# How about some Black Hole Reissues



## Guy Schlicter (May 3, 2004)

Hi Folks,Since Round 2 is reissuing many old kits,How about the 3 Black Hole kits reissued and while I'm on the subject how about some Space 1999 reissues.Whatcha Think?Guy Schlicter


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## cireskul (Jul 16, 2006)

I would buy Black Hole re-issues.


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## SJF (Dec 3, 1999)

I'd also go for some more Eagle kits. 

Sean


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

The only one I have is Vincent and I was disappointed with that kit. I find the detail on it very soft in places (plus lack of detail) and Vincents head piece (the top grey bit with the red pieces you stick on) is badly moulded. It should be uniform in shape all the way around but one half's a different shape to the other half. It would be good if it was reissued with a new piece for that plus one or two other detail parts. There's no eyes included for him either.


As for the Space 1999 kits well the Airfix/MPC eagle was terrible so I'd prefer a new kit to seeing that again.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

None of the original Black Hole kits impressed me very much. I think if they cast the ship out of clear styrene for lighting properly you would have a winner...

.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

Richard Baker said:


> None of the original Black Hole kits impressed me very much. I think if they cast the ship out of clear styrene for lighting properly you would have a winner...
> 
> .




That could be a great idea....and a new piece for the middle so it's the correct length. One other problem I've heard with the Cygnus is that the framework on it's poorly defined but because I haven't seen the kit in the flesh I don't know how bad that is.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

It is a bunch of raised ribs over the lighted areas. I do not think thaey are that accurate but from across the room it is a good effect. Since the model was molded in grey plastic, the only way to approximate the lighting would be topaint it metallic gold (like I did) or maybe UV paints. The way the kit assembles if they only cast it is clear a couple of bulbs would give you a great effect.

.


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## Gunstar1 (Mar 1, 2007)

I'm not sure that I've seen the previous Black Hole kits, but I can't imagine doing the Cygnus without lighting it - and no matter what scale you do it in, you may as well build 90% of it with photoetch parts. 

However it seems the Cygnus falls into that category of "better off not attempting it though I would sure love it" - the ship (model) is about the same size as the Executor in Empire Strikes Back - both around 9-10' long - but sooooooooooo detailed that they may as well be 100' long - the detail is a large part of what makes those 2 ships so great, and a lot of that detail simply cannot be simplified - and since the detail is so important, a lesser detailed kit cannot capture the essence of the original. The studio model of the 1701 refit is 8', but translates much better simply because there is comparatively not that much detail - it's mostly smooth, and that translates well to a few more manageable scales.

....ooooo if I had the time I would love to figure out doing an almost entirely photoetched Executor - think of it - you could assemble the interior "exposed city" structure as a topographic layering of photoetched sheets (end result would look like millions of tiny wafers sticking in and out and overlapping) where each sheet would have etched paths for light to seep through in millions of tiny windows, and the main surface of the arrowhead would have a photoetched layer applied..... ok so it would cost as much as making the studio model, but fun to dream at least :thumbsup:


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## aric (Jun 23, 2009)

A 30-36" Cygnus with lots of photo-etch would be awesome.


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## GordonMitchell (Feb 12, 2009)

anybody know where to get decent drawings and pics(not frame grabs I can do that)of the Cygnus and Palomino,

Gordon M:thumbsup:


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## OzyMandias (Dec 29, 2004)

I've got a Maximillian still bagged in an open box... I've never been able to make a decision to build it or not. It would be nice to see the kits re-released, as hokey as the film was the models hold some nostalgic appeal.


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## geino (May 9, 2006)

I have Vincent, unbuilt. I plan to build it in the next year or two. I want to modify it so the accessories will move up and down/in and out. I also plan to light it up. I have a few other kits to build or finish first.

I would love to get Maxamillian and the Cygnus, but not at current prices. A reissue would be fine with me.

I built the Cygnus years ago, but it smashed in the black hole of a move.

The Cygnus would require a new mold since the kit is inaccurate. It is missing an entire section of the ship. I agree it should be clear or transparent plastic so it could be lighted.


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## Bradleyfett (Jan 22, 2003)

I think they could re-issue the Cygnus kit as-is in clear and it would sell like hotcakes; less cost for the manufacturer. Those of us who want to could easily combine to kits to rectify the other problem.

Mark


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## rossjr (Jun 25, 2001)

I'd go for the Space 1999 re-issues but I don't think we need the Moonbase kit. I really wish they would reissue the Hawk kit, that would be fantastic....


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

These things are fresh in my mind since I've rebuilt them both in the last few years . . .

VINCent. Clunky kit. Poor decals. Lots of options for things sticking out that make you realize what a poor design it was. Best option: repop and sell with new decals and a lighting kit. Still a dumb kit but would look pretty lighted up.

Maximillian. Another clunky kit with appendages that don't make sense. Parts are soft in detail (especially the tools at the end of the arms like really thick kinfe blades). Lighting the eye might help.

It's been a while since I built the Cygnus but I don't remember it as fondly as some of the previous posters. First off, it's about 18" and sit uncomfortably on its stand. It's inaccurate as mentioned. Detail is very soft and the antennae are downright ugly. To make it work, it needs to be reworked with more detail and some photo-etch for the attenae. Molding it in clear for lighting would be tricky since the light would need to be even throughout and not let's even think about seams in the clear parts.

No, I really think some things are best left in the box - particularly subjects from a badly received movie that only a few of us remember. 

Besides, you think Disney's going to issue a license to repop these for just a few bucks?

Jim


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## aric (Jun 23, 2009)

Bradleyfett said:


> I think they could re-issue the Cygnus kit as-is in clear and it would sell like hotcakes;
> Mark



I'd definately buy one like that, heck I'd buy a carbon copy re-issue,


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## rossjr (Jun 25, 2001)

Bradleyfett said:


> I think they could re-issue the Cygnus kit as-is in clear and it would sell like hotcakes; less cost for the manufacturer. Those of us who want to could easily combine to kits to rectify the other problem.
> 
> Mark


Missed this the first time, I don't know that I would say it would sell like hotcakes, I know I'll regret this but I worked at our hobby store when these kits were originally released and they didn't do all that well then, probably why they were not reissued. The reality of the matter on this family of kits is that it is a rather obscure movie and I would suspect sales on these would be rather limited. Certainly a rush for many collectors/builders upon initial release but not much after that....


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

rossjr said:


> Missed this the first time, I don't know that I would say it would sell like hotcakes, I know I'll regret this but I worked at our hobby store when these kits were originally released and they didn't do all that well then, probably why they were not reissued. The reality of the matter on this family of kits is that it is a rather obscure movie and I would suspect sales on these would be rather limited. Certainly a rush for many collectors/builders upon initial release but not much after that....





Don't forget kids most probably wouldn't be buying these kits, it would be people who grew up with the film and many, many 40 somethings remember the Black Hole with affection. It's a good film and has been bashed by a small minority unfairly.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I loved the movie except for the ending- after that much build up about going into the Black Hole it should have been a bit more than a Heaven/Hell Light Show.

The spacecarft design, interiors, matte paintings, SFX- it was almost the last time the old school artists all worked together on a film. A great effort and still beautiful to watch...

.


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## IEDBountyHunter (Oct 17, 2008)

I have a vincent and Maximillian kit id be willing to part with if any one wants it.
Just PM me.

Al


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

PM sent!


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## Gunstar1 (Mar 1, 2007)

The movie came out around when I was born, but I grew up watching it, and always loved it - though yeah, the ending was not best it could have been, and certainly not the same as the book, which is a really good read.


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## MightyMax (Jan 21, 2000)

Ditto to what Richard said in post #19 above.

I bought all the models when they were on the shelves and they still reside unbuilt in my stash.
I have 2 Cygnus kits and I guess things do happen for a reason because up until a year or so ago, I never knew you would need two to bash into one.

There was a buildup in a model mag many a decade ago on the cygnus. The builder used phosphorous paints to "light" the ship. It looked way cool.

I think if they ever do pay any high priced licensing fees to Diznee for a repop they could and should at least give VI.N.C.E.N.T. alternate parts so we can also make Old Bob. While we are dreaming put me down for a S.T.A.R.R. kit as well.

Max Bryant


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

The Cygnus kit, from what I've been told, is not long enough--missing some sections. It would have to be altered in that respect or you'd have to buy two kits.

Molding it in clear plastic would be the best way to make it a decent kit but I still don't see that there'd be much demand for such a relatively obscure subject. 

An improved _Space:1999_ Eagle might sell very well but would need to be a new, more detailed kit to be worth buying for me. I doubt the powers that be would be willing to tool a new kit. The only economical compromise might be to use the tooling from the Product Enterprise version if possible to create a styrene version. It might be a little clunky to put together compared to most kits but would certainly be heavy duty.


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

I agree on how unlikly a repop of these kit would be. I remember the Anniversry DVD being released (got one then) and it was met with yawns. A movie these days needs zooming ships and planetary destruction now- the days of slow ship pans and thougth provoking ideas (2001 anybody?) has passed it seems...

A repop of a 1999 Eagle would be fantastic- if they reworked it. Right now the only company I could see doing a proper job would be Moebius. They have the builder's attitude and are not afraid to make a model with a parts breakdown/detail level some subjucts need to be proper...

.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

I actually like the ending of the Black Hole. Don't ask me why but I always found the images of heaven and hell slightly disturbing, especially with the magnificent soundtrack. Much better than if it had been some aliens or something at the end. 

As for a repop of the Airfix eagle. I'd say that was pretty much pointless as it's just a useless kit full stop. I think it's such an iconic craft it would sell if someone like Moebius did a new tooling


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

Beautiful build here!:thumbsup:

http://www.starshipmodeler.org/gallery7/au_cygnus.htm
-Jim


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

SUNGOD said:


> As for a repop of the Airfix eagle. I'd say that was pretty much pointless as it's just a useless kit full stop. I think it's such an iconic craft it would sell if someone like Moebius did a new tooling


I agree completely. I think it has potential as a decently popular subject and, despite the other shortcomings of the show, is in an of itself a very cool, practical looking space ship that many would probably buy with absolutely no prior knowledge of _Space:1999._


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## fortress (Apr 1, 2006)

I agree that the cygnus deserves a 09 makeover with more detail 
Including brass metal parts. And be a little longer.

The real question is who would do it?


Fortress


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## John O (Mar 8, 2000)

PerfesserCoffee said:


> The Cygnus kit, from what I've been told, is not long enough--missing some sections. It would have to be altered in that respect or you'd have to buy two kits.


There's a great deal more that's wrong with the Cygnus kit than it's length, but that is the biggest issue (literally). There is lots of missing or simplified detail in sort of the way the sides of the Monogram's Galactica were over-simplified to the point of being stupid.

Here are some build pics of a kit I bought from a fellow on the SMM forum:

Basic Side View
Side View With Ends
Aft Top View
Bow Top View
Detail 01, Detail 02, Detail 03, Detail 04, Detail 05, Detail 06

It is missing a few antenna pieces and the kit itself doesn't have enough of the correct side panels to finish off the hull extensions, but it did include the hull piece needed to get the correct length. So, I'm glad to have gotten this far, but I have a little molding and casting to do before I can get this pig to the painting stage.

John O.


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

MightyMax said:


> I think if they ever do pay any high priced licensing fees to Diznee for a repop they could and should at least give VI.N.C.E.N.T. alternate parts so we can also make Old Bob.


Built both - the MPC VINCent and a resin Old BOB - and can tell you that adding alternate parts to build BOB would add almost a whole new kit. They are very unalike in detail.










Jim


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## Bradleyfett (Jan 22, 2003)

Does anyone know the folks at X-Factorproductions.com? They make (made) the BOB kit, but its been unavailable for a while now. I'm hoping they offer it again, but I don't see an update on the site.

Mark


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## StarshipClass (Aug 13, 2003)

John O said:


> There's a great deal more that's wrong with the Cygnus kit than it's length, but that is the biggest issue (literally). There is lots of missing or simplified detail in sort of the way the sides of the Monogram's Galactica were over-simplified to the point of being stupid.
> 
> It is missing a few antenna pieces and the kit itself doesn't have enough of the correct side panels to finish off the hull extensions, but it did include the hull piece needed to get the correct length. So, I'm glad to have gotten this far, but I have a little molding and casting to do before I can get this pig to the painting stage.
> 
> John O.


Great job so far, John!

You may yet have a silk purse out of it!:thumbsup:


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## MightyMax (Jan 21, 2000)

Arronax said:


> Built both - the MPC VINCent and a resin Old BOB - and can tell you that adding alternate parts to build BOB would add almost a whole new kit. They are very unalike in detail.quote]
> 
> 
> Your right. I didn't realize there was that big a difference. I seemed to remember B.O.B. as just a banged up version of V...
> ...


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## geino (May 9, 2006)

John - looks good so far!

Arronax - Wonderful builds!

Anyone building the Vincent model - I fould pictures on ebay of the new toy they were selling at ComicCon. It is a die cast approximatly 9 inches tall. One of the sellers posted several pictures that will be very useful when building the model. If anybody needs them let me know.


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## SUNGOD (Jan 20, 2006)

geino said:


> John - looks good so far!
> 
> Arronax - Wonderful builds!
> 
> Anyone building the Vincent model - I fould pictures on ebay of the new toy they were selling at ComicCon. It is a die cast approximatly 9 inches tall. One of the sellers posted several pictures that will be very useful when building the model. If anybody needs them let me know.




I wish it was diecast. Those Comic Con Vincents are made of that vinyl crap


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## geino (May 9, 2006)

My mistake, I thought it said it was made of of die cast. I don't have one, and the price they are selling for on ebay is way to much. The paint job looks good in the pictures for when I build the model.


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

Thought this was neat!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/MECO-MUSIC-FROM..._CDs?hash=item58833b9ac1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 

-Jim


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## geino (May 9, 2006)

Neat, but they are ripping them off on the shipping price. It does not cost over $10 to ship a CD anywhere in the world.


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

Ya know I just watched Black Hole again for the first time in years!
Seems different now...........................................


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

JGG1701 said:


> Ya know I just watched Black Hole again for the first time in years!
> Seems different now...........................................


It is a grand film with a unique style. After watching zooming model kits I like to see it again for a refreshing change...

.


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

JGG1701 said:


> Thought this was neat!!!
> 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/MECO-MUSIC-FROM-STAR-TREK-AND-THE-BLACK-HOLE-CD_W0QQitemZ380158843585QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMusic_CDs?hash=item58833b9ac1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
> 
> -Jim


Ah, yes. I had that on vinyl. "The Black Hole" theme was passable but the highlights of the album are the rock version of the ST:TMP and the segue into the funky (almost disco) Klingon theme. It's a lot better than that sounds.

Jim


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

"Disco Klingons" creates a rather disturbing image...

Funny, but disturbing.

.


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## ccbor (May 27, 2003)

iTunes sells the soundtrack to the movie.

Bor


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## Arronax (Apr 6, 1999)

They also have the rock version of the ST:TMP theme. Do a search for Meco. 

Go on, you know you want to.

Jim


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## Richard Baker (Aug 8, 2006)

Meco did a rock version of almost everything- some well, some I really wish I had not ever heard...


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## bigdaddydaveh (Jul 20, 2007)

What better soundtrack to play on your 8-track in the R2-D2 van????


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## geino (May 9, 2006)

Does it count if I rememer seeing a Death Star van in Buffy the Vampire Slayer?


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## Miek (Jan 29, 2008)

*Black hole models*

I actually like the vintage black hole models, they are pretty acurate (except the cygnus which is indeed poor in detail).
I bought the lot of three build models on Ebay a few years ago, they were already build and only needed some extra finishing (especially the V.I.N.cent model) and after painting them a bit more they really look great.
The Cygnus model was build with some lights in it, the builder of the model drilled holes in the model to let the light come through, and made a custom base for it (with a switch).
I've added the auction picture of it (see attachements) the seller took some pictures with different exposure times. The builder also painted the ship in a dark copper finish, not movie accurate, but it 's nice to look at...
The other picture is of my two droid models...
I've seen the V.I.N.cent vinyl model (sold at comicon) but I was so sad to see it don't resemble the original (totally wrong proportions)... a fine diecast version with lights would be great!:thumbsup:


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## Scorpitat (Oct 7, 2004)

Miek,

that photo set of the Cygnus looks great! Thanks for posting it. I love the stand position, and the colors he used do not look that bad. It makes me contemplate pulling my Cygnus out of mothballs and attempting a similar buildup.

I loved the movie when I saw it, and the kit was always a "grail kit" to get for me. I found one on evilbay years back, and luckily, it had all the parts, including the Palomino. I sub-assembled it, and that's about as far as it went. The ship is massive, and you do have alot of plastic there. If someone made a mold of the needed sections to add to the length, I'd pony up the funds for it. It's a good looking representation of the basic ship, and is a detailers dream. I may have to go looking in the garage bins and seriously dig into the kit again.

If anyone can find the kit, I do reccomend it. And if anyone considers making the hull parts for length, PLEASE, let me know. I'll be a customer!

Sincerely,
Scorp.

"Boldly GO!" :wave:


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

Cool pics. Meik!:thumbsup:
-Jim


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## Miek (Jan 29, 2008)

*Black hole models*

Thanks!  
These really are three very nice looking models, and 'till now the best representations availlable of the two droids and the wonderfull cygnus.

The build cygnus was send to me into a huge box (From the States to Belgium), the seller really did his utter best to pack it with styrofoam, plastic cups to protect the antennas and so on, and surprisingly it didn't even had a part broken!
I only had to paint the Palomino ship in a green-ish tint with small red dots on the engines (lights in the movie) to make it movie accurate...

The black hole is also one of my favourite childhood movies... and after seeing it back on DVD it still has it's charm.


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