a casual nostalgia impulse buy. 

So if it's Revell USA pushing the aggressive releasing in Germany (and EU overall) then dang. That's both impressive and sad that they can't do the same here.


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## fire91bird (Feb 3, 2008)

Hobbico owns both Revell and Revell Germany.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Steve H said:


> I have no problem whatsoever with nostalgia kits. I love the idea that I can find the U.N.C.L.E. Car or the Lindberg space kits or the AMT Enterprise (version 4.0?) or anything. I love the idea. I cherish the idea.
> 
> I would be MUCH more happy if those kits were priced as vintage as well. $5-10 instead of $20 and up...
> 
> ...


This turned into another ramble of mine, sorry!

Most modelers in this country are middle-aged and up men. People that were kids in the late '50's to '70's. Companies know this and also know nostalgia plays a part in kit purchases for men in this age group. That's why Revell and Round 2 concentrate on re-pops. That it happens to be a lot cheaper then doing new tool kits is icing on the cake. Unfortunately, today's costs for manufacturing kits makes them much more pricey. I can remember when the 18" Enterprise could be found in corner drug stores for $1.50!

Nostalgia for old kits works out well for companies, especially regarding car/truck kits. Check out Revell's and Round 2's Facebook pages, every time they announce a reissue of some car/truck kit that first came out in the '70's, people who comment are besides themselves...and ask for more reissues. Reissues sell, and the companies are all too happy to provide more.

Also, older car kits are pretty good, compared to older military or sci-fi kits, most are not glue-bombs. And most reissues, of any genre, are usually cheaper or better overall buys than originals listed on ebay.

Getting back to Trek, I've bought a few of the reissues, including the 18" Enterprise (Tholian Web version). If it wasn't for the glow in the dark effect, and the fact I don't have to worry about puttying or correcting it (so as not to ruin the glow effect), I wouldn't have bothered. Having made many an 18", and having all of them come out, shall we say less the perfect, I'm over the kit and for $30 don't feel the need to buy another one. But, since this is the first kit my dad bought for me, there is a nostalgia (there's that word again) factor for me, which is the other reason I purchased the kit.

So, while I understand why Round 2 continues to reissue the 18" Enterprise, I think it's time to retire the mold...and make a new tool kit in 1/500 or 1/600 scale that is as accurate as the 1/350 version. 

At this point, Round 2 has reissued just about every AMT Trek kit. All are enhanced, some better than others. IMHO, now it's time for them to concentrate on new tool, accurate kits. After all it's 2016 _not_ 1966!

I've given them the benefit of the doubt regarding why they can't do new tool Trek kits this year, but all bets are off starting next year. If 2017 turns out to be another year of just reissues, then you'll see me join the chorus of others who feel that Round 2 is not using the Star Trek license to it's fullest.

Lastly, regarding the ROG TOS Enterprise kit, while it's not accurate to the 11 footer (I've read it's based on the Enterprise model used in the DS9 episode, Trials and Tribulations), it is a modern kit that goes together well, is nicely molded and includes clear parts for windows. As far as accuracy goes, the original 18" Enterprise is no more or less accurate. I would think Revell's kit sold well, but maybe not.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> Really? I mean, it's OK, if that's true I've made a mistake, but from what I see Revell Germany seems VERY aggressive in making not only new kits but a surprisingly active old kit revival program. Didn't I see some MASSIVE mining machine that would be a joyful pile of parts for scratchbuilding and custom work, released not too long ago?
> 
> Mind, Revell USA does still do their SSP program but man I am so far out of the loop I find out about them after the kits have been snapped up by scalpers. And, as I said above, the things cost too much for a casual nostalgia impulse buy.
> 
> So if it's Revell USA pushing the aggressive releasing in Germany (and EU overall) then dang. That's both impressive and sad that they can't do the same here.







Well people were worried that the takeover by US company Hobbico (as firebird says) would make ROG take less risks. I think it probably is true to a certain extent as recently they seem to do more reissues and less new stuff that hasn't been done before. That mining machine (which you did see) whilst nice to see back is a reissue of an old kit.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

spock62 said:


> This turned into another ramble of mine, sorry!
> 
> Most modelers in this country are middle-aged and up men. People that were kids in the late '50's to '70's. Companies know this and also know nostalgia plays a part in kit purchases for men in this age group. That's why Revell and Round 2 concentrate on re-pops. That it happens to be a lot cheaper then doing new tool kits is icing on the cake. Unfortunately, today's costs for manufacturing kits makes them much more pricey. I can remember when the 18" Enterprise could be found in corner drug stores for $1.50!
> 
> ...





Same over here in the UK and probably countries like Canada, Australia and a lot of Europe that's why things like the Eagles and the older 1/350th Enterprise kits sell and kits like the Kazon torpedo don't sell. Kit manufacturers obviously have to try and get youngsters involved but it's us older gits who buy most of these kits at the moment.

That's why maybe something like a new K'Tinga might be a good idea. And a nice villain ship to add to the 1/350th line for a change instead of another Enterprise.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

fire91bird said:


> Hobbico owns both Revell and Revell Germany.


Thank you! I grow in knowledge! 

You know, I don't Google. When I really want to try and find something I tend to use Bing and dang if it isn't just messy as can be. Everything eventually leads to porn. :grin2:


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Steve H said:


> Didn't I see some MASSIVE mining machine that would be a joyful pile of parts for scratchbuilding and custom work, released not too long ago?


This?










Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Radiodugger said:


> This?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Indeed so!

Doesn't that look like a treasure trove for a scratch builder? If that kit had existed back in '65 the effects guys at Gerry Anderson's studio would have been all OVER it.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

That is the ultimate Greebles kit! Wow! By the way, you ever SEE this beast?










Humongous 45,500-ton behemoth! _Scary_ big!

Doug


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## bigdaddydaveh (Jul 20, 2007)

The thing to keep in mind with Round 2 is it's a very small company. Pockets are not as deep as a larger company like BanDai.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

SUNGOD said:


> Same over here in the UK and probably countries like Canada, Australia and a lot of Europe that's why things like the Eagles and the older 1/350th Enterprise kits sell and kits like the Kazon torpedo don't sell. Kit manufacturers obviously have to try and get youngsters involved but it's us older gits who buy most of these kits at the moment.
> 
> That's why maybe something like a new K'Tinga might be a good idea. And a nice villain ship to add to the 1/350th line for a change instead of another Enterprise.


Fact is most kids would rather stare at a smartphone screen or play video games for hours on end. Plus, I highly doubt that models of fantasy spacecraft from a TV show that's 50 years old holds much interest to kids today!

A 1/350 K'Tinga would be a great idea IMHO (plus one in 1/1000 too). Hopefully, this is in the works for next year, though I won't hold my breath!


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

spock62 said:


> Fact is most kids would rather *stare at a smartphone screen* or *play video games* for hours on end. Plus, I highly doubt that models of fantasy spacecraft from a TV show that's 50 years old holds much interest to kids today!


And what a shame that is. I remember when the the power went out, I built my model by candle light! A friend of mine's son...I talk to the top of his head most of the time. As he texts with that "phone". :freak:

Doug


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## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

Here's what Round2 just released... LindBergs Mad Maestro !
Check this out for a Blast from the past!!!:woohoo::roll::woohoo:
Just bought this kit couple days ago from BurBankhobbies out west. It has been reissued by Round 2 comes with the motor ect. Really cool kit that I never had before and glad to see it reissued. Truly a GRAIL







[/
Finally a Cool kit!!!:grin2:
Mcdee


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

mcdougall said:


> Check this out for a Blast from the past!!!:woohoo::roll::woohoo:
> Just bought this kit couple days ago from BurBankhobbies out west. It has been reissued by Round 2 comes with the motor ect. Really cool kit that I never had before and glad to see it reissued. Truly a GRAIL
> 
> 
> ...


What part is motorized? - I have never seen this kit before ...


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## mcdougall (Oct 28, 2007)

The Arms move like he's conducting an Orchestra....
I've been waiting for this re-release for 50 years now!>
Denis


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

spock62 said:


> Fact is most kids would rather stare at a smartphone screen or play video games for hours on end. Plus, I highly doubt that models of fantasy spacecraft from a TV show that's 50 years old holds much interest to kids today!
> 
> A 1/350 K'Tinga would be a great idea IMHO (plus one in 1/1000 too). Hopefully, this is in the works for next year, though I won't hold my breath!




Oh don't get me started on those sodding smartphones. I was in a superstore earlier on and the amount of kids and older people typing on those things was unbelievable. 

We need a 1/350th K'Tinga to restore some sanity in the world.:grin2:


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I was asked to create some safety posters at work. "Please don't text while walking!" I made them silly fun by showing people falling over railings, or about to be hit by a truck. After they were put up, I was walking thru the halls. As I walked past one of the posters, I was almost hit by an engineer who was, yes, texting while walking.

The posters don't do any good if the people don't look UP to see them!


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

That Mad Maestro model is pretty cool - I've only seen pictures of the box but never one built up. Nice to see these really obscure kits from the past reappear!


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

scooke123 said:


> Nice to see these really *obscure kits* from the past reappear!


So, I guess Round 2 ain't as broke as we thought! I've never seen this one either! Wonder if they'll recoup expenses for this...hmm?

Back on topic...

I wonder what Round 2's Trek 50th Anniversary Plans ARE! That little tease caused pure speculation. Now my brain is in overdrive! The K'Tinga in 1:350 would be schweet, as would the Reliant in that scale. 

After seeing that F-104/Enterprise combo, I'm thinkin' they might do that again. Combine two different models to make a scene from an episode. I can't really think of anything right off. Could happen though...

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

The problem I see, regarding R2 and plans to tie-in to the 50th anny of Star Trek, that window is just about closed.

Of course they can celebrate right up to Dec. 31, that's the technical way, but the PRACTICAL, the way most people think, you've got until September. If your product isn't in stores by Sept. 2016, you missed it, you're done. Go ahead and ask your wife/girlfriend/significant other if it's OK that you 'do something special' three months after your anniversary. 

And the real world problem, the hard facts, the cold numbers of reality in the retail world is it's almost too late to announce anything that can be manufactured and distributed by Sept. Retailers have to have time to take orders. Money has to be allocated (that's what's called 'open-to-buy' Dollars) and the longer it takes to do that solicitation the less of that money is available. 

So they need to poop or get off the pot. Or just straight up say "that's all we're doing special for the 50th."


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

Not a matter of being broke - they have the mold thru their purchase of Lindberg so why not use the mold for some profit. The money is already invested. The sci-fi stuff is just a very small slice of the pie for them and Star Trek an even smaller slice. It excites me more to see the Mad maestro types of kits issued than more Star Trek stuff and I love Star Trek! More things to worry about than some 50th anniversary model that may or may not be released. Won't upset my world either way.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

scooke123 said:


> More things to worry about than some 50th anniversary model that may or may not be released. Won't upset my world either way.


LOL! Me neither! Got to buy stuff now, before it goes away! I'm about halfway...

Doug


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

Tell me about it!! More stuff coming out at a rate quicker than I could spend it!


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Yikes! That 1:350 TOS E is $160!! Forget that...wow...

Doug


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

scooke123 said:


> Not a matter of being broke - they have the mold thru their purchase of Lindberg so why not use the mold for some profit. The money is already invested.....


Assuming you're referring to the F-104 kit. One of the issues a lot of us are having is that the Lindberg kit is the _worst, most inaccurate kit_ of this aircraft available, which tarnishes the whole look of the completed kit. Since the F-104 will be front and center of the kit, the Enterprise being only 4.5" lg, it's inaccuracies will very noticeable. Of course, you could just substitute the Lindberg joke with a good kit of the F-104, like Hasegawa's, but that will end up over doubling the total cost.

Like I said before, a great idea, just poorly executed.


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

John P said:


> I was asked to create some safety posters at work. "Please don't text while walking!" I made them silly fun by showing people falling over railings, or about to be hit by a truck. After they were put up, I was walking thru the halls. As I walked past one of the posters, I was almost hit by an engineer who was, yes, texting while walking.
> 
> The posters don't do any good if the people don't look UP to see them!


You should make the posters an app.:freak:


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## MartyS (Mar 11, 2014)

Radiodugger said:


> Yikes! That 1:350 TOS E is $160!! Forget that...wow...
> 
> Doug


It's about $115 at Amazon.


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

spock62 said:


> Assuming you're referring to the F-104 kit. One of the issues a lot of us are having is that the Lindberg kit is the _worst, most inaccurate kit_ of this aircraft available, which tarnishes the whole look of the completed kit. Since the F-104 will be front and center of the kit, the Enterprise being only 4.5" lg, it's inaccuracies will very noticeable. Of course, you could just substitute the Lindberg joke with a good kit of the F-104, like Hasegawa's, but that will end up over doubling the total cost.
> 
> Like I said before, a great idea, just poorly executed.


I was referring to the Mad Maestro model that was brought up about them acquiring that mold and using it.


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## edge10 (Oct 19, 2013)

John P said:


> I was asked to create some safety posters at work. "Please don't text while walking!" I made them silly fun by showing people falling over railings, or about to be hit by a truck. After they were put up, I was walking thru the halls. As I walked past one of the posters, I was almost hit by an engineer who was, yes, texting while walking.
> 
> The posters don't do any good if the people don't look UP to see them!


Or maybe, if you hadn't been admiring your own work, you wouldn't have almost ran over some guy just minding his own business. :grin2:


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

MartyS said:


> It's about $115 at Amazon.


Thank you Marty! Now that I can handle...

Doug


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

There was a study about signage and perception. If you post a new sign it will be noticed by almost everyone the first day, less than half the people by the end of the week and then largely ignored after that. People notice new things in their environment as part of out wiring, but these things become part of the background clutter quickly. 

I do agree the choice of the F-104 kit was rather strange- it was mostly a cheap solution on hand to get something on the shelves with no new tooling costs. I am not an expert in that subject and quite frankly never noticed the differences pointed out in this thread. 

I just hope "that something special" Jamie alluded R2 is creating fo the 50th to is not in the same vein as this.


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## edge10 (Oct 19, 2013)

Radiodugger said:


> Thank you Marty! Now that I can handle...
> 
> Doug


$108.99, with free shipping, from a couple of sellers on the bay of e.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Yikes. That IS a deal! After just seeing Starship Exeter on YouTube, I am fired UP! 

Doug


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

scooke123 said:


> I was referring to the Mad Maestro model that was brought up about them acquiring that mold and using it.


Sorry, my bad. Just figured since this is a forum about R2 Trek 50th Anniversary plans...:|


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

spock62 said:


> Sorry, my bad. Just figured since this is a forum about R2 Trek 50th Anniversary plans...:|


I understand..:grin2: I'm sure the same logic went towards the aircraft too. They saw the mold for it and decided to capitalize on the 50th Anniversary figuring it would sell more copies as a Star Trek kit than a stand-alone model by itself. I'm sure it will sell ok just because it will be purchased for the 50th packaging. I doubt R2 cared if the model was close to accurate at all so long as it sold for them.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

It might; possibly lead to accurizing kits to bring that recycled F-104 kit to match what was seen on screen better for those Trek fans who are also knowledgeable about fighter craft of that era.

I am not going to bother getting this kit at all- I still think the whole idea is a cynical money grab.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> It might; possibly lead to accurizing kits to bring that recycled F-104 kit to match what was seen on screen better for those Trek fans who are also knowledgeable about fighter craft of that era.
> 
> I am not going to bother getting this kit at all- I still think the whole idea is a cynical money grab.


I can understand that and you're exactly right. On the other hand, I do kind of admire that oblique thinking. 

And if they were to release some 1930's roadster as the 'Federation Gang car' complete with 'not quite but meant to be' figures, I could smile at that too. 

Sure it's not pure Star Trek, sure it's not ANYTHING (on whatever wish list) we would prefer. But it does show some imagination. 

I count it better than a gold-plated AMT Enterprise or a snap-fit prepaint/pre-deco Enterprise in a clear box or any of those even more cynical cash grabs.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

It does reflect out of the box thinking.
I think Round2 is very creative in repackaging the 18" we have already bought with a novel twist. Tin 'Collector' boxes, glow in the dark (with one small tree extra), One extra Botany Bay - I full expect a chrome of Gold one with a sound chip playing Kirk quotes to be the big surprise us fans are going to be delighted and oh so grateful for.

I would love to see almost anything on the wish lists provided above- a 1/1000 five ship set from 'The Ultimate Computer' (just a custom stand and decal sheet) I think has a good chance. 

A 1/350 K'Tinga would be fantastic, but if they pulled the plug on the Galileo I would serious doubt another mega kit would be in the offing.


----------



## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Richard Baker said:


> A 1/350 K'Tinga would be fantastic, but if they *pulled the plug on the Galileo* I would serious doubt *another mega kit* would be in the offing.


Exactly, Richard! Still, they said we'd _"be happy"_. :freak:

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Radiodugger said:


> Exactly, Richard! Still, they said we'd _"be happy"_. :freak:
> 
> Doug


The problem is, how do we assign the proper value to 'be happy' in that quote? There are the things we might like and approve of and be honestly excited about, and then there are things that some marketing idiot might have pushed as 'sure thing they'll LOVE it' to management. 

And it may well be something so out of the blue, so huge a surprise, we'll have problems processing it for a time. 

I ask for a check on my thinking. To my memory, two Trek kits released by AMT that haven't had a re-pressing since the initial release would be the Galileo Shuttlecraft and the Runabout from DS9. 

Galileo would be upsetting to some but overall welcome. Runabout would be welcomed but not really fitting for the ST 50th deal. 

Are there ANY 'lost' Trek kits from AMT I don't know about? Anything planned but never released? Like maybe a Kirk figure to companion the old Spock kit?


----------



## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Steve H said:


> The problem is, how do we assign the proper value to 'be happy' in that quote?


Good point. "Happy" is relative. Hmmm...



Steve H said:


> There are the things we *might like* and approve of and be honestly excited about...


I understand. Like the Archer Enterprise and the Refit A in 1:350 scale! Those BOTH are on my want list. I was honestly excited about those!



Steve H said:


> ...and then there are things that *some marketing idiot* might have pushed as 'sure thing they'll LOVE it' to management.


Haa hahaha! We had one of those! Long story, but I was a radio disc jockey for 40 years. I have had my share of _marketing idiots_! They think they know better than YOU do about your show and your audience! I have a seething hatred for marketing idiots! They cost me ratings, and MONEY!



Steve H said:


> And it may well be something so out of the blue, so huge a surprise, we'll have problems processing it for a time.


Like Moebius' Jupiter 2! Like the Proteus in 1:32 scale! Yeah. Kinda doubt it. But, I like your thinking, Steve!



Steve H said:


> I ask for a check on my thinking. To my memory, two Trek kits released by AMT that haven't had a re-pressing since the initial release would be the Galileo Shuttlecraft and the Runabout from DS9.


Ahhh! I forgot about the Runabout! How accurate was that? I kinda like that model!



Steve H said:


> Galileo would be upsetting to some but overall welcome. Runabout would be welcomed but not really fitting for the ST 50th deal.
> 
> Are there ANY 'lost' Trek kits from AMT I don't know about? Anything planned but never released? Like maybe a Kirk figure to companion the old Spock kit?


Or some other spaceships? Didn't I see a Nomad somewhere? Or was that resin? 

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

I seem to recall the Runabout had issues, many of them due to the way things were simplified for tooling. Nothing that was a showstopper but it might benefit from a little re-tooling and maybe some new parts. 

Nomad was a resin kit. 

I have a saying. "Nothing can screw up a company like a dude with a minty fresh Harvard MBA." *

*note: It wouldn't surprise me at all if some here had Harvard MBAs. But come on guys, for every one of you that's smart and logical and rational and have common sense and use it, there's a 1000 that are just dumb as a box of rocks. You KNOW it. Some of them have been your bosses!


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## MartyS (Mar 11, 2014)

Radiodugger said:


> Like the Archer Enterprise and the Refit A in 1:350 scale! Those BOTH are on my want list. I was honestly excited about those!


I picked up the 1:350 NX-01 when Woot! had it for less than $50, last year I think? I don't really have room for it but will get around to building it someday. I don't get why so many people don't like that ship, after the TOS Enterprise and the Reliant it's my 3rd favorite Star Trek ship, I wish there was a 1:1000 version of it, I like the original more than that refit version they did at that scale.

I'd never build the Refit A 1:350, too much aztecing to deal with for a model I don't really love, although a 1:350 Reliant might tempt me to do all that work someday if I ever move into a place where I can set up a spray hood.


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## larskseme (Sep 2, 2014)

MartyS said:


> I wish there was a 1:1000 version of it, I like the original more than that refit version they did at that scale.


I'm pretty sure that the NX-01 1:1000 scale (at least the one I have) can be built either as the refit with the secondary hull or as seen on TV without. I've not done anything more than open the box once though, so I can't say anything about accuracy...


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

So I had an insane wacky idea.

A kit of the Fesarius. It would be CRAZY but it could also be fun. Sure, it's a giant 'negative golf ball' (bumps instead of dimples, see?) but maybe they could find something unexpected to do with it. 

Or the SS Aurora? Build it as either a big Tholian ship or the space cruiser?

Either would be insane but fun.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Steve H said:


> So I had an insane wacky idea.
> 
> A kit of the Fesarius. It would be CRAZY but it could also be fun. Sure, it's a giant 'negative golf ball' (bumps instead of dimples, see?) but maybe they could find something unexpected to do with it.
> 
> ...


Yes, they would be interesting choices. But, these are Star Trek "Geek" ships, i.e. the kind of ships only really hard-core Trek modelers would want. Nothing wrong with that but I don't think there's enough of them around for Round 2 to spend the money on tooling for such subjects. I would think that Round 2 has to take into account all their customers that buy Trek kits, and most of them want Enterprise/Klingon Battlecruiser/Reliant...well you get the idea. I doubt they would invest in the tooling for either kit. Besides reissues, they seem to want to stay with what sells (see my list above). Also, which version of the Aurora would they produce, the canon version or the updated version? Providing parts for both would be costly.

At some point, Round 2 will have to start to produce Trek ships that haven't been done before, once they run out of reissues and popular ships to produce in 1/1000 and 1/350 scales. They could do more in 1/2500 since those are cheaper to produce, but nothing smaller then the TOS Enterprise (which is only 4.5" long). Problem is, like I mentioned, doing kits of ships that have minimal screen time is risky...and they don't strike me as big risk takers.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

spock62 said:


> Yes, they would be interesting choices. But, these are Star Trek "Geek" ships, i.e. the kind of ships only really hard-core Trek modelers would want. Nothing wrong with that but I don't think there's enough of them around for Round 2 to spend the money on tooling for such subjects. I would think that Round 2 has to take into account all their customers that buy Trek kits, and most of them want Enterprise/Klingon Battlecruiser/Reliant...well you get the idea. I doubt they would invest in the tooling for either kit. Besides reissues, they seem to want to stay with what sells (see my list above). Also, which version of the Aurora would they produce, the canon version or the updated version? Providing parts for both would be costly.
> 
> At some point, Round 2 will have to start to produce Trek ships that haven't been done before, once they run out of reissues and popular ships to produce in 1/1000 and 1/350 scales. They could do more in 1/2500 since those are cheaper to produce, but nothing smaller then the TOS Enterprise (which is only 4.5" long). Problem is, like I mentioned, doing kits of ships that have minimal screen time is risky...and they don't strike me as big risk takers.


I have no disagreement whatsoever here. I was just throwing those on the table because I was thinking of the Moebius Lost in Space 'Derelict' kit.

I find myself split in half over this whole thing. Part of me hopes it's something super unexpected and amazing, part of me expects it'll be a complete letdown. I don't think there's a middle ground here. 

I mean, if it's something universally considered "eh, OK, I guess, whatever" I think that still falls in the letdown category.


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## scooke123 (Apr 11, 2008)

Yea the box art itself is pretty cool - if I get it that will be the reason for me to buy it.


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## MartyS (Mar 11, 2014)

larskseme said:


> I'm pretty sure that the NX-01 1:1000 scale (at least the one I have) can be built either as the refit with the secondary hull or as seen on TV without. I've not done anything more than open the box once though, so I can't say anything about accuracy...


I had not read anywhere that the refit kit could be built as the on screen NX-01.
I'll have to look into that some more.

Edit: It does look like it can be built both ways, just ordered one so I guess I'll find out this week....


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

MartyS said:


> I had not read anywhere that the refit kit could be built as the on screen NX-01.
> I'll have to look into that some more.
> 
> Edit: It does look like it can be built both ways, just ordered one so I guess I'll find out this week....


Your faith has been rewarded: Star Trek NX-01 Refit | Round2

The description of the kit states that both the NX-01 and NX-01 Refit can be made from the kit.



Steve H said:


> I have no disagreement whatsoever here. I was just throwing those on the table because I was thinking of the Moebius Lost in Space 'Derelict' kit.
> 
> I find myself split in half over this whole thing. Part of me hopes it's something super unexpected and amazing, part of me expects it'll be a complete letdown. I don't think there's a middle ground here.
> 
> I mean, if it's something universally considered "eh, OK, I guess, whatever" I think that still falls in the letdown category.


I'm split too, I'd love to think it will be a new-tool kit of a highly desired ship, but I'm thinking it will be just another repop, maybe a combo kit like the Tomorrow is Yesterday kit.

Speaking of the LIS Derelict kit, _that's_ the way to do a kit based on an episode/scene of a sci-fi show/movie. Everything is new tool and accurate. Of course, Moebius had no other choice since they don't have a huge catalogue of old tool kits to choose from!


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

With the LIS Derelict kit, you get _three_ Jupiter 2s! Oh the diorama possibilities...

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Radiodugger said:


> With the LIS Derelict kit, you get _three_ Jupiter 2s! Oh the diorama possibilities...
> 
> Doug


Yeah, but if I've read correctly, they made a really odd mold layout choice.

You get three Jupiter II because the tree consists of the top, the bottom and one landing leg. Did they also include a 'closed leg' cover?

Anyway, three kits to make 2 Jupiter II. 

Thing is, if they had designed the mold so there were 3 legs (and three gear well covers), they could have easily sold that tiny Jupiter II the same way they sold the mini Flying Sub and the B9 Robot from the Chariot kit. 

To quote Steve Martin: "But NOOoooooooo"


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Ya know, screw it. I'm goin' for broke. I'm officially starting...
*
THE K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!*

Only *10* Days to go until Round 2 announces the 1:350 at Wonderfest. WonderFest Home 

Because they will. Right?

RIGHT??!!

Here we go.

10...


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

So a good friend told me today about a new R2 Trek product that's coming out. I'm assuming that this is the thing that will make many people happy, unless they have something else up their sleeve. Was surprised in that it revisits something from the past (some might say *rectifies*). My friend was a little pissed in that he is currently "in progress". But yeah, I think that many people will be happy that R2 listened and produced this, if we're talking about the same thing...


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Hunk A Junk said:


> Ya know, screw it. I'm goin' for broke. I'm officially starting...
> *
> THE K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!*
> 
> ...






Great idea! We better find a hiding place though for when it doesn't appear.:grin2:


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

RB said:


> So a good friend told me today about a new R2 Trek product that's coming out. I'm assuming that this is the thing that will make many people happy, unless they have something else up their sleeve. Was surprised in that it revisits something from the past (some might say *rectifies*). My friend was a little pissed in that he is currently "in progress". But yeah, I think that many people will be happy that R2 listened and produced this, if we're talking about the same thing...




Sounds like a revamped older tooling with new parts.


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## morrihl1 (Jan 19, 2008)

That sounds like a reworking of the 1/537 refit smoothie possibly?


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

Not really trying to be coy, I think my friend would rather I not be specific. It does relate to a relatively recent tool though. I guess it's not a huge deal as he heard about through the hobby shop he works at, but still. I'm pretty sure the info will be all about soon, especially at Wonderfest. Don't know the release date. I think you could say that it falls in line with the release program of the original product...


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

SUNGOD said:


> Great idea! We better find a hiding place though for when it doesn't appear.:grin2:


No promises intended. I'm just going to live in hope that Round 2 won't crush my happiness and turn me into an angry drunk. Again.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Recent tool... it couldn't be a re-worked 1/350 Refit could it? Doesn't make that much sense for the 50th anny but I think it would indeed make people happy. 

re-tooling on the 1/350 Original Enterprise? Only thing I can think of that would be nice to have fixed would be the mis-positioned 'three portholes' (formation lights, sensor ports, whatever they were) on the underside of the saucer, appx. at the 4 and 8 o'clock position. This would make some happy. 

I just don't know. 

But if it's the AMT TMP Enterprise, 'backdated' to smooth, I called it way back in the thread.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Hunk A Junk said:


> No promises intended. I'm just going to live in hope that Round 2 won't crush my happiness and turn me into an angry drunk. Again.


Because otherwise you're a happy drunk?

Did someone say 'phrasing'?


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Hunk A Junk said:


> No promises intended. I'm just going to live in hope that Round 2 won't crush my happiness and turn me into an angry drunk. Again.




I do sympathise. I've got my fridge full of beers at the ready........when it turns out to be a gigantic 50th anniversary damp squib.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> Recent tool... it couldn't be a re-worked 1/350 Refit could it? Doesn't make that much sense for the 50th anny but I think it would indeed make people happy.
> 
> re-tooling on the 1/350 Original Enterprise? Only thing I can think of that would be nice to have fixed would be the mis-positioned 'three portholes' (formation lights, sensor ports, whatever they were) on the underside of the saucer, appx. at the 4 and 8 o'clock position. This would make some happy.
> 
> ...





Probably is something like that but even though it would please quite a few people........it's not really going to make a BIG 50th splash. I think the 50th deserves something big from R2, especially as you can get the smoothie if you look. I actually don't mind the engraved one as I'm thinking of doing it as another version of the Enterprise A plus I prefer engraved details to decals. It would be great to see a few things from R2 though.


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

It's already been solicited in the US with the MSRP at $40.00...


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

I'm pretty sure I know what it is now. Some modelers might like it, but I think others are going to be pretty ticked off.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

RB said:


> It's already been solicited in the US with the MSRP at $40.00...


(Knew I couldn't sleep tonight for a reason...)

Is it _this_?

TowerHobbies.com | AMT 1/350 Star Trek TOS USS Enterprise Smooth Saucer

1/350 Star Trek TOS USS Enterprise Smooth Sau (amtmka015-06) AMT Science Fiction Plastic Models

Some of us who haven't started our kit will be thrilled. The rest, especially those who spent hours of filling and sanding...not so much!

Not sure why this is listed as an AMT kit though.


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## robn1 (Nov 17, 2012)

spock62 said:


> ...Not sure why this is listed as an AMT kit though.


Because AMT was the original maker of Trek kits. Just as the new 22in Eagle is listed as MPC, because they made the original 1999 kits.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Yeah, great, I've already built my first season model and spent the money on two more kits for future builds.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Wait - looking at the price, is it JUST the saucer??


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

THAT is their big surprise for the 50th Anniversary?- a replacement saucer without those dreaded grid lines?

If true that is one of the most stupid ideas I have heard. It is only going to be enjoyed by a niche group of a niche group- etc...- those who have already bought the complete kit, not built it yet, are really annoyed with the inclusion of the grid lines and have no desire just to fill them in themselves and would rather buy an expensive set of replacement parts...

I hope this is just a build option Round2 is providing and not that 'special' kit that they feel certain will delight us all.


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## edge10 (Oct 19, 2013)

It works for me, except: I have to pay for the version with the grid canyons and then pay for it's replacement.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

ahhh, count me in on that "$40 MSRP for just the two saucer parts?!" befuddled face jaw dropped crowd.

Seriously. If ALL this is are the two saucer parts (and that's how they did it, right? top and bottom like the old AMT kit? never mind any internal bracing or clear parts, those aren't changed)... I don't have the words. I don't. 

It's a good idea, a GRAND idea on one level. If that had been done WHEN THE KIT WAS FIRST RELEASED. 

Picture this fictional product information blurb:
"OK, we know there's controversy over the so-called grid lines, so here's the saucer without them. We're sorry for the price but that's the reality of tooling it up. How much is your time worth? If you'd rather not spend all that time and effort filling and sanding, this gives you a ready made solution. We include special grid line decals that accurately replicate the very fine lightly penciled appearance of the lines on the real filming miniature."

That would have been great, few years ago. I think it would have been joyfully embraced, then. Now? Oh, brother. 

I can't even imagine what could be added to that to make it a 'must have' item.

I tell you, if I were a retailer, I'd order ONE, maybe. But geeze, how do you even SELL that? "Hey, here's this fantastic kit of the Enterprise. Only $150 (MSRP)! And if you want a smooth saucer, that's $40 extra!"

It's not even...you know, when they made that 'conversion set' of first and second pilot (and other things?) options, specifically made that so to keep the MSRP of the main kit down, THAT made sense. 

This..this...wow. That's not gonna go well for R2, publicity-wise.

I hope either A. this is a very misguided 'time bomb' April Fools joke or B. we're completely mis-reading things and that $40 MSRP is for the entire kit, now at reduced price and smooth. THAT would be exciting. So of course that's completely impossible.


----------



## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

Well ... there is always the 60th anniversary coming up. :grin2:


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

robn1 said:


> Because AMT was the original maker of Trek kits. Just as the new 22in Eagle is listed as MPC, because they made the original 1999 kits.


And Round 2 chose to do it that way.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Throw in a pilot-era bridge and maybe I could retrofit my pilot E with the smoothie saucer. Maybe.


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

WOW!!! I usually defend Round 2. In my opinion they made some very good marketing choices in the past. This idea of offering a smooth saucer at an added cost is kind of an insult. Plus it costs you an extra $40 added on to the over $100 you paid for the kit. For that much money I'm more than happy to fill and sand grid lines.

Nice try Round 2 but you jumped the shark on this one.


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## scotthm (Apr 6, 2007)

Steve H said:


> ahhh, count me in on that "$40 MSRP for just the two saucer parts?!" befuddled face jaw dropped crowd.


I think it's a great idea to offer it, but the price should be more like $15 - $20. It's too expensive for someone who's already paid over $100 for the main kit.

---------------


----------



## HabuHunter32 (Aug 22, 2009)

spock62 said:


> (Knew I couldn't sleep tonight for a reason...)
> 
> Is it _this_?
> 
> ...


The second link (Hobbylinc) has it for $28.39 on pre-order.


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

HabuHunter32 said:


> The second link (Hobbylinc) has it for $28.39 on pre-order.


What one place has as a sale price is not useful in any comparative discussion. The only way to make apples to apples is using the MSRP.

The list MSRP is actually $41.99 USD. Just like the 1/350 Enterprise can be found for less than the MSRP of $162.99, finding one price at one place is useful to the person buying it, but if a discussion involves value, one needs to use MSRPs because that's across the boards.

So, if one wishes a smooth saucer, one must buy the kit and the addition, that's $204.98 MSRP, plus shipping and/or tax.

Wow.


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

irishtrek said:


> And Round 2 chose to do it that way.


And it does get confusing, when a site has a crappy search engine, and the 1/350 Enterprise is tagged 'Polar Lights' but the new smoothie saucer is tagged 'AMT/Ertl'. 

Found THAT out when I was looking up the MSRP of the 1/350 E and it wasn't listed on the big Star Trek AMT page on Tower, had to drill down to the Polar Lights pages to find it. 

So, yeah. Welcome to 1996, huh?


----------



## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

Yeah, that's what I was talking about, what my friend saw solicited. As I said, I assumed that this was what they were talking about as being a pleasing item for many people, but I don't know if it would be described as a 50th anniversary kit. Who knows, maybe they do have something else going. They are bringing the lighting kit out again as well, so the 1/350 TOS should have all the original options and more. The full kit averages about $100 - $115 currently on Amazon, and with discounts elsewhere on the saucer smoothie, it'd be about the same as the original MSRP to get the full kit plus saucer section. I think R2 is counting on customers like my buddy, who'll buy a copy of a kit such as the Refit or TOS annually, just to have on hand. For the 50th, having all this available will be hard to pass up for many people. After all, we've seen many a stash here on Hobbytalk with multiplies of many kits, especially the 1/350 kits. I used to joke that my friend could build a dividing wall in his house using just PL 1/350 Refit boxes. And, you can always use a spare saucer section for a kitbash...


----------



## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Since I never wanted engraved grid lines and textured surface on the saucer in the first place, I would gladly trade in the kit saucer to Round 2 in exchange for the smooth one.


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## HabuHunter32 (Aug 22, 2009)

Steve H said:


> What one place has as a sale price is not useful in any comparative discussion. The only way to make apples to apples is using the MSRP.
> 
> The list MSRP is actually $41.99 USD. Just like the 1/350 Enterprise can be found for less than the MSRP of $162.99, finding one price at one place is useful to the person buying it, but if a discussion involves value, one needs to use MSRPs because that's across the boards.
> 
> ...


Does anyone actually pay MSRP for anything mass produced? Resin kits yes. Plastic...no. I know I don't. That's just the retailers way of making us feel like we got a great deal on our purchase. If we all had to pay MSRP a lot less kits would be sold that's for sure. I have never paid MSRP for any plastic kit since the internet came along. If you choose MSRP as your yardstick. So be it. It means nothing to me.

Mike


----------



## Fraley1701 (Sep 3, 2003)

*Star Trek Models: 1:350 scale developments*

Personally, I think it is good to have options!! :wink2:

Star Trek Models: 1:350 scale developments | Collector Model


----------



## HabuHunter32 (Aug 22, 2009)

Fraley1701 said:


> Personally, I think it is good to have options!! :wink2:
> 
> Star Trek Models: 1:350 scale developments | Collector Model


The 1st and 2nd pilots accessory set is being re-released also! I feel a fourth 1/350 TOS Starship in my future!:wink2:


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

It looks like they're also going to start including the smoothie saucer in with the original kit, so you wouldn't have to pay a two-fer. Looks like the engraved saucer is going to be the one that's endangered...


----------



## BolianAdmiral (Feb 24, 2009)

Just reinforces that they never should have had them (the gridlines) on in the first place, as it was all wasted money. But instead of listening to what the fans wanted, they decided to listen to a two-bit hack like Gary Kerr, who knows nothing about what he's talking about, and tick off a lot of people getting something wrong which never had to be wrong to begin with. Oh, well. At least this will save some people the time and effort of sanding/filling those wretched lines, and they can use the lined saucer parts for kitbashing, spare parts to give/sell to others, or target practice.



Steve H said:


> ahhh, count me in on that "$40 MSRP for just the two saucer parts?!" befuddled face jaw dropped crowd.
> 
> Seriously. If ALL this is are the two saucer parts (and that's how they did it, right? top and bottom like the old AMT kit? never mind any internal bracing or clear parts, those aren't changed)... I don't have the words. I don't.
> 
> ...


----------



## edge10 (Oct 19, 2013)

Don't hold back BolianAdmiral, tell us what you really feel.


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

Gary Kerr is one of the main reasons that kit happened and had the success that it did...


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

BolianAdmiral said:


> But instead of listening to what the fans wanted, they decided to listen to a two-bit hack like Gary Kerr, who knows nothing about what he's talking about, ...


Seriously? You are kidding, right?

In any case ... I may go ahead and pick up a new kit and electronics in case I decide to do a new, updated, version. I love the one I have but it would be nice to have one that has the new paint scheme to be more accurate.


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

HabuHunter32 said:


> Does anyone actually pay MSRP for anything mass produced? Resin kits yes. Plastic...no. I know I don't. That's just the retailers way of making us feel like we got a great deal on our purchase. If we all had to pay MSRP a lot less kits would be sold that's for sure. I have never paid MSRP for any plastic kit since the internet came along. If you choose MSRP as your yardstick. So be it. It means nothing to me.
> 
> Mike


But that's arguably part of what's destroyed the local hobby shop (as well as most all retail). Knowledge is power, and being able to seek out the lowest price is a GOOD thing. I don't dispute that. 

but that search is individual. It's a moving target. What I bought a kit for may not even be possible to duplicate. 

I'll give you a personal example. I bought the 1/350 NX-01 for $5 USD. Brand new, just released, Five Dollars out the door.

It was at a Hobby Lobby, the person putting price tags on for whatever reason wasn't paying attention when they dialed the little dials in setting the price so instead of $50.00 it was $ 5.00 (that spacing is important).

For some reason Hobby Lobby, even tho they have a modern POS cash system, they still type in prices based on what the tag says. Cashier didn't even blink when I had that big box and it said five bucks. Yes I went back and bought the other one on the shelf. 

NOBODY is going to ever find that kit on the shelf for $5. I don't even LIKE the ship, but I just could not resist that. Yes I know that's de facto theft and normaly, believe it or not I would have said "hey, this price is way wrong, better do something" but this time I was weak, I listened to the devil on my shoulder and I bought two kits I didn't really want or need for STUPID cheap. 

Now, knowing I did this thing, does that serve any purpose in you evaluating if the kit is worth the money? Does that help you decide to spend $82.95 MSRP ($72.95 at Starship Modeler) (wow, they sure upped the price when they changed the box!) or does it just make you gnash your teeth because of my epic score? 

Using MSRP makes sure that any value discussion compares apples to apples. My getting that kit for $5 while you pay $72.95, there's zero balance. There's no way to express value for money and no way for anyone to jump in and do the same thing. Look how prices flux on Amazon, daily, hourly, sometimes even faster. One can say "Amazon has it for $xx.xx and free shipping" but a day later that price might up 10% or more. 

Using MSRP is a stable point. What you end up paying for it is your value judgement. 

And don't forget, even people here on the interwebtubes, SOME of them don't buy online. Some of them walk into Hobby Lobby or Hobby Town or that struggling local hobby shop that's more Warhammer figures and Pokemon cards (and drones. lots and lots of drones) than plastic kits. Discussions using MSRP gives that person knowledge to know if the price on the shelf fits their comfort level to spend. 

is my thought on it anyway. It's worked in 40 years worth of discussions, pre and post internet.


----------



## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Wow. I do like this idea. I don't really care about grid lines. Makes no difference to me. The correction of the lights...yeah. That's important. OK. Nothing Earth shattering! LOL!

Doug


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

BolianAdmiral said:


> Just reinforces that they never should have had them (the gridlines) on in the first place, as it was all wasted money. But instead of listening to what the fans wanted, they decided to listen to a two-bit hack like Gary Kerr, who knows nothing about what he's talking about, and tick off a lot of people getting something wrong which never had to be wrong to begin with. Oh, well. At least this will save some people the time and effort of sanding/filling those wretched lines, and they can use the lined saucer parts for kitbashing, spare parts to give/sell to others, or target practice.



Hold on a minute. Many fans said they liked the grid pattern. In fact I'd say about half of the people on here wanted the lines

I'm indifferent to this as I didn't mind the grid lines but it's not exactly much of a 50th anniversary celebration kit if that's all they're doing.


----------



## Kremin (Sep 26, 2012)

well anyone that doesn't want their grid lined primary hulls feel free to send them this way :-D , nice to see the supplemental parts pack being re-issued


----------



## Captain Han Solo (Apr 5, 2002)

While I busted my "you know what" getting my Hull smooth on my builds, I look forward to this. As I believe the first pilot and second pilot add on parts will be available again (I hope!!). I plan on doing a Captain Pike version(my favorite).My personal take on the grid line debate...Having actually been up close to the 11'miniature While she was on display before the last "restoration" as well as before her move to current restoration, one could hardly see the penciled in grid lines on the hull. There is no way one would see them on a 3' or 1/350 scale model kit. Of course there is nothing wrong with the modeler who likes them...I am also VERY thankful that we have this kit at all! And to those individuals who made it happen.

What's funny is I actually suggested that perhaps Round 2 should release the upper and lower hulls sans Grid lines as an add on part like the pilot parts several months ago on a heated Face Book thread...It was deemed a "stupid and un profitable idea". Oh well.

I am also happy for the guys who have waited for this and perhaps didn't want to deal with the filling and sanding nonsense.


----------



## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Even though Round 2 has confirmed "the smoothie option," as a great man once said, "I reject your reality and substitute my own!"

*K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!*

Keep hope alive!!!

8...


----------



## HabuHunter32 (Aug 22, 2009)

Steve H said:


> But that's arguably part of what's destroyed the local hobby shop (as well as most all retail). Knowledge is power, and being able to seek out the lowest price is a GOOD thing. I don't dispute that.
> 
> but that search is individual. It's a moving target. What I bought a kit for may not even be possible to duplicate.
> 
> ...


Points well taken. I understand your point of view. I place less value on the MSRP it's true because it is not my primary concern. The price I pay is. Your logic is sound. I guess I just never thought of it that way. I'm never to old to learn. 

Mike


----------



## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

So...is this saucer a whole new tool? Or did they modify the one with grid lines to make this one? If the latter, then it it is the 1:537 STTMP "smoothie" all over again--just in reverse!


----------



## scotthm (Apr 6, 2007)

Steve H said:


> So, if one wishes a smooth saucer, one must buy the kit and the addition, that's $204.98 MSRP, plus shipping and/or tax.
> 
> Wow.


I'm guessing you don't buy many resin kits.

---------------


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

scotthm said:


> I'm guessing you don't buy many resin kits.
> 
> ---------------


I do not. I AM aware of the kind of pricing even small, simple kits can get to.


----------



## robn1 (Nov 17, 2012)

Well it sounded bad at first, but as Jamie has said the new saucer will be included in future releases of the kit so it's OK. The separate saucer is there for folks who want the update for an existing kit, but seriously I'd sooner fill the grids than buy the replacement. Since I haven't got this kit yet it's a huge win for me :smile2:

Thank you Round 2 for greasing the squeaky wheel.


----------



## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

Fozzie said:


> So...is this saucer a whole new tool? Or did they modify the one with grid lines to make this one? If the latter, then it it is the 1:537 STTMP "smoothie" all over again--just in reverse!


Hate to burst your bubble buy Jamie posted a new blog today stating they will be releasing a smoothie TOS 350 saucer later this year. Go to Collector Model | for more info.


----------



## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Zombie_61 said:


> I'm pretty sure I know what it is now. Some modelers might like it, but I think others are going to be pretty ticked off.


Okay, it seems "ticked off" wins. 

I've been putting off the purchase of the 1/350 TOS Enterprise kit for a number of reasons, but primarily because I don't have the display space for a kit of this size. But the "smoothie" version of the full kit might just be too tempting to resist, so for the moment I'm in the "like it" camp.


----------



## MartyS (Mar 11, 2014)

spock62 said:


> Your faith has been rewarded: Star Trek NX-01 Refit | Round2
> 
> The description of the kit states that both the NX-01 and NX-01 Refit can be made from the kit.


Got it and yes, it can be built as 3 different ships, NX-01, NX-02, and the 01 refit. So I now know what my next build is going to be. Odd that the painting instructions say to use the same color as the TOS enterprise, it certainly wasn't even close to that color on screen.

As for the big announcement of the smoothie 1:350, I've been thinking about building another one and doing things a little differently with the lighting, so I will probably pick up the new version when it comes out, will be a good project for next winter....


----------



## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I'm still trying to figure out how to respond to the "two bit hack Gary Kerr" statement. :freak:


----------



## robiwon (Oct 20, 2006)

Still have not built my original "1701 Edition" kit. Would be neat if you could send in your untouched grid saucer for a smoothie replacement set, kind of a straight trade deal.


----------



## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

If the 1st edition kit goes on sale, you BET I'm snapping this up! Grid/no grid _be damned,_ it'll be perfect, 'cause I can't afford the MSRP.

Doug


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

John P said:


> I'm still trying to figure out how to respond to the "two bit hack Gary Kerr" statement. :freak:


Probably the best response is to not.

I mean, there's zero discussion content there, no logic to refute, it's all emotion. Can't change emotion. Can't fix stupid.


----------



## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Haaa hahaha! Good one Steve!

Doug


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

robiwon said:


> Still have not built my original "1701 Edition" kit. Would be neat if you could send in your untouched grid saucer for a smoothie replacement set, kind of a straight trade deal.


I agree 100%, but they can't make money that way. I feel they have an uphill battle with this.

And what other new content might be in the set? A new painting guide I think was mentioned. One thing I would think is necessary would be grid line decals. Very faint but more accurate. 

20/20 hindsight, I'm surprised they didn't go that route originally when they just couldn't get the Chinese factory to make the lines super thin and intensely subtle. Was that point argued back in the day? I do recall some hand wringing over how the factory claimed they just couldn't do that, very fine and small and subtle lines. Danged if I know how they manage panel lines on 1/72 aircraft and 1/200 airliners then.


----------



## edge10 (Oct 19, 2013)

I will finally pick up a copy of the 1/350 Enterprise thanks to this change.

Was a 'Blue Shirt' during the whole prerelease process but didn't go through with the order since Jamie didn't keep his promise on the grid lines.


----------



## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Steve H said:


> 20/20 hindsight, I'm surprised they didn't go that route originally when they just couldn't get the Chinese factory to make the lines super thin and intensely subtle. Was that point argued back in the day? I do recall some hand wringing over how the factory claimed they just couldn't do that, very fine and small and subtle lines. Danged if I know how they manage panel lines on 1/72 aircraft and 1/200 airliners then.


The point was argued profusely, with Round 2 claiming that they would only do the grid lines if they could make them "Tamiya fine". Otherwise, they would leave it smooth.

Well, what we got was not only deep trenches instead of the fine grid lines, but that hideously rough texture on the saucer surface as well. So, even if you chose not to fill in the grid lines, you still had to do a lot of sanding and priming steps to remove that awful rough texture.

At least, now, hopefully - they will replace the original, grid-lined saucer halves with the smooth ones from now on with all future kit releases, and not just for the 50th Anniversary "Special Edition" release.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

I haven't actually seen it in the flesh but they should get rid of the rough texture on the grid version too by the sounds of it. If it's like the texture on one of my planes it's a pain.


----------



## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

_Okay, here I go... mustering some enthusiasm... deep breath now... you can do it... ahem..._


*K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!*

7 days until Wonderfest...



_Whew. I won't lie. That... was hard. I think I pulled something. Better breathe into a paper bag for awhile..._


----------



## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

MartyS said:


> Got it and yes, it can be built as 3 different ships, NX-01, NX-02, and the 01 refit. So I now know what my next build is going to be. Odd that the painting instructions say to use the same color as the TOS enterprise, it certainly wasn't even close to that color on screen...


Well, the "refit" NX-01 never made it to the screen. They were planning to introduce it in Season 5, and I think the plan was to give it something closer to an Original Series livery.


----------



## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

So, after reading the Collector Model Blog post (been out of town the past few days), I have to say that I think the "smoothie" hull is a good idea. Round 2 is correcting all the issues with the 2 hull parts (gridlines, rough surface, misplaced lights), and is offering both a revised kit and an accessory kit for people (like me) who haven't started their kit yet. 

Yes, it would be nice if you could trade-in your original hull parts, but we all knew about the gridlines, at the very least, and still bought the kit anyway. And other companies that correct parts in their already issued kits never offer the corrected parts separately, you have to purchase the whole corrected kit. At least Round 2 is giving those of us that already own the original release a cheaper option to obtain the revised parts.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

spock62 said:


> So, after reading the Collector Model Blog post (been out of town the past few days), I have to say that I think the "smoothie" hull is a good idea. Round 2 is correcting all the issues with the 2 hull parts (gridlines, rough surface, misplaced lights), and is offering both a revised kit and an accessory kit for people (like me) who haven't started their kit yet.
> 
> Yes, it would be nice if you could trade-in your original hull parts, but we all knew about the gridlines, at the very least, and still bought the kit anyway. And other companies that correct parts in their already issued kits never offer the corrected parts separately, you have to purchase the whole corrected kit. At least Round 2 is giving those of us that already own the original release a cheaper option to obtain the revised parts.






Yes and of course the more money R2 makes from things like this the more Trek kits we'll hopefully get.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Hunk A Junk said:


> _Okay, here I go... mustering some enthusiasm... deep breath now... you can do it... ahem..._
> 
> 
> *K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!*
> ...



I've been breathing into a paper bag too.:grin2: If we ever do get a big new K'Tinga I hope they release a lighting kit for it very soon after. One that's very easy to install and one that can be repaired easily if it breaks. And one that doesn't need any soldering.


----------



## Owen E Oulton (Jan 6, 2012)

morrihl1 said:


> That sounds like a reworking of the 1/537 refit smoothie possibly?


Actually it really sounds more like the reissued Excelsior, which we already know about...


----------



## JediDad (Dec 5, 2009)

spock62 said:


> So, after reading the Collector Model Blog post (been out of town the past few days), I have to say that I think the "smoothie" hull is a good idea. Round 2 is correcting all the issues with the 2 hull parts (gridlines, rough surface, misplaced lights), and is offering both a revised kit and an accessory kit for people (like me) who haven't started their kit yet.


Although I would have loved to see them announce an all new kit (I am hoping for a TOS D-7 sometime in the future), I am extremely happy about the smooth hulls. This will save me the aggravation of filling all those grids, and smoothing that weird pebbly surface, when I do my 1701.


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

Well, the smooth saucer is cool, and I'm tempted. BUT, at the same time I'm also tempted just to sell my 1/350 Enterprise because I question whether I'll ever build it. I honestly don't know where I'd display the built kit.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Dr. Brad said:


> Well, the smooth saucer is cool, and I'm tempted. BUT, at the same time I'm also tempted just to sell my 1/350 Enterprise because I question whether I'll ever build it. I honestly don't know where I'd display the built kit.






Is that lack of storage room or just lack of display room?


----------



## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

A lack of display room, mostly. I do have mixed feelings, like I said. It's a tough call... I guess, to be honest, it's also a function of age. Sometimes I think about how I have fewer years ahead than I do behind, and I wonder if it's worth it.


----------



## jheilman (Aug 30, 2001)

It's worth it if you will enjoy the building. Display room is a challenge for something that big. Mine will remain boxed probably until kids have moved out and I take over one of their rooms to expand my "stuff." Then my wife will probably talk about downsizing and getting a smaller place in a warmer state. :smile2:


----------



## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

I should probably hang onto it! You're right. I'd sell it, then get the bug to build it, and never get one because of the prices on evil-Bay....


----------



## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

*K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!*

2 days until Wonderfest.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Display space is always a problem with the big kits- I have a 1/350 Refit that I will probably build as a destroyer just to save some space.


----------



## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Richard Baker said:


> Display space is always a problem with the big kits- I have a 1/350 Refit that I will probably build as a destroyer just to save some space.


I did that, but in addition to the full kit. 










I think I may give that pilot version E to a friend, and get the gridless kit to do it again without the grid. I'm fine with the grid on the series version. looks like i have room up there for the Coventry I'm kitbashing .


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

That's the way any proper house should look!:wink2:


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Somebody must be REALLY careful and obsessive with their dusting...


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## Rahn (Jun 2, 2009)

Steve H said:


> Somebody must be REALLY careful and obsessive with their dusting...


My girlfriend used to bug me to let her dust my collections, but I was afraid something bad could happen.

I finally said 'ok'.

Damn if the very first thing she picked up, she dropped (and destroyed) it.

She never asked again.


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Rahn said:


> My girlfriend used to bug me to let her dust my collections, but I was afraid something bad could happen.
> 
> I finally said 'ok'.
> 
> ...


Aw, man...

Did Love Triumph Over All or was that The Final Straw?


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Rahn said:


> My girlfriend used to bug me to let her dust my collections, but I was afraid something bad could happen.
> 
> I finally said 'ok'.
> 
> ...


My wife can dust some of mine but the real special ones are in a Plexiglas case and never need cleaning.


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## Rahn (Jun 2, 2009)

Steve H said:


> Aw, man...
> 
> Did Love Triumph Over All or was that The Final Straw?


Yeah, she's still around. Fortunately, she learned her lesson.

When she dropped it, there was a chair between her and myself. I couldn't see where it landed.

It wasn't until she picked the bent and broken (it was pewter) pieces up that I was able to see the damage.

The time from drop to her picking up the pieces seemed to take FOREVER.


----------



## oggy4u (Sep 27, 2007)

I am so with you on the K'tinga . We deserve a better model .


----------



## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

I'd be happy with an accurate K'tinga in 537.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Richard Baker said:


> Display space is always a problem with the big kits- I have a 1/350 Refit that I will probably build as a destroyer just to save some space.


I bought the 1/350 NCC-1701 Refit _and_ the 1/350 NX-01 kits when they were first issued. It wasn't until they arrived and I saw the size of the Refit's saucer section that I realized I was in trouble as far as finding a place to display them after they were built. :lol:


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

As I've said before unless you live in a mansion it's unrealistic to expect to put everything on display. Most of my stuff is in boxes and I can only display a small part of my collection.

That shouldn't stop people from buying big models though.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

oggy4u said:


> I am so with you on the K'tinga . We deserve a better model .





We sure do!:grin2:


----------



## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Dust? You're supposed to dust them!?



Rahn said:


> My girlfriend used to bug me to let her dust my collections, but I was afraid something bad could happen.
> 
> I finally said 'ok'.
> 
> ...


My father had a friend who built airplane models. One day his wife got disgusted with the dust, filled up the bathtub, dropped them all in the tub and swirled them around.

Yup. Parts soup.


----------



## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

*K'TINGA COUNTDOWN!!!!*

1 Day to go!

Last year Round 2 surprised everyone by announcing their awesome Eagle kit at Wonderfest and this year they'll do something even better by revealing their thoroughly researched, accurately proportioned 1/350 K'Tinga with supplemental light kit and parts to make a Kronos One conversion.

They *will*.

_Really._

I can feel it.

Actually, that might be last night's tacos. But still...

It's totally gonna happen!


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

SUNGOD said:


> As I've said before unless you live in a mansion it's unrealistic to expect to put everything on display. Most of my stuff is in boxes and I can only display a small part of my collection.
> 
> That shouldn't stop people from buying big models though.


Problem is also trying to store a model about three feet long...

I do have a corner reserved for the 15" Atomic City Aries 1b whenever it ships, but it is a sphere so a pedestal display in a corner would work fine.

If they do issue a 1/350 K-Tinga I could do a ceiling hang since it is fairly flat, but my space has a low dropped ceiling so any large Enterprise is a walk around. 

Oh well, at least I can enjoy the big builds other people create


----------



## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Hunk A Junk said:


> Last year Round 2 surprised everyone by announcing their awesome Eagle kit at Wonderfest and this year they'll do something even better...


Hmmm...it's possible. What's better than The Eagle? That blew me away! Yeah, you'd like to see:



Hunk A Junk said:


> ...their thoroughly researched, accurately proportioned 1/350 K'Tinga with supplemental light kit and parts to make a Kronos One conversion.


That would complement the 1/350 Enterprise Refit. Could parts be included to make a straight D-7, or no? Still, the K'Tinga would make a beautiful model. I'd like to see that...



Hunk A Junk said:


> They *will*.
> 
> _Really._
> 
> I can feel it. Actually, that might be last night's tacos. But still...


Yeah. _The tacos_. Me too. Burritos and chimichangas. Still...

Doug


----------



## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

Richard Baker said:


> Problem is also trying to store a model about three feet long...
> 
> I do have a corner reserved for the 15" Atomic City Aries 1b whenever it ships, but it is a sphere so a pedestal display in a corner would work fine.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I'm starting to lean towards selling mine.... I don't know what a fair price would be for one, but I have to be realistic. I'll keep my 1/350 refit kit, but get rid of the TOS kit. If I ever build my refit kit, I'll have to find space for it. 1 1/350 kit will have to do.


----------



## scotthm (Apr 6, 2007)

Dr. Brad said:


> I'll keep my 1/350 refit kit, but get rid of the TOS kit. If I ever build my refit kit, I'll have to find space for it. 1 1/350 kit will have to do.


You'll regret that. The refit is much more difficult to paint.

---------------


----------



## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

scotthm said:


> You'll regret that. The refit is much more difficult to paint.
> 
> ---------------


Very true. And that's why, for that model, I will use the Aztec decals, even though they don't come close to some of the amazing paint work for the refit we've seen on this site...


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Richard Baker said:


> Problem is also trying to store a model about three feet long...
> 
> I do have a corner reserved for the 15" Atomic City Aries 1b whenever it ships, but it is a sphere so a pedestal display in a corner would work fine.
> 
> ...




Big models like these are pretty rare anyway but people in bedsits aside (and in really small acomodation) everyone should have space for at least 2 of them in a normal sized house.....even if they can't always be displayed.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Radiodugger said:


> Hmmm...it's possible. What's better than The Eagle? That blew me away! Yeah, you'd like to see:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





I doubt there's a way to do a D7 and K'Tinga in one kit as there's so much extra detail on the K'Tinga plus the engraved Aztec lines. Mind you fill in the lines on the Revell kit and you'd have a pretty good D7.


----------



## RMC (Aug 11, 2004)

Radiodugger said:


> Hmmm...it's possible. What's better than The Eagle? That blew me away! Yeah, you'd like to see:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I hope its a 1/350 scale RELIANT !


----------



## Fozzie (May 25, 2009)

Am I the only one not expecting anything from R2 now that we've heard about the 1:350 smoothie saucer...?


----------



## Scotty K (Mar 21, 2011)

Fozzie said:


> Am I the only one not expecting anything from R2 now that we've heard about the 1:350 smoothie saucer...?


Seconded! I concur...


----------



## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Fozzie said:


> Am I the only one not expecting anything from R2 now that we've heard about the 1:350 smoothie saucer...?


Trust me, you're not the only one not expecting any more from Round 2 this year. Maybe next year for the 51st anniversary.


----------



## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

SUNGOD said:


> I doubt there's a way to do a D7 and K'Tinga in one kit as there's so much extra detail on the K'Tinga plus the engraved Aztec lines. Mind you fill in the lines on the Revell kit and you'd have a pretty good D7.


Also the dimensions of the K'Tinga and D7 are not the same. K'Tinga's engines are bigger, The main hull has some shape differences and of course the bridge area and forward ball are not the same as the D7's.


----------



## seaQuest (Jan 12, 2003)

I've already seen pics coming in from Wonderfest. It's the smooth saucer, the 1/350 TOS kit reissue with the new smooth saucer and that's it.


----------



## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

seaQuest said:


> I've already seen pics coming in from Wonderfest. It's the smooth saucer, the 1/350 TOS kit reissue with the new smooth saucer and that's it.





Great.:frown2: I wasn't expecting anything but like many I was secretly hoping they'd do something for the 50th. Even just an announcement.

Looks like a missed opportunity.


----------



## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

Anyone have links to photos from Wonderfest? Buc doesn't have his up yet and can't find any others...


----------



## lunadude (Oct 21, 2006)

Here's a couple from facebook.


----------



## pagni (Mar 20, 1999)

I like the way they spell "includes" and "Enterprise"... really clinches it for me...It's the attention to detail after all.
so uh... you can't be bothered to have a release for the 50th (alltho you hold the license) and you can't even muster a spell check for your promotional collateral....
wow....just wow.


----------



## TIEbomber1967 (May 21, 2012)

To be fair, the 7-Enterprise set IS a 50th anniversary release. It's just not a NEW release. Wait... the 1:2500 NX-01 is new isn't it? So, for the most part, it isn't a new release (but I do think it's a better Star Trek kit offering than the F-104).
As for the spelling, well, since the internet came along I no longer have any expectations of correct spelling, on anything, ever. It's kind of sad really.


----------



## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

TIEbomber1967 said:


> To be fair, the 7-Enterprise set IS a 50th anniversary release. It's just not a NEW release. Wait... the 1:2500 NX-01 is new isn't it? So, for the most part, it isn't a new release (but I do think it's a better Star Trek kit offering than the F-104).
> As for the spelling, well, since the internet came along I no longer have any expectations of correct spelling, on anything, ever. It's kind of sad really.


The 1:2500 NX-01 is new, unfortunately it's only available in the 7 kit set. 

Since I have all the others, I'll pass until it's released as a separate kit.

And the picture of the F-104 clearly shows how the proportions are off compared to the real thing.


----------



## BWolfe (Sep 24, 2013)

From the seven Enterprise box set "includes pressure sensitive decals", IOW, stickers. They can't even bother to include real decals?


----------



## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

BWolfe said:


> From the seven Enterprise box set "includes pressure sensitive decals", IOW, stickers. They can't even bother to include real decals?


Might be just an option but yeah, blurg. But at least they're not pre-painted pre-deco'ed 'toy' models. Right? 

Sad they seem a little more thrilled about a 1/2500 NX-01 then anything else.


----------



## apls (Dec 5, 2005)

An aftermarket set for the HD Star Trek episode The Doomsday Machine (really improved in that version) for the 1000 scale [ Constellation] Enterprise would be cool.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

'Golf clap'

So we have from Round 2 in celebration of the grand anniversary

An inaccurate jet repop

A bundled set of ships with stickers

A bone thrown to those who hate gridlines

Yeah, right.

I am going downstairs and work some on my Bandai now.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> 'Golf clap'
> 
> So we have from Round 2 in celebration of the grand anniversary
> 
> ...


I cannot disagree. Love the company conceptually but in the practical world they really whiffed this one. Swing and a miss. 

Is it just us? Have we come to expect too much in this day and age? Are there people out there jumping up and down screaming "hey! A 1/2500 NX-01 WITH STICKERS! I'mma gonna lose my MIND!!" somewhere we just don't know about?

(that's gonna be, what, 6 parts including stand?)

The new smooth saucer, I've already done my cheerleading on that, it's a good idea, a GREAT idea... for 2011. Now it seems a weaksauce apology. "Yeaaaaaah, you know, we really should have gone this way when we saw the Chinese factory couldn't deliver what we wanted. Sorry"

An apology that costs a pretty penny, mind. 

so, oh well.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Richard Baker said:


> 'Golf clap'
> 
> So we have from Round 2 in celebration of the grand anniversary
> 
> ...







It's a BIG, BIG, BIG......50th anniversary damp squib!:frown2:


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Steve H said:


> ...Are there people out there jumping up and down screaming "hey! A 1/2500 NX-01 WITH STICKERS! I'mma gonna lose my MIND!!" somewhere we just don't know about?...


If it also comes with proper decals and they eventually sell it separately? Maybe.


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

Could "pressure-sensitive decals" mean rub-on dry transfers instead of stickers?


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

RB said:


> Could "pressure-sensitive decals" mean rub-on dry transfers instead of stickers?


I am pretty sure they mean stickers since rub-ons are not pressure-sensitive.
Rub-ons are usually called 'Dry Transfer' decals/markings


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

SUNGOD said:


> It's a BIG, BIG, BIG......50th anniversary damp squib! :frown2:


Well, it means I _don't_ have to spend any money! _Always_ a good thing! :wink2:

Doug


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

And is the partly retooled Excelsior due out this year? I know it's not really in celebration of the fiftieth anniversary, but I'd imagine a lot of people will be happy to see it...


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

Dr. Brad said:


> And is the partly retooled Excelsior due out this year? I know it's not really in celebration of the fiftieth anniversary, but I'd imagine a lot of people will be happy to see it...


Should be out some time this summer.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Radiodugger said:


> Well, it means I _don't_ have to spend any money! _Always_ a good thing! :wink2:
> 
> Doug



No Radio............that's not a good thing when it comes to BIG K'Tingas. 

Big K'Tinga's make the world a happier place!:grin2:


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

SUNGOD said:


> No Radio............that's not a good thing when it comes to BIG K'Tingas.
> 
> Big K'Tinga's make the world a happier place!:grin2:


PHRASING! 

It's not polite to brag about the size of one's K'Tinga. It should speak for itself.

Now there's a frightening image. What would my K'Tinga say? Would it demand to always be in the happy place? 

And you know what they say about THAT.

:grin2:


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> PHRASING!
> 
> It's not polite to brag about the size of one's K'Tinga. It should speak for itself.
> 
> ...




Let's hope that one day R2 gives us something substantial in the Klingon ship department............then we can all brag about our big K'Tingas.:grin2:


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Steve H said:


> PHRASING!
> 
> It's not polite to brag about the size of one's K'Tinga. It should speak for itself.
> 
> ...


Set phrasers to stunned?


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## RB (Jul 29, 1998)

SUNGOD said:


> Let's hope that one day R2 gives us something substantial in the Klingon ship department............then we can all brag about our big K'Tingas.:grin2:


Then it'll be a matter of who has had K'Tinga enhancement...


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## tardis1916 (Mar 24, 2004)

Oh My!!!


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Slightly surprised there has not been a 'Klingons are ridged for pleasure' comment yet...


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

I have not yet purchased any 1:350 Star Trek ships yet. While I wait for the TOS Enterprise to be updated, I'm thinking about the NX-01. I really loved that series and its ships. But Round 2 needs a D-7 to go with the TOS Enterprise, right? They must know that. And a K'Tinga would not be far behind.

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> Slightly surprised there has not been a 'Klingons are ridged for pleasure' comment yet...


Now, let's not go to racial stereotypes and myths. Next you'd be making comments about how 'overbuilt' Klingons are and how they have two of everything. EVERYTHING. Every. thing. 

That would take real balls to do. Like 4 of them. 

I wonder what the slang is for Andorians not getting any? I mean, they're blue all over already...

Now see how you've lowered the discourse! For SHAME!


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## JediDad (Dec 5, 2009)

I just took a peek at Round 2's page, and it looks like they are re-releasing the clear 1701-D. I am very happy to see this as I have been looking for a 1/1400 1701-D.


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

JediDad said:


> I just took a peek at Round 2's page, and it looks like they are re-releasing the clear 1701-D. I am very happy to see this as I have been looking for a 1/1400 1701-D.


Me too. I am glad they are re-releasing this one as well. I want to get the accurizing parts from DLM Parts:

Star Trek Model Parts


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

It would be logical for R2 to crank out a re-release of anything with 'Enterprise' on it. Be nice if they were a bit more bold about it but, hey.


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## irishtrek (Sep 17, 2005)

Richard Baker said:


> Slightly surprised there has not been a 'Klingons are ridged for pleasure' comment yet...


Well guess what, you just did one.:grin2:


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Truly disappointing that Round 2 couldn't come up with something spectacular at Wonderfest. Sure, I'm happy they've updated the old Excelsior kit and that they've fixed the grid line issue for those who want it. But the peel'n stick decal Enterprise collection and the Tomorrow is Yesterday fighter re-pops are sacks of flaming manure left on our doorsteps. I had high hopes for the company after the TOS-E and last year's Eagle announcement. Great kits, great scale, great attention to detail, great value. It seemed like, for a moment, someone at the company "got it." Hopefully, this is just an awkward transition period and things will get headed back in the right direction. Still, a huge missed opportunity.


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

Well, for what it is worth, Round 2 does have new stuff in the works, but we probably won't see any announcements until next year:

Collector Model |


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## Hunk A Junk (Jan 28, 2013)

Opus Penguin said:


> Well, for what it is worth, Round 2 does have new stuff in the works, but we probably won't see any announcements until next year:
> 
> Collector Model |


It's good to hear. I'm glad at least they recognized this year's show was "light" on new stuff. I certainly hope they get everyone at the company on the same page about what they're doing so that we can have more releases like the Eagle and less like "Tomorrow is Yesterday." Speaking for myself, I'd much rather sing their praises and send them my money than complaining about disappointments.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Opus Penguin said:


> Well, for what it is worth, Round 2 does have new stuff in the works, but we probably won't see any announcements until next year:
> 
> Collector Model |


I have to say, that's a real man's job of trying to make lemonade. Kudos to Jamie, I mean that.

Still unaddressed: That box of 1/2500 ships, stickers ONLY or do they throw in some waterslide decals as well for those a tiny bit more advanced?

Will the newly minted 1/350 saucer include (don't be haters, y'all  ) gridline decals? Very fine, very faint DECAL lines?

I'm a bit concerned about ABS for the clear 1701-D, I think it would be wise to put some advisories on the box concerning proper cements. I know most of the liquid cements we use seem to be effective on both styrene and ABS but...oh, who am I kidding, nobody is going to buy a clear Enterprise that isn't somewhat experienced.


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## taneal1 (Jul 27, 2014)

Steve H said:


> Will the newly minted 1/350 saucer include Very fine, very faint lines?


Presumably, the option to purchase JUST the 'smooth' saucer will not be available? It would be expensive of course, but eliminating the gridlines is NOT something to look forward to...

Tom


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

taneal1 said:


> Presumably, the option to purchase JUST the 'smooth' saucer will not be available? It would be expensive of course, but eliminating the gridlines is NOT something to look forward to...
> 
> Tom


I altered my post some to correct any potential mis-understanding. The new saucer parts will indeed be sold on their own as well as becoming a 'running change' in the 1/350 kit.

Know what would have been a cool, crazy idea? If they had included enough of the needed parts so one had a kit of a Saucer that had to blow free from the Engineering Hull. Maybe some new insert piece to show the dorsal/saucer connection interface. 

Yeaaaah but if they did THAT then the 'replacement' aspect of the kit would have suddenly had a $100 MSRP


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## taneal1 (Jul 27, 2014)

Steve H said:


> I altered my post some to correct any potential mis-understanding. The new saucer parts will indeed be sold on their own as well as becoming a 'running change' in the 1/350 kit.


Hey Steve,

Thanks for the quick reply, and MORE importantly for providing the response that I WANTED to hear! I haven't had the time for that ordeal known as gridline removal, so I have delayed starting the build. All I have to do now is decide whether to go motor or LED for the Bussards, and then I can decide whether to use somebody's light kit or do my own...



Steve H said:


> Know what would have been a cool, crazy idea? If they had included enough of the needed parts so one had a kit of a Saucer that had to blow free from the Engineering Hull. Maybe some new insert piece to show the dorsal/saucer connection interface.
> 
> Yeaaaah but if they did THAT then the 'replacement' aspect of the kit would have suddenly had a $100 MSRP :


I made the mistake of commenting that someone had done a TOS Enterprise and lit the nacelle trenches with blue LEDs and it really looked great. Over the objections, I pointed out that there is evidence that Roddenberry had considered doing this and later AND earlier Enterprise versions had them lit. So unless you're doing an exact copy why not? I barely escaped with my life.

Even though it had landing gear doors, a TOS that separates may get you excommunicated... >


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Taneal, in the end, the ONLY person you have to please is yourself. You're the one who is going to be looking at the finished build day after day, and if you're not happy, it doesn't matter how much you've 'conformed' to 'mass opinion', for good or bad. 

If you want to paint the TOS Enterprise in shades of silver like a '50s era USAF aircraft (which is what I think Jefferies had in mind until he considered the realities of TV filming and how poorly it would photograph), go right ahead. If you want to light the trenches, go right ahead. Heck, there was a point where Roddenberry wanted the 'balls' on the back end of the nacelles to be lit the same way as the front, or at the very least lit in SOME manner, but that was nixed due to cost. 

Myself, I think that would have been overdoing it but it's an interesting idea. One thing from an artistic standpoint, the lit front of the nacelles gives direction to the model- if you see those caps lit up, you know that's the front of the ship. 

I've not suggested that the saucer section of the TOS Enterprise be an independent vehicle ala the 1701-D (altho some have, citing long-discarded ideas in the very very early stages of design), just a wistful fantasy of R2 making an entire kit of the newly smooth saucer and not just selling the two parts all by their lonesome. It's a completely impossible idea due to the parts breakdown on various trees in the 1/350th kit. I DO hope they include that panel line decal I've suggested but I bet not.


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## taneal1 (Jul 27, 2014)

Steve H said:


> Taneal, in the end, the ONLY person you have to please is yourself. You're the one who is going to be looking at the finished build day after day, and if you're not happy, it doesn't matter how much you've 'conformed' to 'mass opinion', for good or bad.


Steve,

To quote the late Rick Nelson, "You can't please everyone, so you got to please yourself." I appreciate your encouragement, but my plan at the moment is-if it's doable-I WILL light the trenches. If I don't like the effect, I'll leave the switch off, cut the wires, or whatever.

Mostly I was just pointing out that many, if not most, get rather irate at the thought of messing with the Enterprise. Next time I'll tell them I replaced the Bussards with 3-bladed propellers.

Now that a smooth hull will be available I won't hesitate to build "Pike's Enterprise." If the budget allowed it, they certainly would have lit the windows and running lights. Steady or very subtle pulsating red lights in the Bussard, IMO, is not changing the nature of the Enterprise, it just isn't an exact copy of the filming model. Again, if I don't like the look, I can leave the lights off.

Tom


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Like most of us, I too am disappointed that Round 2 didn't have a big release for Trek's 50th anniversary. However, in Round 2's defense:

1. Big kits like the 1/350th Enterprises and the 1/48th Eagle take a long time to plan, engineer if you want them accurate and well constructed.

2. These kits require lots of capitol to produce. Round 2 has a lot of irons in the fire. What with all their various model companies, slot cars, diecasts and other products the money is spread rather thin. Plus they just recently reaquired their Johnny Lightning brand, more money spent.

3. Though I don't have actual figures, I suspect the profit margin on model kits is surprisingly low. I've spent over fourty years in retail and to make big profits you have to move large numbers of merchandise. Let's face it, plastic kits are a niche market and Sci-Fi kits even more so. The fact that Round 2 and Moebius are willing to produce these kits is nothing shy of a miracle.

Bottom line is it maybe a year or two if not longer before we see another large Sci-Fi kit. I'm sure Round 2 has plans for more. Just be patient.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Round 2 had a big kit in development- it was cancelled/"Back-Burnered".

It might be a selfish point of view, but you would think the official license holder of an American icon which was having the significant anniversary would consider that some sort of priority and perhaps plan a bit better for it? 

They cancelled the Galileo which would have been a perfect tribute kit. 

We got instead an inaccurate reboxed Lindburg kit, some parts in a way which a lot of felt should have been that way in the first place and a tiny new kit of a ship bundled with a bunch of existing kits which should make it an expensive group.

It is their choice and their priorities, nothing we can do about it, nothing will change what is.

If they are expecting fans and builders to roll their eyes in gratitude for this it may be a while.

The Hot Wheels 'Cool Spock with his Buick Riviera" is a far far better tribute than anything Round 2 has coughed up.
A Tiny Spock Leaning on a 1964 Buick Riviera Is the Best Hot Wheels Car Ever


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> Round 2 had a big kit in development- it was cancelled/"Back-Burnered".
> 
> It might be a selfish point of view, but you would think the official license holder of an American icon which was having the significant anniversary would consider that some sort of priority and perhaps plan a bit better for it?
> 
> ...


Again, can't disagree with anything you say here. Taking the new-tool Galileo off the table was a really poorly timed thing to do.

I cut them slack on the Lindberg F-104 because I'm in favor of OCCASIONAL outside-the-box thinking, I had seen a pic of the previous release of the kit and was just SURE I was looking at some odd squeezed picture but nope, the kit really is that way, way off-model. So I gotta take points away.

In that vein I find that Hot Wheels to be GENIUS and it would have been the perfect Christmas present for my late friend, who was a giant Spock fan. Um, That is, a fan who really appreciated the character of Mr. Spock, not necessarily a fan of the giant 50 foot Spock from the animated episode 'The Infinite Vulcan'. 

Seems to me somewhere in their automobile kit inventory they, Round 2, likely have the same car, they could do the same thing but no...


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Capt. Krik said:


> Like most of us, I too am disappointed that Round 2 didn't have a big release for Trek's 50th anniversary. However, in Round 2's defense:
> 
> 1. Big kits like the 1/350th Enterprises and the 1/48th Eagle take a long time to plan, engineer if you want them accurate and well constructed.
> 
> ...





Well unless someone says different the Eagles have been selling quite well from what we've heard so this is why many of us were wondering if R2 had another big kit in the bag seeing as it's the 50th anniversary.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Steve H said:


> Again, can't disagree with anything you say here. Taking the new-tool Galileo off the table was a really poorly timed thing to do.
> 
> I cut them slack on the Lindberg F-104 because I'm in favor of OCCASIONAL outside-the-box thinking, I had seen a pic of the previous release of the kit and was just SURE I was looking at some odd squeezed picture but nope, the kit really is that way, way off-model. So I gotta take points away.
> 
> ...







I actually thought the Galileo was cancelled as they were working on something else big. Obviously I was wrong.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Steve H said:


> ...I DO hope they include that panel line decal I've suggested but I bet not.


I can just hear the folks at Round 2. "Wait, wait, wait. We got rid of the panel lines that they didn't want etched into the kit, and now they want panel line _decals_???" :lol:


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Richard Baker said:


> They cancelled the Galileo which would have been a perfect tribute kit.
> 
> We got instead an inaccurate reboxed Lindburg kit, some parts in a way which a lot of felt should have been that way in the first place, and a tiny new kit of a ship bundled with a bunch of existing kits which should make it an expensive group.
> 
> It is their choice and their priorities, nothing we can do about it, nothing will change what is.


Yep, the 1:32 Galileo would have been a _perfect_ tribute kit. No doubt. A 1:350 D-7 or K'Tinga would too. But I am going to be optimistic. When I have bought everything I want, suddenly these will appear. I got some catching up to do. LOL!

Doug


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Zombie_61 said:


> I can just hear the folks at Round 2. "Wait, wait, wait. We got rid of the panel lines that they didn't want etched into the kit, and now they want panel line _decals_???" :lol:


Well, sure, of course it seems headache inducing. 

But wasn't the key point of contention the inability of the Chinese factory to make the engraved lines as fine and subtle (wasn't the term 'Tamiya fine' used or something similar?) as scale called for? 

Heck, seems to me decals would have been the best go-to option way back when.


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

I believe Jamie mentioned in one of his posts that designing the Galileo kit was actually designing two kits. the exterior and the interior. That and the fact that the Galileo was limited to sales as the Galileo only. The Eagle on the other hand allows itself to be produced as different kits based on the various versions of the Eagle as seen in the TV series. That and the fact that the old 1/72nd scale kit did surprisingly well in sales. This from a kit that is extremely inaccurate and 40 years old. That is why The Eagle got priority and the Galileo got shoved aside. 
While Star Trek is certainly more popular than 1999, the Eagle has more sales potential than the Galileo. 
It's a business folks. They have to make money to survive. They look at the projects they have in development and decide which will be the most successful.


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## Stimpson J. Cat (Nov 11, 2003)

Big scale kits are interesting but 1/1000 is my scale of choice.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Capt. Krik said:


> I believe Jamie mentioned in one of his posts that designing the Galileo kit was actually designing two kits. the exterior and the interior. That and the fact that the Galileo was limited to sales as the Galileo only. The Eagle on the other hand allows itself to be produced as different kits based on the various versions of the Eagle as seen in the TV series. That and the fact that the old 1/72nd scale kit did surprisingly well in sales. This from a kit that is extremely inaccurate and 40 years old. That is why The Eagle got priority and the Galileo got shoved aside.
> While Star Trek is certainly more popular than 1999, the Eagle has more sales potential than the Galileo.
> It's a business folks. They have to make money to survive. They look at the projects they have in development and decide which will be the most successful.


I never heard it described as an either Eagle or Galileo choice.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> I never heard it described as an either Eagle or Galileo choice.


Seconded on that. I don't even recall that as part of the discussion.

What I DO recall is how 'fast tracked' into production the Eagle was, compared to other all-new tool kits. It seemed to come out of the blue. 

We've speculated that the modular design of the kit, which resulted in smaller and fewer molds needing to be cut which ultimately resulted in lower manufacturing costs making production very attractive due to increased ROI as the final 'go' signal to production. I have never seen anything that confirms this directly said by anyone at R2 but it's reasonable and logical speculation based on known facts. 

The Galileo is a tough nut to crack. You've got those surprisingly complex, subtle and beautiful shapes for the hull which would demand a LOT of work to get right*, you've got the conundrum of scale- the stage set of the interior Vs what the physical object allows, and that pesky problem that there's no easy re-use of the molds to extend the ROI. 

Then again, there's no real easy re-pop potential to the 1/350 TOS Enterprise either, is there? I've not heard of a 'glow in the dark' version on the boards. 

*On the Galileo hull, I just don't think a deep draft mold is the way to go with that in the larger scale. The only way I can see that work would be a sliding multipart mold and THAT, friends, is REAL expensive. I think it would need to have the Bandai 'frames and panels' assembly method to do all that right, but if you do THAT say goodby to any kind of interior...


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I would have settled for a smaller Galileo kit without any interior as long as the hull shape was correct.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

Richard Baker said:


> I would have settled for a smaller Galileo kit without any interior as long as the hull shape was correct.


And I agree with this as well! And there would have been plenty of Aurora-style reuse as well! Picture the Galileo by itself, then later a deluxe kit with diorama base and figures. There could even be a pre-paint/pre-deco'ed kit for the 'build toy' customer base.

I think to be fair, most of the heartache is over the loss of the (nominally?) 1/24 scale new tool kit. Sadly, a smaller new tool kit was never on the table, at least that I ever heard. I think there's a fixation that if the Galileo gets made it MUST have a detailed interior and that's just a stumbling block no matter what. 

I'm of the opinion that a series of Star Trek shuttlecraft kits in a consistent scale would be boss. I guess 1/72 would be best because that lets you toss the Runabout into the mix. Man that would be a nifty display.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

I wouldn't be surprised if the Galileo returns as a smaller kit in the future. It's only a small craft so there's no need to make it a big kit even with an interior.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Stimpson J. Cat said:


> Big scale kits are interesting but 1/1000 is my scale of choice.


Mine too, but a 1/1000 scale Galileo would be only slightly over 1/4" long. 



Richard Baker said:


> I would have settled for a smaller Galileo kit without any interior as long as the hull shape was correct.


Same here. Something approximately the size of the old AMT kit would be just fine with me.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

You can already get all the shuttlecraft in 1/72 in resin (which I never did, 'cause that's too small!). If there were to be a mass-market styrene series, I'd want at least 1/48, and preferably 1/32. Interiors are not a must for me, but would be nice.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Don't forget those are resin though. But does it have to be one of those standard aircraft scales of 1/32, 1/48 or 1/72? Maybe they could do a compromise of say 1/60th?

There's not many kits (if any) of Trek subjects in those scales anyway so it's not as if it could be displayed alongside craft in the same scale.


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## Steve H (Feb 8, 2009)

The key, in my mind, would be start at the largest kind of shuttle, I would say the Runabout, and work down from there. If you can make a Runabout in 1/48, then glory to all and go for it. I *suspect* they'd only want to go to 1/72 on that (and wasn't the existing kit close to 1/72 anyway?). 

So, yeah, small kits. They could 'bundle' shuttles by series to up the pricepoint. ST:TMP would give you the Long Range Shuttle, plus the smaller standard shuttle, and a Travel Pod. That would be a nice set. TNG gives you several shuttles including the original Probert designed one. Classic Trek you could have a Galileo Seven diorama, or a nice chunk of hanger deck. 

There are ways to do this stuff. Really.


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Richard Baker said:


> I never heard it described as an either Eagle or Galileo choice.


My mistake. Jamie never actually said that. Those were my thoughts which I should have stated. However, in my defense it does make sense. The Galileo was put on the back burner while the Eagle was green lit for production. Looking at potentially more sales from the Eagle it would make more sense to get production started on that kit. Once again that is only my guess on what happened.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

The AMT runabout is supposedly 1/72. I'd be happy with a reissue plus an interior.

I guess the Delta Flyer would need to be 1/72 also, being so big.

The rest I want in 1/32.


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Stimpson J. Cat said:


> Big scale kits are interesting but 1/1000 is my scale of choice.


I love the 1/350th scale ships. However, Round 2 has done such a great job on the 1/1000th kits that I really look forward to their next release. I hope they have more on the way in the near future.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Capt. Krik said:


> I love the 1/350th scale ships. However, Round 2 has done such a great job on the 1/1000th kits...


I've thought about that. Noting that the 1:350 TOS Enterprise is being considered for use as a filming miniature, do you think a 1:1000 ship would work in that capacity?

I really love that 1:350 NX-01! How hard would it be to light the little 1:1000 ships?

Doug


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Radiodugger said:


> I've thought about that. Noting that the 1:350 TOS Enterprise is being considered for use as a filming miniature, do you think a 1:1000 ship would work in that capacity?
> 
> I really love that 1:350 NX-01! How hard would it be to light the little 1:1000 ships?
> 
> Doug


I think a 1/1000 model would be fine for long shots. Closeups would be tough to keep in focus. 
I have seen some incredibly lit 1/1000th kits. A little beyond the skills of my aging hands and eye sight, but it can be done.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I have seen some 1/1000 builds which would work on film- at a distance of course.
Trouble with a filming miniature is that it needs to be big enough so the camera gets perspective into the shot (the foreground elements larger and the background elements receding to a vanishing point). Small scale ships are good for fleet shots- the SSD in Star Wars had a small brass ISD built to the same scale so they could be filmed together in formation.


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Interesting! Thanks guys!

Doug


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## robn1 (Nov 17, 2012)

Radiodugger said:


> ...Noting that the 1:350 TOS Enterprise is being considered for use as a filming miniature...


Considered by whom?


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## Radiodugger (Sep 27, 2011)

Radiodugger said:


> I've thought about that. Noting that the 1:350 TOS Enterprise is being considered for use as a filming miniature...





robn1 said:


> Considered by whom?


Mark Myers mentioned it. No surprise there...

Doug


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