# Kit parts used for Picard's Stargazer model



## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

I apologize if this has been asked, but the search returned no threads on either Constellation or Stargazer (that seems wrong; I'm sure I've seen mentions here of both).

I've read some info on the model in the past, but the memory might be wrong. If you know better, correct me.

Without checking the episodes (I checked screencaps at trekpulse.com) I see it first in Code of Honor, somewhat before The Battle (I haven't checked the production order here). I originally remembered it not being in early episodes, but I think what I'm recalling is that it was replaced in a few episodes while it was being used to build the studio miniature.

I know they were thinking of using a Constitution class ship for the Stargazer in The Battle but changed their mind in production, so they dubbed Geordi's line to the lip-matching Constellation. Was the model seen in Picard's ready room just a random model (ie no specific backstory) until that decision?

What I'm curious about is whether it was built originally as purely a display piece, or whether it was built originally to serve as a study model? I'm guessing a display piece, but I hope someone can confirm this.

In any event, I know that the studio miniature was built to copy the small model.

What I want to know is, what kit parts were used to build the DISPLAY model. I'm not interested (for the moment) in what's needed to match the studio miniature, but only the little model from Picard's ready room.

If anyone knows, some or all of the pieces. I'd appreciate it! Thanks!


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Check out Ex Astris Scientia, as they've got some excellent articles on reconstructing the parts used on various ships. I don't know if they've got anything on the _Constellation_-class, tho. If nothing else, they've got some excellent images in their Starship Gallery. You can also check out StarFleet Modeler, in the Starships section of the site. There are some nice pics of various ships there.


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## The Trekmodeler (Jul 21, 2005)

From what I know Stargazer used many refit components such as the standard saucer, the warp engines, the impulse crystal, even the pylons were used. This is a link to a custom model of it being sold on ebay, its got VERY clear pics. 
http://cgi.ebay.com/STAR-TREK-USS-STARGAZER-SCRATCH-BUILT-AEROSPACE-MODEL_W0QQitemZ5991827919QQcategoryZ1187QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

It seems to me that some sort of SuperDeformed Gundam is on the bottom section, just about where the impulse dome would be on the Refit saucer. The top area where the impulse crystal would be is inhabited by some sort of Macross part. I want to say it's a shield...? I can't find my notes on what has been said of the non-Trek pieces/parts that went in to the construction, so can't really help beyond that.


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## The Trekmodeler (Jul 21, 2005)

I found a really rare conversion kit on there too if you are interested 
http://cgi.ebay.com/RARE-1-1400-STAR-TREK-STTNG-STARGAZER-MODEL-KIT_W0QQitemZ5991559540QQcategoryZ49211QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## ProfKSergeev (Aug 29, 2003)

The parts used on Captain Picard's garish yellow display model were taken from the following kits:

ARII 1/100 Battroid
ARII 1/48 Orguss Orgroid
Super deformed Xabungle (robot on bottom)
Crusher Joe "Galleon" (the smaller of the two kits)
Tripod from Star Blazers, as seen here: http://www15.ocn.ne.jp/~ndopara/page_thumb27.htm
And of course two AMT/Ertl refit Enterprises

I've collected most of the above parts and am in the process of constructing a replica of the Stargazer. As I get further along, I'll make sure to post some progress photos here. Ciao, guys!


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## ProfKSergeev (Aug 29, 2003)

I thought I'd snap a shot for you of some of the parts, labelled as to their source.


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Kewelness! Thanks, Lauren!


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

Wow, lotsa helpful replies!

Thanks for the links guys.

Lauren, thanks so much. Did you reverse engineer the yellow model from pics of the studio model, or did you find references/info specific to the yellow one?

I would have thought there were more parts that were needed, are you sure that accounts for everything? By the way, don't the nacelles require pieces from 4 kits? Because there are eight "grilled" nacelle halves used and two kits would only have 4, right?

Finally, are any of those parts rare or expensive? I know the Consitution kits can be. Is it a smoothy?

Thanks again!


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

The Constellation class does indeed use a total of eight nacelles - all outboard pieces. I'm not sure how far up from the end that they're cut, either. No clue about how hard the different pieces/parts kits are to get hold of for trickin' out your starship, but the Refit kits seem to be coming down in price on EvilBay







, tho I've not really paid too close attention in a while. I also don't think it was a smoothy in Picards ready room, but don't recall for certain, as I've only ever seen one image of it and don't seem to have saved it nor is it in any of my reference books.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

If it was in Encounter At Farpoint, I assume it was built late 1986/early 1987. Does that sound right? If that were so, how many different editions of the TMP kit had been put out by then?

Also, who built it? Jein?


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## The Trekmodeler (Jul 21, 2005)

I am not sure who built it but I know that by 1987 there where 4 editions, the latest being the star trek 4 kit.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

I found a good picture of it:

http://tng.trekpulse.com/episodes/season3/3x04/screencaps/whowatchesthewatchers176.jpg

Was only the first edition the smoothy?


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Richard Compton said:


> If it was in Encounter At Farpoint, I assume it was built late 1986/early 1987. Does that sound right?


If you're referring to the _Stargazer _model in Picards ready room as "it", then it didn't show up 'til about halfway thru the first season, IIRC. 



> If that were so, how many different editions of the TMP kit had been put out by then?


As far as I recall, there were only ever three editions of the TMP Refit released - the standard AMT, an AMT/Lindsay release and a Matchbox release which was the Canadian/European release. 


> Also, who built it? Jein?


I think that Rick Sternbach said he and one or two others 'bashed the display model for Picards ready room. I don't believe that Greg Jein was involved in the display models conception nor construction.


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

Richard Compton said:


> I found a good picture of it:
> 
> http://tng.trekpulse.com/episodes/season3/3x04/screencaps/whowatchesthewatchers176.jpg
> 
> Was only the first edition the smoothy?


Only the TMP releases were smoothies. Starting w/the ST:TWoK release they added the hull plate texturing to the models - which seemed to get deeper and deeper in their look as later pressings of the kit were released. The holes in the saucer for the navigational lights didn't show up 'til they released the "Lights & Sounds" kit and those nasty holes showed up from the ST:V and ST:VI releases - tho the latter two also included the ST:V shuttlecraft.


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## ProfKSergeev (Aug 29, 2003)

Richard Compton said:


> Thanks so much. Did you reverse engineer the yellow model from pics of the studio model, or did you find references/info specific to the yellow one?


I just asked Rick Sternbach what kits he used. No kidding. He wasn't able to remember all of the specific kits used, so some guessing on my part and inquiries made with anime modelers helped to identify the remainder of the kits.



Richard Compton said:


> I would have thought there were more parts that were needed, are you sure that accounts for everything?


My list does not count for all of the parts used. For instance, I have no idea where the bridge module on the display model comes from. The same goes for some of the detail bits on the horizontal warp pylons.



Richard Compton said:


> By the way, don't the nacelles require pieces from 4 kits? Because there are eight "grilled" nacelle halves used and two kits would only have 4, right?


Yes, you're right. I forgot to mention that.



Richard Compton said:


> Finally, are any of those parts rare or expensive? I know the Consitution kits can be. Is it a smoothy?


The only one that seems to be rare and possibly expensive (don't know for sure) is the Tripod from "Star Blazers." John Lester of starshipmodeler.com was the fellow who identified those pieces and was generous enough to send me them from a partially built up kit. I haven't seen the kit elesewhere for sale since, and since most of the other kits from "Star Blazers" are plentiful, I'm led to believe that the Tripod is - at the least - not common.

The Constitution kits are _not_ the smoothies. I do plan, however, on obliterating the engraved pseudo-aztec pattern on the saucer, nacelles, neck, and pylons.



Richard Compton said:


> Thanks again!


You're quite welcome!

P.S. Here's a couple of nice shots of the display model.


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## The Trekmodeler (Jul 21, 2005)

ProfKSergeev said:


> My list does not count for all of the parts used. For instance, I have no idea where the bridge module on the display model comes from. The same goes for some of the detail bits on the horizontal warp pylons.
> 
> I'm assuming the bridge module was done using 2 refit modules somehow.
> Nice pics!


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## Griffworks (Jun 24, 2002)

That's the front half of two bridge modules, glued together by the looks of it, with a strip of plastic stock (rectangular?) added to the aft section.


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## ProfKSergeev (Aug 29, 2003)

Griffworks said:


> That's the front half of two bridge modules, glued together by the looks of it, with a strip of plastic stock (rectangular?) added to the aft section.


Thanks, Griff! That looks right to me.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

Griffworks said:


> If you're referring to the _Stargazer _model in Picards ready room as "it", then it didn't show up 'til about halfway thru the first season, IIRC.


 Yes I was. Like I said above, I saw it a number of episodes before The Battle and without checking, I believe it was in the pilot. I saw a person at another board say that it was there as well.



> As far as I recall, there were only ever three editions of the TMP Refit released - the standard AMT, an AMT/Lindsay release and a Matchbox release which was the Canadian/European release.


 I mostly meant when there was a difference in the kits' parts of the different releases.



> I think that Rick Sternbach said he and one or two others 'bashed the display model for Picards ready room. I don't believe that Greg Jein was involved in the display models conception nor construction.


 I've heared Sternbach and maybe Okuda too...but does anyone have a source on this info. I might eventually email Sternbach, but I want to know more before I do that.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

Griffworks said:


> Only the TMP releases were smoothies. Starting w/the ST:TWoK release they added the hull plate texturing to the models - which seemed to get deeper and deeper in their look as later pressings of the kit were released. The holes in the saucer for the navigational lights didn't show up 'til they released the "Lights & Sounds" kit and those nasty holes showed up from the ST:V and ST:VI releases - tho the latter two also included the ST:V shuttlecraft.


 Okay, that's good info. So I should expect the kits they used couldn't have been a lights and sounds version because they weren't out yet. The only thing I need to know is if it is a smoothy or not. Thanks.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

ProfKSergeev said:


> I just asked Rick Sternbach what kits he used. No kidding. He wasn't able to remember all of the specific kits used, so some guessing on my part and inquiries made with anime modelers helped to identify the remainder of the kits.


 Heh. I figure he gets asked all the time, so it's better for me to find out as much as possible before I go asking. Like asking people like you! 



ProfKSergeev said:


> The only one that seems to be rare and possibly expensive (don't know for sure) is the Tripod from "Star Blazers." John Lester of starshipmodeler.com was the fellow who identified those pieces and was generous enough to send me them from a partially built up kit. I haven't seen the kit elesewhere for sale since, and since most of the other kits from "Star Blazers" are plentiful, I'm led to believe that the Tripod is - at the least - not common.





ProfKSergeev said:


> The Constitution kits are _not_ the smoothies. I do plan, however, on obliterating the engraved pseudo-aztec pattern on the saucer, nacelles, neck, and pylons.


 Interesting. That does make sense. If they were pulling from kits that they or Sternbach gathered during the early production of the show, then it's more likely to be later kits.



ProfKSergeev said:


> You're quite welcome!
> 
> Lauren Oliver
> 
> P.S. Here's a couple of nice shots of the display model.


 Thanks again for the info. Where do those shots come from, if I may ask?


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## X15-A2 (Jan 21, 2004)

I was in the Paramount office shared by Mike Minor & Joe Jennings one day (I knew Mike) when they were working on STWOK, Jennings stormed in cussing a blue streak about those "SOBs" at ILM who wanted to paint the "Reliant" yellow. He had a cigar chomped in one side of his mouth with space for obsenities on the other side as he launched into a rant about how these are ships of the same fleet and they should be painted the same @#[email protected]%%* colors! Now those @%#!& guys think that they're designers!!

Mike and I just kinda looked at each other. Apparently Mr Jennings had just gotten off the phone with the ILM guys. So, the "Stargazer" was not the first Star Trek ship to be envisioned (by somebody) as being yellow. Personally, I agree with Mr Jennings (without the profanity), yellow is an ugly color for a Starship.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

Great anecdote! Minor's done some really great things.


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## Capt. Krik (May 26, 2001)

Actually, Mike Minor passed away several years ago. My swiss cheese memory won't allow me to remember which year he died. He went way to young. Talented and imaginitive, one wonders what he would have came up with as he gained more experience and knowledge. I think it was Harve Bennett who exclaimed that Mike had saved Star Trek. Originally the Genesis device was to be some super weapon. Everyone thought making it a weapon was a terrible idea but no one could come up with another solution. It was Mike who came up with making it a terra-forming device instead of a weapon. It was agreed that this was much more in keeping with the ideals of Star Trek rather then some super weapon. A device created for creating that had the potential to be a terrible weapon. We can all thank Mike for that and all his other contributions.


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## TheYoshinator! (Apr 2, 2004)

X15-A2 said:


> I was in the Paramount office shared by Mike Minor & Joe Jennings one day (I knew Mike) when they were working on STWOK, Jennings stormed in cussing a blue streak about those "SOBs" at ILM who wanted to paint the "Reliant" yellow. He had a cigar chomped in one side of his mouth with space for obsenities on the other side as he launched into a rant about how these are ships of the same fleet and they should be painted the same @#[email protected]%%* colors! Now those @%#!& guys think that they're designers!!
> 
> Mike and I just kinda looked at each other. Apparently Mr Jennings had just gotten off the phone with the ILM guys. So, the "Stargazer" was not the first Star Trek ship to be envisioned (by somebody) as being yellow. Personally, I agree with Mr Jennings (without the profanity), yellow is an ugly color for a Starship.


I think the idea of painting them "Yellow" is a mis-interpretation. It's hard to speculate what ILM's intent was. But from my understanding it wasn't that they wanted the ships to be SEEN as "Yellow". If you look at the ST:III CineFex issue it may become apparent what they most likely meant. You may notice that they purposely cast a yellow light on the ships during that time to help pull mattes from the bluescreens. To have painted it yellow in the first place may have been their initial idea to get easier mattes from model up against all that blue. While at the same time having the ship a bit more glossy since the highlights may have been yellow-ish as well. Once filmed they would have most likely filtered the yellow out. Leaving us with a white-ish ship in the end... and who knows, purhaps even higher quality work than what we now know.


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

The other person who helped kitbash that model was Andrew Probert. He told me himself in the course of an email discussion where it came up.

This reminds me, I need to finish my model of the ol' girl....


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## X15-A2 (Jan 21, 2004)

No, the ILM guys thought that a so-called "science ship" (aren't they all?) should be painted a different color from the normal "fleet" ships and had suggested yellow. Mr Jennings was pissed, I think he not only disagreed but resented "those guys" trying to be "Art Directors" (thus trading on his corner). It must have been quite an exchange because he was livid. Creative differences...

Mike was not only creative but also a really nice guy. Very sad about his passing. I met him one day when a friend and I were wondering the halls of the Disney studio offices. I don't remember if it was on a weekend or just late in the day after everyone had gone home but the offices were empty and we were looking around at all the stuff on the walls. As we walked down the hall we began to hear the "Star Wars" sound track eminating from one of the offices so we looked in and there was Mike, working late. He looked up and without hesitation said "come on in". We looked at each other then went in and introduced ourselves, after explaining that we had heard the music comming from his office. He was very aimiable and seemed amused to learn that we had "snuck into" the studio (not technically correct but we didn't have any real business there beyond basic curiosity). We talked for quite awhile and learned that he was just finishing up his work on "The Cat from Outer Space". Sometime later, after that intitial meeting, he would contact me (he was also friends it turned out with Tom Scherman of Nautilus fame who I also knew quite well) about doing plans for the crawler being designed for Jim Danforth's "Timescape" film (which was never made). Still later he invited us to come see the Star Trek sets under construction when it was still the "Phase II" TV show. As I said, he was a very nice guy.


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## Richard Compton (Nov 21, 2000)

Wow. Do you recall anything of note from that set visit? I think it was Shane Johnson who said when he visited the movie sets that they just built right over the corridor walls. I don't know if I've ever seen what the corridors were meant to look like. Do you recall?

Were the main ship sets arranged as they ended up for the film (I'm thinking mainly the corridor complex with sickbay, transporter room, crew quarters, engineering here) or was that reapproached when they were changed for the film?


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