# JL XT Pickup Shoes



## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

Hi Guys,
I have three release 1 JL X-Tractions in my runner case. They are basically new and I've finally gotten around to doing some tuning. I've done two of them so far and without doing anything radical (I still need to correct the rear wheels - either they are pressed on crooked or the axle is bent), I've improved them a lot. One of the big improvements came from tapping down the rivet on the rear gear; it was slipping a lot on the crown gear.

My question concerns the pickup shoes. It seems that one of the cars loses contact wth the rails whenever it fishtails. If you're going fast enough, you may pick up contact later in the turn; if not, you stall. I swapped out the JL ski shoes for an old worn pair of long step AFX shoes and the problem went away. So, I need to tweak the ski shoes. I tried bending them a few different ways and can sometime make them better, but not as good as the long step shoes. I don't think I can bend them into the shape of the long step shoes.

Advice? In general, is the long step AFX shoe the best of the three - ski, short step, long step?

Thanks...Joe


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## martybauer31 (Jan 27, 2004)

I like the stepped shoes better, the longer ones will give you more contact area so should run better as well.

If you have a spare piece of track, set your car on it and look underneath to see how the shoe contacts the rail, make sure that it lies flat across the whole step otherwise you are not going to get all you can out of your car. Bend your shoe accordingly to how it appears to be lining up with the track rail.

You may also want to play with limiting the travel of the shoe by either folding the top of the pickup shoe over slightly or using some heat shrink tubing over the top.

Hope that helps.


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## dlw (Aug 17, 1999)

One thing I come across ia a little warpage on the stepped part of the shoe (the part that contacts the rails). I just squeeze that section in needle-nosed pliers to starighten them out (don't straighten the actual step), after that I correct the bend to get the good contact angle.


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## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

Thanks guys. I should also mention I have replaced the front tires with some new O-Rings.

One of the times I bent the shoes, trying to replicate the long step shoe, I ended up raising the front tires off the ground. So I undid that bend. I've been trying to put a slight bow into the shoes. This has made the shoes better than being straight, but not as good as the stepped shoe. I've got to keep trying to replicate the long step shoe. 

DLW,
The stock JL shoes have no step in them, so there is no warpage to correct. When I did replace the ski shoes with stepped shoes, the car ran much better. I'm hoping there is a way to get ski shoes to work well.


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## twolff (May 11, 2007)

The XTraction shoes I've messed with were all hitting the rail with only the very front edge of the bend out of the box. I bent them at the rear hanger so they would hang lower in the rear and bowed them slightly downward too. They seemed ok, but they also wear rather quickly compared to an Aurora Magnatraction shoe. I prefer the AutoWorld wide shoes over either one, but I've never tried any other aftermarket shoes.


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## dlw (Aug 17, 1999)

Ok, Grandcheapskate....I misunderstood you. But the R1 XT shoes are warped the wrong way, caused by the way they put them on the cars. A little careful bending will fix this. And if you wish, you can put a step in these shoes, similiar to the steps you see on current XT's.

With needle-nose pliers, make a downward bend about 1/3 length of shoe from the front end. Then, just slightly ahead of that bend, put an upward bend, which will give you a homemade stepped pickup shoe, giving you even 'footing' against the newer AW's.

Twolff, you don't want too much of the shoes to contact the rails, or any fishtailing you do may short you car or track. You only want half of the shoe, or less to touch.


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## twolff (May 11, 2007)

dlw said:


> Twolff, you don't want too much of the shoes to contact the rails, or any fishtailing you do may short you car or track. You only want half of the shoe, or less to touch.


Ah. Most of them are setup with about the forward 3/4 of the shoe contacting the rail. I've got a couple that use the shoe all the way back to the springs. They do tend to hang up on the rails when they get sideways and you have to lift the car to get the shoes back on the rails. Could be why I prefer the AW stepped shoes.


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## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

Hi Guys,
Playing around with the bend in the shoes does eventually lead to making them better. It just takes time.

One of the issues, not just with JL cars, but original Aurora as well, seems to be that the shoes get "stuck" when the car fishtails. Most times this leads to losing contact with the rails, but sometimes the car just spins the rear wheels. Is this simply a function of the thin shoes and you must live with it?

On another tuning topic. One (maybe two) of the 3 JL R1 XTs I have seems to have a very tight rear axle. The drive train is nice and loose, and the armature spins freely when in place. However, when I put everything together, the car is tight. I narrowed this down to the rear axle not turning freely. I try to read all the tuning posts about these cars but don't remember reading anything about reaming out the rear axle holes. Is that a common tuning practice? I'm also not convinced that the axle isn't bent or that the chassis isn't slightly warped, thereby causing the rear axle holes not to line up.

It also seems the gear plate, when looking from the rear of the car, is tilted. It is higher on the crown gear side than on the other. This is not caused by the "hooks" in the front, as the gear plate is sitting square on the chassis. Has anyone needed to shave any material from the back of the chassis to get the gearplate to sit straight?

Thanks...Joe


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

Yup Joe, I've seen some irregularities jack the rear of the gear plate askew to the point that the crown is bound. I usually look for flash or malformations on rear index pegs of the gearplate and the corresponding chassis pockets first and trim them with a blade.

Sometimes there is an irregularity down the bottom sides of the gearplate in the north/south direction towards the rear. Some careful file work cures this quick.

Of course it never hurts to check the chassis tub for flat along it's top edge. I just drop them onto a small piece of glass or known flat surface to see if they do the rocky horse. Ya cant take much off here but it is possible to take just a smidge off.

Sometimes it's only one thing and sometimes its a combination of the evils. Ya just gotta pick and poke at it til the plate drops in square. If after all that the final drive is still "gritchy" I like to swap AW crowns for a known good AFX crown as a test. Some times this alone can fix those skeeeeezer gearskip issues. An inspection of the pinion never hurts either as it hides up and out of sight and could conceal a problem.

Once I get things sorted out a lapping with toothpaste (ultra bright) often takes the typical AW buzz saw noises out and smooths things considerably.

As to your shoe snagging issues; If rolling up the "toe" of the contact patch under the hanger window hasnt helped. I'd be suspicious of the rail height. Swap in a set of the wider footprint shoes and see if the snags go away.


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## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

Hi Bill,
Thanks for letting me know that I may have to shave the chassis. I was thinking about doing a little grinding on the gearplate tabs and chassis pocket, but they are so small I need a magnifying glass to see what I'm doing.

I also like the idea of putting the chassis on a piece of glass.

I don't know if I made it clear that the rear axle is tight even when there is no gearplate in place. I can feel tightness just turning the rear axle in an empty chassis. It should be a lot looser than what I'm feeling and I'm guessing it's one of three things - (1) the axle holes are too small, (2) the axle is bent or (3) the chassis is warped and the axle holes are off.

Also, do you ever notice the following: look at the chassis from the rear. There is a "U" shape to the back of the chassis. The gearplate sits atop the side walls of the "U" and the axle holes are in the side walls. It looks to me that on all three of my XTs, the left side wall (looking from the rear and the wall closest to the crown gear) is slanted outward. On an Aurora AFX, the two walls of the "U" are completely parallel. This would be a problem with the mold.

Joe


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## Bill Hall (Jan 6, 2007)

*Ahoy matey! It's a Chinese Junk.*

Har Joe! If ya dont have a tech block a good piece of glass works pretty good for checking chassis. A lot of my weirdo customs dont 'zactly adhere to Fray or Vhors specifications so a tech block is useless. I just lay the shoes, springs and guide pin aside, remove the idler gear and roll that pup across the glass. Gives me an immediate indicator to any wierd lumpage in tires wheels or axles. Tells me how my crown/pinion mesh is, and of course most importanly whether or not all four corners are touching. Just put your fingie on the armature gear and gently roll it across the glass. You'll be surprised what you can feel and see. I'd be lost without it. 

Could very well be ya got a warped chassis causing the "bound axle-crappy crown mesh-gearskip syndrome". Yup the saggy left side is common.

For the most part words like square, plumb, parallel, and concentric dont really apply to this product unless you enforce it on your own. They're just toys after all. Some horse shoe and handgrenade technology can get most of them down the track. My problem is drawing the line between giving it one more shot or the windmill dunk into the trash. I usually opt for the former, but the latter is always tempting


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## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

Hi Bill,
For what I paid for almost all my early JLs, I can't complain too much about quality. They is what they is. Although it would seem that with CAD designs, it should almost be harder to make something wrong than to make it right.

There's no question something is out of alignment. In certain positions, the chassis will rock right rear (passenger side) to front left. Rarely do both wheels touch the track.

I'll have to work on the chassis to see if I can get the gearplate to lay straight. And then I'll have to work on getting the rear axle loose. It may finally be time for me to break down and buy a wheel and gear puller. There's going to be no way to fix this without completely dismantling the chassis.

I'm a stubborn guy. When I buy a new car, I will get it running. I don't even like having old cars that don't run.

Joe


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## SwamperGene (Dec 1, 2003)

Joe, this could be what you're seeing. We've confirmed and fixed this on a number of early XT chassis.


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## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

Hi Gene,
I have read through that tip before and have been checking all the XTs for that problem. The gearplate on this chassis looks to be sitting perfectly square. Both magnets show the same amount on the left and right. Even looking very closely doesn't show any issues.

The issue on this chassis (and at least one more) seems to be at the rear of the gearplate. This is not even a case of the gearplate lifting up (although that makes it worse); when fully seated, the left side is not level with the right side. This may or may not be a problem; it may be close enough.

And the tight rear axle. The car will never run loose with an axle that tight. I don't now if running the car a lot will eventually open the rear axle holes, but I'm afraid that with the amount of resistance in the rear axle, the armature is going to get really hot.

Joe


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## dlw (Aug 17, 1999)

Joe, try using the knurled ends of an XT rear axle to ream those axle holes a little. That should stop the binding....


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## Grandcheapskate (Jan 5, 2006)

dlw said:


> Joe, try using the knurled ends of an XT rear axle to ream those axle holes a little. That should stop the binding....


 Yup, that is something I will try as soon as I pick up a wheel puller. I don't want to pull it apart using just a screwdriver.

Joe


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## jeremy1082 (Apr 27, 2004)

One of the best mods that I have ever made and the least expensive way to more power is adding original AFX non-magnatraction silver pickup shoes to my magnatraction and X-Traction cars. They do fit and it's like adding a 4 barrel carburetor to a 2 barrel car...instant horsepower gain and they last longer.


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