# Alclad II



## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

I know that there are a few here that have used Alclad II in the past, some with great results. There are two different number codes for the chrome paint - what is the difference, and which one is the brightest, or has the most reflectance? 

~ Chris​


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Well they make chrome for models and chrome for lexan car bodies. They also sell chrome in a couple different size jars so those would have different numbers too. 

a google search netted this

ALCLAD II	ALC-107	1oz. Bottle Chrome Lacquer for Plastic 
ALCLAD II	ALC-114	1oz. Bottle Chrome Lacquer for Lexan 
ALCLAD II	ALC-205	1oz. Bottle Holomatic Spectral-Chrome Lacquer 
ALCLAD II	ALC-4107	4oz. Bottle Chrome Lacquer 
ALCLAD II	ALC-5114	3oz. Spray Chrome Lacquer for Lexan


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

I looked on evilbay for my search. One seller says that they don't know what the formulation is. Lexan is acrylic. It's also a plastic too. That doesn't tell me much.  

I just wonder if one is formulated for spraying without a black paint backer - RC car bodies, or if it's for spraying the outside of the cars themselves? If you spray the inside with this stuff you won't see it very well since it's formulated to have a black undercoat. Maybe it's the hardness, or adhesion properties? If you spray the wrong one over paint maybe it won't adhere, or build up the way it's supposed to? This is why I asked this question. I'm trying to guage whether, or not this is the stuff for my project. If not, I'll have to buy something from someone else.

I sprayed my 1/12th scale '57 Chevy with black lacquer - nitrocellulose lacquer to be sure. I'd just need to spray the colour over it. Once painted it would be good to go. All I'd need to do is put the car together. Most everthing else is finished. The accents around the windows is what I need to complete. 

This will be my crowning glory since most of my models need either a fix here, or there, or a touch up, or completely repainted. Once assembled I'd make a wooden base for it. I'd have to make a cover for it, probably vacuum form one myself. Either way, I just need to know which one is the correct formula to use with what I have so that when I do the treatment I get the results desired, as I can't take this stuff back to the store - I'm going to buy mine on the net rather than attempt to special order it from my local supplier. 

~ Chris​


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## rkoenn (Dec 18, 2007)

I've been using Alclad for the last couple of years and really like it. I rechromed all the model chrome parts with it rather as it gives a much more realistic finish. I have always put a coat of gloss black lacquer under it with either Testors spray can or Alclad black with the airbrush. Whatever is under it definitely effects the final chrome effect. I've used some of their other metallic finishes as well. As you know it has to be airbrushed on, even the touch up if necessary. I've bought it locally from Colonial Photo and Hobby in Orlando and online from Mega. It isn't sold by too many places it appears.


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Well none of the Alclads require "black" but Chrome and Polished Aluminum do require some sort of undercoating. Black certainly works. The formulation for the lexan Chrome is not the same as the styrene Chrome. Perhaps because the lexan is flexible and rubbery. If you use the regular styrene Chrome on it, it may flake and peel off the same way regular model paints peel off. As with all lexan car body paints you apply the Chrome on the inside, and then back it (usually with Black).

For a lot of good discussion about the right primer, etc. for Alclad, search on Hyperscale's plane talking forum. Alclad is a common topic.


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

Well, here's the thing. Not too many places sell it. Those that do don't know what they've got. They sell it, but they don't understand it. From what I've read that you need to rub it a little at a time to get the mirror shine. I don't know exactly what makes the difference, but the car I want to paint is thick - not thin plastic. I even wetsanded the mouldings down to give it that smooth effect. If I can get this stuff to work, then I'll remove the "chrome foil" from my car, and paint it with the Alclad. I'd rather use the Alsacorp stuff, but it waaaayyyyy to expensive to use only a few times! I only have a few models that I would need to detail the chrome parts with this stuff. I know that this is airbrush only, I just wonder if it will be enough to do this car, and have enough left over for at least a 1/25th scale '57 Chevy that I started about the same time I started the big boy? I've seen some do an excellent job with this Alclad II (REL), but I've also seen some that go too heavy with it, only to come out with a dull aluminum spray paint look to it. I guess that you have to be careful how much, and how often you paint it while waiting for the build up? I've read up on it, but without experimeting I don't know what results I'll get as I don't paint very heavy when airbrushing. 

~ Chris​


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

The thickness of the plastic has nothing to do with the finish. Also with Alclad you can't buff or polish it... it isn't a buffable finish like metalizer. One bottle of Alclad will do quite a few models. You just mist it on and dont build it up like regular paint. It must also be sprayed on at low pressure


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

I see. The Alsacorp stuff is rubbed, or buffed with a rag once sprayed. I just figured this was the same way. I'm on my way to see the Alclad II site to see what all things I need to prep the surface. If the type of plastic isn't a factor - what is the difference if you need to paint the surface with some sort of black glossy surface? Maybe you can only use the Lexan type paint with the acrylic car bodies? I don't know, but I need more information before I decide if this stuff is for me. I don't spray my models, or anything else very hard, or with high air pressure since I'll be doing this inside. I do know that you have to wait five minutes for between coats before spraying it with anymore paint. I'll find out this afternoon. 

~ Chris​


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

You will want REGULAR Alclad chrome

It will work on Styrene plastic (regular model stuff)

You do need a smooth clean base for it. Fine automotive lacquer primer, buffed out, will work fine. I have had good results using Alclad's own black primer and Tamiya black spray lacquer paint. You get poorer results, IMHO with an enamel base as Alclad is a lacquer.

You do NOT apply Alclad in layers. Use just enough to give you the finish you require. Alclad sicks to platic and primer but not to itself, so putting more paint on top of it, will give you a dull, powdery finish that will just rub off.

If you have never used the stuff, you probably want to do some tests. Yeah its $8 a bottle but it costs what it costs. Why blow your big project by either cheaping out or rushing, or not trying the product out on something else first.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

For those of you located in the LA area, stop by Burbank House of Hobbies. They have a model airliner fuselage with many of the Alclad metal finishes applied to different panels in order to show the quality of the various metal finishes. Other than Bare Metal foil, I don't think that there is a better metal finish out there than Alclad.


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## Dave P (Jan 5, 2005)

The chrome and polished aluminum require a gloss black base because that is what gives the finish the shine and reflectivity of the real thing. If you spray it on any other primer the result will be a dull finish. And as others have said, it is misted on at low pressure. I usually spray around 10psi or a little lower.

I've used both their black base and Tamiya gloss black. Both work well. I also did some research and found that a lot of people use Krylon gloss black decanted and airbrushed. I gave it a try and it worked very well.

As with any natural metal finish, surface prep must be perfect. Any little scratch, bump or booger will be magnified.


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Yes and no the chrome and polished aluminum need a gloss base but it does not have to be black.


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

I've been thinking about using this instead after seeing so many use the distilled water, and silver nitrate method. That's too messy, and most of the guys that I've seen using Alclad have been a joke! Most of their models look like aluminum powder - too much paint that gives it a dull look. I don't want a product that does this on my car. It'll just end up making a mess! 


http://alsacorp.com/strechchrome/index.html

~ Chris​


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

I don't know where you have been looking at models with Alclad but again, go over to Hyperscale and look for some build ups and comments. It won't make a mess unless you kludge it up yourself. In most cases its not the product you use but how you use it.


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

I noticed that too - how you use it makes a HUGE difference! I've only seen a few of these videos because some of them are the same person, but one guy did his perfectly. I'm almost sold on the Alclad II because the Alsacorp stuff is WAAAYYYY TO pricy for no more than what I need. The silver nitrate application that www.sprayonchrome.com sells is even more expensive than even this, and I don't want to paint the entire car, but just a little tiny moulding line around the windows. I doubt I'll get an answer from the companies about this since what I have is so small. Plus the spray on chrome method is so messy there's no way I can do this within reason. I'd have to mask everything anyway, but I don't want to do more of this than neccessary. I have to be very careful since I sprayed the entire outside of the car with lacquer not to take any paint when I remove the masking tape. I think I'll use the low tack blue painters tape with a hair dryer to get this done right. There's another company that makes a chrome paint that looks exactly like actual chrome, but it's more expensive, and it comes in an aerosol can. I like the effect, but it's formulated for RC car use. Thanks for the link. As soon as I get done here I'll check out what others have done with this stuff. 

P.S. 

Did anyone else hear about how Danica Patricks' temper tantrum that caused her to wreck her car over the weekend? I understand that Godaddy.com is going to drop her as soon as her contract expires. It seems that she can't win the regular route, so now she's going to make sure that she can't win at all! 

~ Chris​


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## rkoenn (Dec 18, 2007)

Well all I can tell you is I've had no trouble using and I've also sprayed more than one coat on with no problems. Here is my Moebius Hudson Hornet that I stripped the chrome from the chrome parts and redid with chrome Alclad. This was my first big project with it. I also masked and painted the side trim with Alclad. You can also see the bare metal foil I applied to the window trim. In some places unfortunately I did it over a rough area and it shows. In the smooth areas the BMF worked great. Since I did this one almost all my chrome parts have been redone with alclad and it is very easy to use and sprays fantastically. I really haven't done anything much different using it than I normally would. But as others said, any surface imperfection will definitely show.


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

rkoenn said:


> I've been using Alclad for the last couple of years and really like it. I rechromed all the model chrome parts with it rather as it gives a much more realistic finish. .


 I don't know what models you've been buying, but so far none of the people I've seen using alclad have gotten the results that model manufacturers do with their chrome. It looks more like lightly polished aluminum. Somewhat like the car in your last post. This isn't the look I'm hoping for. If I can't get this to work, and aluminum foil is out of the question, the only thing I think of is to use another brand of spray on chrome. 



djnick66 said:


> Also with Alclad you can't buff or polish it... it isn't a buffable finish like metalizer.


 That's not true from what I've seen. A couple of people on youtube have hand rubbed their finishes on their models to help make a more uniform finish. 



Trek Ace said:


> For those of you located in the LA area, stop by Burbank House of Hobbies. They have a model airliner fuselage with many of the Alclad metal finishes applied to different panels in order to show the quality of the various metal finishes. Other than Bare Metal foil, I don't think that there is a better metal finish out there than Alclad.


I've checked them out already. They have the cheapest prices in town, and the biggest variety. However, I'm still on the fence about this stuff. 



Dave P said:


> The chrome and polished aluminum require a gloss black base because that is what gives the finish the shine and reflectivity of the real thing. If you spray it on any other primer the result will be a dull finish.
> 
> As with any natural metal finish, surface prep must be perfect. Any little scratch, bump or booger will be magnified.


 This is true. From what I've seen, the black is what makes the chrome deep. This sounds like a paradox, but it actually makes sense. Without this colour the background has nothing to give the aluminum powder its' reflectance! Everyone I've seen has used black. This is all across the board. 



djnick66 said:


> Yes and no the chrome and polished aluminum need a gloss base but it does not have to be black.


 I'm afraid you're wrong on this one. Maybe a little more time with this stuff will prove what others have been saying about it. Without a dark colour - in this case black, there's nothing for the light rays to bounce off of appropriately. This means that the silver colouring won't deflect certain light rays that are needed to give the illusion of full depth. This stuff looks very difficult to use properly since most of the people using it say that you have to spray it very lightly. I understand that because I thin my paints so that they go on very thin to keep down the dust, and orange peel spray texture that occours. But in spraying this too much will dull it as the black under coat can't disperse the light evenly between the paint particles once shot over the surface. You can't spray too many coats over your model as this will ruin the effect by covering the black under layer completely. For years chrome parts used to come on black sprue. I didn't think anything of it, but it makes sense for the spray on paint since vacuum plated parts don't need to have any type of coloration for them to be effective. Dark colours have the tendency to hide things more where as light colours don't. 

~ Chris​


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## rkoenn (Dec 18, 2007)

Well to me the chrome parts that come with models look fake like overkill and not realistic. It doesn't look like real chrome to my eye. My picture might not have captured the Alclad chrome too well but the stuff looks great to me in person. Have you actually seen a model that was painted with it up close? That should tell you whether you think it would do the trick or not.


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## Zombie_61 (Apr 21, 2004)

rkoenn said:


> ...My picture might not have captured the Alclad chrome too well but the stuff looks great to me in person. Have you actually seen a model that was painted with it up close? That should tell you whether you think it would do the trick or not.


This is one of the things I've noticed about Alclad II--it looks great in person, but rarely photographs well enough to give the impression that it's anything other than just another silver spray paint. I've seen a few build-ups in person on which the modeler used different types of Alclad next to each other, and each of them looked like some type of polished or buffed metal. That said, I understand it takes some practice to get the proper effects.

I've seen a lot of recommendations on various websites for Spaz Stix Ultimate Mirror Chrome, but I haven't tried it myself yet.


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Quote:
Originally Posted by djnick66 
Yes and no the chrome and polished aluminum need a gloss base but it does not have to be black.
I'm afraid you're wrong on this one. Maybe a little more time with this stuff will prove what others have been saying about it. Without a dark colour - in this case black, there's nothing for the light rays to bounce off of appropriately. This means that the silver colouring won't deflect certain light rays that are needed to give the illusion of full depth. This stuff looks very difficult to use properly since most of the people using it say that you have to spray it very lightly. I understand that because I thin my paints so that they go on very thin to keep down the dust, and orange peel spray texture that occours. But in spraying this too much will dull it as the black under coat can't disperse the light evenly between the paint particles once shot over the surface. You can't spray too many coats over your model as this will ruin the effect by covering the black under layer completely. For years chrome parts used to come on black sprue. I didn't think anything of it, but it makes sense for the spray on paint since vacuum plated parts don't need to have any type of coloration for them to be effective. Dark colours have the tendency to hide things more where as light colours don't. 

Well Chris, I have been using Alclad II and Chrome for many years now. And so have many other people who have actually bought and USED it. And YES you can spray too many coats on your model. I must say your paint theories and methods really make little sense based on other threads on paint you have posted in. Have you actually even bought and used any of these products like Alclad? Again I recommend you read up on Hyperscale where some EXPERT modellers describe the best primers (fine grey automotive primer) how to apply it, etc. Alclad themselves makes non-black primers for ALL of their finishes. They have a clear one, for example, IIRC. They had a yellow "honey" primer as well.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

The difference between chrome and polished silver lies in the sharpness of the reflections. If the reflections are blurry or soft-edged, then we ain't got chrome.

To my eye, the Hornet looks nice, but the reflections in the bumper look a little soft. I could be wrong, of course, Got closeups?

This one looks pretty good: note the sharp-edged reflection at the left. Not sure about the overall mottling, though.
http://floch5.com/me163revchromfuse1.jpg


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## ryoga (Oct 6, 2009)

I recently tried using Alclad II chrome on my Moebius Cylon Centurion. Friends who had experience with this paint had advised me to coat the base with gloss black first. Just followed the instructions and this is the result I got - first time using her.

http://s1246.photobucket.com/albums/gg612/brucescalemodeling/Assembling%20Moebius%20Cylon%20Centurion/?action=view&current=DSCN6599_3008_zpsb0c11880.mp4

And yes, I am having a tough time trying to get a great image of its effect. The video showed its effect better

http://www.hobbytalk.com/bbs1/showthread.php?p=4338958#post4338958


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## djnick66 (May 2, 2008)

Alclad looks almost universally better in person than in photos. For model purposes it is not as bright and toylike as most kit chrome, but it is vastly better than silver paint.


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

rkoenn said:


> Well to me the chrome parts that come with models look fake like overkill and not realistic. It doesn't look like real chrome to my eye.


 I understand what you're saying, but nothing is more real that the real thing itself. The problem is that the detail say on a grill where there are usually holes in between can make it look unrealistic in appearance because of it, and the scale can sometimes compound this. However, if the plating is bad, or if the company did a rotten job of plating, mastering the kit, or did nickel instead of chrome it can look bad. I've had to remove plating before, but I used a toothbrush with lacquer thinner back in the day for parts that weren't originally chrome plated on the real vehicle. It's pretty hard to remove the plastic between the grill lines without destroying it, or marring the surface even if you sand from behind! This also makes the grill more delicate although it may look more realistic it's still a bad idea to do this. This is why I don't remove the chrome from my models on the parts that are supposed to be chromed I.E. bumpers. 



Zombie_61 said:


> This is one of the things I've noticed about Alclad II--it looks great in person, but rarely photographs well enough to give the impression that it's anything other than just another silver spray paint. I've seen a few build-ups in person on which the modeler used different types of Alclad next to each other, and each of them looked like some type of polished or buffed metal. That said, I understand it takes some practice to get the proper effects.
> 
> I've seen a lot of recommendations on various websites for Spaz Stix Ultimate Mirror Chrome, but I haven't tried it myself yet.


 That's the same experience I've had with this stuff just looking at it online. I've thought about using the Spaz Stix too, but it looks like they only sell it in an aerosol can. I need something that I don't have to decant to use. It's just a waste no more than you would get from such a small can having to spray it even with the technique that I use.

I guess that the picture quality is determined by the camera, the pixelation of our computer monitors, and clarity of resolution these have in conjunction with each other. What looks like chrome in person may not look like it over the internet. This IS a paint, and not an actual solid layer of chrome. Chrome sometimes looks a little pixelated, but it does have the reflection of actual chrome surfacing. It's very difficult to get the chrome effect with paint no matter how well it's made. The spray on chrome brand is silver nitrate, and is activated by distilled water, and ammonium nitrate. This makes the silver stick real well to the surface. 




djnick66 said:


> Well Chris, I have been using Alclad II and Chrome for many years now. And so have many other people who have actually bought and USED it. And YES you can spray too many coats on your model. I must say your paint theories and methods really make little sense based on other threads on paint you have posted in. Have you actually even bought and used any of these products like Alclad? Again I recommend you read up on Hyperscale where some EXPERT modellers describe the best primers (fine grey automotive primer) how to apply it, etc. Alclad themselves makes non-black primers for ALL of their finishes. They have a clear one, for example, IIRC. They had a yellow "honey" primer as well.


 My "theories"? Here - let me explain. My EXPERIENCES are the only things I post here on Hobby talk. I don't usually post what others experiences are, except in my last post. This is what the guy who impressed me most said in his video - it DOES make sense. If you spray silver over a light colour it's more difficult to see the light dispersement than it is to see it over a dark colour until it achieves full coverage. I know this from experience. The same is true from gold, or copper coloured paints. They reflect light more than darker colours, so you'd have to use a dark colour for two reasons. One - you have to see when you have full coverage. Two a darker colour allows you to see this more easily under a lighter paint colour than a light colour would. Does this not make sense? A darker colour over a lighter colour has more hide than I lighter colour over a darker colour. Does this not make sense? A metallic paint doesn't require a darker, or lighter colour to make it reflective, or have the same amount of hide, (coverage) over other colours. It's a metallic powder - not a pigment. None of this may make sense to you, but it does to everyone else. What we really have here is a difference in opinions rather than actual fact. I got my experience first hand. I was in the painters' local # 469 as a union member. I learned my stuff about paint formulation from them. Not off an MSDS (material safety data sheet). I learned the controls for handling paint, and hazardous materials, the type of method for cleaning them up, as well as dispensing them, the type of clothing, and safety equipment used for it as well. I'm not some turnip that just fell of the wagon when it comes to paint, or its' related mediums.  No - I've never used Alclad, or anything like it as this is very new technology to me. That's the reason why I started this thread - to get the information I can't find on the Alclad website, or anywhere. I looked at hyperscales' website, but I couldn't find a definative answer to my questions, or see anyone elses' work there since I don't know what search to put in other than Alclad II chrome which didn't come up with many search terms. Most of these were posts questioning its' use, and replies to it, but nothing to see, or any real useful information. I DID see a couple of guys that got excellent results from this on youtube. The second video was of one guy using the chrome, and stainless steel Alclad II side by side comparison. This is what ultimately sold me on it. He had to do a close up to see the results, but it looked just like the chrome plating that you see in a model kit. I got the idea, and I hope to use this stuff sometime soon. :wave:




SteveR said:


> The difference between chrome and polished silver lies in the sharpness of the reflections. If the reflections are blurry or soft-edged, then we ain't got chrome.
> 
> To my eye, the Hornet looks nice, but the reflections in the bumper look a little soft. I could be wrong, of course, Got closeups?
> 
> ...


 Your impressions are the same ones that I had of this before the youtube videos. I guess that the quality of the cameras, or resolution is what throws it off.


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## Dave P (Jan 5, 2005)

As another example, here are a couple shots of a white metal Model Airways Albatross engine that was "hot rodded" to go in Monogram's Big Red Baron.

I used both Tamiya and Alclad gloss black as a base for the chrome. I found that the Alclad base provided a slightly brighter and more durable finish than the Tamiya, but I was very pleased with the overall result.


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## robiwon (Oct 20, 2006)

Oh, for Pete's sake. Why don't you just buy the stuff and try it? Instead of telling people who have used something that they are wrong or missinformed because of something you read somewhere, saw a video of, or some job you had in the past, why not try it yourself and get your own answers? This is almost a repeat of the Future thread with the same underlying tone. You argue with modelers about a topic you have no experience with and then post long drawn out answers with "big words" thinking you are impressing us with your knoweldge and vocabulary. In reality you are being rude and degradding to other modelers who have hands on experience.

You only post about your experiences? Not true with that old Future thread where you told people never to use it even though you have no experience.

Build something and post pictures of a completed model, do you have any?

Sorry Mods, but it had to be said by someone. *I will accept my punishment*, but this is getting old.


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## rkoenn (Dec 18, 2007)

Hey Robiwon, too bad we don't have a "LIKE" button on Hobbytalk! I would have given you a load of "LIKES!" You succinctly wrote what needed to be written!

And Dave P., that engine looks great even though you did use Alclad!!! Actually I have a Red Baron to build someday and I'm going to keep a picture in my build folder for when the time comes to build it.


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

These comparisons look interesting: 
http://www.scalemotorcars.com/forum/building-tutorials/18666-alclad-testing.html
http://www.automotivehelper.com/topic638256.htm


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## SteveR (Aug 7, 2005)

Dave P said:


> As another example, here are a couple shots of a white metal Model Airways Albatross engine that was "hot rodded" to go in Monogram's Big Red Baron.


Now that's an engine! Show us the car when it's done!


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## Dave P (Jan 5, 2005)

Thanks. Don't want the thread to take a left turn, but it's part of a large WWI trench diorama that's been ongoing for a looooooong time. The car itself is almost there.

Back to the Alclad, I've noticed the chrome has a tendency to rub off with handling when using Tamiya as a base. It's rock solid over Alclad base or Krylon. Perhaps it was my error, but it's happened more than once.

To strip existing chrome I've had good luck with Westley's Bleche-Wite. Soak over night and scrub with a stiff brush and mild soap. Never had a problem with delicate detail.


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## spock62 (Aug 13, 2003)

Sorry if this has already been answered here, I've just skimmed over this post, but, having never used Alclad myself, I was wondering, when using a clear coat (to protect decals or dull the finish), is there a preferred brand and type?


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

robiwon said:


> Oh, for Pete's sake. Why don't you just buy the stuff and try it? Instead of telling people who have used something that they are wrong or missinformed because of something you read somewhere, saw a video of, or some job you had in the past, why not try it yourself and get your own answers? This is almost a repeat of the Future thread with the same underlying tone. You argue with modelers about a topic you have no experience with and then post long drawn out answers with "big words" thinking you are impressing us with your knoweldge and vocabulary. In reality you are being rude and degradding to other modelers who have hands on experience.
> 
> You only post about your experiences? Not true with that old Future thread where you told people never to use it even though you have no experience.
> 
> ...


 Where the hell did Future come from? This isn't a pissing match, nor was it intended to incite one! I'm not trying to impress anyone, or be rude. I'm just stating my case the only way I know how to! We don't all think the same way, nor do we react the same way to everything - should we? CALM DOWN, ROBERT!!! CALM DOWN. This isn't about past lives, past sins, or posts. It's about paint, which FUTURE brand floor polish is NOT. Just because one person, or a few use a product that they're satisfied with doesn't mean that I have to, or going to use as well.

I'm only trying to get information from people that know what this (Alclad) stuff is like, and the only thing I've found is videos which are more informative, and in depth since they show it being used, and the end result! I wasn't being rude - just standing my ground. I was only quoting what another user of this stuff has said in a video - one that got the actual chrome look to his project. It HAS to have a black base as this is what the manufacturer says since it reflects the light rays differently than light colour which only diffuse metallic paints like this one. It's formulated for a chrome effect unlike regular silver paint, or other metallic powders suspended in a solvent base. Light diffuses more with light colours, and darker colours concentrate it, or make this effect more intense. As far as buying some, I've already beaten you to the punch! I ordered this stuff last week after seeing a video on you tube of one guy using it side by side with Alclad II stainless steel, which shined like a mirror. This is what ultimately sold me on it. I might try the Spaz Stix at a later date since the results with it are just as good, and seemingly better than Alclad brand paint. It can be painted over without worry of running, or over doing it since it's formulated somewhat differently than what I bought. I saw this video two days ago - after I already bought the Alclad II in chrome. I haven't tried it yet - it just arrived on my doorstep today. The label looks like someone printed it on an inkjet printer which is just what they did. Either way, we'll see what results I can get with this stuff. :thumbsup:



rkoenn said:


> Hey Robiwon, too bad we don't have a "LIKE" button on Hobbytalk! I would have given you a load of "LIKES!" You succinctly wrote what needed to be written!
> 
> And Dave P., that engine looks great even though you did use Alclad!!! Actually I have a Red Baron to build someday and I'm going to keep a picture in my build folder for when the time comes to build it.


 We don't need "like buttons" - that's why we have "REPORT POST" buttons for those who abuse each other, or the privelage of being a member here! None of that needed to be written, at least not publicly!  


Dave P said:


> Thanks. Don't want the thread to take a left turn


 I'm afraid it already has. 



Dave P said:


> Back to the Alclad, I've noticed the chrome has a tendency to rub off with handling when using Tamiya as a base. It's rock solid over Alclad base or Krylon. Perhaps it was my error, but it's happened more than once.
> 
> To strip existing chrome I've had good luck with Westley's Bleche-Wite. Soak over night and scrub with a stiff brush and mild soap. Never had a problem with delicate detail.


This is what this thread is SUPPOSED to be about - let's stay on topic, people. I used nitrocellulose lacquer as my paint coat. I hope that this stuff will live up to its' name when I spray it on scrap pieces! I'm not 100% sold just yet, but if it can get at least a polished aluminum, then I'll use it for medieval knight models. Those don't always need to be mirror polished in their appearance. 


And for those who have any other pearls of wisdom that they care to impart: 

Don't get your panties into a twist because something I said upset you. Learn to control your emotions. If you have something to say that isn't related to this thread, send to me through a PM, instead of airing your dirty laundry publicly. Otherwise, thanks for reading, and have a nice day.

~ Chris​


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

spock62 said:


> Sorry if this has already been answered here, I've just skimmed over this post, but, having never used Alclad myself, I was wondering, when using a clear coat (to protect decals or dull the finish), is there a preferred brand and type?


I'm sorry I missed your message - I'm replying through email notices as I recieve them. This makes it hard to see all responses if some are on another page.

From what I've read on the Alcald site, you'll want to use the same stuff made by them if you want to have the results seen on most successful websites, without paint incompatability. Alclad II is lacquer based from what I've read, or at least the chrome, and aluminum paints, and their clearcoats are. I know they do sell enamel based paints, but you'll want to check the base coat, and the clearcoat with this brand. Some clear coats can't be used with decals, or certain paint under coatings. You don't want to use setting solutions with the chrome, or decals as this is what it says on the bottle. Stick with the clear coat the manufacturer recommends, otherwise you'll make a mess unintentionally. They don't warranty, or guarantee your models, or the usage of their product with another makers brand of products. 

~ Chris​


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## robiwon (Oct 20, 2006)

Chris, it isn't really about me calming down. It's about a great many things. You ask about a product and then want to argue or degrade those who post with real world answers to your question. You tell people their answers are wrong when they have actually used said product and you haven't.

You said a gloss black has to be used under Alclad, matter of factly. Well in reality, you can use whatever you want. It's best to use the companies brand of base, but you don't HAVE to. That's called experimenting with what is out there, to find what works best for you. You are right, not every one has the same skill set, but they are posting what they have done. That's what people are trying to tell you.

As far as the Future thread goes I alluded to, you were arguemenative to those who used it, and belittled a lot of experienced modelers who have actually used the product. Same as this thread. That's what I was refering to. 

"Don't get your panties into a twist because something I said upset you. Learn to control your emotions."

You should learn to have some *respect* for other modelers.

And to stay on topic, here is some good reading.

http://www.swannysmodels.com/Alclad.html

And for actual "chrome" tips, this is a good video.

http://www.modelcarsmag.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=52196


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## Dyonisis (Nov 11, 2009)

robiwon said:


> Chris, it isn't really about me calming down. It's about a great many things. You ask about a product and then want to argue or degrade those who post with real world answers to your question. You tell people their answers are wrong when they have actually used said product and you haven't.
> 
> You said a gloss black has to be used under Alclad, matter of factly. Well in reality, you can use whatever you want. It's best to use the companies brand of base, but you don't HAVE to. That's called experimenting with what is out there, to find what works best for you. You are right, not every one has the same skill set, but they are posting what they have done. That's what people are trying to tell you.


 Actually, I didn't degrade, or berate anyone - I simply said what the website said: "A black basecoat is required to use spray chrome" - I was only quoting what they said. In all reality most of the people that have gotten the results that I desire have used black for the same reasons I stated before in my last post. Experimenting aside, if you want what the company promises, it's a good idea to listen to them. Everyones' experiences are different - I understand that, but in all reality when using someones' product it's best to follow their suggestions. I understand that not everyone has the same skill level, or experience - I can appreciate that. It helps to ask those who are truly in the know about these things. I also needed a definative, guided answer - not a varying degree, but what I'm looking to get from this product which I know VERY LITTLE ABOUT. I also know for a fact that black DOES indeed disperse light differently with this paint as it's formulated a lot differently than the regular silver spray paint we're all familiar with. This is what people on youtube say, and I see what they mean. It's very hard to disagree with results. We post what we want to on hobby talk, but rarely in video form. On youtube it's more interactive as you can see others reactions to the video, and the content is more definative than simply exchanging words on a hobby chat forum. 

On another note: When I post things on here I don't do it out malice, or hate for any reason! That's NOT my intent, nor is it in my personality to undermine those who share the same passion for something that I do. I'm not cynical, or narcussitic in nature, or condescending - that kind of attitude sucks, and I hate it!!!!







It's posts like these that make me not want to come back here. This, and my life situation are killing my love of modeling. I was hoping for a definative answer, but now this thread is THREE pages long, and the last one is mostly arguements of how one person doens't like what the other has said. This is what is killing modeling forums in general - the spite that others carry for one reason, or another. Most people have sentiment for a certain model, genre, modeler, or the technique they use. I hoped to share something here, but THIS IS NOT IT!

In the FUTURE threads I only got into them because I'm so sick of seeing people touting this as a wonderful "Be all-End all" solution to modeling clear parts. If it IS acrylic, why not just use Rustoleum, or Krylon? What's the difference? What's wrong with using a product that IS formulated as a paint product, and that is approved for use on wood, plastic, and metal? They always say - "Try on an inconspicuous area". However, I've never had a problem using any of these products with models, or anything else I've used them with. I HAVE used Future, and Mop-n-Glo which are the same thing basically. But I've only used them on floors for which they were originally formulated. Maybe THIS will clear things up once and for all? :thumbsup: 

All I know is that I got my answer (on youtube) a few days ago, and no more replies to this thread are neccessary. This thread has served its' purpose. I'm done here. Thank you all who actually had something to contribute to this thread, and for those who read it without saying a single word. I hope someone learned something from this thread. It can now be closed. 

~ Chris​


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Great Googly Moogly! 

RESPECT is indeed something that seems in short supply around here - from a varity of posters. It's to the point where I'm locking down a thread every other day here on HT. 

I'd like to suggest everyone re-familiarize themselves with the Terms of Service for HobbyTalk. Ultimately, it comes down to "Be Nice." and "Treat Others as You Want to be Treated". Apparently, some of you like to ignore others or outright treat what they say dismissively - which means that's how you wish to be treated, right?

Betcha not. 

Yet another thread locked....


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