# Coupla New Kits



## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

If you're curious, click here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/lazymodeler/sets/72157625889650833/


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

Nobody's the least bit curious? To see two new Moebius kits? I've underestimated this board...


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## BrianM (Dec 3, 1998)

...we're all speechless! Very nice, love the Spindrift.


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## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

It took 29 minutes for the first response and you're complaining?


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

I monitor these things very closely..


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## Sonett (Jul 21, 2003)

Beautiful! (both of them). Can hardly wait to get my hands on these. Moebius did it again!


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## whitewarrior (Nov 29, 2008)

I would be happy with just the box!


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

I like the Spindrift. A good size for display or a diorama.


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

Thanks for sharing. Looking forward to getting both. :thumbsup:


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

jbond said:


> Nobody's the least bit curious? To see two new Moebius kits? I've underestimated this board...


I sort of resent that- your thread title- "Coupla New Kits" was not very clear as to what the subject was- first glance would assume these were new purchases of yours- not first looks at two new Moebius releases. The first post does not explain anything either, and quite frankly while I enjoy seeing a member's work, a lot of the time I do not have time to link over to a flickr/photobucket/other-host and wade through. I do that on the weekends when there is more time to spend online.
That aside, now that you have these kits in your hands what are your impressions? How does the new Clipper compare to the older Aurora?


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## Gary K (Aug 26, 2002)

Frank sent me a '2001' Orion and a mini-Spindrift today, too. Haven't had a chance to inspect the Orion yet, but I thought I'd post a couple pictures of the Spindrift. My first impression is that the model is even tinier than I'd envisioned - yet the detail & fit are amazing. The Spindrift in these photos is simply snapped together, without glue or tape holding the parts together. 

Gary


The Moebius model sitting atop an Aurora Spindrift that I'd started to rehab years ago.











Look, ma - no glue or tape holding it together!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Life is good. 

So, okay, just to clarify - folding cardboard interior, but without seats?


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

Sorry--I'm not acting as an official Moebius representative so I'm guilty of being coy.

I love both the kits--very interesting to see how the Space Clipper has been redone. It does have VERY minimal panel lines with most of that detail being created by decals. That will probably drive some people crazy but in looking at the details that are molded into the kit, it looks very much like photos of the actual miniature. The decals look like they will have an interesting look when put down--this does take a little control away from the modeler but those who wish to can probably also just use the decals as a guide to doing their own panels and panel lines.

The interior for the Spindrift looks terrific as well. I'm not a Spindrift expert so other than the obviously corrected bubble top I can't say how much it's been improved over the Aurora but I love the fact that I can display it next to the Seaview. Very much looking forward to building these!


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

On the Spindrift there are seats for the cockpit (at least when you look through the windows there will be seats visible) but no, none for the passenger area.


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## Aurora-brat (Oct 23, 2002)

Woohoo!!!! I'm quite pleased! They both look pretty dang great to me, though I'm no expert on either vehicle.

I'll definitely be purchasing both. Thanks for posting these!


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## kenlee (Feb 11, 2010)

jbond said:


> If you're curious, click here:
> 
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/lazymodeler/sets/72157625889650833/


Awesome, another home run for Moebius, can't wait to get my hands on these.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Both these kits look great. I'm surprised Moebius went with decals to represent the panels on the Orion, they look fine and will hopefully look the part on the model. Thanks for posting the photos jbond.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

Opus Penguin said:


> I like the Spindrift. A good size for display or a diorama.


I'll second that! My display space is limited, so smaller model kits are better as far as I'm concerned.


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## RMC (Aug 11, 2004)

awesome !........just awesome !


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

Jeff,we're not that clever


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

spock62 said:


> Both these kits look great. I'm surprised Moebius went with decals to represent the panels on the Orion, they look fine and will hopefully look the part on the model. Thanks for posting the photos jbond.


It was said the filming miniature panel lines were penciled (?) on and not engraved. So the detail was not part of the physical model. 

Some noted already they would have preferred engraved panel lines. But I bet some would have complained the engraved lines are either out of scale or not accurate to the studio model. 

Thus as many have said, "Moebius can't win".


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## Joe Brown (Nov 16, 1999)

I'm looking forward to both of these, and planning on buying several of each! I simply cannot have too many sci-fi vehicles! 

:thumbsup:


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## xsavoie (Jun 29, 1999)

Thanks J Bond.Great pictures.If someone wants panel lines,the can always pencil them like they did in the 2001 prop department,if such a rumor is true.Many do so with military aircrafts.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

Very nice! The detail on these kits looks outstanding. And the foldup interior for the Spindrift is a nice touch. Definitely a must have for both. Moebius does it again!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Hm. Actually, I much prefer engraved lines to decals. Decal panel lines look like cartoons.


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## j2man (Jun 18, 1999)

Splendrift! Awesome looking little kit! I can't wait for this one.......


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Solium said:


> It was said the filming miniature panel lines were penciled (?) on and not engraved. So the detail was not part of the physical model.
> 
> Some noted already they would have preferred engraved panel lines. But I bet some would have complained the engraved lines are either out of scale or not accurate to the studio model.
> 
> Thus as many have said, "Moebius can't win".




I wouldn't have complained as models these days are usually more accurate (Moebius have done a great job on 99% of their models so far) and panel lines are fine, but it is tricky for Moebius to try and please everyone.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

John P said:


> Hm. Actually, I much prefer engraved lines to decals. Decal panel lines look like cartoons.



The front of the fuselage looks like it has some nice detail but have to agree.


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## Xenodyssey (Aug 27, 2008)

Looking forward to seeing both of these kits in the flesh. I quite like the detailing on both, especially the Spindrift.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

John P said:


> Hm. Actually, I much prefer engraved lines to decals. Decal panel lines look like cartoons.


To me it's a double edged sword. If the decal panel lines are thin and subtle and they lay down well, then the decals will save you time and produce a good looking model.

To my eye, the decal panel lines look alittle too intense, based on the photo, but I'd wait to see the finished model before a final judgement. Also, if the decals don't lay down correctly and have bubbles or silvering, it will ruin the look of the kit, something you wouldn't have to worry about with engraved lines and painted on panels. Plus, you can darken engraved panel lines (with washes) to suit your taste. But, the engraved panel lines would have to be very thin and delicate, not heavy handed. Guess it's just a matter of personal preference.

Overall the kit looks great and I can't wait to get my hands on one, it's just that I have reservations concerning using decals for panel lines.


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## BlackbirdCD (Oct 31, 2003)

They look really cool. Love the size on the Spindrift.


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## Trekkriffic (Mar 20, 2007)

spock62 said:


> To me it's a double edged sword. If the decal panel lines are thin and subtle and they lay down well, then the decals will save you time and produce a good looking model.
> 
> To my eye, the decal panel lines look alittle too intense, based on the photo, but I'd wait to see the finished model before a final judgement. Also, if the decals don't lay down correctly and have bubbles or silvering, it will ruin the look of the kit, something you wouldn't have to worry about with engraved lines and painted on panels. Plus, you can darken engraved panel lines (with washes) to suit your taste. But, the engraved panel lines would have to be very thin and delicate, not heavy handed. Guess it's just a matter of personal preference.
> 
> Overall the kit looks great and I can't wait to get my hands on one, it's just that I have reservations concerning using decals for panel lines.


What about applying the decals but not seal them and then use them as a guide to carve your own panel lines with something really thin like an exacto knife? Get a rounded blade and rock it along the line of the decal so you can control the blades path without the use of a straight edge. Then you could either scrape the decal off or wet it so it lifts off leaving thin panel lines. Just a thought.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

xsavoie said:


> Thanks J Bond.Great pictures.If someone wants panel lines,the can always pencil them like they did in the 2001 prop department,if such a rumor is true.Many do so with military aircrafts.



That's totally missing the point xsavoie. Some of us are saying we prefer engraved panel lines in the actual plastic to ones that are printed or drawn on. You don't get the same effect with drawn or printed on lines as you get with 3D moulded in lines.


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

SUNGOD said:


> You don't get the same effect with drawn or printed on lines as you get with 3D moulded in lines.


Well in reality, when you see a panel on an airplane, ship, etc., you arent seeing a big raised line or big engraved trench. So being drawn in is really more accurate than either way. Myself, I do not mind raised or engraved details on kits. But the trend today, especially with smaller scale models (this thing is what, 1/500 scale or something?) to have more restrained surface detailing. If you pick up 1/144 or 1/200 airliners they are pretty smooth.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

djnick66 said:


> Well in reality, when you see a panel on an airplane, ship, etc., you arent seeing a big raised line or big engraved trench. So being drawn in is really more accurate than either way. Myself, I do not mind raised or engraved details on kits. But the trend today, especially with smaller scale models (this thing is what, 1/500 scale or something?) to have more restrained surface detailing. If you pick up 1/144 or 1/200 airliners they are pretty smooth.



Raised lines and big engraved trench's no but I can't see how you can say drawn on lines are really more accurate to a real aircraft etc. You wouldn't have a real life Jumbo with drawn on panels. They'd be fine recesses or overlapping panels (I think the B17 had those).


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

SUNGOD said:


> That's totally missing the point xsavoie. Some of us are saying we prefer engraved panel lines in the actual plastic to ones that are printed or drawn on. You don't get the same effect with drawn or printed on lines as you get with 3D moulded in lines.


Exactly. Having the lines engraved generally looks better and gives the modeler more control over how the model is finished. Also, what if you want to do the kit in a different airliner scheme, one that isn't white? The areas of the decals were there is panel shading would have to be painted over, or the decals not used at all.

As for engraving the lines ourselves, I'd be willing to bet alot of modelers are like me and do OOB builds. Don't really want to engrave all the panel lines, especially on a kit produced in 2011!

I'm guessing the reason Frank chose the decals is because to replicate the thin pencil lines of the original would require extremely delicate engraved lines, which would have added cost to the molds, thus raising the price the kit will sell for. But don't quote me, it's just MHO!

Hopefully, the decals are done well and go on well. If that's the case and the model looks right, it will be good enough for me.

Again, I'm not knocking the kit or Moebius as a company, just expressing a preference for engraved panel lines as opposed to decal panel lines.


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## Dr. Brad (Oct 5, 1999)

spock62 said:


> Overall the kit looks great and I can't wait to get my hands on one, it's just that I have reservations concerning using decals for panel lines.


That about sums it up for me! Can't wait to get this kit!


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## miniature sun (May 1, 2005)

All credit to Moebius for trying something new with the decals, and given the small scale of the ship even the finest engraved lines might look overscale.
As someone said before, you can use the decals as a template for scribing the lines then wash them off.
Either way, I think it's better to reserve judgement until the kit's in your hands rather than speculating on the quality based on a few photo's.


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## Opus Penguin (Apr 19, 2004)

I would love to see a J2 this size!


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## SJF (Dec 3, 1999)

These look great! I'm planning on getting them, now. 

Sean


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

SUNGOD said:


> ...but it is tricky for Moebius to try and please everyone.


Such is the nature of producing products for the general population; the best you can hope for is a product that pleases the majority of your potential customers.


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## g_xii (Mar 20, 2002)

jbond said:


> On the Spindrift there are seats for the cockpit (at least when you look through the windows there will be seats visible) but no, none for the passenger area.


Once you have one of these in your hands, you'll realize how very small the interior is. I wanted something to show at least the pilot seats, but figured it might look cheezy. So, I attached an image of some chair backs and arm rests to the back of the flight console. Looking in from the outside, it does indeed look like there are pilot seats, but you can just as easily cut them off and install plastic seats if you don't like them. I wanted to leave some wiggle room for those that did not like the "seats"!

Regarding the passenger area, there was just no easy and pretty way to simulate the chairs in the time I had to do this. Originally we were only going to do the cockpit as we figured not much would show through the tiny side windows. But I cobbled something up, and you could see it from outside of the model, so while it's not exact, it's not just empty space. 

I literally had about three days to do get this done and upload it to the manufacturers (after Moebius approval). The entire process was rushed in order to get the actual model kits into your hands, as the work on the kit itself was already done and they were ready to start manufacturing them. The interior is just a "free" bonus, to be used or discarded, but at least it is _something_ to put in there for the time being. They had time to put the creases in the areas where you need to fold, but there was not even time to die cut them (like was done for the mini Flying Sub). 

Me, I'm just glad to make a contribution to a subject (and kit) that I love, and also glad that Moebius made this kit so accurate and made it happen so fast! There are a lot of other model companies that talk and talk and it seems to take years for them to deliver, if they ever deliver at all. At least Moebius keeps us informed and keeps us in quality kits.

I hope folks are not too disappointed with the interior -- I did the best I could in the time allowed. 

--Henry


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## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

I think it's great--for most subjects of this type, the scale of the windows means you're really just going to get an impression of the interior--whether you install the fold-up interior or not I don't think anyone's going to be able to make out the nuts and bolts, but with the bright color scheme and details on the provided interior the "impression" made is very strong and with minimal work from the builder. That's the way I prefer it and again, people who want to go further are more than welcome to try.


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## kdaracal (Jan 24, 2009)

g_xii said:


> Once you have one of these in your hands, you'll realize how very small the interior is. I wanted something to show at least the pilot seats, but figured it might look cheezy. So, I attached an image of some chair backs and arm rests to the back of the flight console. Looking in from the outside, it does indeed look like there are pilot seats, but you can just as easily cut them off and install plastic seats if you don't like them. I wanted to leave some wiggle room for those that did not like the "seats"!
> 
> Regarding the passenger area, there was just no easy and pretty way to simulate the chairs in the time I had to do this. Originally we were only going to do the cockpit as we figured not much would show through the tiny side windows. But I cobbled something up, and you could see it from outside of the model, so while it's not exact, it's not just empty space.
> 
> ...


The interior looks crisp and totally cool. I'm so glad you took the time to do this. Amazing work, as usual.


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## kdaracal (Jan 24, 2009)

Thanks, Moebius! I'm so glad you did not put those panel lines in. No filling and sanding needed! The size adds so many diorama possibilities. Buying at least three..........

Can't wait to see what Paul, Gil, Crow's Nest, Lou, Henry, and JT might have for these little gems in the future!


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## g_xii (Mar 20, 2002)

Thanks for the kind words! Well, I don't know what others are doing, but I have this in my webstore right now for the Space Clipper. Now, if I could just get a good photograph of it... Supplemental decals and a cardstock interior!

--Henry

A nice big detailed photo can be found by clicking here.

You really can't see much in that thumbnail...


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## Ductapeforever (Mar 6, 2008)

Bear in mind when discussing panel lines, drawn on, or decals, in this scale ,either way would be the size of a drainage canal ! A thin suggestion of panel lines penciled on just as the prop dept did on the shooting miniature goes a LONG way in this scale, a very long way.
Actually...in this scale they wouldn't even be visible! Military aircraft even in 1/32 scale have raised panel lines that if blown up to full size , would appear as two by fours glued to the wings and fuselage! I say leave 'em off !

Just my two cents...


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## gareee (Jan 1, 1970)

I didn't realize the spindrift was in scale with the seaview. I'll have to add that to my shopping list now.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Ductapeforever said:


> Bear in mind when discussing panel lines, drawn on, or decals, in this scale ,either way would be the size of a drainage canal ! A thin suggestion of panel lines penciled on just as the prop dept did on the shooting miniature goes a LONG way in this scale, a very long way.
> Actually...in this scale they wouldn't even be visible! Military aircraft even in 1/32 scale have raised panel lines that if blown up to full size , would appear as two by fours glued to the wings and fuselage! I say leave 'em off !
> 
> Just my two cents...


Well, the shooting miniature was about 36" long, so thin penciled lines looked right. Penciled lines on a 1/144 scale model would probably not. Any lines would have to be extremly delicate to look correct. 

All military aircraft models have panel lines represented. Most use recessed lines, raised panel lines are almost never used anymore. Some companies over-do them, making for trench like lines on the kit (new Airfix kits being a good example). Others have lines so fine and shallow, they really enhance the kit as opposed to taking away form it (Tamyia and Hasegawa come to mind). 

I have a Tamyia 1/72 P-47 kit with super thin/shallow lines. Just right, not overdone. Panel lines done like that would work great on the Orion IMHO. Having made many a military aircraft model, I can't see why you wouldn't want panel lines represented, as long as they are done right. 

While I've heard people complaining about panel lines that are too deep/wide or incorrect/missing, I've never heard anyone fill in those lines because they'd rather pencil them in or have no lines at all. If you use the "scale" argument, then your correct, panel lines would be hard to see on a 1/144 scale kit and even in 1/32 should be drawn on, since on a real aircraft panels mate flush, not with a trench between them. But I doubt very much that most modelers would appreciate a aircraft kit without those panel lines and be told they have to pencil them in!

I do appreciate what Moebius is trying to do, faithfully represent the filming miniature and hopefully the decal panel lines are thin enough and light enough. But I still would rather have engraved panel lines, if they were done correctly, like the P-47 example I mentioned.

Also, thanks g_xii for the upcoming decal sheet, looks great. I'll definitely have to pick up a copy!


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## JeffG (May 10, 2004)

The decal sheets look to be something of a must! I think lightly penciled in lines will look just fine on this as long as you use a really thin lead. I hope the instructions might show some info on where the lines should go, otherwise much of it will be anybody's guess.


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## Solium (Apr 24, 2005)

I know its not an IR license but Moebius really needs to do a mini Invaders ship now. (Including the cool Aurora box art)


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

spock62 said:


> Well, the shooting miniature was about 36" long, so thin penciled lines looked right. Penciled lines on a 1/144 scale model would probably not. Any lines would have to be extremly delicate to look correct.
> 
> All military aircraft models have panel lines represented. Most use recessed lines, raised panel lines are almost never used anymore. Some companies over-do them, making for trench like lines on the kit (new Airfix kits being a good example). Others have lines so fine and shallow, they really enhance the kit as opposed to taking away form it (Tamyia and Hasegawa come to mind).
> 
> ...




Great points. People say that panel lines would be overscale or they would have to be so incredibly fine you'd hardly see them to be 'scale accurate' but just fine engraved lines like Hasegawa or Tamiya do on their aircraft would be perfectly acceptable, even if they might be a bit overscale. 

They'd still in my opinion look much better than decals. 

I'm not saying it's the case with Moebius but I think a lot of this using decals for panel lines came from some people moaning about the overscale, inaccurate aztec detailing on the old AMT Enterprise A. Then in response the version without the engraved aztec detail was released and since then both Bandai and PL have released Enterprise A's and others with decals or printed on Aztec instead of finely enraved lines as they seem to think everyone wants that now. 

As far as I know yes..the Enterprise A studio miniature had the lines just painted on but that's another one I think would look better with engraved Aztec lines. 

I have an Art Asylum Enterprise A with the moulded on Aztec pattern and I personally think it looks great and a lot better.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

This is my Stargazer Orion II in 1/144 scale. I actually really like the way the panel lines look.


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## g_xii (Mar 20, 2002)

John P said:


> This is my Stargazer Orion II in 1/144 scale. I actually really like the way the panel lines look.


That's quite the nice buildup, John! What a cool model that is! Looks fantastic!

-- Henry


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

John P said:


> This is my Stargazer Orion II in 1/144 scale. I actually really like the way the panel lines look.




Me too. Some nice detail on that!


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## falcondesigns (Oct 30, 2002)

JeffG said:


> The decal sheets look to be something of a must! I think lightly penciled in lines will look just fine on this as long as you use a really thin lead. I hope the instructions might show some info on where the lines should go, otherwise much of it will be anybody's guess.


There is plenty of resources,here and on the web.....


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