# Lunar Models Proteus -- finished at last!



## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I posted some work-in-progress pix a short while back; here are a few shots of the completed model.

Additional pix can be found in "My Gallery."


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## Zorro (Jun 22, 1999)

That is a beautifully clean build-up.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Incredible!
Man, when I do something that requires a finish that clean, I end up weathering the hell out of it just to hide my mistakes!


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## Steve CultTVman Iverson (Jan 1, 1970)

That is sweet.


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Stunningly beautiful! Great details!


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## Seaview (Feb 18, 2004)

VERY nice job!!!!!!! :thumbsup: I think I'll take a break from my 3rd LM Spindrift as soon as my Proteus Interior kit shows up and work on that one instead.
Thanks, Carson, for the inspiration! A worthy companion to Flukes' Spindrift for an "ultimate" Lunar Models Museum


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Very nice indeed Carson!!

I believe you mentioned on another thread that this kit is a vac-formed hull with a resin interior. Or did you scratch-build much of the interior?

In any case, how did you find the kit in terms of difficulty to build? I'm pretty comfortable with styrene kits and resin kits like the ones that Wilco produces but vac-formed kits have a reputation for being difficult in the extreme. Did you find that to be true with this model?

Huzz


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## Nektu (Aug 15, 2001)

Carson,
Really beautiful...hats off!
How did you wind up doing the decals? Would it be possible to get a set from you? Please PM or email me at [email protected]

all the best,
Ken


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## john guard (Dec 31, 2001)

man!! i wish i had skill and patience like that! i will be attempting to make the Wilco kit! i can only hope my results will look decent! may i use your pic's a paint guides????


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Seaview said:


> I think I'll take a break from my 3rd LM Spindrift as soon as my Proteus Interior kit shows up and work on that one instead.


3rd LM Spindrift?!? You poor masochistic man...

Alas, I too am a LM Spindrift veteran. Not as tough a build as the Proteus, but damn close. 

True story: about ten years ago, I entered my recently completed Spindrift in a model contest sponsored by Monsters in Motion. It was the first time I'd ever entered a model in competition, and I wasn't sure what to expext. Well, the good news is I won first place... the bad news is the twit they'd hired to MC the festivities dropped my model nose-first onto a table. Screwed up the interior pretty bad; I had to cut open the windshield and perform major surgery on the dislodged flight deck. 

But hey, at least I won a bunch of figure kits I didn't really want.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> Very nice indeed Carson!!
> 
> ...you mentioned on another thread that this kit is a vac-formed hull with a resin interior. Or did you scratch-build much of the interior? In any case, how did you find the kit in terms of difficulty to build?
> Huzz


The LM Proteus features two large upper and lower vacu-form hull halves. Unfortunately, the section of the upper hull which comprises the window frame/ upper deck/snorkel housing is included as a seperate resin piece which must be seamlessly wed to the larger vacu-form hull piece. I don't know why Lunar opted for this approach, but it required a tremendous amount of puttying and sanding.

Lunar also makes (or used to make) a resin interior for this kit. Although I bought one of these, I ended up using it mostly as a sort of road map for what turned out to be a largely scratch-built interior.

I love this ship; she's probably my all time favorite as far as media related sci-fi vehicles are concerned, and I'm grateful to Mike Evans and the gang at L.M. for producing a truly accurate kit (I bugged them for years to do so). Nevertheless, it is far and away the most difficult and time consuming model I've ever built -- or ever hope to build.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Nektu said:


> Carson,
> Really beautiful...hats off!
> How did you wind up doing the decals?


I played around with custom-made decals, but couldn't get them as clean and crisp as I wanted. I ended up creating the hull markings in Adobe Illustrator, then sending the digi-file to a local print outfit that makes "chrom-a-tec" transfers. In other words: they're rub-on. A bit more pricey than decals, but in this instance they were well worth the expense.

By the way, Lunar now offers decals for this kit.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

*HOLY COW!!! VERY NICE!!!* I VANT THIS KIT! I NEED THAT KIT!!!

*Cool SPINDRIFT too!*

Here is what I did with my 1/35 Lunar SPINDRIFT


http://troysmodels.homestead.com/SPINDRIFT.html


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

fluke said:


> *Here is what I did with my 1/35 Lunar SPINDRIFT*


*

Awesome. The flight deck in particular is, well... WAY awesome. 
The Spindrift is one ship that clearly benefits from a snazzy lighting job. 

That's a model I'm gonna have to re-visit one of these days. Bravo!*


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

That... is... nice! Very nice! Did I mention it's nice. Just a great job! You can be justifiably proud!

Brad.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Thank you Carson!

I have always liked the Spindrift...or was it Deanna Lund?  

There were so many times I was ready to snipe the Aurora Spindrift on ebay before the PL re-release....Man I'm sooo glad I did not! $$$  

I would have done the same to that tiny thing as well! and I would still be paying off the psych bills and taking funny little pills!

Again....Great Job on the Proteus!! :thumbsup:


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Aside from the studio model, that's definitely the best Proteus I've ever seen!

Excellent job!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Trek Ace said:


> Aside from the studio model, that's definitely the best Proteus I've ever seen!


Thanks for the compliment, however... have you ever seen the studio miniature up close? If not, you might be surprised. Not to seem like an egotistical jerk, but the craftsmanship is really pretty shoddy -- and I'm not talking about Greg Jein's "restoration" (which, so fas as I can tell, involved a paint job and the refurbishing of a few surface details). I'm talking about the overall construction of the model itself. Like most studio miniatures of the period, the Proteus was built to look good on film... period. I only mention it to illustrate how far the overall quality of studio miniatures has come since the 50's and early 60's -- thanks in large part to Gerry Anderson, Stanley Kubrick, George Lucas, and the talented craftsmen working for them. Anderson's TV shows, "2001," and "Star Wars" introduced a new level of realism to the art of the movie miniature.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

That raises a question Carson - just where can one see the sole surviving Proteus filiming model?

Huzz


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## Steve244 (Jul 22, 2001)

eeep.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Zoinks?

Jinkies!

Roobie Doo!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> That raises a question Carson - just where can one see the sole surviving Proteus filiming model?
> 
> Huzz


Unless I'm mistaken, the large Proteus model is still owned and maintained by Greg Jein, and is almost continuously on loan to somebody somewhere. I know the old girl has logged a lot of hours at museums in L.A. and Tokyo, and was most recently on display at the Smithsonian as part of their "Magic of Movie Miniatures" exhibit (it may still be there, for all I know). 

Note to Gregg Jein: if you're looking to find the Proteus a good home, call Paul Allen. She'd make a great addition to his Seattle-based science fiction museum.


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## Seaview (Feb 18, 2004)

Dave Hussey said:


> That raises a question Carson - just where can one see the sole surviving Proteus filiming model?
> 
> Huzz


I don't know if it still exists, but try this link:

http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/Proteus/ProteusTop.htm

(I hope that link works).


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## PhilipMarlowe (Jan 23, 2004)

I saw the _Proteus_ years ago at the Smithsonian, and agree with Carson, it's really disapointing how rough and primitive the characters, exterior, and interior were. The figure's faces were about as detailed and smooth as those carved dried "apple" dolls you see in the rural south.

The IDIC page used to have a whole page of high-res photo's of the _Proteus_ at the Smithsonian, and I _think _ the Subcommittee (sp?) had the same pictures. 

Carson's has a better paint job


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Its somewhat apparent from the pictures of the 5 foot model on the Cloudster site that the Captain Owens figure in the navigation bubble is fairly un-detailed. Although its hard to really get a sense of the quality of the overall finish from those pictures.

Thankfully, the model still exists in reasonably good condition!

Huzz


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

Carson,

I referenced the studio model only because it is the "original" _Proteus_. If I had to pick the "definitive" _Proteus_, it would definitely be yours!

BTW,

I feel the same way towards Fluke's _Spindrift_. I had the opportunity to see it up close last year, and it looks far better than the original studio model. Ditto with Jim Key's excellent 1/2 scale TOS _Enterprise_.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I thank you for the compliment, Ace. Rest assured no offense was taken at having my model compared to the original. I just wanted to draw a distinction between the degree of finish required for a 60's FX miniature vs. a model subject to close quarter scrutiny by the naked eye.


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## PhilipMarlowe (Jan 23, 2004)

Dave Hussey said:


> Its somewhat apparent from the pictures of the 5 foot model on the Cloudster site that the Captain Owens figure in the navigation bubble is fairly un-detailed. Although its hard to really get a sense of the quality of the overall finish from those pictures.
> 
> Thankfully, the model still exists in reasonably good condition!
> 
> Huzz


There's a different set of photo's of the 5 footer at the Smithsonian, I used to have them bookmarked on my old webtv but I looked a few likely places today and couldn't find them posted. But they were taken much closer, you could plainly see into the interior and a lot of detail. I'm sure someone will post a link, I've seen them on more than one site.

You could see it very good at the Museum itself, it was in a big lucite case at waist level, you could walk around it. It looked very cool and impressive, but it just seemed much rougher and cruder than you would think from watching the movie. Especially the figures, really only the Donald Pleasance was recognizable('Sides Raquel of course). They looked like they were made out of clay or sculpey, but were very rough, though that may have been from age.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Carson Dyle said:


> I love this ship; she's probably my all time favorite as far as media related sci-fi vehicles are concerned, QUOTE]
> 
> I have to agree 100% with that sentiment! Truly lovely work Carson! :thumbsup:
> 
> Huzz


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

*details on pilot panels?*

What a masterpiece!

How'd you do the details on the pilot panels? I love the LITTLE red light effect on top of the center monitor! How'd you make those?


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Thanks for the compliments, guys. After all the work that went into this model, it's very gratifying indeed.

Someone had asked about the intake grills, and there's an interesting story behind that (well, interesting to me anyway). 

The forward intakes -- the ones located directly below the observation windows -- were a last minute addition to the design, and do not appear in the original studio blueprints. I suspect this was the practical result of needing more vent area for the actors to de-clog when the sub gets bogged down by "reticular fibers" during the film's inner ear sequence. I had always wondered about those vents; certainly the mouth-like openings provide the Proteus with an extra measure of personality, but they don't make a great deal of sense, leading as they would into the interior of the boat. This becomes an issue for the modeler; on film the vents go dark, but when viewing the model up close it's quite obvious they're simply shallow indentations that don't lead anywhere. My solution was to create a "grill" out of horizontally ridged styrene (see pix).

Another inconststancy betwee the blueprints and the model/ full scale mock-up involves the "light collar" beneath the navigator's dome. The studio blueprints call for a single neon tube which would have encircled a concave (or is it convex?... I can never remember which is which) collar piece. This approach was subsequently abandoned for a more practical lighting solution, but the blueprints themselves were never amended to reflect this revision. Lunar Models, having based their patterns on the studio prints, wound up with an inaccurate dome collar; it's the wrong shape, and it's thickness causes the dome to sit too high. It's a subtle thing, but a lower, more accurately positioned dome really streamlines the boat and provides a sleeker profile. Fortunately, this is an easy fix for the modeler.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

drewid142 said:


> How'd you do the details on the pilot panels? I love the LITTLE red light effect on top of the center monitor! How'd you make those?


Although my initial plans to light the interior were abandoned for reasons I've already outlined, I decided to go with the next best thing: lights, dials, and compass lenses made from tiny drops of sanding resin mixed, in some cases, with food coloring. This is also a great way to make running lights, as I discovered when finishing my Lubliner Seaview. When those little bits of resin catch the light, they really shine. In fact, a number of people who have seen my Proteus model up close were initially fooled into thinking I wired the interior for lights.


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## starman (Jan 11, 2004)

VERY NICE, I love models with interior details and lighting, yours is a example of fine workmanship. Karl


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

*tell us more*



Carson Dyle said:


> ...tiny drops of sanding resin mixed, in some cases, with food coloring. This is also a great way to make running lights, as I discovered when finishing my Lubliner Seaview. When those little bits of resin catch the light, they really shine.


It looks really great. I'm going to try it! Can you expand a little on it? I'm thinking two things... first... great technique for little details that don't have lighinting as you did... but also... could you run fiber optinc into the back of such little bits?


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I can't see why it would not work. 

Why not try it out on a piece of scrap or sheet plastic as a test? Drill some small holes and run the fibre optic (FOTS) into the hole with just the tip protruding. You could secure the FOTS with cyanoacrylate glue and then apply a drop of sanding resin. 

By the way, where can I get sanding resin?!!! 

Huzz


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## Steve244 (Jul 22, 2001)

But don't use CA to secure the fiber. It makes it brittle.

Flare the end of the fiber using a heat source. Insert the unflared end through the hole. Use the resin to secure it.

Alternatively, dab some white glue on the fiber behind the flare to secure it, and use more colored with food coloring on the surface to add interest. Or use food colouring if you're from Canada.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

And sometimes its "fibre" too!
Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> Where can I get sanding resin?!!!
> 
> Huzz


The actual name of the sanding resin I use is HAPOL 1300-1E. I suspect it's manufactured by any number of companies, but if you have trouble finding it where you live you might consider contacting Hastings Plastics in Santa Monica, CA. They've been around forever, and I'm pretty sure they'll ship anywhere (they may even have a web site).

As for Drew's fibre-optic idea, I'm pretty sure it would work. Hapol cures very fast, very clear, and very hard. The trick is getting the little drops (i.e. "lights") the right size, but that comes with practice.

Another tip for instrument lights: teeny-tiny little rhinestones, the kind available at the more artsy-craftsy hobby shops. The multi-faceted faces render them undesirable as far as running lights are concerned, but they really catch the light. I used them for the heat ray emitter on my still-under-construction Martian War Machine (the shots below are a bit fuzzy, but I think you get the idea).

By the way, I used Hapol to fill the seam between the emitter’s clear vacu-form lens and the resin cobra hood. Once the filled seam has been sanded, polished, and painted, the meld between the two will be completely smooth and uniform.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Thanks Carson! By the way, is that a scratch-built War Machine or a kit? 

Ah - is it the Monsters in Motion kit?!!!

I've got an unfinished Wilco Models Martian War Machine kit on my "to do" list. Its quite nice.

Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> is it the Monsters in Motion kit?!!!
> 
> Huzz


Yeah, it's the M.i.M. kit. A bit expensive, but they did a fantastic job. I'll post a new thread once it's complete.


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## FoxTrot (Jan 27, 2000)

Magnificent finish, awesome Carson....! FT


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

*to quote columbo...*

just one more thing...

so you put the whole smash together, sealed it all up, primed it, painted it and buffed it. Tell us a little about how you masked off the wondows and dome and intakes. It's probably obvious for some but I'm sitting here making my plan of attack on my Lunar Models Proteus and I'm curious.

Damn that thing is sweet!


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## fokkerpilot (Jul 22, 2002)

Carson, that is one heck of a job you've done :thumbsup: . Sharp, clean, and a professional build. Keep up the good work.


Jack :wave:


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## Ralpho (Sep 25, 2002)

Man, I wish I could have gotten such a crisp paint job around the windows. I am in the midst of redoing the Proteus though my New Jersey BB62 and Enterprise aircraft carrier are in my radar sights right now. Here is a link to the pics of my Proteus with lights including a red LED I threw in for effect. Good job on that Proteus. 

http://groups.msn.com/KingRalphsplace/shoebox.msnw?Page=2


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

That's nice!

How did you find the vac-formed kit to build? I'm currentky working on an all resin 1/48 scale Proteus by Wilco. It has a nicely detailed interior too. Some pics of the basic kit over on CultTVMan's hobby shop at:

http://culttvman.net/proteus_from_wilco.html

Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> How did you find the vac-formed kit to build?


As I mentioned earlier (see post #11, this thread), L.M.'s Proteus is a great kit in terms of scale and accuracy, but putting her together took every shred of "kit assembling" skill I possess. If you love the design as much as I do, it's worth the effort -- but make no mistake... it's a serious commitment.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I'm hoping to do a nice job of my Wilco Proteus (maybe I'll post some pics with my new digital camera if someone can tell me how to do that). 

Wilco's Proteus is a great buy for the price seeing as it includes figures and an acceptably accurate and detailed interior. The only glitch with it is the front window section. The upper windows don't sit flat enough, the two outboard upper windows extend back too far towards the stern and there is a very large pronounced lip at the bottom of the lower row of windows. So far, I have undertaken the following fixes:


I've sanded back the pronounced lip at the bottom of the lower windows and beveled the edge back to approximate the angle seen on the bow of the full scale ship. I don't want to use filler to re-sculpt this area because i want to leave the top removable a la Aurora. Easy. 
I've lowered the top windows by cutting the vertical window separations at the top and re-positioning them. Easy. 
I've begun reducing the size of the upper outboard windows by cutting crescent shaped pieces of sheet styrene to insert in the ends of the too large openings. This is proving to be harder than I thought - there are very few good views of the shape of these windows in the movie or on any of the internet reference sites like cloudster. There are good views of the 5 foot filming model's windows; but not of the full scale ship. It does appear to me that these windows were shaped differently on the 5 footer and the full scale mock-up. The windows on the 5 footer have a rounded circular outboard end. the windows on the full scale model look like they were just slightly curved on the outboard ends, and at a slight angle from vertical. The windows on the Lunar model look to be patterned after the full scale Proteus mock-up.
Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

drewid142 said:


> just one more thing...
> 
> so you put the whole smash together, sealed it all up, primed it, painted it and buffed it. Tell us a little about how you masked off the wondows and dome and intakes.


There's no real trick to it... just a lot of time and patience. The windows and intake vents were very carefully masked with a combination of clear frisket film and masking tape. This had to be done twice of course; first for priming, and then again for painting. In both cases I was careful not to leave the tape on too long, and used much caution when removing the mask so as not to streak or "pull" the curing paint. Final masking and finishing were completed during one six hour session. 

One thing that really concerned me while building this model was dust. After the hull halves were glued together, and all through the puttying/ sanding/ finishing stages, I was extremely careful not to let any dust get into the interior (the opening for the pilot's seat was kept sealed with tape at all times).

The dome/ dome collar required no masking, as these parts were added after the finishing stage was already complete.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

The windows on the Lunar model look to be patterned after the full scale Proteus mock-up.
[/list said:


> Huzz


Both model and mock-up were patterned after the same set of drawings; the set builders got it right... the model makers got it mostly right. The main difference between the two is the thickness of the window beams; the full scale version's are thinner and more elegant looking.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Neat Carson. Do those drawings still exist I wonder? And how did you find out something like that? 

Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

By "drawings" I mean the studio blueprints; I've got copies.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

I wish that sci-fi modelers could get just half as organized as ship modelers.

When I was primarily a ship modeler, there were plans services that could get you usable drawings of just about anything. I don't know if it still exists, but Taubman Plans Service had a catalogue loaded with stuff.

These services didn't actually do the drawings themselves. They were basically stores or clearing houses for products that were available from others. I'll post this (non sci-fi) model as an example:

http://groups.msn.com/WorldAccordingtoGair/scratchit.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=14

It's an Algerine class minesweeper. I wanted to build it because this one is named after my home town. You'd look in the plans service catalogue and you could find three different sets of Algerine class drawings from different companies or individuals. Send Mr. Taubman a few bucks, and you'd get your plans in the mail.

I also built a model of the French battleship RICHELIEU using plans purchased from a service. The plans come in 8 huge sheets...and they are in POLISH! But they are very detailed plans.

For sometime now, I've been looking for a good sci-fi subject. My capabilities, in terms of both equipment and experience, have advanced since my ship building days. Just today, I was out buying brass bar stock for my lathe. I can do much more metal work in terms of milling and welding than I could ever have done when I was ship building.

Now, I've got all of this equipement and several years of experience under my belt (plus several years of pizza under my belt...) but finding PLANS and/or DRAWINGS is an incredible chore. Much of the stuff on the net is only borderline useful. Although often detailed, it rarely enlarges to a usable form.

I'd give anything for something like the old Taubman Plans Service ship catalogue: 120 pages with plans for 1,000 ships!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Brent Gair said:


> For sometime now, I've been looking for a good sci-fi subject.... but finding PLANS and/or DRAWINGS is an incredible chore. Much of the stuff on the net is only borderline useful. Although often detailed, it rarely enlarges to a usable form.


I suspect the reason you're having a hard time finding plans or technical drawings for a worthy sci-fi subject is because, in many cases, those drawings never existed to begin with. 

I got lucky with the Proteus; 80% of "Fantastic Voyage" takes place inside, or immediately outside, the Proteus's full scale mock-up -- a rare instance in which the interior of a sci-fi vehicle literally "fits" inside the exterior. Naturally, this required careful planning and coordination on the part of the art directors and construction crew, and as a result, detailed blueprints were produced (I have over 40 sheets for the Proteus alone). On the other hand, media-related sci-fi vehicles have often been produced without the benefit of detailed drawings.


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## Tony Agustin (Nov 25, 1999)

Very nice job on building up that Vac form kit Carson. Great inspiration for those of us who have the same Lunar Models Proteus/interior kits. Last month I finally located a Fantastic Voyage DVD to help me get thru the building process for my own Proteus project. Thanks for posting your pictures.


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## nurturer69 (Sep 4, 2004)

*Proteus's port and starboard circular intakes.*

Carson,

Nice job. I've been working my Proteus on and off for the past year and you're right. To accurize this model takes an awful lot of modeling energy, but the results are worth it. One detail you on your model that you nailed are port and starboard circular intakes just below the side windows. Those are the ones just below the last window with the vertical grid lines. They've got me baffled.

Did you construct those or are they parts from another kit?? Please tell.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Nurturer:

The vents you refer to are, I assume, ballast intakes. Here's whatcha do (or, at least, here's what I did)...

*Purchase a sheet of thin, pre-scribed styrene (or scribe your own).

*Using a hole-punch, cut four discs to be fit into the holes you've drilled in the hull. The sizing of these discs must be EXACT so when inserted into the holes they are, in effect, flush against the hull.

* Spray-paint the four discs black and let dry.

* Lightly sand the discs to remove the black paint on the raised areas; the paint remaining within the scribed areas will leave crisp, clean "vents."

* Insert the vents into the holes on the hull and fasten with glue/ putty on the inside of the hull.

* Using a jeweler’s saw, cut four "rims" from appropriately sized styrene tubing. Sand these rims until they are very, very thin, then carefully glue them into place over the previously inserted vents.

* Carefully mask the vents prior to finishing.

It may sound like a lot of work, but it honestly didn't take that much time. In any case, this detail is one which really stands out on the finished model. If you find an easier way to do it, pass it on!


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

Regarding the vents... I've been planning to do it with custom photo etch parts, emulating the terrific results I saw in his model. I probably won't get my test parts etched until late this fall... I'm working up a big set and I'm busy at work... but when I do I'll be happy to share/sell for little or no "profit"... but Carson's solution sounds pretty swell to me!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Amusing factoid regarding these vents: Not only do they appear on the exterior of the Proteus's full scale mock-up, but they can also be found in the set's interior (if you have the DVD check out the "ventilation ducts" on the port and starboard bulkheads, just above either end of the dashboard). According to the studio blueprints these vents were custom fabricated (not "rummaged" from the local hardware store).

Photo-etched brass parts would be ideal; alas, I was not so ambitious.


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## nurturer69 (Sep 4, 2004)

*Proteus vents*

Thanks for the info. Carson. It will come in handy.

Jusy an FYI to those that are getting ready to paint the Proteus or any model that requires a gloss white. I use Krylon FUSION gloss white. Don't forget, it's the FUSION version of the paint. This stuff is like an airbrush. It sprays out like a forced mist in a fan-like pattern and the result is always uniform and super smooth. Directions read that it dries in about 10 minutes, which it does, but I let it cure for a day. It bonds to the plastic as if it were part of it. I bought mine at the local WalMart for about $3.00.


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## SgtofMarines (Jun 22, 2004)

I usually only care about Trek models, but this is great work. You are a god among modelers... I bow down to superior talent.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Trek Ace said:


> Carson,
> 
> BTW,
> 
> I feel the same way towards Fluke's _Spindrift_. I had the opportunity to see it up close last year, and it looks far better than the original studio model. Ditto with Jim Key's excellent 1/2 scale TOS _Enterprise_.


*Thank you Ace!  

Are going to make it to Sci-Fan the first few days of October? *


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## Guest (Sep 14, 2004)

Hi all
I want to let all the members to know.
That there is going to be an 8" injection plastic model kit of the Proteus.
OK, that is all I can tell you right now !

Chris Lee


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Great News!

But in my view, it will have a hard time competing with the Wilco Proteus. 

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Eight inches! sorry even if it were only 12.00 bucks and more accurate.....

*TOO SMALL!!!!!*


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Yes, and the Wilco is nice!

http://photos.hobbytalk.com/uploads/203/DSC00136-A.JPG










Pardon the tilted tail fin - its just tacked in place. Or maybe its a Venetian version?

Huzz


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## heiki (Aug 8, 1999)

Did anybody have a template for the internal supports that are missing in the Wilco proteus?


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## heiki (Aug 8, 1999)

Chris Lee said:


> Hi all
> I want to let all the members to know.
> That there is going to be an 8" injection plastic model kit of the Proteus.
> OK, that is all I can tell you right now !
> ...


What scale is this suppose to be?


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Heiki - I was just planning to build those supports from 1/8 inch plastic I beam. My idea is to make them so they fit into the Wilco but still look right. You can get the I beam at:

www.oakridgehobbies.com

See "scale structural" on the left hand side of their page.

huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I appreciate the additional comments, guys. Here are a couple of pix featuring the recently completed display stand. The stand itself is a vacuform ceiling sconce I picked up at the hardware store. The hexogonal "miniaturizer" surface was created in Adobe Illustrator, then printed out on a bg HP 5000 printer. A thin disc of clear styrene was trimmed to size and placed over the hexogoal pattern to create a smooth, glossy effect (I've got an extra one of these if anyone is interested).

Got a funny email comment from Dave Merriman re: this model...

"Oh, man! ... you've had your trial-by-fire... if I was teaching a Graduate course in model building I would make the building of the Lunar PROTEUS the make/break project for the final grade.
-- David"

Thanks, Dave. Guess it's time to go for my PHd.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

*I had the same idea!*

Carson!

Lovely! :thumbsup: 

I had a very similar idea! I was considering getting a DVD screen capture of the overhead view of the miniaturizer floor, copying and fitting sections to it to get a suitable representation of the entire miniaturizer, and then printing it as you have done. The only difference is that I was going to sandwich the miniaturizer pattern between two circular glass or high quality plexiglass or lexan plates and have the Proteus sit on the miniaturizer as it does in the opening of the movie.

Don't suppose you still have that miniaturizer Photoshop file lying around?

Huzz


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

I was just made aware that Steve has restocked the Wilco Proteus in his online Hobby Shop! Since I missed out last time, I went _post haste_ and placed my order for one just now!

I have an old Lunar Models vacuuformed kit that I bought about 15 - 16 years ago. But, while I _have_ worked on it in stages now and then, I've been dragging my feet with it because I was afraid I might screw it up ( and this was the _only_ Proteus I had ). But now that I have a solid, resin kit on the way... I'm hoping to work on them both simultaneously and have them both ready for display in relatively short order ( not another 15 years! ).

I'm planning to build 2 dioramas - 1. As a miniaturized Proteus in the human body. and 2. As the full scale Proteus in the CMDF minaturizing room.

Thanx Steve and Sarge!

- GJS

P.S. I would be interested in that photoshop file, too, Carson!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Actually the Wilco Proteus _is_ a full scale model, as seen at about 27 minutes, 44 seconds into the film! :thumbsup: 

Huzz


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Dave Hussey said:


> Actually the Wilco Proteus _is_ a full scale model, as seen at about 27 minutes, 44 seconds into the film! :thumbsup:
> 
> Huzz


You're right, Dave! Boy, did you ever make me feel _small!_









- GJS


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Ha!!

I hope I didn't offend you there Batman, I was only having fun! :wave: By the way, that is a major neat picture you posted. Are there more like it at that skinstotal site?

Huzz


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Dave Hussey said:


> Ha!!
> 
> By the way, that is a major neat picture you posted. Are there more like it at that skinstotal site?
> 
> Huzz


Dunno, Dave. I just found that one while doing a Google search for Fantastic Voyage. I'd never seen that one before and I was looking for a good excuse to post it to the BB.

- GJS

P.S. Have you checked out this website?
http://www.lunadude.com/pet_proj/html/cmdf/cmdf_nav.htm
Be sure to click on 'Technology' and check out the miniaturizing Proteus animation.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Batman - Excellent stuff!!! You don't need any excuse to post it!

I wonder if i can save that animation on my PC! Its quite cool!!

Huzz:thumbsup:


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

The Batman said:


> P.S. Have you checked out this website?
> http://www.lunadude.com/pet_proj/html/cmdf/cmdf_nav.htm
> Be sure to click on 'Technology' and check out the miniaturizing Proteus animation.


That's great. The Lunadude site has been around a while, but it looks like it's in the process of getting a makeover. Hope he adds more stuff in the future.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Thanks Carson!

That Proteus animation is pretty darn cool!

I can't wait to dig into my Wilco kit!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Chris - any news on that styrene Proteus?!!!

Huzz


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

That's amazing news--but who the hell is making it? Captain Cardboard? I can't think of any company other than PL that would be making an injection molded Proteus, but at the moment I can't imagine PL doing one. Must...know...more...


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Yeah, we need info!

News!
News!
News!

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

I don't know....An eight inch long Proteus.....man ...I don't build space ship models smaller than my......  

I did a rough draft of the Wilco Proteus on paper and WOW! *11x6.5 inches is way cool! *


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## Guest (Sep 16, 2004)

I am amazed at the response ?
Wen PL did the 8" Spindrift, you did not hear It is to small.
No, We were so excited.
I would think you all would support the kit?
This is not a joke, we have more to come !

Chris Lee


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Don't get me wrong the more SCI-FI hardware kits the better! and I'm sure the kit would do just fine. 

Except for the Aurora Spindrift was a LONG TERM OUT OF PRODUCTION kit that was going for 300.00 to 500.00 ( unbuilt ) on ebay before PL re-released it and a hair more popular than the Proteus. 

I would love to see what the final sales report was on the PL Spindrift and Snake scene....it would give us a real good idea on how kits like that sale.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Personally, I plan to get me at least one more Spindrift kit. Even if Polar Lights continues to exist in a meaningful way after the RC2 takeover, that kit will go out of production one day, and it is one of my faves!

Chris, I get from your message that you are closely associated with the folks doing the Proteus. Cool! Don't get me wrong - just because I am a big fan of the Wilco does not mean that I would not be interested in a styrene Proteus too! I am sure that whatever details and expected availability dates that you can provide would be eagerly devoured by us folks. 

By the way, in case you don't know, WWW.Cloudster.com has excellent reference photos of the Proteus. 

Huzz


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## Sgt Wilco (Jan 29, 2004)

*Injection Proteus?*

Hi Guys---
Believe it or not (coming from a competitor, even) I'm with Chris on this one--- "What, no rejoicing in the streets?" 
Believe me, if the injection-molded Proteus is available at a reasonable price point I'll buy half a dozen; at least one will be converted into a bath toy 
Seriously, this is great news--- the reason I do stuff in resin in the first place is because there's no styrene kit available!
And Chris, if you're doing market research and taking suggestions, I've got two words for you: MOON BUS.
---Da Sarge


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Did some one say *MOON BUS*?

If so it should be at least 1/48 scale. 


*SIZE DOES MATTER!  *


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Chris - Getting back to that Proteus, will it have an interior? Do you have any pictures? Any other details that you can share with us?

Huzz


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

I better chime in... WOW WOW WOW. I'll buy a couple of those injection molded Protei! That's great news. Yeah, bigger would be better, but a cool little Proteus would be great!!!!!!!!! Tell us more when you can!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Ditto!


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## Steve CultTVman Iverson (Jan 1, 1970)

Chris Lee said:


> Hi all
> I want to let all the members to know.
> That there is going to be an 8" injection plastic model kit of the Proteus.
> OK, that is all I can tell you right now !
> ...


This is one of those "I know something you don't" type of posts. Usually a pile of manure. Please don't make statements like this unless you are able to provide something to back it up.

Thanks
Steve


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## ChrisDoll (Sep 2, 1999)

Chris Lee said:


> I am amazed at the response ?
> Wen PL did the 8" Spindrift, you did not hear It is to small.
> No, We were so excited.
> I would think you all would support the kit?
> ...


Cough up some "Who", "When", and "How"s and maybe I'll consider getting excited.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

A credible "who, when and how", and I WILL get excited!

Huzz


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## Seaview (Feb 18, 2004)

Steve CultTVman Iverson said:


> This is one of those "I know something you don't" type of posts. Usually a pile of manure. Please don't make statements like this unless you are able to provide something to back it up.
> 
> 
> That reminds me; where's that big super-sized PL Captain America re-pop?


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Yeah and while were at it where are those 1/1 scale TOS Star Trek HOTTIE kit line up.....huh?

Is that too much to ask for? :freak:


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

One 1:1 Marta the Orion girl and one full scale Mirror Universe Uhura, please, and I'll be happy.

Captain America is on the way! (That's, er, not a euphemism relating to the above fantasy).

Carson, I'm in awe of your Proteus.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Dreamer is in awe of alot of things.....Airbrushing while not opening the window will do that to a guy :freak:


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

The Batman said:


> I was just made aware that Steve has restocked the Wilco Proteus in his online Hobby Shop! Since I missed out last time, I went _post haste_ and placed my order for one just now!


I posted the above on Tuesday. Guess what just arrived in the mail today ( Friday )???? Yep, my Wilco Proteus! Man, you're fast, Steve! I wasn't going to hold my breath when I ordered this but, I probably could have! I'm surprised and delighted to have it already in my hot little hands!

After hearing so much praise and hype over Wilco's products I've got to admit to being just a little disappointed ( just a _little_, mind you ). 

1. There's actually quite a bit more clean-up that needs to be done on the parts than I expected but, that's not too big of a deal. 

2. I found that the part that forms the window housing was broken in my kit. It's a pretty clean break, though, and should be fairly easy to cement together. 

3. The only other actual _gripe_ that I have concerns the bad casting of the interior peice. The portal door on the rear wall is malformed. I'm going to try using an X-acto blade to scrape away the excess resin and re-scribe the outline of the door. If this fails, I suppose I'll have to sand the wall smooth and and make a whole new door from sheet styrene.

I'm not too pleased about that but, I suppose it's not beyond my abilities to correct. It just presents an annoying set-back.

Overall, the kit is *impressive!* And so very *BIG!* Of course we all know that the upper row of windows is angled incorrectly but, IMHO the error is so negligible that I don't think I'll even bother trying to correct it. The plusses of having this beautiful kit far out-weighs the minuses! I'm *very enthused!*

- GJS


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Batman - if the glitches with your kit prove too much work, I'd sugest that you give Sarge a call or an email. He stands behind his products and I am certain that he will be eager to help you out!

By the way,in one of my last posts here I hava a pic of the front windows in the process of being re-aligned. Its not that much work and makes a nice model even nicer.
Huzz


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Dave Hussey said:


> in one of my last posts here I hava a pic of the front windows in the process of being re-aligned. Its not that much work and makes a nice model even nicer.
> Huzz


I've been looking it over.... After I get my _real _problems corrected, I may consider doing the windows, too. Keep posting those nice pics, Dave!

- GJS


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Okay, I couldn't resist the simplicity of the correction technique. I'm in the process of re-aligning my upper row of windows, too.

- GJS


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Cool!!

I'll post some pics of mine tonight!

Huzz


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## Sgt Wilco (Jan 29, 2004)

Hello Batman---
Check your PM's; If you need a new interior tub it'll be in the mail in a couple of days...
---Da Sarge


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

*Proteus in progress pics*

Hi Batman!

Here are a couple of in-progress pics of my Proteus that compares it to one that I haven't made any modifications to.

I have trimmed down the ring on the navigation bubble too.

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Good work do so far Dave!! :thumbsup:


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Looking good! The mods do that little extra something to make it more movie like in appearance.


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Yes, those pics do look good! One of these days I gotta get me a digital camera!

- GJS


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## Prince of Styrene II (Feb 28, 2000)

Excellent job on the build up! Looks like she's fresh from the factory! I am very impresed!



Carson Dyle said:


> The studio blueprints call for a single neon tube which would have encircled a concave (or is it convex?... I can never remember which is which) collar piece.


Concave- think of the last half of the word... "cave". Caves go into a mountain/hill. Convex is protruding outward- a bubble.



fluke said:


> Here is what I did with my 1/35 Lunar SPINDRIFT


Fluke, I never get tired of looking at your Spindrift.

uhhh... waitaminute... that came out wrong...


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

Dave, one question (since I'm interested in doing these modifications myself)--since you added those crescent pieces to correct the shape of the upper windows at the rear, what are you going to do about adding the actual clear window material at that point? It looks like the crescent sweeps up to the upper level of the hull but the corrected window struts now lead lower because of the way you've extended that support underneath the dome structure.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Ah ha! Someone is paying attention!

I initially thought about just fitting the windows into place as best I could. The window would contact the outboard window's corrected inboard strut and just fit under the crescent shaped insert. 

However, I think a better approach is to attach a "lip" just behind the edge of each crescent piece. The lip would start at around the end of the strip of sheet plastic that you can see in the pics and is used to attach the ends of the lowered window struts. The lip would run just inside the crescent shaped pieces and parallel to that curve. The lip would taper away as it approaches the bottom of the crescent. If you look at WWW.Cloudster.com, that is actually the way the real model did it, although its done very subtley. See:

http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/Proteus/proteusmod04.jpg

And on the full scale mock-up:

http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/Proteus/proteus32.jpg

Note that those outboard windows are a different shape in the 5 foot filming model and the full scale mock-up. They are rounder on the 5 footer but squarer on the full scale mock-up. I based mine on the full scale mock-up.

Huzz


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Carson,

If you're still out there, I have a question. Forgive me if you've already answered this. I'm wondering about your color choices - they look spot on to me - just what colors did you use for your interior and exterior of the Proteus? Is that exterior matte or satin finish?

- GJS


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

You're absolutely right--looks like that's what I'm gonna have to do...


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

The Batman said:


> Carson,
> 
> If you're still out there, I have a question. Forgive me if you've already answered this. I'm wondering about your color choices - they look spot on to me - just what colors did you use for your interior and exterior of the Proteus? Is that exterior matte or satin finish?
> 
> - GJS


It's quite a mixed bag; I'll start with the interior...

The deck is Testor's intermediate blue. The dash and central kiosk work surfaces are Tamiya intermediate blue (which has a lighter, bluer value than the Testors version). The kiosk and airlock drum are Tamiya Medium Sea Grey. The support braces are Testor's Lt. Sea Grey. The bulkhead walls are a combination of Testors Lt. Sea Grey and Testor's Dark Sea Grey. The face of the chart table is Testors flat aluminum. The finished interior was lightly weathered with various shades of grey pastel, and a light wash was used here and there to bring out surface detail. 

The exterior is Tamiya Pure White, straight out of the can, polished to a glossy finish with Micro-mark finishing abrasives. A glassy white hull was very important to me, and while the effect is really dramatic in person I've found it very hard to capture the gleam via digital pix. You just have to trust me -- it's neither flat nor satin!

It should be noted that none of these colors are, so far as I know, "accurate." Your guess is as good as mine as to what shades were actually used by the Fox Art Dept. I simply went with what I thought looked right based on available reference -- i.e. the DVD and a couble of lobby cards.


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## The Batman (Mar 21, 2000)

Carson Dyle said:


> It should be noted that none of these colors are, so far as I know, "accurate." Your guess is as good as mine as to what shades were actually used by the Fox Art Dept. I simply went with what I thought looked right based on available reference -- i.e. the DVD and a couble of lobby cards.


I hear you, Carson. I have a full screen version and a wide screen version on VHS and I can't really pinpoint what the actual colors are supposed to be. Your color choices look very good together. I figured that following your color selections would be a lot more satisfying than trying by trial and error to come up with my own. It'll save me a lot of frustration.

Thanx!
- GJS


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Grey in particular is a very tricky value to capture given its chameleon-like reaction to varying lighting conditions. Trying to nail down a specific hue is a fool's errand IMO -- unless of course one is willing to play archeologist and track down the original model builders, paint chips, etc. Even then the results are likely to be unsatisfactory given the differences between how a model looks in person and how it appears after having been photographed against a blue screen.

One thing we can all agree on: the exterior of the Proteus is gloss white.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I guess the best place to see accurate interior colors is at the beginning of the movie before the Proteus is "injected". Once inside Benes, the interior surfaces reflect the lava lamp colors of the circulatory system sets.

Huzz


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## nurturer69 (Sep 4, 2004)

*Photos*

Carson,

More Proteus photos, please . . .


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I'm running out of fresh angles here guys...

Given the imminent closure of this forum, and the continued interest in this subject (what with the Wilco kit and all), I suppose it's time to start a "Proteus" thread at the new TVCM forum...


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

One of the entire top outboard window would be nice!! Either side will do!
Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

As this site is shutting down, I've posted a link to additional pix of this model at the new TVCM forum (see the "Wilco - Lunar Proteus!" thread). Or, simply click on the link below...

http://www.ofoto.com/BrowsePhotos.jsp?&collid=20502091406&page=1&sort_order=0


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Carson Dyle said:


> As this site is shutting down . . .


Huh?  :freak:


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Nevermind


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

never more...said the raven.

*Hows the Proteus comming along Carson? *


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Well, seeing as this place is still open but under new management, how are those resin Proteusseseses coming along?

I've been making my own internal support structures out of 1/8 ABS I-beam. Y'know, the ones that support the front windows and attach to the chart rack and also appear at the sides of the diver's chamber. I've been attempting to make them look like the ones in the movie by drilling out the flanges of the I-Beam with a series of 1/16 inch holes and carefully trimming away the excess material. So far, they look pretty good.

Huzz


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

^^Cool!


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

fluke said:


> never more...said the raven.
> 
> *Hows the Proteus comming along Carson? *


The finished model can be viewed at...

http://www.ofoto.com/BrowsePhotos.jsp?&collid=20502091406&page=1&sort_order=0


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## heiki (Aug 8, 1999)

Carson Dyle said:


> The finished model can be viewed at...
> 
> http://www.ofoto.com/BrowsePhotos.jsp?&collid=20502091406&page=1&sort_order=0


How does one view the resin one? I see the Lunar one but not a wilco.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

The Lunar version is the only Proteus I've posted pix of.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Heiki - I still have the pics I took a while back of my resin Wilco Proteus. I'll re-post them later today so you can take a look.

Huzz


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Here are some.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

And:


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

The Proteus on the right is "out of the box" and the one on the left I have slightly modified to make the top windows a bit closer to the way they look in the movie. the navigation ring is also trimmed down a bit too so the edges are not so thick.

For size reference I suppose I should have a picture with a model you may already have. But in lieu of that I can tell you that the Wilco Proteus is about 50% bigger than the Polar Lights Spindrift.

Huzz


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

And pardon the drooping vertical stabilizer fin on the left Proteus. I had held the fin in place with masking tape but it kept slipping.

Huzz


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## nurturer69 (Sep 4, 2004)

*Polishing the Proteus*

Carson,

In the thread you mentioned that you used fine finishing sandpapers to get the polished surface effect. Did you use any kind of polishing compound along with the sanding to get that polished finish? And what grit did you use? And if there wasn't a polishing compound, did you sand wet or dry?

I tried sanding with 1200 and all I got was this flat look. Maybe I need to apply more muscle and time . . . what do you think?


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

nurturer69 said:


> In the thread you mentioned that you used fine finishing sandpapers to get the polished surface effect. Did you use any kind of polishing compound along with the sanding to get that polished finish? And what grit did you use? And if there wasn't a polishing compound, did you sand wet or dry?
> 
> I tried sanding with 1200 and all I got was this flat look. Maybe I need to apply more muscle and time . . . what do you think?


1200 is far too coarse a grit to use as a polishing surface. Depending on how smooth your finish is you probably want to start with either 3200 or 3600 and work your way up. 

The polishing system I use (micro-mark) advances like so: 3200, 3600, 4000, 6000, 8000 and 12000. After the model's surface has been thoroughly wet-polished by each successive abrasive a liquid polish (applied via soft flannel cloth) may then used to achieve the smoothest, brightest possible finish.

I know it sounds like a lot of work -- and it is -- but the results are well worth it. The Proteus in particular really benefits from a glossy finish; I cannot over-emphasize what a difference a shiney "new car" gleam makes when viewing this subject in person. I used the same technique to achieve similar results on my Lunar Models Spindrift, Lubliner Seaview and Fantastic Voyage Voyager. Having just recieved my Rick Tesky 24" Flying Sub in the mail I plan on giving it the same treatment.

There's just something about these 60's ships that lends itself to a bright shiney finish.


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## nurturer69 (Sep 4, 2004)

*Polishing the Proteus*

I take it you used water applied to the model to wet-polish with the Micro-Mark abrasives? Did you buy the abrasives from the Micro-Mark website and lastly, what type of liquid polish did you use to finalize the polishing process?

This will be my first attempt at polishing a model for a high-gloss eefect, so of course, I wouldn't want to mess it up. 

Thanks again Carson.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Yeah, I used water with the polishing abrasives.

Contrary to my earlier post, I used the Detail Master polishing system (not Micro-Mark), which I ordered directly from the D.M. website. For about $17.00 you can get a "variety pack" of abrasives ranging from 3200 to 12000 grit.

I used the Novus 3-part (liquid) polishing system to complete the finish, which I also purchased online via the Micro-mark website.

The main thing to remember when using polishing grits is to lay down enough paint on the model so you don't end up "striking primer" (my Proteus required three complete wet coats). 

If this is your first time using a polishing system you might want to consider practicing on a spare model or piece of scrap styrene. It's really pretty basic once you get the hang of it.


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## nurturer69 (Sep 4, 2004)

*Polishing Proteus*

Thanks for the tips.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Hey Huzz! Hows your Wilco Protues comming along?

I just started a new job recently so I still have not started mine yet.

Are you going to use the Wilco interior tub or make your own walls and floor?

Wilco did a great job on this kit but it will be very tough to clean up some of the rougher parts so it seems easier to make it out of sheet styrene, copy whats already there and make some corrections if needed?

I havn't had time to really look or compare so In your opinion how accurate are the side and rear bulkhead wall details on the Wilco kit?

I'm thinking with my walls I will build them at the right angle and touch the cieling so there are no awkward seems or fuss when joining the top part to the main body.

Lets see sum pics on those beams... sounds like a good idea! :thumbsup:


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

hi fluke, i am typing with one hand right now whille the other keeps my little fellow from adding his own touch to this note - hes only two! upper case with one hand is hard.

i'm using the wilco tub. mine had no warping. if yoy use the wilco, remember to trim the height of the walls so the cabin roof sits right down on the upper hull. i also trimmed mine where the dash sits so the dash will sit flush with the bow and not lift the windows up.

i'll try to post some pics tonight of the support beams. maybe even with upper case characters!!!

evan - don't staple my shirt!!!!!

help!!!!!!!!!

huzz


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Mom to the rescue!

Hi again Fluke.  I think the interior of the Wilco is reasonably accurate. Looking at Cloudster, the various panels seem to be in about the right places and look to have the right number of dials and doodads. I think there may be a corner in the side of the cabin walls that does not appear in the Wilco but I'll have to watch the movie to say for sure - the Cloudster pics don't show that area well. 

Agent Grant's radio station is also okay, but you could add the equipment details that attach to the structure above and to the right of the radio station. Cloudster has no pics at all of Ms. Peterson's station, so I may scratch build a few things to put there.

Huzz :thumbsup:


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Thanks Huzz,

It may already have or its close to SNAP KIT time for Evan...My oldest daughter entered her first model in a contest at 2 1/2 yrs old! ...it was the Lindburg snap Godzilla kit both my daughters enter every year at the local HobbyTown and Galaxy kidz contests! They have lots of fun....but they are 10 and 8 now and starting to loose some interest ...but thats ok.

My Wilco tub is straight but the rear door and the side walls have some issues, I have seen others have the same problem....I think that Bill has already cleaned up the molds since then but its not worth asking for a replacement because I want to make my own anyways, in fact there were some bits of blue mold material on a few places on my Protues....I remember thinking "Boy the kit after mine isn't going to look so hot" 

Good luck and run like hell when Evan gets a hold of your No 11 blade!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

*Some progress pics*

Hi Fluke! Here are a couple of progress pics. It still looks _real_ rough because some clean up is needed and most of the assembly is held together together with masking tape, except the support struts that I've fabricated.

I trimed the walls of the cabin tub to be flush with the hull of the Proteus. That lets the cabin roof sit down nicely on the hull. I also trimmed the forward walls where the dash sits so the dash is flush with the bow. This lets the front windows sit down nicely on the bow. Otherwise, the dash will lift the front window frame up off the bow.

I discovered a pleasant surprise when I laid the cabin roof/window piece in place over the taped together interior, now featuring my new support struts. Without them, the roof would easily slide off the model. But with them, they are held in place at both sides at the front and back by the new suport struts. The only way to get the roof to slide off is to tip the model forward; addition of a small tab at the rear cabin wall will stop that too. This of course is only of interest if you are planning to leave the roof removable in the Aurora style.

Sorry that the last pic is blurred; I'm still getting use to the macro feature on the digital camera and evidently I haven't yet mastered it!!

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Looks very cool! :thumbsup: 

Keep us updated!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I spent some time last night putting the three ladder rungs on the port side of the diver's chamber. Those are the ones that Dr. Michaels uses when he tries to escape from the top hatch of the sub in a fit of claustrophobia just after being miniaturized and the sub first submerges. You can see them here:

http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/Proteus/proteus11.jpg

I also added a grab handle to the diver's chamber door. Captain Owens has his left hand on it in this pic ( I'll bet he was thinking of placing its somewhere else):

http://www.cloudster.com/Sets&Vehicles/Proteus/proteus33.jpg

And I used some filler to close up the gap between the dash and the hull. I had to address that because it would be visible on my model because the roof will be removable.

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Thanks Huzz, Always a big help!

The two foward seats hide in those compartments but what about the two seats on each side of the communications and map chart....do they just stay in place or what?

What made you decide to make your top removable.....is it that classsic Aurora thing?


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Grant and Cora's seats were mounted to the deck in a stationary position.

I scratch-built these seats for my Lunar Proteus, but they were difficult to research. For some reason they do not appear in any of the (40+) sheets of studio blueprints I've got, and they're obscured by clapper-boards in the continuity shots posted on Phil Broad's site. 

One of the (unoccupied) seats is fleetingly glimpsed in the film; if you have the DVD, check out the shot near the climax in which Grant re-enters the sub through the breeched hull (the one in which he helps Captain Owens to his feet)...


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> i am typing with one hand right now whille the other keeps my little fellow from adding his own touch to this note - hes only two! evan - don't staple my shirt!!!!!


Go for it, Evan! 

Of all the quotes on this thread, that's my favorite. 

Hang in there, Dave; as the father of a four year-old (with a 2nd due on Christmas day) I'm feeling your pain. Which is to say, I'm feeling your joy.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Thank you carson! I will take a closer look. :thumbsup:


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Dave Hussey said:


> I've been making my own internal support structures out of 1/8 ABS I-beam....Huzz


Huzz,

What brand of ABS beam are you using?


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Hi Guys!

Carson, its incredible how a hug from my two year old can make my day! I think you are going to have a very merry and busy Christmas - great stuff!! I am in the Cheerios phase right now. Evan practically lives on the things. His car seat and the entire back seat of the car are generally peppered with the things at all times!

Fluke, I'll check on those I-Beams for you tonight when I get home. I am pretty certain that they are the same ones that you can get on-line at http://www.oakridgehobbies.com/g_scale/g_63.html. But I will check!

I decided to make the roof removable for a couple of reasons. First, yes it was the Aurora thing. I like to be able to see the interior detail and Wilco has done an admirable job of that with this kit. Second, if I glued the roof on, that would necessitate taping the windows during painting. That looks like quite a daunting task and I was also worried about dislodging one of the windows during that process. That would result in disaster; how would I, working from the outside of the model, retrieve the window and reinstall it on the inside of the window frame with the roof glued in place? Its a whole lot easier to leave the roof removable, paint it, then install the windows. No taping, no worry!

That raises another question - what is the best, most secure way to attach the windows? 

Huzz


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> That raises another question - what is the best, most secure way to attach the windows?


Rivets.

Seriously, are the windows individual panes or do larger segments cover several openings?

If the former, I'd be tempted to use moderate amounts of epoxy putty along the frames being careful to wipe the clear portions clean with alcohol at every step of the way.

If the latter, I'd use frames behind the clear parts and attach them securely top and bottom with epoxy putty. Anything else I can think of will either fog the clear parts or will be too insecure in such a situation (Elmer's for instance).


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

The Perfessor is on the money :thumbsup: 

CLEAR PARTS and WINDOWS......ARGH!!!!
It doesn't have to be that scary. 

In some cases where there is room I have locked 
clear parts in place by means of adding pieces of 
plastic strips on the sides....depending on the thickness 
of clear sheet... create a strip of thick plastic that is L 
shaped ( for lack of better words ) and thin out one side 
of the part for the depth of the clear sheet and 
'lock' it into place.

The other way I like to adhere clear parts is to use small
amounts of five minute epoxy.

On the proteus I may consider using a 'one piece' window 
and simply lock it into place from the sides.

I have never used canopy or 'white' glue because the idea 
that clear parts could be pushed in from a slight mis handle 
has always creeped me out 


For painting and masking issues?

I hate masking clear parts and avoid it *IF * I can so I Paint the 
exterior areas first - Install the clear parts and continue with 
the assembly, then later mask off the whole window area and 
blend the exterior paint where I left off, if done carefully it looks GREAT!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Sarge has provided a sheet of clear window stock from which one must cut the windows. 

That could be done three ways:

either as individual window panes; or
as a strip for the top row of windows and another strip for the bottom row of windows; or
as four columns of windows.
Huzz


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Fluke / Troy - I like those ideas!!!

Huzz


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

Fluke has some great ideas. 

If you were to use my epoxy putty idea, you'd either have to paint hull color or use plastic strips around the edges of the clear plastic to ensure that the epoxy color doesn't show.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Yeah, the windows are tricky. I used 5-min. apoxy to secure them to the canopy frame, then reinforced the assembly from within with a scratch-built bulkhead (see pix at post #11 of this thread). 

By sandwiching the windows between the two frames I was afforded an extra measure of support when it came time to mask the panes for painting. This approach has the added advantage of providing the interior with a greater sense of depth when viewed through the windows.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Fluke, Perfessor and Carson - these are all great suggestions! 

I had been worried about how I would address the windows but with your suggestions I think I can tackle it.

Thanks!
Huzz

PS, don't forget to tune in the upcoming Simpsons Fantastic Voyage spoof episode.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

*I-Beams*

Yo Fluke!

The I-beams that I used are Plastruct 90023 1/8 inch (3.2mm) ABS I-Beams. they also make a 1/48 scale ladder section.

If you have a Polar Lights Jupiter II kit (who doesn't?), I believe that Plastruct also makes a circular ladder cage that you could adapt for that kit's elevator cage.

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

*Thanks Huzz! * :thumbsup:


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

*Pictures Needed!!!*

Okay Fluke, its time for some pictures!!! :wave: 

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Funny you say that.....

You want NUTZ!?....you want CRAZY!? :freak: 

Here take a look!

I wasn't happy with the way the upper windows looked....even with Daves great correction idea They look as if they need to be a lower profile...almost like a 'green house' effect. So I'm going to build it all back up from scratch.
The other steps needed to correct this is to put that 'center' section out towards the front a hair more and that will also make the lower windows at steeper slant as well. I have spent hours at the Vault and watching the DVD and thats what I have come up with. ( I can use some input at this point )  

The Wilco kit also needs the two engine 'bulges' that go down the length of the body top and bottom look more ROUND than flat, The main intakes in the lower front need to be taller and the bottom portion of the side intakes needs to be fatter and lower.

Yep that is a reflection of the parts you see....I find that a 1/8th inch piece of glass painted black on the underside gives me a straight and smooth serface to work on.....when it gets to rough from cutting or what ever...I clean off the piant, turn it over and presto! a new working surface! works nice for photo etch parts as well!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

All that work on the front windows is quite an ambitious project! So far, my modifications to the windows are 98% complete, just a bit of finish sanding left. It really makes the thing look more like how the Proteus appears in the movie. Don't forget to post pictures so I can see how its coming!

I wasn't too fussed with the shape of the two bow intakes at the front of the sub, but I'll have to take another look to see if I missed something that can easily be addressed. I had contemplated sharpening the profile of the lower bow but I decided against that. Maybe I'll do that too. The nice thing about solid resin is that you can keep trimming back parts like that.

I agree that the lower part of the side intakes (by the front diving planes) should be deeper. I assume that this consists of an engine/ intake cowl and the rest is an exhaust pipe which runs from the engine cowl to the rear exhausts along the edge of the ship. Perhaps adding a piece or two of sheet styrene to the bottom of the engine cowl would give a better look. I didn't think the exhaust pipe section was too bad though. 

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Sounds about right.

The other reason I did all that was because the lines and the clean up of all the window rails ( for lack of better words ) would have been difficult as well.

I'll try to update my progress as I go.


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## Johnnyb1 (Oct 14, 2004)

very nice! I just finished my LM Proteus a couple of months ago and need to start on my LM Spindrift. It's nice having a brother who worked closley with Lunar Models, as I got most of my kits for free. I also just finished The Voyager from the animated series. Nice kit now that it's done but the casting was terrible.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

I know what you mean John!

A pal of mine has that kit and BOY! what a mess.....That was the bad thing about older and newer? Lunar kits....you paid tones, waited for ever to get a kit that was packed too loosely and talk about bad casting! The kits were fine but no time was taken to see if the kits molds were up to par or if the kits castings were ok.....its almost like they just did everything as fast as they could and shipped it.

I'm glad I always got my Lunar kits on Ebay or from friends.

*Wilco * 'can' be the very next BIG and Awesome Garage kit maker if they watch their molds and pack the kits nicely so what you do get isn't all broken up by the time it arrives! They alraedy have GREAT customer service, very interesting kits and not to mention VERY NICE PRICES!! :thumbsup:


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

John,

Here is my 1/35 Lunar SPINDRIFT ( in case you hav't seen it ) I would be glad to help you with yours! 

http://troysmodels.homestead.com/SPINDRIFT.html


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## Johnnyb1 (Oct 14, 2004)

Very nice work. I'll take you up on the help in a couple of weeks. I need to finish my Deboer Enterprise. Most of the painting is done I just need to get started on the lighting.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Fluke - was your Proteus damaged in shipping?

My last order from Sarge was a box containing two Proteus kits and a Cosmostrator. If you look at the map, you will see that from Abilene Texas to St. John's Newfoundland is quite a long trip. I am at the extreme eastern tip of North America. You can't go any further east without landing in England. My kits arrived quickly and completely undamaged.

Huzz


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Nope....my proteus arrived just fine!

BUT....I did supply Bill with a return box and packing stuff cuz I sent him a model.

My Wilco EVA pods had some minor damage due to lack of 'packing fluff' or loose parts. but hey....I guy can only do so much when he works full time ...punches out kits on demand and charges very FARE PRICES!!

*Wilco still ROCKS over Lunar any day!! * :thumbsup:


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

fluke said:


> Wilco still ROCKS over Lunar any day!!


Kudos to Wilco for producing a quality product and making it available at a fair price.

Having said that... if your goal is to build the best, most accurate Proteus miniature available, the Lunar Models kit simply cannot be beat -- unless of course you plan to start from scratch, and even then you'd be hard pressed to top Lunar's product in terms of accuracy. No disrespect to The Sarge, but Mike Evens and the former Lunar Models team should be applauded for getting it as right as they did. Sure Lunar had (has) its share of quality control issues, but that's something you're subject to run into with any garage kit manufacturer. It's not like these guys are getting rich off this stuff.

Bottom line: Lunar had the studio blueprints as a reference point. Wilco clearly did not, and it shows. Fluke, considering the excellent example set by your own Lunar Models Spindrift, I'm surprised you don't hold their efforts in higher regard.


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Carson ....you got me there Pal! 

Yes I will say that Lunar did some GREAT kits when no one else did or would and yes not 'verything' Lunar did was bad and yep! the Wilco Proteus is not 100% accurate.
I stand corrected and humbled.

Funny you mention *Mike Evans*....check this out! 

*Hi, Troy! I just stumbled onto your "LOTG Spindrift" model while surfing modeling sites and was very impressed, indeed! My name is Peter Chelemedos, from Santa Cruz, CA. I am the person who ORIGINALLY pencilled the Lunar Models "Spindrift Interior Kit " instructions for Mike Evans waaaaaay back in 1991! The reason I took that assignment was because the original drawings by Jim Kreegar were barely legible pencilling and I arraigned with Mike Evans to do the "cleaned up" drawings, which were then sold with the kit. Needless to say, during that project I became TOO familiar with dear old "Spindrift". I also had the privilege of picking Gary Conway's memory while working on that project. My drawings were somewhat crude ( I hadn't gone on to ACAD yet ), and I suspect that they've since been re-drawn ( at least I HOPE they have! ). Now for my reason for this e-mail; I LIKE YOUR SPINDRIFT BETTER THAN I DO JIM KEY'S PROTOTYPE! EXCELLENT WORK!!!!! My best regards, Peter*


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

First of all, it seems to me that the three of us Carson, Fluke and I) are huge Proteus fans. Let's start a fan club!! I think that Carson's Proteus is simply magnificent. In fact, I have referred to pictures of it just as much as the pictures on Cloudster. 

I've been aware of the Lunar model for a number of years now but I haven't bought one and that is for two main reasons. First, its fairly expensive at about $250 for the exterior and interior kits. Second, I have no experience with vac forming, there is very little information on that type of kit, and my inquiries on what its like to work with have been met with undetailed responses like "its very difficult". I would just hate to spend all that money and screw it up. If Lunar's kity had been resin, I'm sure I would have bought it regardless of the price but vac formed was too scary for me.

The Wilco on the other hand, offers excellent pricing at about 1/6 of the Lunar and is easy to build. It includes an interior and figures. Out of the box its a very nice representation of the Proteus even if it isn't 100% accurate. And with a bit of fairly easy extra work, it can be made to look much more accurate. I'm pretty certain that Sarge is open to suggestions from the fans to improve his kit too.

Overall, I think if you want a very nice Proteus that can be easily accurized, go with the Wilco. If you want the most accurate kit and you don't mind the cost and all the extra work, get the Lunar. I may buy one one day, but for now I'm delighted with my Wilco.

Huzz


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Dave Hussey said:


> Second, I have no experience with vac forming, there is very little information on that type of kit, and my inquiries on what its like to work with have been met with undetailed responses like "its very difficult".
> Huzz


One thing you have to understand about doing a vacuform kit: it's very difficult .

No really...it isn't.

I have done two large vacuform kits. Both of them are Radio Controlled ship models. The first one is the HAPPY HUNTER which is 40" long. The entire hull is vacuformed and it's quite impressive. The remaining parts are a mixture of sheet plastic and more vacuforming. In fact, this particular ship is formed in ABS.

The second ship is the WEISEL (a German patrol boat). It has a complete 42" long vacuformed hull as well as having virtually all of the superstructure pieces vacuformed.

Both kits cost several hundred bucks and they were my first attempts at full vacuform kits...and this was just before I started acquiring tools so I had little more than a razor saw and an exacto knife. Both turned out very nice. In fact, I'd say they were more than nice. I still have them and they are in excellent shape even after years of operation.

There is nothing inherently difficult about vacuform. It just requires a bit more thought and planning. For one thing, the parts will require careful trimming and many parts may have to be cut free from a sheet. That means you have to pay attention to trim and cut lines so that you only cut the excess and not the part itself. The other challenge is that the parts are more flexible so you must plan the build so as not to build in any warps.

That being said, the construction process is not especially different than a normal styrene model. You have to use care in aligning parts because they won't come with pins. But, when you get right down to it, it's still a big plastic model that is glued together. And, 95% of the time, normal plastic cement does the trick (even my ABS molded HAPPY HUNTER was assemble with Testor's Liquid Cement...the red stuff is ABS compatible). On my ships, I also epoxied in some wooden support structures where necessary.

So I think you will find that vacuform isn't half as daunting as you might have thought. It's the kind of thing where you might be a little nervous when you first see the parts in the box...but then you look at if for awhile and say, "Now I get it!"


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## fluke (Feb 27, 2001)

Brent is right, vacuform kits can be just as straight foward as styrene kits.

The earlier vauform kits were some times made of very THIN material and lacked much detail...I saw only just a few and that was enough to scare me away!

The Spindrift was my first vac kit and did not have much problems at all...I did add thicker plastic to the places where the kit was going to be glued to something or where the shell halves met, some magic sculpt came to play as well, plus the Spindrifts plastic was pretty thick and that helped a lot.

All in all I would say that any modeler with good skills should be able to build a vac kit with no problems.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Thanks guys.

So, in the case of the Lunar Models Proteus, how thick are the hull sections in comparison to say, the plastic used in the hull of the Polar Lights Spindrift? I'm familiar with the PL Spindrift so it serves as a good point of reference.

I had heard that there were some significanty quality and fit issues with Lunar Models' Proteus Interior kit. Does anyone know if that is still the case or have the problems been fixed?

Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> Thanks guys.
> 
> So, in the case of the Lunar Models Proteus, how thick are the hull sections in comparison to say, the plastic used in the hull of the Polar Lights Spindrift?...
> 
> I had heard that there were some significanty quality and fit issues with Lunar Models' Proteus Interior kit. Does anyone know if that is still the case or have the problems been fixed?


Lunar's Proteus hull sections are significantly thicker than those of the P.L. Spindrift, which is a good thing given the larger scale of the former.

I have to say I'm mystified by the rampant vacu-phobia I've encountered on this site. I actually prefer working with styrene to resin; if Lunar's infamous "Fantastic Voyage" Voyager had been molded in vac-styrene instead of resin it would have been a MUCH easier kit to build. What makes Lunar's kits challenging is not the fact that they contain vacuform parts; it's that the builder is required to seamlessly meld together pieces -- both resin and vacuform -- which for various reasons don't always want to meld together. This is why God invented sandpaper, putty, and super-glue. 

As for the Proteus interior, the problem isn't poorly fitting parts so much as poorly realized detail. There's a sloppy, slap-dash feel to the pieces, which perhaps isn’t surprising considering it was the last kit Mike Evans's L.M. team produced before the sale of the company back in the early 90's. Fortunately, with the exception of the crewmembers, there is NOTHING contained in the Proteus's interior that cannot be scratch-built by even the most modestly skilled "kit assembler."

Huzz, I hear what you're saying about the cost of Lunar's kits, but if you're as big a Proteus fan as you say you are then you owe it to yourself to make the leap. Sure building Lunar's Proteus will be a challenge, and sure it will take time... but so what? Being challenged is a good thing, and anyway, what's your hurry? 

If nothing else you'll overcome your fear of vacuform styrene.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

*Thanks Guys!!!*

Now this is getting interesting! And fun!!

First, I'd say that my admitted vacu-fear wasn't irrational; rather it was the result of simply no information. Fear of the unknown; conversely knowledge is power!! *I have to thank you Carson, and Brent and Fluke for providing solid useful information on this topic*. I have been asking about vac-formed kits from time to time since I joined up here in 1998. This is the first useful data I have gotten in six years! 

So, if I understand you correctly, the vac formed Lunar Proteus is made from fairly thick STYRENE, the same stuff that a regular old Polar Lights kit is made of? Like, you could use plain old tube glue on it? I had been under the impression that the plastic was really light and very flimsy, so you can see why I had concerns.

You mention that the real difficulty with the kit was seamlessly blending resin and vacformed parts. I actually have a bit of experience that may be useful with that, gained when I stuck the Rebellion Creations resin bow on my styrene Polar Lights Seaview a few months back. That required about a dozen and a half fill and wet-sand cycles. Using a filler technique that Brent told me about.

Wow! Maybe I'll get me a Lunar Proteus soon too! 

I will still have one remaining vacu-fear though: every weekend when "D'Wife" points to the Electrolux and says "vacuum the house dear!" 

Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> So, if I understand you correctly, the vac formed Lunar Proteus is made from fairly thick STYRENE, the same stuff that a regular old Polar Lights kit is made of? Like, you could use plain old tube glue on it? I had been under the impression that the plastic was really light and very flimsy


Lunar's Proteus is made of the same stuff Polar Lights kits are made of... and the same stuff Aurora's kits are made of... and the same stuff Revell's kits are made of... and Monogram's, and... well, you get the idea. The main difference is the thickness, and the fact that (as someone mentioned above) you will occasionally be required to cut the vac parts out of the styrene sheet in which they've been formed. If you haven't already done so, invest in a pair of tin-snips. A set of sanding rasps and files will also come in handy to smooth & shape the cut edges. And if you really want to get fancy you might consider spending $15.00 for an electric X-acto blade (the type with a heating element), which is a great tool for cutting through thicker grades of styrene.

Your impression of vacu-form styrene models as being "light and flimsy" may derive from the infamous S.F.M.A. kits available in the late 70's/ early 80's. These simple little vac-styrene kits pre-date Lunar Models, and were very thin-skinned indeed. Fortunately, in my experience, Lunar's styrene parts are quite thick and sturdy.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

I strongly suspect a lot of the vacuphobia originates with model airplane builders who would build small scale vacuform models many years ago.

I can remember vacuform model planes from 35 years ago. This was an era when 1/72 was still dominant an models were much smaller. I attempted a couple of those ancient vacuforms and they were a nightmare. For the most part, they were manufactured by hobbiests with no "real" equipment.

The lack of commercial quality facilities invariably resulted in "kits" made of paper thin plastic. There was virtually no mating surfaces and excess glue or putty would deform the shape (another side effect of the thin plastic).

For about 20 years, the reputation of vacuform was probably based on those bad experiences with bad kits.

So when I first got my HAPPY HUNTER ocean going tug kit, I was a bit concerned about an operating model that was vacuformed. But when I opened up the large box, it was quite obvious that the hull was very sustantial.

Regarding the glue situation...I don't have a Lunar kit so the others can comment. I will say this, whatever the material, gluing should be absolutely no problem unless you try to use one of those girlie-men non-toxic glue. I used a Testors liquid cement on my HAPPY HUNTER which was all ABS. This was the same glue I used on the early PL kits which were ABS. In fact, I had no idea they were ABS until other people started complaining. Any decent home store or hobby store will carry adhesives to bond anything. People only have real problems when they insist on using that citrus smelling crap intended allergy prone pre-schoolers.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Excellent info Carson and Brent!

If we were all in the same berg the first round would definitely be on me tonight!

Thanks!!!

Huzz


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

A bit of clarification re: bonding styrene parts together. At the risk of stating the obvious, cements like Testors work fine when affixing one styrene part to another. On the other hand, if you're attaching styrene to, say, resin, you'll want to use some type of sandable, gap-filling super glue.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Thanks Carson. 

When I added the Rebellion Creations resin bow to my styrene Polar Lights Seaview, I used a mixture of 2-part 24 hour epoxy glue and microballoons. It worked beautifully. I would expect it to be equally appropriate with the Lunar Proteus.
Huzz


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Not to raise a sore point here, Huzz...but let me say that people should not be buying $200.00 kits before they own an airbrush  !

I know it's been discussed before but I never got official word on your airbrush status. When the price of kits starts to exceed the price of the tools used to finish them...

(JUMPING IN MY TIME MACHINE TO QUOTE DAVE HUSSEY WHEN HE USES AN AIRBRUSH FOR THE FIRST TIME):

"Son of a #*$%&. I can't believe I've been painting models for 30 years with a frickin' hand brush!!"


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Actually Brent I've been doing a lot of reserarch and I figger this little beauty will work wonders:


http://www.canadiantire.ca/assortments/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524443275679&FOLDER%3C%3EbrowsePath=2534374302200077&FOLDER%3C%3EbrowsePath=2534374303514251&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374303514251&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=1408474395348027&bmUID=1098705718399

That and a bit of high gloss interior latex and I'll have the Proteus and the front porch done in a jiffy! :jest: 

Huzz


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

All joking aside, someone at one point recommended Krylon Fusion Gloss White in a spray can as a pretty good paint for the Proteus.

Any comments on its suitability? I have a can and I'll be test painting some scrap material but comments are welcome!

Huzz


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## F91 (Mar 3, 2002)

Dave Hussey said:


> Excellent info Carson and Brent!
> 
> If we were all in the same berg the first round would definitely be on me tonight!
> 
> ...


No Way! I tried drinking with a bunch of Canadians a couple of times, the next day is Hell!


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

That's right.

Here in Canada, we don't have just beer, we have *beer!!*


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Just another airbrush nag (given the length of this thread, I don't think there is any danger of it being hijacked by another topic).

I have some facts that may be of interest.

I'll preface all of this by saying that, as you'll read, the relationship of airbrushing and modeling has changed over the years. When I was a young guy in the early 70's, airbrushes were brutally expensive luxuries and models were dirt cheap. Therefore, only the very serious, working adult modeler could buy an airbrush. Things are radically different today. Note the following:

I have in front of me a copy of the SEPTEMBER 1974 issue of SCALE MODELER magazine. So we have a time capsule into the world of modeling more than 30 years ago.

Page 6. An ad from Valley Plaza Hobbies for a PAASCHE MODEL VL airbrush with hose. Price: $51.95

Page 74. An ad from Squadron Shops Mail order. Revell 1/32 Corsair for $3.75. Monogram 1/48 Dornier Do 335 for $2.50. Airfix 1/72 Brewster Buffalo for $1.25.

As you can see, 30 years ago, and airbrush represented an investment of more 20 times the cost of an average model! As somebody who was a highschool junior at the time, I can tell you that the minimum wage at this time would have been about $1.90 per hour depending on your locale. Back then, you could buy a used car for $50.00 (not kidding!).

FORWARD TO 2004:

I just checked the dixieart website. They have a PAASCHE VL (yes, the same AB from 1974) with hose and jar for $46.50! Yep, 30 years later, it's $5.00 cheaper.

What does a model cost today? C'mon, I don't have to tell you. The last kit I bought was a Trumpeter Corsair for about $60.00US.

The fact is, an airbrush today is about 2 to 3 times as expensive as an "average model" and it's about the same price as a big model. Of course, once you get into the high-end, serious models, a good airbrush is CHEAPER than the kit! An airbrush is no longer an exotic luxury. Average guys can afford them. True, I have left out the price of compressor. Ok, a compressor is about the price of a very good DVD player.

The point of all this being that, in 2004, the airbrush is a standard modeling tool within the reach of any modeler. To be a modeler today without an airbrush is like being a carpenter without a circular saw...you can "work around" most problems but having the right tool makes things so much better.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I agree, but what do you think of the Krylon Fusion Gloss White?

Huzz


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## Tman123 (Dec 2, 2004)

Wow Carson! I am so impressed. I too think of Proteus as one of my favorite ships. The amount of puttying and sanding is driving me nuts (hence I've had it for a few years and not completed it yet. I built my interior from scratch but I can't seem to find a crew since I didn't purchase the still available interior. 

Anyway...I'm so impressed and you've inspired me greatly to pursue this awesome (and difficult), kit to completion.

I also think that Spindrift is spectacula!!!

Cheers,
Gary

BTW: I ordered the Wilco Proteus from C & S Hobbies yesterday....it shipped today....talk about surprise considering I was expecting 3-4 weeks!!!


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## Martin Dressler (Jan 9, 2005)

Carson Dyle said:


> I ended up creating the hull markings in Adobe Illustrator, then sending the digi-file to a local print outfit that makes "chrom-a-tec" transfers. In other words: they're rub-on.


Sorry for resurrecting such an old thread but I'm finally getting around to building my Lunar Models Proteus and I'd love to hear more about this "chrom-a-tec" stuff. Based on the posted pix you appear to have gotten terrific results.

Has anyone else messed with rub-on letters -- and if so, how would you rate them compared with decals?


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## JeffG (May 10, 2004)

SWEET! Both the Proteus and the Spindrift. Although I've often wondered how a green, smoking planet has blue skies and rolling hills when you land on it.

I once read a while back, and this could be complete BS, that James Cameron had an interest in doing a remake of Fantastic Voyage. Has anyone else heard this rumor? Given his fondness for oceanography, subs and related tech, and the fact that he is a more than capable director, he would seem a perfect choice for such a project-that is if there's any truth to it.


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## drewid142 (Apr 23, 2004)

http://www.filmlisten.no/cgi-bin/visnyhet.cgi?id=886

here's a link with some info about Cameron's Fantastic Voyage!


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## veedubb67 (Jul 11, 2003)

Err... What language is that?


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I'm thinking the Svedish Chef could help us out!

Bort Bort!! 

Huzz


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## lisfan (Feb 15, 1999)

Dave Hussey said:


> Actually Brent I've been doing a lot of reserarch and I figger this little beauty will work wonders:
> 
> 
> http://www.canadiantire.ca/assortments/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524443275679&FOLDER%3C%3EbrowsePath=2534374302200077&FOLDER%3C%3EbrowsePath=2534374303514251&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374303514251&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=1408474395348027&bmUID=1098705718399
> ...


 hey dave 
thats a great idea!!!!!!!!! porch is done now to painting!!!!!:jest: no weathering though


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## lisfan (Feb 15, 1999)

Dave Hussey said:


> That's right.
> 
> Here in Canada, we don't have just beer, we have *beer!!*


 hi dave another great idea. air brush , beer , keep them coming. painting the house sounds fun:lol:


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Martin Dressler said:


> I'd love to hear more about this "chrom-a-tec" stuff. Based on the posted pix you appear to have gotten terrific results.
> 
> Has anyone else messed with rub-on letters -- and if so, how would you rate them compared with decals?


Chromatech is a type of rub-on lettering used primarily for architectural and graphic design applications. I prefer it to decals because it produces sharp, crisp, borderless markings that won't yellow with age. Also, because my company does a lot of business with the local supplier, I can get the occasional set of model markings for free  

Rub-ons can be a bit tricky to use, but the end results are worth the effort IMO.

I may have an extra set of Proteus markings stashed away somewhere... drop me an email if you're interested.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Phil - LOL!!

I've been doing lots of painting over the last three weeks but its all house painting! Perhaps I can use that 4 inch brush on a model later this week!

Huzz


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

Dave Hussey said:


> I'm thinking the Svedish Chef could help us out!
> 
> Bort Bort!!
> 
> Huzz


Actually that website is Norwegian. But then, that's pretty close to Swedish — like the way Portugese sounds like Spanish with a jawful of novocaine.

To Carson Dyle: Your LM Proteus is absolutely GORGEOUS! Just one tiny nitpick (but that's what we're here for, right?): Going by the full-size mockup and the 5-foot miniature, the lettering on the engine nacelles that reads "_DANGER - KEEP CLEAR_" should be oblique (italic). Something to keep in mind when you build the next one!


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## Martin Dressler (Jan 9, 2005)

Carson -- thanx for the info. 

By the way, where did you find reference for Cora & Grant's seats? I've looked and looked but thus far my searching has been in vain.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

scotpens said:


> Going by the full-size mockup and the 5-foot miniature, the lettering on the engine nacelles that reads "_DANGER - KEEP CLEAR_" should be oblique (italic).


Not only should the lettering be oblique, but the markings as pictured at the top of this thread are a bit too big. Both inaccuracies have since been corrected -- but thanks for keeping me on my toes.



Martin Dressler said:


> Carson… where did you find reference for Cora & Grant's seats?


I never did find any good reference of these seats. Phil Broad’s site features some great continuity shots of the sub’s interior…. unfortunately the seats in question are partially obscured by a rather large slate. 

The best reference is probably the film itself: Grant’s chair is glimpsed (fleetingly) when Grant re-enters the crashed sub after having blasted it with the laser (i.e. the shot in which Grant helps Captain Owens to his feet). Blink and you miss it.


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