# Pl Seaview Tips Needed



## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

I have recieved the polar lights seaview kit and wanted to get some information from those who have built it. I know i want a two tone light bottom and darker top area. this kit has the 8 small windows up front instead of the 4 large windows, and both ways looks good. I was thinking of painting only the 3 dividing lines that run from top to bottom and eliminate the long right to left horizontal line in the center to make it look like it has the 4 big windows instead of the 8 small ones. has anyone done that with this kit ? and any painting tips also appreciated.


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## jay_barnes (Apr 11, 2002)

edited


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

My PL Seaview:
http://www.inpayne.com/models/seaview_pl1a.html

My Lunar Models 33-incher:
http://www.inpayne.com/models/seaview_lm1.html

My detailing and painting research:
http://inpayne.com/seaview/seaviewpics.html

The belly and dive plane undersides are bright white, the topsides a medium gray. I've found that both testors ModelMaster Medium gray or Dark Ghost Gray look good. I used Medium on the PL kit and Dark Ghost on the Lunar.

Just leaving out the cross-bar for a 4-window effect is terribly inaccurate. The Flying sub-carrying version had windows on one level only, whereas the pilot-movie version had 8 windows on 2 levels, 4 above 4. Hence the 4-window bank is only half the height of the 8-window bank.

What you should do is sand the clear nose piece smooth and buff it shiney again, then mask it for just the one-level set of 4 windows of the proper height.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

Also, of note is the artificial shading done to the model because filming underwater washes out the depth and details, so the models had shading applied to the lower half of the hull above the chine(or whatever) and on the lower engine tube areas too.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

And here is my good old build-up:



http://culttvman.com/dave_hussey_s_seview.html

Huzz


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

thanks everyone, those are excellent seaviews gentlemen ! now i see the differences in the hull nose shapes with each window version. if i was to go with the 4 window i would need to add the sonar humps on each side to make it look right and then the shape of the front nose would be different, i think i will stay with the 8 window movie version so everything will look correct. John, that is the coolest diorama i have ever seen, it looks very real. that was a great idea you had there ! all of those seaviews are very well done, i hope mine will come out just as nice as all of yours have ! thank you for the very helpul information !


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Jay, i see you have also modified the conning tower windows on yours , it looks like you moved those small windows out to the sides, that looks pretty good, did you make a new part for that ?


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

John P said:


> My PL Seaview:
> http://www.inpayne.com/models/seaview_pl1a.html
> 
> My Lunar Models 33-incher:
> ...


 John, when you painted your window frames, did you mask the 8 windows with tape or liquid mask ? or did you hand paint the dividing lines ?


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## veedubb67 (Jul 11, 2003)

JP,
Every time I see your Seaview diorama I get inspired to take a crack at it. Just curious, if you had to do it all over again, is there anything you'd change or try differently?

Rob


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## jay_barnes (Apr 11, 2002)

edited


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

There are a couple of aftermarket accurizing kits for the PL _Seaview _if you want to do the four-window TV version, but they're definitely for advanced and very patient modelers as they require an awful lot of shaping and filling to look right. IIRC, Rebellion Creations makes a complete nose section that has to be mated with the kit hull after you've sliced off the front. I don't know about its current availability, though.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Don't know how much time and money you're willing to invest, but a set of Micro-Mark polishing abrasives would come in very handy when it comes to getting those windows nice and crisp.

For my Lubliner _Seaview_ I used Testors Model Master Medium grey (FS35237) for the primary hull color, and Testors Model Master Camouflage Gray (FS 36622) for the underside. 

The best _Seaview_ miniature I've ever seen is the one Ed Miarecki built, pix of which can be found via the link below. I found these shots very helpful when I was building my model.

http://www.fxmodels.com/seaview.shtml

Happy building!


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

that is a very nice job on your sail jay, thanks for the link carson, man, that is one beautiful seaview.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Thanks for the nice words!!

I made my Seaview using the Rebellion Creations resin bow. It comes with that tiny Flying Sub too. You do get a nice result but you have to be prepared to cut the bow off your styrene Seaview, mate the new resin bow and do a lot of filling and sanding. But you do get a nice result!!

There are more comments if you check the link in my last post. Here it is again:

http://culttvman.com/dave_hussey_s_seview.html

"Ahead two thirds, Mister Morton"

Huzz


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

model maker said:


> John, when you painted your window frames, did you mask the 8 windows with tape or liquid mask ? or did you hand paint the dividing lines ?


 I masked the windows off with bare Metal Foil. I can't hand paint very cleanly .


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

veedubb67 said:


> JP,
> Every time I see your Seaview diorama I get inspired to take a crack at it. Just curious, if you had to do it all over again, is there anything you'd change or try differently?
> 
> Rob


 Well, the fake railroad water has since yellowed and shrunk, so it doesn't look nearly as good now. Plus, the bubbling splash was bigger in the movie - I never got it the same proportions. If I did it over, I think I'd like to try using expanding foam insulation for the splashes instead.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

John P said:


> I masked the windows off with bare Metal Foil. I can't hand paint very cleanly .


 me either, i have that liquid mask but it didn't work very well with my jupiter 2 fusion cores tiny clear panes


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

model maker said:


> me either, i have that liquid mask but it didn't work very well with my jupiter 2 fusion cores tiny clear panes


They used to have a brand of liquid masking that worked well. Made by Hobbico, or something like that. Walthers bought them out, and stopped making it. I HATE Micro-Mask! It takes longer to set, than most paints.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

I use liquid Laytex for mask. Goes on easy, and very gentle when removing.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

yep thats what i tried to use , micro mask. i layered it on the bottom panes and put in on thicker in 1 coat on the side panes to see which method worked best and both sucked. i ended up masking all 64 tiny panes on that fusion core part, but it came out good with the masking tape.now i see the fusin core is now an aftermarket accessorie that has a clear insert.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Carson Dyle said:


> ...The best _Seaview_ miniature I've ever seen is the one Ed Miarecki built, pix of which can be found via the link below...http://www.fxmodels.com/seaview.shtml


Yepp.....haaaaaahhh. That's the _Seaview_.

Note the frame around the nose windows, on the latter, four-window version.

About the two-tone hull: it's been years, but it seemed to me that the hull was the same color all over. Perhaps, the filming miniatures were painted two-tone, in order to give that impression.

I realize this is similar to the question of the color of the original TV Enterprise. Supposedly, it was, in fact, a metallic silver color; the lighting and post-processing gave it the white look. So, then the question to the modelmaker is whether to model what is apparent on-screen, or what is used to create the effect. 

If I were to build the Seaview, I would have it the same color all over, because I believe that is what it was _intended_ to look like.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Well, if you're building the movie version Seaview, it WAS gray on top and white below, without question:
http://www.inpayne.com/models/seaview_pl1c.html

And the original TV Enterprise was concrete gray overall, no metallic:
http://www.culttvman2.com/dnn/Features/Articles/tabid/74/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/7/Default.aspx



> Richard Datin states: "Jeffries also furnished paint chips, for which I had lacquer-based paint custom-matched by a Fuller's Paint dealer on Olympic Blvd. in Los Angeles"....."it was not a Ford or GM paint or primer as some "learned" souls have decried. It was a flat finish--a light grey color with a light tint of green."


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

John P said:


> Well, if you're building the movie version Seaview, it WAS gray on top and white below, without question...


I have seen this scene a few times. I've never been inclined to think "wow, the Seaview is white on the bottom". The movement is fast enough, that it appears that the underside is merely reflecting light. 

And there are enough underwater shots of her underside, that suggest the _intent_ was that she appear the same color all over.

I am not trashing anyone's models, period. Shoot, I painted my best-effort Aurora Seaview a blue-green, because that's how she looked underwater! 

I have a related question: what real submarines have been painted white, on their lower hulls? 



John P said:


> And the original TV Enterprise was concrete gray overall, no metallic...


It's been a while, since I read about this. The point is, the ship consistently looks white on TV. If they had _wanted_ her to look grey, they certainly had the smarts, to pull it off.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Really? 'Cause I never thoguht it looked white on TV - medium gray-blue, maybe.

here's some underwater shots of the Seaview from the pilot movie, with it's definitely-white belly:
http://inpayne.com/seaview/seaviewpics.html
(Scroll down)


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

John beat me to it but for those of you too impatient to load JP's page, here's the condensed version of my own screen grabs (and, no matter how you rationalize it, the Seaview is painted white on the underside):


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

thats how i plan on painting mine


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Brent Gair said:


> John beat me to it but for those of you too impatient to load JP's page, here's the condensed version of my own screen grabs (and, no matter how you rationalize it, the Seaview is painted white on the underside)...


No, the Seaview PROP is painted white, on the underside. No matter how YOU rationalize it, there is a difference between what is used to create the illusion, and the subject of the intended illusion seen on screen. 

Individual frames will reveal the sleight-of-hand used in motion pictures. To me, the intent of the filmmaker is seen only at 24 fps.

Evidently, some of you want your models to look the same as the props. I want my models to look like the full-size subjects they represent on screen.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

I subscribe to the "paint the model like it appears on the screen, don't paint it like the prop" theory.

But I painted my Seaview white on the bottom because that is the way it always looked to me on TV.

Huzz


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

What color is the model in Nelson's office?


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

toyroy said:


> No, the Seaview PROP is painted white, on the underside. No matter how YOU rationalize it, there is a difference between what is used to create the illusion, and the subject of the intended illusion seen on screen.
> 
> Individual frames will reveal the sleight-of-hand used in motion pictures. To me, the intent of the filmmaker is seen only at 24 fps.
> 
> Evidently, some of you want your models to look the same as the props. I want my models to look like the full-size subjects they represent on screen.


 Oh good lord ... :freak:


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

toyroy said:


> No, the Seaview PROP is painted white, on the underside. No matter how YOU rationalize it, there is a difference between what is used to create the illusion, and the subject of the intended illusion seen on screen.
> 
> Individual frames will reveal the sleight-of-hand used in motion pictures. To me, the intent of the filmmaker is seen only at 24 fps.
> 
> Evidently, some of you want your models to look the same as the props. I want my models to look like the full-size subjects they represent on screen.


Too many 'shrooms there Toy??

So, is the Seaview Light blue, or grey? What kind of grey? are the lights a bright yellow, or white? 

IF you do the model like the props, and photograph them like the props, YOU KNOW WHAT YOU HAVE??? Photos of the Seaview that look like the one on film. Jeez.


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Now now, let's be nice.

Besides, I have it on good authority that the Seaview in the black and white episodes was actually painted different shades of pink. Its true. Monsters in Motion even tried to replicate that in their resin kit, although they did it on the later 4 window version:

http://www.culttvman.com/monsters_in_motion_seaview_rev.html

Huzz


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Y3a said:


> Too many 'shrooms there Toy??


Not that I'm complaining, but how long _do_ I play the red-shirted phasor target? 



Y3a said:


> So, is the Seaview Light blue, or grey? What kind of grey? are the lights a bright yellow, or white?


Exactly. 



Y3a said:


> IF you do the model like the props, and photograph them like the props, YOU KNOW WHAT YOU HAVE??? Photos of the Seaview that look like the one on film. Jeez.


Ahhhhhhhhhh. You guys all have fish aquariums. I get it. :drunk:


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

For what it's worth, the underside of the eight-windowed _Seaview_ is not "white" but a very light shade of grey.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Then use ModelMaster "Light Gray," which is basically off-white. I almost went with that too, but the stills of the emergency blow from the movie make it look more white to me.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

toyroy said:


> Not that I'm complaining, but how long _do_ I play the red-shirted phasor target?


Until you finish your paper Jupiter 2...


LOL


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

John P said:


> ...the stills of the emergency blow from the movie make it look more white to me.


Kinda like the TV _Enterprise_ looks white.  

These color scheme arguments always crack me up.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

yep here is my 100 Gallon aquarium !


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

toyroy said:


> Not that I'm complaining, but how long _do_ I play the red-shirted phasor target?
> 
> Exactly.
> 
> ...


 yep sure do


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Its very very very light black on bottom, and only very light black everywhere else.

Huzz


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

This is the great thing about modeling BBs. Where else will people look at a picture of white and find ways to explain why it isn't really white?


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Yes Brent, there really is a Seaview.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Yes, there really is. It's a 12-foot long model with a gray top and a white bottom. That's the real Seaview.

And this is the second thread in two days where some wise guy has pulled the "you know it's not REAL, don't you?" card, and I'm sick of it.


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## the Dabbler (Feb 17, 2005)

It's all just a pigment of your imagination. It's really reflection off the white icebergs !! :thumbsup:


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

I saw the seaview in buena park, ca. at a now closed place called cars of stars and planes of fame. it had all kinds of movie cars, the motor cycle from then came bronson {remember that show ?) it had robby the robot plus the submarine set that rocked back in forth that was open on one side for the cameras. they used that in a lot of movies. now, i saw the seaview it looked gray and it was a lighter color on the bottom. i remember it having a rough texture and it was very long. i have a link somewhere wher it describes the making of the seaview and they said there were actually 3 subs. 18 feet 12 feet and 3 feet long. i am going to find the link and post it below somewhere.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

Actually, a 17 foot blue one for dragging along the surface on a pond, an 8 foot job for FS-1 dropping, a 4 foot job and a 2 foot job for shot s with the "Giant Octopus" The rest were grey with airbrushed highlights!


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

here is a picture of the 18 footer being lowered or slid into the water and also a cutaway seaview picture


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

here is a link to a seaview link i found. lots of info and fan built seaviews here.
http://www.vttbots.com/seaview.html


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

here is an article on seaview in buena park
Another close-up of the nose of the 17 ft. Seaview studio model. here is the belly of the 18 footer and also a screen grab showing a lighter colored belly

I took this photograph sometime in 1975/76 while the model was on display at Planes of Fame and Cars of the Stars in Buena Park, California.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

here is a pic from cars of stars and planes of fame in buena park


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

clearly a white or at least a lighter colored underside. how about 2 seaviews side by side ?


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

here is a good link
http://rtq.net/rtq/modeling/Seaview/SeaviewStudioModels_pt2.asp


http://rtq.net/rtq/modeling/Seaview/SeaviewStudioModels_pt1.asp

http://www.vttbots.com/seaview_central.html


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

and a real neat link to see all the special effects and how they were done.
http://www.vttbots.com/special_effects_central.html


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

go here!

http://www.cloudster.com/sets&vehicles/Seaview/SeaviewTop.htm


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

If the Seaview was white, why did Aurora cast it in _black_? Huh? Aurora would NEVER mislead us.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

*Time for some attitude adjustment, heh heh.*



toyroy said:


> If the Seaview was white, why did Aurora cast it in _black_? Huh? Aurora would NEVER mislead us.


Okay, *that does it!* Tie 'im onto the sofa, here boys...that's it. Make those knots good and tight - he's gonna be kicking in a minute. Now I'll just slip these headphones on - KEEP STILL!! Man, they had an easier time tying Boris Karloff down in _Bride of Frankenstein..._all comfy toyroy? Good.

Now I'll just take the headphone jack and plug it into this tape player. See here? I've got a tape arranged in a loop so that it will play continuously. And what's on the tape, you ask? Why what else but - Frankie Avalon singing "The Theme Song from _Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea_". BWAHHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

Enjoy, toyroy.......*click!*


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## veedubb67 (Jul 11, 2003)

You mean the "La-La" song?
http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/2044/sounds/lala2.WAV


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Don't forget Godzilla was pink!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

John P said:


> Don't forget Godzilla was pink!


You think you're "in Payne" now, kid? When it's your turn, I'm going to set the "Syrupy" setting in Dolby to Max!


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

Toy,

Got that Paper Jupiter 2 dunn yet?? 


LOL

WHY NOT?

WE're ALL WAITING to see it!

What color will it be?

Is that the "Correct" shade of Unobtanium?

What about the Confusion Kore?

How many laigs will yers have?


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Mark McGovern said:


> ...Frankie Avalon singing "The Theme Song from _Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea_"...


Yo markie, 
How about you and Joe McCarthy go burn some witches, huh?


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

John P said:


> Don't forget Godzilla was pink!


I thought you said he was white on the bottom?


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Y3a said:


> Toy,
> 
> Got that Paper Jupiter 2 dunn yet??...


Go play with your four footer.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

No no, Godzilla's white on the BACK.


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## the Dabbler (Feb 17, 2005)

LISA ...kindergarten is getting rowdy again !! LISA !!!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

toyroy said:


> Yo markie,
> How about you and Joe McCarthy go burn some witches, huh?


This close to Halloween? I'm not *that *nasty.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

OK, as I looked at the BIG 17 foot job, it dawned on me...

HOW was it constructed? a 2 piece mold or something? It's amazing that casting parts for a model THAT SIZE was done.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Y3a said:


> OK, as I looked at the BIG 17 foot job, it dawned on me...
> 
> HOW was it constructed? a 2 piece mold or something? It's amazing that casting parts for a model THAT SIZE was done.


2 piece mold, LOL! 

Good question. It reminds me of the construction of the Statue of Liberty, and of large, cast bronze statues. I heard about a huge bronze statue of David on horseback, which Leonardo had plans to pour in a _single_ casting(!!!).

And, weren't the subs at Disneyland/WDW fiberglass-hulled?


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

They soldered the 11' Nautilus together from brass coinings and castings!


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

when i saw the 17 ft. seaview in buena park ,ca., i spent a lot of time around it and as i remember, it had a rough textured feel to it, and it was pretty solid and heavy. here are 2 pictures of the 17 ft. in buena park, and the 3rd pic. is the film crew sliding it into the water on the studio back lot. and i saw the colors of it and it had a gray top and a white/beige bottom.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

I've added a helpful color notation to those model builders who, like myself, might misinterpret the underside color.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Grey, as others have pointed out, is a tricky color. Depending on the surrounding light its range is all over the map.

The model below was photographed outside on a clear day. Portions of the boat's underside may appear lighter (or whiter) than others, but that doesn't alter the fact that I used Testors Camoflage Grey. 

Mind you, I'm not trying to sway anyone's opinion one way or the other. Paint the underside day-glow orange for all I care. To my eye the contrast between a medium grey upper hull and a pure white underside seems a bit severe, but if that's what floats your boat it's certainly okay by me.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

nice seaview, i see the diving planes bottoms are also a lighter color. i didn't mean white really, just lighter than the top. kind of like a great white shark dark on top to be hard to see from above and lighter on the bottom to be harder to see from below. Carson, is that a blue gray ? that is really a sharp looking seaview.


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

toyroy said:


> . . . weren't the subs at Disneyland/WDW fiberglass-hulled?


From available sources, it seems the _Nautilus_-styled boats at the Florida park were fabricated from fiberglass. The original Disneyland subs were basically large steel cylinders. The "subs" at both parks didn't really dive or surface, of course — just ran on fixed tracks at the bottom of the lagoon. A pity both rides are gone now.

[IMG-LEFT]http://www.sandcastlevi.com/images/travel_disney/wdw-1973k.jpg[/IMG-LEFT]








Beauty shot








[IMG-LEFT]http://www.20kride.com/content/behind/Nautilus-at-DisneyWorld.jpg[/IMG-LEFT]What you didn't see below the surface





Check out for more info:
http://www.20kride.com/photos_behind.html

The same site has an interesting "conspiracy" theory as to the real reasons why Walt Disney World’s _20,000 Leagues_ ride was closed and eventually demolished:
http://www.20kride.com/history.html

And now, back to the _Seaview_, which, as everyone knows, should be purple and chartreuse!


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

From "The Day the Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea Stood Still".


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

model maker said:


> Carson, is that a blue gray ?


I used Testors Model Master Medium grey (FS35237) for the primary hull color, and Testors Model Master Camouflage Gray (FS 36622) for the underside. 

I tested a bunch of different greys before selecting the exact shade, and the Medium Grey was my favorite. It has a subtle blue-green quality, and I found it to be a little richer looking and more complex than the other greys I sampled (jeesh, sounds like I'm discussing a bottle of wine).

I went with Camouflage Grey for the "white" underbelly for no other reason than I thought it was the best match for the Med. Grey.

Buffing with polishing abrasives produced a semi-gloss finish. Originally I had envisioned the sort of flat grey finish typically found on models of this subject, but somehow the glossy hull looked more Irwin Allenish and I decided to leave it.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

That works too!


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Of course, there _was_ the model in Nelson's office. But, frame scans of that might show that she was mono-colored, so it is CERTAIN we won't see any such thing here.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Carson Dyle said:


> I used Testors Model Master Medium grey (FS35237) for the primary hull color, and Testors Model Master Camouflage Gray (FS 36622) for the underside.
> 
> I tested a bunch of different greys before selecting the exact shade, and the Medium Grey was my favorite. It has a subtle blue-green quality, and I found it to be a little richer looking and more complex than the other greys I sampled (jeesh, sounds like I'm discussing a bottle of wine).
> 
> ...


 your seaview colors look perfect carson, the glossy looks better than dull flat because , just like john p's seaview, the glossy look makes it look wet and more realistic. i am really liking this model and can't wait to start on it. It makes me want a much larger version because the seaview is a good subject to detail. thanks for the color reference codes.
Bert


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

toyroy said:


> From "The Day the Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea Stood Still".


[IMG-LEFT]http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/attachment.php?attachmentid=33885&stc=1[/IMG-LEFT]From "The Day Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea Jumped. . . " Well, you know.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

great picture !


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

toyroy said:


> Of course, there _was_ the model in Nelson's office. But, frame scans of that might show that she was mono-colored, so it is CERTAIN we won't see any such thing here.


 Because Nelson's display model clearly isn't one of the effects models, which is what we're trying to model. 

Why are you being such a nasty little pisher?


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

K, Heres MY PL Seaview, painted like the 8 foot SPFX model

You'll notice back by the engine intake a "boo-boo" in the finish was painted over, and the darker color 'shadow' hadn't been added again.
at the bottom is the Desk Accessory Seaview piece. THAT seems to be what the model was based on...


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## Robert Hargrave (Dec 4, 2003)

To: Model maker.
The one photo you posted of a model of the Seaview that contained an interior I had seen before but don't remember the web site. But there is a problem with that model, if anyone remembers that in the Torpedo Room/ Missle Room/ Diving chamber Room on the wall where you entered there was a set of blueprints of the ship (always seemed strange to me to have a set of blueprints out where anyone could see them or all the nasties that seemed to get aboard the ship could have easy directions to vital areas of the ship). Anyway back to the blueprints it shows the Seaview as being 2 levels, and the photo of the model you posted had three levels within the pressure hull. There are three levels shown on the blueprints but I'm very sure the lowest level was ballast tanks. anyone got a photo of those blueprints???? 
Another question: In IA's universe how did he bend the laws of physics to get the periscope in the control room to raise up through the conning tower that is clearly many feet further back from the location of the control room???? Was there a special channel cut through the upper decks and the scopes tube angled. Don't get me wrong I loved the Seaview best darn sub ever designed if your looking for eye candy, but for function what were they thinking, huge vent pipes people could crawal throught and sneek around the ship in, a reactor you could just walk up to and remove the rods by hand. Hello security..... And how could you ever forget the circuit room where all wiring for the whole ship passed through, never a guard on duty and you could walk right in, pull a few wires and send the ship spinning out of control and crashing on to the bottom of the ocean, did we hit the rocks this time on the way down or was that last weeks show, oh well every body run left, now right, now left again, someone yell brace yourself were gonna hit...... CRASH, BANG. Hey the lights went out, quit spraying that fire extinguisher stuff out of that pipe it leaves a funny taste in my mouth. Okay here comes the guy in the rubber monster suit to shake the ship, stunt double, STUNT DOUBLE...... Tune in next week, shame show as this week, but different guest. sparks turn off the darn Rap music.


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## Steve244 (Jul 22, 2001)

heh. too much coffee this morning, Robert? or too little?

Now tell me a story about the Flying Sub. Please?


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I'll admit I'm a little bewildered by the ongoing "white/ grey" argument, which I thought had been settled a long time ago.

The particulars of the _Seaview's_ painting scheme have been well-documented by the likes of *************, Dave Merriman, Greg Jein, and Ed Miarecki (among other "experts"), and their widely reported consensus was that the underside of the boat was in fact "light grey" (I suspect Paul could tell you the presise shade and reference number).

I honestly have nothing against white paint, but the underside of the _Seaview_ has never looked "white" to me. Turns out there's a reason for this; it's light grey. Those who have a problem with that can take it up with the gents mentioned above (Merriman in particular is a mellow, easy-going, affable chap who loves being pestered by strangers seeking sci-fi trivia).


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

i like the light gray idea for the bottom, hey Mark, nice seaview, i was looking at your doors on your conning tower. Are those hatches drilled out ?


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Y3a said:


> ...at the bottom is the Desk Accessory Seaview piece...


Thanks, for posting the pic of the Nelson office model. Yeah OK, it's the wrong color. And just when you need Irwin Allen to answer a question about the Seaview color, he's dead. 

My impression that the Seaview was intended to be a uniform color remains. So, if I build a model of her, that will be the way she will be painted. I'd rather have a model of the way the ship was intended to look, rather than trying to replicate a prop, which has been specially made-up for underwater photography.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

Oh man, don't you just hate it when this happens. Look what this poor schlub has done. (photo from Phil Broad's cloudster.com).

This collector has a casting taken from an original miniature and wants to build the submarine hull to go with it. But look at the absurd two tone and his choice of colors. The man must be delusional. You'd think somebody going to this much effort could have put some research into the project:


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

Robert Hargrave said:


> . . . In IA's universe how did he bend the laws of physics to get the periscope in the control room to raise up through the conning tower that is clearly many feet further back from the location of the control room???? Was there a special channel cut through the upper decks and the scopes tube angled. Don't get me wrong I loved the Seaview best darn sub ever designed if your looking for eye candy, but for function what were they thinking, huge vent pipes people could crawal throught and sneek around the ship in, a reactor you could just walk up to and remove the rods by hand. . .


The original movie/first TV season _Seaview_ had the 2-level observation lounge with the spiral staircase. For the second season, the observation nose and control room were adjoining and on the same level, essentially becoming one large set. This was obviously done to cut production time and costs by allowing the camera to track directly from one room to the other, speeding up the action and eliminating the need for separate camera setups. Of course, that meant that the control room was now in the wrong position relative to the sail and periscopes, but jeez, it's an IRWIN ALLEN show!

Ventilation ducts big enough for a grown man to crawl through have been a staple of action-adventure movies and TV for decades. As for lack of security, how about a starship where a single deranged crewman can barricade himself in the engine room and disable the entire ship, putting everyone in mortal danger while singing an off-key rendition of a schmaltzy old Irish song? (Given enough time, _any_ thread eventually mentions _Star Trek_.) 



Carson Dyle said:


> . . . (Merriman in particular is a mellow, easy-going, affable chap who loves being pestered by strangers seeking sci-fi trivia.)


And don't forget his most outstanding virtue — his humility. :lol:


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I have a set of plans foir the Seaview that suggest the periscope as being a TV camera, and the periscope viewer in the control room having a tv screen inside. :shrug: Best explanation unless you want to have 100 feet of light tunnel and prisms.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Brent Gair said:


> Oh man, don't you just hate it when this happens...


Everyone's a propmaker, these days.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

toyroy said:


> Of course, there _was_ the model in Nelson's office. But, frame scans of that might show that she was mono-colored, so it is CERTAIN we won't see any such thing here.


Not certain at all, toyroy - if you post a photo of your own _Seaview._ It's pretty clear that your take on the sub's coloring is different from that of the many other who have posted on this thread. However, to paraphrase Nathan Hale (or was it Anna Nichole Smith?): "I may not agree with the way you paint your models, but I will defend to the death your right to paint them." So ignore us and carry on!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

I think that was Alan Hale.


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

John P said:


> I think that was Alan Hale.


Actually, I think Alan Hale is still debating the correct color of the S.S. Minnow with Bob Denver.
Some arguments live beyond the limitations of death.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

toyroy said:


> Of course, there _was_ the model in Nelson's office. But, frame scans of that might show that she was mono-colored, so it is CERTAIN we won't see any such thing here.


Take another look at the rudder in the image below. Note that it’s a lighter shade than the top of the sub. The underside of this model was light grey as well.

Some of you may be familiar with *************’s work (he produced the Seaview model I built). As Dave Merriman will attest, Paul is probably the world’s foremost expert on the submarine Seaview in all its various incarnations. What follows is an un-edited email from Paul sent this AM in response my query re: the grey vs. white debate…

_Hi, Rob. 

Okay, underside (and top for that matter) color(s). WHAT season, which miniature?!

For all of the 8 window miniatures, refer to a good ORIGINAL copy of the Feb '65 T.V. Guide photos. The title shot with David Hedison holding the 4 footer out of the water mimicking the emergency surfacing of the feature's opening is a very accurate color rendering. Yes, the underside of the feature and 1st season Seaviews was a light gray-green! The top side was a dead ringer for a federal standard color # FS 36118 (no doubt what they used on the miniatures when first built,) a medium to slightly dark gray with a hint of blue. I have color chips of these colors. VERY close colors may be found in the Tamiya spray can range, colors #'s: AS 10 (RAF Ocean Grey) for top surfaces and I believe it is AS 16 for the underside (don't have a can on hand, but I think that's the number.) but somewhat lacking that hint of green.

The Flying Sub versions are another matter. I have seen all of the miniatures or the surviving pieces. The "Hero" 8 footer nose you know I molded. The top surfaces may best be described as a mired (mucky!!!) grey/green brown or yeccch as MAD Magazine would describe it to be accurate. This was airbrushed along the side nose fins and "chines" (side keels) in a darker shade of muck. The underside was a neutral light grey. Period. The 17 footer's top surfaces were essentially the same base color as the 8 footer but devoid of shading. The underside, the same light neutral grey. I have photos of all and can prove what I am saying. Those who claim the underside was white don't know what they’re talking about.

There you have it, hope I have been of some assistance.

Regards.

Paul_

It’s probably naïve of me to hope that the above email will put this issue to rest, but I’ll leave it with you guys to decide the matter for yourselves.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Besides, the real news is that the original three-foot Enterprise miniature wasn’t light grey after all! It was white – and here’s the incontrovertible photographic evidence that proves it!


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

WHEW! I'm SURE GLAD to put THAT to REST!! (???)

THANKS!!


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Carson Dyle said:


> Take another look at the rudder in the image below. Note that it’s a lighter shade than the top of the sub. The underside of this model was light grey as well.


Funny, I never noticed the racing stripe along the middle of the hull. Must be de rigueur, for hot rod subs.

This picture doesn't look much like Nelson's office, as I recall it. One thing I do recall, is the transverse line on the underside, just aft of the bow fins. I remember the Aurora kit had an inscribed line, which roughly approximated the outline of a Manta ray. I think part of that line was where the underside piece met the upper hull. At the time, I thought Aurora had made a half-assed attempt to represent the flying sub bay doors, as an update to the kit. 



Carson Dyle said:


> I don’t know about the rest of you guys, but I just love being talked down to by a condescending know-it-all who can’t admit when he’s wrong.


 I thought it was reasonably good sarcasm.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Carson Dyle said:


> ...the original three-foot Enterprise...was white – and here’s the incontrovertible photographic evidence that proves it...


Man, is that incontrovertible, or what?


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

toyroy said:


> I thought it was reasonably good sarcasm.


So did I.

The first couple of times.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

The rudder 'color' difference is probably glare, like toy's racing stripe.


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## Brent Gair (Jun 26, 1999)

I just checked this thread and I gotta' say again, I was stunned.

On the other hand, I should have known better. I've been online since the pre-internet days when we called local BB's and got our messages through FIDO about 16 years ago.

Sarcasm just never seems to work, no matter how obvious it seems to the poster.

I was under the impression that my posts on the subject were so unmistakably sarcastic that nobody could possibly interpret them otherwise. But that old lesson just never seems to take root with me. There is just no way to make sarcasm obvious to everybody. Didn't work 15 years ago...clearly not working now.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

I just took another gander at the feature film and compared Admiral Nelson's model to the "real thing". It's clear to me that the Aurora _Seaview _reflects the contours of Nelson's cigar humidor or whatever far more closely than any of the filming miniatures. So one could give their Aurora/Polar lights _Seaview_ a semigloss dark gray finish, mount it on a scale desktop with brass finials, and call it a 1/2 scale model of the Admiral's pill box or whatever.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Brent Gair said:


> ...There is just no way to make sarcasm obvious to everybody...


When does everybody understand what anyone says?


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Brent Gair said:


> I was under the impression that my posts on the subject were so unmistakably sarcastic that nobody could possibly interpret them otherwise.


No hard feelings.

It was never my intention to get into a pissing match over the Seaview's paint scheme, but since these boards were created to provide useful information to model makers I hope you'll understand why I bothered.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

toyroy said:


> When does everybody understand what anyone says?


 WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT!?!? 



Carson - thanks for contacting the experts and clearing it up. Light gray it is. All I can say is, yes, I_ didn'_t know what I was talking about, which is why I researched it via the DVD, and came up with what I thought was the right answer. Obviously first hand witness accounts trump eyeballing the video.

I'm VERY surprised at the FS 36118 info. That's Gunship gray! The topside color of current F-16s, B-52s, B-1s,and cargo planes. That's VERY dark. A lot darker than anyone I know ever thought.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

I'm glad you prop-replicators got your info, but what color is the Seaview?


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

toyroy said:


> I'm glad you prop-replicators got your info, but what color is the Seaview?


 read it here one more time !!!

Hi, Rob. 

Okay, underside (and top for that matter) color(s). WHAT season, which miniature?!

For all of the 8 window miniatures, refer to a good ORIGINAL copy of the Feb '65 T.V. Guide photos. The title shot with David Hedison holding the 4 footer out of the water mimicking the emergency surfacing of the feature's opening is a very accurate color rendering. Yes, the underside of the feature and 1st season Seaviews was a light gray-green! The top side was a dead ringer for a federal standard color # FS 36118 (no doubt what they used on the miniatures when first built,) a medium to slightly dark gray with a hint of blue. I have color chips of these colors. VERY close colors may be found in the Tamiya spray can range, colors #'s: AS 10 (RAF Ocean Grey) for top surfaces and I believe it is AS 16 for the underside (don't have a can on hand, but I think that's the number.) but somewhat lacking that hint of green.

The Flying Sub versions are another matter. I have seen all of the miniatures or the surviving pieces. The "Hero" 8 footer nose you know I molded. The top surfaces may best be described as a mired (mucky!!!) grey/green brown or yeccch as MAD Magazine would describe it to be accurate. This was airbrushed along the side nose fins and "chines" (side keels) in a darker shade of muck. The underside was a neutral light grey. Period. The 17 footer's top surfaces were essentially the same base color as the 8 footer but devoid of shading. The underside, the same light neutral grey. I have photos of all and can prove what I am saying. Those who claim the underside was white don't know what they’re talking about.

There you have it, hope I have been of some assistance.

Regards.

Paul


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

model maker said:


> read it here one more time !!!...


Thank you. I have been following the discussion, and I read the email the first time it was posted. I didn't ask what colors the props were. I asked what color the Seaview was.

By this, I mean: what was the _apparent_ color, as seen on-screen. Clearly, as John pointed out, there is a big difference between the prop coloring, and the on-screen coloring. I don't think the answer is as easy as pulling an arbitrarily-selected frame. We have seen that such frames can be deceptive, for a number of reasons.

I think this is an interesting challenge. With regard to the original 8-window configuration, the only color footage is from the movie, and the series pilot. I don't even know if additional SPFX footage was shot for the pilot. With the movie, some of the footage is colored by the burning Van Allen belt effect. I think it would take a serious looksee, and possibly some comparative analysis, to come up with a color which would look right, on a model of the Seaview(as opposed to a prop replica).

The TV four-window version would, I think, require similar care, although there is much more footage available. As has been pointed out, grey is an ellusive color, as it takes on hues from surroundings. Even the blue, from a clear sky.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

toyroy said:


> I didn't ask what colors the props were. I asked what color the Seaview was. By this, I mean: what was the _apparent_ color, as seen on-screen.


Why don't you pick. Perhaps something in a nice tweed. The _Seaview_ has always looked kinda Herringbone-ish to me.

:freak:


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

It depends on what kind of TV you had. 
Was the 'color balance' correct? 
Was the TV working perfectly, or was there some minor problems? 
Did you local ABC station "EQ" the colors you saw IF you saw it in color? 
Could the film have been poorly developed? 
was the chemical bath used a little, or band new? 
was the film old or new? 
what color filters were used on the cameras used for the underwater shots? 
Were the same filters used on the above the waterline shots? 
Was the paint newly applied, or showing signs of wear and discoloration? 

You are ACTUALLY ASKING... 
What was the intentions of Irwin Allen, and L.B.Abbott and the Fox 2nd Unit 
as far as color, finish and appearance of the Seaviews as seen on TV, or the movie screen. 

Answer all those other questions first and maybe I can help...

The REAL answer IS...
Light grey on the bottom, darker on top. their 'may have' been some other color additives, but that is SUBJECTIVE.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Y3a said:


> ...You are ACTUALLY ASKING...
> What was the intentions of Irwin Allen, and L.B.Abbott and the Fox 2nd Unit
> as far as color, finish and appearance of the Seaviews as seen on TV, or the movie screen...


Correctamundo!


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

toyroy said:


> I didn't ask what colors the props were. I asked what color the Seaview was.


I hate to have to say it, but there never was a _Seaview_ - it existed *only *as shooting miniatures. As has been stated, there were several of them, and all differed in their contours and paint schemes. 


Y3a said:


> ...The REAL answer IS...[it] is SUBJECTIVE.


I think that's the whole point of this thread in a nutshell...that there never was a "one, true _Seaview"._ There were several shooting miniatures, plus Admiral's Nelson's stateroom model. So there can't be a perfect model of THE _Seaview,_ only a close likeness to the version of your choice.

It would be been great if Polar Lights had reissued the Aurora _Seaview_ with the same options that came with their TOS _Enterprise._ You'd have gotten the original kit, representing Nelson's model. There's have been the longer, circular-hulled movie version pieces, and the four-windowed 2nd season sub. Plus bits to model the 17, 8, and 4 foot miniatures. Would've made for one HUGE box, though.

As I posted earlier, it's up to to you decide what looks right, because it's *your *model. Some may agree with the choices you make, some may disagree. But if your choices satisfy you, then they're the right ones.

Now let's move on to some more important issues, such as: when did Joan Fontaine's character of the lady psychologist learn to knock out a nuclear reactor anyway - ?


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

toyroy said:


> Correctamundo!


 Well, apparently you're never gonna be happy, so you're gonna have to pick what color it looks to you, and go with that. Since you want to go with "the way it looks" instead of "the way it was painted" (a perfectly fair and common practice among sci fi vehicle modelers), your impression is going to be different than another guy's, and another guy's, and another guy's.

It looked medium gray over white to me, on screen, but I've been shown to be wrong. But I was still doing the same thing you want to do - paint it the way it looked to me on screen.

What color was the Seaview? Gray.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

John P said:


> you're gonna have to pick what color it looks to you, and go with that.


It really is that simple.

I mean, I painted the underside of my _Seaview_ model light grey because that's honestly how it reads to my eye. If it read as white, I would've painted it white in spite of what the "experts" say.

Example: For "Fantastic Voyage" the _Proteus_ miniature was originally painted a creamy off-white because a true white would have been too "hot" for the camera and would have washed out under the harsh lighting (ditto the spaceship miniature from "Planet of the Apes" and the escape shuttle from "Alien"). That said, there is no doubt in my mind that the art director intended the hull of the _Proteus_ to read as a gleaming gloss white -- which is exactly what I used on my Lunar Models version (see My Gallery).

Just because I like knowing what color a filming miniature was painted doesn't mean I'm a slave to accuracy -- especially if the end result is a model that doesn't look the vehicle (or whatever) it's intended to depict.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

exactly ! i want mine to look like it does on screen, and hope i had the best tv signal lol


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

John P said:


> Well, apparently you're never gonna be happy...


That's it. You're getting the rolled-up newspaper, poochface.


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## Y3a (Jan 18, 2001)

Why don't you just FINISH your Papr J2? Think about the Seaview a few more years and do a paper one of those?


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Y3a said:


> ...do a paper (Seaview)...


Hmm. It'll have to wait, for my burger box Disneyland monorail.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

> Originally Posted by Y3a
> ...do a paper (Seaview)...


You can only play with it in the tub ONCE.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

...Poochface?


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Mark McGovern said:


> ...Poochface?


 i agree mark, whats THAT about ???? that wasn't very nice.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

He was referring to Mort, in my avatar. It's a fair cop.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

ok then, hey john, what are you working on now ? anything special ?


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

John P said:


> He was referring to Mort, in my avatar. It's a fair cop.


Oh, ah. "Poochface" sounded kinda hip, in a weird way. The 21st century is getting to me, I guess...


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

model maker said:


> ok then, hey john, what are you working on now ? anything special ?


 I was gonna actually build the PL TOS Enterprise AS the Enterprise, but I screwed up the decals, so it's back to WWII German fighters.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

can you order new decals ? i used to fish with an old guy a few years back who was a german fighter pilot in world war 2 who fought the russians. he told me a story about how he was flying alone going home for christmas not looking for any trouble and he flew over some russian troops and wasn't really paying attention and someone on the groung started shooting at him . well he got shot right in the BUTT and he said it hurt like h-ll and it ticked him off so much that he climbed and circled around and scatterd them with machine gun fire not hitting anyone but making a complete mess of their camp in the snow. he told me that hitler came along after he was a flier and he along with a lot of germans soldiers/flyers hated hitler


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

Order decals? Me? I'll just snag a sheet out of the 14 other kits I have stashed for kitbashing.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

oh thats right,i forgot that you are your own warehouse of supplies


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Okay back to topic: there's a good side view of one of the _Seaview _miniatures (not sure which one - I think the model hanging in Planet Hollywood) on William McCullars' (sp?) IDIC page that shows the aft minisub doors are cut out of the sub's keel. This left a flat spot, and its position is clearly shown in the underside view of the miniature that modelmaker shared with us. The doors themselves are missing from that photo, however.

So my question is: can anyone provide info on the nature of those minisub doors? In the _Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea _feature film, they swung open like the bomb bay doors of a World War II bomber. Were the 2nd season TV doors similar? Or were they more like the corrugated doors of the Flying Sub bay?

RogueJ - thanks for reminding me about the Skyhook Models Tv conversion kit. However, it's out of production. So it's a scratchbuilding job for me after all.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

John P said:


> Order decals? Me? I'll just snag a sheet out of the 14 other kits I have stashed for kitbashing.


Soooooooo, why is it back to WWII fighters? :freak:


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Mark McGovern said:


> ...my question is: can anyone provide info on the nature of those minisub doors? In the _Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea _feature film, they swung open like the bomb bay doors of a World War II bomber. Were the 2nd season TV doors similar? Or were they more like the corrugated doors of the Flying Sub bay?


As for your door question, I must leave an authoritative answer to someone else. I don't recall the minisub being used much, if at all, on the four-window Seaview. They did use that area for the diving bell, though.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

model maker said:


> ...i used to fish with an old guy a few years back who was a german fighter pilot in world war 2 who fought the russians...


Can't remember any German WWII hardware in _Voyage_, but I do remember a _COOL_ WWI U-boat. Sort of a Flying Dutchman story, I think.


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## RogueJ (Oct 29, 2000)

Mark,
The MiniSub doors on the Seaview were the same bomb bay doors in the "Flying Sub" configuration. Only the Flying Sub bay doors were corrugated.

John

P.S. Once again great job on your King Kong. Looked fantastic!


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

toyroy said:


> Soooooooo, why is it back to WWII fighters? :freak:


 My first love, and usually my most relaxing projects.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Thanks on both counts, John. I know I can always count on a Black Swamp Modeler to come through. :thumbsup:


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## mb1k (May 6, 2002)

Look!!! Proof positive that the Mirror Mirror dagger's blade is Red! I told you!!


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

Noit to drag this thing into any kind of useful territory, but I'm having a hard time figuring out the lenght of the Seaview re: just how much longer to extend the Aurora/PL. Does anyone have a profile diagram in the right dimensions?

For what it's worth, I intend to paint the bottom of mine black. It will be a very, very light black that photographs as white.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

:lol:!

According to Orne Montgomery who makes a Seaview upgrade kit, the hull needs a 1-inch plug ahead of the sail to match the proportions of the filming miniature.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

John P said:


> :lol:!
> 
> According to Orne Montgomery who makes a Seaview upgrade kit, the hull needs a 1-inch plug ahead of the sail to match the proportions of the filming miniature.


 I still think your seaview diorama is a work of art, simply outstanding john.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

dreamer said:


> Noit to drag this thing into any kind of useful territory, but I'm having a hard time figuring out the lenght of the Seaview re: just how much longer to extend the Aurora/PL. Does anyone have a profile diagram in the right dimensions?


http://www.vttbots.com/seaview.html


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

Thanks, guys. I've been looking over all the shots I can find online.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

dreamer said:


> Thanks, guys. I've been looking over all the shots I can find online.


I believe I may already have posted this link somewhere upthread, but in any case be sure not to miss Ed Miarecki's masterful build-up of the 4-windowed _Seaview_...

http://www.fxmodels.com/seaview.shtml


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

Carson Dyle said:


> I believe I may already have posted this link somewhere upthread, but in any case be sure not to miss Ed Miarecki's masterful build-up of the 4-windowed _Seaview_...
> 
> http://www.fxmodels.com/seaview.shtml


That is a breathtaking build indeed. 


Judging by a profile shot from David Merriman's reconstruction, Orne's right right about needing an inch and a quarter before the sail. But it looks like it needs a smidge extra length behind the sail as well. That's harder to tell with the fins and shafts in the way.

I'm still jotting down notes about the differences between the Flying Sub version and the movie Seaview.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

dreamer said:


> ...I'm still jotting down notes about the differences between the Flying Sub version and the movie Seaview.


Dreamer, there's a _Seaview _thread over on the Sci-Fi Builder's forum that's about 6 months old, but chock full of good stuff. While the 2nd season version of 'Nelson's Folly' is on the table, I'd like to ask a question about the raised frames around the edges of the bow windows. They seem to come and go, even in good photos of the miniatures off-camera. Does anybody know whether those frames appeared consistantly on all the miniatures some of the time? Some of the miniatures all the time? Eh?


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Dreamer and Mark, here is a picture i have of both versions side by side and a close up og the 18 foot prop to see how the bow frames look. hope this helps.


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## dreamer (Jan 1, 1970)

Mark, thanks for the tip! It definitely helps. Ditto that for the pics, MM.


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

Thank you for the pics, Bert.


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## bert model maker (Feb 19, 2002)

Your welcome Mark & Dreamer.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

Has anyone made an RC model from the Aurora/PL kit?


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## Dave Hussey (Nov 20, 1998)

Dunno. Perhaps one day we will have a ************* Seaview - a "Lubmarine!!"

Huzz


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## scotpens (Sep 6, 2003)

That seems pretty unlikely — how would you power and control a sub that's only 13 inches long?

Although I used to have fun with my Aurora Seaviews in the swimming pool — the thing's naturally a bit nose-heavy and has all those stabilizing fins, so if you let it fill up with water, you just give it a little push and it glides straight to the bottom.


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## toyroy (Jul 17, 2005)

scotpens said:


> That seems pretty unlikely — how would you power and control a sub that's only 13 inches long?...


I guess you haven't seen those itty-bitty RC subs that work in fish tanks!


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## the Dabbler (Feb 17, 2005)

scotpens said:


> That seems pretty unlikely — how would you power and control a sub that's only 13 inches long?
> 
> How about baking soda or Alka-Seltzer tablets ?


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## Mark McGovern (Apr 25, 1999)

*BUUUURRPP!!*

But seriously, folks...I just glanced at a screen cap of the Manfish waltzing with the Seaview, which must have been the big 18 footer. The window frames are clearly visible, naturally - that means more scratchbuilding fun. Yippee.


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## John P (Sep 1, 1999)

scotpens said:


> That seems pretty unlikely — how would you power and control a sub that's only 13 inches long?
> 
> Although I used to have fun with my Aurora Seaviews in the swimming pool — the thing's naturally a bit nose-heavy and has all those stabilizing fins, so if you let it fill up with water, you just give it a little push and it glides straight to the bottom.


 :lol: Me too! And the flying sub would do a falling-leaf right to the bottom.


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