# Sneak Preview - Moon Bus Thruster & Rocket Set



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

It's taken a boatload of time getting the details right, but I'm finally closing in on releasing the thruster and rocket set. 

There's more info on the pieces here: http://www.paragrafix.biz/x_gallery-moon-bus-preview.asp

EDIT: I forgot to mention on the site that the set will also include wire for the engine pipe and a bending jig to shape it.


----------



## miniature sun (May 1, 2005)

Cool!....put me down for a set Paul (although it might be 3001 before I get to use it!)


----------



## Model Man (Oct 1, 2007)

Oh nice! That makes 3 aftermarket kits for this model. If only I'd waited one day to do the moonbus review!!!


----------



## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

miniature sun said:


> Cool!....put me down for a set Paul (although it might be 3001 before I get to use it!)


Me too!


----------



## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

Case in point...

a lot of companies release models featuring engine bells and not a lot of them have pin and locators inside the bell itself making it painfully obvious to anyone who sees it that it's a model. When all is said and done, it's not _supposed_ to look like a model.

your witness.


----------



## Bwain no more (May 18, 2005)

VERY cool Paul, time well spent! 
Tom


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

miniature sun said:


> Cool!....put me down for a set Paul (although it might be 3001 before I get to use it!)


Not THAT long, I hope Iain! Given what you're doing with the Flying Sub, I can only imagine what you could do with the Moon Bus.

MAGESBLOOD: The pin arrangement was common (dare I say ubiquitous) in 1960s kits and the Moebius kit is a faithful reproduction of the original Aurora kit.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

That is a spectacular set! The shoulder thrusters int he original model bothered me more than any other feature- even the windows. Such a prominent element badly interpreted by Aurora into hollow shells. When I eventually get this kit this is the only accessory set I will get- it really finishes up the exterior!

.


----------



## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Looks great. 

Please post a heads up once these become available.


----------



## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

Yeah--count me in for these definitely.


----------



## JeffG (May 10, 2004)

Also a good reason to use some of the highly metallic 'buffing' type paints! I never got an answer to another question I asked a while back though; doe's anybody know of any lighting kits planned for this kit? I can't think of a better argument for Lightsheet.


----------



## Tim H. (Jun 23, 2009)

Yes, someone may as well do a light kit at this point. Not much room since the roof is only a single layer of hull with no place to run wires, I think.

These look very nice to be sure but it's whittling away at the amount of the Moebius kit left - can I get a refund on those unused parts   I'll open my kit again and peruse, may put in an order for all the add ons at once. :wave:


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I have seen a build where lightsheet was used in the ceiling- I forget who did it but it was a great effect.
I am thinking of using some UV LEDs for the interior with fluorescent paint in the ceiling panels. The back is mostly blue lit anyway and I think the UV could also work to light up the controls and a regular red LED to alter the ambient room lighting.


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

I'll definitely be posting a big announcement when this set it ready!

As for the lighting - Miller Engineering has a great little "experimenter's kit" that provides more than enough EL sheet to the interior with separate connectors mounted all around the edge so you can cut the pieces you need.

Here's a new shot: the test priming of the rear wall. There's a bit more seam cleanup to do (I've already started on the right-hand thruster), but it's essentially done then I can get to work on the inside.


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Forgot to mention - surface mounted LEDs would be awesome to mount in the can lights in the cockpit.


----------



## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

"Just an Illusion" has a Moonbus EL kit, no?

... and I think Fluke built and lit a Moonbus.


----------



## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

Paulbo said:


> MAGESBLOOD: The pin arrangement was common (dare I say ubiquitous) in 1960s kits and the Moebius kit is a faithful reproduction of the original Aurora kit.


I think that's why I'm such a fan of Round 2. They took molds that AMT clearly didn't care about and retooled them for increased accuracy. Take the Romulan ship for example. They've listened to the masses and added detail and got rid of inaccuracies.

Now one would think or hope that Moebius, a company that everyone raves about would or could retool a few bits and pieces here and there.

And what gives with the instructions? So many pieces and only two assembly steps? Don't know about you but I prefer a clear diagram of exactly where each little piece goes - especially for a kit I'm going to throw down $50 for. Is there some kind of order you should go in to avoid mishaps later or does everything go on without any rhyme or reason?

And "see box art for painting" just smacks of laziness. Guys, take a few minutes to make a color chart and call outs!

I know it's a lot of people's grail kit and I admittedly want one too but I think they could have done a heck of a lot better.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I think a lot depends on the licensing agreements. Round 2 has a bit more flexability in what they do, although their retooling is mostly stands and decals. The added features (R-BoP & K-BoP) are adding a new parts tree, not reworkign the existing molds. It worked for the BSG repops. 
2001 is a very different ballgame. The licensing rights are tied up with multiple owners and no one wants to cooperate of make money off of it. We would buy the kits, but there is no assured market for them in volume like the Trek kits which have a LOT of screen hours. You add up the series (TOS.TNG, DS-9, ST-V, ST-E with so many shows a season and mostly seven years of seasons, then add the movies you have a big marketing shoe in. Even if a parent does not watch the show, they will recognize the ships and buy them as a present.
2001 was a two hout movie and the ships were seen for only minutes. It was an important movie in Cinema, but there are a LOT of people who have never seen it at all. When we got a HD-TV and I was showing it off for my sisters kids, I played 2001 as a show off piece. They response?- "does anybody ever say anyhting in this movie?"
While the actual paperwork is only know to Moebius, I feel that it only allows permission to reproduce this kit exactly as it was originally- they could add a parts tree (like round 2), but it had to be a faithful duplication of the original kit as licensed.
Moebius has firmly established itself and not being satisfied with existing kits when producing new ones The J2 is a good example. I think if the kit has not been really 'fixed', which would require new molds & parts breakdowns, scale & detail changes, it is because they are not allowed to if they want to be able to produce the kit at all.
I may be wrong, but I do not think the reason they did not fix the Moonbus was not because they were lazy, but were limited be contract to be faithful to the origianl. If they could make a 'correct one;, it would be two feet long with perfected features, like the Seaview kit.


----------



## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

Thanks for that explanation. See, so much goes on behind the scenes and people like me are ignorant to what goes on and how.

I stand by my assessment of the instructions though. They could be done better.


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

I have a slightly different take - the Moon Bus (and the other Moebius repops) are *grail kits*, out of production for decades and sought by builders and collectors who are looking for the original kits (or as close to the originals as possible). That goes for everything about this kits, down to the instructions and packaging.

The Trek kits, on the other hand, are generally "commodities" that have been produced in huge numbers over the years and the way to get people to purchase the new repops is to spend money on retooling and updates.

Also, I think it's important to remember that Moebius is producing kits that people want. From the response on these boards, 99.99999% of people are pleased with kits and aren't bothered by the "archaic" aspects of the models.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I do agree with the instructions- I have built two original releases and both times when I was prepainting I missed the same spot because it always looked like the part fit underneath another inthe instructions.
It is a fairly logical kt toassemble fortunately. I do not have a new one yet- do the 'new' instructions show the two window options or it that on a seperate sheet and the instructions are faithfully reproduced from the Aurora as well?


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

The Moebius instructions have both window options included. There are some other minor changes like removing the references to Aurora paint and glue.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

If they made those changes it would have been nice to have a reworked set. Somebody in these forums probably would have done it for them for free just to be involved.


----------



## jbond (Aug 29, 2002)

I don't know; a HUGE part of the appeal of this kit is having the closest thing possible to the original kit release, which has been unavailable for decades. It's clearly different with the Star Trek kits which have been reissued countless times. The Romulan BOP and K-7 do have improvements but they are minor and neither addresses the kits' overall innacuraccies--in fact neither is as integral a fix as the one Moebius provided for the Moonbus windows, while still providing the option to build the kit in its "classic" guise for those who want that. Round 2 is doing all these modifications now in lieu of coming out with any new kits, while Moebius is providing ongoing classic reissues with a wealth of brand new kits. Without dissing Round 2, I'd say Moebius has earned its praise.


----------



## Magesblood (May 12, 2008)

yabut, you'd think with such a major fix of the windows, they could have spent a little time on the lading legs and engine bells.


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

The landing legs are pretty good - believe me, if they were bad representations I'd be making a set to replace them 

Other than the diameter (and the alignment pins), the engine bells are pretty good representations of the originals ... unless you're chronically obsessed with 2001 (and all other things related to SF ships) like me.

As for the alignment pins, there's really no way to do injected engine bells without them. These engines can't be done in a single piece which would be required to eliminate the pins because of the upper gimbal mount and the ribs. As it is, once the engines are assembled, the pins can be removed in a very short time with a Dremel.

(Actually, they could be done as one piece using multipart molds, but that type of molding would seriously dive up the cost of the kit.)


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Magesblood said:


> yabut, you'd think with such a major fix of the windows, they could have spent a little time on the lading legs and engine bells.


The windows were not a major fix- just a new spru with the clear parts and IIRC a small notch removed from the cockpit inset panel.
Sure- I would hav liked a completely perfect kit correcting all the problems with the original and a larger scale if possible, but as a general kit from that era it was pretty good for it's day.
I jusr hope they sell like hotcakes and Moebius follows up with the Orion and - dreaming- _othe_r craft from that movie.

.


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Richard Baker said:


> ...I just hope they sell like hotcakes and Moebius follows up with the Orion and - dreaming- _other_ craft from that movie...


You and me both! I would love to see a nice styrene Aries. In scale with the Orion would be awesome to do a cool in-orbit dio. (Or a bigger one in scale with the Moon Bus, that that would be one big honkin' piece of plastic.)

A Discovery would be neat - given the detail on the Galactica Moebius could do an awesome 18"-ish Discovery could look amazing.

OK, I'd better stop this before we turn this into a bunch of posts that should be in the "Wish List" thread


----------



## Tim H. (Jun 23, 2009)

Thanks for the link to the Miller Engineering EL products, Paulbo! Looks like great stuff, never knew such things existed though I'd heard of the term "light sheet" before. Cuttable light panels, :freak: crazy! Yes, I sometimes don't google about things. Looks right for the job and easy to use.


----------



## JeffG (May 10, 2004)

I've kinda got a different take on this. The way I see it is; why bring out a modern version of the same flawed kit that was released earlier? I'm just not that nostalgic. Been there, done that. I'd rather have a more accurate version of what was a once inaccurate kit. While I can respect that some folks are into the memorabilia, that's just not where my interests lay personally. If you can bring back yesterdays prices that would be great. Can't do that, eh? Okay then make an updated and more accurate kit. Whining aside, I'm still gonna get one, buy all the aftermarket bits and make it into what I want. But it sure would be nice if some of those additional corrections were already in the box for that price.


----------



## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Many people never got a chance to get the original flawed kit- this is their second chance.
Moebius can clarify this if they view this thread , but I still think the only way they recieved permission to release this kit at all was to release it as it once was.
Moebius is a company that is never satisfied with things as they are- but sometimes there is not a choice if you want to be able to produce it at all.


----------



## Lee Staton (May 13, 2000)

I'm just darned happy to have the Moon Bus again. It is back out, reasonably priced, and they even threw in better windows. Moebius gave 2001 fans a huge gift. It's easy for us to back-seat quarterback because WE aren't taking the financial risk. Nobody knew whether 2001 product would sell. I was amazed they made the window change, because that made it a bigger cost/bigger risk.

Now I hear that the kit's exceeded their hopes sales-wise. If so, that opens the door to more good stuff!

I'm grateful for the after market products, too. If you add them all up and add the price of the repop, it'll STILL come out cheaper than a resin kit.

Thanks Frank and Dave!

Lee


----------



## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Richard Baker said:


> Moebius can clarify this if they view this thread , but I still think the only way they recieved permission to release this kit at all was to release it as it once was.


Moebius released the kit "as is" because, a) they didn't want to go to the considerable expense of retooling, and b) there's something to be said for re-popping an incredibly rare and sought after vintage kit as closely as possible.

Frank is free to correct me here, but I don't believe "getting permission" was ever a factor.


----------



## Jim55 (Sep 11, 2010)

Paul,

How am I supposed to keep up with all the aftermarket you're doing? Photoetch, resin engine bells/thrusters, etc. Now I just need a lighting kit. I know there's not much to it (probably blue lightsheet and a couple of red LEDs in the cockpit someplace. My main question, though, is this: Is it possible to use the resin interior that's out with your stuff? There seems to be some redundancy with the thrusters (as the interior set includes them, but no bells). And finally, what about the thrusters on the back? Don't they have to be done as well (to fit in the holes on the back)? Thanks for your time...
Oh, yeah, one more thing...do you have a release date yet for the engine bells/thrusters, and are you including some wire for the 'handles' or whatever they are spaced at 72° five times each around the bell (how do you do that, anyway?).

Jim


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Hi Jim,

How to keep up? Send me small, unmarked bills and I'll keep you up-to-date 

My set should work fine with Stargazer's interior, though from the pictures I've seen, you'll need to cut a bit (maybe 1/8" or so, a bit more where the thrusters are) from the back of his floor and wall assemblies to accommodate my replacement back wall. 

The replacement back wall includes the thrusters. I was originally going to just include the thrusters and have the builder cut the holes and pop them in. Since the wall "eaves" are the wrong shape there wasn't enough room for the thrusters, and I ended up rebuilding the rear wall with the thrusters in place.

Our "shoulder pad" thrusters are a bit different - it looks like his mount behind the existing openings, while for mine I have you expand the openings a bit so they mount flush and include the raised bead around them. His are (from what I can see) easier to install, but mine are a bit more accurate.

I know I showed the original sneak preview a while back and only had to finish up the rear wall, but it's been a hell of a busy month or two, so I'm only finishing it up right now. If I don't hit any major last minute snags, I should be sending the masters off to the caster tomorrow.


----------



## Jim55 (Sep 11, 2010)

Thanks for the update, Paul!

Maybe I should forego the interior for my first time, and just use what's in the kit for
now. It sounds like it'd be easier to work with your stuff for the first time. Do you think
it would be prudent as well to get the photoetch kit? Does it really add that much?
(No offense, as I DO have your Working Group decals for the 1/12 EVA pod from CC,
as well as all the plans...too chicken of screwing it up, so I haven't started it yet.)
Maybe the photoetch and different bells/thrusters are enough (especially if I figure out
how to light it). One more thing...do you have a price point on the bells/thruster set yet?
(Send me a PM if you want).

Jim


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Hi Jim,

The Stargazer interior's pretty darned spiffy, but I understand where you're coming from.

I don't have a price point on the thruster set yet, as Jimi's got to have it in his mitts to figure out the cost of the rubber and resin. As soon as I get that info from him (and an ETA for finished pieces) I'll make a general announcement.

For the Pod interior - go for it! It was my first scratch build and (IMHO) it's come out quite well thus far. It's really not difficult if you print out a couple of copies of the plans, glue-stick them onto 1/16" stock*, then cut out the pieces by scribing and snapping.

Speaking of the Pod - I made up new joysticks and waldo controllers for my own kit and I'm going to be sending a set off to Jimi in a few weeks for him to cast up as well. I'm hoping they're not too small for him to cast up - or rather, that the joysticks' support rod isn't too small. They'll work with the original interior and the WG version.

* For $20-ish you can buy a 4 foot square sheet of polystyrene at your local plastics supply house. To get that much from the LHS would be upwards of $100.


----------



## Jim55 (Sep 11, 2010)

> My set should work fine with Stargazer's interior, though from the pictures I've seen, you'll need to cut a bit (maybe 1/8" or so, a bit more where the thrusters are) from the back of his floor and wall assemblies to accommodate my replacement back wall.


Thick in the head, or slow-moving today, but I don't understand this quote. Can you clarify this for me?



> Speaking of the Pod - I made up new joysticks and waldo controllers for my own kit and I'm going to be sending a set off to Jimi in a few weeks for him to cast up as well. I'm hoping they're not too small for him to cast up - or rather, that the joysticks' support rod isn't too small. They'll work with the original interior and the WG version.


Paul, 

Thanks for the tip on the polystyrene. I think I'll go over to my local Tap Plastics and pick me up a sheet. I wish I would have thought of that before spending $70.00 or so on a bunch of 1/16" white plastic.

I hope you can get the joysticks and waldos done...that seems to be the one thing that was perplexing everyone...what do they look like, how do they work, etc., etc. So that means another set of resin goodies to add to the Pod?

And to add to the fear of screwing up, I want to light the Pod the way you did. Looks really great, but for me I have no scratchbuilding experience and no electronics experience, but there's a first time for everything. All I know about soldering is to make sure the solder's shiny at the joint (I think...see? don't know much...Google will be my friend!!) Thanks for all your quick responses, as I appreciate all your replies and input. 

Jim

ps I'll leave you alone now...thanks again!


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Jim55 said:


> ...but for me I have no scratchbuilding experience and no electronics experience, but there's a first time for everything.


That's my pod, as well! For most of the lighting (except the headlights & HAL's eye) I'm using EL sheet. You can pick it up at www.microstru.com and many other places online.

Of course, it's hooking up the electronics and lighting panels that have me stalled - at this point I don't want to do anything that ruins all of the other work I've done on it


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Jim55 said:


> Paulbo said:
> 
> 
> > My set should work fine with Stargazer's interior, though from the pictures I've seen, you'll need to cut a bit (maybe 1/8" or so, a bit more where the thrusters are) from the back of his floor and wall assemblies to accommodate my replacement back wall.
> ...


Sorry I missed that part before.

Check out this shot at Stargazer's site: http://www.planet3earth.co.uk/moonbus/MB INT (1).jpg

Also these that I just took really quickly of my rear wall (it still needs to be polished so don't slam me too badly! Also, sorry about the poor photo quality - I just took them with my video cam to get something up quickly without dragging out the good camera): 

http://www.paragrafix.biz/gallery/moon-bus-preview/Rear-wall-exterior.JPG and http://www.paragrafix.biz/gallery/moon-bus-preview/Rear-wall-interior.JPG

You can't see that I've made the wall about 3-4 times as thick to help ensure good castings and to get some of the new details in place. In addition to that, though you'll see how I changed the shape of the cutouts where the engines are located and that on the inside the engines jut into the interior a bit. 

These differences will have to be taken into account with Ian's interior and will likely require some modifications to his parts.

If you're using the stock interior, all you need to do is remove a couple of locating notches on the hull and one small tab area on the floor piece. (You'd need to remove the hull notches if using my wall with Ian's interior as well.) EDIT: I forgot to mention you'll need to cut 3/16" from the back of each of the seats.

It should be possible to use Ian's rear wall with my thruster set rear wall, though there'd need to be some modifications to it. 

BTW - His interior rear wall is a tad more accurate than mine (his air vents are less chunky and the door is more rounded).


----------



## Steve Mavronis (Oct 14, 2001)

Nice


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

I finally decided that if I did any more tweaking and polishing I would end up destroying the new back wall, so I packed everything up and shipped it off to Jimi for casting. Hopefully he'll be able to provide me with costing in the not too distant future.

Be packing things up, I took some "farewell" photos. (More here: http://www.paragrafix.biz/x_gallery-moon-bus-preview.asp )


----------



## Steve Mavronis (Oct 14, 2001)

Just an observation to make the general interior better besides the great work you are doing. You know if those side walls were redone or moved inward close enough to the seat bases it would match the rear bulkhead cutout better and make the wall continue down from the window similar to my drawing cross-section below and the kit wall parts shouldn't look like a bench or cubby hole, it should just be a short angled ledge effect with the side framing forming the shape. I'm probably going to scratchbuild a new interior for my yet unbuilt kit representative of this plus get rid of those seat bases and replace with more realistic leg frames.


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Hi Steve,

Yes, I'm well aware of the problems with the kit's inner walls. My set is centered around the thrusters and I only dealt with the inner rear wall as I needed to beef it up for casting and to replace the (inaccurate) A/C vents since I'd destroyed them moving the outside detail.

Cheers,
Paul


----------



## Hunch (Apr 6, 2003)

Looks great paul. Well done.
Any chance you will be at Chiller in October?
Jim


----------



## Paulbo (Sep 16, 2004)

Thank Jim.

It doesn't look likely that I'll be at Chiller this year. There's not much of a modeling crowd (I think it was just 6 or 8 of us total, if you include Frank and Joanne).


----------



## Hunch (Apr 6, 2003)

Yeah, I hear you. The show is not what it used to be, of course I'll be there anyway just in case there are some good model vendors.
Jim


----------

