# M.R. TOS Enterprise news-NEW PIC



## TOS Maniac (Jun 26, 2006)

I did a google search for new news about the big E today, as I'm getting itchy for some new info. I pulled this off statueforum.com. It's from last week.
http://www.statueforum.com/showthread.php?p=878567

Are you guys as concerned/dismayed as I am at the appearance of the seemingly scribed grid lines on the upper hull? this DOES NOT look good to me! it looks too "toy-ish" someone please give me some comfort! tell me this is wrong!


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

If it is true, them I will stick with my Playmate one. Not big, but no lines.


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## Joeysaddress (Jun 16, 2006)

While this may be a new post on the web, the photo if is from an event earlier this year. The production model will have the grid lines done in pencil...like the filming model. NOT SCRIBED!


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## Admiral Nelson (Feb 28, 2002)

Big question: HOW MUCH $$$?


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## Joeysaddress (Jun 16, 2006)

$1,199 standard version
1,299 Shatner Nimoy signed
1,499 Bridge crew signed...Sold out I think.


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## TGel63 (Mar 26, 2004)

I would not ever dish out that type of money for a model, no matter how detailed or accurate.


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## ilbasso (Jun 7, 2006)

I dished out that kind of money - once - for a piece of paper! But one that had been to the surface of the Moon. I'm getting it signed by Gene Cernan tonight!


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## compucrap (Dec 16, 2000)

neato, Ive always wanted to meet Gene. What was the paper on the moon for?

Josh


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## ilbasso (Jun 7, 2006)

It was a page from the malfunction procedures manual for the lunar module. 

What a great evening - it was part of a lecture series at the National Air & Space Museum. Wally Schirra, Tom Stafford, and Gene Cernan all sharing recollections about their missions. What a hoot! Lots of funny stories from three guys who obviously like each other very much. After the lecture they signed autographs.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Everyone is different.
Whatever floats your boat. Some people spend more money on beer in a year. 
For the quality of the MR E, lighted, accurate, lovely large scale. 
It is well worth it in my opinion. But I am not buying a model or toy. 
It represents "the dream" to me. The Jeffries design is high artwork to me. Powerful imaginings of Jeffries and Roddenberry. Where we want to be someday. Where I want humanity to be someday, something like it anyways, though I can never live to see it. You either get that or you don't.

On space collectibles.....
In the early days of eBay I was able to snatch up a flown shuttle tile for a few hundred bucks with all the reject documentation. Hammered and nasty looking thing from one of Endeavours OMS pods.
Flown multiple times, probably on different shuttles too as I know they swap the OMS pods sometimes. Even had a few spots where they patched up small damage with some kind of putty. Flown items still come up on eBay from time to time. 


I was able to go to the Smithsonian Air and Space and the Dulles museum as well for the first time recently.
You guys who live there are spoiled rotten!

I must have taken a couple hundred pics.



PS, I did not hyperlink the above links to the auction site. That happened automatically! when did this start? ack!


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

I find if you put e bay, like this then, no link.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

New production model pics today.......


http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i197/master_replicas/Enterprise1.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i197/master_replicas/Enterprise2.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i197/master_replicas/Enterprise3.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i197/master_replicas/Enterprise4.jpg
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i197/master_replicas/Enterprise5.jpg


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

Is it me, or is their too much rust on the saucer?


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Lloyd Collins said:


> Is it me, or is their too much rust on the saucer?



This is the original studio scale model, 

http://www.uah.edu/~jim/nasm4.jpg

the top of the saucer has not been repainted during all the smithsonian restorations and looks as she did back in the day. 


Edit.
Aging I am sure has impacted the appearance of the top of the saucer certainly.


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

I just don't trust the new paint job, on the 11 foot model, as being accerate. I like the 1st season look of the 1701.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Lloyd Collins said:


> I just don't trust the new paint job, on the 11 foot model, as being accerate. I like the 1st season look of the 1701.


Well the 11 footer as it appears today is waaaaay off from the studio days. 
Only the top of the saucer was pretty much left alone. 

Anyways, they added much to the model over time from the "pilot" version, I understand your point. 

But MR has sought to reproduce this version. They had planned a pilot version too but cancelled those plans.


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## John Duncan (Jan 27, 2001)

I'm still impressed with the job they have done on it. I very nearly cancelled my order last week (the lust for the model having subsided) but now I'm glad I didn't. There may never be another chance to get one of these.

And certainly if it had been a kit, it would be stacked in the closet with the 1/350 refits....


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

Is anybody aware of a more difinitive release date yet?

I just ordered mine last night. 40th birthday present to myself (not 40 yet -Dec 11th).


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## John Duncan (Jan 27, 2001)

I had heard from Barry that they would be shipped before the end of December but it's anyone's guess at this point.


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## Chuck_P.R. (Jun 8, 2003)

I hope they take their time and get it right, even if December comes and goes by a few weeks.

I, like many others, wish they would drop the heavy rust job(too "Mr Ed" for my tastes). Even if the studio model can be shown to have as much rust in a few shots I'm willing to bet most of us don't remember her that way from most of what we remember/saw onscreen.

To use the very apt analogy someone else here came up with on the subject, I hope they model the character, not the actor.

It won't be a deal breaker for me, but I'd much prefer he with little to no rust(or even those dirt "speed streaks" on the top of the saucer for that matter). 

I hope M.R. has their ears on or this can be passed on before a final set configuration.
Heck, it would probably make painting and finishing both simpler and faster, too.



CessnaDriver said:


> Well the 11 footer as it appears today is waaaaay off from the studio days.
> Only the top of the saucer was pretty much left alone.
> 
> Anyways, they added much to the model over time from the "pilot" version, I understand your point.
> ...


While I understand M.R.'s technical viewpoint, with one or two exceptions I've seen virtually no one on any of the boards who actually has said they WANT heavy heavy weathering whether it was present on the studio model or not...

Perhaps it would be accurate to the studio model at one or two moments in it's series production life...

... but then again so would miniature duct tape and galvanized piping coming out of her port side!!!

P.S. I understand the weathering issue is not something you personally support, but if you have any contact with those who you could make the point to about the mini-duct tape and piping being just as accurate, I'd appreciate your bringing it to their attention(so long as the final version doesn't adopt the two.)


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## John Duncan (Jan 27, 2001)

As far as I know, they are in production now and have been for a while. So I don't think there will be any changes.

Now, who's gonna redo the paint job on theirs? That's what I'm waiting to see!

(Come on MR, ship 'em already!)


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

The character or the actor, that is a perfect way to put it. 

I think what is causing a rift with people interested in this product...

Screen accurate appearance Vs. studio scale model appearance.

And I need not remind anyone here of the areas in between that all modellers make decisions on. But none the less, a decision must be made at some point. 

Has anyone seen anothers work and not thought, I would have done this different or that different. Not quite right to my eye here or there? 

I am pretty pleased with what I have seen so far. weathering and gridlines all. 
I have seen the nacelle effect in person, at least a prototype anyways. 
I am convinced that if we put her before the cameras of the TOS era and filmed her similarly, same lighting and all, then viewing her on TV after sixties era film processing, the MR product would do well.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

My only wish is that they would have followed my advice and warmed the color temperature of the internal lighting, which is much too blue (a common problem with uncorrected "white" LEDs) when compared to the original stage model. The internal color of the original lighting (with the exception of the top and bottom domes) was a "warm" white in the range of 2800-3100K. The LEDs they are using are in the 5000-5600K range (closer to daylight) and are incorrect in color when compared to the original.

When I brought this to their attention, I drew blank stares.

"They're white LEDs", was the reply from the project lead person. "I don't understand what you mean by them being the wrong color?"

"Well, if you look at photos or footage of the original, you'll see that the lighted ports are a warmer color white, while yours are a very cool color white", was my reply.

More blank stares.

"They're white LEDs. White is white. It would be too expensive to try to change the color to something else."

Oh, well. I tried.

At any rate, the outside details look good. They at least darkened the engine domes somewhat, but still not dark enough to resemble the "frosted raspberries" look of the originals when powered down.

In any case, the structure is sound, and quite heavy (no sagging on this one). I'll anxiously await mine whenever it ships.


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## Nova Designs (Oct 10, 2000)

Well I don't know about you guys... and I'm as anal about this as anyone... but I think that is the best damn looking reproduction of the Enterprise I've ever seen!


I just wish they still did payment plans.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

I here ya on the lighting. 
An old incandescent bulb light is different from a modern LED without doubt. 
Anyone can see this with an old flashlight and a newer LED flashlight.

But yes, the ship still looks great.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

I'm still not sure about the scale and accuracy of the phaser turret on the lower sensor dome. The posted images don't show this particular detail too clearly, but unless I'm mistaken it would appear MR has done a bit of revising/ refining since I last saw the prototype.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Looks like it is not in all the way, like it could be (gasp) optional.


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

One of the aspects of that little whatsit on the lower sensor dome that seems to have escaped the notice of both MR and CBS Digital is that the little nubbin that it's attached to lights up right along with the rest of the dome (which is the key reason why it couldn't be seen unless the camera practically runs into the thing, like that one approach shot in "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield").


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## Joeysaddress (Jun 16, 2006)

Barry says the phaser/nipple/turret whatever thing and the navigational deflector dish will arrive in the box unattached so as to prevent damage in shipping. That being said, you can choose to attach it or leave it off. So no one will have to saw it off. How nice! Now if only the pencil line grids were not covered in clear coat we could just erase them and all would be fine.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Captain April said:


> One of the aspects of that little whatsit on the lower sensor dome that seems to have escaped the notice of both MR and CBS Digital is that the little nubbin that it's attached to lights up right along with the rest of the dome.


I've wondered about that.

Not that I doubt your word, but to my eyes the reference point you cite ("L.T.B.Y.L.B.") appears somewhat inconclusive. Can you offer another source with which to confirm your lit nubbin hypothosis?

"Lit Nubbin Hypothosis." Now there's a name in search of a band...


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

All this talk of price, you should see e bay!


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## Captain April (May 1, 2004)

Carson Dyle said:


> I've wondered about that.
> 
> Not that I doubt your word, but to my eyes the reference point you cite ("L.T.B.Y.L.B.") appears somewhat inconclusive. Can you offer another source with which to confirm your lit nubbin hypothosis?
> 
> "Lit Nubbin Hypothosis." Now there's a name in search of a band...


Well, there is the fact that we never did see a little dark spot in the middle of the lower dome...










And the aforementioned specific shot shows things pretty clearly....


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Phaser turret dealy, Tip I believe was red. 

"Phase Pistols" pic..










Saucer grids just for fun...


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ [Khan] It is very cold in spaaaaaaaaaace [khan]


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## Lloyd Collins (Sep 25, 2004)

That is CLOSE! Great detail shots.


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Captain April said:


> Well, there is the fact that we never did see a little dark spot in the middle of the lower dome...


Well, this shot certainly supports your assertion that the turret was illuminated. The images posted by Cessna are less conclusive, but I'm more than willing to give you the benefit of the doubt  

Thanks for posting.

Does anyone have a good shot of the lower sensor dome as it appeared prior to the addition of the turret? It would be interesting to compare the two.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

You know, the whole lower sensor dome array reminds me of a ceiling light.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Carson Dyle said:


> Does anyone have a good shot of the lower sensor dome as it appeared prior to the addition of the turret? It would be interesting to compare the two.


Several pics down there is a pic and you can zoom in on the dome if your right click. 

It looks clearer, and you can see inside it better. 

http://www.startrekhistory.com/restoration/bluescreen.html


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## Carson Dyle (May 7, 2003)

Thanks, Cessna. Interesting how clear and transparent the dome appears on the pilot miniature. 

Based on this I'm convinced the phaser turret on the production model was indeed illuminated -- or at least translucent enough to allow light to pass thru it. 

Do we know for certain that MR's turret will be opaque?


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Going out on a limb here.....
I think it is just like the windows.
The whole saucer is frosty clear and the windows and sensor are simply left unpainted so the light from inside can shine through. 
Clearly there are internal structures (arcing braces or ?)in there on the studio scale, even after they frosted it and added the turret. you can still make them out, I havent seen anything from MR indicating that they will try to reproduce that.
It does imply they could have ran wiring to the turret to light it along those arc braces or whatever they are.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

CessnaDriver said:


> New production model pics today.......
> 
> 
> http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i197/master_replicas/Enterprise1.jpg
> ...


_Sweet!_ :thumbsup: 

If I only had the cash.


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## TGel63 (Mar 26, 2004)

I think it looks great, and if it were in the $500.00 range or so, I would consider it, but no way I can justify to myself paying that type of money for a replica.


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## MGagen (Dec 18, 2001)

Trek Ace said:


> My only wish is that they would have followed my advice and warmed the color temperature of the internal lighting, which is much too blue (a common problem with uncorrected "white" LEDs) when compared to the original stage model.


 I share your disappointment about the color temperature of the interior lights. Way too blue. It's amazing that they had no understanding of the issue, given the business they're in. 



> At any rate, the outside details look good. They at least darkened the engine domes somewhat, but still not dark enough to resemble the "frosted raspberries" look of the originals when powered down.


 Was this due to the domes being frosted on the outside and tinted a color on the inside? Having never seen the original domes in person, I'm curious for the assessment of one who did...

M.


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

Trek Ace said:


> My only wish is that they would have followed my advice and warmed the color temperature of the internal lighting, which is much too blue (a common problem with uncorrected "white" LEDs) when compared to the original stage model. The internal color of the original lighting (with the exception of the top and bottom domes) was a "warm" white in the range of 2800-3100K. The LEDs they are using are in the 5000-5600K range (closer to daylight) and are incorrect in color when compared to the original.
> 
> When I brought this to their attention, I drew blank stares.
> 
> ...


I agree, interesting on the white is white thing.

If your daring, you could try to slightly warm the windows and hence changing the color temp of the glow.

Perhaps take something like tamiyas clear yellow, thin it, then lightly airbrush the windows. (after masking of course).

Come on, we're modelers, a lot of people are sounding pretty helpless here. Just because its already assembled and painted doesn't mean you can't modify it at all. ( you just better be darn sure you won't screw it up). 

It will be interesting to see who has the guts to do a total repaint.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Yep. 

I had that same thought. 

But would a clear yellow just mix with the cool white bluish light and make it look green? 

Blue and yellow make green right? 
I forget. 

Maybe a color wheel is needed to figure this out.


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## JGG1701 (Nov 9, 2004)

Here ya go sir.......... :thumbsup:


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

oof. looks like yellow is a primary color and cannot be made by mixing. 
That might put the kabash on this. 
Making a cool white look warm may not be possible.


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## Trek Ace (Jul 8, 2001)

You would need a heavy orange color to correct the blue daylight to a warmer "tungsten" color. In the world of cinematography, this is known as a CTO (color to orange) and would be either a filter or gel that would correct the daylight (blue-white) light into an interior (warm-white) light. If you're using LEDs for lighting models, Tamiya clear color paints can be mixed into a heavy orange and the "white" LEDs dipped into this concoction to warm up the color.

The engine domes on the stage model were darkened and frosted in order to balance the exposure with the skin of the ship and the interior lighting, as well as the bluescreen stage. Since the model was exposed entirely "live" in one pass, it was necessary to make certain that the engines did not "blow out" and read as too hot compared to the rest of the model. There was always a careful balance maintained between the external lighting on the model and the interior. 

With the introduction of precisely-repeatable motion-control cameras years later, models were shot in non-realtime frame rates and in multiple passes, exposing each light source at an optimum frame rate in order to arrive at a proper balance of exposure when composited later on. No such system existed during the original _Star Trek_ years and the ship, lights, engines and blue backing were all shot in realtime in one single pass.

The lights (both interior and exterior) were quite hot and did take a toll on the model over a period of time, considering that the exposure index of the film stock was only about 100-125 and the cameras were stopped down for maximum depth of field. The lights were only turned on and the motors spun up just prior to a take, or series of takes, and then turned back off again, in order to try to keep things from overheating too badly. The same thing happened over at Desilu on the live action stage with the bridge indicator lights, they were only turned on just prior to takes and and left off the rest of the time and during rehearsals because of the tremendous heat buildup.


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## MGagen (Dec 18, 2001)

It would need to be something closer to an amber tint rather than plain yellow. It needs to be strong enough to neutralize the light and then pull it over to a warmer incandescent-like color. This would have the effect of dimming the intensity of the windows and might also be noticeable when the power is off.

I don't think I have the guts to try it on mine. I'll just live with the bluish windows. Maybe one day, when some of the lighting gives out and I have to break the thing open to fix it, I'll tint the LEDs or put a gel between them and the windows -- as should have been done in the first place.

M.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

A couple vids from the Vegas con some time back courtesy of
BartmanNX over at ASAP forum.


Nacelles in action.........

http://www.t2.net/users/bartman/remotelink/enterprisenacelle.wmv

Overall........

http://www.t2.net/users/bartman/remotelink/enterprise.wmv


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## ClubTepes (Jul 31, 2002)

If this were movie lighting, I would simply take like a quarter CTO (Color Temp Orange) to warm up light that is too blue.
That is why I suggest a yellow or a orange. Thin it out real good and mist on a light coat.


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## ket (Jan 19, 2004)

Two questions
The inner cage/fan is supposed to spin that fast? and if seen from the front, the cage/fan on the left nacelle should not be spinning clockwise?


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

Well, I have a hard time telling from the vid which way they are spinning the video frame rate is probably not fast enough to help there much. 

The comicon proto had the spin direction correct so I wouldnt worry.
I saw that in person and it looked great, looks like they have dialed it in even better now as far as fan blade width and the internal flashing colors. 
The speed does indeed appear to be warp 10! Quite a warp field must be being generated. 
A bit on the fast side, but not over the top. The TV series would of course speed up or slow down the film so the exact RPM is probably something they are going to just try to eyeball for best look.


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## ket (Jan 19, 2004)

thank you for the info :thumbsup:


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## Treadwell (Aug 22, 2002)

Either spin direction would be accurate, as sometimes the effects shots were run in reverse.


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## Nektu (Aug 15, 2001)

I thought they rotated to the center of the ship, so starboard clockwise, and port counterclockwise.....
Isn't this right?

KK


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

This is an older vid but shows that on an older prototype from MR

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6Cli6GA3Xk


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## NWO (Jul 26, 2004)

I don't mind the the grid lines on the upper primary hull so much as I do the ridiculous 'rust' ring. How can there be rust in space, and how can tri-titanium rust anyway? I just don't like it.


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## CessnaDriver (Apr 27, 2005)

NWO said:


> I don't mind the the grid lines on the upper primary hull so much as I do the ridiculous 'rust' ring. How can there be rust in space, and how can tri-titanium rust anyway? I just don't like it.


Entering earths atmosphere, hull heating numerous times, powerful fields of her shields reacting with the hull and taking her to the limit of warp drive, passing through a giant space amoeba, through the galactic barrier, battles against strange weapons of aliens ships, powerful fields of the stolen romulan cloaking device, time warps whipping around the sun. Apollos giant grubby hand on her.

She earned a little weathering boldly going.


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## Treadwell (Aug 22, 2002)

And "rust ring" is just our modeler pet name for it. I don't think it's supposed to be rust.


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## Warped9 (Sep 12, 2003)

I don't mind the ring nearly as much as the grid lines particularly when some make them way too obvious.


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## Nosirrag (Apr 26, 2005)

In point of fact, they do make white LED's that radiate in the 3000 to 3100 degree Kelvin range -- like incandesent bulbs. They may be a bit more expensive and it is my impression that they are not as "intense" as the blue white ones that run about 6500 K, bluer even than sunlight -- which is about 5500 K. Like warm white flourescent bulbs, they also have sort of a "pinkish" quality that comes from an LED's restricted light wave emission -- just like a flourescent bulb. Light from hot filiments is much more broad in the wavelenghs produced. LED's give off very specific wavelengths and lack all the others. Burning bulb light through a prisim gives you a rainbow, LED's and flourescents give you sharp bands in various colors with nothing in between.

Clear orange paint will warm up those LED's nicely -- I've done this myself. But, be aware that if you don't apply the same amout to each window, you will end up with some being bluer than others and what appears to be a "checkerboard" effect.

I read once that TOS model had halogen lights inside (what in those days were slide projector bulbs that were about 600 watts at about 3800K. Studio lighting was provided by the old carbon arc lamps -- about 8000 to 10,000 watts at about 5000 degees Kelvin. When they balanced the film to make the windows "white" the light on the ship was rather blue. When they balanced the film for the light on the ship, the windows were a little amber. This may account for the variations in the "blueness" of the ship from shot to shot -- not to mention the optical processes that were done. You will no doubt be aware that when the ship looks grey, the windows are warmer, when the windows are very white, the ship looks more blue. It's all in the color timing.


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