# how to silifoam tires



## joegri

hey guys grab a chair and get up close.u might like this. first off this my rendition of an article by a guy named trek that i saw on marion county speedway.it is very informative and something that you can do!!i,ll do half tonite and finish later.things you,ll need. get some foam blanks from sluggoslots on ebay.the seller slade is a prefered seller next a mandrell from jw,s speed again, top shelf guy.knock out the plug from the blank and mount it on the rim that you,re gonna use.with a nice small pair of scissors trim em down close to the size you want.this is not the finish size so make em big.next chuck,em up on a drill or dremmel and get the sidewalls closer to finish size. use some 220 or so paper you,ll know what works best after 4 or 5 sets you make.o.k. take the jw,s mandrell chuck it and secure it so it,s stable. lay both rough sized foams on mandrell and cranker up. check the pics u see i,ve got a box to catch foam dust.do the box catcher cuz it could get messy.now start to even up the foams ,maybe even try some different paper sizes to get a feel how the foam behaves.you,re gonna need a tube of flowable silicone.so go get some of that stuff.i,m here to tell ya that you,ll make a bunch of crappy sets at first but you will soon be makin silifoam tires that work quite well and you,ll be very proud of youreself cuz u saved a bunch of money and u mad,em you,re self!!.so fellas check the pics out .i,ll post more soon. class dismissed!! for now.


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## blubyu

How are you putting your silicone on? Any pics of the finished tires?


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## joegri

hey blubyu ya just rub/ message the silcone in with youre fingers then spin it off. let it dry for well till its dry then repeat maybe 3 times you,ll see. and yes more to come. did/nt want to show everything in 1 sitting.go ahead and get started on rounding up materials.youre gonna like the way they come out.


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## blubyu

Thanks,how much does one spin add to the size? I'll need to know what size to cut my foam too before applying the 3 coats so I can have the right size - range for my cars. Thanks again,can't wait for my material now! This should save me a bunch of $$$ on tires.


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## joegri

i cant really say with expertise but u will see 1 coat has a dimple finish.2nd coat kinda fills in low spots 3rd coat really is nice finishing coat! i,ve been using pemitex flowable silicone. as for the flowable silicone i kinda wonder is it all the same?as for cutting to size. get em close then tru em i tick small then buildup with the flowable. be read to make some really bad ones.you will get better.to date i,ve fashioned up mybe 30 sets. no 2 are the same but simular/close.i dont have time to post pics right now but , i will tonite. youll see a lil better/ how to.


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## Hornet

If you're dipping them and spinning them on low speed in your Dremel,each coat should add between 2 to 3 thousands.
This dipping trick also works to rebuild old silly-foam tires.There's a few differant varieties of flowable silicone's out there,i used to use Dow Corning's,but it's tougher to find then Permantex's version,both accomplished virtually the same end result.
If you can,while they're curing,flip them over,let them stand up for a bit,then flip them upside down and hang them for a bit,less tendenancy for the silicone to puddle on the end of the tire.
Stick em in old axles,and have a bunch to do at one time.
I set a couple old cardboard boxes up,to stick the axles in,then used a hair dyer under the boxes to speed up curing time.:thumbsup:


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## bearsox

Hornet said:


> If you're dipping them and spinning them on low speed in your Dremel,each coat should add between 2 to 3 thousands.
> This dipping trick also works to rebuild old silly-foam tires.There's a few differant varieties of flowable silicone's out there,i used to use Dow Corning's,but it's tougher to find then Permantex's version,both accomplished virtually the same end result.
> If you can,while they're curing,flip them over,let them stand up for a bit,then flip them upside down and hang them for a bit,less tendenancy for the silicone to puddle on the end of the tire.
> Stick em in old axles,and have a bunch to do at one time.
> I set a couple old cardboard boxes up,to stick the axles in,then used a hair dyer under the boxes to speed up curing time.:thumbsup:


*Try Dow Corning 734 clear if ya can find a local distributor as it is as good as it gets but if not look for a Murphy / O Reilly's auto store and get Versa Chem flowable winshield repair silicone as it is also VERY good stuff. Harbor freight also sells a generic brand that ain't half bad stuff in a white tube w/ red label. Looking forward to the rest of Joe's how to so thanks ahead Joe i love to see what other guys do and i just know your having fun with it .

Bear :wave:*


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## Hornet

Dug up my old notes from years ago.
I used to mix Dow Corning Flowable and Permentex Flowable together,with an equal part of laquer thinner as a thinner(the laquer thinner is a bitch to mix,i used to spin a tire in the mix with my dremel to mix everything,laquer thinner probably isn't the best thinner median,but it's what i've got lots of,lol).
If you're rebuilding old silly-foams,clean and lightly sand the tire on a sheet of 220 Wet/Dry sandpaper using 99% rubbing alcohol as a lubricant,then clean them using 99% ,before dipping them.
A piece of styrofoam is what i stuck the axles in to hold them after dipping,to hang them the other way,i used old magnets to hold the axles upside down on my steel bench,you want to let them hang each way for roughly 20 min's,helps avoid the puddling effect that will happen if you only hang them one way.
2nd coat i applied after the first coat had cured for at least 20 min's.
I cured them for a couple hours using heat,then let them sit for a few days before using.
Not meaning to butt in on your post,just passing my experiences on for you.
After you've done a few,you'll get you're own technic down,they do take a bit of experimenting to get right:thumbsup:.
BTW.i was always meaning to look into a better thinner median then laquer thinner,but i switched to slip-ons a 1/2 dozen yrs ago,and never pursued it after that,so you might want to search around for something better to use as a thinning agent,straight out of the tube,i always found the flowable to be to thick to work as a dipping agent,but that's me:wave:
You can also use normal old RTV silicone,and use your finger to apply it,some spit on a sheet of glass works to smooth it out


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## blubyu

I was told that using thinner like lacquer or any of the others was not the way to go for a durable coating? Was told about Micro-Marks silicone thinner was the ticket?


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## Hornet

Your probably right,the laquer was a bitch to mix throughly into the silicone,but i had lots on hand,:thumbsup:.
I did about 500 pairs using this combo of mix,sent about 300 pairs out for guys to try,never had many complaints about the coating's life expectancy,but also never had a proper thinner to compare the coatings too,so you could very well be right,about a better thinner giving a longer life'd coating.
At the time i looked around for a proper thinner,but this was close to 10 yrs ago when i was playing around with coating tires,and there wasn't that much that was easily available for thinners up here in Canuckville 
Years ago BSRT (probably 20yrs ago now) used to sell foam donuts in 2 hardness's that you glued to a hub,then trued to size before coating,if they still have any left over,that's your easiest approach to making your own silly-foam tires from scratch


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## Bill Hall

Oh OK Hornet!

I confess....I too have used the RTV and spit method too!

It worked great for baked AFX Specialty and Dragster tires.


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## joegri

ok class settle down now and open up your mind.thanx to hornet for adding /sharing nice to see an interest in tire makin.we left off with sanding to size.150 grit to get em close then 220 for the final shaping also take a lil off the edge to gie em a lil roundness and the dont catch a rail also they start to look realistic.once the dremmel is secured in the vice and your sure u like the size and shape take the silicone and put some on your finger and rub it in and smear it all around your home spun slicks now just hit the on switch and let it rip. just for a second or 2 ahh first coat done! youll notice the have a rough finish to em but the 2nd coat will make all sins go away.now you need a place to let em dry .i drilled a hole in a bench and insert the mandrell in it. to speed drying time i have a clip light and get it 3 or so inches from mandrell it will cure/dry em quickly.soon youll be ready for coat 2 repeat spreading silicone.this time stand the mandrell on the other end this will let the sillicone migrate to the other side.let them dry. hurry up and wait cuz that chassis is calling for her new skins.i go for 3 coats myself. they look so good you could eat,em.now boys its up to you go ahead and try it ! youll be rewarded with a fine product that u made. ther will be no final exam but i do what to see pics of your good and bad rounds.silifoam tires will and to the enjoyment of slot hobby.as for me i,m heading to a scratchbuilt that i started last winter. thanx for reading this enjoy boyz!!


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## Hornet

Bill that's how the first silly-foam came about,some guy showed up at i think it was the Hopra nats somewhere around the mid to late 80's with a homemade foam tire coated with RTV silicon,and things proceeded from there,that's my understanding of the story,but i sure wouldn't want to be quoted on it.
As far as i know,it was Tony at Slottech who pionered the mass produced dipped silly foam tire as we know it today
JoeG,you'll get a better finish if you look into thinning the flowable then dipping the tire in the mix.I'd check into what Blubyu suggested
The best finishes i used to get,were when i managed to get the flowable silicone thinned almost to a water like mix


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## blubyu

I have to confess,but I have been doing my own tires starting this summer for the winter season series (now). Just finished my last batch of .436 on .230x.340 rims and will post pics when they are dry. It's been fun learning the technique. So far they have worked as good as what is out there. But I was waiting for the true test on our banked oval as it tears up the outside tire and I can say the black foam that I was using could not hold up to the rookie who I had driving my loaner. The other colors that were used passed the test. Pics coming. SORRY!


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## blubyu

*Had Some Race Pics*

Top 3 from the last race all homemade,the yellow ones are also.


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## Hornet

They look really good Blu:thumbsup:.
Are you dipping them.


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## blubyu

No I'm not dipping them.Don't like to use my fingers either (to messy for me) I spread the first coat on using a scrap pc of plastic rubbing in the first coat real good then spinning it with a plastic cup covering the tire again to keep the mess down.


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## blubyu

Just as joegri say's the first coat is just to get it down into the foam and it looks a bit rough but the 2nd & 3rd coats change all that,nice and smooth. He also is right on about the amount of time spinning. I will spin a bit longer when I am trying to final match if one is sizing out taller it gets a second more.


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## joegri

hey blu and hornet thanx for attending i learned from the both of you . heading to the bench to see what some ascitone will do as a thinner.i,ll check back if i get a positive result.


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## blubyu

*Some off the bench*

Here are a few pics of some Wides & Narrows. First pic has the black tires from are banked oval standing up in back,they got shredded.The other axles all have a bunch of laps (400+) on flat ovals & roadcourses.


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## blubyu

*few more*

Some narrow closeup.


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## joegri

hey blubyu great pics!! got a question, what are the rins youre using? and what size axel fits in them.i gots some tuffys that could use nice wide aftermarket rims . so in short .062 axel hole and wide as i can get. i,m not lookin to make it look stock. im lookin to have some meats stickin out the fenders and getting crazy traction!! also about thinning. a dude told me today that alcahol could work as a thinner. heading down to the bench to see what trouble i can get into.again youre rims and tire look beautiful.yum yum.


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## blubyu

The .062 axle would work on any of the rims. When I would miss my mark on the lathe and cut one to small I would just keep going to about .340 dia. and make a set of T-jet tires for my Buds. Rims are 280x.250 blk for the wide tires. The narrows are .320 or .340x.210 or .230, wht rims .320,blu,blk rims .340.


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## bearsox

joegri said:


> hey blubyu great pics!! got a question, what are the rins youre using? and what size axel fits in them.i gots some tuffys that could use nice wide aftermarket rims . so in short .062 axel hole and wide as i can get. i,m not lookin to make it look stock. im lookin to have some meats stickin out the fenders and getting crazy traction!! also about thinning. a dude told me today that alcahol could work as a thinner. heading down to the bench to see what trouble i can get into.again youre rims and tire look beautiful.yum yum.


*Hey Joe , 
food for though... alcohol and sponge often not a good match . Cutting the silicone IMHO should be limited and cutting it with the wrong mixer can cause more issues than help. Alcohol actually slowly breaks down the sponge and can lead to sidewall blowout. Same holds true for some other items folks blend in including mineral spirits when over used. Often this makes for a good looking tire BUT that tires usually lasts not at all as long as an uncut topcoat. For a longer lasting tire i prefer 3 UNCUT coats. To make the silicone slightly more workable just warm the tube in hot water prior to dispensing it. 1st mount rim onto axle and chuck into dremel. Sand seat area to prep for gluing donut on rim. Use Walthers glue to glue donut. Grind to size. Massage silicone into donut . Apply UNCUT coats 1 at a time about 6-9 hrs apart ( be sure to capture edges with each coat ) and voila ! Ok that's the short version but you get the idea .

Bear :wave:*


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## blubyu

As far as thinning the non flowable silicone's I was told to try Toluene. But my biggest problem was then how to store what I had mixed up without drying up & to repeat it? Have a few ideas on the storage part that I still have to try. But I plan on trying the thinner from Micro-Mark @$15.00 a bottle. I do have some thin as water stuff that is sweet,and really gives a shinny coat with looking smooth like I put 5 coats on. It's so thin you would spin it right off doing it like I do with the flowable stuff,have to work on applying it a different way.


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## blubyu

I have to agree with Bearsox also,The manufacture that has help me out, did alot of testing and said that is not the way to go.


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## joegri

thanx for the heads up bearsox.my add kicked in and started workin on a tuffy so,i never mixed anything up.as i read on im thinkin that first i dont race. and i really dont make beautiful cars. so its straight out of the tube silicone for me. its what i know.however i have never heated the silicone up. i think that is the futurer is ,fact i think i,ll put that tube in the microwave for say 2 mins on hi!!! yeah thats it microwave the future. cmon im kiddin.but yes D i concure warming the silicone should be the way to go!! nice to see you jumpin in on this topic i always respect what u have to offer up .and same to BBU your tire look smooooth and sticky!!.heading to a new situation in tuning plz look for it and add if you know my prob.


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## blubyu

I just lay my tube on top of the furnace while I am setting everything up,did the hot water in a cup but the moisture cures any around the cap fast,then you have to watch out for dried silicone pcs.


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## blubyu

*2 Styles*

The 3pr. in the back are thinned black RTV. 2pr in front, black are rounded edges,Greys are a straight cut.


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## joegri

i know i,m sick cuz they look good enough to eat !! liken the blu/gray combo too.


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## 4eyes

blubyu - I guess I may have got lost reading this thread, but where do you get those beautiful rims - do you make them yourself? Are you starting with the same sponge tire mentioned in the beginning of the thread? Your tires don't just look great, they look better than anything I have ever bought. If it is not too much to ask could you take us through your steps, the products you use and the mixtures. If the answer is no I would completely understand because you got something great going here!


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## 4eyes

also where do the great colors come from?


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## bearsox

4eyes said:


> also where do the great colors come from?


*Hi ,
for foam products you can either get them as Joe mentions earlier in the thread or you can contact http://www.amfoam.com/rubber.html and ask them to tell you what to get based on what all the other slot car guys who buy from them use. Rims ... also sold on ebay under slot cars HO just search rims as a couple of guys sell them. Colorizing rims is easy as using RIT clothing dye or Dylon in a pot on the stove. All of the rims sold by my buddy Slade i dyed up using one or the other of these dyes for him awhile back. If he or Dan Walsh do NOT have rims for sale on ebay i MAY be able to help so email me and i will see if can do so but no promises. If you go back and look through this thread you now have pretty much all you need to make sili's . Good luck !

Bear :wave: *


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## blubyu

4eyes, Bearsox has got you covered.Using RIT to color...rims,chassis....Checkout the 1/24 sites on gluing foam tires for tips & tinning glue. Glue for rims=3M weather stripping adhesive thinned W/lacquer thinner, Coating for sponge=VersaChem flowable silicone straight from the tube. I have used dbl flanged rims by cutting down the flanges also. Hope this helps you.


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## joegri

het dennis and blu thanx much for adding to this thread!! it started out as some thing i thought i could add to the HT community turns out i went to school on you guys.thanx for all your input.now just keep the sili,s on the track!!


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## LeeRoy98

joegri said:


> this my rendition of an article by a guy named trek that i saw on marion county speedway.


That would be Trek Lawler (posted with his approval), yes... the X man himself and Marion County Raceway (Marion County Speedway is a real 1:1 track) AND last but not least based upon a compilation of information first seen on... drum roll please... 
HOBBY TALK!!!

Is this a great hobby or what??

Gary
AKA LeeRoy98
www.marioncountyraceway.com


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## Sir Slotsalot

This is excellent guys!! I was ready to chuck my worn out silisponges until I saw your thread. I feel much better now. Being this easy, you'd think the tire makers would offer a refurb service. The answer I got from one of them was NO. I will definately try this at home. It looks pretty safe.


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## joegri

you got nothin to loose but your time go for it!!!


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## copperhead71

Great info! love those tires, A BIG HOP UP!


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## blubyu

*fresh silicone*

Latest batch for next seasons series.


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## joegri

hey blu that batch of candy looks tastey.just spun a coupla of sets last week.glad to see this topic risin up again !! let em roll.


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## NTxSlotCars

Wow, guys, I have a whole box of used Wizzard silicones I would like to redo.

This 'flowable' silicone, has anyone tried using it to make molds for bodies and stuff?
I saw someone mention Harbor Freight, whats the prices on some of these products?
Any links to these products?


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## blubyu

How is it working for you joegri? Thanks,they look nice but they have to work on the Race Track next season......will find out in October?


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## joegri

the tires that i,ve spun up all seem to be better than fair.they dont pick up dirt so thats a plus.but i believe home spun tires would really perform on a track surface that is smooth and glossy.i posed that question on the trak building forum.as with anything else the more you do it the better you get at it.i wish i could sit down and spin up 5 or so sets but it seems i have so many more things to do first.wifey has me painting ceilings/hall livingroom/kitchen and replacing all baseboard windoow casing and door casing. wheeew... i,m bout halfway there so not too much slotcave/ bench time these days.


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## blubyu

joegri, I'm going to be in the same boat as you this summer with HOUSE PROJECTS,thats why I started early on next seasons tires.We have an addition and new deck & pool project that just broke ground! I hope to have it all done so my tracks can still be used in are series.


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## blubyu

*Last batch for now*

Heres some pics of mounted & glued,cut and finished up with coats of silicone.


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## bearsox

blubyu said:


> Heres some pics of mounted & glued,cut and finished up with coats of silicone.


*Excellent lookers ! You seam to have a great system down and the results sure show .

Bear :wave:*


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## blubyu

Thanks Bear! Actually they look almost as good as yours.As far as results I'll wait till this Fall season to see if the changes I made work the way I'm hoping (looking for less increase in size as they get run in). I should of shot some pics of the T-jet tires I did with the rims I picked up from you at the last Midwest slot show.


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## bearsox

blubyu said:


> Thanks Bear! Actually they look almost as good as yours.As far as results I'll wait till this Fall season to see if the changes I made work the way I'm hoping (looking for less increase in size as they get run in). I should of shot some pics of the T-jet tires I did with the rims I picked up from you at the last Midwest slot show.


Dude these look terrific ! Thanks for the nice comments but i am quite sure ya got me covered . Do post the tjet tires as i would love to see what ya do with em as well. 

Bear :wave:


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## blubyu

*T-jet Tires*

Bear, here is what I have left for T-jet tires (2pr) I only picked up 4pr from you at the show and have given the other 2pr away to a local Racer to test out. .342 & .344 sizes.


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## bearsox

blubyu said:


> Bear, here is what I have left for T-jet tires (2pr) I only picked up 4pr from you at the show and have given the other 2pr away to a local Racer to test out. .342 & .344 sizes.


*EXtremely nice looking edge work ! What's the coat count on them ? 

Bear :wave:*


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## blubyu

3 coats.With the 1st worked in real good,sides also.Have done some with 5 coats? But I think it's a waste of silicone as you'll have a hard time wearing out 2 coats? Still learning what the cars wants.


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## Mach10_shooter

If anyones interested... I have all the tools and supplies to make your own tires like the above. I was doing it quite a bit a year or so ago but have not had time lately. I'd let it all go. It includes a custom tire grinding lathe, doughnuts, rims, and a couple varieties of sili.

LMK
Chris


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## blubyu

*Stuff*

PM sent.


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## bearsox

blubyu said:


> 3 coats.With the 1st worked in real good,sides also.Have done some with 5 coats? But I think it's a waste of silicone as you'll have a hard time wearing out 2 coats? Still learning what the cars wants.


whoa 5 coats ? Serious coating dude ! I think your right there with the 3 and working in the 1st via massage. these like i say look great and i suspect work very well too. The big time commercial guys use less and often thin out the coats to cosmetically look better . This too also usually cause the side wall blowouts and just happens to lead to more purchases . Funny how that works LOL !

Bear :wave:


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## bkreaume

I would realy like to give this a try. I found the guy on ebay for the sponge tires. But where can I find the rims?


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## joegri

try bearsox/ballsout/dennis i believe he has the rims yer lookin for. just send him a pm!


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## bearsox

bkreaume said:


> I would realy like to give this a try. I found the guy on ebay for the sponge tires. But where can I find the rims?


Depending on type and size etc i MAY be able to help you out but need to know what your looking for I.E. tjet rims or magnet car / AFX sized rims etc. 

Bear :wave:


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## blubyu

Bear,I have some silicone that runs almost like water,works real good for a first coat on the porous black sponge to keep that smooth look instead of pebbled. I have to be careful when drying them though as it will run down if set in the holder to early? I think 3 coats is plenty as more sponge would work out better for car handling??? Oh GO BLACKHAWKS!


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## bearsox

blubyu said:


> Bear,I have some silicone that runs almost like water,works real good for a first coat on the porous black sponge to keep that smooth look instead of pebbled. I have to be careful when drying them though as it will run down if set in the holder to early? I think 3 coats is plenty as more sponge would work out better for car handling??? Oh GO BLACKHAWKS!


*In between 2nd and 3rd period now and were leading in the quest for the cup !!! 
As for that silicone that runs like water ... send me the info if ya don't mind as i'm curious as to what it is. Only way i seen it quite that flowable is via cutting with a silicone thinner .

Bear :wave: *


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## bkreaume

bearsox said:


> Depending on type and size etc i MAY be able to help you out but need to know what your looking for I.E. tjet rims or magnet car / AFX sized rims etc.
> 
> Bear :wave:


Bear,

I think I will start out with t-jets and maganatraction. I mostly have the autoword variety right know.


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## bearsox

bkreaume said:


> Bear,
> 
> I think I will start out with t-jets and maganatraction. I mostly have the autoword variety right know.


I can send ya a mixed bag of tjet and larger sizes say 20 pairs total which would get ya enough to play around with. Cost would be say $28 shipped . LMK if that is ok and i will get ya my address to send a MO to.

Bear :wave:


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## bkreaume

cool shot me a PM


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## bearsox

bkreaume said:


> cool shot me a PM


*You got mail !

Bear:wave:*


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## blubyu

Anyone have any tips for trueing sponge tires?


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## alpink

well, this was ONE way to bring this up to the front again.


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## blubyu

Yeah it's about time to get ready for this upcoming Race season........If I can find some free time?


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## Boosted-Z71

I modified a Hudy Micro tire truer by machining a new spindle and some machining on the arm and stop block to work on HO size tires, it works great, very repeatable, not the cheapest method, but they come off the machine perfect. Prior to that I had used a tire mandrel in my mini-mill against a diamond coated block, real good results with that setup as well but a bit overkill.
I will scuff silifoams on the Hudy as well, just mount them up and scuff with 1200-1500 wet paper lightly.

Boosted


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## HO_Only

Dumb question....I've read all through this thread and I see that most of you are putting on more that one coat. Do let the silicone completely dry between coats?

TIA


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## blubyu

Yes,but not for 24hrs. Just long enough so it's not tacky and I can take a size reading about 30min with Permatex flowable. That way I know to spin it less or more for size.


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